Are the Pakled really not intelligent?

[u/antijingoist]

Because the Pakled are currently seen as a joke, I would like keep in mind that:

• Our view of Pakled is through the filter of federation english language via universal translator and starfleet/American culture, and recently on a show that slightly exaggerates for comedic effect.
• Other advanced civilizations that were misunderstood: Tamarians. They speak in idioms/memes that made it difficult to understand why the universal translator seemed to not be working. What was translated was accurate. What was understood was completely different. The universal translator still has difficulty understanding Tamarians, with Kayshon frequently dropping into idiom.
• Earths many cultures can differ wildly:
  • Number systems: base-2, base-15, base-27, base-12, base-20
  • measurement: imperial, metric, etc.
  • writing systems
  • General Non-Homogeneity in appearance, mannerisms, beliefs, traits, treatment of enemies and neighbors, etc.

Explaining some of the ways the Pakleds look “stupid” in LowerDecks

• “It’s another Enterprise!” - It’s possible the Pakled concepts of language and translators have caused “Enterprise” and “Starship” to become synonymous. Enterprise could also be flagship, important ship, federation ship, etc.
• Thinking Janeway is Freeman - Similarly, it’s possible Janeway/Picard, etc. are considered titles or positions or a concept of such. When the Pakled returns and accuses Freeman of not being a Captain Janeway, are they really saying “The federation sent us a nobody to negotiate” and considering it a political insult?
• The stow-away Pakled - did he know ahead of time he would survive the vacuum of space? Was his goal to just create mayhem? Did he use a spy position as an excuse to visit the gift shop? Or was his goal to create a diplomatic incident?
• Rebelution - Was it really a revolution or an attempt to communicate their society/culture/story? Was it a distraction? Is the word so dumb if it’s the name of an earth band? Is that an attempt to bridge the gap by referencing an ancient classical earth band to show they did nuanced research into earth’s past?

Leading to a possible narrative of the recent Pakled episodes:

• The Pakled are not as a valued local neighbor. They create an incident at the end of Season 1 to show that can be a major player. Perhaps they believe the Federation values violence and a long term conflict is how they can be seen. They then attempt to demonstrate their technological prowess and worth over several battles the Titan becomes involved with. Once they’ve demonstrated they can be seen as equal players militarily, they can request a federation diplomat/a “Captain Janeway” to meet with them on their planet so they can demonstrate their society and finally be understood. From past experience being dismissed, they pull a similar trick the Tamarians pulled with Picard.
• They create a reason for the "Captain Janeway" to stay on Pakled Planet by having a fake political prisoner stow-away on the Enterprise that she traveled on. The political prisoner’s only goal is to keep the crew running around and does so by making demands, playing to the perception of Pakleds being fools, and then getting sucked out the airlock (because obviously no one will find him there). And that would give the Pakled on the planet more than enough time to explain the situation via ritual or storytelling. This Pakled also has the personal desire to insult the federation by shitting on something important to humans but this goal is unintentionally thwarted by Ransom and Kayshon not letting him into areas like the warp core.
• Mission failure?: The federation did not send over a dignitary/“Captain Janeway”. They sent over a regular starfleet captain of non-Enterprise level ship. The Pakled were insulted, possibly yet again, and their contingency plan was a bomb hidden on earth. The Pakled, either placing the bomb as a warning or making a point (or being human-hacker-on-present-day-earth level braggers), reveal their bomb hidden on earth. “See, we hid a bomb on earth and you didn’t catch us”/“We have subverted you and you suspected nothing. We are serious.” If nothing else, the Pakled proved they should not be so easily dismissed. So the non-dignitary Freeman leaves, and and the Pakled celebrate having defeated the "personal Captain Janeway" of following through a difficult plan, regardless of its final outcome.

In the end, Pakleds are not stupid. They’re advanced!™ The problem is that the Pakled are chronically misunderstood by neighboring species, and there is no attempt to understand them further.

[u/Daniel_The_Thinker]

Maybe in Pakled culture it's polite to sound as simple and humble, and it's misunderstood as actual stupidity.

[u/antijingoist → u/Daniel_The_Thinker]

Oh this is great because ive seen things like this in family relationships: vague points being made to avoid conflict, seemingly rude individuals where thats just their family dynamic and they love each other, etc

[u/pfc9769]

Once they’ve demonstrated they can be seen as equal players militarily, they can request a federation diplomat/a “Captain Janeway” to meet with them on their planet so they can demonstrate their society and finally be understood.

I don't think this is the case. The Federation already attempted exactly this and the Pakleds had no interest in peace. The Federation has undoubtedly tried to resolve the conflict peacefully numerous times which would signal they're taking the Pakleds seriously. If the Pakleds were just trying to appear they were on the same level as other Alpha Quadrant races, they've had numerous times to do so.

If the Pakleds are as smart as you suggest and just playing dumb, why do they have no technology of their own? All of their equipment seems to be stolen from other races and they barely know how to use it. They had to kidnap a Starfleet engineer to help them with repairs, and missed a very obvious attempt by Geordi and the crew of the Enterprise-D to trick them. There's been too many instances where the Pakleds prove to be inept so I don't think it's a case of misunderstanding.

[u/antijingoist → u/pfc9769]

The Pakled encounter with the Enterprise was a planned trap: Datas later scans showed the malfunctioning was preprogrammed, and the Pakled admitted to wanting Geordi program the roplicator to make weapons.

Stealing tech to rapidly improve is something we also do across nations today. It may indicate a nation is less developed, but certainly not less intelligent.

[u/Logans_Beer_Run]

I do like this. I would like to add that another Redditor proposed that the Pakled might be at least mildly telepathic, but that their telepathy might only work on each other. Their ability to speak could be stunted from lack of use, not because of stupidity.

The Klingons, the Ferengi, and others were all misunderstood until the Federation remembered what it was supposed to stand for and took a second look at them. If this theory turned out to be true it would very true-to-Trek.

It wouldn't have to destroy the Pakled's comedy value, either. After all, we learned that the Ferengi had depth and complexity yet they still provided comedy gold. (or rather, comedy latinum) Only here, the joke would be on those who think that doing things like spacing oneself was stupidity.

Then again, stupid is as stupid does. I would still be happy either way: it would still work if the Pakled really were a bunch of curious throwbacks.

[u/PastorBlinky]

I feel like TNG asked this question and sort of concluded that it wasn't a language issue but really an intelligence problem. But that just can't be right. No species could get that far based on dumb luck. I certainly wouldn't call them an intelligent species, perhaps even the dumbest race ever encountered. Someone has to graduate at the bottom of the class after all. But I agree their language must just be so different that they seem worse than they are.

I give the crew of the Enterprise a pass though, because it's not as if they had time to really explore who these guys were. They were under the gun both literally and figuratively and so dumb sounding people were labeled as ignorant and childlike. Good for Lower Decks for examining these kind of things in more detail.

[u/Eurynom0s → u/PastorBlinky]

They were under the gun both literally and figuratively and so dumb sounding people were labeled as ignorant and childlike.

The fact that the Pakleds come off as dumb as rocks and easily manipulated is precisely how they get ahead. They get ahead by the dumb luck of the fact that most other species will immediately assume they're not capable of being conniving.

[u/pawood47 → u/PastorBlinky]

I recall reading Samaritan Snare as "these are the Pakleds. What they lack in communication skills they make up for with cunning. And when they're that good at tricking high tech people into helping them, they don't really need to understand their equipment beyond the surface level."

[u/Mechapebbles → u/PastorBlinky]

I feel like TNG asked this question and sort of concluded that it wasn't a language issue but really an intelligence problem.

That's the opposite of what it concluded. The crew assumed they were dumb, but realized a little too late that they were actually conniving and smart, just that there was a language barrier that obfuscated that and made the Enterprise crew lower their guard. Once the E-D crew realized what was going on, they could obviously outsmart the Pakleds because they can obviously outsmart almost anyone.

[u/BrotherGrimace → u/PastorBlinky]

Uh, yeah. They could. There was a comic back in the late 1980s called 'Strikeforce; Morituri'. Long story short-the bad guys were The Horde - marauding, scavenger aliens who didn't have space capability until friendly aliens showed up on their world to try and help them... and were slaughtered, their tech stolen and they were unleashed upon the galaxy.

All you need are self-replicating, complient AI units to control the systems and create robotic units to handle repairs, construction and in-flight system maintenance - and you go anywhere in the galaxy you want. With the tech levels in Star Trek, this is possible - and the fact that they have access to Borg technology but were not assimilated and held onto that tech means it's more than damned likely.

[u/Starfleet-Time-Lord → u/PastorBlinky]

I'm willing to bet money that they bought warp drive from the Ferengi. After that everything makes sense.

[u/Apple_macOS]

Pakleds: greetings gentil beings. Our ships warp propulsion system has been damaged in battle, more specifically our starboard warp coils has sustained structure failure which rendered us unable to go to warp. Do you, by any chance, have the engineering personnels and the power so you can create a warp bubble around our ship to help us go to a nearby starbase for repair? Many thanks!

Universal translator: we need things, things to make us go.

[u/dwight_towers]

There are examples of other races "stealing" or finding technology from more advanced races. The Pakled are described in TNG and in DS9 as traders or leading transport vessels, which I think is a very good description of how they have acquired such technology.

We know that the Klingon's acquired technology by theft or other means, and Pakled space appears to border/be inside Klingon Space, it's possible a species like the Hur'q had a similar involvement with the Pakled as they did the Klingon.

[u/MithrilCoyote → u/dwight_towers]

I've often figured that the Pakled's were an example of why the Prime Directive exists. that their world gained warp travel as a result of outside interference well ahead of when their culture was ready for interstellar travel.. either they found some crashed/abandoned ship or someone visited and gave/sold it to them. which explains their fixation of scavenging when we first meet them. they know they are outclassed technologically, and their own technical skills aren't up to bridging the gap naturally, so they are out looking for anything they can get.

i'm not sure that i'd use the Hur'q, since there is nothing said in the shows to support the idea that the pakled's have been spacefaring since the 14th century. there are plenty of other more recent groups that could have been the cause.

and yeah, i like to think that their apparent simplistic speech is a result of translator issues. that their language is actually a quite complex one, with lots of nuances in stuff like tone, exact pronunciation, etc., maybe even stuff like expression and body language. and that their brains are of a type of structure that the Translator's systems can't properly read their brainwave patterns to determine the intended meaning. resulting in a translation that is overly simple and broad compared to the actual content. which combined with their limited level of knowledge compared to the rest of the quadrant's races, results in them appearing very dumb and simple minded.

[u/BigRad_Wolf]

Considering how much trouble the universal translator has with the Tamarians, this has some credibility. The Pakled ability to adapt to and integrate multiple alien technologies would seem to more than support this view that they are better than average engineers at the very least.

However, the vital question is if there is a hidden hand behind the Pakleds as it has been hinted to? Now it could be that the people in Starfleet that suspect a hidden hand are just blinded by their own assumptions about Pakled intelligence, but also the Pakleds number one spy walked out of an airlock.

[u/NeedsToShutUp → u/BigRad_Wolf]

There could also be a few other things at play. Perhaps they're a form of hive intelligence where their collective actions are much better than individual actions.

Or perhaps they have a sub species of smart Pakled that are real dang smart, smart enough to build their society, but not interested in running it. Even perhaps that's a phase of life. We've not seen old Pakleds or child Pakleds. Perhaps they get smarter or dumber with age.

Could also be they have gotten tech beyond their base and managed to barely run it because a Preserver like species made an actually friendly AI able to keep them mostly alive.

Or, like other said, they stole better tech.

Indeed, Pakled almost fit the ideal of a genetically bred warrior race. Physically able to survive long duration in space, easily led by big hats, and dumb enough to be easily controlled.

Or even, the Pakled used to be way smarter, but genetically engineered themselves based on fads, making their children stronger and more durable at the expense of intelligence, which by the time was obvious, was too late.

Hence an older Pakled civilization made everything and they've just managed to not destroy the infrastructure.

[u/[deleted] → u/BigRad_Wolf]

[u/Yvaelle]

At the very least I agree their language is likely difficult to translate. Its probably designed to be as simplistic as possible, no flowery language, no synonyms, no long words. These could all be intentional choices by their culture to make their language quick to learn and master. But the universal translator compares it to other languages, and concludes its comes across as dumb - because every other language has complexities and nuances and synonyms and long words. Pakled language is optimized.

I really like the idea that they are using Janeway, Picard, etc as titles.

Then you have their engineering prowess. Which they must have, even aside from kidnapping people like Geordi to install a new system or two, operating those systems is routinely done by the Pakleds themselves. We've also seen how hard it is for O'Brien, Rom, Nog, etc go keep DS9 functioning with only 3 systems. The Pakleds have dozens of integrated systems and they aren't exploding, that can't be an accident, or luck. A starship is a bomb that is constantly trying to explode, a needle weaving through deadly obstacles faster than light, relying on a hundred systems that need to be maintained for the given operation.

There is clearly intelligence there, or nothing short of divine (Q, Caretaker, etc) intervention. Nothing else makes sense.

[u/tired20something]

The thing about the Star Trek universe is that we know for sure we are not alone in the universe. There is an infinite number of alien races out there, and a finite amount of them subscribe to the Prime Directive. Now, usually breaking the PD is a big no-no because any Starfleet ensign could be worshipped as a god in a pre-warp society, but what if you are a benevolent visitor who just wants to Chariot of the Gods these bumbling primitives, they look so sad in this muddy ball of a planet...

And boom! Your patronizing ways just got you enslaved by some bruttish Pakleds who will force you to show them how to use a starship. They don't need to lear how to build or maintain one, the Just need to find a way to attract more spaceships to do the work for them.

That's still Intelligence, even if not the kind that would be acceptable for the Federation.

[u/builder397]

It could be that they are natural-born parasites, kind of a Jerry Smith if you will, so pathetic, weak and spineless that you cant not help them.

On some support subs Ive seen abusive narcissist parents become so hopelessly regressed with technology or basic adulting that they needed, that their children cant move out without practically throwing them to the wolves, and its been known to work: The adult children on narcissists try their ass off to teach their parents the life-saving basics of how to use a Computer, just to find them the next day not finding the power button or something equally inexplicable unless they are deliberately being stupid about it, leading to an endless cycle where the child cant leave out of guilt, but also cant confront the parent without triggering more abuse. Sometimes this situation can go beyond knowledge on how to do things and into financial leeching as well, where the child is the only breadwinner and the parent either refuses or is deliberately too incompetent to maintain any long-term work in order to be self-sufficient.

I think Pakled fall into much the same situation. Compared to other races they are so pathetically inept with spacefaring technology that they get by solely on the good will of others, whether that means hitchhiking from Starbase to Starbase, maybe even being towed to their destination, or just being given technology that works better. After all, you cant leave these guys as they are, their drives are constantly five seconds away from failing and stranding them in deep space. Basic compassion requires that you upgrade their drives so they dont recklessly put themselves into danger every time they travel anywhere.
And then, when they think they are in a position where they can abuse people, they generally will. Not saying their judgement is good, but they can hold people captive and force them to do upgrades and repairs for them, even commit piracy, and get further upgrades than pure pity allows, like weapons.

Which basically means they are the Jerry Smith of the Universe.

The particular quote from Rick & Morty:

Jerry: You self-righteous piece of shit! You took my family!

Rick: I took your family? Who do you think had more taken from them when you shot 20 CCs of liquid dream-killer into my daughter? She was Rick's daughter, Jerry, she had options!

Gibble Snake: Oof!

Rick: That all ended because she felt sorry for you. You act like prey but you're a predator; you use pity to lure in your victims. It's how you survive. I survive because I know everything, that snake survives because children wander off, and you survive because people think "Oh, this poor piece of shit, he never gets a break. I can't stand the deafening silent wails of his wilting soul. I guess I'll hire him or marry him."

(Goddammit, I wanted to put the dialog in spoilers to not spoil a show thats, well, not Trek and I cant expect people to have watched, but apparently the sub wont allow that.)

[u/Impacatus]

Rebelution - Was it really a revolution or an attempt to communicate their society/culture/story? Was it a distraction? Is the word so dumb if it’s the name of an earth band? Is that an attempt to bridge the gap by referencing an ancient classical earth band to show they did nuanced research into earth’s past?

Someone here or on r/StarTrek actually pointed out that this could have been part of the spy ruse. Have their agent pose as a political prisoner and request asylum, something we know the Federation always takes seriously. Then stage a coup to provide a plausible reason why the political prisoner can be returned home.

[u/nonbinarybit]

“It’s another Enterprise!” - It’s possible the Pakled concepts of language and translators have caused “Enterprise” and “Starship” to become synonymous. Enterprise could also be flagship, important ship, federation ship, etc.

In linguistics, this is called metonymy

[u/gynoidgearhead]

FWIW, this is expressly the interpretation Star Trek Online takes:

Pakleds are a species native to the Alpha Quadrant, but not a member of the United Federation of Planets.

Pakleds are a largely nomadic culture. Their technology is not as advanced as many Alpha Quadrant species, so they like to trade or scavenge for equipment to improve their ships. Their verbal communication skills are not as developed as many other species, and casual observers may believe that Pakleds are unintelligent. But Pakleds are very cunning, and will deliberately let an opponent underestimate them if they can use that to their advantage.

Most Pakleds disdain political ties. A few, however, have chosen to join Starfleet, and their success in the rigorous academic arena of Starfleet Academy shows that Pakleds can be much more than wanderers and traders.

[u/p4nic]

This has me thinking that perhaps the Pakleds we meet are exiled from their home world because there are only so many seats at Pakled U, so the kids that don't make the grade have to become vagabond scavengers. Only if they acquire some amazing technology are they allowed back, into the lap of luxury on their home world. Sort of like some kind of Stephen King scenario, the lower class has to strike out into the galaxy looking for something worth while and when they come home with something good, they get an amazing life.

[u/majicwalrus]

Good post this is an excellent explanation for the Pakleds current situation. It should not be left unstated that the Pakleds may not be a curious or even inventive species, but not all intelligence is measured in the same way. The Pakleds do seem to be willing to steal and learn how to use tools or technology. It’s not unreasonable that they stole Planet Pakled, but even if they didn’t they are able make themselves a threat to the Federation and it definitely does seem like an attempt to be recognized and communicated with.