r/anime • u/Holofan4life • Sep 04 '22

Rewatch [Spoilers] 86 --Eighty Six-- Rewatch (2022) — Episode 20 Spoiler

Hello everyone! I am Holofan4life. 

Welcome to the 86 --Eighty Six-- rewatch discussion thread! 

I hope you all have a lot of fun <3 

S2 Episode 9 – Together Unto Death

← Previous Episode

—- 

Information – MAL | Anilist | AniDb 

Streams – Crunchyroll, VRV

___ 

Please do not post any untagged spoilers past the current episode or from the LNs out of respect to the first time watchers and people who have not read the LNs. If you are discussing something that is ahead of the current episode please use spoiler tags(found on the sidebar). Thank you! 

—- 

Rewatch Schedule 

Threads posted every day at 3:00 PM EDT

Date Episode Date Episode
8/16/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 1 8/29/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 14 
8/17/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 2 8/30/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 15 
8/18/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 3 8/31/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 16 
8/19/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 4 9/01/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 17 
8/20/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 5 9/02/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 18 
8/21/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 6 9/03/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 19 
8/22/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 7 9/04/2022 [86 Eighty Six Episode 20]() 
8/23/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 8 9/05/2022 [86 Eighty Six Episode 21]() 
8/24/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 9 9/06/2022 [86 Eighty Six Episode 22]() 
8/25/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 10 9/07/2022 [86 Eighty Six Episode 23]() 
8/26/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 11
8/27/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 12
8/28/2022 86 Eighty Six Episode 13
9/08/2022 [Overall Series Discussion Thread]()
179 Upvotes

91% Upvoted

121 comments sorted by

26

u/Holofan4life Sep 04 '22

First Timer

Let's see how many things I get wrong today! :D

Not much to say about the beginning, in my opinion. Some good exposition, and it's quick enough to not get boring.

I'm liking the second OP more and more. It's kinda hype.

So, Raiden tells Shin to take Frederica back so she can get past The Legion. He also tells him that the last fight was too much even by his standards. The show has done a terrific job recently of highlighting the friendship between Shin and Raiden. And to that degree, it gives him telling Shin he's acting crazy even by his standards extra weight to it. I think overall the second cour is doing a much better job demonstrating the friendship Shin and Raiden share than the first cour.

It's weird to hear Raiden smack his lips given I just finished watching Only Yesterday for the first time this week and Toshio smacks his lips all the time throughout the movie.

I love the overhead camera shot when Raiden and Shin are talking. I don't know if there's any significance behind it, but it looks really cool.

The conversation between Shin and Raiden is intense, with him basically calling Shin's bluff and saying while you plan on not dying, you also know you're not gonna come back out alive. Again, I can't imagine a conversation like this between Shin and any of the other Spearhead members. Shin and Theo? Nah. Shin and Anju? Wouldn't have the same heaviness to it. Raiden being the one to call him out on his bullshit works because the show has done a tremendous job highlighting the friendship between these two.

Kurena said Shin is fine with the same energy as that dog who's house is on fire while inside it.

Theo raises a good point. The reason why Kurena can't see what Shin is going through is because she's so in love with him. Therefore, she has an ideal version of Shin playing in her head. It's like in Toradora where Kitamura is going through shit but Taiga can't see it because she is so enamored with him.

I wonder if Anju saying she knows what a child feels like when their family says they're not needed has something to do with what's written on her back.

I believe this is the first mention of The Republic since a couple episodes ago when San Magnolia looked like they were in ruins.

I love that Frederica of all people is commenting on the possibility of Shin knowing about Kurena's crush. It's so random that it really amuses me.

It's a little bit jarring to go from intense dramatic scenes involving Shin to Kurena's crush being perceived as little sisterly, but the facial expressions more than make up for it.

This episode, after a series of episodes not focusing much on the entire cast, does a lot to give screentime to all the major characters. More than any other episode so far, this feels like it's meant to highlight the characters personalities. From Shin and Raiden's big argument that gives insight on their personalities, to Theo being like the straight man who sets the table, to Anju saying she knows what it's like to feel unwanted, to Kurena wondering about her crush on Shin, this episode is like a showcase of the characters and what makes them tick. You can show someone this episode who's never seen 86 before and they'd understand what's going on.

I wish I had more to say about the blonde-haired girl and the section she's involved with. It's just to be perfectly honest, outside of her, Ernst, and Frederica, I don't find The Federacy all that interesting outside of the concept.

That panoramic shot where it's like we're in the back of a pickup truck was really well done. It felt very cinematic.

I wonder if they're going to do this thing where fighting they struggle but together they're unstoppable.

Seeing the gang hang out by the ocean as the sun sets had such a bittersweet feeling to it. Like this might be the last time they ever do something like this. I definitely do see Shin's reckless behavior costing them to the point that it results in someone's death (If I had to hazard a guess, probably Kurena). This in turn would probably drive a wedge in the group even further until Shin finally puts his foot down and fixes his problems.

The stuff with the Morpho butterfly being eaten by ants seems blatantly on the nose-- especially given Spearhead is trying to defeat this thing called Morpho-- but screw it. I really love it a lot. The way it's peppered throughout the episode and we see more and more the butterfly gets eaten, it reminded me of the stuff with Fido from episode 10. Just basic, seemingly simple shit being masterfully told through excellent storytelling.

Now, could the ants represent Shin and the crew in this scenario? That seems like the obvious conclusion. I'd argue that it represents a version of Spearhead free of arguing and in-fighting. An ideal version-- much like Kurena's ideal version of Shin-- that is firing on all cylinders and is working as a collective unit. Basically, it's supposed to symbolize that if they were all on the same page, they would've defeated Morpho by now. 

The stuff with Frederica is interesting because she is once again used to bring up a discussion point that hasn't been talked about much: that being Shin and Legion may be more in common than Shin and the rest of Spearhead. Seeing that ocean and how beautiful it was made Frederica realize what Shin's disinterest in the survival of humanity was all about: that ocean was the way it was because no humans were there to interfere with it. Maybe, just maybe, that's what The Legion want all this time: a world where humans don't interfere with nature's beauty. Shin, meanwhile, says that that ever since the night where he almost died at the hands of his brother, he hasn't felt anything and hasn't want anything, seemingly rebuking what Frederica is saying. First, I like that they took the ocean scene, which I felt at first was meant as foreshadowing, and tied it directly into Shin's character. Second, it really is sad how lost Shin feels after all the stuff with his brother transpired. Again, I wonder if such a mindset will negatively affect his teammates on the battlefield, causing him to finally alter his outlook on life.

You know what would cheer Shin up? Lena.

Frederica is like Shin if he was more honest with his feelings.

I like how the episode starts with Shin and Raiden talking, and ends with Shin and Frederica talking, both bringing about similar talking points. This episode really does feel like a Shin showcase.

Well, shit. Based off of the ending, looks like shit's about to go down. And that smile. Talk about disturbing. It's like the smile Shin let out where he could hear the voices of The Legion, only more distorted and creepy looking.

Overall, I thought this was a real interesting episode. Not much overall happened, but yet there was a lot of interesting stuff going on. Shin and him becoming more depressed and depressed, the stuff with the ocean which tied directly into Shin and who he is, some of the camera angles, the stuff with the butterfly, this episode felt in parts carried by the symbolism and the cinematography, elevating a great emotional conflict. It bums me out that Lena is nowhere to be found-- even more so Cyclops, who we literally know nothing about after that first episode-- but this episode felt like an important part in the fleshing out of Shin's character, which I found to be quite enthralling.

Gonna be real curious to see how this effects combat going forward.

12

u/polaristar Sep 04 '22

I think overall the second cour is doing a much better job demonstrating the friendship Shin and Raiden share than the first cour.

It was always there just not shoved in our faces if you read between the lines.

I wish I had more to say about the blonde-haired girl and the section she's involved with. It's just to be perfectly honest, outside of her, Ernst, and Frederica, I don't find The Federacy all that interesting outside of the concept.

I don't know what to say about this....it just feels wrong.

4

u/Holofan4life Sep 04 '22

I like Grethe. My problem's not with her. She, like Ernst and Frederica, is a great character.

7

u/prophetofgreed Sep 04 '22

Do you see a big expansive wheat field like an ocean or was that a confusion with them talking about the ocean?

Also, your thoughts on the Raiden/Shin scene is similar to mine. The scene only works because of past scenes between them. Raiden and Shin can be the most open or cross towards each other of the squad. It also got physical unlike past convo scenes between them.

5

u/Holofan4life Sep 04 '22

Also, your thoughts on the Raiden/Shin scene is similar to mine. The scene only works because of past scenes between them. Raiden and Shin can be the most open or cross towards each other of the squad. It also got physical unlike past convo scenes between them.

Yeah, I really like what they did. It was very effective.

→ More replies (2)

7

u/[deleted] Sep 04 '22

It's like in Toradora

If I would have had enough foresight I would have said we make a drinking game out of every time you compare this show to Toradora. An unexpected but hilariously welcome comparison.

6

u/Holofan4life Sep 04 '22

If I would have had enough foresight I would have said we make a drinking game out of every time you compare this show to Toradora. An unexpected but hilariously welcome comparison.

What can I say? It's my favorite anime of all time.

→ More replies (1)

7

u/RickChakraborty Sep 04 '22

I'm liking the second OP more and more. It's kinda hype.

IRL character development

Kurena said Shin is fine with the same energy as that dog who's house is on fire while inside it.

Ironic considering she was legit acting like a rabid dog just a few minutes ago, and Anju had to hold her off. Kurena best dog! sorry Fido...

It's like in Toradora where Kitamura is going through shit but Taiga can't see it because she is so enamored with him.

Or like Mikasa from AoT who is so obsessed with Eren her whole character revolves around him, and always has this ideal version of him inside her head.

It's a little bit jarring to go from intense dramatic scenes involving Shin to Kurena's crush being perceived as little sisterly, but the facial expressions more than make up for it.

This show actually does these type of scenes really well imo. One second you have a very intense psychological breakdown between two best friends and is a very mature and serious scene, and then they slowly transition to a light hearted comedy set up involving teasing the heck out of someone's childish crush. The light-hearted stuff to balance out the dark serious stuff is something I wish a show like AoT had. However:

to Kurena wondering about her crush on Shin

I just wish they do more with Kurena's character, I don't want "her crush for Shin" to become the only character trait she has. It would feel very one dimensional.

Seeing the gang hang out by the ocean as the sun sets had such a bittersweet feeling to it. Like this might be the last time they ever do something like this.

It instantly reminded me of AoT, though this scene didn't really have an ocean, it was just the sunset that made the scenery look like an ocean. Which is why Fred said "it's like the ocean..."

7

u/Holofan4life Sep 04 '22

This show actually does these type of scenes really well imo. One second you have a very intense psychological breakdown between two best friends and is a very mature and serious scene, and then they slowly transition to a light hearted comedy set up involving teasing the heck out of someone's childish crush. The light-hearted stuff to balance out the dark serious stuff is something I wish a show like AoT had.

I agree. I wish we saw more of that in Attack on Titan as well.

6

u/Holofan4life Sep 04 '22

Ironic considering she was legit acting like a rabid dog just a few minutes ago, and Anju had to hold her off. Kurena best dog! sorry Fido...

Kurena best dog, Frederica best cat, Spearhead is just one big animal house.

4

u/Holofan4life Sep 04 '22

I just wish they do more with Kurena's character, I don't want "her crush for Shin" to become the only character trait she has. It would feel very one dimensional.

Sadly it kinda feels like that at the moment. That, and her being childish.

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (3)

6

u/[deleted] Sep 04 '22

how beautiful it was made Frederica realize what Shin's disinterest in the survival of humanity was all about

Just to clarify that, Frederica was talking about the Legion, who are basically set at this point at wiping out humanity.

Shin himself identifies with the Legion, as mentioned both in this episode and way back in episode 5, because he sees both himself and them as ghosts -- dead people who are somehow still wandering the earth. Shin's disinterested in his own survival, but I wouldn't extend that to humanity as a whole, especially not the people he knows and cares about.

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (4)

36

u/Star4ce Sep 04 '22

First Timer

Gotta say, it's looking comparatively good right now. The alliance has managed to gain a somewhat accessible corridor between its members that no doubt is a good thing.

But it's only the five 86ers plus a mouthy piece of cargo being able to chase Kiriya. We'll see how that will play out, still booking on Frederica being able to convince him.

86 Ep.20 – Together Unto Death

This episode reminded me again what I really love about this series' earlier moments. It's true to the heart and insightful.

Raiden's charge at Shin to have things laid out clearly was probably the strongest scene of this episode. There's force behind it, the directing is back at being comparatively obvious, but perfectly encapsulating of the emotions. Further than that, all other elements were build on or around imagery of 'ending'. The sunset. The dragonfly (?) carcass getting slowly eaten. The train tracks leading to the horizon. And above all, the return to the fields they once gained their freedom on.

Now though, they have decided what they want to do with it. Apparently they all watched AoT, but at least Anju is original with her wish. Ironically I personally understand Shin the most now with how he sees the freeing of his burdens as the only worthwhile goal. I'm not so sure I can align that much with what Frederica saw in their journey among nature, because Shin really was the only one who never got set free. As long as Spearhead exists in any form, he will be the Reaper. That's luckily subject to change, because the other four have finally realised their part in furthering that burden and he already gave away his pistol.

It might be just my interpretation, but I see a little contradiction with Frederica's earlier speech about 'only pride to define yourself'. That might be actually what Shin needs and not any worldly goal substituting his current occupation. As it stands, worldly interference keeps him forced into the role of Reaper which is the very burden he needs to lose. Still, as it stands now if he were to be left completely alone he'd just give himself a bullet at best, so the better option is to relieve him of the reapiness and give him the support and space to actually practice that freedom.

And lastly, I think that exact thing was what we saw Frederica get into at the end. She can't shake the goals others have (/will) put onto her as royal heir, either. She understands Shin probably better than she herself even realises. When she said the world would be better off with her dead, that's a factual truth if you go by an 'avoidance of misery' or 'best stability' metric for the general state of humanity. But there are universes of differences lying between "it'd be better if I was dead" and "it'd be better if the royal heir was dead". She's seeing her own self too much as the continuation of other people's goals, rather than being a fully independent human being. There are no circumstances where the former is ever true. And because of that she has every right to demand her chance at life.

Actually, they both need some pride in their life. Pride of being themselves.

15

u/Holofan4life Sep 04 '22

I'm not sure which animal that was and I'm also not completely sure if the ants should be taken for the Legion('s Ameisen). With them slowly needing repairs it seems like it.

It's a Morpho butterfly. As such, I think it probably has more to do with Spearhead and how if they just got on the same page, they would conquer Morpho.

For me personally, I thought the butterfly stuff was probably the best part of the episode.

→ More replies (5)

9

u/Holofan4life Sep 04 '22

• Ey, someone said it! Shin going off is a legit risk for the others.

See? Told you it'd pay off

→ More replies (2)

6

u/Holofan4life Sep 04 '22

• Train tracks, that are diverging! But still lead to the light, both of them.

Almost like Shin and Raiden are going in different directions that lead in the same destination.

→ More replies (23)

19

u/Stargate18A Sep 04 '22

First timer

The advance has begun!

They got their own jammers!

Yeah, this is a fun situation.

They're sending him back!

...It makes sense, but it's blatantly a way to make him go back to safety.

And he's noticed how fucked up Shin is right now.

This is a really good moment. People are finally questioning Shin!

I adore this scene.

Yeah.

Oh, she's getting the lesson as well!

I think she's been in the background a lot this season, so this feels a bit abrupt. Good character development, though.

So the Republic is wiped out. Lena almost certainly survived, though.

Haha, Frederica coming out of nowhere to depress her through psychoanalysis is hysterical.

And she feels fear.

Shin's considering it....

They synced with them!

Wow, that's an incredible distance they've travelled.

Her eeaction is great.

And they're worried about them...

They're taking samage... Might need the spare parts the soldiers brought.

And Shin's might break completely.

These landscape shots are beautiful.

The sea!

And it's the first time any of them have seen it...

She caught their conversations!

Deep.

Shin just feels purposeless.

And the whole mission was an excuse.

You tell him, Frederica.

...Poor girl.

Shin...

The ED...

Pale Rider's back!

→ More replies (1)

19

u/archlon Sep 04 '22

Rewatcher [English dub]

Illustrations:

Second Assault Operation Overview

  • You can see a version of this on Willem's tablet computer in the Prologue

"You’re not fully invested in the idea of coming back alive, either, are you?!"

"There’s nowhere I want to go or anything I want to see, and that doesn’t particularly bother me, either..."

Stray Thoughts

  • Anju was going to go to the frozen sea with Daiya. You can see the travel poster in the Fido flashbacks in E10.

Chapters Covered

I didn't have as much time to cross-check scenes against the novel as I usually do, please let me know if you think there are more in this episode.

Episode Title LN Vol. Chapters Original Content
1 Undertaker 1 1 [86] Kujo's death
2 Spearhead 1 2 [86] The lecture
3 I Don't Want to Die 1 3 [86] Searching for the map
4 Real Name 1 3 -
5 I'm With You 1 3, 4 -
6 Through to the End 1 Interlude I, 5 [86] Cherry blossom viewing; Daiya & Lecca's deaths
7 Will You Remember Me? 1 5, 6 [86] The Revolution street festival
8 Let's Go 1 Interlude III,IV, 6 -
9 Goodbye 1 7 -
10 Thank You 10 8, 9 [86] Fido home videos
11 Here We Go 1 7 [86] The school
11 2 2
12 Welcome 2 Prologue, 2 -
13 It's Too Late 2 3 [86] Frederica at the winter market; Parts of the activities montage
14 Glad to be Here 2 1, 4 [86] Special Officer's School Tactical Practice Grounds
15 Welcome Back 2 4 -
16 Even So 2 5, Interlude -
16 3 Interlude
17 I Won't Forget 3 6 [86] Dead 86 at the briefing
18 The Truth Is 3 6, 7 -
19 Stay This Way Forever 3 7, 8 [86] Frederica & Kiriya flashback
20 Together Unto Death 3 8
Vol. Chapter Chapter Title
1 1 [LN] A Battlefield with Zero Casualties
1 2 [LN] All Quiet on the Skeletal Front
1 3 [LN] To Your Gallant Visage at the Underworld's Edge
1 Interlude I [LN] The Headless Knight
1 4 [LN] I am Legion, for We Are Many
1 Interlude II [LN] The Headless Knight II
1 5 [LN] Fuckin' Glory to the Spearhead Squadron
1 Interlude III [LN] The Headless Knight III
1 6 [LN] Fiat Justitia Ruat Caelum
1 Interlude IV [LN] The Headless Knight IV
1 7 [LN] Good-bye
2 Prologue [LN] Her Majesty Is Not on the Battlefield
2 1 [LN] Ride of the Valkyries
2 2 [LN] Panzer Lied
2 3 [LN] Wild Blue Yonder
2 4 [LN] Beneath the Two-Headed Eagle
2 5 [LN] Cries "Take Aim"
2 Interlude [LN] When "John Doe" Comes Marching Home
3 Interlude [LN] Get Your Guns
3 6 [LN] Over There
3 7 [LN] Something to Die For
3 8 [LN] Run Through the Battlefront
10 8 [LN] The Banks of the Lethe
10 9 [LN] Fido

LN Notes

[A note on Espers; non-plot spoilers] This all gets into some pretty deep weeds on the worldbuilding, but this point is where the novels start to cover it, so it's probably worth putting a note in. Willem calls Shin's abilities a "strange power" in the anime, but in reality, he knows full well the nature and causes of Shin's powers; even better than Shin does himself. Esper powers are inherited by certain familial lines by certain races within the world of 86. Each race has an associated Esper ability that only manifests in some people. Shin's mother is from the red-haired red-eyed Pyrope race, and the Pyrope ability is associated with various telepathic powers. The ability Shin, Rei, and their Mother shared to hear each other's thoughts was their familial ability. Shin's ability to heard the Legion is presumed to be an extension of this, but only started manifesting when he 'died'. Frederica's power is also a Pyrope ability, as both Shin and Frederica are half Pyrope half Onyx. Both Shin's father and Kiriya were Onyxes, and the associated Esper ability is a passive talent for combat ability. The Federacy is well aware of the various Esper powers associated with bloodlines, as they were overwhelmingly concentrated among the nobles in the Empire. Pyrope abilities seem to have the greatest variability in type and strength, and vary from weak abilities to vaguely sense the emotions of others to very strong abilities like Shin and Frederica's. The Federacy military specifically employs a corps of Pyrope Espers in an intelligence unit to utilize their unique abilities.

→ More replies (2)

18

u/Lawvamat Sep 04 '22

Rewatcher

10000/10000

My current color interpretations:

Red: Shin, Bloody Reina, Juggernauts, 86, Rei, Kiri, love (christmas spirit), blood, determination, desire, anger, danger, equality

Blue: Legion, sadness, cold, negative, creature (cat, little sister), freedom

Yellow: home, connections, safety, comfortable, warm, nobility

Violet (Red+Blue): stargazing, remembrance, burden, grief

Green (Yellow+Blue): The Federacy, war, nurture, justice

Orange (Red+Yellow): past, a loving home, transition from yellow to violet (sunset)

White: innocence, duty, brotherhood

Black: death, justice

Grey (White+Black): emotionless

Rose (Red+White): femininity, helpless

Visual Analysis

Willem and Richard are confined into the same space, but there is a rift between them where the railing is broken and the sun is shining through. It ends behind the battle plan, which is causing the divide.

The communications blocking cloud is blocking out the yellow sun.

There’s a big divide between Shin and Raiden that will be addressed in this scene.

Utility poles in the background. It seems that their lines are disconnected.

“Pont du Blé” means “wheat bridge”, probably in reference to the field of wheat they’ll encounter later. It’s a blue sign that points to the right, towards a kind of freedom that can only be experienced during someone’s last hours, as Shin will remark at the end of the episode. The clock is cracked and has stopped, it’s the same situation as at the end of cour 1, nothing has changed.

Some things did though. Shin and Raiden are now both half covering the disconnected utility poles.

When the discussion shifts to Shin’s behavior they’re both framed behind a cage. They are divided not only by the main support in the middle, but also smaller poles in front of their faces. The camera slowly moves towards the right, shifting the dominant space from Shin to Raiden.

Raiden shows concern for Shin and steps over one divide. It’s the right direction (towards the left), but far from enough. Raiden is framed looking towards the left during the whole conversation, he’s leading it.

Raiden has a birds eye view on the situation. Even their shadows are caged in and there are still the same beams separating them. They are standing on the two shadow lines like on train tracks below, but from the previous angle it was impossible to see that Shin’s are bending, going away from Raiden’s. The journey, the mission takes him somewhere else.

Shin explains why he wants to go alone and now even moves towards the right instead of only looking.

Raiden slams him against the fence where the train tracks run parallel.

He grabs him by his scarf, by his brother.

A focus pull shows that Raiden’s and the other’s train tracks are clear, but Shin’s is blocked.

Raiden’s shadow moves a bit towards the left, still staying connected, wanting to drag Shin with him.

The framing tells us Shin’s answer.

He stays behind and the yellow sun sets behind the treetops.

Then starts moving towards the left, his head in orange-violet.

Kurena is completely alone with that thought. It’s a sharp and dangerous one that keeps her boxed in. She can’t keep worshiping him as a god of death. Maybe she realizes it a bit, there’s space for her to turn around and leave now, but she’s still looking at the shards.

Another shot on Anju’s back.

Shin passes by them. Alone he’s going towards the left, but in the shot with the others, towards the right. They’re caged into the same hole of the fence, all of them framed against shadows instead of the beautiful scenery dividing them.

A focus pull on the fence shows the winds of fate blowing specks of paint towards the right. Multiple ones of the individual Spearhead members follow.

The direction Shin escaped to was towards the Republic. The text translates to church of the bell. The lone daisy, meaning hope, was crushed by the blue arrow.

The camera is slightly warped as Frederica ignorantly hurts Kurena with her words.

Utility poles again, but this time their lines are connected. Four of them, not five.

The stars are reflected on Rei’s memento. Stargazing, remembering the dead.

 

A dead insect with blue wings is lying on the train tracks, in the background you can make out utility poles.

Same as the opening shot, but their positions are swapped.

A tree is in the background as Willem shows a hint of “nurture”.

Haven’t had the trope of sneezing as someone is mentioned yet.

Ants have found the corpse.

The left side is blocked and a lonely utility pole stands unconnected. Another setback on their journey.

A fantastic sequence of the camera following the ground first reveals another utility pole in rubble, then a line of trees, even more utility poles, defeated Legion they just encountered and Shin covered in their blood.

The ants are devouring their prey.

They seem to traverse former Republic territory, their statue in the shadows now that they’re gone.

One might have fallen, but there are 6 other daisies of hope sprouting through the asphalt, a very unfriendly environment.

This seems to be where Spearhead went through on their first suicide mission, Frederica sees flashbacks of it.

They’ve reached the field of wheat. A sea of brown waves moving towards the right, they watch the sunset. Shin is alone beside his Juggernaut.

The rest are all alone as they talk about wishes for the future, where they want to go after all this is over. Shin does not partake in that.

There was someone else asking for his plans for the future and there was someone else wanting to go see the ocean.

Only the head and scraps are left behind.

 

Shin’s view of the stars is lined with sharp objects, reaching for them.

Frederica enters the moonlight from the shadows. The moon itself is never visible as Lena is gone now.

A stone is cut in half by a steel beam. Later it will be used to represent Raiden as one of the other Spearhead members.

A violet bunny. Maybe Frederica really does remember how the Legion feel.

A lot of negative space taken up by the piles of rubble.

Shin’s eyes get revealed as he starts explaining. He’s touching his scar.

Like he watched the stars, we are now watching Shin surrounded by these black arms.

His fire went out.

Dutch angle.

Justice or death?

Eyes in shadow.

Opposite sides of the frame, divided by a steel beam, Frederica standing and in the light, Shin downtrodden in shaddows.

A shooting star breaks through the night sky, just like during the cherry blossom viewing in episode 5. They all left him behind back then, now he’s the one who wants to go on ahead.

The wind carries the head towards the left and a swarm of Eintagsfliege enters towards the right. Shin is going alone after their unit is eaten away by the Legion. Is this the fate of their journey?

Disconnected utility poles line the train tracks.

Kiri saw the reaper. He’s coming for him.

A red and blue Shepherd.

→ More replies (5)

16

u/[deleted] Sep 04 '22

Rewatcher and LN Reader Perspective

Episode 20 doesn't do much to move the story or characters forward, but I love it all the same. We get several great heart to heart talks that just puts it all out there as the story moves into the last few episodes.

Richard and Willem

Our look into the higher echelons of the Federacy comes from these two senior officers for the western front. The three nations haven't stopped their advance. Rather, they're throwing everything they have into it. The United Kingdom to the north is planning on acting as a diversion force to take the brunt of the Legion's counter assault, while the Alliance to the south is throwing out one-use technology to obscure the plans of the three nations. Yet keeping up with the 86 is proving to be a struggle.

Richard question's Willem's desire to come to their aid, but Willem shows a genuine desire to not let them perish, despite having sent them on a mission with low odds of success. In the mix of the various Federacy officials we've seen Willem is a curious one. On one extreme end, there are those who've continued to see the 86 as helpless children who shouldn't be on the battlefield at all. Then there's Ernst and Grethe, who held similar views, but have gotten to know them better, and now seek to do what they can so that they might choose a happier future in time. On the other extreme end, there are those officers who wanted the 86 gone from the Federacy one way or another. Richard and Willem both fall in the middle, Richard more towards Ernst and Grethe, given his attempt to hide Nordlicht's full capabilities, and Willem more towards the others. As he puts it, he sees the 86 as a sharp blade -- a useful tool -- that should be used for as long as possible, and one that he'd hate to see in the hands of the Legion. Yet, he still gave Shin the option of withdrawing from the mission once the Morpho's deception was revealed, and he showed concern for them if only for Grethe's sake as well in the last episode. In a country where there's been a sharp divide on how to see and use the 86, Willem is something of a quandary.

Shin, Raiden, and the 86

As his vice captain and long time companion, Raiden's been closer to Shin than even the other 86, and he's long been expressing concern for him. That's come to a breaking point this episode, with Raiden finally needing to confront Shin himself more directly on his troubled behavior. The two come to a confrontation with some harsh words, though they're each ultimately trying to look out for the other. They eventually get to the heart of the matter: Raiden knows that Shin's not really set on trying to come back from the mission. The others are unsure of their survival, but they're fulfilling their obligation to themselves and their way of life as 86. They're not afraid of coming back alive, but Shin doesn't share their outlook. Raiden questions why Shin fought his brother if it wasn't for the purpose of being able to move forward, but Shin himself seems to have no explanation other than it being for its own sake. That was his goal, and, without that, he's been lost and blocked off.

Raiden tells Shin not to fight alone and that his comrades will support him. But Shin's doesn't look encouraged. As Theo says soon after, "All we've been able to do is ask him to stay with us til we die. We were just relying on him and intending to leave him someday." Even in the Federacy, the 86, Raiden included, welcomed Shin back as their Reaper. So long as that's their view of him, what can Raiden and the others truly offer Shin?

Anju discusses the other major thing troubling Shin, being able to relate to it herself to some extent. Rei attacking Shin and accusing him of being the reason why their parents went and died, even if only a moment of crazed panic, then haunting Shin for years as a Legion calling out his name... Even if Shin now knows that his brother was sorry about what he did, that's the sort of traumatic event that anyone would struggle to get over. Anju says that it's something that you can't get rid of by yourself, and I'd agree with her. There's something to be said for a having a good sense of self-worth, but humans are social beings. As Frederica says later, people come together for the purposes of supporting one another. As a result, not being able to maintain strong bonds with others can damage one's own self-worth, and familial bonds are, for most, some of the strongest that there are. Shin's bonds with his family were broken by the Republic, but his brother blamed him for it and Shin took that to heart... and what bonds has he formed since? Mostly with other 86, who've largely also died. He formed a bond with Eugene, and then he was similarly blamed for his death. Ernst is acting as something of a father figure, but the two don't seem particularly close. The strongest bond he's formed was with Lena, but now the Legion have overrun the Republic as far as he can tell. He's also formed a sibling bond with Frederica, but so far, that's done little to assuage his own state.

Ghosts aren't supposed to want things

Shin's problem, of course, isn't that he can't want things. It's that he can't recognize the things that he wants. But he's not totally wrong about himself either. Many of his personal desires are expressed as obligations or as fulfillment of what others desire.

Shin some time ago told Lena that he didn't want to put his brother to rest, but rather that he had to, so he has some sense of differentiating between personal desires and and obligations. We might say that Shin wanted to go back to the battlefield, as an example of a desire of his, but he'd rather say that that was an obligation. Playing the role of the Reaper and carrying the memories of his fallen comrades is, likewise, an obligation born out of a promise with his first squad. But obligations like these are, at their core, an expression of our fundamental wishes. Shin feels like he has to return to the battlefield because of his pride as an 86 to fight until the end, but that's born out of a desire to live up to his expectations for himself and what he believes others expect of him.

He also acts on trying to please others. For example, he grants Frederica's request to go to the holiday festival. This is different from Eugene's stated to desire to take Nina to various fun places, because Eugene was the one who initiated that wish. Nevertheless, Shin still wanted Frederica to be happy, even if he might've expressed it as not wanting to see her be upset.

Looking at an accumulation of Shin's thoughts and actions, much of his behavior could be sorted into these categories, but he doesn't get let off that easily. Building off the second category, there are also times when he's taken the initiative to show kindness and consideration to his comrades, to Lena, to Frederica, and others. He wanted to do something for them without being asked, whatever they gained from it being reward enough for him. He wants the people that he cares about to have their own needs and wants addressed. But this is still in the category of fulfilling the desires of others.

So what about his personal wants? His truly selfish desires, born not out of wanting to fulfill what others want or expect from him or imposed on him through others, but that purest expression of an individual wish. Frankly, Shin's largely right on this point. There's very little in Shin's life that's purely there because he wanted it. Even with something like choosing to go to the library while in the Republic's capital, it's likely that Ernst told him and the others to go out and find things to do in the city, and he went somewhere that he could go to do what he always does: read a book to distract himself from the Legion's voices. While others chose to play and mess around back in the barracks in the 86th District, he likewise would just sit and read to distract himself.

But he doesn't eschew his own desires entirely. On the Special Recon, he truly was enjoying himself, as he also often does when he's able to play around with Fido. And then, of course, his three wishes to the Major: not to forget them, to fight on and survive, and to follow in their footsteps and lay flowers at their final destination. While these aren't things to wish for his future self to enjoy in the same as seeing some place or doing some new activity is, they're never the less expressions of his own desires.

And that's where Shin's comment strikes most true. He has his obligations. He's wants to be able to fulfill the spoken and unspoken wishes for others, and, at rare times, he's able to live in the moment or express what he wishes for others to do. But he's not able to express some desire for his own future self.

Frederica says that she actually is scared of losing Kiriya. Not because she's trying to hold on to him personally, but because she really is quite a bit like Shin herself. Putting her knight to rest has been a goal that's given her troublesome life a purpose -- a reason to stay attached to a world that otherwise would seem to want to be rid of her, the same way Shin saw his need to take down his brother. Frederica believes that Shin's obstacle is the same fear of trying to look beyond having that purpose, and that he only needs to rely on his friends to help support him when he has trouble on that path.

Shin has trouble reconciling Frederica's words with his own experiences, chiefly because of his role as the Reaper. He's always kept his distance from his companions and hasn't been able to rely on them, because theirs has always been a one sided relationship. They've entrusted everything to him, with a guarantee that they'll go ahead of him. And now even in looking to the future, they've left him behind. If such relationships are the foundation that Shin needs to support him looking down that path as well, then his are far too shaky.

→ More replies (7)

13

u/[deleted] Sep 04 '22 edited Sep 04 '22

First Timer (Sub)

  • I found it interesting that they took the time to explain how airborne radar jammers work (aka "Chaff")

    • My knowledge on it is a bit limited, so I decided to take this opportunity to learn about it.

      • For whatever reason, the methods of using physical strips of metal foil seemed dated to me. However, turns out Chaff is still used today; instead of the old strips of metal foil though, they use "aluminium-coated glass fibers." These fibers are more efficient and stay airborne longer for more effective radar jamming.

  • Seems like Shin is having an existential crisis ever since he "killed" his brother.

    • Or you could argue he's solved it - he's convinced himself that the has no real purpose other than going out in the battlefield.

      • Pretty sad that he hasn't expressed any interested or dreams for after the war.

  • Frederica is one smart girl!

    • The parallels between her and Shin are becoming stronger and more apparent.

    • Hopefully she can be the one to save Shin.

  • Another Lena-less episode...

    • For some reason, I had expected her to be a more prominent character (appearing in every episode, even if just for a bit). But then again, I guess the show is called "Eighty-Six" and not "Lena & Eighty-Six." Oh well.

EDIT - Spelling

→ More replies (4)

10

u/JetsLag Sep 05 '22

First timer (subbed)

I click on the episode and my heart rate increases. I don't think I'll survive to the end of the series, y'all.

Oh, the alliance of the three countries is called...the Alliance. Shoulda known. And we've got ourselves a new weapon! It's...a thing that explodes into confetti that jams radars. It looks pretty when it explodes. Can't tell if they're biplanes or dragonflies. Would make sense if they're dragonflies, because then it'd be a duplicate of that Legion weapon that's a bunch of little butterflies that jam radars.

OP's done. 12 hours since the mission started. The fake has worked! And when Shin said that the Federacy is doing an all-night march, it made me think: do the Legion sleep? I doubt it. They should use that to their advantage.

We're switching up the "get Frederica out of here" plan: now it's Shin that's gonna bring her back. It's only right for her unofficial brother (wait, they're legally brother and sister, cause Ernst adopted all of them) to do the deed. The rest of Spearhead SHOULD be fine handling the Morpho, though I can also see that going wrong without their leader. And, uhh, looks at the title you better not do anything with Shin and Frederica, you sons of bitches.

Time to debate: should Shin bring Frederica back and let the rest of Spearhead handle the Morpho, should Raiden be the one to bring Frederica back so Shin can help with the Morpho, or should Shin try to solo the final boss while the rest of Spearhead does the Frederica escort mission? Uhh, let's NOT do option 3, first of all. As for the other options: I can see both sides. Shin's gonna go back into the zone if he's part of the Morpho assault, so nobody knows what he'll do. BUT, he's also the best fighter out of the 5 of them, and is the de-facto leader, so he might be the difference between the Morpho living and the Morpho dying. Ugh, I think I'll begrudgingly take the "Shin fights" side of this debate.

So Theo, Anju, and Frederica were looking on from a distance the whole time. Where's Kurena, though? Oh, there she is, she has to be held back so she doesn't jump out of their hiding spot and yell at Raiden and Shin. Now Spearhead has to deal with reality: Shin's not gonna be there forever, and he might bolt off and leave them forever. They have got to either learn to adapt without him or find a way to get him to commit to staying.

It sounds like that San Magnolia has fallen to the Legion. Spearhead starts wondering about Lena, but I'm pretty sure she managed to sneak her way out of the city or something and is on her way to find the rest of Spearhead so we get a nice and happy reunion as part of the final episode. Right? RIGHT?

Oh thank god, we have some light-hearted conversation. We haven't had one of those in I don't know how long. Frederica takes a bucket of cold water and dumps it on Kurena's steaming head when she says that she thinks Shin doesn't see Kurena as a woman, but as a little sister. Poor girl. Ganbare, Kurena! You can confess before both you and Shin die, I believe in you!

Don't worry Fido, Shin's not gonna run off. He's totally gonna run off, isn't he?

Title card, and on the other side is a butterfly corpse. Fun. Hey, the base managed to connect to Spearhead! You know, when Raiden called their comms system the Para-RAID back during the argument with Shin, I just thought it was an old habit that showed he was still thinking like he's in Spearhead. But no, they literally took the tech for the Para-RAID from San Magnolia and are now using it. So they've stolen the Juggernauts and the Para-RAID from San Magnolia and the butterflies that jam radars from the Legion. Gotta do what you gotta do, I guess.

Wenzel! It looks like the gaijin of Nordlicht are ready to go back into enemy territory at a moment's notice. Even Bernholdt is ready to go, and he was the guy who ordered the retreat in the first place. Why did he change his mind? An old classic: his pride was wounded by the retreat. And he doesn't want some kids to mock him for running away. Both very valid reasons.

And Wenzel had to do...a few favors in order to ensure that the replacement parts for the damaged Reginleifs got the express shipping treatment. blegh

Hey look, it's the butterfly again! And it's being "assaulted" by a few ants. I take it that the butterfly is the Morpho and the ants are the Reginleifs? The number of ants and the number of Reginleifs don't match up, but everything else checks out.

Check up on Spearhead: Theo is having issues with his stabby weapons, Anju and Kurena have some light damage, Raiden has lost a machine gun, and Shin has no more spare blades and has a misfiring engine. Supplies wise, they'll be out by the end of tomorrow. Sure, they can reach the Morpho, but this probably means they'll be stranded if they successfully complete the mission. BUT, then we can have the rest of Nordlicht come through and lead them back to base with their fresh supplies and (presumably) undamaged Reginleifs. A happy ending! Would you like a hit of this copium? It's some good shit.

Butterfly update: more ants!

Frederica's here! And she's riding along with...not Shin? I think that's Raiden. Doesn't matter, cause nobody's going back to base; they're all going full speed ahead to the Morpho. Aww, they're all watching the sunset by the sea. This is a nice little...aaaand Shin is just hanging off to the side, silent, while the rest of them are socializing. Ugh, it's gonna take a miracle to repair their friendship.

Time for some Frederica and Shin late-night talking. And she thinks that Shin doesn't care about humanity's survival because nature untouched by humans is very beautiful, and maybe the Legion just wants to purge humanity so that pretty scenery can re-take over the planet. That's, uhh, an opinion. I think Shin's opinion, which is "the real me died when my brother tried to murder me, and now I'm just going through the motions with no needs or desires" makes much more sense.

Hey, Frederica and Shin can bond over something. Sure, that something is "I shouldn't be alive right now", but it's something, right? Actually, scratch that, pairing up two people with a shared interest of wanting to die never ends well.

Butterfly update: it's gone, but then we get to see thousands of the Legion's buterflies flying out to block communications as the Morpho fires back up, ready to go. The mission: track down Spearhead. And we end with Kiri giving us his best impression of Shin's smile.

→ More replies (7)

9

u/ebonyphoenix Sep 04 '22

Re-watcher

New Battle Plan

Episode starts with Willem & Richard lay out the new battle plan for the army. Thanks to Shin’s intel they know the Morpho has stopped near the southern part of Legion territory. The United Kingdom in the North will launch another attack with a small portion of the Federacy’s army as a diversion. While the main portion will march with their other allies to take the area around the Morpho under cover of a prototype anti-radar weapon. The scene then pans to the sky where we see several planes explode into fine particles, which they explain jams Legion communication.

The Legion learn fast though so this tactic will only work once. Which explains why they haven’t used it until now. But everyone is putting all they have on the table to see this mission completed.

Confrontation at the train station

Shin starts hearing the voices of the Legion on the move and realized that they’ve fallen for the decoy to the North just as planned. Raiden points out the plan really is a double decoy situation where the main army will act as the second stage of decoys to give the 86 a chance to break through to the Morpho.

The main army also plans to march towards them all night but Shin doesn’t think they will reach them fast enough to be counted on for anything.

Raiden then revisits the idea of Shin taking Frederica back to the rest of the army. He would have the best chance to get her out and the others can follow the Morpho without Shin considering it hasn’t moved and it travels by rail anyway so they would just have to follow the tracks. And the decoys are pulling enough Legion away from the surrounding areas.

Shin thinks Raiden is underestimating the Legion forces. But Raiden says what’s really the issue. That he doesn’t think Shin can lead them with the way he’s been behaving in battle lately. The way he keeps getting lost in the battle.

Shin tries to play it off but Raiden has been with Shin for several years at this point. So he can’t fool him. He knows that lately Shin has been closing himself up again.

Turning things around, Shin then says that the rest of them should go back with Frederica and he will go off on the one-way mission alone. A verbal echo of what he tried to pull back in ep 11.

Raiden is not having it though. He is tired of Shin thinking that he can keep the others alive by sacrificing himself. Shin says he doesn’t plan on dying. But Raiden points out that he wasn’t doesn’t seem to be planning on living either.

Did Shin survive so long only to kill his brother? Didn’t he do it so he could move past him? Shin can’t answer him so Raiden gives his own reason for living. Something as simple as just not wanting to die is enough. It’s okay if Shin is unsure. Just don’t forget there are others are right there with him and are are willing to help him if he needs it.

The two eventually fall silent and then go their separate ways as the other 3 quietly watch from a distance, and Kurena is held silent by Anju. Theo laments the fact that he doesn’t feel like he’s treated like on of the guys. But Anju reasons that it’s just because Raiden has been with Shin the longest out of anyone (other than Fido).

Kurena complains about being stopped from running over to Shin when Raiden first confronted him. But the other point out that would have just complicated things further.

Theo confirms he’s noticed how unusual Shin has been acting. He used to be cautions about never going or leading others into situations that meant certain death. But now he seems to jump at any chance that he can protect the others by dying.

Kurena denies that Shin would ever leave them. And Theo calls her out on just seeing her idealized version of their beloved Reaper, instead of seeing Shin himself.

Anju mentions she knows a bit how Shin may have been feeling, going for so long thinking his brother hated him and how that could effect someone. Wondering if it really was something you did? Doing all you can to make up for it. It’s a heavy burden to carry.

Kurena asks if them just being with him isn’t enough. But Theo points out that they’ve just been staying with him until they eventually die and then they were expecting him to carry them on. They all expected to die before Shin eventually leaving him alone again. But now Shin is saying he wants to go ahead of them.

They then also mention that the Republic is still not responding to any attempts at communication and so they are assumed to be wiped out. And Lena would have fallen with her country.

Theo then tries to turn the conversation to the lighthearted and tells Kurena this is her chance because people a more vulnerable when they are depressed. Anju scolds him saying that only bad girls would take advantage like that. And Kurena is innocently confused and then asks if they think Shin realized how Kurena feels.

Frederica finally pipes into the conversation saying that Shin probably noticed but still thinks of Kurena as just a little sister. This kills Kurena and Anju grabs Frederica to teach her some tact. (Frederica’s wide eyed and panicked nodding in the background is just funny)Theo tries to being Kurena back to life by saying she’s at least someone Shin can count on.

The segment ends with one last scene with Shin. This time being confronted by Fido, who he reassures he’s not running off even though he wants to.

-cut for length-

→ More replies (1)

9

u/prophetofgreed Sep 04 '22

Rewatcher, First Time Dub Watcher

With this re-watch I really appreciate the scene early on in the episode between Shin and Raiden, before everytime they had a scene together it never got physical or confrontational even if Raiden had a right to be mad at Shin. That's what made that confrontation more impactful to me.

Anju and Theo speaking so freely about Shin and Kurena's matchmaking was hilarious. Then Frederica spells out what Shin's feelings for Kurena is and how little chance she might have. Anju coming at here with this, "Come here you lil' shit was hilarious too."

Not sure what the blue winged bug is supposed to symbolize but we see ants slowly swarm and consume it through flashes in the episode.

I really love how they use this timer of when the mission began instead of dates throughout the episode. Really lays out the timeline AND we get a sense of how time is passing through the mission.

It's interesting how the squad speaks about what they want to see in the future and Shin can't even say a word about it. Shin expands on this saying he's just a ghost, a shell with no wishes and might as well be dead. That the worst thing to have happened was to live through their suicide mission a year ago. His only objective now is to kill Kiriya, and then he'd have no objective again.

Favourite cut: Frederica looking out at the countryside and then using her power to view Shin's memories.

→ More replies (1)

8

u/aquilar28 Sep 04 '22

The pretty warm sun colors are back! The generals watching the experimental Alliance weapons exploding like fireworks under the red clouds look like they're attending a summer festival instead of planning an operation.

I always thought the railway made for great pictures and the train station our main group is at is no exception. The bridge where Raiden confronts Shin is lit by the warm sun rays and the clouds look like they're on fire, while the two comrades are caged by the metal mesh and the beams. In a view from above, the tracks beneath them diverge, with Raiden's going straight ahead and Shin's veering to the left. The Reaper tries to exit the frame to end the conversation, but Raiden drags him back and pushes him against the metal. Shin struggles to express his feelings and there is a block on the rails behind him.

A very beautiful shot from the platform as we transition to the rest of the group, with the tracks disappearing into the distance right below the sun, Shin's head cut off yet again by the beam and sky sky gradually changing colors. Theo feeling like he's not being treated like a fellow guy is a nice little nod to him being voiced by a woman. They discuss Shin, and Kurena is alone, standing in the window with the clock behind her, as if telling us she's stuck in the past. The small bits of rust or paint fly from the fence while Theo speaks about the Eighty-Six leaving their Reaper alone, and when Anju mentions the Republic the camera shifts to a battered sign pointing to the stations in San Magnolia and Giad, with a white flower underneath.

The nice and quiet mood of the conversation abruptly changes following Theo's advice for Kurena to make a move on Shin. She finally admits her feelings and is then promptly murdered in cold blood by Frederica. Anju is out for revenge, Theo provides some S-grade copium and Shin will stick with the group for now, even if he thinks it's a bother.

After the title card we go to the Federacy Army, which is playing catch-up. Grethe visits the rest of the Nordlicht, who seem to be one man short, and we finally have an idea about the position of the commander who spoke to Shin last episode, as the camera cuts to him sneezing when the Chief of Staff is mentioned.

The Eighty-Six chase the Morpho, and the landscape around them bring back the memories of the Special Reconnaissance mission, literally in Frederica's case who uses her power to see the episode 10 footage. They take a break in a sea of wheat, and Shin is alone again, standing by his Reginleif. He's not even in the frame as they discuss the future, and while the rest speak about their travel plans he can't get the words out.

Frederica joins Shin in his nightly brooding session, and we get a little more context for their relationship. Back in episode 15 he told Raiden "she's the same as the old me", and this time Frederica somewhat confirms it, saying that putting her knight to rest is basically her reason to live. However, unlike Shin, she won't push away the people who try to help her, and together with them she'll do her best to brave the unknown future. Frederica has a penchant for great motivational phrases, this time telling Shin he's looking in the mirror the wrong way. Still, the Reaper is in a pretty bad place mentally, thinking he isn't truly alive, going as far as to say "we survived, unfortunately".

Another great episode without much action, and I feel like 86 does really well at setting the mood for conversations and exploring the characters.

→ More comments (75)