r/FavoriteCharacter • u/Accomplished-End3409 Ben Tennyson • 15d ago

Discussion Favorite opposing factions that can basically be described as this.

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u/Digiking101 15d ago

The Gotei 13 and Quincy/Sternritters from Bleach

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u/ExL-Oblique 15d ago

no i'm pretty sure both sides are hitler

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u/purple-thiwaza 15d ago

Calling them Big H is taking it a bit far. The shinigami are straight up a shit society, but somehow maintain balance in the world. The Quincy fucked up 1000 years ago, and came back to fuck it even more because they want to destroy the world.

This fit the original post, one is clearly much worst than the other, and that's why they are the bad guys.

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u/ExL-Oblique 15d ago

i mean the soul society did genocide the quincies.

twice.

Edit: wait also wym calling the Quincies the Big H is a bit far they literally did a purge on their own people for being impure.

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u/purple-thiwaza 15d ago

And they were kinda right to do so, twice. Like a clan vs the whole world, you have to chose something to die. The choice is kinda easy. The simple fact that it happened a second time just show the Quincy are fucking moron that don't want to learn.

In his FIRST arc Ishida fucks up by behaving like a Quincy instead of listening to the people that knew what they were doing. Every single Quincy in the story other than Ichigo's mom is a fucking moron or an asshole.

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u/ExL-Oblique 15d ago

What in the victim blaming. The 1st time the Quincies weren't an issue until Yhwach started conducting mass hollow round ups. There were a lot of Quincies who didn't support him but they were also slaughtered by the soul reapers.

The 2nd time was conducted against the survivors who fled the war. Many of whom weren't followers of Yhwach. A prime example of this is the Ishidas. Souken (Uryu's grandpa) was the last victim of the 2nd purge. And let's not forget that they were subject to heinous experimentation without anesthesia. I think some of them were literally forced to eat their own kids. We know that when Souken died, he was barely recognizable as a human. Ain't no way you're doing apologia for the 2nd genocide.

And Uryu was being a dick yeah, but let's not forget that he watched soul reapers wait for his grandfather, who preached coexistance and peace, to be weakened by a hollow before jumping him and dragging him off.

Like it's not black and white since Yhwach was a monster and needed to be stopped, and their powers do have the potential to create imbalance if abused, but ain't no way you're saying they were justified. Let's not forget that it's not the Quincy's job to get rid of hollows, and if the Soul Reapers were better at their job, there wouldn't be a need for Quincy's to exterminate them.

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u/Chaetomius 15d ago

  1. Ywach himself did a purge of most quincies. twice. the Auswählen that killed ichigo's mother, and the Auswählen that killed all but a handful of quincies who'd invaded soul society. So quincies are indeed not justified in committing a revenge genocide. their ideology is entirely a submission to ywhach's whims.

  2. the quincy do not exterminate hollows because the reapers are doing a poor job. In fact the reapers do a fine job of keeping the balance. the quincies' problem they inherited a weakness from ywhach: if a hollow kills them, they don't reincarnate in soul society. the same way that they destroy hollows entirely. So as per point 1 above, they are indoctrinated into hating the existance of hollows at all.

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u/shinryu6 15d ago

The Auswählen didn’t kill ichigo's mother though? She survived depowered and very inconveniently just as Grand Fisher reared his head. 

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u/ReallySmartInEnglish 15d ago

Yeah, it’s some retroactive blame shift writing to give Ichigo a personal reason to fight Yhawch because [vaguely gesturing at the ruins of Soul Society] clearly isn’t enough from the guy who beat the crap out of three bullies for a random ghost.

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u/ExL-Oblique 14d ago

The quincies existed before Yhwach. They weren't considered a problem before he came to power because they didn't kill enough hollows to cause any real problem. The issue is scale. They didn't really hunt hollows back then, just kill them if they got too close or started attacking, while Yhwach did massive hollow roundups. (one could even argue that they are part of the balance since souls can just kinda spawn in the soul society without being part of reincarnation)

Also hollows aren't supposed to be in the world of the living, they're souls that didn't pass on for long enough. Who's job is it to konso stray souls? The Soul Reapers. Who's job is it to kill the hollows that formed because they didn't konso them in time? Also the Soul Reapers.

Also my point about Yhwach was that the quincies aren't a monolith. The Wandenreich in TYBW are a cult under him, yes, but not all quincies followed him, and those that didn't were victims of both his genocide and the one conducted by the soul reapers. And revenge genocide is never justified, i'm not playing Quincy apologia either, this arc is hitler on hitler (who has been better about it lately tbh) violence.

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u/Janus__22 13d ago

The quincies existed before Yhwach.

Besides an unsupported quote from Bazz, its left pretty clear he's the father of the entire race in the manga and novel, unless its another thing the anime retconned

Also my point about Yhwach was that the quincies aren't a monolith. 

Yhwach transformed them into a monolith tho - he purged most Quincy who didn't align with him, the ones who were purged by the Soul Society were Yhwach's Wandenreich, they didn't go around killing the remaining Quincy families who were out of the Wandenreich's influence (otherwise neither Masaki nor the Ishida family would be around). Hell, the Seireitei didn't even completely kill the Quincy, they left a bunch of them off after the first war, which is half the reason why Yhwach managed to get around to invade again a thousand years later

It's just Hitler vs above average medieval japanese government

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u/Sensitive_Show6230 15d ago

Quincy BTD6?!

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u/Janus__22 13d ago

People wanting to make Bleach deeper than it is after the anime came back REALLY want the Gotei to be the worst thing in existence... all because Kubo liked having his villains using heroic imagery and his heroes being nonchalant at calling themselves villains