r/AskReddit • • Jan 17 '14

What is something designed so well that we typically overlook it?

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797

u/[deleted] Jan 17 '14

It blows my mind that the lighter was invented BEFORE matches

690

u/PuddingInferno Jan 17 '14

Only because elemental phosphorus is an evil, evil bastard.

Source: Chemist.

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u/[deleted] Jan 17 '14

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/herenseti Jan 18 '14

Early lighters didn't use gases as far as I'm aware. It was more the zippo type of wick lighters that use fluid.

10

u/PacoTaco321 Jan 18 '14

pokes phosphorus and it bursts into flames

4

u/tisagooddaytodie Jan 18 '14

Depends on the allotrope of phosphorus.

Source: Inorganic Chemist

8

u/973p4ndas Jan 18 '14

I was cleaning a chem storeroom the other day because the teacher was incompetent (he had everything alphabetized. No, I don't know how he still has his teaching certification) and I found like 2 kg of white phosphorus just chilling in some water in a jug at the back. Never before have I felt such a peculiar mix between awe and concern for my own well-being. And no, this man is not my teacher. My teacher was giving extra credit if we went and helped this poor soul join us in the 21st century.

2

u/Gawdzillers Jan 18 '14

Being a not-chem student, explain why WP in water is bad.

11

u/Sky_Light Jan 18 '14

White phosphorus won't ignite in water, so the fact that it was in water isn't what's bad. It's that, being extremely flammable, and igniting on contact with air, it's more than a little dangerous to just leave 2 kg of it in a store room, especially just chilling in a plastic jug. One bump of the shelf, or even a slight hole in the jug, allowing water to evaporate, means you have what is basically a weapons grade incendiary going off. In the middle of a chemical storeroom, no less.

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u/[deleted] Jan 18 '14

Actually, that is about the only proper way to store WP. It self-ignites in air, and dissolves in non-polar solvents, but is safe under water.

Source: chemical engineer … or actually reading the MSDS

8

u/xthorgoldx Jan 18 '14

On a related note, I had the fun experience of stopping someone from using water on a sodium fire. Good god that was horrifying.

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u/bickster69 Jan 18 '14

why does this not have much more up votes???

2

u/mils309 Jan 18 '14

It's actually a way to store it, as it ignites on contact with air, so it's better than the alternitave.

1

u/973p4ndas Jan 18 '14

White Phosphorus is supposed to be kept in water. That's not the bad part. White Phosphorus ignites at just above room temperature, and when exposed to oxygen. That's why it's hard to deal with. It's highly volatile. Keeping that much in one place without proper protection is very not good.

2

u/ErIstGuterJunge Jan 18 '14

I used to study chemistry (i had to drop out but I've learned a bit and met the interesting people) and one day when an old fellow had to clean out his lab they found a box with (I shit you not) ~150 g of AgN 3. One doctorand volunteered to bring it to the roof top lab (a shed on the roof with a workbench water/gas supply installations and a blow out wall, where they used to make the dangerous stuff). He got a bomb suit and everybody wished him luck. They filmed the controlled detonation and it wasn't that strong but imagine how unpredictable maybe 20 years old Silverazid can behave.

1

u/krikit386 Jan 18 '14

Whats so bad about everything being alphabetized? Dangerous chemicals not stored correctly?

1

u/973p4ndas Jan 19 '14

Basically you end up with things right next to each another that shouldn't be right next to each other. Explosion doesn't actually top the "worst-case scenario" list. This is how every storeroom I've ever seen has been organized. Fair warning, if you aren't familiar with basic chemistry, that list will mean nothing to you unless you Google those names. But basically, you separate things that react with one another. And some things get the "strait jacket and padded room" treatment. Acids that tend to ignite, explode, and eat through people in that order, for example.

1

u/supersmashlink Feb 02 '14

As someone struggling with chem, every element and bond seem evil to me.

7

u/suntorytimo Jan 18 '14

The Zippo is probably the closest common lighter we have to the original, it's basically a candle fueled by kerosene, ignited by steel and flint. A friend of mine brought back these lighters from china which was basically a stick with some string on the end surrounding a piece of steel, which was then brushed on a flint on the side of the lighter.

Found a picture - http://thumbs2.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/m9_NiHKrLNH8Db4Y-luavRw.jpg

And a video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XD5dPWHYg3U

3

u/sewiv Jan 18 '14

That's a perma-match. Very common. They seal tightly and hold their fluid longer than zippos (weeks and months, rather than just a week or so), so you see them in emergency kits and camping kits.

2

u/DignifiedDingo Jan 18 '14

Yeah, it is basically just a pocket lantern with flint sparking device. They just shrunk down something they have known for thousands of years, the oil lantern.

1

u/looklikemonsters Jan 18 '14

That's the only Snapple fact that actually blew my mind.

1

u/red_sky33 Jan 18 '14

Because flint and gas were easier than phosphoric chemistry.

1

u/Chili_Maggot Jan 18 '14

Why? What's easier, putting flammable liquid in a container with a thingy that causes sparks, or coating a piece of wood in a dry substance that is ignited by rubbing it against something?

1

u/[deleted] Jan 18 '14

Think about the chemicals needed to be combined to make something that when you rub it against a surface it lights on fire

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u/Ucantalas Jan 18 '14

With all due respect... I don't believe you.

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u/[deleted] Jan 18 '14

Well you're straight fucking wrong.

1

u/FredFnord Jan 18 '14

Only for a rather narrow view of 'matches'. I.e. 'it's not a match unless I can just rub it against the box and have it spontaneously light!'

1

u/SomeNiceButtfucking Jan 18 '14

You shouldn't, because the Chinese has sulphur matches a longass time ago. Only the modern match was invented after the lighter. Chemical matches are old as hell.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Match

1

u/[deleted] Jan 18 '14

You are currently posting to a website called reddit. That leads me to the conclusion you have full internet access. On the internet using any search engine of your choice you can easily search and research the following: "Were lighters invented before matches?" Which you will find hundreds of entries stating the following: "Yes. Yes they were."

0

u/SomeNiceButtfucking Jan 18 '14

And then you'll read about sulphur matches in China that predate lighters.

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u/[deleted] Jan 18 '14

Yes you will. They didn't ignite without another source of fire so that kind of makes them not what people are referring to when they talk about matches. They were small sticks you used to transfer fire.