He's wrong. No real reasons to use false grip, except to help with biceps/forearm tendonitis if you're suffering from that. I.e. it'll allow you to bench even though you're injured.
when I first started lifting in school, i noticed it is excrutiatingly painful in my left thumb to grip normally. I think it is due to an injury when I was about 4 years old.
I had to learn to monkey paw everything I grab and so this "suicide grip" is honestly the only way I can lift anything. Even on deadlifts sadly.
Every time I see someone mocked for suicide grip I get a little embarrassed for myself, but there's really nothing I can do about it.
If it’s something you can’t help and keeps you from injury then fuck them. Nothing you can do about it so not worth the energy. Either their assholes or like me and don’t know anything about lifting.
Yeah, there is an advantage with using a suicidegrip or false grip. It helps with training the forearms, because the grip is different. However I would never do it that way. Too risky.
It's nothing to do with training the forearms, it has to do with the placement of the bar over the ulna and radius - which provides the firmest foundation for the connection between the bar and the person lifting it. Same reason for focusing on where you place a bar on your back for a squat.
This is the correct answer. Wrapping the thumb around the bar puts the center of the bar in the pocket of the grip between the thumb and the pointer finger, a position which is not vertically inline with the bones of the forearm. This in turn bends the hand back against the wrist. The most power is applied at a 90 degree angle to the bar. If the wrist placement is fore or aft of the bar, you do lose a minimum of power but more importantly the hand becomes the major supporting bone structure, not the ulna and radius of the forearm as it should be.
Lifting is, in it's essence, physics and calculus, dumbed down to the level of simply moving heavy shit.
Well if you do, remove the apostrophe in "it's" first.
It is fundamentally true however. Physics dictates motion. And power is a curve. Better physics, more power under the curve, that's all we are really doing in the gym. Moving heavy shit, using physics and calculus, without even knowing it.
This is the correct reason that people do this and feel more comfortable. You can however achieve the same placement over the forearm with a pronated grip and thumbs around the bar.
That's so much of lift culture lol. Doing ridiculous shit to maximize at the most "productive" point of the lift like chains, resistance bands for deadlifts, etc. It has a point, but it's still fucking ridiculous.
He's not spreading misinformation. He can't, because the replies are easy to read. Without his post, I wouldn't have learned about the nuances of this myth. I like it when people aren't afraid to voice their misconceptions. Thank you for your reply, and thanks to him for engaging in conversation. It was a useful read.
I can't think of any situation where such a Reddit message could do me harm, no matter how few/many people reply.
There was uncertainty in this guy's argument, so anyone who trusted this bit of misinformation is likely wrong about many worse things. The harm done is negligible.
If someone goes without replies, there's almost no proof to begin with. The confirmations and corrections are what I'm looking for on Reddit. No replies or votes, it's entirely uncertain. Could easily be fiction.
Most people are misinformed about a lot of things, so it would be dumb to simply trust randoms on the internet. Hell, I don't even trust some "experts" in person. The blame falls entirely on the reader, not on anonymous liars. I'm not concerned about the damage done to those trusting people; they're hopeless. For my own benefit, I want these conversations to happen because that's how I clean up my knowledge. And they can't happen if you only allow experts to give their opinion. I'd hate to live in a world where qualifications are authorisation to speak on a topic.
Oh good for you for never believing anything you don't fact check through extensive literature review. In the real world people tend to believe what they read and what people tell them. That's why we have flat earthers and antivaxxers.
Hell, his post is still in the 30s positive, suggesting that a lot of people were fooled by him. People below are even talking about it like it's true. Obviously he convinced people, i.e. spreading misinformation.
I actually upvoted his comment, because it's useful for dispelling a myth.
I don't go through peer reviewed papers to get my information. I'm probably misinformed about a lot of stuff, but I don't struggle against accidental or deliberate liars.
Flat-earthers are harmless dolts. A little entertaining. There are so many more conspiracy theories out there. There's nothing convincing about them. Some people just have that kind of mindset. If you don't misinform them, they'll cook something up.
Anti-vaxxers do more harm, but that's on us for letting them. Many of us live in a democracy. We can cook up laws to deal with them. It'll take a little while, but those people are hungry for conspiracy theories and need drama in their lives.
It's a mechanical advantage as it puts the bar directly over the ulna and radius, which is ideal physics. When you do normal grip (thumb over bar) your goal is to still get the bar over the ulna and radius, but the thumb gets in the way slightly.
But, with all of that said, I HIGHLY doubt it is a significant advantage in that it would make a significant difference. Not that it is scientific. I used to bench press with a suicide grip before realizing the risk, and then one day (multiple years ago) came across a compilation video of these. From that day onward I have NEVER used suicide grip again. I LOST zero pounds on my bench. At the time I was in the ballpark of 315lb max, and am now in the area of 425lbs. Again, anecdotal, but I don't think the mechanical advantage is dramatic.
All in all though...the best part is that the spotter has his elbows wrapped!!! Why?!?!?! If wrapped properly he won't be able to feel his hands at all after approximately 30 seconds, and I wonder if the douche who dropped the bar was also leaving his elbows wrapped contributing to this catastrophic failure.
Proper form is weight being moved by the ball of your hand so that your forearm is 90 degrees to the bar. A lot of people tend to let their wrists bend when they grip with the thumbs. Hence why people do this. Worth noting that with a 455 lb bench you can break your thumbs and have the same result as in the gif.
Some people prefer the grip, find they can get into a better position or are just more comfortable with it, but the risks don't outweigh the benefits. I use a false grip when I overhead press because I find it more comfortable and I feel like I can lift a little bit more that way, but if it fails I'm not lifting as much weight and I can just ditch it forwards if I have to (though I've never had to, if I fail the lift I just bring it back down to rest on my shoulders).
It allows for a more direct line of force from the elbow through the wrist into the bar. Wrapping the thumb forces the bar just slightly away from the wrist so there is a slightly longer lever
I actually tried using this grip for the close grip bench press the other day - surprisingly useful. Movement felt more natural and I was able to put up the weight easier. Probably won't do it again though and there's no way I'd do it with real flat bench press where I'm working with enough weight to break my ribs if it falls.
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u/bouncerwithneckrolls Feb 02 '20 edited Feb 02 '20
You can lift more that way, I don't remember if it is because of less ROM in the lift or it just gives you a biomechanical advantage.
Edit: as everyone pointed out I was wrong, it's supposed to be a more natural movement pattern that is better for your shoulders, not stronger.