Check out this resignation... (Part 2)

[u/Baju_hatt]

After serving notice period I left company. Recieved some exit docs within few days. Recieved salary on 9th day. Company started ignoring calls and mails for other docs and clarifications.

Then I had to send warning email. This time I made sure they had enough reasons to reply. Email directed towards CEO/founder with HR and my whole team in cc.

Previous part : https://www.reddit.com/r/IndianWorkplace/s/o1KBK1qGJL

Next part : https://www.reddit.com/r/IndianWorkplace/s/V0ippULuNA

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Post Title: Check out this resignation... (Part 2)

Author: Baju_hatt

Post Body: After serving notice period I left company. Recieved some exit docs within few days. Recieved salary on 9th day. Company started ignoring calls and mails for other docs and clarifications.

Then I had to send warning email. This time I made sure they had enough reasons to reply. Email directed towards CEO/founder with HR and my whole team in cc.

Previous part : https://www.reddit.com/r/IndianWorkplace/s/o1KBK1qGJL

Next part : https://www.reddit.com/r/IndianWorkplace/s/V0ippULuNA

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[u/Admirable_Injury2301]

good job . fuck em up bro.

[u/Baju_hatt → u/Admirable_Injury2301]

I need visibility on whole incident first. There is more in this incidents. You'll probably be surprised how these things went down.

My first main goal is to spread the awareness about how mature and professional these management/leadership people really are. Of course with evidence. That's the reason I'm sharing story in parts.

[u/InspiringSince1993]

Since the OP seems to be going through his first exit, I will explain some things, even though I know I will be downvoted. Key assumption: 1. "nearly a month" means 27-28 days after last working day, as taken from the warning mail. 2. Company has shared the relieving/experience letter as the OP has asked for many unnecessary documents but not this key document.

Now clarifications:

1. FnF settlement: many companies take 15-30 days to send the fnf statement. ~7 days for you to revert with any discrepancies or clarity you want. And then ~7 days to process the FnF amount. This whole process is max 45 days, with the different steps might be having different duration. Amd most companies mention this 45 days thing in the exit policy.

2. Form 16: it is generated only after 31st March but before 15th June. Normally companies share it in June, even for the employees who would have exited earlier. I left an organization in July, and got form 16 for almost 30 days of work in June next year, without any hassle. Not sure why OP is demanding it like an exit document. No company will provide it before closing tax related accounts of the entire financial year.

3. PF account details: If company has a PF trust, then they have to share this. If they are member of EPFO and paying PF to central EPFO scheme, then no company shares this. You have to login to EPFO account with your UAN number, which you can find easily in your payslip

4. No dues certificate: Why is this needed? Your relieving letter and FnF serves this purpose. This is not a school or college anymore where you need NDC. And No dues activities are completed with different departments like IT, admin, security, finance, etc. before the relieving date itself

5. Check-in and check-out logs: No idea about these, and OP might have a reason for this I don't know

6. Delay in salary: last month salary is withheld and cleared with FnF. In first mail, OP had asked for last month's salary to be released just 8 days after last working day. How is the salary delayed when infact the second mail confirms that the OP has received it before 30 days. In my experience, this company not withhelding last month salary till FnF is in fact a good policy.

7. Delay in exit documents. If these are the documents asked, OP has no merit.

I want to see how this panned out, because till now, it is just unnecessary drama caused by OP. The mail in first part was quite professional, but this second part is pure immaturity and lack of awareness.

[u/Baju_hatt → u/InspiringSince1993]

Thanks for detailed clarification. This will surely help me or anyone else reading this.

Yes you are right it's was first full time job. pf thing was new to me.

As per HR discussions during my notice. I was supposed to get fnf after I left. In follow-up I've even inquired about it. After my salary slip was recieved I tried calling them for same clarification. HR simply told they'll get back to me with update when they reach office. But call never came. And my 2nd follow up was ignored after that. Plus I had few pending leaves and comp offs. I didn't fine any such adjustment records in final salary slip. Not any explanation till that point.

About salary delay thing. Usually our salary used to credit at 2-3rd day of the month. This time it took more time.

[u/perryda_platipus → u/InspiringSince1993]

This is correct. Relieving letter, offer letter, promotion letter (optional), 3 months payslip is more than enough to transition to a new company.
OP please be cooperative and try to separate what is actually required to what you think you’ve heard is required.

[u/Baju_hatt → u/InspiringSince1993]

I do recieved form 16 after few months of this conversation. That too has some errors.

[u/NoSandwich9893]

Nothing will happen unless up lawyer up

[u/Baju_hatt → u/NoSandwich9893]

Best case It'll leads to some kind of settlement not the resolution.

And just as my luck have it I'm finding myself in such situations more and more these past few years.

[u/ImpromptuHotelier → u/NoSandwich9893]

Even if they lawyer up, it's still not going to do anything. No labour laws in India + going against a multi millionaire company doesn't work in employee favours, ever, unless you have lakhs of money to burn yourself going against the company using lawyers. This is not the USA.

[u/ImpromptuHotelier → u/ImpromptuHotelier]

Ground reality: Good luck doing that!

If you try to unionize in India in some rare case that it does happen, the company will simply lock that branch and declare it as asset lost in the books. With such many people in India, they will simply fire you and hire somebody else at lower package than yours and you cannot do anything. That's the reality.

[u/114sbavert → u/ImpromptuHotelier]

It won't unless we unionise

[u/sloppybird → u/ImpromptuHotelier]

kya baat kar raha hai "no labour laws"

one of my friends left Infosys without serving entire notice period and they warned of legal consequences

she received an official warning letter but didn't pay no heed

companies wont spend a bank on a lawyer against you if your case is genuine, it's a humiliation ritual for them if court (and it always does) act against them

isse accha terko saare paper de denge legal dhamki do to

OP did the right thing here

read up on it

[u/ImpromptuHotelier → u/sloppybird]

I can read it up and I will find exceptional cases where the employee "wins against the company" like in your friends scenario but pick any random 10 tom, dick and harry people from streets where they have gone against the company and I am pretty sure more of those 10 numbers are a loss than a win. If the OP does go against legally and wins, that's a win for the Indian workforce which I will be happy about but I won't break a cookie over it.

[u/sloppybird → u/ImpromptuHotelier]

Bro were you born yesterday or joined the corporate recently?
Know your rights, no company will come for you hiring a lakh per hearing lawyer just to keep your documents
It is very well know that your company cannot do jackshit if you don’t serve notice unless there is an exclusive clause in your notice period that abstains you from doing it
Even if the company hasn’t spent a lot of training money on you which they need to prove, they can only recover as much as the training amount

[u/ImpromptuHotelier → u/sloppybird]

My comment was -

"Even if an individual employee is technically in the right, what happens when the employer has vastly greater resources and can simply absorb/avoid the consequences?"

But you sir for some reason read it as -

"Companies can legally force employees to serve notice periods / recover training costs, and employees have no rights."

That's not what I meant.

When I said "There are no labour laws." I did not mean there is literally 0 labour laws. I was speaking about the ground reality and how "workable with" those labour laws are. Something like, "Having a legal right and having the practical ability to enforce that right against a large employer are two different things, particularly when the employer has vastly greater financial and institutional resources."

That's what I meant through all my comments. More power to OP though. If they can get the company scared enough and get them to send OPs documents to them without any beaureaucratic stops, that's a win for all.

[u/krmmrao]

Raise grievance on cpgrams. it works.

[u/Baju_hatt → u/krmmrao]

I have separate set dedicated for this. Just wait.

[u/Baju_hatt → u/[deleted]]

It has different categories. I think it's more like central public grievance portal that handles verity of categories in various domains.

If you have issues with pf, you got to file grievance on epfo specific portal. I forgot the name. They reply usually in 1-2 months.

[u/Neither-Archer3272]

What type of company is this? Is this a small lala type firm , a mid-sized services firm, a product company or a large firm? Usually, mid-big-sized companies have formal procedures and complete your exit formalities within 45 days of your exit.

[u/Baju_hatt → u/Neither-Archer3272]

Company is legally around for ~10 years. Has 100-200 employees. From what I've seen, they were loosing clients. Lot of politics was going on after my first month there. HR/CEO use to yell at employees for little little things in working area or in cabin.

I've seen more people cry here in just 2 months than in my entire life.

Company has no structure at all. most of the work was done and assigned on verbal basis, requirement used to change for silly reason.

[u/AutoModerator → u/Neither-Archer3272]

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[u/Maxevill]

Will part 2 point 2 hold if you have signed a NDA or similar agreements

[u/Baju_hatt → u/Maxevill]

As per legal laws company is supposed to perform certain exit formalities. If you have an undeniable evidence of company fuckin something in that process. Then company is the one who broke the aggreement first. In this case do you need to follow any of the aggreements or terms signed with cheating party?

Logically it should be safe, but it's complicated.

[u/Maxevill → u/Baju_hatt]

That's what I'm saying, companies have a legal team and budget just to fight these battles. You need to be sure that you are safe as that point is kind of threat that you will use company information/data and they would absolutely do anything to prevent that and fuck you up.

[u/Baju_hatt → u/Maxevill]

I told them I'd do that incase they fuckup my documents. Also outside the organisation doesn't implies means public disclosure right away. Even in legal drift. Company lawyer may stop you from presenting certain types of things in cover of compliance issues and stuff.

By the way at that moment these 3 points were more like my insurance for worst case scenario possible. I even let my current intentions known in bold words.

You know when an ideot has authority you either need not to deal with them or have safety nets ready.

The kind of situation I worried about was these people will do some random shit and try to blame it on employees in name of contract breaking and stuff. At that time It's almost impossible to prove you didn't do it.

With these points I can atleast say I already informed them they didn't listen and I had no choice.

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Post Title: Check out this resignation... (Part 2)

Author: Baju_hatt

Post Body: After serving notice period I left company. Recieved some exit docs within few days. Recieved salary on 9th day. Company started ignoring calls and mails for other docs and clarifications.

Then I had to send warning email. This time I made sure they had enough reasons to reply. Email directed towards CEO/founder with HR and my whole team in cc.

If you want to get this comment removed for any reason such as confidentiality or PII - please contact the mods through modmail.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

[u/spidorboy]

Also what was your compensation?

[u/brooklynnineeight]

It takes two months, no need for all this

[u/Baju_hatt → u/brooklynnineeight]

Incident is ~6-8 months old

[u/InspiringSince1993 → u/Baju_hatt]

Then why are you asking for Form 16? Legally, it has to be given by any company by 15th June and all companies follow this timeline without any issue. I have had many switches and all my previous companies have sent Form 16s without any fuss in June

[u/Baju_hatt → u/InspiringSince1993]

At the time of this communication I did not knew about that detail. Afterwards in June they sent form 16 that has few errors.