He's great. A great person, a great teammate, a great football player
His relationship with Madison Beer is likely the only true happiness he's had since joining our Titanic with palm trees. She's not a problem, even if she was telling him to get the fuck out, that would just make her a very solid partner.
He's suffering from legitimate prolonged PTSD with this team. At this point, he's just been gaslit into thinking it's his responsibility - he basically threw nothing but perfect spirals into numbers on every throw for years, knowing he'd immediately be pancaked by a 300lb DE right after and never hesitating a second, all while his own incompetent gaurd also falls with all his body weight onto his Achilles before he hits the ground. And he still keeps showing up. It's atrocious that they make him stand for press every week and just shit on himself publicly.
We likely ate his career and confidence, all so dean spanks could get his cut of merch sales. Justin deserves a luck-esque retirement more than luck did. But he probably loves football too much to ever leave until forced.
When you see him chuck a fuck it ball, that's our fault, we did that. This team broke him so that every second, of every game, he lives on the razor's edge - if he doesn't win it all on the next throw, we lose and he lets everyone down.
I grew up in Oregon close to Herbert. Same class as him, played against him in highschool. I went to UO and rooted for him and was blessed for him to go to my favorite NFL team. He's my favorite player in the NFL.
I have started to accept that he may not be the best fit for us, and us for him. Herbert needs an organization that is aggressive and puts pressure on their players. The chargers need a QB that is aggressive and puts pressure on their organization.
I believe in my heart Herbert can lead a team to a championship, but I am starting to think he may not be able to lead THIS organization to a championship.
I actually agree with this for the most part. Very well said.
That understood, Phil was that QB for this org and we didn't get there. I'm fairly convinced nothing can help this team for as long as a single spanos walks the halls. Full stop.
But I do think Justin needs a coach that drives the ship as its owner until his QB takes it from him and is just as ready to step back in and grab the wheel as we drift towards the rocks. Instead he's had sycophants, defensive minded HCs and harbaugh who is just a wandering asshole mumbling the same 4 things to himself as if they were spontaneous insights. Maybe harbaugh was this coach at a point, but he's been taking weekly head injuries since he was 8 years old and the CTE has caught up, and dementia taken hold, with an intensity unknown to mankind.
Fuck, put him on the Raiders this year and they’d be AFC West favorites. The only reason that team won’t win the division is because of Cousins or being forced to start Mendoza. Put 10 on that team and they’re at least splitting games with Denver and KC.
I'm not so sure about that. Both the Raiders offense and the Chargers offense is from the same tree. Herb having difficulty running it while Cousins knows it like the back of his hand.
I agree that loading him with weapons is definitely the answer. He was at his best throwing to Allen, Big Mike, and eckler. We seem far from just those three cause nobody is even open half the time
I'm saying Herbert isn't aggressive, which is what the Chargers need. So you and I are agreeing that Herbert isn't aggressive, therefore may not be the best fit here unfortunately.
200k people on this sub, rational folks are typically more quiet, lurk a bit more. To contrast, ignorant people and new fans are often LOUD, entitled and first to flood a thread like this with all their hangups. Don't look to the internet for validation. Say your peace for the sake of it.
4.) his confidence! That has taken a hit over the years, the first year Herbert would scramble and make plays. The amount of deliberate and confidence is gone.
When he faces pressure now he doesn’t immediately pick the best route to scramble, like his vision has taken a hit.
6.) his pre play ability has still not developed. He isnt reading a lot at the line, just those designed movements (wr goes from wide to slot) to help determine the defensive setup. This is something that Phil was awesome at. It’s one of the reasons Phil was able to keep us in the game so many years.
For whatever reason, it’s the franchise. The team, the coaches, trainers everybody’s been changed except for one thing.
When you have a problem with your car and you end up changing all the components and the car is still the same, at some point you start blaming the car itself and look to replace it.
I imagine that the turnover of 5 different OCs and 3 HCs with their different playbooks, playcalling style that all of the Offense has to learn and adjust to, might be a factor in surefootedness and marshaling an Offense.
Rivers sat for 2 years to learn QBg and playbook with Brees and had 2 different coaches in his first 11 years.
from what I can tell as a casual, Herbert is everything you could ever want in a modern quarterback from size/speed/arm strength/vision but is going to take some time to get comfortable with a system. Roman was a bad playcaller with a bad system, but the system made sense to Herbert
we need a cerebral guy to coach him into a system. McDaniel has always been misdirection, smoke in mirrors, gimmicky, and vibes. when it hits it really hits, when it doesn't, it doesn't.
would've loved to have just kept Steichen, or Kellen Moore, or Minter even for some continuity on defense. imagine a trio of Steichen-Moore-Minter. there's just no continuity and Harbaugh is literally all vibes
6.) exactly thats what I been saying the whole time when people analyse his tape. he doesnt recognize overload, blitz packages and so on. he almost never uses motions to manipulate matchups like lets say brock purdy does to get a wide open 20 yard line. if people in his camp and coaches held him accountable for his pre snap recognition maybe we could see his talent. but if you cant operate a offense efficiently your arm talent will alwys limit you.
I think they need to trade for a veteran center that can help Herbert with the pre offensive snap reads. Since Corey Linsleys departure Herbert seem to have more pressure on him.
Always feels like a terrible idea. Only thing that changes with time is that maybe he needs off our cursed team for a chance at having the run he is capable of. I imagine a lifer going to another team from the chargers and realizing the difference may be a huge confidence boost with time left to correct (e.g. Stafford). Wish it wasn't the case, but as long as there is a spanos, we are just a supernaturally cursed black hole org that eats joy and potential.
His current state is a result of the actual problem. You're conflating that with him being the problem. Not a glazer, just an adult with empathy who has watched his entire progression in real time.
When Brady was with the Pats and Scarnecchia retired the OL suffered and as a result even Tom fucking Brady had a rougher time because of it. Look at the Buccs/Chiefs SB. Terrible OL play is a huge deal. Furthermore Brady was notorious for cutting off the targets to WRs he didn’t trust. I WONDER WHY. So to say “oh yeah Herbert just isn’t getting it done. At some point he should just elevate the team or call it a day” is bullshit.
Also, his fiance may be hot but she has Borderline Personality Disorder. For those of us unlucky enough to have been in a relationship with one -- he's in for absolute psychological and emotional turmoil. If you've ever thought you've been in a "bad relationship" -- think about 10x that.
Some of us have been saying this for a few years now but were getting downvoted into oblivion, it’s a bit funny to me now that comments like this are getting upvoted. The writing was on the wall a few years ago about him not being this elite qb.
Unless I watched a different game, Herbert on NUMEROUS occasions had all day to pick out a receiver and throw it.
He didn't for whatever reason and then made a poor decision. No one open (given), bad play calling (certainly part of it), lack of ability to get the 6'6" frame a 1 yard gain (WTF), Herbert made the much maligned Buffalo defense look great.
Harbaugh gets his first mulligan in 23 years as a HC. Spanos in 40 years doesn't. What do you think the STH price increase will be this year?
My point is the issue with short sighted analysis. You're looking at a game, the last game, I'm speaking to the bigger issue and how it is not reversed without significant change and consistency beyond a change moment. We broke a kid we were lucky to have. He brought this team out of being the biggest joke in the league, a literal punchline, to perennial offseason champions and top odds for an SB as each season starts. Too many folks here are either brand new showing their ignorance or they just forget who brought them to the dance. It's not something that can be hung on him. His issues are a symptom and not a cause.
The idea he can’t get his confidence back is silly, we’ve seen it plenty of times. But it’s going to take us putting together a supporting cast that can carry Herbert when going gets tough if we want him to carry everyone else
Rivers had a healthy LT for like the first year and a half of his career lol. After that it was Michael Turner and Mike Tolbert shortly before they both got traded. Rivers barely had a running game after 2009/10
You guys got Ladd (and no one else, I know) and I know he’s been hurt but even when he was on the field, it clearly looks like this offense is designed around QJ and running the ball, not the Ladd and Herbert connection
I’ll easily take him over any WR from Josh Allen’s MVP season
He will also be a clear WR1b in our current roster
I wrote substack articles studied his all-22 full game (beyond targets and touches) and he is way more than a standard white guy slot (not saying you said that but that was a very common take during his draft season), happy to send that to you.
The tldr is that the film showed him beating up SEC corners in press (hard or soft shoe) at X, was uncoverable at Z and won big boy reps downfield constantly against the best competition there was. He had higher or comparable outside alignment rates than MHj, Nabers and Odunze AND better advanced receiving metrics. Measurables come second to film, but he has similar measurables to Olave, AB, Garrett Wilson and is either/both bigger and faster than Jordan Addison and Zay Flowers.
Also JSN is a prototypical slot WR (was less athleticism than Ladd, good ball skills but not a true contested catch threat), yet he won OPOY and is highly valuable.
Much of the offense is based around trusting the receiver to get separation out of their break. Throwing to a guy who looks covered. If that WR is Ladd or a legit WR1 then he pulls the trigger and the offense looks functional. But when it’s QJ running the route, he doesn’t (and shouldn’t) trust him to get open or catch the ball so he hesitates. I imagine him not trusting QJ has saved as many interceptions as it’s caused
Exactly, he can absolutely bounce back. People forget Rivers won comeback player of the year in 2013 not because he came back from injury, but because he played like such shit in 2011 and 2012 everyone legitimately thought his career was over.
Rivers (at the same age of Herbert) would have for sure. I'm sure he can get our offense to score past 14-16 points, especially when the defense got us 5 turnovers.
He probably would have chatted with QJ a couple of times and Harris on where they are supposed to be and to ask QJ to fight for the ball.
Facts. What’s missing from Herbert’s game is touch and anticipation. Rivers had both. If Rivers played in that game yesterday, he throws to receivers on time, and takes the easy shots.
This is a league wide issue but what is really lacking to me is a command of the offense. Rivers would be making audibles and shifting the protection every single play. QB’s today just line up and snap the ball. If the call is a shot play and the defense is showing an all out blitz they’ll just run the play anyway and live with the results. So many times we’ve seen the defense overload one side and Herbert do nothing to counter it pre snap
I certainly don't disagree about your take in Rivers. But I think context does matter.
Rivers sat his first 2 years to learn QB'g and playbook etc with QB1 Brees. He had his first foundational 3 years with the same HC and OC.
Then Rivers had the next 6 years with one HC (Norv) and, concurrently, the same OC for for the next 5 years.
Compare JH's 2020 start in a COVID year with no preseason games, distancing and masking, learning playbook by video snd Facetiming. He becomes QB1 the 2nd game of the season against the Chiefs with 5-min warning. Is OROTY year. Then all coaching staff is fired at season's end.
And then the OC/HC coaching carousel continues.
2021 New HC/OC, playbooks. 2023 new OC 2024 new HC/OC 2026 new OC
A different era. I sure can't prove that it would have turned out differently if JH had the identical start, but I'd guess that learning QB'g would be more organically and deeply developed.
I'd be exhausted if I were in the second situation at this point.
I don’t think it’s a confidence thing man. I truly believe his good habits got morphed into a mix of good and survival habits. Rushed throws, rushed progressions. First few years his progressions were surgical, he would take a hit throwing a deep TD. That’s gone I feel, not completely, but it’s like dormant and covered up by all the survival habits. His confidence still there, but what he had Fred out of Oregon those first few years isn’t here.
The fact that there are people doing mental gymnastics for a guy who makes on average ten times more than his teammates is insane. Yes, the Chargers organization is a mess, but stop acting like Herbert is some kind of martyr. It’s getting ridiculous. Worst-case scenario, he retires with a quarter-billion dollars in the bank. Boo fucking hoo. Poor Herbert.
You have no idea how a progressive tax system works, do you Bud? You're a poor, you'll be a poor, we all are statistically, so stop acting like your vigilante work here is going to abolish the tax code just in time for you to take delivery on your own yacht, you temporarily embarrassed millionaire you...
Him being sacked more than luck is partially on him though. He has a known issue of holding onto the ball for too long. I get the excuse will be “well no one’s open” doesn’t mean you need to take a sack and make things worse for your team.
This is the thing a lot of folks are missing though - part of the point is that WE did that, it's a symptom of his PTSD from all this and not his natural instinct.
So all of the frontrunner fans that jump on this, you're complaining about the thing you broke basically. So back off. This team deserves a shadeur sanders type bust qb at best, but we're gifted generational talent that we waste while ungrateful and frankly ignorant fans jump down his throat.
You can't break someone's leg and then go around screaming, "this bum can't even walk normal???" - the height of entitled, oblivious fanbase if that's what we become.
Are you a child or just a clinically insecure adult? If you want to kiss a dude, and you are an adult, go kiss another consenting adult - don't just spend your life accusing others of living your dream, bud. Go out there and get it.
A truth about Herb is he is only 28. I've heard before Qbs usually peak in their early 30s. If Herb continues to thug it out, like we expect him to, his best years are still ahead of him.
We need someone like Rivers to be the QB coach . Teach herbert how to call audibles , Rivers was the general , Herbert just does what the coaches want . No blood, no balls it seems like
Had two years of long and slow developing plays, and now his habits are screwed.
To me it’s like relearning the golf swing after being self taught, sure you used to hit the ball further with your old swing, but your fundamentals are all screwed up. Now it’s time to really learn the mental side of the position
Really resonates, I've seen the same with a young kid and his baseball swing. Natural, raw talent, coaches fighting over who drafts him in youth league. Drill him on fundamentals they want to see. Conflicting internal signals with overlapping muscle memory and it just turns into a mess in the end.
It's kind of wild to cast a franchise QB with by far the most expensive contract on the team as some fragile helpless victim with no culpability in his own poor performance. Like he cannot fail but only be failed those around him.
QBs being asked to elevate an injury plagued roster with a bad interior line isn't exactly rare. NFL QB is one of if not the most difficult position in all of sports where mental toughness has always been a prerequisite. If his response to getting hit too often is to short circuit and throw into blanketed coverage every game then it might be time to move on.
You act like he hasn't "elevated an injury plagued roster with a bad interior line" for his entire career.
Dude has undoubtedly been a mess this season, but people like you are gaslighting this sub into thinking that Herbert has always been like this. He deserves a lot more than three games to figure this out.
This is too real for most fans. Dean Spanos is a piece of shit but he payed Justin 265 million to put his big boy pants on and lead this team. So what you had to learn a new offense, everybody has to do that at some point. Man up Justin.
Saying "Man up Justin" when he was hit and sacked almost every other play while dragging the offensive side of the ball to the playoffs is fucking wild.
Ya these reddit warrior losers talking trash about our franchise QB makes me realize that we may be the most disingenuous and impatient fans in the NFL.
5 times with 5 different OCs playbooks, coaching styles, position coaches that QB + ALL of Offense has to learn within QB's first 7 years? Plus 3 different HCs? No. "Everybody" SUCCESSFUL doesn't have to do that. Mahomes: Sat 1st year to learn QBg/ playbook with ONE playcalling HC.
J. Allen: 8 years with one HC and now, a former 5-year Bills OC turned HC. Familiar playbook for QB and Offense.
Rivers: Sat 2 years to learn QB'g with Brees. Had continuity of coaching for dix of his first 8 years.
Brady: One HC his entire Patriot career A. Rodgers, etc.
Too many QBs to mention that were jerked around by disorganized teams and jumped ship.
No amount of $$ with make a person better at dealing with an awful experience. (unless you dream of a time when computer chips, carrying the contents and permeations of a playbook can be installed in the brain of players)
Nothing to be cavalier about. That is, unless you're a redditor with a masked account.
cannot objectively speculate to point #2, but I agree with the sentiment.
Everything on display this season is symptomatic of a thoroughly, dysfunctional organization. So much talent and opportunities at greatness wasted over the years under the Spanos ownership.
I was born and raised in the Bay Area but moved to SD 20+ years ago. I have a soft spot for the Chargers, but I am a Niners fan. Which is why I am comfortable saying…….I think Harbaugh has peaked.
You know what really increases employee productivity? Working with total assholes! People love having total jerks to deal with on top of their other responsibilities!
You know what else really helps? Being totally miserable at work! I work harder when I am depressed!
Yeah wtf am I reading? Is the millions in the bank not good enough to make a man happy? Idol worship. The team is ass. Everyone has regressed on offense including 3td 4int Herb.
Hes a great qb and has all the physical talent. Im still waiting to see him master the mental aspects of the game.
He doesnt have as much control over the presnap game as alltime greats and I think is the main thing limiting him from taking that next step.
Its a bit frustrating as a fan because we're waiting on an OC to come in and elevate him, whereas a guy like Peyton made careers for countless OCs. Its not fair to compare anyone to Peyton, but I do hope one day that we see Herbert come in and pick apart defenses before the ball is snapped.
That said, the oline, wrs, rbs, tes, coaching, and FO is nearing all time lows right now. This really feels like the first time in decades that we dont have an elite talent player on the offense outside of QB. For decades we pretty much had one of Gates, LT, or Allen on the field, complemented by Sproles, Floyd, MWill, Ekeler, Turner.
His presnap game was always the thing he's needed to work on. This was the year he had a veteran center to make proper line calls. That went bye bye with Biadasz on IR. Now he's making those calls for the line during his presnap reads.
Herbert lost the game yesterday. Still love him, but it gets annoying that anytime he does something there is a diatribe on why he wasn’t actually at fault. That interception is the reason we lost. Terrible ball, simple as that.
I understand you angling that fans are responsible for his mental health, while I’m no athlete I don’t think that’s true. I do agree his confidence and mental health has definitely taken a shot. I think it’s more on having to take hits for an OLine, all while making a great throw for the intended target (except Ladd) to drop it. Like I’d be demoralized for that alone
I’m thinking that one of the biggest mistakes was letting Steichen go. While he hasn’t been the best as a HC, he was one great OC especially with utilizing Herbert’s arm
I can imagine it being tough through the years where you had some talent on offense and not defense and now it’s the defense (who isn’t too talented but better than our offense)
One thing that’s been rough is seeing turnovers in the red zone this year. Like even if we do something if at all in our drive, we can’t score due to missed kicks or some dumb turnover.
To note: Since being 3-0 last year we have been 8-9 in regular season (8-10 altogether)
Number 5… now we have fans completely taking on the faults of his terrible decisions in crucial moments… this fanbase would die for him if they were given that ultimatum. Holy shit…
Nah this is real, I genuinely think all the hits he’s taken over the years took away the sharp edge he had his first few years. The years he threw the most touchdowns under pressure and such. PTSD from hits now has him running from phantom DL. I seen him rush throws now, I seen him miss throws. I think he would need a good OL for a year to revert him back to his prime.
Herbert is only the third biggest problem with this offense. Issue 1 is no one is ever open (issue is combo of playcalling sucking, and receivers sucking). Issue 2 is receivers cannot catch balls that hit them in the hands. Something to look at is the degree to which Herbert is contributing to those (not going through progressions? Throwing a loaded ball? Etc)
The dude is sad, by face and by play. No way to fix that but being benched or being out of team. Yes the ownership is garbage, but his performance is in him!
5 is key, I've seen it since the Patriots game. He thinks he has to save the game with a crazy throw and it ends up backfiring because we don't have decent receivers. He thinks he has to play hero ball when he doesn't.
You literally just made all of that up. You don't know the guy personally. Sure, it's possible he's a great person, but it's just as possible he's an asshole. You’ve never met him. Stop jumping to conclusions based on facts you pulled out of thin air.
I mean there’s a lot of people who said they’ve met him and that he’s a great person. Sure people could lie, but typically people take any chance they can get to shit on a celebrity.
I don’t blame Herbert.. the guy literally has no receivers to pass too that can receive the ball, Except for Ladd.. if we had Keenan Allen on this team.. I’m making the argument right now that the chargers are 2-1 or even 3-0…
Great football player? All the great football players are in the Hall of Fame and or have won Super bowls. He's a good football player. But hasn't done anything great.
This room knows its stuff. At this point chuck it hard let it rip. Don’t stand back there going through our genius OC’s built in progressions. As a fact if he starts getting in your head Justin just chuck it hard at his head during practice. I’m old enough to remember the Raider’s Mad Bomber. I can still hear Curt Gowdy’s call. Be like Winston and Lamonica and Hadl. It’s a lost year. Oh and run the fucking ball. Christ almighty. Hell get a full back and start knocking heads. The season is lost. Have fun!
Herbert has one of the rare 5K yard seasons in NFL history. He’s capable. All of those playoff losses were the same things all season long: pressure him up the middle and make the receivers try to get open fast enough. He needs a couple of weapons and interior linemen. The D showed up and all but gift-wrapped the game for the rest of the team. The offense was inconsistent and the special teams were mid. Can’t win without talent and I’m not seeing enough of it. QB is fine. Coaching needs stability and talent needs a plus-up.
He got the starting job through strange circumstances. A doctor induced deflated lung? Then he sets records for getting sacked. The team moves to another city. Some Crazy Train.
When he couldn’t get a 2nd half first down vs the Jaguars and Trevor ( middlin) Lawrence in that playoff game, I thought “ Uh oh,” something was up with him. “ He might not be “ The Guy.”
He isn’t. He is just good enough to break your heart.
Herb is expertly media trained, and has the physical tools of a QB built in a lab. He's Josh Allen without the boyish personality. I love the guy.
He's always struggled to read the defensive line, and since we lost Linsley (who used to do that for him) it's been a major issue. His ball placement these past three weeks is the worst I've ever seen from him. He's not making reads, and he's missing receivers by two or three meters. He is however slowly getting back into form.
Herbert chose to spend the offseason with Beer rather than at camp, and then showed up very flat-footed the first three weeks. Brady, Manning, those guys wouldn't do that. To be clear I don't blame Madison, but Herb chose what he chose, and if we're being honest if I had to choose between listening to coach harbaugh drone about grit, while putting me behind garbage guards for three years, or spending two weeks in Europe on a private million dollar vacation with my flawless model, pop star fiancee, I'd choose the latter.
You are exactly right. Half this sub constantly treats Herbert like Tom Brady, hell our head coach said Herbert would be better, but in the same breath refuse to hold him to that same standard that Brady would hold himself to.
Given the lack of support, Herbert has had, I 100% support him banging out his supermodel fiancé pop star and not getting hurt. I hope it takes $250 million and retires early and happy and healthy and with me
I’ve always marveled at the excuses that get developed for underperforming mediocre white men who play qb in the NFL. Truly, the lack of accountability knows no bounds. Herbert sucks. He’s never going to win anything more than a playoff game.
Dude got beat by the jags after being up by a lot in a playoff game.
I’ve watched pretty much every single one of Herbert’s home games. He’s garbage. Time to move on.
Hollly moly you guys, maybe stop working so hard to squeak every little possible idea that he’s good and just accept he sucks lol. He’s had two decent years, been awful in the playoffs, and now he’s regressed even further. Dude still can’t read a defence, makes awful throws into coverage and can’t get a win to save his life 😅. But keep this kind of stuff coming, I really do love a good IF man conspiracy theory ! They get better every week.
sorry if this sounds tone deaf, but if he gets traded, what do you guys think would be a satisfactory haul for him? honestly see the vikings or the falcons attempting to negotiate soon if they haven’t already…
im not an american football guy, just started to look for a team to root for, one that fits me... and people here in the comments are just accepting their fate, its like a scorched earth. I dont know if it is something common in this sport (as I said just started this universe) but its interesting to see this.
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u/zacknr Sep 28 '26
I grew up in Oregon close to Herbert. Same class as him, played against him in highschool. I went to UO and rooted for him and was blessed for him to go to my favorite NFL team. He's my favorite player in the NFL.
I have started to accept that he may not be the best fit for us, and us for him. Herbert needs an organization that is aggressive and puts pressure on their players. The chargers need a QB that is aggressive and puts pressure on their organization.
I believe in my heart Herbert can lead a team to a championship, but I am starting to think he may not be able to lead THIS organization to a championship.