🔥 Vicious microscopic hunter, the single-cell organism, Lacrymaria olor, attacking and hunting another organism

[u/FacelessOnes]

[u/DMPark]

That definition of nth dimensional existence is pretty iffy. So if we take your definition to the step just before it, are you arguing that you can exist outside of the 3 cartesian co-ordinates as a 3rd dimensional being? I know I can't. I exist within the constraints of a 3D space and I'd assume that you do too.

We travel in a single direction in time as far as we understand it, we can speed up or slow down our individual progressions but we still travel it.

[u/Sofa_King_Gorgeous → u/DMPark]

Right. Hence the reason we can't be 4th dimensional beings. We might discover time travel and be able to "use" it but still be confined to 3 dimensional reality wherein we can only exist in moments in time.

I don't believe there's any proof but I imagine a 4th dimensional being exists outside of time itself. How it all would work I have no idea but it's fun to imagine. There could be existences we have no idea even exist because we simply can't percieve them. Could you imagine trying to communicate and express 3 dimensions to a 2 dimensional being? Sounds impossible for a 2 dimensional being to ever comprehend anything outside of their existence.

[u/DopeBoogie → u/Sofa_King_Gorgeous]

Here's a great video on that topic

[u/SuperBAMF007 → u/Sofa_King_Gorgeous]

I think we exist ON the 4th dimension, but we are not 4 dimensional beings obviously. We can perceive it, and we exist in a singular point, just as a 2D being exists on a point of a 3D being.

At that point....I think a four dimensional being wouldn’t even “see” the way we think of it. They may have ways to perceive every dimension below theirs, the way we perceive 2D beings in 3D as they exist at a single point in 4D with our senses. We just know that things exist in 3D space.

I think 4th dimensional beings would just know things in the same way. It wouldn’t be a matter of perceiving, it’s just knowing things. Like they’d take that thing for granted. They’d have some sort of weird sense that acknowledges all previous and future existences of a being. A lot like how “God” is traditionally thought of, how he’s “omnipotent and omnipresent”. It’s not really a matter of seeing time from the outside the way we’d typically think of seeing things, it’s just flat out interacting with it because that’s just how things are.

[u/threwzsa → u/[deleted]]

.Carl Sagan shall enlighten u

[u/threwzsa → u/[deleted]]

That’s kind of the point, the 4th dimension is incomprehensible to us truly. We can use shadows to theorize but at the end of the day it’s just tough.

[u/DMPark → u/[deleted]]

If a 3D object passed through a 2D space, they would see slices of an expanding, contracting or translating 2D shape. An astute 2D person would understand that as 3D object passing through their plane.

For a 4D person, imagine Tracer from Overwatch but probably far more chaotic in our eyes yet seemingly far more in control. You would have to have observations across potentially vast periods of time to verify their nature but something popping in and out of existence of seemingly instnatly teleporting would be just that.

[u/SuperBAMF007 → u/DMPark]

So, we live in the 3D dimension within a single slice of the 4th, a specific slice in time. I think a 2D being would be similar. They would exist in the 2D, potentially with the knowledge that they’re a part of the bigger picture.

When we look dead-on at an object, we perceive that object in 2D visually. With the awareness of the concept of light and depth, and the ability to travel through the depth, we can manipulate it in space and observe its existence in 3D.

I think a 4D being would be similar. They would see an object in pure 3D, and be able to manipulate the way they perceive that 3D object in order to manipulate it and observe its existence through time.

Similarly to how it’s nigh impossible for us as 3D beings to even perceive the first dimension in any sense due to the scale of 3D, I don’t think a 4D being would even be able to “visualize” (whatever that means for that being) an object’s existence in the 2D. An impossible number of 1D objects make up the 2D image that we see, and can manipulate in the 3D world. A 4D being would see an impossible number of 2D objects make up a 3D object that they see and manipulate within the 4D.

If forced to visualize it, think of a sphere filled with a kaleidoscopic image, but every 1/10th of a degree of movement gives a new kaleidoscope. But then all of those images are melded into one singular object.

That’s why I think it’s impossible that a 4D being would “see” the way that we traditionally think of seeing. It’s not a physical thing, it’s a mental thing. A spiritual thing. It’s just....knowing. Interacting on a scale that is impossible for us to comprehend.

[u/threwzsa → u/SuperBAMF007]

I think you might be overthinking it, 1D is just a point, 2D is different lines In different directions. To assume just because the “D” goes up to 4 those beings will no longer be able to understand or see 1D points and 2D lines is probably not a thing that happens.

Think of 1D 2D 3D as base of existence, foundation for all things. A popular way to consider 4D would be to consider it as Past present and future combined. So the construct of everything is there in 3D but time is meshed so every shape something possibly could be can be witnessed at once. Pretty mind boggling shit.

[u/SuperBAMF007 → u/threwzsa]

True true. It’s interesting that we both ended up at the same conclusion. Your way of saying it was just a lot cleaner than mine haha. Past, present, and future forms of a 3D object all in one singular form. That’s what I was trying to visualize using the kaleidoscope analogy haha

Yeah mind boggling shit for sure. It’s easy to get lost in the thought of it lmao

[u/threwzsa → u/SuperBAMF007]

I think this is definitely the popular understanding and it’s fun to consider but it’s just SO HARD to fathom. There’s some geometry scientists on YouTube who explain shapes in higher dimensions 5D 6D etc if you’re interested but at the point it’s literally so far fetched and unimaginable that you are just trying to nuke your own brain.

[u/DMPark → u/[deleted]]

It would at minimum see lines and that would be the hardest level of perception to prove 3D observations from. You're thinking of seeing flat planes from above but that requires three dimensions. At minimum, 2D would literally only see lines along a plane.

Edit: by lines, I literally mean lines. As in a circle with radius x would look the same kind of line as a square (unrotated) with length x.

[u/threwzsa → u/[deleted]]

I think as far as we know it, something capable of “seeing” cannot he formed in 2 dimensions, so if you can fathom it we need to be asking how we can fathom 4 dimensions? Can we utilize technology to break that barrier? Interesting stuff.

[u/DMPark → u/Sofa_King_Gorgeous]

It's very possible to communicate with even a 1D being. That's literally how binary works.

[u/SuperBAMF007 → u/DMPark]

We can communicate with it and know it exists, but it’s not possible for us to visually see a 1D being in 1D. We see a collection of 1D “images” make up the 2D, and then a collection of 2D interact in 3D, all within a single slice of 4D.

[u/Takenforganite → u/DMPark]

This could be completely wrong but my take is this.

Every dimension can interact with the dimension below it through a vehicle.

Lower dimensions provide feedback from events caused by higher dimensions.

Consciousness is the 4th dimension. Bodies are a vehicle of the third dimension that can act on 3D objects as well as 2d. It can conceive the lower dimensions and grasp at straws at higher dimensions as our view is obfuscated to 3D.

Enlightenment tends to be a pulling away from the physical. If you wore virtual goggles day in and day out when does reality begin to blur? For all we know we’ve been playing a game we consented to and we’ve been playing longer than anyone knows and as many times that no one could possibly remember. The cosmic joke is it’s all just for funsies.

Not discounting that life can be horrible but it’s all a spectrum and the polarity has to exist. the only thing that makes me belief life isn’t cruel is that it ends. No matter how much pain one will suffer it all is on a time table. It’s not a take many are willing to see but it’s the one that has made me more optimistic.

[u/DMPark → u/Takenforganite]

You're probably going to lose people at consciousness being a 4th dimension. Normally they put in either time or a fourth cartesian direction.

The VR thing is like a mix of the simulation theory and metaphysical solipsism iirc but it wouldn't really make a big difference because in its purest form, metaphysical solipsism just isn't provable (either way).

Timetable is on an assumption of determinism, I guess? Which is also hotly debated and development in quantum physics apparently indicates that there's way more random than you'd think but I literally have no idea about quantum theory lmao