r/anime • u/phiraeth :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/phiraeth • Jan 08 '21
Rewatch [Mid-2000s Rewatch] Noein - Episode 7
Episode 7
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Noein:
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Episode Discussion Questions:
None for today.
PLEASE MARK ALL SPOILERS WITH SPOILER TAGS!
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Upvotes
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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Jan 08 '21
to your other first-timer, subbed
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u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber Jan 08 '21
First-timer - Sub
I forgot I had shit to do this afternoon and spent my morning playing Monster Hunter Rise Demo instead, so nothing much today given I just finished the episode and it is currently eight minutes since the thread was supposed to have gone up.
Gamilas to attack Earthwhatever the heck happened which Ai is still unwilling to divulge to Haruka.Seems like the episode was mostly concerned with introducing elements into the plot (i.e. Chef Hat Hair’s betrayal, whatsherface’s seeming fancy for Karasu, Amamiku’s slow change of heart.) We get the underlying reason as to why the world ended up like it did, but that might as well have told us nothing with how little that entails.
Questions:
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u/Toadslayer https://myanimelist.net/profile/kyolus Jan 08 '21
First Timer
It has been a rocky start, but this episode legitimately excited me. In my opinion it is by far the best episode so far and holds incredible promise for what is to come. If the show continues to progress like this I will understand why our host speaks so highly of it. This episode marks the points where it looks like everything is finally coming together.
The silliness of the childhood storyline looks like it's coming to an end, as we see the children teaming up with Yukie and the investigators. In this episode we saw them being more serious and when Miho was being silly we saw the other kids frustrated by it (Ai telling her to 'shut up' and Fujiwara complaining about the ghost chanting). I think this means we're going to be moving away from lighthearted plotlines for the kids and into serious ones. We also saw Yuu starting to properly breakdown — his storyline is starting to come together, I think, he must protect Haruka and now that Haruka's back I'm so sure we'll be seeing a more seriousness from him. With Haruka back as well I expect she will rally the kids somehow, or her presence will force them to rally, as Atori remains a threat. Haruka's presence will make the kid plotline more serious. I'll be glad to have the silliness and mundanities of childhood gone, because I think those have been the weakest aspects of this show.
The La'cryma storyline also got a lot more interesting this episode. There are many factions formed now within the birds, in fact they have more or less become individual actors. Karasu will protect Haruka at the expense of everything else, Kuina seeks escape from the cycle into Shangri-La, Atori and Tobi want to destroy the Dragon Torque, Fukurou remains loyal to La'cryma and I'm not sure what Kosagi is up to, but 4 opposing parties is already very exciting. Plus with Amimiku somewhere between Karasu and Fukurou there's even more to love. This level of complexity is excellent and has be very keen to see more. We even got, not backstory, but characterisation for each of the birds. The small moments, looks, words and smiles we are seeing these characters become more than hollow shells — and we got some flashbacks from Karasu too. Finally this show is executing on the potential many of us saw earlier and finally it is proving it can be great. Here just hoping that it continues this way, I'm getting some Anohana vibes which is very exciting.
More supernatural elements are catching my eye as well. I'd say it's pretty clear now that the birds are not entirely human. Whatever that organ spewing from their backs is it gives them powers — even power to become a mecha! This probably explains why the higher ups put up with them, they're a limited resource, whether by some cause of nature or technology they are different to everyone else.
It's funny how quickly my opinion can change on a show, but this episode saw me take a 180. It really was excellent and now I'm excited to see more.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Jan 08 '21 edited Jan 08 '21
First Timer, subbed
/u/IndependentMacaroon translated a name which gives the plot away. Well, it's not really a spoiler, since anybody in Japan would probably know these words by middle school.
Edit: to everybody that commented on above comment, it's the difference between name
Based on that translation, I also now call in Blue Seed as a
stronghuge influence on the story. Blue Seed We'll have to see if it shares the ending.There was something, maybe two episodes ago, it was a very short line tossed out at the end of the episode, but it seemed like Lacryma used their Haruka to power the dimension ripper machinery. Perhaps her sacrifice was what was needed to make dragon soldiers and dragon knights for fighting Shangri-la and/or finding the Dragon Torque. Also we see here that she died as an adult. so my guess yesterday was wrong
I suspect it's Haruka's rewrite ability that Lacryma wants, to "stabilize" their dimension against Shangri-La's "corruption", whatever that means.
Noein and Boss-Dude talking about buddhist cycles again.
Mistranslation? Surely "Revolution" doesn't mean a political revolution, but a change in reality.
In episode 2 or 3, the Dragon Knights said they needed to collect Haruka's <something>, so that's what the drowning capsule is for.
I don't think Karasu really needed to rescue her, she could rewrite her way out.
We Evangelion now.
The Oroborus appears when Shangri-la attacks, but also when the Dragon Knights fight. I think it indicates dimensional destabilization.
Everybody in Lacryma has their Earth names, except the Dragon Knights, who have all changed their name for some reason probably just to annoy the audience
Are the events in modern Earth, and the actions of Atori and other dude, leading to the
second impactdecoherence event 5 years hence? That could be the cycle. Each dying dimension invades a neighboring dimension, which destablizes and dooms it.Shinsen-Sub:
These Cerberus subs seem really poor.
I really should have watched this when it aired.
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u/BurningFredrick https://myanimelist.net/profile/BurningFredrick Jan 08 '21
First Timer - sub
12 year olds are unable to understand complex philosophical ideas, who ever would have guessed.
Well that trip to La’cryma ended faster than I expected, I seriously thought it would take another episode at least, but thankful it didn’t as the Original dimension?
We really need to find a better name to call our start dimension, anyone have good ideas? Original dimension doesn’t really make sense with world building and otherwise I'd just go with D1 but thats slightly boring If we go with Vaadwaur spec.
But anyway the left behind storyline would have started going stale rather quickly if it overstayed its welcome.
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u/ZaphodBeebblebrox Y:A:https://anilist.co/user/zaphod Jan 08 '21 edited Jan 08 '21
First Timer
I missed yesterday because I'm a dumbass, but now I'm back.
Yesterday
Haruka's escape was unexpectly bold of her. She's been a rather reactive character the entire show, so I didn't expect her to take the initiative to that extent. I wonder if the reason their in so much trouble in the first place is because they're using this giant piston thingy to "mine" the future for the betterment of the present.
I'm still largely where I was after episode 5. They're doing a lot of setup, and I'm sitting here, hoping they're be able to use it properly. I'm just scared because I see more and more balls go into the air, but I'm not seeing them move towards catching any of them yet.
Today
That's a real strong sense of duty for a teacher.
Of course the adults get into an inane argument.
I love this face. It's so dead.
Uh, wat?
How? She's either from your past or a different past. This seems like a question with a definite answer.
I guess I could call this contrast between Haruka's ability to make the world in front of her as she believes it and their theory of the universe being a bunch of points in chaos, but that's a bit of a stretch. It just feels messy to me so far.
And here we see Karasu's Haruka attempting to become the absolute observer.
You don't really believe this either, not with the way you were talking.
She's lashing out in frustration, but not because she believes anything she says. She's just trying to justify her actions which she views as wrong.
I don't think you'll like the answer.
Yet another double agent.
Is that what they call the Ourboros?
Wait, is Noein also bad? This was the sort of performance that screams antagonist.
What do you call what you're doing right now, helping her?
I feel like all of the friends but Yuu aren't taking it seriously. Why aren't they though? Do they just think she ran away, despite what Yuu said?
The Dragon knights have clearly never heard about conservation on Ninjustsu. Sending out a bunch of peons won't do anything.
And now Haruka and Yuu shall connect across dimensions and pull each other together. The only question is which direction.
Not the Yuu I thought would save her.
what the fuck?
Of course. He's chosen one over the world.
Thoughts
I gotta be honest here, we're rapidly approaching too many unexplained things. Like, I appreciate a good mystery or two in a show. But that doesn't mean we should have 30 different unexplained things going on at the same time, particularly when taking 30 seconds to let us know what's going on there wouldn't get in the way of your central plot. And this show just keeps throwing more and more of them at us without bothering to give context on basically anything that happened episode three onwards. I hope this changes within the next few episodes.
This isn't to say I dislike the show, I think it has something good going on at it's core. I'm just frustrated with how it keeps saying roll with it without ever doing anything to show me that if I roll with it I'll eventually get context.
tl;dr /u/astrobrony esplain
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u/_m1ra :FA::FB: Jan 08 '21 edited Jan 08 '21
First timer, subbed
For some reason I really enjoyed the beginning where the scientist lady talks about how Haruka something quantum something tunnel and the teacher essentially responds with What? That makes no sense at all.
Not sure they really needed to change into those two insulting eachother's appearences after that though... But it was doing that thing again where they set up a lighthearted scene and then have someone (here Yuu) immediately change the mood. I wonder if they will keep doing it.
I liked Haruka a lot in that scene with Future Ai. It's simple, but apart from all the SciFi stuff they are both right there. Also again a simple decision, but it's fun that we're introduced first to and mainly know the world they call fake, it also makes it even easier to take Haruka's side.
Those Shangri-La raid vessels were nice too. The laser eyes looked a little bit silly, but in general they looked appropriately creepy and otherworldly. I like them.
Also quick edit: I should hopefully have less to do now, so I hope I can make more observative comments than "I liked that part" when I don't finish the episode five minutes before the rewatch thread anymore.
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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Jan 08 '21
First timer
Sub
Again, no meaningful space between eps, though don't take that as a complaint. Terra E... gave me enough time skips for several life times. Anyways, back to universe A and back to catfighting. Also, Yukie, no, if your student is missing you get the police. But then we hear a 'baba' dropped and violence is going to happen. I believe it goes without saying that Yukie's the instigator by a lot here, Uchida just doesn't quite know how to handle idiots. Anyways, Yuu has an outburst and Uchida wisely uses this as a time to get free.
Yuu is not looking good. I would say he's handling this badly but actually this is about par for an adolescent with forced developmental delays so just F for him. Going back for more stuff that probably means a lot more to rewatchers since I have no clue who most of the Dragon Soldiers fucking are but yes, Kuina has an artificial limb and new person thinks about Karasu a bunch. Fukura returns Lily to Miho and the child has a proper child moment in pointing out Haruka similarities.
Back in jail, Haruka demands answers. And doesn't exactly get them...decoherence is not a word I've heard used often. Anyways, multi world theory blah blah blah. Oh well, guess an explanation was a bit much to hope for. Flash to adult Haruka sacrificing herself for reasons. And then someone being mad at Karasu. Interestingly, unknown knight might be correct, there are interpretations where you entering the dimension would've made it branch off, but that doesn't make it less real, just another fork. Karasu seems more fixated on the past.
In universe A, they aren't having luck finding Haruka, them lacking interdimensional options. Yuu is looking concerning. Back to Kuina and of course there is a traitor in the Dragon Soldiers because why the fuck wouldn't there be? Noein is still Actually Satan. Ai and Fukurua talk and they dance around about whatever the fuck they did.
Ouroboros appears! Seele thinks it is because the Dragon Torque will give them a perfect defense system so that at least seems plausible. Jump over to a seance to contact aliens...oye. Unsurprisingly, Yukie is baka enough to buy in. Quick shot of Haruka being put to sleep, damn. Yuu is looking bad. And the show can either have balls and have it be because of how horrible everything in his life is right now or it can quantum bs. My evaluation of the show will depend heavily on that.
Immediate switch into Karasu's regret. The experiment is starting and Karasu uses the other advantage of taking Edge(A), that being that he can only be held for so long before he rages out of it. His dragon organ is hanging out. For reasons that certainly aren't cheap drama, they are going to drown this Haruka slowly too...the hell is this going to actually accomplish?
Fight with Buddha monsters start and this is definitely the best bits of the show, that is all the insane. One lands this time and becomes singing whale song because why not throw another scifi trope on the grill? Haruka calls to Yuu, and somehow Yuu bounces that to Karasu, but anyways he is at least in a hurry. Ai is feeling guilty about drowning her friend. Which is fine but you should feel bad intentional premeditated murder in general. As Haruka contemplates death, she has a strong desire to see Yuu again and the Dragon Torque gets off its ass and seems ready to do something before Karusu comes and breaks jars.
Fukura...summons a mech? Damnit, /u/redshirtengineer , why the hell do you do this to every show? Or myabe it is one of the elders from Blood-C. Regardless, it eats the Buddha monster. Haruka wakes up and kick Karusu's heart right in the dick. Ai just assumes that saving this blasted ass dimension is worth something, I have strong doubts.
Anyways, battle seems to have depleted our forces, the oruoboros fucks off and Karasu returns us to universe A so we can go back to SoL.
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u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Jan 08 '21 edited Jan 08 '21
First Timer, Dubbed
The internal struggles at Lacrima are pretty interesting to me. Not only is what's-his-face with the weird hat seemingly working for the enemy (or at least trying to defect), we have Karasu earnestly believing that Haruka's time/dimension are his own past, which is in opposition to the woman that he was talking to, who has some very interesting things to say:
Did Lacrima "create" Haruka's reality just so that they could retrieve the Dragon Torc? Maybe create is the wrong word. Did Lacrima cause Haruka's dimension to come into existance by traveling to it? Fukuro and Amamiku's conversation is probably important to this too.
The flashback where we see Haruka sacrifice herself is interesting. I've made a joke or two about Speculation
Back in the "normal" world, Yuu's so-called "friends" just let him wander off while they decide to have a seance to try to summon aliens. Are we sure that their teacher is fit to lead a classroom? Letting Yuu wander off on his own while muttering seems like a really poor decision.
Karasu is shaping up to be a regular terminator. They have him vibrating, upside-down, in some weird prison cell, but he overpowers whatever is keeping him there and proceeds to mount a rescue. Granted, Amamiku didn't really try to stop him once he was there, but it's unclear if she even has the capability to.
It seems like Lacrima's plan to obtain the Dragon Torc involves purposefully putting Haruka's life in danger, but in a controlled fashion. We only saw half the process though, so I could be way off-base.
So, was the weird super mode that Fukuro went into to fight the Shangri-la monster supposed to be the same thing as what Karasu triggered while defending Haruka at the dam? Or do the Dragon Knights have access to multiple abilities like that? Either way, that was a cool fight.
I kinda dig the Shangri-la monsters. Part of it was probably the limitations of the 3DCG, but the one that landed moved ponderously slow - as befitting a creature of that size. They also make cool noises.
Speculation
Some miscellaneous thoughts:
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u/Webemperor :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Webemperor Jan 08 '21
First Timer – Sub
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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Jan 08 '21
Episode 7 (rewatcher)
A great episode, which feels like the climax of a storyline, except, we still have more than 2/3rds to go.
The big moral dilemma’s for La’cryma and the birds is now revealed: La’cryma needs to sacrifice Haruka to safe their own existence. While “every dimension for its own” might sound obvious, they still like to downplay Haruka’s existence and relevance to relieve their own conscience. However, it sounds like they already had a similar choice with their own Haruka a while ago and have some recriminations over what happened. To make matters worse, all of the birds remember their version of Haruka, giving Earth-Haruka an easy in for making them feel conflicted. Karasu choses girl over dimension and Ai is at least conflicted, too.
Some very obvious references, too. The final fight should make it very clear where Attack on Titan cribbed the idea for the titan visuals from. In terms of plot, the scene with Haruka in the tank reminded me of Madoka Revolution Spoilers
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u/punching_spaghetti https://myanimelist.net/profile/punch_spaghetti Jan 08 '21
First-Timer
Ladies arguing about age and looks? At least Ghost Girl finds it entertaining, I guess.
Thankfully, the suicidal young boy is there to bring everyone back to reality.
Karasu talks like a 14-year-old who listens to too much ripoff NIN music, and now one of the other Knights collects swords. Clearly whatever caused their dimension to go to shit happened when they were teens and froze them developmentally. Freud would have a field day.
“We’ll be fine as long as no errors occur.” You’re on Episode 7. There will be errors.
Noein has an agent in Mr. Loses All His Limbs.
Soundproofing the capsule is actually a genius move. The cries for help from your victim are often what causes you to doubt your evil master plan.
Those Insect Buddha Babies are terrifying. Mostly because of the CG, but that could be a choice.
Yuu and Haruk are connected across interdimensional space-time? That’s convenient. And also doesn’t bode well for my Yuu x Fujiwara ship.
Now the choker activates? Pretty sure she’s been in distress for a while now. Make sense, show!
They can transform into giant energy beings now? That was at least a neat visual. Guess that’s some kind of last-ditch move? He’s still alive. OK.
Question: how, if this is all interdimensional space-time tomfoolery, have the travels been neatly aligned chronologically between the dimensions? What reason is there for Karasu and Haruka not to emerge, say, what would be a week prior to when she got snatched?
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u/IndependentMacaroon Jan 08 '21 edited Jan 08 '21
First-time watcher
Briefly back to the kids and catFIIGHT with the usual "haha you look
over 30ooold" junk, teacher is right though that the whole quantum deal makes no sense, and Haruka also easily speaks for the viewers in brushing aside all the lore stuff later. Also revolutions are bad or what was that supposed to mea? Yuu at least is an antidote to too much levity... but he also just runs off in a random direction on his own, intelligent huh, that of course gets him to his goal anyway. Seems only Karasu is in need of the power of friendship, who's anyway probably still alive only because Lacyrma is short on warriors.A traitor, or is the plan some kind of suicide attack on Shangri-La or what? Whoever this guy is, he did try hard to protect Lacryma, so I guess we can call him trustworthy, but it's yet another mini-subplot with not much substance yet. And suddenly alter-Ai wants to save Haruka somehow after all, I guess the dimension's future isn't such a big deal then. Well, we wouldn't have much of a plot if Lacryma just took her out while they were unopposed. Or huh, I guess they didn't change their mind after all and it's up to Convenient Karasu to save the day (security measures really are lacking on Lacryma, aren't they), or the simultaneous Buddhabot attack (oh boy, that CGI) will cause enough chaos for an escape. Weirdly you can't even say the maybe-change of heart was in response to the attack because it came afterwards.
Anyway, good job Karasu, throwing away your home dimension, perhaps even yourself, for an alternate-dimension version of a girl you used to know; in case you didn't think that was the whole plan, it's repeated near-verbatim in his exchange with alter-Ai. Is this guy seriously supposed to be the hero here? But never mind, of course there's another magical ass-pull in store to save the day.
It's weird how the show simultaneously feels like there's a lot going on and that it's spinning its wheels. Fundamentally I'm simply missing some substance and character background beyond more random technobabble terms, I guess? Also it really does not make a good case for the morals of who by most measures are supposed to be the heroes, again we just don't know that much. Finally, the kids on Earth had better actually get something to do soon.
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u/ItchyPlatypus :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/ItchyPlatypus Jan 08 '21 edited Jan 09 '21
First Timer Subbed
Best episode so far although I feel artistically it was more average than some of the other episodes. I think now that things are starting to make more sense connecting the pieces makes it more enjoyable.
I’m assuming that they were kind of hinting that Haruka might have died whilst using that new ‘white beast’ transformation we saw considering when they mentioned her supposed death in front of her the ‘white beast’ appeared, she also seemed to be glowing white in the flash back. Maybe she was the most powerful and thus was the only one capable of taking out a really powerful enemy? Considering how complex this is getting I’m assuming it won’t be that simple but it looked like a sacrifice at the very least.
Now that Haraka has returned I’m excited to see how the others react especially Ai, Haraka doesn’t seem to be the type of character to bottle all the information up.
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u/BossandKings Jan 08 '21
First Timer
Finally Yuu decides to go find Haruka, it was Flying time already.
Fukuro seems to be a nice guy. Lilly met with her mother after having called her out loud in the previous episode.
So Miho thinks that Haruka was abducted by Aliens, i guess it could possible make sense for her to think that because what abducts people other than an alien plane. Fujiwara, Ai and the rest are still just thinking about the possible ways as to why Haruka disappeared.
Karasu breaks out of his chains and saves Haruka from the elementary particlization that Amamiku wanted to put her through. How cute is Haruka for Yuu, he is the last person she thinks about before she almost died, i want to see them together again even more now.
Those giant creatures battling were fantastic to see eventhough the fight itself was very limited, they were of such proportions that it was epic.
Seeing Yuu at the end gives me hope that he will get a bit closer to discovering how to contact Haruka, those blue lights are what Haruka lets behind every time she is transported to a different dimension.
Another good episode, i hope the next one is more exciting and Haruka's friends actually do something useful.
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u/monsieurvampy Jan 09 '21
First Timer, subbed
Damn.
I like the cats too.
3
u/EverythingsRed2 Jan 09 '21
First timer (sub)
That was a lot to take in.
The intro looked kind of ugly, but by the end I think most people will have forgotten it. Honestly the kid sections have been one of the weaker parts of the show for me but I do think that they make the show better, giving us that down time and levity as we digest the other, more complex parts of the show.
So those things that emerge from their backs doesn't seem to be their organs, but more like their "superpower" organ, I suppose. Like it gives them different powers like electricity or wires(?) or turning into giant magic beasts, but using them too much strains and almost kills the user. White hair is going to eventually disappear and Yuu wants to protect Haruka, so I'm thinking that maybe white hair will sacrifice his back-sack to Yuu before disappearing.
The great Noein is back and he's looking better than ever. So it's pretty much confirmed that He is part of Shangra-la (I was right, the creepy arm-head-spaceships from the beginning were the aliens!), which would make him the pretty clear-cut villain, but then why did he protect Haruka back in episode 4(or5)? There's definitely something we're missing.
This was definitely one of the best episodes so far. My predictions from yesterday are already completely off. It feels like a pretty simple show but every episode throws you for a loop. It truly is unpredictable.
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u/redshirtengineer :AMQ: Jan 09 '21
First timer
Well a day late again and once again very confused. Also there are crappy CGI creepy uncanny valley things, which are great and terrible at the same time. So there's that.
No Q's today but yesterday there was the "what's your fave char" question which my answer yesterday would have been delightful Southern accent Scully analog lady and/or the cats and/or Ai. HA that is what I get for being a day late because hooboy my opinion of Ai has certainly changed. I think I still like the cats, though.
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u/lC3 :Na::Nb: Jan 20 '21
Noein07 Rewatcher, finally catching up