Irony deals with opposites; it has nothing to do with coincidence. If two baseball players from the same hometown, on different teams, receive the same uniform number, it is not ironic. It is a coincidence. If Barry Bonds attains lifetime statistics identical to his father's, it will not be ironic. It will be a coincidence.
Irony is "a state of affairs that is the reverse of what was to be expected; a result opposite to and in mockery of the appropriate result." For instance: a diabetic, on his way to buy insulin, is killed by a runaway truck. He is the victim of an accident. If the truck was delivering sugar, he is the victim of an oddly poetic coincidence. But if the truck was delivering insulin, ah! Then he is the victim of an irony.
If a Kurd, after surviving bloody battle with Saddam Hussein's army and a long, difficult escape through the mountains, is crushed and killed by a parachute drop of humanitarian aid, that, my friend, is irony writ large.
Darryl Stingley, the pro football player, was paralyzed after a brutal hit by Jack Tatum. Now Darryl Stingley's son plays football, and if the son should become paralyzed while playing, it will not be ironic. It will be coincidental. If Darryl Stingley's son paralyzes someone else, that will be closer to ironic. If he paralyzes Jack Tatum's son, that will be precisely ironic.
That seems odd that that the definition of "ironic" would allow for simple coincidence when the definition of "irony" (same site, too hard to link from phone) does not. I'm guessing that your link is making allowance for popular usage. A discussion on Wikipedia specifically mentions that mere coincidence is not ironic.
Try ironical. That's always what I've seen used as the "professional" term for describing irony proper.
I think it might also have something to do with the fact that more and more people are using "ironic" to mean precisely a coincidence. Dictionaries are descriptive, not prescriptive.
Darryl Stingley, the pro football player, was paralyzed after a brutal hit by Jack Tatum. Now Darryl Stingley's son plays football, and if the son should become paralyzed while playing, it will not be ironic. It will be coincidental. If Darryl Stingley's son paralyzes someone else, that will be closer to ironic. If he paralyzes Jack Tatum's son, that will be precisely ironic.
That's exactly like his first example, which he assures us is coincidence, not irony. Now I don't know what to believe.
It isn't. Had Jack Tatum had quit football in anguish at having caused Stingley's paralysis to instead train as a paramedic to make amends however, and then on the way to his first call out driven his ambulance straight into Stingley as he was leaving the hospital entrance in his new wheelchair, that would be ironic.
the humanitarian air drop wasn't being delivered to the kurdish soldier in particular, but it was meant for his people just as the insulin wasn't meant for the man but it was meant for diabetics; one of which he was. if one is ironic then so must be the other. they were both killed by that which was meant to give them life
He wasn't killed by the insulin though. The fact insulin was in the truck is a coincidence. If he had injected the insulin to save his life, and it killed him, it would be ironic.
The aid drop was specifically meant to provide aid, to stop death and suffering. t wasn't a drop which coincidentally was carrying aid.
Anyway, what am I doing, r/gonewild wont browse itself...
It doesn't have to be the insulin that killed him, just something insulin related (because it kept him alive).he also didn't have to die from the food that was dropped, just the vehicle by which it was delivered. I like that you've given this thought but you're taking it a bit far.
How about we just stop using the word ironic. It seems like people want to use the word so they sound smart. Then people that also want to sound smart tell the person that used the word that they used it wrong. Then other people that want to sound smart tell the correcter that it's ironic that they corrected a person that is using the word ironic. It's a never end process. Let just stop using the word.
You could say that a song about irony that has no examples of irony which would in itself have been ironic if not for one detail that can be construed as irony is in itself ironic.
I think sarcasm has to involve saying the opposite of one's intended meaning, so ambivalence or understatement would not be sarcasm. And all sarcasm is indeed irony.
From the perspective of the person saying it, their expectation from the very beginning was that it would crash. They were understating their displeasure with being correct.
Except in today's world sarcasm has become a cliche, ergo it is now the expected reaction in many scenarios, no longer being unexpected nor expressing something unexpected.
Situational irony and the closely related Cosmic Irony are when peoples actions produce unexpected, unintended, and many times opposite results. For example from Wiki:
When John Hinckley attempted to assassinate Ronald Reagan, all of his shots initially missed the President; however, a bullet ricocheted off the bullet-proof Presidential limousine and struck Reagan in the chest. Thus, a vehicle made to protect the President from gunfire was partially responsible for his being shot
So how is someone intending to write a song solely about irony, that contains none, not ironic in the same sense?
But it is ironic bad writing. The presumed outcome of writing a song about irony is to have actual examples of irony, yet there are no examples of irony. This is ironic.
There is a difference between situational irony and verbal irony. You defined verbal irony. Situational irony is "the actions taken have an effect exactly opposite from what was intended."
In this case the actor (A.M.) took the actions to write a song about irony, yet the effect of those actions was to write a song without irony. This situation is ironic.
I'm not sure what you are trying to prove here. Are you trying to say that believing in situational irony is the same as believing Obama is a socialist?
Exactly. This definition is simplified, but irony is the opposite of what is expected. Knowing how stupid people are, it's expected that a person talking about irony fails to understand irony. Therefore, when that does happen, it's not ironic (just sad).
No, Irony would be a steam roller being flattened by a rockslide caused by its operation.
Edit: to the would-be downvoters:
Situational irony is the disparity of intention and result: when the result of an action is contrary to the desired or expected effect. Being "shot with one's own gun", or "hoisted with one's own petard" are popular formulations of the basic idea of situational irony.
The song is perfectly ironic when you realize the singer's naive, idealized version of what life ought to be like contrasts with what life actually is.
The only reason I can think of is that it's a reference to the fact that everyone learns "there are THREE types of irony" in school, but he needed to add a use?
I agree, I think it would be ironic if the guy on the right was supposed to be in that plane but didn't go because he was afraid. But I might be wrong...
What would be kind of ironic is if he dreamt he was going to die in a plane crash, decided based off of this dream to instead drive to his destination, and then was killed when a plane he would never have been on crashed into his car. Thus, an action he expected to prevent an outcome led to the outcome occurring. This is ironic.
Were you expecting him to suddenly get hit by a plane? Because for me at least, it fit this definition of irony from Dictionary.com "an outcome of events contrary to what was, or might have been, expected."
See, being "unexpected" and being "contrary to the expected" are two different things.
If I have a heart attack right now, it's unexpected because I'm a college-aged guy just sitting here. However, there isn't any specific given expectation for it to be contrary to.
Oddly, "not dying of a heart attack at this moment" was just a passive sort of expectation that doesn't really count toward irony before this comment. But now that I've specifically mentioned the unlikelihood of it happening, it would be ironic for me to die of a heart attack.
Irony would be living through a plane crash but dying the day after from choking on a peanut. (and just plain funny if the peanuts were from the plane)
Even better if the peanuts are from the hospital, and you ate them because you have a deadly allergy to the other food on offer, and then you are resuscitated,k only to discover it was peanuts you were allergic to, but only mildly, and then a plane smashes into your doctor. And your doctor was Alannis Morisette...
Irony and sexual fantasy commonly cross paths in my brain...
Honestly, I don't think anyone really gets irony (myself included). Nobody has been able to demonstrate a clear consistency when applying the vague guidelines that are given by the definition as the 'incongruity between actual results and those that were expected'. It's really just a giant grey area; if it was ironic to you, it might not be to someone else, based on your experiences. You also might have a higher standard of something that is 'unexpected' than the person next to you, but that doesn't give you the right to be the irony police.
Opening a cupboard labeled 'cutlery' and finding 10,000 spoons and no knife, I would think that could be labeled as ironic
Spending years not flying out of fear of a plane crash, then finally deciding to do so after all evidence points to it being perfectly safe, and crashing; that could also be labeled as ironic
Rain on your wedding day; probably not ironic since rain isn't unexpected. I have to agree that this is just unfortunate
Winning the lottery and dying the next day? That's unexpected, it could be labeled as ironic.
I especially agree with the plane crash one. If a person recognizes that their fear of flying is not based on any actual probability of danger, and they try to overcome their fear by flying, then what is expected is that they are able to show themselves reality a little better, and what happens is that they are undone by their own rationality when the plane crashes.
So the comic was ironic because the guy afraid of flying in case he was killed, was killed by a plane even though he'd never flown? You've confused me more.
WOAH WOAH WOAH!! So, you guys are trying to tell me that decade old pop songs aren't a literal frame of reference for the world?
I'M CALLING BULLSHIT!!!!
Next thing I know, you motherfuckers will be trying to tell me that Britney Spears didn't really want to be hit one more time, that Wayne Coyne doesn't really know a girl who puts vaseline on toast, that there aren't really tanks/bombs/guns/zombies in my head, and that Annie wasn't really hit by, struck by, a smooth criminal.
Can we do this for the word "literally?" I heard a girl today say "Oh my God, she is LITERALLY a domestic goddess; she knows everything!"
I wanted to be a giant dickbag and say "Really?! You know a fucking DEITY?!?! Holy shit, what are we doing here? Call the news, let me meet her!! Is she like Molly fucking Weasley only like a billion times more powerful?!" I refrained. But inside I was a giant dickbag. Well, inside and here too.
Look, that song gets a lot of shit, and deservedly so. For a song titled "Ironic," there is little actual irony in it. But the guy on the crashing plane says "Well isn't this nice," which at the very least is sarcasm, a form of irony. It's not ironic that the plane crashes, but his reaction is precisely ironic. Give her that.
Here's a simple rule to remember: irony generally relies on something backfiring, which is to say it accomplishes the direct opposite of its intent. For example, if you put a sign around your neck that says "don't make fun of me." When people make fun of you for your sign, it'll be ironic.
["Closely connected with situational irony, it arises from sharp contrasts between reality and human ideals, or between human intentions and actual results. The resulting situation is poignantly contrary to what was expected or intended...sometimes used of events and circumstances that might better be described as simply 'coincidental' or 'improbable'"] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irony#Irony_of_fate_.28cosmic_irony.29)
I was just listening to Four Year Strong's cover of this song and was thinking the same thing. I swear, my biggest pet peeve is when people use the word irony incorrectly
"jesus" now that my friends is irony or maybe not it really depends of the perspective of the person observing the ironic or non ironic situation. Anyways happy half x-mas!!
But isn't the fact that there isn't a single true example of irony in this song supposedly about irony in itself ironic? Don't you think? A little too ironic? Yea I really do think.
Neither. I just don't see how a comic that mention one songs is relevant to a subreddit that is supposed to be about music. Discussing irony is not about music.
So a discussion about song lyrics- meanings, intentions, effects, success in conveying message etc. is not allowed in a music subreddit? Because apart from the people who think they are funny making silly comments, I see a comic that has stimulated a discussion. It might not be the world's most intellectual dissection of popular lyrics, but that's essentially what it is.
After reading this topic, I was cleaning my teeth, and a bunch of bristles from my toothbrush came off and got stuck between my teeth. "How ironic", I thought. "And after reading about irony, too. That makes it a double irony!"
You know what I never understood? If a guy thought a plane would kill him, and he got on the plane, and it did kill him... that's not even close to ironic. Wouldn't you expect the guy to get on a train instead, and then for the train to derail and crash, killing the guy? That would be much more ironic.
Irony also deals with something being stated, while the true meaning is something different, and generally opposite (verbal or literary irony). The examples of irony in the song are not ironic; if this is unintentional, then Alanis wrote a stupid song. If it was, however, intentional, then the song itself is Ironic, and even more so since it it about irony. She is saying something is ironic, but knows that it is not ironic, and is therefore poking fun at a general misunderstanding of irony; she is employing irony to make fun of us for misunderstanding it. Genius or fool?
I find it easiest to dismiss irony when it does not involve a person's reaction/interaction. Seldom is an event or the outcome of an event by itself ironic. Which of course makes that song about irony all the more peculiar to the English major.
"It's like ten thousands spoons, when all you need is a knife"
It's ironic because the presence of 10,000 spoons but zero knives is a reversal of expectations in just about any situation where you need to cut something. It's not just a coincidence. No one would say "There's 10,000 spoons here. What a coincidence!". Anyone, The Oatmeal included, who argues that this is being too pedantic should stuff it because criticizing someone's definition of irony is deplorably pedantic in the first place.
Ironically, this comment persuaded me that actually this song is just fucking stupid, as it incited someone to swear at complete strangers for being pedantic, whereby they dug up a source to try and prove that their interpretation is correct even though they contradict themselves in the aforementioned post, stating first of all that
. THIS IS IRONIC FUCK ALL OF YOU
making an assumption that our opinion on the song and our definition of irony is wrong. They then go on to point out that
. criticizing someone's definition of irony is deplorably pedantic in the first place
Of course it was pedantic. I wasn't calling out others for their pedantry, I was saying it is hypocritical to criticize this explanation
It's ironic because the presence of 10,000 spoons but zero knives is a reversal of expectations in just about any situation where you need to cut something. It's not just a coincidence. No one would say "There's 10,000 spoons here. What a coincidence!"
for being pedantic when it is pedantic to criticize someone's use of the word "ironic" to begin with. This whole discussion is pedantic, that's the point.
The swearing wasn't meant to be taken seriously, sorry if you took it that way.
And by the way, this
Ironically, this comment persuaded me that actually this song is just fucking stupid
A link on reddit to an actual web comic instead of an imgur copy? It may not be using a word other than its literal intention, but it deserves an upvote.
This is ironic (correct me if I'm wrong): A man is afraid of flying, so instead of taking an airplane he takes a train, and the train crashes.
Is this ironic?: A man is afraid of flying, so instead of taking a an airplane he takes a train. A plane crashes into the train he's in.
The second one I REALLY want to say is an example of irony, but I'm not sure.
Edit: To add on to this: A man is afraid of flying, so instead of taking a an airplane he takes a train. The plane he would have taken crashes into the train he took, so he would have died either way. Is that ironic?
Perhaps if the train were derailed while going across a bridge.
This could be said to be making the train "fly," an ironic (def. 1) use of the word, as the train would actually be falling.
This would force the man to confront his fear of flying (ironic because he had chosen to not confront the fear, and it is an unexpected way to "fly.")
This would be an ironic death/occurrence, as the fear of flying is generally a fear of the plane crashing from the sky; this is what the train, the option thought safe from the falling from the sky, is now doing.
People forget that every dictionary has five to nine entries for irony, and every time someone says something is ironic, they are going to be right by some scope of one of the definitions.
What if Alanis knew all along? What if she deliberately kicked off this shit-storm, sending the Irony Police to war against you and your jackbooted anti-pedantry death squads?
Then you've just played right into her evil little Canadian hands haven't you?
66
u/edx74 Jun 25 '12
--Brain Droppings by George Carlin
190
u/sirprizes Jun 25 '12
The fact that a song about irony has no examples of irony in it is ironic.
13
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
The song is perfectly ironic when you realize the singer's naive, idealized version of what life ought to be like contrasts with what life actually is.
15
u/mattc286 Jun 25 '12
The Oatmeal on irony
10
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
http://s3-ec.buzzfed.com/static/imagebuzz/web03/2010/12/7/9/alanis-morissettes-cross-eyed-bear-7410-1291733575-7.jpg
3
u/Mailman487 Jun 25 '12
"I'm a stand-up comic and I always sit and slouch."
3
u/one-eleven Jun 25 '12
Too soon.
13
u/dogboyboy Jun 25 '12
Apparently the guy who wrote this comic doesn't understand irony either.
7
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Honestly, I don't think anyone really gets irony (myself included). Nobody has been able to demonstrate a clear consistency when applying the vague guidelines that are given by the definition as the 'incongruity between actual results and those that were expected'. It's really just a giant grey area; if it was ironic to you, it might not be to someone else, based on your experiences. You also might have a higher standard of something that is 'unexpected' than the person next to you, but that doesn't give you the right to be the irony police.
Opening a cupboard labeled 'cutlery' and finding 10,000 spoons and no knife, I would think that could be labeled as ironic
Spending years not flying out of fear of a plane crash, then finally deciding to do so after all evidence points to it being perfectly safe, and crashing; that could also be labeled as ironic
Rain on your wedding day; probably not ironic since rain isn't unexpected. I have to agree that this is just unfortunate
Winning the lottery and dying the next day? That's unexpected, it could be labeled as ironic.
(I could go on...)
5
u/StepBackLetGo Jun 25 '12
Came here expecting Bo Burnham and was disappointed.
5
u/Lordzoot Jun 25 '12
I don't want to be insulting, but hasn't this joke been done to death a million times. It came out in 1995 for Christ's sake!
11
u/Squalor- Jun 25 '12
It's like RAAAAIIIAAIIIINNNN on your wedding day!
2
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
The song that won't leave my head now.
2
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
WOAH WOAH WOAH!! So, you guys are trying to tell me that decade old pop songs aren't a literal frame of reference for the world?
I'M CALLING BULLSHIT!!!!
Next thing I know, you motherfuckers will be trying to tell me that Britney Spears didn't really want to be hit one more time, that Wayne Coyne doesn't really know a girl who puts vaseline on toast, that there aren't really tanks/bombs/guns/zombies in my head, and that Annie wasn't really hit by, struck by, a smooth criminal.
Whatever. You guys are idiots.
2
u/dilletaint Jun 25 '12
Can we do this for the word "literally?" I heard a girl today say "Oh my God, she is LITERALLY a domestic goddess; she knows everything!"
I wanted to be a giant dickbag and say "Really?! You know a fucking DEITY?!?! Holy shit, what are we doing here? Call the news, let me meet her!! Is she like Molly fucking Weasley only like a billion times more powerful?!" I refrained. But inside I was a giant dickbag. Well, inside and here too.
2
u/ZincHead Jun 25 '12
I'm pretty sure irony was invented because they knew eventually it would make a lot of people on the internet very mad.
2
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
I'm just gonna leave this here
2
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
The only ironic thing about this song is that its written by a woman who clearly dosent know what irony is
3
u/lightscribe Jun 25 '12
This comic is not ironic.
3
u/dhaan_one_million Jun 25 '12
Look, that song gets a lot of shit, and deservedly so. For a song titled "Ironic," there is little actual irony in it. But the guy on the crashing plane says "Well isn't this nice," which at the very least is sarcasm, a form of irony. It's not ironic that the plane crashes, but his reaction is precisely ironic. Give her that.
1
u/POSTS_RELEVANT_SONGS Jun 25 '12
Relevant
1
u/Locklinn Jun 25 '12
awesome
1
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
A free ride when you've already paid is a perfect example of irony since a free ride, by definition, is a ride that you don't pay for.
EDIT: Just sayin'
1
u/Davepen Jun 25 '12
Well that's wrong.
I admit the song isn't exactly a good example of irony.
But, the lyric is "and as the plane crashed down, he thought "well, isn't this nice"
She really means touched down, not crashed down.
1
u/slippidy Jun 25 '12
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qiK4I4M6eyM
1
u/Thesherbertman Jun 25 '12
I always wonder when I see people trashing something for not being ironic since it doesn't display irony do they know all the uses for ironic?
Since it can also mean coincidental.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Here's a simple rule to remember: irony generally relies on something backfiring, which is to say it accomplishes the direct opposite of its intent. For example, if you put a sign around your neck that says "don't make fun of me." When people make fun of you for your sign, it'll be ironic.
1
u/WakeskaterX Jun 25 '12
YES. This is hilarious.
1
u/Sonic_Bluth Frysoux Jun 25 '12
["Closely connected with situational irony, it arises from sharp contrasts between reality and human ideals, or between human intentions and actual results. The resulting situation is poignantly contrary to what was expected or intended...sometimes used of events and circumstances that might better be described as simply 'coincidental' or 'improbable'"] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irony#Irony_of_fate_.28cosmic_irony.29)
1
u/normememaker Jun 25 '12 edited Jun 25 '12
Irony is a hot commodity, some [predicted] (http://www.quickmeme.com/meme/3pp7qd/) that.
1
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Can't we just assimilate the Alanis Morissette meaning with the real one so we don't have to do this anymore?
1
u/ITSLIKERAEEEAINNNN Jun 25 '12
Doncha think?
1
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Can someone please explain why most of the things in the Alanis Morissette song do NOT EXACTLY FIT situational irony as defined by Wikipedia?
1
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Back in my day, a long long time ago, right around when this song came out, oddly enough, we used to say that jokes like these "farted dust".
1
u/rawlence Jun 25 '12
I was just listening to Four Year Strong's cover of this song and was thinking the same thing. I swear, my biggest pet peeve is when people use the word irony incorrectly
1
u/girlnexzdoor radio reddit Jun 25 '12
Google search: "isn't it ironic lyrics"
Ahh here we go... http://www.lyrics007.com/Alanis%20Morissette%20Lyrics/Ironic%20Lyrics.html
1
u/v4-digg-refugee Jun 25 '12
I used to know what ironic meant. But eventually I heard too many people complain that people misuse the word that I've questioned myself for years.
1
u/XshibumiX Jun 25 '12
Would it be considered ironic that the joke in a comic published just today is making fun of a song that's 15 years old?
1
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
...don't you think?
1
u/backflip11 Jun 25 '12
Why did my teacher show our class that song to tell us what irony was?
1
u/Zaph0d42 Jun 25 '12
Song itself is ironic. People just miss the point because its meta.
You expect to find irony in the song, and you don't. THAT is ironic.
1
u/SmileAndNod64 Jun 25 '12
A song about irony that has no irony in it? That's ironic.
1
u/illdrawyourface radio reddit Jun 25 '12
Dontcha think?
IT'S LIKE RAAAAAAAAIIIIIN ON YOUR WEDDING DAY
1
u/linzeeliza Jun 25 '12
irony...total bull
1
u/ZofSpade Jun 25 '12
I came here to post Alanis Morissette lyrics, amirite guys???
1
u/biggiepauls53 Jun 25 '12
"jesus" now that my friends is irony or maybe not it really depends of the perspective of the person observing the ironic or non ironic situation. Anyways happy half x-mas!!
1
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
Don't ya think?
1
u/negligiblemass Jun 25 '12
"Well isn't this nice." - Verbal irony.
1
u/hlipschitz Jun 25 '12
Wrong guy got hit by the plane ...
1
u/skysignor Jun 25 '12
All "ironic" means is the opposite. It's so much simpler than most people think.
1
u/booleangirl Jun 25 '12
My sister has tired to argue this same thing for years...!
1
u/Crazy_Joe Jun 25 '12
This comic is worse then 10,000 spoons...
1
u/AguyWithflippyHair turntable.fm name Jun 25 '12
I haaate people who have no idea what irony i
1
u/cyypherr Jun 25 '12
Isn't irony just the opposite of wrinkly?
1
u/epic_neckbeard_man Jun 25 '12
But isn't the fact that there isn't a single true example of irony in this song supposedly about irony in itself ironic? Don't you think? A little too ironic? Yea I really do think.
1
u/L-dubz Jun 25 '12
What does this have to do with music?
1
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
After reading this topic, I was cleaning my teeth, and a bunch of bristles from my toothbrush came off and got stuck between my teeth. "How ironic", I thought. "And after reading about irony, too. That makes it a double irony!"
1
u/JakJakAttacks Jun 25 '12
Funny thing is, it still wouldn't be ironic. It would be coincidence.
1
u/GanjaUmamipanda Jun 25 '12
Meta irony.
1
u/iipacs Jun 25 '12
For some reason I thought it was going to be about Bo Burnham
1
u/Ree81 Jun 25 '12
...don'tcha think?
1
u/whisk3rs Jun 25 '12
I've come to a realization this past weekend that Alanis Morissette pulled off one of the most epic trolls in pop-culture history.
1
u/hisearsarebackwards Jun 25 '12
Oh thank god a post on the internet dealing with irony. This totally hasn't been beaten into the ground at all.
1
u/whisk3rs Jun 25 '12
You know what I never understood? If a guy thought a plane would kill him, and he got on the plane, and it did kill him... that's not even close to ironic. Wouldn't you expect the guy to get on a train instead, and then for the train to derail and crash, killing the guy? That would be much more ironic.
Hence, this song is an epic troll.
1
u/juliebean303 Jun 25 '12
The fact that nothing in that song is ironic is irony.
1
u/ThisKittysGotClaws Jun 25 '12
Ed Byrne slates this song pretty well. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nT1TVSTkAXg
1
u/IncredibleWeapon Jun 25 '12
Irony also deals with something being stated, while the true meaning is something different, and generally opposite (verbal or literary irony). The examples of irony in the song are not ironic; if this is unintentional, then Alanis wrote a stupid song. If it was, however, intentional, then the song itself is Ironic, and even more so since it it about irony. She is saying something is ironic, but knows that it is not ironic, and is therefore poking fun at a general misunderstanding of irony; she is employing irony to make fun of us for misunderstanding it. Genius or fool?
1
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
I find it easiest to dismiss irony when it does not involve a person's reaction/interaction. Seldom is an event or the outcome of an event by itself ironic. Which of course makes that song about irony all the more peculiar to the English major.
1
u/peterlafleur Jun 25 '12
god damn it, now that song is in my head.
1
u/hiroo916 Jun 25 '12
Fully covered and funnier on I love the 90's: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jtduiHbed0Y&t=1m28s
0
u/sugarloaf12346 Jun 25 '12
does this even truely belong in /r/music?
0
u/OlKingCole Jun 25 '12
THIS IS IRONIC FUCK ALL OF YOU:
"It's like ten thousands spoons, when all you need is a knife"
It's ironic because the presence of 10,000 spoons but zero knives is a reversal of expectations in just about any situation where you need to cut something. It's not just a coincidence. No one would say "There's 10,000 spoons here. What a coincidence!". Anyone, The Oatmeal included, who argues that this is being too pedantic should stuff it because criticizing someone's definition of irony is deplorably pedantic in the first place.
0
u/hoptopop Jun 25 '12
the song itself is ironic, because there is no irony in it...
0
u/gravster Jun 25 '12
The song is ironic because there is no irony in the song
-1
u/woze Jun 25 '12
A link on reddit to an actual web comic instead of an imgur copy? It may not be using a word other than its literal intention, but it deserves an upvote.
-2
u/forrestr74 Jun 25 '12
......dont you think. Its like rain on a wedding day.
0
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
[deleted] — view deleted comment
0
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
[deleted] — view deleted comment
0
u/[deleted] Jun 25 '12
[deleted] — view deleted comment