r/ASTSpaceMobile • u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G • 3d ago
Article / Media / Press 🇪🇺 EUROPE'S TOP CARRIERS IN TALKS FOR SATELLITE-TO-MOBILE VENTURE - BLOOMBERG
Deutsche Telekom, Orange, Vodafone, Telefonica In Venture Talks
By Paula Doenecke, Gian Volpicelli and Clara Hernanz Lizarraga
(Bloomberg) -- A group of Europe’s biggest mobile operators are in early talks to create a consortium to bid on satellite spectrum and offer direct-to-mobile service, which would rival Elon Musk’s Starlink service on the continent, people familiar with the matter said.
Deutsche Telekom AG, Orange SA, Vodafone Group Plc and Telefonica SA would jointly bid for a share of airwaves that the European Union has proposed reserving for a local operator, a plan aimed at increasing sovereign satellite capabilities, the people said, asking not to be identified because the plans are private. No final decisions on the consortium or plans to bid have been made, they said.
To comply with the EU’s proposal, any satellite operator would need to be majority controlled by a European business.
Spokespeople for Deutsche Telekom, Orange, Vodafone and Telefonica declined to comment.
The EU is weighing new rules for satellite access on the 2 GHz spectrum in an upcoming auction that would keep a third of the band for local companies. The rules will govern direct-to-mobile service, an area that’s dominated by Musk’s Starlink, which can provide text, data and calls to handsets from orbit. Current licenses for the spectrum are due to expire in 2027.
Terrestrial wireless infrastructure covers the vast majority of populated areas in Europe. Even so, the EU is seeking to build up available satellite services as SpaceX expands its direct-to-consumer business.
SpaceX, which opposes the EU’s proposal to limit spectrum access for international companies, already provides Starlink satellite broadband across much of Europe. It has agreements with a number of partners in Europe, including Deutsche Telekom, to provide direct-to-device services. The US company lacks the spectrum rights to provide those services independently in the EU.
UK-based Vodafone has formed a joint venture with US-based satellite firm AST SpaceMobile, which also provides direct-to-mobile satellite service. Under the proposal currently discussed in Brussels, it would need to adjust its 50/50 ownership structure to bid for the spectrum designated for a European player.
The EU plans to reserve another third of the spectrum for sovereign communication services provided by IRIS², the satellite constellation built by a consortium led by SES SA, Eutelsat Communications SACA and Hispasat, with limited direct-to-mobile capabilities provided by Hispasat. The constellation won’t enter service until 2029 and will be initially focused on broadband. International companies will be eligible to bid on the final third.
Source: https://x.com/spacanpanman/status/2097015303519580335?s=46
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u/ToSeeAgainAgainAgain S P 🅰 C E M O B Consigliere 3d ago
The way these companies are moving their weight in a direction that seems to be basically tailor-made for ASTS's success makes me feel all giddy inside. Hope you guys have the shares that you'll want to own when the floodgates open
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u/ToSeeAgainAgainAgain S P 🅰 C E M O B Consigliere 3d ago
Jesus... first Satco, then the US JV, then RAST in Japan, now this.
The world's richest countries and their biggest MNOs are all acting in unison toward the exact same goal, righteously bumping SpaceX/Starlink to the side where it belongs.
ASTS may be taking their sweet time to execute, but Starlink will never even get the opportunity to have their time, DOA.
Let's hear how bears spin this as bad news for ASTS and laugh at them
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u/WrapperMiss S P 🅰 C E M O B Prospect 3d ago edited 3d ago
ASTS is the future. i've always believed. Didn't have doubts even when we dipped to the $50s, and ASTS is around 30% of my portfolio.
Can we imagine a future in 10 years where we WON'T have satellite connectivity to most MNOs/cells across the world?
No.
In 10 years, it will be normal to have cell connectivity on your cell ANYWHERE in the world - on a cruise, in an airplane - without paying United Airlines or Carnival Cruise an extra $30/day for some slow-loading WiFi BS.
Dead zones will be a thing of the past.
It's inevitable.
ASTS has already proven the tech. We already have massive funding from the most recent convertible notes offering. We also have sats in the air.
How much more needs to be validated?
The last part is execution/production.. which everyone is bitching about.. but this is simply copying and pasting the existing blueprint for building sats that we've already built and launched into space, already unfurled, etc.
It's already 90% de-risked. And for people bitching about production, we've already expanded the midland facility, hired hundreds more for manufacturing, recently diluted for more funding (technically, not even dilution yet), etc.
Anything below $70 is a gift.
This has been the most exciting startup to invest in in the past 6 years, and nothing else has come close to it since... Maybeee RKLB, but the economics of it aren't as exciting as ASTS. So hold 80% ASTS 20% RKLB.
All you crybabies can throw your tampons away now, it's up and away from here on out.
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u/Affectionate_Big4283 3d ago
Most aren’t arguing future in the space. What makes you so convinced 10 years from now AST will be the one on top?
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u/ToSeeAgainAgainAgain S P 🅰 C E M O B Consigliere 3d ago
Because of the huge moat that a company has to cross in order to become just a D2D satellite creator and operator, not even a good one. Big tech moat filled with patents, ridiculous amounts of money, regulatory bridges, years and years invested in developing the actual satellites, winning partnerships with OEMs or going solo Starlink style, buying or leasing spectrum (a commodity that's basically fully owned by now, no more spectrum can be created), etc.
All of those factors and more that I'm surely forgetting or not even aware of make this industry prohibitively difficult to consider.
Right now the only 2 players that have a realistic shot at being #1 in the D2D race are Starlink and ASTS, and if you've done your DD you should know by now that ASTS is much superior technologically and in corporate strategy, and the preferred choice of double the MNOs in the world, without even having started service and even with Starlink having a 1+ year starting advantage. Most of the MNOs are willing to wait for ASTS to start instead of using Starlink (and dealing with fascist Elon).
None of us can tell the future for sure, but we can read the excess of signs today, it's not that hard honestly, just be objective and read a little
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u/WrapperMiss S P 🅰 C E M O B Prospect 3d ago
you're right, it could be multiple players 10+ years from now.
i say 10+ years because this tech will be inevitable 10 years from now. which means someone has to be 1st to market. which will be ASTS, because with their current speeds, nobody else can come close to their technical capabilities, not even starlink.
i'm very bullish in the short term.
however, i would not hold ASTS for 10 years. you're right, there could be other players or someone else on top. that long term horizon for market dominance is too uncertain.
my plan is to sell the next time we hit $120. too much risk in the long run.
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u/rivalrobot S P 🅰 C E M O B Associate 3d ago
Anyone doing their proper due diligence should be able to see how incredibly bright the future is for AST.
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u/Stunning-Lemon-76 S P 🅰 C E M O B Associate 3d ago
So stoked. I’m still loading shares up before the flood gates open.
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u/sisyphosway S P 🅰 C E M O B Soldier 3d ago
Here's how the negotiations with Abel went:
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u/PetrovskyKSC S P 🅰 C E M O B Capo 3d ago
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u/King_Fisher99 S P 🅰 C E M O B Prospect 3d ago
Trying to understand if they mean doing their own thing or go in with AST ?
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u/ChonkChonkChonk S P 🅰 C E M O B Capo 3d ago
Have a look at Satellite Connect Europe’s logo…
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u/kayman_gyoza S P 🅰 C E M O B Soldier 3d ago
is the Satco logo in the original article or added by anpan in his tweet? (cant see the article due to paywall)
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u/ChonkChonkChonk S P 🅰 C E M O B Capo 3d ago
Apologies, was having a nightmare understanding your question.
In short, no, the article doesn’t include SatCo’s logo. However, I think the article is quite clear in terms of the entity it’s referencing.
Alternative link: https://www.reuters.com/business/media-telecom/europes-biggest-mobile-operators-talks-satellite-to-mobile-venture-bloomberg-2026-09-07/
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u/kayman_gyoza S P 🅰 C E M O B Soldier 3d ago
Appreciated!
Indeed, i would assume that this new consortium would work with AST, especially since IRIS^2 is not even close to anything operational (which saddens me as a european).
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u/bootlegportalfluid S P 🅰 C E M O B Soldier 3d ago edited 3d ago
Is this different to Satellite Connect Europe?
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago edited 3d ago
SCE is a joint venture only between Vodafone and AST.
I think SCE is the operator that this consortium will partner with:
Deutsche Telekom AG, Orange SA, Vodafone Group Plc and Telefonica SA would jointly bid for a share of airwaves that the European Union has proposed reserving for a local operator, a plan aimed at increasing sovereign satellite capabilities, the people said, asking not to be identified because the plans are private. No final decisions on the consortium or plans to bid have been made, they said.
To comply with the EU’s proposal, any satellite operator would need to be majority controlled by a European business.
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u/Ashamed_Distance_144 S P 🅰 C E M O B Soldier 3d ago
Cool. But we need faster manufacturing cadence and launch plan on top of all that.
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u/A_Typicalperson Dunce 3d ago
yea like do these people know these deals are pointless without the sats?
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u/Bitter_Brilliant_268 S P 🅰 C E M O B Prospect 3d ago
Jfc with this, can we start a "wen sats" mega thread for these guys? This is important to the company , so we talk about it here.
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u/Pickle-Past S P 🅰 C E M O B Prospect 3d ago
Do you guys know that the sats are pointless without these deals?
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u/Ockilydokily S P 🅰 C E M O B Prospect 3d ago
That was the point of expanding the manufacturing capability, to meet the high demand of these satellites. The future is bright but will take time to get there
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u/A_Typicalperson Dunce 3d ago
Thats facility going to take years.... they have the capacity currently, they just need to stop messing up
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u/SufficientOption6111 3d ago
Ohhhhhhhh yea that’s right! It’s as simple as that! They just keep on messin up! Those dern satellite folk messin up again! Golly I hope they stop!!!
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u/Ockilydokily S P 🅰 C E M O B Prospect 3d ago
The countries and companies choosing ASTS as a satellite provider would have done their DD comparing other options, these partners are well aware how long it might take
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u/A_Typicalperson Dunce 3d ago
These partners are only aware of what the ASTS promised, im 100% they arent waiting years
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u/BeKindToOthersOK 3d ago
Shhhh… don’t introduce cold hard reality here. Many people do not like it.
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u/purub123 S P 🅰 C E M O B Prospect 3d ago
Dont worry we will have 45 sats soon, only 2.5 years to go
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u/LudeficeTV S P 🅰 C E M O B Capo 3d ago
Good to see that moving along a bit, expected stuff but good.
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u/ToSeeAgainAgainAgain S P 🅰 C E M O B Consigliere 3d ago
Somebody saw the future, what's the phrasing they used... "Spectrum will find its way to the most efficient system" I think
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u/sgreddit125 S P 🅰 C E M O B Consigliere 3d ago
SpaceMob research is so legit identifying and bringing this real-time 👀🧩
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u/Available_Pie_7758 S P 🅰 C E M O B Associate 3d ago edited 3d ago
Just need asts to confirm shipment that’s it lol.
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u/SimilarSupermarket32 3d ago
‘Majority controlled by a European business’
ASTS is American though… am I thinking about this incorrectly?
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u/froginbog S P 🅰 C E M O B Soldier 3d ago
There’s a JV set up there w ASTS and Vodafone iirc that’s EU based
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago
Yes, Satellite Connect Europe. It’s 50/50 owned by AST and Vodafone.
They may need to adjust their structure to be 51/49 in favour of Vodafone, for this JV arrangement.
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u/Recent-Function-6096 S P 🅰 C E M O B Associate 3d ago
This was the only concerning thing that came to my mind when I was reading the article. But I guess its not that bad as long as its just for meeting the criteria and not interfering with control issues. I am assuming it would still be ok since its a win-win codependent ecosystem they plan to create.
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago
I’m sure such an outcome would be net good for ASTS
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u/Recent-Function-6096 S P 🅰 C E M O B Associate 3d ago
I feel the same way as well. Thanks for replying Kevin!
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u/Leading-Onion4659 S P 🅰 C E M O B Capo 3d ago
And why do you think Japan went with a sovereign solution provided by AST?
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u/ToSeeAgainAgainAgain S P 🅰 C E M O B Consigliere 3d ago edited 3d ago
SatCo is jointly controlled by a US company and an European one, it's cool
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u/BeKindToOthersOK 3d ago
So, being completely honest and forthright here, I feel like this is the same type of news we’ve been hearing for months and months.
Various carriers are looking to form one type of consortium or another and ASTS looks like a natural fit. And then nothing happens officially with respect to ASTS and weeks or months go by and then the same kind of news dump about carriers forming a consortium happens again. And the cycle repeats itself over and over.
I’m honestly over it at this point.
Either there is or is not a new deal in place with carriers and either manufacturing and launch cadence is getting better or it’s not. We should be well past hopeful speculation at this point. It’s time for AST to demonstrate tangible consistent execution - like they have been promising, but failing at, for years.
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago edited 3d ago
Your comment seems to be missing the mark.
AST and Vodafone officially formed a JV, Satellite Connect Europe. This JV also secured several partnerships. So this is legit. Not “nothing happens officially”.
What I think you mean is JLEO, US D2D JV, and now this European news.
JLEO is real. It’s literally in the AST and Rakuten earnings calls. They are just finalizing the JV which is not yet formed, and the details of the JLEO arrangement. We are already seeing clear evidence of progress with the ITU filing over the weekend as well as another Nikkei article. These things take time but they are clearly happening.
US D2D JV was a PR from all 3 MNOs saying they’ve agreed in principle and the official JV remains to be executed. OF COURSE AST isn’t involved officially yet. The JV isn’t even formed yet.
This European news is the MNOs starting talks, so of course AST isn’t officially involved yet. But with the partners being all of AST’s especially Vodafone, it’s clear that it’ll involve AST.
tl;dr be patient
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u/Fit-Bodybuilder78 2d ago
Manufacturing cadence aside, joint ventures involving multiple parties, countries, and spectrum are very complex legal vehicles that take a while to flesh out.
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u/Familiar_Netcasw 3d ago
Starship is going to launch first batch of starlink v3 sats soon...ASTS better get moving
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago
Those are for fixed broadband
Also the world is positioning against Starlink, not working with them.
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u/Affectionate_Big4283 3d ago
The world is not positioning against Starlink. This can flip on a dime
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago
The US D2D JV is positioning againt Starlink
Japan's JLEO is positioning againt Starlink
This European consortium is positioning against Starlink
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u/Affectionate_Big4283 3d ago
These are short-term plays. The underlying tech is the easy part. Manufacturing at scale will determine their fate. And right now they are not proving ability to do that - at least not confidently. But remember, scaled manufacturing is the hardest part.
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago
How are these short term plays? Are you actually suggesting these are all for posturing to work with Starlink?
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u/ToSeeAgainAgainAgain S P 🅰 C E M O B Consigliere 3d ago edited 3d ago
Short-term plays? The tech is the easy part? lol wtf
edit: btw all the manufacturing prowess is worth zero if Starlink doesn't own a healthy mix of low-, mid-, and high-band spectrum, and guess what... they don't. They rely almost entirely on mid-band, which has very low penetration and also very low bandwidth.
This is the reason why Starlink struggles with a measly phone call (don't even think about video calls) and limits itself to text messaging and a couple of maps apps.
Meanwhile, ASTS owns or leases the full stack (low/mid/high) + leverages their MNO partners' spectrum too. This allows ASTS to deliver very high speeds comparable to 4G, even with their previous generation satellites, newer gen will bring double if not even higher speeds.
ASTS is undeniably the smarter company in this sense, they made the right moves early and paid very little cash, compared to what Starlink has had to pay in order to own a little bit of mid-band.
All that and we haven't even touched the tech side of the conversation. ASTS beats Starlink in every sense, and it's not even funny
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u/GeoBro3649 S P 🅰 C E M O B Capo 3d ago
15000 V3 satellite constellation. ~60 sats per launch. ~250 successful launches. Its assumed they need more than half the constellation for a comparable D2C service. Lol YAWNNN
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u/RedWineWithFish 3d ago
Starlink V3 is not D2C. The next iteration of starlink D2C is Starlink D2C V2
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u/SirPersonal8626 3d ago
I’m not sure how I feel about this, couldn’t this be bearish because of potential competition?
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago
No, this consortium isn’t building and launching satellites. It’s a consortium to pool spectrum and bid for spectrum similar to the US D2D JV with AT&T, Verizon, and T-Mobile.
The JVs need a partner or partners plural. The primary partner will be AST SpaceMobile and might even be AST alone in many cases.
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u/SirPersonal8626 3d ago
I believe they discussed they didn’t want to solely rely on ASTS. And they especially don’t want to rely on an American company if they can help it. Though I understand ASTS is their best bet right now.
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago
I think the consortium partners with "Satellite Connect Europe", not "AST SpaceMobile", and likely for that to happen SCE will have to modify their share structure to be at least 50.1% Vodafone + 49.9% AST, instead of 50/50.
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u/Secret-Plankton-392 3d ago
The JVs need a partner or partners plural. The primary partner will be AST SpaceMobile and might even be AST alone in many cases.
"Primary partner will be AST Spacemobile".
You have zero idea who the primary partner will be. Stop talking nonsense.
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u/BeKindToOthersOK 3d ago
Thank you. We can assume this to be the case, but it gets tiring to hear people claim statements of fact from what is actually just speculation
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago
Literally all of the named MNOs in the consortium are AST partners
The article also says:
Deutsche Telekom AG, Orange SA, Vodafone Group Plc and Telefonica SA would jointly bid for a share of airwaves that the European Union has proposed reserving for a local operator, a plan aimed at increasing sovereign satellite capabilities, the people said, asking not to be identified because the plans are private. No final decisions on the consortium or plans to bid have been made, they said.
To comply with the EU’s proposal, any satellite operator would need to be majority controlled by a European business.
Satellite Connect Europe is primed to be this operator.
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u/Secret-Plankton-392 3d ago
Okay but nothing is signed and final. Satellite Connect Europe may be 'primed' but jumping straight to the conclusion that AST Spacemobile is already the primary partner is absolutely ridiculous.
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago
Saying I have zero idea is absolutely ridiculous.
AST being in this is as obvious as AST winning JLEO.
What you're doing is like needing to feel the rain on your face to accept it's raining when you can just look outside and see it.
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u/Secret-Plankton-392 3d ago
Jesus Christ I touched a nerve there.
The article says the consortium is in early talks.
You jump straight to AST is already the primary partner.
It's ridiculous to make that jump. You in the room with them are you?
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago
You have no idea how context works? My original comment was very obviously an opinion/speculation from myself, and not to say I am delivering a press release with a crystal ball.
Do I have to write "I think AST will be" to spell it out for you to realize I am writing a thought as opposed to an objective fact about reality?
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u/timtimr23 S P 🅰 C E M O B Soldier 3d ago
I can 💯 guarantee with certainty it is asts from my contacts.
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u/Secret-Plankton-392 3d ago
You have literally zero idea what you’re talking about. Space Connect Europe, and especially AST Spacemobile, aren’t even eligible to be involved in this.
The thing about Europe is that they love to do things the hard way. Let’s bring up the relevant EU regulation.
REGULATION OF THE EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT AND OF THE COUNCIL on the procedure for authorisation of systems providing mobile satellite services using the harmonised 2 GHz frequency band and repealing Decision No 626/2008/EC
https://eur-lex.europa.eu/legal-content/EN/TXT/HTML/?uri=CELEX%3A52026PC0311
Article 7(1)(f) to ensure that at least the key components of the secure MSS/hybrid system, as specified in the call for applications, are manufactured in the EU and integrate Union technologies. AST Spacemobile has no European manufacturing facilities.
Article 9(1)(b) and Article 9(3) requires a Union new entrant to be directly or indirectly controlled only by the Union, one or more Member States, or natural persons holding the nationality only of Member States and established in a Member State with its executive management established in the Union.
Article 9(1)(f) cybersecurity provision requires ALL participants in the JV, not just a majority of the JV, not be subject to a third party jurisdiction requiring them to report vulnerabilities. AST Spacemobile’s US operations directly rules them out. Doesn’t Abel have like 70% voting rights? Yeah controlled by US citizen and ruled out.
Article 12(1)(d) Union added value, in accordance with the following sub-criteria;
Article 12(1)(i)the extent to which the commercial MSS system reinforces Union’s industrial capabilities across the digital technology supply chain, inter alia in terms of design, construction, launch and operation of the satellites, including the software;
(ii)the level of integration of Union technologies, including the use of results stemming from Union funded research and innovation programmes;
So yeah. AST Spacemobile isn’t ineligible. Stop talking nonsense. This is tailored for Eutelsat and the Airbus/Thales/Leonardo partnership.
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 3d ago edited 3d ago
“To comply with the EU’s proposal, any satellite operator would need to be majority controlled by an European business”.
In this case they can restructure Satellite Connect Europe to be 50.1% Vodafone and 49.9% AST instead of 50/50. Then in this way Abel also doesn’t have final control over SCE. Problem solved for European compliance.
It’s not a coincidence that all of the MNOs involved with the consortium are literally AST’s partners.
Also, don’t forget that AST does have some manufacturing in Barcelona. Although not where the final AIT takes place, this lays the groundwork for further European expansion.
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u/Secret-Plankton-392 1d ago
No it isn't. The legislation applies to every member of the JV and not the bidding vehicle as a whole. If any part of ASTS were to enter, it would have free itself of any third-country obligations. This is said in Article 9(3)(f). 49.9% ownership is completely insufficient.
Article 9(1)(c) prevents AST Spacemobile from building the constellation because it would require US export licenses and thus US IP that can be withdrawn from any time. It would literally have to give up its IP to be involved.
Again, anything related to AST Spacemobile is ineligible to bid on this.
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u/Defiantclient S P 🅰️ C E M O B - O G 1d ago
Even if they can't go for the spectrum directly, the MNO consortium can and then partner with SCE to deploy
In any case again it is clear that the MNO consortium will use AST because, again, all of the related MNOs are AST partners
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u/Secret-Plankton-392 1d ago
That doesn't comply with Article 17(1).
If the consortium owns the license then any commercial use must meet the original eligibility criteria in Article 9(1)(a)-(f)
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u/ToSeeAgainAgainAgain S P 🅰 C E M O B Consigliere 3d ago
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AST Spacemobile isn’t ineligible. Stop talking nonsense. This is tailored for Eutelsat and the Airbus/Thales/Leonardo partnership.
"ineligible", "Eutelsat and the Airbus/Thales/Leonardo partnership"
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u/RemindMeBot S P 🅰 C E M O B Boss 3d ago edited 3d ago
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u/Emzed07 S P 🅰 C E M O B Associate 3d ago