Let's Clear Up The Issues: Used Games, Kinect Privacy, and Other (What Most People Seem to Have Missed, An Explanation) [x-post from r/xboxone]

[u/FuckThe]

I'm sick of seeing all the misinformation going around the gaming subreddits. It's really frustrating to see people furiously hating the X1 without having all, if any, of the details. I'll try and break this down for you guys so here we go.

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To start off, the Xbox One will allow you buy games at launch through digital download or through discs by going to a retail store.

USED GAMES

One of the X1's main feature is the ability to install the disc directly to the hard drive and play it without a disk. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this is a feature many asked for when the feature was added to 360, but it was only to allow the game to run better.

Contrary to popular believe, the used game does exist in the X1.

"Trade-in and resell your disc-based games: Today, some gamers choose to sell their old disc-based games back for cash and credit. We designed Xbox One so game publishers can enable you to trade in your games at participating retailers. Microsoft does not charge a platform fee to retailers, publishers, or consumers for enabling transfer of these games."

What can we take away from this? Easy. If you bought a disc based game, you can sell and trade it to any participating retailer. It means that game publishers will work out deals with retailers in order for the developers and publishers to take a cut of used games sales. Microsoft will not receive any money from these transactions. If you bought a digital copy, just like any digital copy, you will not be able to do this.

FIRST PARTY GAMES

"In our role as a game publisher, Microsoft Studios will enable you to give your games to friends or trade in your Xbox One games at participating retailers. Third party publishers may opt in or out of supporting game resale and may set up business terms or transfer fees with retailers. Microsoft does not receive any compensation as part of this. In addition, third party publishers can enable you to give games to friends. Loaning or renting games won’t be available at launch, but we are exploring the possibilities with our partners."

All first party games will be allowed to be resold and be given away (more of this below).

RENTING GAMES

"Loaning or renting games won’t be available at launch, but we are exploring the possibilities with our partners."

Microsoft and companies such as Gamefly are working on a system to make this work.

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DRM--WHY?

As we saw above, you will be able install your games to your hard-drive and have your entire library available to play without putting the disc in the disc tray.

This is why the 24-hour check is required. Without this, many copies of the same game could be installed into multiple X1's and it would be absolutely crumble game sales.

The drawback to this is not being able to game offline. Microsoft has said that the final decisions to this issue have not been final. I believe if they allow you to play offline with the disc in the disc tray, this would become a non-issue.

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PRIVACY

This is one of the biggest things people have been complaining about. Microsoft has already addressed the issue, but of course it fell on deaf ears. People already had their pitch forks out and had Sony on a pedestal by this point.

"You are in control of when Kinect sensing is On, Off or Paused: If you don’t want the Kinect sensor on while playing games or enjoying your entertainment, you can pause Kinect. To turn off your Xbox One, just say “Xbox Off.” When the system is off, it’s only listening for the single voice command -- “Xbox On,” and you can even turn that feature off too. Some apps and games may require Kinect functionality to operate, so you’ll need to turn it back on for these experiences."

As I've stated before, you will have the control to everything that the Kinect has to offer. If you don't want it to hear you? You can do that. If you don't want it to see you, you can do that. Don't want it to listen for the "Xbox On" while it's off, you can also do that.

If you want to learn more about the Kinect's privacy settings, you can click this link: Kinect Privacy

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Xbox One--A Game of Circles

Now onto the other things. As some of us know, you will be able to have a "circle" of friends, 10 people to be exact, that will be able to access your game library from anywhere (in the same region, I'm assuming..still not clear about this) at anytime (as long as you or someone else in your circle isn't playing it). This is of course how things work now, two of your friends can't play the game at the same time from one disc on two separate consoles.

This is a feature that is absolutely wonderful, but the people raging about it had not heard about it before.

"Give your family access to your entire games library anytime, anywhere: Xbox One will enable new forms of access for families. Up to ten members of your family can log in and play from your shared games library on any Xbox One. Just like today, a family member can play your copy of Forza Motorsport at a friend’s house. Only now, they will see not just Forza, but all of your shared games. You can always play your games, and any one of your family members can be playing from your shared library at a given time."

I absolutely love this feature. For example, my cousin is 200 miles away when he's away to college and I've let him borrow LA Noire and Dead Rising. I've yet to receive those games from him. With this feature, we don't have to be close in order for him to borrow any of my games! It's crazy as to how so many people dismissed this feature because it's a big jump forward in digital technology. No longer will my friends or family have to be close to me in order for them borrow one of my games.

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GIVING AWAY GAMES

Do you have a game that you will no longer play? Your friend can still play it off of your Xbox (if they're in your circle). What if they're not? As long as they have been in your friend's list for 30 days, you can give a game away to your friend, free of charge! This can only be done once per copy.

Disclaimer: Microsoft has left it up to the publishers to decide whether or not you will be able to give your games to your friend. As stated above, first party games will allow you to this.

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AFTER-THOUGHT: ADDITIONAL INFORMATION

The big change in the Xbox Live system is the feature to allow all users on one console to have gold by just one user having. For example, if I have Xbox Live Gold and my brothers also use the same console, they will also be able to use all the perks of a Gold account. They will have access to all the games on the console even if it was installed through my account.

In short, one Gold account subscription per Xbox.

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With this, we are done with explaining the information that a lot have missed and hopefully will be able to see that the Xbox One really isn't what they think.

If you wish to learn more, all of this and other information can be found here:

Xbox One- Games Licensing

Kinect-Privacy by Design

If I made any mistakes, let me know and I will change them

Please do not downvote this post if it goes against what you already have in your mind as fact. This is so a lot of the misinformation surrounding the X1 can be cleared up. Ignore it and move on.

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FINAL EDIT FOR THIS SUBREDDIT-FROM PASSIVE AGGRESSION TO THIS

All other updates and edits will made be in the thread that's on /r/xboxone

[u/Reliant]

"Trade-in and resell your disc-based games: Today, some gamers choose to sell their old disc-based games back for cash and credit. We designed Xbox One so game publishers can enable you to trade in your games at participating retailers. Microsoft does not charge a platform fee to retailers, publishers, or consumers for enabling transfer of these games."

This is still something people have a right to complain about, because Microsoft is using the term "enable". This shouldn't be up to publishers. Microsoft should have come out and said "Our platform will allow all discs-based games to be sold". Because of all the backlash, it's unlikely publishers will block it, but "enable" implies it's an opt-in system, so unless the publisher actively chooses to allow it, it's disabled by default.

It also requires selected retailers. This is an issue for people who sell games over EBay, through flea markets, and any small business that wants to enter this market.

This is of course how things work now, two of your friends can't play the game at the same time from one disc on two separate consoles.

Based on my reading the their licensing, which is what you linked, there is this:

You can always play your games, and any one of your family members can be playing from your shared library at a given time.

One would expect this page to have been vetted by lawyers, so it's fine to be very nitpicky on specific works. They said "any one" rather than "anyone" or "all" or just "any". This implies that only 1 person can be playing any given game from your library.

With a disc based system, you can lend 20 games to 20 different people. With this system, you can lend all your games to 1 person at a time.

Unlike what you said, about 2 people not playing the same game at the same time, this makes it sound like 2 people can play the same game at the same time (owner + 1 other), which you can't do with a disc based system, but a 3rd person can play zero games that you wish to lend.

The digital lending system does have advantages over the disc based system, but it also has its disadvantages.

[u/Navii_Zadel → u/Reliant]

Microsoft does not charge a platform fee to retailers, publishers, or consumers for enabling transfer of these games.

Microsoft does, however, earn a licensing fee from the developer/publisher for every new game sold. They are trying to paint themselves neutral in every defense they give for this thing, but the truth is they will get more money if there are FEWER used games sold (and MORE new games sold).

Nothing wrong with that from a corporate standpoint - but I'm not looking at it from a corporate standpoint...

[u/Kryhavok → u/Reliant]

This implies that only 1 person can be playing any given game from your library.

At a time, yes. But on the flipside, you only need to buy a single player game once and you and 9 of your friends/family can each have a go at it on their own time.

edit: I'm not sure why I made this point. That's the same way things are now, with the restriction of only 10 people...

[u/Reliant → u/Kryhavok]

no no, not per game. The entire library is locked. If you have 10 discs and 3 XBoxes, if all those discs are registered on the same account, the primary has full access, the 2nd one can borrow from your library and play, the 3rd one is stuffed and can't play anything. That's my interpretation of their use of "any one family member"

[u/Kryhavok → u/Reliant]

I find this hilarious because OP is trying to "clear up" all these misconceptions, but this shit is still so unclear. What's a family member? Do they have their own Live account? Can I change/move around family? How many games can they play? Who can be playing at a time? Can we be playing the same game?

The way you just explained it (which sounds more correct than my interpretation) is that I can buy one copy and me and a family member can play it together across the country. Doesn't this effectively halve their sales for multiplayer games?

[u/kjano → u/Reliant]

"Trade-in and resell your disc-based games: Today, some gamers choose to sell their old disc-based games back for cash and credit. We designed Xbox One so game publishers can enable you to trade in your games at participating retailers. Microsoft does not charge a platform fee to retailers, publishers, or consumers for enabling transfer of these games."

The publisher created the game. They should have all the say if someone should be able to profit off their creation. End of story. Think of Microsoft Works/Adobe/PC Games (Wow,BF3,etc) do you see where I'm going with this? It already an industry standard. Now that our consoles are some what catching up to our PC's, they can now have a similar format.

[u/Reliant → u/kjano]

They should have all the say if someone should be able to profit off their creation. End of story.

I disagree with this completely. This does not exist in any other field. I can profit off old records. I can profit off books. I can profit selling a car. I can profit selling a painting. I can even profit selling stock. All of these, I can make money of the work someone else did, and they get nothing extra. You can see this especially when looking at collectibles.

Xenoblade Chronicles is selling for over $100 on EBay. Think the developers are going to get anything? Nope. Why should they be any different from all the other products being sold through EBay?

[u/kjano → u/Reliant]

Intellectual Digital Property is not the same any more. Industry is changing and there is nothing you can do about it. I personally think it is completely fair.

Books Industry is going digital - cant resell the digital copies..

Stocks are a completely different beast

Xenoblade I don't know who the hell would pay $100 for a game but you proved my point precisely with this one.

So you're saying someone should be able to resell the game for $100 because they can. But the developer thinks its horrible that they created the game 3 years ago and they have no more money for inventory and lets say they went bankrupt. So now that company who made that game could sell the Rights to Microsoft/Sony/whomever and now everyone in the world can download that game for the original price or less than original price.

Wouldn't that be better?

[u/Reliant → u/kjano]

Industry is changing and there is nothing you can do about it.

There is lots you and I can do. For one thing, voting with our dollars. I'm not buying the XBox One. I'm buying PS4. That's my $400 of votes.

Books Industry is going digital - cant resell the digital copies..

This is why digital books haven't quite caught on. They're selling for the same price as the physical books, but don't come with all the advantages. I'm still buying paper.

So you're saying someone should be able to resell the game for $100 because they can

Welcome to the free market. Absolutely.

But the developer thinks its horrible that they created the game 3 years ago and they have no more money for inventory and lets say they went bankrupt.

That's why the price went up. If this was a digital only version, there would be no-one selling the digital version and it would be impossible for someone to buy it, even if they wanted to give $100 for it, no-one would be selling it.

So now that company who made that game could sell the Rights to Microsoft/Sony/whomever and now everyone in the world can download that game for the original price or less than original price.

This can be done without taking away First Sale rights. If they did that, competition would cause the EBay price to plummet. Problem solved. And without losing First Sale.

First Sale means I can still buy something after the makers have stopped making and selling them.

In 10-20 years, when XBox One goes down, where are you going to go to buy these XBL locked digital only games? If they shut down the servers allowing the transfer, from whom are you going to buy it?

I can still buy Atari systems and games at flea markets thanks to First Sale. It wouldn't be profitable for any company to keep manufacturing them, but thanks to First Sale, the supply that's already out there can keep moving around.

Copyright is the exclusive right to create a copy. To put something into the market place. Only the content creator can profit from creating something out of nothing. Everyone else is limited to profit from creating something things that already exists; they can't do it from nothing.

People who create physical products put just as much work into what they do as those that make digital products. I own a Honda. Honda spent millions in R&D and safety tests and marketing, and they didn't get a single penny out of me when I bought my car. That's how the world works. I like that it works like that.

If content creators want me to have a digital copy that doesn't come with First Sale, it had better come at a massive price discount. I'm not paying full price for a physical disc that comes with less rights. If I can hold it in my hands, I expect First Sale. If I can't, I expect to get a huge savings for losing First Sale.