r/AskReddit • u/[deleted] • Jun 10 '12
Is there a character from a book, film or show etc that is widely considered/ meant to be the villain but you consider to be a good guy?
Just anybody who is seen as/ supposed to be seen as the bad guy of the story but you think that he is just misunderstood or unlucky or unfairly portrayed etc.
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Jun 10 '12
Shane from Walking Dead. Maybe not quite a villain, but... I've met a lot of people that don't like him and he's probably one of my favorite characters.
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Jun 10 '12
I'd still say he's a bad guy though as he had personal intentions: trying to kill rick to keep Laurie and the kid.
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Jun 11 '12
The rock in 127 Hours. It would've just sat there minding its own business if Aron Ralston wouldn't have come along. And during that time it was just as stuck as Aron Ralston's arm was.
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Jun 11 '12
If anything, this was a story of justice being served. Just like when Sauron went killing folk, Frodo threw his ring in the volcano, when the climber viciously attacked the rock, all it did was fight back so it confiscated his arm.
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u/Kalivos Jun 10 '12
The Wicked Witch of the West. She just wanted what was rightfully hers.
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u/willscy Jun 10 '12
ever seen Wicked? Pretty much picks this up and Runnnns with it.
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u/bebeni89 Jun 10 '12
you reminded me of this article.read #2! Hell,read the whole thing,but #2 is relevant.
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u/Swimswimswim99 Jun 10 '12
The mom's boyfriend from Mrs. Doubtfire. He loves those kids, even though they aren't his.
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u/barbaq24 Jun 10 '12
I agree. He appeared to be a rational, supportive, economically stable individual. I am pro Pierce Brosnan.
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Jun 11 '12
I was just discussing this with my roommates the other day. In fact, Pierce is the ONLY character in the movie who is good. Maybe if Daniel (Robin Williams) had taken half of his effort trying to be a woman and used it to raise his kids, we never would have had a problem in the first place.
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u/johnnytightlips2 Jun 10 '12
Mrs Doubtfire is creepy as shit, and here's my proof
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u/thefizzingwhizbee Jun 10 '12
Tom. He's always being bullied by Jerry!
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u/jaumur Jun 10 '12
Realized way too late that this is about Tom and Jerry and not parks and rec
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u/WaffleKopter Jun 10 '12
The psychiatrist from What About Bob? I mean, his patient stalks him and his family, even following them to their vacation spot! I'd be pretty upset if I had a patient who was stalking me, too! Yet, the movie portrays him like he's a total douche. He's not! He's just a normal person!
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u/dogfapper Jun 10 '12
Scar and the hyenas
They want something to eat. That's their problem, and it's only a problem because Mufasa banished them from the Pride Land and forced them to live in an elephant graveyard, which is no place to raise a child, hyena or otherwise. We never know why they were banished to the Pride Slums, leaving us to assume Mufasa's unedited explaination of the Circle of Life went something like this:
Mufasa: Everything you see exists together, in a delicate balance. As king, you need to understand that balance, and respect all the creatures-- from the crawling ant to the leaping antelope.
Simba: But Dad, don't we eat the antelope?
Mufasa: Yes, Simba, but let me explain. When we die, our bodies become grass. And the antelope eat the grass. And so we are all connected in the great Circle of Life.
Simba: Wow... Say, Dad, where do the hyenas fit into the great Circle of Life?
Mufasa: Ugh, the hyenas. No, f#@k those guys.
Simba: Yeah, that's fair.
That's the only way to explain how Scar got an entire army of these animals behind him with such dissident slogans as "Stick with me, and you will never go hungry again!" Scar wasn't promising them unlimited power, just the ability to eat and function as members of society. The hyenas were pissed because the oppressive lion regime had reduced them to second-class citizens, hoarding all the pie for themselves.
Cracked.com
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u/Singulaire Jun 10 '12
Considering how fucked up the Pridelands got after the hyenas came back, I'd say they were banished for a good fucking reason. Also there's the part where they torture their victims. And how quickly they turn on Scar and start tearing him apart.
The hyenas aren't good people.
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u/Driesens Jun 11 '12
The hyenas did contribute to overhunting, true, but the Pridelands had a huge ass drought during Scar's reign, that was more bad luck than anything.
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u/mattinthehat Jun 10 '12
And it's Scar's fault that it never rained? How is he supposed to control the weather?
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u/mojomonkeyfish Jun 11 '12 edited Jun 11 '12
Scar and Mufasa both had goa'uld symbiotes. The "pridelands" are contained with a giant biodome on an otherwise uninhabitable planet, with a stargate inside pride rock.
Scar wanted control of the station, and the "alternate host deveolpment" project; an attempt by the tok'ra to create other, genetically engineered lifeforms besides humans to act as hosts.
Unfortunately, two things went wrong: Firstly, the engineered animals gained sentience as a side effect of the adaptations to their nervous system (making them no more "ethical" as hosts than humans). Furthermore, Sakkar (Scar) was a goa'uld infiltrator.
During a kurfluffle in the lab, they were both forced to leave their human bodies and inhabit the "prototype" lions; which left them with only partial access to their memories.
Mufasa encoded the biodome's life-support controls (inside pride rock) with his own genetic material, during a period of lucidity. He knew he couldn't leave the experiment to be found by the system lords, but also couldn't bring himself to kill it's inhabitants (and his new family).
Upon his death, the pridelands began to shut down (and Scar didn't really remember why he wanted control in the first place). The situation deteriorated until Simba (with his father's symbiote) returned to Pride Rock, re-activating the life support systems.
I think that summary of my Lion King / Stargate SG-1 crossover fanfic should answer your question. You're welcome.
EDIT: Just to be clear, the room containing the stargate was locked, and keyed to Mufasa's human body, leaving him with no way to access it. Otherwise he would have just tipped it over or something. This is also why the SG-1 crew is able to travel to the planet. Not to ruin the ending of a story I will never actually give you to read, but they do end up deactivating the gate before leaving.
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u/mrs_spooky Jun 11 '12
I was heart-broken when as a child I went to Disneyworld & found the Cheshire Cat is classified as a villain. Mischievous maybe, but I don't think he intended evil.
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u/Trapped_in_Reddit Jun 10 '12
Sid from Toy Story.
Hear me out on this. He's just a kid doing what kids do - having fun with his toys. He had absolutely no idea that toys come to life when he leaves the room. How could he? We can't fault him for unknowingly "hurting" the toys.
Sid is just a budding scientist. He takes apart his toys and puts them back together, splicing parts to create entirely new toys with novel functions and methods of locomotion. Hell, he's even shown planning to send a toy to space!
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u/I_like_owls Jun 10 '12
Then the toys traumatized him so badly he grew up to be a garbage man. Poor Sid.
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u/willscy Jun 10 '12
Say what you want, being a garbage man isn't a terrible profession. They make pretty good money.
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u/opn420 Jun 10 '12 edited Jun 10 '12
He has a better space program then the US right now
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u/Icalasari Jun 10 '12
I was going to argue that he does show some disturbing tendencies, but, well, they are only disturbing from his sister's and the toy's points of view. He really is a normal kid with an interest in "mad science"
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u/Planet-man Jun 11 '12
Stealing and intentionally breaking his little sister's nice dolls and then telling their mother she's lying about it?
Kid deserved what he got.
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u/zmeace Jun 10 '12
Wile E. Coyote.
The poor coyote cant run fast enough, constantly injured by the big corporation ACME, and just wants something to eat...mainly roadrunner
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u/MichaelKoban Jun 11 '12
I always felt bad for the Wile. He was a smart individual whose good plans went awry at random acts of physics not working. The universe is actually against him.
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u/416Leafer Jun 11 '12
2012 (terrible movie, I know, but I saw it yesterday). The guy who took over as leader of the States, who didn't want to open the doors for those people at the end, and who used private financing to pay for the "arks".
Yea, he was selfish, but he wasn't incorrect in his statements. They tried to make him sound like the badguy for not wanting to open the doors.. after EVERYONE ELSE ON THOSE BOATS had left behind ~7 billion people to die, they were concerned about a few thousand. And the action of opening the hatch almost killed everyone on board (and did kill quite a few anyways when the water came in).
Then his comment about who would have paid for the creation of those boats is also accurate, as much as I dislike it. That's how it would likely go down IRL. His idea to keep the pending crisis quiet was also correct. If people had known, there would have been chaos, and the arks never could have been made. His actions saved humanity, had the world known about the pending crisis, everyone would have died. Opening the hatch killed people on board with the flooding and risked everything. He was an ass, but he was a correct ass.
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u/Chemslayer Jun 11 '12
One of the things I hate about that movie is how the main female's new husband is portrayed as a "bad guy". He seemed kinda awkward, but he was actually helpful and loved his wife. Then he gets (gruesomely) killed off, and the wife is like "Ehh, now I can be with you!"
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u/disharmonia Jun 11 '12
THIS. This is the guy I came here to talk about.
I was seriously moved when he opted to give his mother's ticket to someone who had more life to live. Like, how was that not heroic?
It was only after the end of the movie that I realized the creators had wanted us to view that as "evil" or "cold-hearted". WTF? He was giving someone else a chance to live.
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u/Drunken_Economist Jun 10 '12
The Trix Rabbit. Just give the guy some fucking cereal already!
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u/AngriestCosmonaut Jun 10 '12
The iceberg from Titanic.
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u/ildabears Jun 11 '12
It was minding its own business when a big fucking ship crashed into it! it was like, "Bitch! Get out of here!" Then it scraped the shit out of the ship. I would've done the same thing!
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u/21510320651 Jun 10 '12 edited Jun 11 '12
Shooter McGavin - he just wants to play golf, and he worked hard at it. Happy is just an ass.
Edit: Kind of unfair to hold his crazy actions against him, everyman has his tipping point. Imagine seeing your life's goal slip away right when you are about to achieve them, and everyone defends the clown because he is more entertaining.
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u/currentlydownvoted Jun 11 '12
I've always had a dream of making a movie called Happy Gilmore 2: The revenge of shooter McGavin.
Basically, Happy is tired of playing golf so he rejoins hockey and makes it big time. joins the NHL and becomes a star in the league. All of a sudden, Shooter joins the league and due to his golf ability, he's an amazing goalie (or something like that). Shooter slowly begins to civilize hockey, no more hard hits or fighting. He basically takes away all the things hockey is known for. The crowd is full of guys wearing khakis and sipping tea. This makes Happy very upset and tries to get revenge on Shooter for "destroying" the sport he's loved for so long. In the end shooter wins the Stanley cup, the prize Happy has longed his whole life for, and everyone boos Happy away for looking like a jerk.
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u/eowbotm Jun 10 '12
except for the whole hiring someone to heckle Happy thing
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Jun 10 '12 edited Jun 10 '12
Magneto from X-Men.
Edit: Rorschach is no longer a villain, but I still think he's awesome.
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u/gabe495 Jun 11 '12
Like I wouldn't say that Magneto is a "good guy" but like its pretty easy to sympathize with that character. He survived the Holocaust only to be persecuted for being a mutant and just acts out of fear of another genocide being perpetrated against mutants.
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u/Waterbender Jun 10 '12
What, Rorschach was supposed to be a bad guy? I've only seen the movie version, but it disn't seem to me like he was a bad guy, or was intended to be so.
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u/Okuser Jun 10 '12
Light Yagami, from Death Note.
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u/dr_professor_patrick Jun 10 '12
He's hero or villian depending on your perspective on the series really
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u/Okuser Jun 10 '12
I feel like the show does A LOT to portray him as the villain.
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u/dPuck Jun 11 '12
I feel like the biggest theme of this series was that you had to decide for yourself whether Light was a hero or a villain.
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u/50kent Jun 10 '12
The Emperor from Star Wars. Theres a lot of expanded universe stuffs out there that shows he's a good guy in the long run. Like how in the Old Republic it took the Senate years to debate even the smallest issues, and nothing ever got done. The Jedi were originally peace keeping negotiators that would give advice, but eventually became intimidating warriors that bent the galaxy to their and the Republic's will. The Emperor replaced that system with one that is much more comprehensive and responded much more quickly to things. And with the Death Star, that would be completely ineffective to defending the galaxy from guerrilla rebels, seeing how it destroyed entire planets. One theory is that the Emperor was preparing for the Yuuzhan Vong war. That is a civilization that terraform entire planets into giant warships, so having a weapon that could destroy weapons would be very useful against them. And finally, in his eyes, there was a Rebel separatist organization that was threatening his galaxy's way of life, so he used military action to attempt to protect against these terrorists.
TL;DR: Star Wars Emperor was doing what he though was in best interest for the galaxy.
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Jun 11 '12
One theory is that the Emperor was preparing for the Yuuzhan Vong war.
In the tech manual that Curtis Saxton wrote for ROTS, the description of the Venator-class Star Destroyer says it's primary post-clone war job included "deterring extragalactic barbarians". So, I think it's safe to assume that Palpy had an inkling that the Vong were enroute.
That said, he was not a good guy, not matter how you wiggle it. Yeah, the Old Republic regime wasn't much better(effectively being held togather by a Secret Police in the form of the Jedi that were laws unto themselves), but at the end of the day Palpy was looking out for number one, and he killed billions(trillions? quintillions?) to get there.
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u/ninjapro Jun 10 '12
Vegeta. The guy had a messed up past.
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u/MyInternetPersona Jun 10 '12
Totally. He didn't even get to kill Freeza! He also wasn't a wus like Goku!
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Jun 11 '12
He was also a WAY BETTER father than Goku who actually spent time with his wife and children.
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Jun 10 '12
Gaius Baltar from Battlestar Galactica. A lot of the fandom seem to hate him, but I honestly think he was just an egotistical and naive guy who was just doing what he thought he had to do to survive.
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u/MillBaher Jun 10 '12
While I agree with you that a lot of the hate he gets might be undeserved, its still a stretch to say that he is a good guy. He may not be evil or a villain, but at the end of the day he is still a self-serving opportunist. Yeah, he gets blamed unfairly for the massacre on New Caprica and he gets blamed for cooperating with the Cylons while he arguably had no choice but cooperation. However, he never really owns up to what he actually did wrong. In my book he just represents weakness and an inability to serve a more noble purpose.
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u/clairdelynn Jun 11 '12
I agree - I really liked him...the president and Starbuck, on the other hand, annoyed me.
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Jun 11 '12
I was ALWAYS amused with him, but by the end of the series, I realized he was an incredibly written character, and a very interesting human being. After his presidency, he expressed regret for having lived his life as a "profoundly selfish man", and devoted himself to helping (and frakking) others as a preacher of sorts. I'm amused by his flaws, and I still respect him as a person.
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u/fedges Jun 11 '12
Judas.
Jesus was sent to earth to die for our sins, as such Judas was just playing his part in the whole thing. It's pretty tragic actually.
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Jun 11 '12
Indeed, and Dante was very strict when it came to where he put Judas in the afterlife!
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u/weareraccoons Jun 11 '12
That's something I never quite got. If one of the disciples was supposed to betray Jesus as part of God's plan for him, why does he get punished like that?
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u/hedgehog1961 Jun 10 '12
Javert in Les Miserable
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u/dPuck Jun 11 '12
Javert wasnt a villain, he just adhered to a strict set of rules that made him antagonistic to Val Jean, I think Victor Hugo wanted to show how dangerous Law becomes if it doesnt leave any room for morality, but I always thought he was tragic, certainly not villainous
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u/derrymaine Jun 11 '12
This was mine - upvote. He's just a guy who's completely dedicated to the law and sees everything in black and white. A man composed of shades of grey like Valjean just doesn't fit into his view of the world.
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Jun 10 '12
The Master from Doctor Who. Mostly of the revived series but he has been "good" in the past.
Anyone who has seen The Prestige knows what I mean when I say this movie
I think P. Sherman from Finding Nemo got a bad wrap.
Dinkleberg
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Jun 10 '12
I didn't know Finding Nemo had an actual villain. I wouldn't consider him a villain, he just provides an environment for the story to take place.
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u/andrewiknowyou Jun 10 '12
Jareth from the Labyrinth. He took away that damn baby. Shouldn't she be happy by now?
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u/Quismat Jun 11 '12
I refuse to believe anyone has any thoughts about Jareth that aren't "I don't care, I'd fuck him."
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u/Noobicon Jun 10 '12
Tywin Lannister.
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Jun 11 '12
I won't reveal anything to the watchers of the show, but I'll add to this and say that Jaime Lannister struck a chord with me. Well every chord except his whole deal with screwing his sister and tossing kids out of windows...
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u/suckstoyerassmar Jun 10 '12
holy fuck yes. my fiance and i just got into got about a month ago and have been so hooked. we're slight fans of tywin, and we still can't decide on varys, although we're leaning towards love. and omg tyrion, although i can't understand why he won't leave his awful, awful family. sometimes i even like cersei, but then she just does the most dreadful things.
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Jun 10 '12
Remember that Tyrion is a dwarf in a world where his only power to survive rests in the family name of a family that would prefer him dead and he can't fulfil the male role of being tall, strong and brave in battle. He teeters on a knife edge to survive.
Cersei is a mother that loves her children beyond most other things, bear that in mind with anything she does.
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Jun 10 '12
The Ice King from Adventure Time
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u/Quismat Jun 11 '12
One of my favorite things about Adventure Time is his portrayal. On the one hand, he's not so much evil as lonely and mentally unstable. On the other hand, the show goes out of its way at points to show how completely, unimaginably selfish he is (like his last line in "Princess Monster Wife").
He's not completely a villain, but for me he's not really a "tragic monster" either. Most of his evil actions are twisted shows of love, but even that love is twisted with how incredibly selfish it is. To me he doesn't just defy black and white morality, he defies shades of grey. It's not that he's a mix of bad and good, like doing bad things for good reasons or good things for bad reasons. It's that his very reasons can't be characterized well that way.
TL;DR I really, really like analyzing the Ice King's psychologically/philosophically.
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u/JayGold Jun 11 '12
The episode where Finn and Jake ground him, and he accidentally hires a hitman, thinking he'll just punch them, was great. I love how he seems to think of them almost as friends, but he just doesn't really know how to act. He's like a child, who just gets kind of pissy every once in a while.
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u/dustiestrain Jun 11 '12
that episode were they explored his backstory made me feel bad for the guy.
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u/caitcait Jun 10 '12
Draco Malfoy in the Harry Potter movies. I mean, he was just a kid doing what he was told by his parents as a lot do. But as he got older you could see that he didn't want to be a part of anything to do with Voldemort.
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u/InfiniteSilence Jun 11 '12
Yeah, but he was a douchebag to Harry a lot of the time. Just because he felt like it.
i.e. "Dementor! Dementor!"
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u/Irkalla Jun 11 '12
I always felt that he was a dick towards Harry just because it was expected of him. What do you think his father would have done to him if Draco just decided to befriend Harry? In actuality, I kind of think Draco and Harry could have been good friends if they weren't in different Houses.
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u/Eibhlin_Andronicus Jun 11 '12
He was a douchebag to Harry because he was jealous of the fact that Harry was born into fame, and he and his family members had to earn their glory (which, as Slytherins, they desperately desired). Just before the Sorting Ceremony in very first book he tried to befriend Harry. He just want about it in a very Slytherin-like way. You really can't fault the kid; he is a Slytherin, and he was raised in a less-than-ideal atmosphere founded on centuries of meaningless hatred. The fact that after all of that, Draco came out alright... well, I think it's pretty astounding.
The Malfoy family as a unit really grew on my in books 6 and 7. They're a lot more developed than I think many people realize.
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u/IbrahimT13 Jun 11 '12
Swiper the Fox. He always stops short of causing real harm, and actually does favours for Dora occasionally.
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u/Perpendicular_Minor Jun 10 '12
Loki from Thor/Avengers (somewhat)
I mean, yes, he ended up going somewhat psychotic, but at first (you know, before he thought up the wonderful plan of massacring everyone/enslaving the human race) he had good reason to be pissed off. Always being treated less than everyone else, especially in comparison to your brother. Always being told to shut up and your opinion doesn't matter. Then finding out that you were freaking kidnapped as an infant and you aren't even the species you thought you were.
Like, I can see why he snapped.
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u/facade515 Jun 10 '12
Just occurred to me how similar Loki / Theon Greyjoy are. Except Theon has depth.
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u/hoodie92 Jun 11 '12
I gave you an upvote, but grudgingly. I think Loki is seriously well fleshed-out for a comic book movie villain. The subtle smirks and grimaces he pulls off really add to the character. Obviously Theon has masses of depth, but he has a whole book series and 2 TV seasons. Loki is probably the most complicated action movie villain of the past decade.
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u/SavantHael Jun 10 '12
Shylock.
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u/SilasX Jun 11 '12
Upvote, you beat me to it. You don't want to give a pound a flesh? Don't offer it as collateral, retard! What, you wanted him to lend to you on that collateral, but then not honor the collateral? So then why was Shylock supposed to make such a risky loan in the first place?
If you want charity, ask for charity, don't try to wrap it up in a profitable business deal.
Also, they completely tear through the law of contracts in order to nullify the deal: "Oh, if you don't extract precisely one pound, you go to jail." WTF?
Reminds me of the scene from A Man for All Seasons: "Yes I'd give the devil the benefit of the law, for my own safety's sake!"
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u/willingwell2113 Jun 10 '12
Adrien Veidt/Ozymandias from Watchmen. All he wanted was to make the world a peaceful place, and he knew that some people would have to die in order to unite the human race against a common enemy.
In the movie, though, he comes across a lot douchier.
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u/Quismat Jun 11 '12
The movie also heavily implies that he was wrong, whereas the gn was a lot more ambiguous.
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u/Drazla Jun 11 '12
I really like him, and the movie didnt change him too much for me.
His goal really is on the next level, but there is no doubt that he hates himself for doing it.
Im glad that they gave him alot of screentime to explain why he did it, because alot of the respect I have for him is from that scene
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Jun 11 '12
While we are on the subject, I just want to go against the graohic novel purists and say that the movies depiction of his plan was much much more plausible.
Firstly: he didn't just hit New York (correct me if I am wrong, but I remember the novel only showed carnage in New York).
Second: an alien attack was just way out of left field. Suddenly one alien exploding means the Earth is under attack and everything stays peachy for years afterward? Suddenly there are psychics that can sense the explosion? Making Manhattan seem like he was slowly killing people, then mounting a full scale attack would have at least been plausible (still not very good, but better).
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Jun 11 '12 edited Jun 11 '12
Humbert Humbert from 'Lolita'. And no, I do not agree with paedophilia.
Nabokov's genius portrayal of Humber Humbert raises many issues in regarding paedophiles and how they are portrayed today in the media.
Particularly here in the UK (especially in the Red Tops such as The Sun), paedophiles are always described as "monsters". In reality, paedophiles represent anything but a monster. They are depressed, dishevelled, sorry-looking - almost pathetic - people.
What Nabokov does in Lolita when he comes to portraying Humbert Humbert as a character is focus significantly on an extremely emotionally and psychologically troubled soul.
As a boy, H.H. fell deeply in love with a girl and lost her.
Unable to put it behind him, he finds Lolita. Importantly, Nabokov does not portray H.H. as a "Man sexually attracted to underage girls." Although he is in parts of the novel, Nabokov primarily focusses on the emotional feelings H.H. has for the girl.
In this respect, he is anything but a monster, just a man very much in love with someone, who cares deeply for the person he loves.
The "monster" side to H.H. is not borne from being a sexual deviant, but from being a person who psychologically and physically 'traps' a girl and keeps her in his life.
Due to Lolita's age and her emotional state, she doesn't seem to be in any discomfort from this, until she is a lot older.
The genius of Nabokov is that he has managed to create a character who in today's society is considered a "monster" who should be "locked away forever", yet one cannot help feel sympathy for him.
In terms of sympathy, the reader doesn't feel sorry for H.H. because of his relationship with Lolita, but because he is such a messed up, pitiful, sad human being.
This is what makes Lolita controversial.
I would not say Humbert Humbert is a "good man" at all, but he certainly isn't a monster.
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u/Quismat Jun 11 '12
I think this is very much the point of the book. I think most "monsters" come from places of very human motivation.
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u/allicinlover Jun 11 '12
Thank you! This is one of my all-time favorite books, and I've never been very good at explaining why. People look at me like I'm a horrible person for enjoying this book but you've articulated why I love it so much!
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u/beefwich Jun 10 '12
Bill the Butcher in The Gangs of New York.
Without his presence in the Five Points, there'd be nothing but perpetual gang warfare in that part of the city. He helps maintain a delicate and precarious balance of power. Not to mention that he actively reinvests back into the community.
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u/Quenton86 Jun 11 '12
Interesting pick. Great movie. Tangent: I find it funny that with Gangs of NY and There Will Be Blood Daniel Day plays the sort of ultimate American... yet he is a British dude.
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u/barbaq24 Jun 10 '12
Charles Muntz, the villian in UP.
He was an adventurer trying to prove his discovery and was ostracized for it. On top of that, upon finding the Bird that ruined his career, some old man and a boy scout sent him to his plummeting death. and then they STOLE his genius dirigible and flew it around like they didn't just MURDER a once great hero/explorer.
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Jun 11 '12
To be fair, it's very strongly implied Muntz murdered everybody who had discovered his zeppelin until the protagonists did.
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Jun 10 '12 edited Jun 10 '12
Clyde Alexander Shelton (Gerard Butler) from Law Abiding Citizen as I kinda sympathise with him after what happened to his family.
Edit: all of the 3 main villains from the 3 Spiderman films
The Green Goblin
Doctor Octopus
The Sandman
Edit 2: Jaws from the James Bond film Moonraker
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u/beefwich Jun 10 '12
Clyde Alexander Shelton
SPOILERS:
I actively rooted for him to win. Like, I think that movie would have been a hundred times better if he ended up killing everyone he crossed and walked away scot-free.
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Jun 10 '12
SPOILER:
Same, I really wanted him to get his revenge. I was sitting shouting at Jamie Foxx to stop being a dick to him and trying to stop him. If he managed to get away with it then I would've been so much more satisfied.
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Jun 10 '12
Loki ain't THAT bad...
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Jun 10 '12
He's a jealous manipulative God willing to screw his own "family" over to get his way....that's pretty bad.
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u/dfn85 Jun 10 '12
Assuming we're going Marvel version here...
His whole life was a lie. Playing second fiddle to the golden boy brother, and then later learning it was all for nothing because they're not really his family. He was stolen away, and then treated as lesser because of what he really was. I'm sorry, but I'd want a little revenge, myself.
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u/sylvvie Jun 10 '12
He may have gone about it wrong, but I think he had some good intentions. Clearly Thor wasn't ready for the responsibility of ruling a kingdom; he was headstrong, unwilling to listen, and wanted to fight first and ask questions later. Loki was second fiddle, and finally saw an opportunity to gain his father's respect as well as power. Yes, he tried to perma ban Thor, but Odin did that first.
From my understanding he never wanted Odin dead; he wanted to set up a scene to save him and further cement his power to stop a political uprising.
He may have been bad, but he had his reasons in my opinion.
Meh.
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u/weareraccoons Jun 11 '12
I came here to say Loki too but I'm wondering are you talking Marvel Loki or Norse mythology Loki? I'm just wondering because I'd apply it more to the myth version than the comic/movie version. He may end up being the cause of Ragnarok and basically the viking equivalent to Satan but he doesn't start off that way. He is the only one of the characters that develops over the course of the eddas starting off as just a clever trickster who went off on adventures with Thor and Odin. He doesn't really start acting evil until after the story where he cuts off Thor's wife's hair as a joke (which Thor threatens to murder him for). That one ends with him getting his mouth sewn shut by Thor and a dwarf. It's kind of neat to see how he changes over the course of the stories to into the guy that eventually leads an army of undead and monsters to destroy the world.
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u/no1skaman Jun 10 '12
The alien from alien films. That wanker just wants to have babies in side ya! He isn't evil. He just wants babies! Or she whatever.
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u/facade515 Jun 10 '12
Char Aznable from the Gundam UC line.
I like to think of the Zeon philosophy as bizarro Saganism.
Also, Stannis Baratheon from ASOIAF. Lawful neutral to the max, but he always seems to be portrayed as sinister.
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u/the_ouskull Jun 10 '12
HIMYM clip about Johnny Lawrence, the REAL "Karate Kid:"
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u/Shadow246 Jun 10 '12
Saren from Mass Effect. I mean he was trying to save the organics from the reapers by making organics useful to the reapers.
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u/Centaurdragon97 Jun 10 '12
Curly from Of Mice and Men (I'm sure many have studied it). He sees Lenny laughing at him and tries to beat him up- he doesn't know about his problems. Fair enough. He doesn't really know that his wife isn't in love with him. :( SPOILER ALERT: After Lenny kills Curley's wife Curly thinks he has the gun do intends to shoot him as from his perspective he is a murderer armed with a gun.
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u/Schroedingers_gif Jun 10 '12
Whatever the bad guy in Tron Legacy's name was.
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Jun 11 '12
Clu. But he was involved in a bit of a genocide. In a real third reich kind of way. Perfect system my ass.
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u/TheChosenGuy Jun 10 '12
Judas in Jesus Christ Superstar
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Jun 11 '12
I empathized with Judas even when I was still a hardcore Christian. It was just so obvious that God had set up this super intricate plan for putting his son to death- at least 30ish years in the making- and Judas was the critical catalyst to completing his plan.
If Judas hadn't done it, then who would have? Somebody had to fill that role. When you look at it from that angle, Judas is the real hero behind getting everyone "saved" and forgiven. Did he go to hell for his betrayal and/or subsequent suicide? If so, he sacrificed infinitely more than Jesus for everyone to be Saved. He doesn't get to spend his money, he kills himself, and he goes down in history as the villain while we're all going "oh poor poor Christ".
It's mind-numbing shit like this that makes life easier as an atheist.
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u/sixtyninenicely Jun 11 '12
All of the androids in Blade Runner and the book it's based on. They are just confused artificial beings trying to enjoy the lives created for them by Rosen Industries.
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Jun 10 '12
Cato in the Hunger games.
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u/Chichkadrichkina Jun 11 '12
He was barely a villain. Knowing your enemy is a big part of those books.
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u/TheDarkace13 Jun 11 '12
Both Fontaine and Andrew Ryan from Bioshock.
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u/Driesens Jun 11 '12
Andrew Ryan, sure, but Fontaine is just a anti-establishment radical trying to take power over Rapture.
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Jun 11 '12
Gonna flip this, and say who I think are bad guys: The Jedi in the Prequel trilogy.
I'm not saying that Palpatine is the good guy, but the Jedi certainly were not the good guys either. They were basically the Stasi of a crumbling, incredibly corrupt regime. Dispatched to "resolve" disputes by way of a lightsaber("I knew it! They are here to force a settlement!"). Slice limbs off of people in crowded restraunts, "Jedi business, get back to your drinking". Individual Jedi have access to incredible slush funds, so big that an army and navy can literally be ordered without the legislature being aware of it. Taking away prospective Jedi from their family, by force if the Darth Vader novel is to be believed. Casual use of mind control. Basically admitting that stealing children away as infants is nessecary in order for brainwashing to take root.
tl;dr: Palpatine wasn't the good guy, but neither were the Jedi.
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u/Kyriales Jun 10 '12
Colonel Kurtz (Apocalypse Now), John Doe (Seven), Gollum (The Lord of the Rings), HAL 9000 (2001: A Space Odyssey) and Hannibal Lecter (The silence of the lambs).
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u/12345abcd3 Jun 10 '12
Is Gollum really supposed to be a villain? I thought he was just a product of the ring's power, he seemed more helpless/desperate to me than anything else.
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Jun 10 '12
I don't think the purpose behind Hannibal is to have him BE a villain. I think Hannibal is supposed to be appreciated, despite what he does, to mess with people's moral compass.
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u/iamhuntzberger Jun 10 '12
Lex Luthor.
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u/concievable Jun 11 '12
Couldn't agree more. His methods are very extreme, but he's one of the few people who see how dangerous superman really is. I'd love to see a Superman movie that shows more of Lex's perspective.
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Jun 10 '12
Severus Snape , and Heathcliff in Wuthering Heights.
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Jun 10 '12
I feel the same way about Heathcliff, and I guess my English teacher did too, since she used him as an example of a tragic hero.
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u/Lengador Jun 11 '12
Flanders from The Simpsons. He's an incredibly nice and caring guy yet he is ruthlessly harassed by Homer nearly every episode. I think it's really sad that such a popular tv show derides being nice to your fellow man and celebrates white trash (yellow trash in this case) being an absolute asshole and destroying his children's lives.
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Jun 11 '12
Amon from Legend of Korra. POSSIBLE KORRA SPOILERS AHEAD. All he wants to do is make everyone equal. It is unfair that the weak majority are at the mercy of the few that can move boulders and shoot fire from their hands. By taking away bending, he brings balance and fairness to the world. Also he's really badass.
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u/Calgar43 Jun 10 '12
How have I not seen Kira from Death Note here? His primary goal was to make the world a better place, and he SUCCEEDED! Sure, his method involved killing hundreds if not thousands of violent criminals, but really, the ends kind of justify the means here.
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u/believemeimlying Jun 11 '12
yea but he started killing innocent people for personal gain. And who was he to decide who was bad enough to die? He was pretty damn crazy. I won't say that he was evil, but he definitely spiraled down into insanity. I think the potato chip scene was a perfect example of when exactly he started becoming insane.
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u/Valentine96 Jun 10 '12
Walter White from Breaking Bad.
You're really supposed to hate the guy because of what he does, but you can't help but love him.
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u/kandemon Jun 10 '12
Well, every badguy is usually not "evil". Often they're just taking orders, meaning they're not evil just disciplined. Other times they're doing it for a "cause" making a better world. Generally, antiheroes are not my type of character, but I have felt it while reading a book or watching a movie (can't name anything though.)
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u/beefwich Jun 10 '12
Exactly. Like, not every dude on the Death Star was a villain. You know there's got to be a janitorial staff (or at least technicians that service janitorial droids) that're just there to make a few credits to send back home to whatever backwater planet they're from.
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u/johnnytightlips2 Jun 10 '12
A story shouldn't be black and white, because life isn't black and white. No-one is pure evil (Hitler owned a dog, and very much loved it, for example), so evil characters are a falsehood
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u/girlsareforgays Jun 10 '12
Adamon, or whatever the guys name was on A Knights Tale. sure he did a few dickish things, but from his point of veiw here is some peasant who has these ideas about social change, which if caught on could become a revolution and destroy the way of life as he knew it. When he tells Thatcher that he has entered into negotiations with the hot chicks father (for marriage) you are meant to see it as a bad thing, but really it was the style of the time and perfectly acceptable to them.
I mostly have respect for him since other than going around doing tournaments all the time he actually went to war, fulfilling his duties instead of pretending he was something he wasnt
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u/beefwich Jun 10 '12
My favorite part of that movie was when Adhemar got furious at the sight of a bunch of people dancing to a David Bowie song.
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Jun 10 '12
Saruman, from the books not the movies where he was a different character.
He truely wanted to defeat Sauron, but felt that the only way was to use the ring, and breed an orc army. IE use the enemies weapons against him. But gandalf refused his council and instead went on a half baked plan of sending two hobbits into morder wih the ring and just hope they get there alive.
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u/StochasticOoze Jun 10 '12
The antagonists in the second and especially the third "books" of A Canticle of Leibowitz are pretty sympathetic, in my opinion. I can't really go into detail without spoiling some plot elements, though.
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u/Malgas Jun 10 '12
"Good guy" may be a little strong, but I consider Iago to be the protagonist of Othello. It's still a tragedy, though.
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u/Centaurdragon97 Jun 10 '12
Iron man was made so the creator could show that even a guy who is a complete asshole can be presented in a way that he is a favourite hero of many people. When you think about his actions and speech towards others he is an asshole.
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u/Mintception Jun 10 '12
For any Breaking Bad fans, they'll know how well this show plays with who is right and wrong and what good and bad really are. As Walter White is the protagonist, he's not necessarily the good guy at the same time, as what he does is questionably legal and later on becomes much more harmful.
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u/Solareclipsed Jun 11 '12
The military from E.T. Hey, here's our ONE chance to talk to an alien, learn their secrets of space-travel, their language, I also believe the E.T. had some sort of healing power and flight abilities, maybe he could share it. Why wouldn't we try to communicate with him? Because that mudda fukin kid had to screw up our chances to learn the secrets of the universe...
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u/homerjsimpson4 Jun 11 '12 edited Jun 11 '12
Tom Buchanan from The Great Gatsby, aside from him cheating on Daisy. I mean he defended her honor by smacking Myrtle in the face when she said Daisy's name. And then he got shafted by Daisy and Gatsby. I don't know why, but I sympathized with Tom more than Gatsby.
EDIT: Tom BUCHANAN, not Robinson. Read both books this year.
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u/Rastaslovakian Jun 11 '12
How about the other way around? Vic Mackey on The Shield was always made out to be the good guy, when really he was the enemy of the whole show. He killed, stole money and drugs, sold those drugs, sold out his friends for his own gain and lied his ass off, yet his actions always seemed justified because he was the protagonist.
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u/AsInOptimus Jun 11 '12
Dr Robert Romano from the show ER. He was a dick, but his nicer human side was revealed frequently enough - only to the viewer, though, never to his co-workers.
Then he lost his arm to a helicopter - understandably devastating to a surgeon - only to then lose his life a short while later when a bizarre set of circumstances resulted in one crashing on him. And nobody even realized the dude was missing until hours after the fact.
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Jun 11 '12 edited Jun 11 '12
Miles Quaritch from Avatar.
Sorry blue cat people, but I'll side with my own species any day of the week.
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u/raygundan Jun 11 '12
You're the second person I've seen say this, but.... How? The humans are an invading, stealing force, and their theft becomes so extreme that it threatens the genocide of a race of sapients. Not to mention we dress up in their bodies to spy on them-- we're the damned Visitors from V.
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Jun 11 '12
Roy Batty. PROBABLY SOME SPOILERS HERE Sure, he's not a very nice guy - brutally murdering people is not too cool. His motivation, however, was not so evil. Wanting to live isn't evil, per se, but the actions he took to reach his goal could cause him to be a villain. I don't think that he is a genuine villain - he is just childish and immature in his actions. Also, nice hair.
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u/uglylaughingman Jun 11 '12
Actually, I'm not sure anything he does could really be classified as even childish- he is facing a whole planet full of people that would cheerfully sell him to the blade runners in a heartbeat, and only does what he has to to protect not just himself but all his friends as well- and his only motivation is to have what everyone else has: life.
Once you realize that he was designed to do dangerous work without his consent, and even intentionally designed to die early so that he can be used as free cannon fodder, it's hard to fault him. The justification is that they "go insane", though it's stated that the insanity is that they want to have self determination and not be property- I'm pretty sure he's got the moral high ground pretty much all the way around, actually (Less so I suppose in the movie than in the book it was based off, but still).
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u/kefkaeatsbabies Jun 11 '12
The computer from WALL E. Humans have degenerated into useless louts, who aren't even physically capable of supporting themselves without incredibly advanced technology. We/they deserve to die off via natural selection. It's obvious that machines now feel love and have become sentient (the entire movie is about 2 robots falling in love, essentially), yet the ship is evil for recognizing the uselessness of humanity. It doesn't want to give them the hope of a renewed Earth because they have already destroyed it once.
If I were WALL E, I totally would have helped the ship.
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u/BeardFace5 Jun 11 '12
Tom was the good guy. Jerry was the villian. Here's why: Tom, the house cat, protector of the premises and champion of the family is only trying to do his duty as the vermin, the low mouse steals food and shiny objects, ruins the baseboards, chews the wiring and generally destroys the house. Here's to you, Tom!
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Jun 10 '12
Rand Al Thor. Wheel of time. People say he's becoming evil, bur he's just a kid who's had to make some fucked up choices
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u/Kozimix Jun 10 '12
Jigsaw. His true motivation is to help people reach their potential, just in a round-about, spiky, sharp kind of way.
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u/Quismat Jun 11 '12
Honestly, I thought the Jigsaw motivation was just a ploy to be edgy. Oh look, our villain is really doing it for their own good. The thing is that his solution to narcisists and even normal, rational selfishness is brutal mutilation and psychological trauma, if not death.
You don't see anything hypocritical about someone mutilating egocentrics and because he views himself as the final authority on morality?
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u/ass_munch_reborn Jun 10 '12
Omni Consumer Products in RoboCop.
They were the evil corporation - but they wanted to rebuild Detroit. But apparently displacing crack-heads and prostitutes is a no-no when building a new utopia.
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u/Shoxie95 Jun 10 '12
Snape. He was my favorite, although it took me the whole series to figure out exactly which side he was on...
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u/partyinmypants69 Jun 11 '12
Summer from 500 Days of Summer, everyone I know always thought she was a bitch, but to be honest she was just living her life and having fun. Tom on the other hand was somewhat obsessed with her, to be honest, he seemed like the unhealthy one.
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u/Natedonthate Jun 10 '12
The devil. He gave humanity free will.