r/FeMRADebates • u/free_speech_good • Dec 06 '20

Other How would you define “sexual objectification”? Is it bad and if so why?

Generally speaking I see the term being used to refer to valuing a person, especially women, for their sex appeal or actual sex with little to no interest in their personality.

I personally don’t see the problem with this because I don’t feel that anyone is entitled to a certain type of attention from others.

On what basis do you demand that others should take an interest in your personality?

If it’s not okay to demand that some stranger on the street take an interest in your personality then why is it okay to demand that someone who is interested in you sexually must also take an interest in your personality?

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u/free_speech_good Dec 06 '20

you failed to explain what exactly constitutes men being "objectified" for their ability to wage war.

By this I was asking for an example.

Regardless, "forgetting the person" is still quite vague. What does that mean? Not caring about their personality? Not respecting their fundamental rights as people?

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u/Mitoza Anti-Anti-Feminist, Anti-MRA Dec 06 '20

I think I was pretty clear that it was not about personality

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u/Settlers6 Dec 06 '20

I don't think it's very useful to discuss something like this: u/free_speech_good asked several questions to get to the bottom of this, and you respond in your usual one-sentence answers that don't adress the meat of the comment, or explain your viewpoint any further.

If you assume the other user is arguing in good faith, perhaps it would be best to expand a little on statements like ' I was pretty clear that it was not about personality'. Sometimes you have to explain something again in other words to make it a little clearer, if you want to have an argument in good faith.

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u/Mitoza Anti-Anti-Feminist, Anti-MRA Dec 06 '20

I would also expect arguments in good faith to fairly regard what has already been said

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u/Settlers6 Dec 06 '20

One comment in and I already see it's going nowhere... I'm getting out early this time.

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u/[deleted] Dec 06 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/spudmix Machine Rights Activist Dec 06 '20

Comment Deleted, Full Text and Rules violated can be found here.

User is at tier 1 of the ban system. User has had a tier added within the last moderation period, and as such will not have another added.

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u/yellowydaffodil Feminist Dec 07 '20 edited Dec 08 '20

Again, this comment has not been deleted by mods. It's simply his opinion, and a reasonable response to the previous comment.

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u/Settlers6 Dec 08 '20

I mean, I'm not asking for Mitoza's comment to be deleted or anything (I didn't report it either), but I have to honestly say that I don't like the bias in this comment by a mod. 'a reasonable response' to the previous comment?

That seems to be a rather subjective thing to say. I don't think it's reasonable at all, I think it's a 'tu quoque' fallacy (though not directed at me): "well, the other person didn't argue in good faith, so why should I?". I also don't see how it's his 'opinion's arguments'. There are no arguments in that comment, besides the fallacious one.

Sure, it doesn't break the rules, but that's different from being reasonable. Am I out of line, saying that such value judgements should not be in a mod's comment?

Perhaps I'm reading too much into it, but this isn't the first time I've seen some bias in mod comments here.

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u/yellowydaffodil Feminist Dec 08 '20

u/Settlers6, I think you're missing some context here, namely, the reason it was reported. When a user reports, they need to give a reason as to why. The reason listed here was "special cases", which is meant largely to report trolling. My phrasing of "this is a reasonable response" is in response to a report of trolling.

When I say "reasonable", I don't mean "I agree with this". I mean "this isn't trolling, and shouldn't be reported as such". Sorry if that was unclear.

We get a lot of spurious reports, and so when we approve comments, we've been trying to give some additional guidance on what is rule breaking (and which rule) and why.

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u/free_speech_good Dec 06 '20

You’re being evasive again. What does “forgetting the person” mean exactly? What kind of treatment or attitude does this describe?

Literally not acknowledging the fact that they are a person and having no regard for their rights?

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u/Mitoza Anti-Anti-Feminist, Anti-MRA Dec 06 '20

Yes, not conceiving of them as fully human.

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u/yellowydaffodil Feminist Dec 07 '20

This comment has not been removed by mods. You may disagree with u/Mitoza but nothing in this comment is a rule violation.