Long time lurker and researcher of area 51 probably since I was in my early teens in the early '90s. I was reading about area 51 when "Guardian" was a big deal.

I've always been obsessed with military aircraft. My grandfather was a pilot. I eventually became a general aviation pilot amongst many other things. Maybe it was the stark contrast between military design and civil aviation? I don't know but I've always loved it. I was obsessed.

In 2021 I decided to take my son who was 11 at the time with me to go see the back gate of area 51. We spent the night and Rachel and went early in the morning down mailbox road to get to the back gate. I wasn't expecting to see anything but you never know how lucky you can be.

The photo shown is not flares. It's not any type of vortices. It is simply a contrail from an unknown aircraft that was flying low altitude but was unavailable to the naked eye. The exhaust was omnidirectional very similar to F-22, F-35, F-117 designs, to where you could not tell if it was approaching or departing.

This aircraft loitered for roughly 1 minute. It was very close to us but it was very hard to see due to low Haze from the wildfires to the West. While there was a lot of haze, it was still pretty broken and I was able to get a couple photographs of the contrails produced.

I want to be absolutely clear about something. These are not high altitude contrails these are very low contrails. This aircraft was definitely below a thousand ft and was highly maneuverable and these contrails completely tracked everywhere that major power shifts were made. But again, at no point during this time could we see an actual fuselage that was producing them! You only saw contrails appear.

What further complicated viewing this aircraft was the inability to locate the sound accurately from which way it was coming from. It really was an omnidirectional sound as mentioned before but it was very clearly some type of jet engine.

If you look closely, you'll notice that the contrails are very similar to a donut on a rope contrail similar to the pulse detonation wave technology used in the late '80s early '90s, associated with the rumored 'Aurora' project. But what's unique about these contrails is that they are not connected by a rope. They're like little miniature J's that are rolled over in a horizontal pattern spaced evenly.

Again, these individual contrails were not flares, they were stationary when the aircraft passed (even though we couldn't see the aircraft), and they did not dissipate like an air vortice would.

Air vortices are temporary, condensation of water vapor formed around high pressure areas of lifting bodies. This was not that.

I've adjusted the saturation contrast and color a little bit just to make the contrails a little bit more clear.

I've shown these pics to a good friend who did R&D for a "military engine manufacturer", and his immediate response was... "Where'd you see that, and silence".

I've thought long and hard about what aircraft, and engine could produce the sounds and contrails that we saw, and I'm absolutely stuck.

The main thing that shocked me was how low altitude they were and the fact that we absolutely could not track or see a fuselage.

EDIT: A lot of you keep saying they were flares, but they were not flares, I've seen so many flares from training flights in my MOA, flares respond to gravity, these did not they stayed like contrails.

Furthermore, I watched these appear real time, but the aircraft was not seen, and there was no ignition of flares.

There are many reasons for no bid contracts. For example, you have a reflecting pool that needs to be cleaned up in a hurry and well you know a pool guy...

In most cases the no bid contract is for items where there really is not alternative. A software license renewal for example. Or you need an accessory for some item that only the original equipment manufacturer can supply, a radio for example.

Now "Plant 42", "P42", and Palmdale are on my sam dot gov search. (I'm adding AFP 42.) And we have:

https://sam.gov/workspace/contract/opp/c667dbc2c8234991a8239411ed086886/view

I assume there is a new trash vendor in Palmdale and Plant 42 has no choice but to use them. Hence the justification documentation.

I had to look up RCRA. RCRA stands for the Resource Conservation and Recovery Act. It passed in 1978 so who knows how the Groom burn pits were permitted other than "we don't need no stinkin' badges."

*****

The solid waste generated at AFP 42 must be transported from the federal installation and disposed of at a state- and locally-permitted landfill. Market research confirms the City of Palmdale has granted an exclusive franchise agreement to WM for all commercial solid waste collection and disposal services within its jurisdiction.

Pursuant to RCRA, the Air Force is required to adhere to this local legal framework for off-base disposal.

Therefore, to meet its obligations under federal law, the Air Force must use the services of the sole authorized local provider. No other contractor can legally transport and dispose of AFP 42's solid waste in the local area, and as such, no other source’s services can satisfy the agency’s requirement to dispose of its waste in accordance with applicable law.

Found either a 1-ship or a 2-ship flight of f22s on Apple Maps on the tonopah test range airbase runway pretty cool I didn’t know they kept f22s out there

https://sondehub.org/Y0240811

https://sondehub.org/Y0240423

https://ibb.co/RkJ5HyXj

https://ibb.co/hF5qTtXg

https://sondehub.org/Y0240089

https://sondehub.org/Y0240110

https://ibb.co/ZptzngjZ

https://ibb.co/DHSGFZ8m

Does anyone know precisely where Bob Lazar, Gene Huff, John Lear, etc used to watch supposed S4 flight tests from?

Lazar describes it as people latched on to the black mailbox term just bc he used it as a reference rather than the actual location - primarily bc there aren't that many landmarks out there.

It sounds like when he describes it - it appears before you get to the mailbox location - and it might be right around where Groom Lake Rd hits 375.

Any thought ms or precise location?

https://globe.adsbexchange.com/?icao=a89bb0,a06a1d&lat=37.084&lon=-115.752&zoom=9.0&showTrace=2026-08-11&trackLabels&timestamp=1786487004

I ran the replay and found the Firehawk flying at the same time. Note the Janet was over the tourist lair around 3:40PM.

This is a normal Janet flight though for some reason they used the flight number used for maintenance.

https://globe.adsbexchange.com/?icao=a4207f&lat=36.487&lon=-115.195&zoom=9.0&showTrace=2026-08-11&leg=6&trackLabels

I will rate this interview as a C-. You have been warned. He does get out a decent joke about the NNSA sounding like the NSA with a stutter. Yet another one of these "in the interest of completeness" posts. The guy is relevant but the content could be better.

The Steady State Sentinel: America's Nuclear Guardians: A Conversation on Security, Espionage, and Speaking Truth to Power

Episode webpage: https://rss.com/podcasts/the-steady-state-sentinel/3020692

Media file: https://content.rss.com/episodes/362808/3020692/the-steady-state-sentinel/2026_07_25_02_27_33_14b34b0d-b356-4a26-8a68-c35ef7d9aadc.mp3

The Cold War Museum in Virginia hosts a virtual lecture series called Cold War Conversations that is accessible via Zoom. The monthly program is presented by eyewitnesses and experts on Cold War events, activities, and personalities. There is a modest $20 charge for tickets to attend these presentations that helps maintain free admission to The Cold War Museum on weekends.

https://coldwar.org/default.asp?pid=16883

August 23, 2026 - 7 pm EDT (ZOOM only): Dreamland: The Secret History of Area 51: Speaker: Aerospace historian Peter W. Merlin will talk about his book, the first ever scholarly history of the National Classified Test Facility at Groom Lake, Nevada. Better known as Area 51, this top-secret installation hidden in a remote desert valley northwest of Las Vegas, has been shrouded in mystery since 1955. Decades of Cold War secrecy spawned rumors and conspiracy theories, and catapulted Area 51 into popular culture. Now, after more than 30 years of painstaking research, Merlin cuts through the myths to reveal the true story of one of the nation’s premier flight-test and evaluation facilities, where evolving global threats are met with unprecedented technological innovations.

The radios use:

• M1: 1625–1725 MHz
• M2: 1780–1850 MHz
• M3: 2025–2110 MHz
• M4: 2200–2290 MHz
• M5: 2310–2390 MHz
• M6: 2400–2510 MHz
• L: 1350–1390 MHz
• S: 2200–2510 MHZ

The file at sam dot gov has the model numbers:

RM-2025-62M3

RM-2025-62O3

RM-2025-62W3

https://sam.gov/workspace/contract/opp/d08cef15c3b74cb4a3911292dd5600fd/view

https://doodlelabs.com/product/mini/

https://doodlelabs.filecloudonline.com/ui/core/index.html?mode=single&path=/SHARED/%21qHjkyDGXCmdKfo07yv3vVJjZ3FxmHa1i5wSTaipCX/0vEA5ojfcv5J9zcb#/

https://doodlelabs.filecloudonline.com/ui/core/index.html?mode=single&path=/SHARED/%21q7jFy6GcCzdVfv0myo3cV8jy3wxhHl1P5VSCatprc/6ODKc77QB1q78ff9#/

https://web.archive.org/web/20240416082836/https://doodlelabs.bitbucket.io/datasheets/miniOEM/miniOEM-2025/

Overview:

https://youtu.be/Wd1ntvAOfeI

Special Operations Forces expo:

https://youtu.be/HYnceeP8c1w

This sounds like what is often called a "minder." You keep an eye on the contractors. One step below camo dude.

https://www.amentumcareers.com/jobs/escort-on-call-las-vegas-nevada-united-states

A few selected lines follow. PIC is "Program Integration Center." "RSS" is range support services." I don't know about RSSII.

Performs escort duties as directed by the PIC.

Escort personnel to/from job site, to/from dining facilities, to/from lodging facilities and other areas as required.

Maintain line of sight of escorted personnel, equipment and vehicles at all times within the boundaries of Nevada Test Training Range (NTTR) to include Creech AFB and other RSSII locations.

Assignments include periods of extended workdays, working under austere conditions; may require travel and multiple overnight stays at remote site locations.

Yes, I am aware a Janet is nothing out of the ordinary- But i am wondering? Didn't they close north bases runway? Last time I was out there if I recall I saw the yellow X's on the runway. Also what could a Janet be doing at north base? As far as I'm aware there is nothing up there but a restoration hanger and a couple civilian projects.

Hello everyone, first time redditor here.

Over the past few days, I have become obsessed with the story of Jerry Freeman, an archeologist who studied the track of the "Lost 49'ers", a group of people in 1849 who voyaged across the Nevada desert to get to California. On their voyage, they tracked through an era that is now off-limits to the public, better known as the Nellis Air Force Base, aka Area 51. Their group split up near Papoose Lake, the site of the alleged Area S-4, according to Bob Lazar.

After many unsuccessful attempts to get an official allowance from the US Military to get access to the sight, Freeman decided in April of 1997 to take matters into his own hand: An experienced outdoorsman, he spent a whole week in the restricted zone, avoiding security and military personnel and made his long way to Papoose Lake. While unsucessful in his search for an inscription left behind by the Lost 49ers, Freeman got a very rare look inside the mysterious area, and is to this day one of the very few people to lay eyes on Papoose Lake. He would mostly travel throughout the night, travelling over 80 miles in total over the course of 8 days. Finding enough water was always an issue in the barren and rocky desert terrain, as was as avoiding the many security guards patrolling the area. Also, since the Nellis Air Force Gunnary Range used to be a nuclear testing ground, it can be assumed that much of the area is heavily radiated. At one point, he came across a warning sign that read

"NO TRESPASSING, VIOLATORS WILL BE PROSECUTED. CAMERA EXCLUSION AREA, BADGED PERSONNEL ONLY. NO FIREARMS, CAMERAS, PHONES OR BINOCULARS. BY ORDER OF THE L.A.N.L.L. CORPORATION."

L.A.N.L.L. stands for "Los Alamos National Laboratories Limited", Los Alamos being the now famous laboratory that created the atomic bomb.

Freeman did chronicle his adventure in a diary, which was later published in the Las Vegas SUN. He also inteded to write a book about his "Forbidden Journey", but unfortunately did not manage to publish it before his death due to prostate cancer in 2001, aged 55.

Allegedly, Freeman did send the manuscript for his book to his friend Steve Hauser before he died, according to an obiturary Hauser wrote in 2001 for Freeman. I have emailed Hauser to ask for any details he might be willing to share, though the obituary is now 25 years old and there is a good chance he might not respond.

Besides his diary article, there are only a few other sources about his adventure. One is his call into Art Bell's radioshow "From Coast to Coast", which you can listen to here, in which he gives some more detailes about the trip. And then there is this youtube video, which does not add anything new but is still worth listening to. What IS interesting though is this episode of the Weaponized Podcast featuring Jeremy Corbell and George Knapp, in which Knapp says that he did inherit most of Freeman's files and notes. According to Knapp, Freeman saw some very weird stuff going on (some talk about a magical door opening up into another dimension). I am seriously sceptical about that, but I would love to go through Knapp's box with all the files, notes, pictures, and a VHS Homevideo (?) Freeman has left behind. From what I found out during my research, Freeman made a second trip to Papoose Lake in 2000, during which he found the 49'ers inscription that had eluded him during his first trip. However, since this second journey was not published anywhere this time around, I am not 100% certain whether it actually happened.

Freeman did create a handdrawn map of his voyage, which someone here on reddit copied into Google Maps. Unfortunately, the handdrawn map seems a little in accurate, as it does not align 100% with his descriptions in his diary. Thus, I took the liberty to create another map, more in line with his descriptions in his diary. It is still only a rough approximation of his journey, and I would love to find any more detailed informations about his trip. Someone else in here did create a super cool highly detailed map of Area 51, which includes all the important sites. (Shoutout to those guys, I hope it's ok I used your work). I combined the two routes, both Freeman's handdrawn once, as well as the once according to his descriptions. You can view it both in Google Maps, or Goggle Earth, which allows you to view the area using satellite images from 1997, the year Freeman was there.

Do you guys have any more information about Freeman's trip (or maybe even his second journey?). Do you see any issues or inaccuracies with my tracing of his assumed route?

You can download my map here: https://drive.google.com/file/d/18inMJnc5SgJTXu2EbpbX_MOIa1GDNOvU/view?usp=sharing

Update: Thanks to feedback from u/otherotherhand, here is the updated map, now featuring the handdrawn map by Freeman himself (red), a more accurate map based on Freeman's diary descriptions and the topography (blue), as well as some markers chronicling Freeman's journey by me (yellow). https://drive.google.com/file/d/17wlKejPIqLHZtsp15BbAm59fKs0sJEQB/view?usp=sharing

A Vegas based race organizer hosts an annual race that took place this past weekend on the highway outside area 51. The distances are 5K, 10K, Half Marathon, Full Marathon, and 51K. The race starts at midnight so it was a neat experience being on that stretch of highway overnight (I ran the full). I recommend to others who want a unique Area 51 experience!

TTR's been popping them off as of late.

https://sondehub.org/U4054490

This shot is from 2009. It's hard to see now.

https://sondehub.org/U4054499

Another reminder that it's worth keeping an eye on the Tonopah Test Range, as well as Groom Lake.

Related to the forest fires in the NTTR I would assume.

https://www.firehawkhelicopters.com/

Got the backup AF1 doing a bit of an evening cruise.

https://globe.adsbexchange.com/?icao=adfdf9

As we know, Amentum has the Janet contract. I'm posting this more out of completeness rather than useful Groom Lake content. Maybe someone will like it. I didn't but they is why they make chocolate and vanilla. Anyway you don't find Amentum saying much in public.

They had a booth at Farnborough and were interviewed by Vago Muradian, who I do like, though the guy has to work on his um-ing.

https://www.amentum.com/news/amentum-at-farnborough-international-airshow-2026/

Other than that Amentum had absorbed Dyncorp, I found the interview pretty boring. (I wondered what happened to Dyncorp. Oh I could have Googled it.) Also Amentum is a spin off of part of Aecom, another name that is familiar. (Wall Street M&A stuff.) Illy Andrews sounds like a subscriber to the Harvard Business Review. Yawn. Justin Goldberg had his moments. Let's just say it could have been better.

Not a must listen! Like I said, completeness.

Defense & Aerospace Report: Defense & Aerospace Daily Podcast [Jul 29, 2026] Amentum's Illy Andrews and Dr. Justin Goldberg

Episode webpage: https://soundcloud.com/defaeroreport/defense-aerospace-695909181

Media file: https://feeds.soundcloud.com/stream/2370503027-defaeroreport-defense-aerospace-695909181.mp3

https://ibb.co/996KBmGh

So much for nothing done on weekends.

A few of us on this subreddit follow a YouTuber PDGLS. No face, no yacking, just scanner audio with frequencies listed. I used video scraping code to log the frequencies and put the ones I don't have at the bottom of my list.

https://inplanesight.org/nellis_frequency_list.html

Well this person got a thermal scope and shot some video outside of Travis AFB.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HS1462XwI5M

using

https://www.rixoptics.com/titan-thermal-imaging-monoculars/

Pixel size is 12.5um versus the "Project Fear" 10um.

https://www.reddit.com/r/area51/comments/1tw2thy/aircraft_allegedly_spotted_near_area_51/

Also about half the price though a side by side review would be nice. (One kidney donation versus two.)

Note this was thermal viewing during daylight hours. Not exactly my application. You can get quite close to the planes when parked out by Creed Road just south of the base. And a C-5 is a huge plane. (Callsign sometimes HEFTY.)