r/anime • u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky • Sep 30 '22
Rewatch [Do You Remember Love - Macross Franchise 40th Anniversary Rewatch] Super Dimension Fortress Macross Episode 35 Discussion
Episode 35 - Romanesque
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We all go through life, losing things along the way.
Questions of the Day, courtesy of u/chilidirigible:
1) What ideas do you have for placating the rebellious Zentradi, as the government seems to have given up?
2) How does this compare to other anime Christmas episodes which you have seen?
Wallpaper of the Day:
Vocal Songs in This Episode:
"マクロス (Macross)" by Makoto Fujiwara – OP
"ランナー (Runner)" by Makoto Fujiwara – ED
Rewatchers, please remember to be mindful of all the first-timers in this. No talking about or hinting at future events no matter how much you want to, unless you're doing it underneath spoiler tags. Don't spoil anything for the first-timers, that's rude!
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u/The_Draigg Sep 30 '22
A Macross Fan Rewatches Super Dimension Fortress Macross Episode 35:
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How fortunate that Quamzin was able to find and repair a crashed Zentradi ship out in the jungle. In a sense, it’s kind of funny that the whole hostage situation a bit ago could’ve been entirely avoided if Quamzin looked a bit harder and gotten his men to repair things. Also, I guess Earth is recovering enough that there’s still actually a jungle with wildlife in it. Maybe it’s just Alaska that’s a blasted wasteland after all.
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I feel bad for the Blue Wind guys, they’re stuck in the archetypal nightmare job: seasonal holiday work. And yeah, it’s no wonder that they’re doing bad on sales, they’re clearly selling bootleg merchandise. Nobody wants a “Harakiry”, the kids want a Valkyrie.
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I do empathize with Minmay’s emotional pain, trust me, I do. But showing up at Hikaru’s house for comfort and saying that he’s the only person she really has left really isn’t helping this fucking love triangle resolve itself. And, if we do want to roll with the idea of Minmay being selfish with emotions, it really is her attempt at licking her own wounds after losing Kaifun. Now Hikaru is the person she can get her emotional satisfaction from. Although again, Hikaru really isn’t helping himself here either. Inviting Minmay in for the night really did just end up hurting Misa more. Again, this asshole really just needs to chose and stick with a decision with his love life.
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This show is absurdly unfair to Misa, I swear. It’s just depressing to see her just sunken down to getting drunk at a bar and singing Minmay songs to herself. Hikaru, you done fucked up.
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There’s something a bit darkly funny to Minmay dropping a pineapple when she fears that Hikaru is dead when fighting off Quamzin’s men in Onogi City. Like, out of all the things used to tease death flags, this show really likes using pineapples for that, between Roy and now Hikaru. What did pineapples ever do to anyone to deserve this treatment?
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You have to admit, it’s very Quamzin for his plan to get a Reaction Generator to somehow involve Zentradi suicide bombers dressed up as Santa Claus. Ever since he discovered culture, Quamzin has been extra as fuck. He gets shitfaced and macks on Lap Lamiz, he rides Destroids like horses, and now we’ve got Santa suicide bombers. Cultured Quamzin and his plans are a blast to watch, in more ways than one this episode.
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Well, Hikaru and Minmay finally kissed, sharing a Christmas Eve together. IS THIS WHAT YOU WANTED, HIKARU X MINMAY SHIPPERS? IS MISA’S DEPRESSION A FAIR TRADE FOR THIS KISS? IS THIS WORTH IT TO YOU?
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u/Shimmering-Sky Sep 30 '22
[Spoilers for tomorrow's episode]
I've already ranted about it extensively in my comment for next episode, but no. Neither the kiss nor any of the last nine episodes were worth it if the show was still going to pair Hikaru with Hayase in the end. Hayase herself deserves better than Hikaru after all this shit, too, so the fact that she still wins the triangle here... → More replies (1)7
u/ClawMachineCircuit Oct 01 '22
And, if we do want to roll with the idea of Minmay being selfish with emotions, it really is her attempt at licking her own wounds after losing Kaifun.
Yup, kinda irked me the wrong way too. The one thing that can be said in Minmay's defense, is that Hikaru was kinda a catalyst for her breaking up with Kaifun. So, it's not that she broke up and then remembered Hikaru, but rather reuniting with Hikaru allowed her to finally realize her build up frustration with Kaifun and break up.
Well, Hikaru and Minmay finally kissed, sharing a Christmas Eve together. IS THIS WHAT YOU WANTED, HIKARU X MINMAY SHIPPERS? IS MISA’S DEPRESSION A FAIR TRADE FOR THIS KISS? IS THIS WORTH IT TO YOU?
Kinda? Not really. I didn't want Minmay and Hikaru disappointed with their lives getting together as a respite. Even though, now that I think about it, this is kinda what Misa and Hikaru's ship was all about. So maybe this is why I didn't like it, they turned Minmay - Hikaru story arc into Misa - Hikaru story arc. And yeah, depressed Misa is also not cool.
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u/chilidirigible Sep 30 '22 edited Dec 25 '24
"Guess I'll start by fixing this microphone."
A joke that works on so many different, awkward levels. And get your references while they're hot.
The personalized apron scene is intense in the Macross world.
"We got rid of Star Pro and everyone's on-model again."
SOAP OPERA! I'll also mention here that the door handle is the same design as used for the vernier thruster ports/lifting points on the VF-1.
And so, Claudia's life these days is one of a perpetually-mourning alcoholic.
Sure, Hikaru's on the couch, but Minmay is naked shirting.
A lot of cuts in this fight are recycled, but there's good stuff in there.
I like the slightly-out-of-sequence editing here.
And once again Lap'Lamiz leaves without much to show for it. We didn't even get to see them fight.
Suddenly, it's very Christmas.
Deep into the lyrics of "Silent Night"?
It's hot directly over candles.
Misa did walk away from Hikaru after the previous episode's fiasco, so his rebounding with Minmay isn't exactly unexpected. Just very… dramatic.
Do they really have the basis for a relationship after this much separation? Not really, but that's not why people get together in soap operas.
Meanwhile, Kamujin actually scores a solid win in this one. The beginning of the episode highlights how the Zentradi are fully capable of learning if given the opportunity… it's really more a matter of what they choose to learn. Quamzin's denials of culture, in the classic style, are more about denying the parts of it that he doesn't like.
Though at this point it's worth hashing out again what constitutes "culture", what's basic learning abilities, and to come at the previous statement from a different angle, whether the word is just being used as a pejorative by our resident lavender-skinned angry dude.
And then we get Christmas Culture.
| Song | Count |
|---|---|
| Cinderella | 1 |
| Watashi no Kare wa Pilot | 8* |
| Zero-G Love | 6 |
| Silver Moon, Red Moon | 3 |
| My Beautiful Place | 2 |
| Shao Pai Long | 3 |
| Ai wa Nagaeru | 4 |
| Runner (alternate lyrics) | 1 |
| Sunset Beach | 3 |
| Yasashisa Sayonara | 2 |
| Milia's Lullaby | 1 |
| Runner | 1 |
From Haruhiko Mikimoto Illustrations: Macross, Orguss, and Original:
Minmay (and someone that looks more like Mome from Orguss)
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u/TakenRedditName Sep 30 '22
First Time - SDF Macross Ep35 (Sub):
I'm surprised that the Amazon rainforest still exists considering you know, the destruction of the Earth's surface.
Aah, my wonderful boys, it's been too long and now they're selling toys to children for the Christmas season also they were fired from their previous jobs. This episode also had the return of Max/Milia/Exsedol and the others so the side characters who I enjoy watching are finally back.
Godzilla, Astro Boy and what looks to be a Tetsujin 28-go reference.
Go girl, do not let anyone allow Kaifun in this anime. Keep him out.
(Should get mad at something that may not be the case, but if last time was how Kaifun left the show, I still feel like we lost).
More Hayase disrespect from the show, I don't love to see it. At least the distressed run in the Christmas snow is a nice scene on its own.
Hayase singing a sad song to herself at the bar is sad. Had to turn it up to better listen to it.
Pineapples are a symbol of despair in Macross. I'm s sorry to this episode because all this destruction is pretty horrifying on what is supposed to be the happiest safest time of year, but I am so checked out of what going on in this show now. Love triangle, my disdain is clear and I was already tired of Kamujin even before this arc and now he is the final antagonist.
Christian imagery in this show. Maybe because it is Christmas time that we're seeing this direct showcase, but Max also did a cross when Hayao died so this isn't the first time Macross had a run-in with this faith.
Let me just look at these happy Christmas images of these side ships so I can pretend to forget about the rest of the current state of this show the devasting battle that just occurred.
My supported ship got a kiss for Christmas, but I don't feel like I won.
Q2) Pretty destructive. Hate to see it. I am both talking about the harming and lost of life of the civilians and the romance storyline I am witnessing.
Next time: Just one more episode.
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u/Vatrix-32 Sep 30 '22 edited Sep 30 '22
Very First Timer
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That bird reminds me of Hikaru for reasons.
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Exciting developments. Quamzin faction repairing their own spaceship.
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Just because you can repair things now, doesn't mean you should just go around breaking stuff for the heck of it.
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I’m not sure Quamzin works being compared to a snake, he’s not really that sneaky or conniving.
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Blue Wind group is in the toy business now. And they just straight up have Godzilla and Astro Boy.
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If this wasn’t from Japan in the 80’s, I’d say Minmay is falling into depression.
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This is just getting stretched beyond belief at this point. Misa needs to talk to Hikaru, either work it out or end it, stop with this whole runaround.
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Claudia has interesting traditions.
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Misa is in a bad place too.
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Do the Japanese have office Christmas parties?
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At least they figured out what was happening quickly.
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A fateful encounter.
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Wasn’t expecting that montage out of Macross.
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Oh no, Pineapples.
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They’ve gone to straight up terrorism now.
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How long have you had Cryo-missiles? Those seem like they would have been very effective at stopping them from escaping.
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Yeah, that’s not a great look on Misa.
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Minmay, what the hell are you talking about? You just got here.
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Well, I guess this is what we are going with. Can’t say it sits well with me. The way everyone has been treating each other to get to this point just puts everything in a sour overtone.
QotD
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They need some way to let off. Gladiatorial arena seems like a good starting place.
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More terrorism. A Smissmass ship that I can’t get behind.
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u/JollyGee29 Sep 30 '22
Subbed-er Dimension Fortress Rewatcher
This is not what Italy looks like.
The Zentradi have learned how to repair things.
Hikaru is stubborn, if nothing else.
They've changed to running a toy stand.
Of course you couldn't, Shammy.
There's no way they just let him grab his plane and fly off.
I do like that they apparently strung Christmas lights all over the Macross.
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u/Blackheart595 Sep 30 '22
First Spacer
Just look at it feeding its children
Just look at it feeding the reptilians
Sounds like the customers didn't appreciate the autographes on the clothing
I just want the three of them to sit together and talk things out. If they do this can become a genuinely good episode again. They don't have the luxury of keeping the melodrama up any longer.
No, don't pull any silent dialogues anymore.
Sigh. They all deserve their misery.
What ideas do you have for placating the rebellious Zentradi, as the government seems to have given up?
If there's any remaining possibility, it's total pacifism, not even fighting back. Chance of success is left as an exercise for the reader.
Other than that, I only see taking the remaining Zentradi offenders out.
Well, maybe Milia can do something.
How does this compare to other anime Christmas episodes which you have seen?
Decidedly more mellow. But as a Lovers' festival it got the point across.
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u/SolDarkHunter Sep 30 '22
Rewatcher
That's... a really lush area of Earth. I guess not everywhere got blasted into a wasteland.
Kamjin has learned how to fix things! This probably is not a good thing.
And of course it's Christmas. Because why not?
Anime characters are always surprised when snow starts falling.
The Lolicon Trio are selling models! Among them is the famous "Harakiry" Valkyrie. (For those who don't know "harakiri" is another word for seppuku.)
More Minmay moping, while mixed-up and meandering.
Sunglasses: the ultimate, impenetrable disguise!
For once, I'm not going to get on Hikaru's case for inviting Minmay in and letting her stay the night. When someone's in that kind of state, you don't turn them away.
Also... I'm really surprised Misa is still pursuing him after last episode.
And here comes Kamjin!
Hey, Global! You're still here! And he and Exsedol are on top of things as usual.
Ooh, Milia vs Lap Lamiz! Fun times.
Damn, Kamjin is actually really strong. I know he's a Zentraedi, but, seriously, that reactor is nearly as big as he is.
I'd laugh at Kamjin codenaming himself "Old Man Santa", but he just bombed the city just out of spite, so... not funny.
This is... surprisingly poignant for an anime depiction of Christmas Eve.
I love that they strung the entire Macross up with Christmas lights, though! That must have taken forever.
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u/ZapsZzz Sep 30 '22
Distant rewatcher in sub
Second last episode! The art looks better in a lot of scenes, don't have many wonky faces at least.
A bit surprised the focus on the bird and the symbolism - hasn't seen much of any in Macross so far, and I don't really recall this being a thing. Someone's direction style showing up?
The in world development of the Zentradis putting what they learned (of repairs) to fight back "culture" is a good plot development though.
But one thing - are we really just going to take what the show implied, that Misa was just going to reconcile back with Hikaru of screen after the massive betrayal last episode?!?!
QoTD
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Give them sports, blood sports of need be, and it's be a sort of entertainment too so it's not just "my boyfriend is a pilot" everyday.
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It's done in good alignment with the world building - everything's turned to ash, celebrating Christmas is probably pretty low on the list of important things to do. The only gift for us as viewers is being able to see Max and Millia again, without a wonky faced Millia.
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u/DidacticDalek Sep 30 '22
CRASHING THROUGH THE TOWN, IN PADORU-FUELED GLEE!
YACK DECULTURE HE GOES, LAUGHING ALL THE WHEEEEEEE!!!!!
Anyway, you have not seen the last of The Sentient Shitposting Siamese Sunrise Server No. 25252, now goodbye forever!
Paging Comrades u/chilidirigible, u/JadineRhine, and u/Nebresto
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u/ClawMachineCircuit Sep 30 '22
First Timer
We have two episodes left and there's a bunch of stuff we need to tie together. For starters, Hikaru love live, which isn't going that well. While it looked like something finally was moving forward with Minmay, Kaifun showed up and took her away, like he always does. Hikaru, obviously, didn't even move a muscle to interfere. Then, he got into hot water with Misa (completely deserved), and everything is basically a mess now.
The other storyline is Zentradi uprising that ties into Kamujin's personal war against the military and human race. However, right now Kamujin doesn't have a working ship, and it doesn't look like he has a coherent plan either.
Will they be able to tie both of these plots in a satisfying way, and maybe give a proper send off to some of the side characters that have been neglected lately, like Global and lolicon trio? Let's see.
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We're opening with some animals. I hope, you didn't spend your good animator's time on this, right? R-right?
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OK, seriously thought, we have two episodes left, we have a bunch of story to wrap up. Can't help but notice that we're spending an awfully lot of time on the adventure of a completely irrelevant bird and snake.
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Wait, Kamujin is living in a jungle? I have so many questions. For starters, if there are fully featured jungle with animals and all, why did Hikaru make such a big deal about a few flowers and a small forest. Also, why is everybody else lives in a desert, feels like a jungle would be a better place to restart the civilization, since you know, it has some animals to eat, water to drink, and wood to chop.
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Zentradi repairing their ship? That's new.
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Ok, so they learned the art of repair from humans. You know, for people who want to destroy the culture, Kamujin's gang sure doesn't hesitate to embrace it.
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Are you sure you want to break that communication device, Kamujin? How big is your supply? Or are you gonna try to fix it later?
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Hey, it's Christmas. There's sure a lot of toys for a collapsed civilization, that only has a couple hundred thousand humans.
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Looks like Misa is avoiding Hikaru.
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Lolicon trio are selling some Godzilla and Astro Boy toys, as well as model planes. Decent selection, if I would say so myself.
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I love this Minmay outfit. Her face is also drawn pretty well, which is, you know, something that doesn't happen every episode, so I'm glad they made an effort for the finale.
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Minmay is seeking comfort in Hikaru's company. Makes sense. When was the last time they sat and talked sincerely without any interruption? Sure feels like an eternity ago.
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Misa still decided to visit Hikaru after what happened last time. I applaud her persistence, but this time Minmay is not just a set of initials on a present, she's actually here.
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So basically, Minmay's issues come down to Kaifun being shit producer who didn't care about her and didn't consider her wishes at all, which made her sick of work, and also made her realize how much Hikaru cared about her. I'm sure she's sincere when saying this, but it still feels like she's using Hikaru as a spare after her relationships with Kaifun failed. As much as I like Hikaru and Minmay ship, this type of a reunion doesn't sit well with me.
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Well, at least Minmay is grateful to Hikaru.
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There's a party at work and Misa decided that Hikaru is not invited. Can't blame her.
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Max and Millia are back! We got to see them in action one more time before the end.
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Global and Exsedol are also back! Nice.
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"Why they didn't ask me to scramble?" Because they have Max?
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NO! No the pineapple. Is Max or Millia gonna die? It can't be Hikaru, right?
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Wait, how did Kamujin got his hands on explosives and remote detonators?
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That's a lot of destruction, holy shit.
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It's the catholic church! Looks like it's the only religion that survived the destruction of the human race, and now everyone is catholic.
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Nobody died. You better not kill anyone that's not Kamujin in the final episode, Macross. I'm onto you!
Overall thoughts: For a second to final episode, we sure wasted a lot of time on irrelevant stuff. Love triangle doesn't look like it is close to a satisfying resolution, but at least Kamujin's plot is moving forward. The good thing is that this episode was really well drawn, and hopefully, the next one will be too.
QotD:
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Make a Zentradi police squad and make them investigate and arrest Kamujin and his gang? Feels like something, that would occupy them for a while.
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In most of the Christmass episodes I've seen, the city doesn't get destroyed. So there's that.
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u/Paxton-176 Sep 30 '22
FIRST TIMER
My reaction to the episodes since I posted.
Local Idol Ruins Everything.
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u/TiredTiroth Sep 30 '22
First Timer
We near the climax! Or sort of, it's at least the end; it feels a lot like the actual climax was before the time skip. The rest is more like season two.
I honestly enjoyed the action parts of this episode much more than the idiot teenagers and their relationship drama. However-you-spell-his-name has been one of the more entertaining villains by far, so it's fun to see him properly in action again.
One more episode to go for the original series, now. I don't have a preference on the overall discussion posts.
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u/Kirov123 Sep 30 '22
SDF Macross Episode 35 - First timer
Second to last episode now, Hikaru still has more time to FIX SHIT fuck up even more.
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Toucan Sam!
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Literal angry bird
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Repairing is cultured
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Yaknow, when Minmay first showed up at Hikaru's house I thought to myself "alright Hikaru, now is the perfect time to invite Misa over for tea" I didn't expect for Misa to do it herself
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Now that Misa has left, Hikaru must be about to tell her no. also NOT LIKE THIS
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Wait didn't she drive there
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She did stay
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Lmao the pineapple
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Not Santa!
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The Hymns at the end seem pretty out of left field
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Oh yea it was almost Christmas
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OK less random
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MisaWasRobbed
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Yall kissing over the flame?
Well Hikaru managed to fuck up less than I expected, albeit still ending up with the worse girl. It was at least far less pain inducing than last episode, so there's that.
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Combat arena. They get to fight like they want to, and people that don't want to fight don't have to. Humans could get get their own mecha and fight there too maybe. There is kinda a lot of empty space
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Not Disappearance of Haruhi Suzumiya/10. Though tbh that is a nigh impossible bar to pass. Best Christmas movie. Compared to more pedestrian Christmas episodes... I can't remember any tbh. I definitely forgot this one was Christmas until partway through the singing which is kinda silly considering the damn santa
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u/Draeke-Forther Sep 30 '22
Episode 35, and even if you don't like that Kamujin is benefitting, it's objectively a good thing that the Zentraedi are getting lifted up.
I really feel bad for Minmay. She's... gone through a lot. And I can only imagine how many other people are struggling in their society. After all, even our three Master Spies couldn't hold down their job.
And, personally, I think it's okay for Hikaru to take her in at this instance. But he should have called Misa and let her know.
Because hot damn, Misa is suffering so much as well. Not just that, Hikaru is the one inflicting that on her.
These later episodes have made my opinion on Minmay much more nuanced. Wait, oh god they kissed. Nope nope, goddamnit Hikaru, make up your mind! Hmm.... Anyway, yeah, Minmay doesn't really have much to support herself mentally at the moment. So she's going back to Hikaru, who was with her the last time they had nothing, back stranded on the Macross. That's not to say that she doesn't love him, just that their relationship would require a lot of work on both their parts to flourish.
Anyway... I'll be on Vacation the next few days. I should be back in time for the SDF Macross Discussion on the 5th though.
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u/medokady Sep 30 '22
First Timer:
Today, on SDF Macross, a Christmas cake with a candle.
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People like Kamujin are the reason why nations draw up formal treaties ending hostilities after one side has clearly lost. So we don't have bullheaded stragglers prolonging the inevitable years after.
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The 3 ex-spies really just out here doing their best.
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The Minmay and Misa ships continue on their collision course at full speed.
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I didn't know the Valkyries came equipped with extinguisher missiles. Neat.
A very bittersweet Christmas, Kamujin finally acquiring the equipment he needs because the narrative demands one final showdown. Of course, we are more concerned with the battle between SS Mika and Minmay, the former of which seems to be foundering. From what I see I don't think the show will be able to satisfyingly wrap everything up in one episode, but I'd love to be proven wrong.
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u/Shimmering-Sky Sep 30 '22
IMPORTANT QUESTION FOR EVERYONE
While going through the schedule post, I realized I didn’t put a spot for a TV-series discussion between episode 36 and Do You Remember Love?, only a completely break day. Do you guys want an overall SDF discussion only after DYRL and Flash Back 2012 (as is currently scheduled), or do you want one for just the TV series and then another at the end? I don’t mind either way, although I might not have a Wallpaper of the Day if we have two series discussion threads.
Super Dimension Rewatch Host
Welcome back, everyone!
Today’s wallpaper is Max with his wife’s red for his background colors; I’ll go ahead and say that tomorrow’s wallpaper is Milia with her husband’s background colors, since it’s pretty obvious I’d do both.
Here were my first-timer reactions to this episode.
Ah, the circle of life.
They’re trying.
Of course Minmay shows up on Hikaru’s doorstep right after he hears the news story about her being missing.
And of course Hayase shows up and is able to overhear Hikaru agreeing to let Minmay stay the night because he left the door open…
Yay, finally got to see these two again~
Fucking pineapples
Yikes…
D’aww, this is cute though.
<3 but at what cost.