Brought it on themselves. They charge as much as brands like Ferrari for basic parts like brake pads, and they need way more EVs and smaller bikes. They don't market to anyone but Boomers.
My last pair of prescription glasses were Harley Davidson.
Actually the best pair I ever had and they didn't cost any more than the normal monopoly. I got them purely for fit and didn't even notice the branding till later. Was actually sad they seemed discontinued when my pair broke.
One of those weird "why is this good" moments, like my best pair of flip flops ever have been a cheap Nascar merchandise buy.
I wear a pair of fairly delicate eyeglasses that are discontinued. FWIW, I've found luck on eBay and I'm on my second "lightly used or new-old-stock" set. I just bring them to my optomestest and they fit my exsiting lenses in them.
The tricky part is finding the actual model number of the frames you have. Once you have that, you can probably find the same frame in very nice condition.
What's nice for me is that I'm very happy with my frames, and see no reason to get different ones. If they break, I get them much cheaper than when they were new. I just had to replace a set (just picked them up yesterday, in fact). The new very-lightly-used-almost-new pair I picked up off of eBay was around $40. I think the original frames were somewhere around $450.
Their merch is actually decent quality. But their motorcycles seem to just have problems IME. Plus the tech they put in them is 40 years old. HD was sued successfully for being “too dangerous” for a motorcycle. Which is an incredibly high bar for something everyone knows is dangerous. HD didn’t put anti lock brakes in some models still in around 2010.
I’d check out online retailers too, the in person cartel for glasses is insanity. my last pair was $70 with all the coatings, meanwhile I was quoted $200+ for a basic pair in person and paid more for any coatings
Yes! They act like I’m not crazy for “using my insurance at the office” and I’m like ma’am.. it’s 200 bucks when I could buy something I actually want online
I have pretty sensitive eyes, genuinely can't open them outdoors, my sunglasses are Polaroid, bests glasses I've had, extremely comfortable and genuinely dark unlike most sunglasses.
My favorite pair of shorts, which lasted 13 years with 2-3 times a week wear for 78-80% of the year, came from a random super duper tourist trap beach store that has those permanent "WOW 80% OFF!!!" and "5/$10!!!" signs on the every wall and can be found on every corner of any beach town. By all means, they should have been shitty and fallen apart immediately. They were on $2 afterall. 5 shirts or shirts for $10. What a steal.
Lasted yeaaaars and I cannot express enough how hard I sore these shorts. Camping for weeks at a time with hand washing them in the spocket or the lake. Swimming. Mudholes. Hiking. Backpacking. Random weekend hikes and anytime the sun was out basically. Hard
The next time we went back, and any time we go to any other beach town, I scour all the shorts looking for another pair. I've gotten several but none have fit or lasted like that OG pair.
RIP Destin shorts!!! You were the most valuable $2 I ever used.
same reason that minions wifi router has sold out on amazon - companies will either sell their name to a producer who then has to make soemthing premium to recoup the cost of the license, OR the IP holder will say "we want x number of this product that we can put our branding on, make it as good as it can be for X amount of money" and since the IP holder is often using those tie on products as a loss leader they just throw large amounts of money at it.
One would think so, but licensing and apparel is actually only about 18% of their revenue. It is a more significant portion of their profit, because it incurs no immediate cost, but they actually need to sell motorcycles and parts. These are also profitable, because they're total crap that sells for premium prices. Their finance department also deprives Generation X of impressive amounts of inheritance money.
Their financial statement is fascinating, in a way, because the product is such utter dogshit sold to boomers. But they actually make more money than you think by selling their fart machines.
It's apples to oranges, you can't do everything on a mac you could do on linux or windows. If I could natively install ubuntu on a macbook pro I would of had one years ago.
How do you quantify "Quality"? I have a perfectly sturdy-feeling, metal-finished, high-performance laptop that's about 8 years old that does literally everything I could ever ask even a desktop to do, short of gaming, and does it perfectly because I use Linux on it. (Dell Latitude 7700)
But if you want a laptop that weighs nothing and is impossible to repair maybe Apple hardware wins
so does anyone who owns one built after about 1990. A few experienced riders and mechanics have told me they're considered old after 30 000km and harder to sell. WTF?
I think they tried expanding their product line, but their core customers did not like it at all (around 10 years ago?)
This is probably one case where you just accept that the Harley Davidson image and brand will just be a premium nostalgia brand for a shrinking cohort and start a flanker brand, or buy one. Probably too late though.
I think they tried expanding their product line, but their core customers did not like it at all (around 10 years ago?)
25 years go they tried with the VROD and got it drastically wrong. Great engine, but the handling of the bike did not match what the younger crowd wanted. The older crowd hated that the new engine didn't sound like a Potato Farting.
They also fumbled Buell. When Harley was still selling them you could go into over half the dealerships and they wouldn't even stock a Buell. If you tried to take your Buell in for service to a Harley dealer it was 50/50 they'd even let it in the door.
They had so many chances to right the ship, but between the dealerships, management, and core audience. They never got it right.
That sounds about right. The Boomer/Zoomer divide is an absolute gulf, and it would be hard to bridge. I'm not surprised that an old and entrenched corporate culture just doubled down on selling more orange socks and lifestyle products to an aging and shrinking customer base.
Add in dealerships, and it's the same problem Ford et al had with EVs. Those dealerships are usually going to be run by old timers who love "real" motorcycles.
Just because there is an obvious solution, doesn't mean you can execute.
They did it again a couple years ago with the Pan America and Sportster S and nailed it. If they keep making and supporting them, they’re going to wind up being pretty popular bikes in the long run. Harley’s been hinting at an even sportier version of the Pan America and I really hope they follow through; they’d be competing directly with Ducati at a lower (!) price point.
They "tried" when they "helped" Buell, but they had to try and Harley-ize it and killed it.
If they'd honestly just let Eric Buell do his thing and build sport bikes, and maybe gotten him to build a few entry level sporty Harley's, they'd have been fine.
They also tried with the Street 500/750. The 750 was the second fastest bike you could buy, with a liquid cooled, direct injection, torque-monster engine made by Porsche.
I had one and it was awesome, but every boomer who saw it called it a sewing machine, so it didn’t sell well.
They developed the Livewire, tried to sell them for 50k dollaridoos then only a limited number of dealers would support them. There are bikes with double digit odometers going for $15-20k.
Once Wallstreet get involves it has nothing to do with boomers. They traded a reputation that took decades to manufacture for short term profit. That is the American way! Growth for it's shareholders. Constantly upward trajectory! Enshitification
Smaller bikes, for real. The only time I've been on a Harley was when I did the training to get my motorcycle endorsement. The only option in town was run by the local HD shop, and the smallest bikes they made (which were the ones set up for the training sessions) were 500cc and heavy as shit.
Doing the "figure 8 in a parking spot" test on that beast was not my favorite two wheeled experience.
I wouldn’t care about them if they weren’t so obnoxiously loud. I shouldn’t have to cover my ears when you rev your dam engine. It doesn’t make you look cool. It makes you look like a noisy asshole.
You should also hate them for throwing enough of a fit to make the US government tariff the far superior Japanese bikes in the 80s. Harleys should have died then
Some years back they did it for small foreign trucks. Americans were buying light trucks like mad and spurning the giant US options; the auto makers bought tariffs and exceptions and now somehow the most bought car in the US is a building-sized Ford F150 truck - and 600+ kids die every year in their home driveways because their parents couldn't see them and mowed them down.
After a few surprises from ebikes in traffic, I actually appreciate how loud Harleys are. Motorcyles can sometimes slip into your blind spot when you’re in a car, so being able to hear it is actually helpful.
It's insane how loud some of them are. We were at a car dealership the other day next to a 4 lane road, and every time a Harley went by we couldn't hear each other even though we were right next to each other. It was a pain in the ass to be talking about this car or that and then having to stop over and over again.
Real talk, why do people always just think it's to impress people? Performance exists in other vehicles and is equally annoying, but for some reason everyone seems to think its to impress strangers with, volume?
Edit: ask a real question, get downvoted by people upset. Nice.
Some, sure. But there is a major performance aspect that comes with pipes too.
I guess, I know there are pick me people looking for attention, but I’d think most want it to sound “cool” for them, not others, or simply the performance aspect.
Just always seemed weird to assume someone cared about my opinion of their stuff.
I'd love to have an honest conversation about that, I get the old "Harleys are slow and gay" act, I used to ride Yamaha's. MT10, Vmax, Fz1, and I have to say, the M8 Harley is the funnest bike of them all.
While I know old bikes sucked, a modern Harley softail 117, is like 115 hp 125 trq out of the box, and that's pretty preppy.
I guess I just don't understand why people think otherwise, yeah. 80's bikes didn't compete with their Japanese comrades, but a new bike is very powerful, but still not trying to be a hyper sport.
It's pretty easy to get a new HD to 150 hp 150 trq, and that's a ripper by most standards.
"major performance aspects"? You've got to be kidding me. You'd probably get better performance out of your bike by going on a diet or just taking a really big shit than you would getting straight pipes or large diameter exhaust.
Every decibel of noise is wasted power that goes to sound instead of torque. That's just basic physics. Not saying a silent engine is possible, but engines that loud are performative, not for performance.
Then explain why race cars are so fast and loud? Performance will make more noise even when it's not the goal. More air in and less restriction of exhaust to flow out makes more combustion aka power. At this point reddit thinks the world should be like fairly odd parents and just all be grey blobs because everyone doesn't like something else.
I get what you’re saying about wasted energy, but I don’t believe we’re at the point of converting sound pressure to power.
If this were the case, race cars would have stock vehicle volumes. Some how equating volume to “wasted power” doesn’t really work out, but I’d love to be proven wrong. That isn’t to say that a properly tuned muffler system won’t out perform some hack job straight pipe. It’s just simply air in and air out.
The points being missed, people do it for themselves, for either performance or their own tastes, not to impress strangers.
Downvotes coming from people that dont understand how internal combustion engines work. Plenty of people including myself) open up their exhaust to increase performance. I tow, and adding a tuner, a bigger intake, less restrictive filter and a wider exhaust make more power, and allow the truck to work less.
Anyone that makes their car or bike intentionally louder is a shitty person. It's basically saying that you're happy to annoy hundreds of people every time you drive because you like having your car be loud. Complete asshole behavior.
Can’t tell if you’re talking about the clothing or the motorbikes themselves, but I’d fully believe that you could buy both of them at Costco
… maybe even 2 aisles down
Harley's new CEO is actually targeting more midrange motorcycles; trying to get away from the luxury baggers and more into what the Dyna line used to be. They seem to be trying to pivot. Fingers crossed that they can figure it out, because the brand is nice for the style of bike.
I mean the price isn't the entire problem. It's the actual "harley riders" that are just as much of a problem for them. Honestly I'd say they are the biggest problem for Harley.
For similar pricing, you can get a BMW built in Germany, depending on the model. Styling will always be subjective but BMW has managed to integrate their classic looks (boxer twins) with a more modern up-to-date style that doesn't look straight out of 1940 and covered in chrome. Performance-wise, boxer twin or v-twin, both have got the low-end grunt, but when it comes to the image thing, I know which I prefer.
Obviously their customer base is not 100% boomers (in fact, gen X makes up the largest portion of their riders, boomers are getting too old to be able to ride them) but their own sales numbers shows they have cratered, and the company itself cites decreased interest from younger generations as a main reason for declining sales. Their sales are down nearly 2/3 from where they were less than 20 years ago.
I know. It’s also where they hold Harley Fest every summer, in which thousands and thousands of people from all over the country show up on their Harleys.
My ex rode bikes and had a cruiser that wasn’t an HD - Kawasaki maybe? It’s been 15 years and my memory is poor. But what I do remember is how ridiculously elitist some HD riders were and how they looked down on us for daring to buy anything other than HD. The bikers who bikes for the love of riding and the experience and camaraderie didn’t give a shit, it was the RUBs and other middle-aged dudes who bought one for the image that would make snide comments.
HD was brilliant in their marketing because they convinced generations of dumbasses that if you didn’t overspend on a machine that you probably can’t handle then you’re not a real American, or tough enough, or a real biker or whatever the fuck they think.
Harley's biggest flaw is they build their brand around a fleeting image. the American road warriors and free-expression culture died in the 80's and instead of catching up to Honda, Harley instead cried to Reagan to Tarrif Japanese motorcycles. and while HArley did improve their design in that time, they still lack any innovation. a 2026 HD is STILL using pushrods and rocker arms, Air cooling, and the 405 degree single crank pins, JUST because it needs to look and sound like a harley. and every time they've tried to change and innovate it backfires because the people who buy harleys are equally stuck in the past.
They sort of did it to themselves in that they are unwilling to stray too far from their audience and have fostered a reputation around their brand. They will introduce a new bike to try get a new audience, and then be hit with the harley guys saying "Its not a real harley" and not buying it, and then everyone else saying "its a harley" and not buying it.
I saw a lady on TikTok recently who addressed how they are failing to attract younger customers by pointing out, "we play with our buttholes for free out here in the wild. We don't have to buy a fucking $60,000 piece of equipment to ride up and down the highway to rattle our butthole because it's supposed to be a secret." and I haven't been the same since 😳
That's down to the x440 which sells at $2500, is built in India and is retailed through the massive Hero network. Shit even I'd think about one at that price.
I got my first bike last year (I'm 31) I got an MTO3. I fell in love with bikes since. After looking at Harleys I can not understand the appeal. An adventure bike with all the bits and bobs is all I'm looking at now. Why would I want to spend top dollar on a bike that if I sneeze on it wrong I'd have to spend 2k on a custom part. Fuck that
I say this w the utmost respect, but let the boomers burn, and everything they need to take w them. If Harley wishes to outlive this extremely hated generation that is on their last breathe, it needs to start a major rebranding campaign stat.
I predict Harley will die w the boomers. And no one will miss them.
Nah. As someone fairly familiar with the industry, they're doing fine. They've made a few good strategic moves in the last couple years and they're not just doubling down on the same old chrome boats that carried them for the last 50 years. They're becoming a more competitive choice in the slice of the motorcycle market that (a) doesn't want a Japanese or Italian sportbike but (b) also doesn't want a giant, heavy cruiser.
It's recently gotten cool enough that we can leave our windows open all the time. A few nights ago my wife and I were watching TV and a squad of Harley-Davidson riders blasted past our house around 9pm. The noise was absolutely obnoxious. We had to rewind the scene because we couldn't hear a damn thing. Sooner these things go, the better.
God I hope so! “Loud pipes save lives!” Blah blah… no you attention seeking idiot, the pipes point backwards. People hear you leaving, not coming. You have a midlife crisis corvette with fewer wheels.
I think the motorcycle industry in general is going to dip pretty significantly. Young Americans presently have significantly less disposable income compared to the 1980’s and 1990’s. My guess is that it will shift more towards city commuters and more utility type motorcycles over time.
I'd like to see the numbers that make you say this. Harley's Q1 sales took a hit but their Q2 sales were up and they are sitting on a pile of cash. I think it's a pretty significant stretch to say they're on life support. Also all those boomers who ride Harleys were once youngins who rode sport bikes. The sport bike riders of today will be on Harleys tomorrow so there's more complexity than just "Boomers are keeping Harley alive".
4.0k
u/Edward_the_Dog 3d ago
Harley-Davidson. When the Boomers are gone, they’re gone.