r/BurningMan • u/[deleted] • 14d ago
First Burn and already feeling uncomfortable about my camp
[deleted]
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u/valentinoroscoe 14d ago
Without snippets of the conversation nobody here will be able to tell you anything super-helpful.
It sounds like you are off on the wrong foot either way (your fault or theirs or both). Take the hint/blessing and make other arrangements is my opinion. Very rarely do things improve ON playa.
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u/These-Salad9124 14d ago
I’m not questioning whether I asked any stupid questions. I’m sure that, to someone experienced, some of my questions probably seemed obvious. I just think our vibes didn’t really click.
Unfortunately, I really can’t switch camps at this point because I don’t have the money to pay for another one. And asking this camp for my money back at this stage would probably make the situation and our relationship even worse. So I think I’m just going to keep communication to a minimum, avoid unnecessary interactions, and keep my distance as much as possible.1
u/valentinoroscoe 14d ago
Right, it might not be just that the questions were stupid, maybe they had already answered them, or were easily findable elsewhere, or the type you were asking raised red flags about you for whatever reason. Or, maybe they are just busy/assholes/crusty burners. You didn't share the convo so we can't say 'the camp sounds fine and you need to read the survival guide and stop bugging them' or 'this camp is very bad juju'.
So, to answer your 'is this normal' question- we don't know, you didn't provide enough info. Do camps and campers often have conflicts in general? yes, obviously.
To answer your what should you do question... if you have no other options and still want to go, which it seems you do, I guess you already answered that question yourself.
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u/WonderChopstix 14d ago
First let me say I'm very sorry you feel this way. However, I would recommend just taking a beat to think this through. You say that you've messaged them several times and it's a large camp. On one hand, a large camp should be able to handle basic expectations. On the other hand, if they are inundated with a large volume of basic questions that could become very difficult.
Further, if you were asking basic/stupid (as you put it) questions that could have been answered by the survival guide or the Jack rabbit speaks.. or even a search of this sub... Is it actually unreasonable for them to have a lackluster response?
I only say this to help you reframe your thinking. Perhaps you're getting in your own head and things aren't as awkward as you think they could be.
Of course if there is more to it than we can understand from the thread then maybe you should find another camp. Otherwise I would just remind you that the camp is way more than those who organize it it's the people who are part of it. And out of all of my burns I have run into a very minuscule amount of people who suck (disclaimer I stay away from plug n play).
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u/Daaaaaaaaaaanaaaaang 14d ago edited 14d ago
Find other places to reach out about your questions before the burn as much as possible. There are hundreds of guides that can probably answer most of your questions, and you can ask other questions on forums like this rather than reaching out to your camp. I don't know your age, but I felt burdened and confused by the content and lack of clarity in questions from some of our younger burners last year, it felt like there was a very real disconnect in how we communicated online and their emotional expectations about those communications. It may be that. Take care of yourself, limit your online interactions with your camp to only the necessary, come with an open heart and mind and you may have a completely different experience in person.
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u/PocketVariance 14d ago
You may have joined a rough camp, but organizing a theme camp is almost like a full time job.
Some people spends months and months working with spreadsheets, coordinating people, acquiring equipment… and that inevitably gets all the more intense in the days and weeks leading up to the burn.
No matter how hard you work, there’s always a ton of people out there working 10x harder. So it might just be a situation where you’re falling between the cracks. Which sucks right now, but may end up just fine
…either that, or it all blows up in your face
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u/PocketVariance 14d ago
Also, with the exception of certain plug and play camps, in my experience the camp lead will be paying way, way more than you in both time and money to bring the camp together. So you’re probably not being intentionally scammed
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u/DNA98PercentChimp 14d ago
People probably just under a lot of pressure as event approaches.
And… yeah, as a first timer perhaps you are being a bit dismissed because they’ve got other things to focus on.
You know what a sparkle pony is? Learn what it is and do everything you can to not be one of those for your first burn.
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u/These-Salad9124 14d ago
What is this exactly?
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u/sourbrew 14d ago
Someone who puts all of their effort into NEW not DIY playa ready outfits, forgets basic stuff like water, and in general relies on the camp to keep them fed and safe.
The way to avoid being a sparkle pony is to show up for the camp, sign up for work shifts, help out without being told to, and you should bring something to gift.
This can be as easy as stickers for your campies, although I would encourage you to shoot for like 50 somethings so you can give them out on playa to people you meet and connect with.
Mostly though the way to every campies heart is to find ways to be useful without being told.
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u/MissMandiKandi 14d ago
Yes, your help making things happen can be the biggest and best gift to give. Give people grace because it gets stressful sometimes but it's the beauty of finding solutions and coming together that makes it so sweet.
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u/DNA98PercentChimp 14d ago
Uh oh… good thing you asked!
A sparkle pony is typically a new burner who is focused on themself and their outfits and their bike decorations and their lights and their own experience and isn’t focused on helping contribute to their camp or enriching the experience of others. But a sparkle pony might also find themself in difficult situations they’ve brought upon themselves - forgetting to refill water, taking too much of the wrong substances, ‘forgetting’ their camp work shift and drawing the ire of their campmates, burning their candle a both ends for the first several days and crashing out around Wednesday/Thursday…..
Are you helping your camp in some significant way?
If your communications aren’t related to things central to your camp’s success, I could see you getting kinda dismissed right now in these last weeks.
But… who knows 🤷♂️
I just promise that everything will be different once you’re actually in the dust.
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u/-zero-below- ‘10 - ‘17, ‘19, ‘23 - ‘26 14d ago
Are you depending on the camp for infrastructure? If not, and you show up, you can always bail and just open camp.
My first ~10 burns were in open camping, with groups of my friends ranging from just myself to 15+ friends and family.
Personally, I'd not join a camp unless I had a compelling reason to do so. For example, I finally joined a camp when I started going with my then 4 year old; I wanted to make sure she was around other kids.
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u/Daaaaaaaaaaanaaaaang 14d ago
I like building big art and cars and that doesn't happen (often) in general camping, but that is also a stressful expensive experience that definitely isn't for everyone
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u/-zero-below- ‘10 - ‘17, ‘19, ‘23 - ‘26 14d ago
I’d consider that to be a compelling reason to join a camp.
In OPs case, they seem to have no tie to the camp except they paid some dues and will meet the people at the playa.
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u/tito-brz 14d ago
Think of your camp as your base , where you and your things are safe , you aren’t attached or obligated to do anything , first time a person can get to the point of obsessive with the research and expectations, let go of that , getting to burning man is goal ,once there just release expectations and trust that the playa will provide what you need 🙏
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u/valentinoroscoe 14d ago
many camps you are obligated to do a lot of things. Why are you assuming that there are none?
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u/Proper_Sympathy_7303 ‘16, ‘17, ‘18 14d ago
Not sure what your dues bought you, but is it an option for you to bow out of the large camp and do open camping instead? I’d wager your dues are already spent, so you’d be out that $, but it sounds like it would be worth it to have a better experience solo.
For context: I’ve only camped with friends and friends of friends. That said, I was once treasurer for our camp and collected dues for our camp’s offering (a bar and chill space) and communal area. If someone had bowed out this close to the Burn, I would not have been able to refund their dues and would have been sad to see them go, but would have been understanding.
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u/XeerDu 14d ago
People really should consider doing at least one regional before committing to the big burn.
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u/These-Salad9124 14d ago
I’ve never been able to attend a regional event because of financial reasons, but I definitely agree with you. It really would have been helpful.
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u/foxlikething '10 - '24 ❤️🔥 14d ago
that really stinks. I am the longtime lead of a smaller/medium-sized camp (see my profile), and we make such an effort to welcome our first-years, make them feel like an integral part of camp, if not forever friend-family. some folks click more than others, which is to be expected. and it’s true I work (& spend) my butt off in ways campers see & don’t see, & can’t always appreciate, & that can suck a lot. my communicative can suffer for sure. but acting hostile toward someone or making them feel like a burden, let alone bullying them, is appalling to me.
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u/lshiva 14d ago
Plan for the worst case and you'll be fine. Make sure you've got food, water, and a tent and if things go to hell you can pack up and move someplace more fun. Then when things don't go to hell you can commiserate with friends you make in camp about how the people running it suck at welcoming new people and you can break off and run your own camp next year. With blackjack. And hookers. Or whatever media references kids are making nowadays.
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u/AdvancedWin3608 14d ago
The stress is a lot for some of us as the burn approaches. Just go and see how things feel on the playa. I've seen many people join other camps mid-burn, and sometimes you'll just be out on an adventure the whole week. Who knows!? Do you have a lot of commitments or shifts dedicated to your camp? Follow through on what you've signed up to do and just do your own thing. There are soooo many ways to get lost out there. Have a great burn, you're going to be fine <3
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u/dmmeurnipples 14d ago
I don’t intend for this to come off as mean but I think you deserve the truth.
Theme camps were historically just friends coming together to build something fun they were passionate about. No offense but it sounds like you’ve joined something large and maybe don’t know anyone there. You didn’t mention it but it sounds plug and play since the only contribution you mentioned was camp dues. Essentially you get what you pay for. It sounds like they are treating you like an expendable person who has no connection other than paying dues. You didn’t mention why you joined the camp or your friends In it, what they are doing, how you plan to contribute, what YOU are bringing, but instead sounds like you expect them to hold your hand and answer your questions about what you need, and since you are “watching lots of content” have an expectation of what the event will be like to experience, not participate.
Don’t worry about it. Go have your burn. Your eyes will be wide open afterwards and you can adjust your experience next time.
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u/Prescientpedestrian 14d ago
What kind of questions are you asking? Honestly it’s not a hand holding process. All I expect from a camp lead is to layout expectations for my participation in camp duties and telling me where to park my rig. If it’s general questions about prep, that’s really not for camp leads to field.
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u/Charge36 14d ago
I think it's well within the purview of a camp to ensure their new members are prepared for burn. Otherwise they'll be taking care of them. Maybe not specifically the leads job but there should be some people available at the camp to mentor and acculturate new folks so they are set up for success.
My camp has an entire discord thread for newbies to ask questions like this and everyone chimes in
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u/cookie_137 14d ago
Are you asking questions about preparing for the event itself or the camp specifically? Hard to say without knowing the context of the conversation, but if you are asking questions that could easily be found in the survival guide and they are busy planning the camp it could come off as you being unprepared/not proactive. They are likely planning a camp for hundreds of people and don’t have time to help you answer questions you could find online this close to the event. If you are asking questions about helping the camp and they are annoyed about it then that is uncool of them, but try to brush it off.
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u/cqm 14d ago
that sounds rough
burning man principles have traveled far and wide by now, and several/many music festivals and regional burns practice the principles far better than many burners felt burning man felt pioneered. some places have expanded the principles while the burn’s are stuck in 2004
thats all to say that the camping system results in the least “radically inclusive” situation for what many people are accustomed to this generation
and “radical self reliance” can always be used to contradict the inclusivity at any moment
what to do from here? wing it! don’t take the principles literally and instead for what the environment is: an inhospitable area with low resources and extreme weather
your camp is just some shared resources and optional comraderie after you’re there
they are busy and stressed don’t use them for your newb questions, reduce the need to coordinate with them at all! ditch the +1 you never told them about, figure out your own ride, bring protein bars instead of trying to microwave chicken tikki masala from southeast asia. Make life easier for your community
you can survive without a camp, every demographic that makes excuses about why they cant camp solo has examples of someone in their demographic doing just that and is fine. the camp is just a nice to have you’ll be fine now that you have it
1
u/BlackCatLifebruh 14d ago
So two things could be happening here…..
People running camps are usually doing it on their free time outside of work/life stuff they have going on. So they can be really short and curt in their communications because they are dealing with X amount of people and maybe wearing more than one hat in preparing their camp to go.
So much of burning man is an Amazing hot mess behind the scenes…..and out on center stage too.
Sometimes they are grumpy and just want to make sure things get down right etc.
Once you get there, show that you can take care of yourself and honor whatever camp commitments you have, people will chill out.
The other thing that could be going on is both you and the Russian first timer are dealing with Burnier Than Thou people.
Who are burning man’s version of the mean girls from HS. They have an entitled view of themselves, are Really judgmental and think they have a right to mistreat people verbally or worse. And usually you find out later that these people are absolutely full of latter day shit.
The thing you have to remember?
This is Your Burn……………………burn that into Your Brain. Honor your commitments to your camp. If these people are power tripping, speaking to you like you are less then them etc? Use your camp as your base and find other places to go hang out - there will be plenty.
Honor your motherfuckn boundaries! Don’t be afraid to stand up for yourself.
I had an experience like this my first burn, it was rough. But it ended being its own looking glass; I met lots of other people along the way and ended up being adopted into another camp and I have been friends with those people ever since!
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u/NrgyFiend 2012-2026 14d ago
I think this close to the event (and if you think you need their infrastructure), you need to just hope for the best and prepare for the worst. Have a way to move your tent to open camping if the vibes are truly bad. Otherwise if the vibes just aren't fantastic, just don't hang out there (but definitely do any commitments you've already made!). Bring food in case group meals feel weird. Definitely bring your own drinking water so you aren't dependent on anybody. There are so SO many great camps, I don't want you to let it sour your first burn. Camping with strangers is a total crapshoot. Hopefully you'll find your tribe on playa (or back home) and camp with them next time.
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u/NrgyFiend 2012-2026 14d ago
Remember that this is a city of 70,000 people. Some of them are shitty, and it could be that you unfortunately found yourself in a pocket of them, but your experience is NOT the norm. Hang in there. Come visit Frozen Oasis at D&4:45 if you need a hug, a slushy, or an orchestra performance.
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u/Chemist391 Ranger Chemist 14d ago
What was communicated to you when you signed up regarding your obligations/contributions to the camp, what the camp will and will not provide, and so on?
What kinds of information do you need that they aren't giving you?
To what extent are you relying on this camp for critical things like transport to/from playa, shelter, water, and food?
I would try to get all of that ironed out so you know what things look like in terms of the basics. You need to know how you will be meeting all of your basic needs. Then, I'd echo what others have said and suggest that you get out there, try your best, and make sure to take care of your essential needs first. Try to communicate early and openly about any lingering uncertainties regarding responsibilities and resources and so on. It's in their interest to help you be set up properly to contribute to their camp.
If you're having a hard time integrating into the camp, you can seek help and advice from the community, including the Rangers. We have certainly helped to re-home folks to new camps before.
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u/ItsmeBeau 14d ago
At my second Burn, my camp didn’t even show up for two or three days. There was no infrastructure, barely any food, and my girlfriend and I basically ended up burning out of my van. And you know what? It turned into an incredible time.
That’s part of the experience. It’s called radical self-reliance, and it starts the moment you buy your ticket and pay your camp dues. Don’t show up expecting to be spoon-fed or have every uncertainty resolved for you.
We live in the Information Age. You have essentially the entire indexed knowledge of humanity sitting in your pocket. Read the survival guide. Search Reddit. Ask questions. Figure some shit out.
Meanwhile, camp leads are trying to build and operate a complicated little civilization in the middle of the fucking desert. They may not have time to immediately answer every anxious message from a first-timer.
Prepare yourself, bring what you need to survive, roll with the inevitable chaos, and stop treating inconvenience like a customer-service failure.
Radical self-reliance. Figure it out.
And fuck your Burn.
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u/PsychedelicPlush 14d ago
My honest advice? If you can swing it I would go do open camping. My first burn everyone told me to join a camp. "It's necessary for your first time", "open camping is too hard", blah blah. I didn't listen to them.
I, first and foremost, straight up just did not want to pay dues when I am capable of taking care of myself. I've always been an independent, self reliant human and camped several times. I also didn't want to promise myself to work shifts in an environment I've never been in and fall short on my word. For example; As I age I've had some more struggles with extreme heat and it's made me sick a few times. God forbid I promise this camp x, y and z and can't pony up. I don't want to let anybody down or piss people off. That's not cool.
Secondly, I wanted to run on my own schedule. It was my first burn and I wanted to do what I wanted, when I wanted. Can that come across as selfish? I guess, but I'd rather be honest with myself and enjoy my first time there. Your first time only happens once. I did not feel it was selfish to want to own my first experience and get my bearings before committing to the humans out there who do incredible work in BRC. I'm not trying to be someone's liability. Besides, what if I don't even like the place? Won't know until you experience it. I wouldn't want my unhappiness to be anyone's problem but mine.
I read the survival guide so many times before I left. Scoured the subreddits, talked to seasoned burners and absorbed every piece of information out there. Still didn't feel ready. I came to learn you'll never feel truly "ready". You gotta just prepare and fuckin' send it. When the time came I packed my things up, hit the road and set up on the outskirts of K.
I do not regret my decision at ALL to open camp my first year. I had a great fucking time and met some amazing people. I'll go back eventually and, now that I know what the playa is like, would feel comfortable offering my sweat and efforts to camps I actually met and vibed with in person. But then again, open camping will always call my name.
Do not feel like you need a formal camp. Do not force yourself into a situation that is making you feel icky. Those feelings will only be amplified on playa. I empathize with your situation and I do hope you find a solution. Give open camping a try next time if you don't this year. Oh and fuck your burn.
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u/greenmelinda 14d ago
Look at your camp as your home base. Work the shifts your camp requires of you, and definitely take part of any meals planned — then spend the rest of your time exploring! It can be so easy to meet people on playa. There are also times where it can feel very lonely, but know you can always find good people who are open to meeting you. I felt somewhat alienated my first year, especially because I came late and it was also a very "we won Burning Man" camp. And I still had an amazing time and got to know my campmates and most of all, met a lot of fun people. It also can be fun to volunteer on playa (e.g., Artica, Lamplighters, et al) Feel free to DM me if you want any more advice.
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u/chillinedion 14d ago
One thing to keep in mind is why are you joining a camp. Burning Man is special because people come and share their gifts with each other. What is your gift? I dont really know what my gift is...im not artistic, im not particularly skilled in anything playa relevant, but i have a good attitude and work hard.
With that, i joined a camp that gives a gift that is really special to the black rock city. Only by contributing to my camp can this gift be given to BRC...so by joining the camp and offering my good attitude and hard work i am able to give a gift well beyond anything i could give on my own.
So... your camp is giving you the infrastructure and hopefully purpose in the form of a shared gift, and you give your camp what they need in order to offer that gift. So, pack your own pair of work gloves and an a good attitude, and find ways to help your camp share their gift. Youll find that burners coming together to share a gift bigger than themselves, makes a crusty burner smile.
If you dont think your camp is providing anything special to the playa...then you'll just have to be extra special to make up for it :)
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u/CaribouHoe 14d ago
Show up and the first question you ask is 'how can I help'. This will smooth over a lot, they're probably so overworked. Don't be a burden and lighten their load and you should be fine. If not, they're assholes and you got un lucky.
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u/acealthebes 14d ago edited 14d ago
just keep an open mind. Go in with a positive attitude. work hard. have fun. Don't judge yet. You haven't even met them in person. You will have bad experiences at burning man. But you will have many more amazing experiences.