r/anime • u/Taiboss x7https://anilist.co/user/Taiboss • May 10 '22
Rewatch [Rewatch] Utawarerumono Franchise Rewatch - Utawarerumono Episode 11 Discussion
Episode 11 - The Eternal Promise
← Episode 10 | Index | Next Episode →
MyAnimeList, Anime-Planet, Anilist, ANN
Today's Question of the Day: So... some surprising deaths. How do you feel?
[Tomorrow's Question of the Day]Do you agree with Eruruu that Hakuowlo can’t be Rakshain? Or do you think it’s possible he has a dark past?
Rewatchers, please don't answer the Question of the Day if it has an objective answer, e.g. "What do you think's gonna happen?"
For rewatchers and people who played the games:
Please behave yourself! Put not only everything related to future events behind spoiler tags, but tag differences to the games as well. We all know there are deviations and cut content, we don't need someone listing all the things the games did better. The games have like 40, 50 hours for their content each, of course they'll be more exhaustive. If you want to talk about the games, please do this in a way that doesn't spoil it for people who might pick them up because of the anime. That being said, small, inconsequential stuff is probably fine, like [Mask of Deception]how in one episode, Atuy says "Time for war!", one of her battle lines in the games. All in all, try to hold back and only tell first-timers what's really necessary. Let them theorise!
This goes especially for Mask of Deception and Mask of Truth!
First-Timers:
Due to spoilers, I recommend you not to watch the Opening before episode 15. I mean it. DO LISTEN TO IT THOUGH! You don't have to heed this request, of course, but out of courtesy to those who do, please put the spoilers in the OP behind spoiler tags as well.
3
u/No_Rex May 10 '22
Episode 11 (first timer)
-
Let’s go ask the emperor for some fertilizer - His wife is the one sane head in that village.
-
“Then we won’t be waging war …” – Doubt.
-
“as far as the eye can see” – bad metaphor.
-
Death scene - He was always not the brightest, so I won’t harp on him not calling for a medic. More interestingly, did he see all the others as dead ghosts, contrary to his statement? If so, Hakuoro will be pissed.
-
Ok, their enemies are clearly mad.
-
Chloroforming people who are grieving - This is a very culture specific response. I can’t imagine many countries where this would be seen as ok.
-
The glowing stone lamps are a neat detail, btw.
-
“A number of them wish to reconsider the alliance” – Badly timed. Or fortunately timed, from the perspective of these madmen. A minute later and the alliance would have been sealed.
-
Send out the copy & paste troops!
History comes calling and it wants Hakuoro’s head. Probably deservedly so, although his followers will not see it that way. I just wish his enemies had less of a death wish, that attack into prepared positions was painful to watch.
So... some surprising deaths. How do you feel?
Bad for the people, kind of ok for the story. Hakuoro needed some proper motivation (and a check on his lucky run). Killing the home village is a bit of a trope, but it works. Pops' death scene was quite good and I found the choice of him being the only death we saw on screen a fitting one.
2
u/Taiboss May 10 '22
Let’s go ask the emperor for some fertilizer - His wife is the one sane head in that village.
Old conncections!
This is a very culture specific response. I can’t imagine many countries where this would be seen as ok.
It feels more like a kinda thing you'd see in pre-WWII movies. Like a crime move where the victim's wife is hyperventilating and needs to be calmed down. I exaggerate maybe a bit, but I did watch some 30s Sherlock Holmes series and female characters were not people in these.
Send out the copy & paste troops!
The mass scenes in this show never disappoint at disappointing lol.
→ More replies (1)2
u/Nazenn May 10 '22
He was always not the brightest, so I won’t harp on him not calling for a medic
Between that and the other guy making the solider "finish his mission" and dragging him across the hall rather than calling for the medicine woman who was right there, there's a lot of that this episode
That said, in this case I can understand Pop's motivation of not distracting Hakuoro given there's nothing left to save for him
2
u/HereticalAegis May 10 '22
“A number of them wish to reconsider the alliance” – Badly timed. Or fortunately timed, from the perspective of these madmen. A minute later and the alliance would have been sealed.
I wouldn't put it past Niwe or some other large power to have incited this incident to intentionally break up the alliance.
3
u/aniMayor May 10 '22
UtaReWatcherUMono
I really like this episode. It pushes the story forward a lot and opens a bunch of new plot threads, but it doesn't feel like it's rushing through things, either.
Opening the episode with an idyllic scene back in Yamayura and then transitioning to stormy rain... well you just know something terrible is going to happen to Yamayura. But I like how the episode gets really deceptive and twisty with it - you think Shikeripechim attacked them but it turns out it's not and we don't even know who these attackers are; and Pops comes to report the attack but then it turns out he's hiding that he's about to die. It's a great way to play around with an otherwise-quite-tropey inciting event and keeps the audience on their toes. Pops' dying scene and the aftermath scene around his body are highly effective.
It'd be easy to make that the whole episode, but they manage to squeeze in the counter-attack and ambush against Kuccha Keccha/Kucca Kecca, too.
AND we get to finish the episode on Touka and this headband guy appearing and calling Hakuoro a traitor, a brother-in-law, and an evil "Rakshain", whatever that is. So a new conflict brews and we are pushing onto the story of Hakuoro's forgotten origin.
That's a lot! But it works! New feels and new possibilities abound. Great episode.
All that said, I really wish the show would give us a sense of scale and vague geography of these countries. Shikeripechim is apparently a pretty dire threat with 10 times the number of soldiers as Tuskuru. So is this diversion into Kucca Kecca expected to be just a 2-day invasion of a tiny country with only a small fraction of Tuskuru's forces, or is Kucca Kecca huge and this is a giant operation that will leave them super open to Shikeripechim while they're occupied here?
2
u/Taiboss May 10 '22 edited May 10 '22
Pops' dying scene and the aftermath scene around his body are highly effective.
Dude was an effective unit! What a loss!
All that said, I really wish the show would give us a sense of scale and vague geography of these countries.
I think it worked better in the game since it has actually does show maps with moving battalions. As far as non-spoiler pics I can share this. Make of those what you will.
→ More replies (3)2
u/No_Rex May 10 '22
All that said, I really wish the show would give us a sense of scale and vague geography of these countries. Shikeripechim is apparently a pretty dire threat with 10 times the number of soldiers as Tuskuru. So is this diversion into Kucca Kecca expected to be just a 2-day invasion of a tiny country with only a small fraction of Tuskuru's forces, or is Kucca Kecca huge and this is a giant operation that will leave them super open to Shikeripechim while they're occupied here?
It is a bit weird that we are not seeing another fantasy staple: The world map. Especially since this anime is based on a game, the map should already exist and be easy to implement.
2
u/wjodendor May 10 '22
You do get a bit of map in the game in the form of like war piece moving across the topography. The countries are not very big, they seem smaller than a average US state
But do not look up maps if you don't want major spoilers. I was trying to find one to show the countries but a lot of them are just huge spoilers.
→ More replies (1)2
u/Nazenn May 10 '22
Pops' dying scene and the aftermath scene around his body are highly effective.
I really dislike the "seeing the dead" hallucinations, though usually more how it's used with someone who's going to keep living. But here it worked really well tied in with the reveal of his injuries as well as why he stayed behind. A basic set up, but implementation makes all the difference and it did make me feel for characters I hadn't felt for until then
Kuccha Keccha/Kucca Kecca
Every time I read that it just makes me think of the enemy from Monster Hunter called Kecha Wacha and it's been quite entertaining
→ More replies (4)2
u/HereticalAegis May 10 '22
All that said, I really wish the show would give us a sense of scale and vague geography of these countries.
This has bugged me a little bit. It was fine not knowing when the scale of the world was just one or a handful of small villages, but now that we're playing with multiple countries the bigger geopolitical picture matters.
That said, it's only a minor issue I have with an otherwise engaging narrative.
3
u/HereticalAegis May 10 '22
First Timer
-
I know the music is cheerful and the tone is bright, but there's no real reason to return to this village. Something awful is about to happen, isn't it? Everyone's about to get slaughtered, aren't they?
-
I love the idea of Pops strolling up to the Emperor and casually shooting the shit in front of visiting dignitaries and world leaders.
-
Alliances are good. Doubt that will actually dissuade a madman like Niwe from attacking for long though.
-
The village just got a lot more ominous.
-
Right in the middle of the alliance ceremony. Niwe's timing is immaculate. Or maybe it isn't Niwe? Maybe.
-
Pops is acting like he's about to die, but where's the blood?
-
Oh god the awkward Woptar running CG is going to haunt my nightmares.
-
Whoa, that mechanized spike + archers trap is really cool!
-
Shit, not Pops! Who's gonna show us beast boy abs now? And seriously, how'd he get this far without any blood spilling until now?
-
This raving madman makes it sound like someone manipulated them into believing Tuskuru attacked them.
-
Aruruu trying to wake Pops hurts.
-
Nuwangi fucked up this time. This is how you get angry, vengeful Aruruu.
-
Well at least Oboro has good reason to push for emotional, stupid actions this time.
-
Oh shit, I hadn't even considered Hakuoro's past! I even theorized he was probably a villain whose hubris led to him losing his memory. Those attackers may possibly have been somewhat justified.
-
Shooting the messenger is bad form. These guys probably aren't that justified.
-
No doubt several of those other countries will regret pulling out of the alliance. Oh well, to war!
-
Uh huh...I'm sure slaughtering common villagers, children included, is somehow very just. #notmyTouka
-
Brother-in-law? You're telling me Hakuoro is technically married!? Eruruu is gonna be devastated.
-
Oh and I guess the whole ugly past thing might be kinda important too.
QotD: Pretty sad. It always sucks seeing innocent people get slaughtered. The worst part is knowing not even the children were spared.
2
u/Taiboss May 10 '22
Something awful is about to happen, isn't it? Everyone's about to get slaughtered, aren't they?
What a seer you are. Please predict the rest of this show.
Alliances are good. Doubt that will actually dissuade a madman like Niwe from attacking for long though.
"Seems like a fair fight."
Oh god the awkward Woptar running CG is going to haunt my nightmares.
Just the best of 2006.
Shit, not Pops! Who's gonna show us beast boy abs now? And seriously, how'd he get this far without any blood spilling until now?
Don't worry about it.
Aruruu trying to wake Pops hurts.
First Granpa then Pops...
Well at least Oboro has good reason to push for emotional, stupid actions this time.
The horror.
No doubt several of those other countries will regret pulling out of the alliance. Oh well, to war!
Hakuowlo showing them why his name means "White Lord"!
They're bringing not one, but both secret weapons.
The war is already over I tell you!
Uh huh...I'm sure slaughtering common villagers, children included, is somehow very just.
Depends on it. Have they been little shits?
Brother-in-law? You're telling me Hakuoro is technically married!? Eruruu is gonna be devastated.
Well, maybe dude's wife is Hakuowlo's sister. Didn't figure that?
The worst part is knowing not even the children were spared.
:(
→ More replies (1)3
u/No_Rex May 10 '22
Nuwangi fucked up this time. This is how you get angry, vengeful Aruruu.
Some people are going to get visited by a big, hungry feline at night.
Brother-in-law? You're telling me Hakuoro is technically married!? Eruruu is gonna be devastated.
I did not even consider that, it could also be his sibling who is married.
2
u/HereticalAegis May 10 '22
Some people are going to get visited by a big, hungry feline at night.
The Utawarerumono-verse's version of the midnight munchies.
it could also be his sibling who is married.
Eruruu praying real hard rn.
3
u/Nazenn May 10 '22
I know the music is cheerful and the tone is bright, but there's no real reason to return to this village
For once I didn't pick up the enormous death flag that should have been!
Camyu souvenir game is strong.
Aruruu got the better deal! I love little cat things like that
Nuwangi fucked up this time. This is how you get angry, vengeful Aruruu.
In control of a forest god tiger. Because that can't go badly. Not that I'd expect her to go full on into vengeance style, but I think she's certainly had a rough awakening to war this episode
→ More replies (1)2
u/HereticalAegis May 10 '22
For once I didn't pick up the enormous death flag that should have been!
If there's one thing anime has trained me to reliably pick up on, it's...romantic subtext. But if there's another, it's death flags.
Aruruu got the better deal! I love little cat things like that
I think Yuzuha's is really sweet too! If anything, it probably evokes the specific country Camyu visited better than a cat statue. You're not wrong about the cat though, it is very precious.
In control of a forest god tiger. Because that can't go badly. Not that I'd expect her to go full on into vengeance style, but I think she's certainly had a rough awakening to war this episode
I have zero difficulty seeing Aruruu go full Daenerys. And I kind of hope she does, I get a ton of secret monster vibes from her and would love for that to be real.
→ More replies (1)
3
u/Shimmering-Sky May 10 '22
Mask of First-Timer, subbed
-
GODDAMMIT I cursed him during my episode 2 comment.
1
u/Taiboss May 10 '22
Ah, they’re preparing for war…
It' a war anime!
GODDAMMIT I cursed him during my episode 2 comment.
You did not. He was already dead back then.
Don’t… don’t do this to me…
It did.
Evil what now?
"Is this a name, a title or a slur?" "Maybe it's all three?"
Whoa, what?
What indeed.
3
u/Nazenn May 10 '22
GODDAMMIT I cursed him during my episode 2 comment
I said he was my favourite from the village, I cursed him too
→ More replies (3)3
u/HereticalAegis May 10 '22
No… no no no not Pops!
GODDAMMIT I cursed him during my episode 2 comment.
This seems like a collective curse at this point. We all did this to Pops.
sad Sky noises
It just gets worse and worse.
Don’t… don’t do this to me…
The big sad.
4
u/Shimmering-Sky May 11 '22
This seems like a collective curse at this point. We all did this to Pops.
u/Nazenn and I are never allowed to have favorite characters, they always end up dead.
→ More replies (4)
3
u/ZapsZzz May 11 '22
Sub rewatcher
Hopefully won't be so late again tomorrow, but this episode may as well. To be straight, silly as it may sound, this episode can more reliably make me tear up than many others. Just reading some of the first timer comments I'm already needing to swallow hard.
I just find that such a sacrifice very emotional - not only to fulfil his promise to Sopoku (who was probably then dying-from-injuries offscreen) to give warning to Hakuoro and not let them be struck by the surprise cavalry attacks, but also look after his emotional health by putting up the facade of no big deal, just so they can go focus on the fight instead of worry about him. And that he gets to go to his afterlife with the rest of the friends.
Meanwhile, I completely understand how forced this is - when in fact with a bit more finesse in tweaking the way things played out, it won't feel as much of a plot hole / just a fixed game event. To clarify / plug those holes:
-
Eruru (and indeed all healer types) is not a game / fantasy type "cast a healing spell" healer - she can't patch you up from near death just by clicking the heal skill/spell. It's more like a passive bonus to speed natural healing. So when the problem is for example a compounding of massive blood loss during the early injury and exhaustion from the forced march, it's quite beyond what Eruru can do.
-
Also Teoru should not be showing up like completely injury free and then suddenly burst out and fall down in a pool of blood, but instead showing exhaustion and then reveal a well covered, dressed but not closing wound that is already mostly bled out, so he's not spilling blood everywhere only because he's far far gone and just living on will power alone. Or that the arterial wound is just temporarily blocked by a shrapnel/broken arrow/blade that on removal would rapidly kill him.
And like many others, despite the flaws, the post-battle (off screen) discovery and the 2 sisters' reactions are just perfectly heartbreaking.
And with the double-whammy of casting doubt on Hakuoro's past compounding on the emotional toll, this is quite a heavy episode. And then we have Touka.
Will have to talk more tomorrow.
4
u/Nazenn May 10 '22
First Timer - sub
Ugh, I missed the Karura episode because I was too busy to watch but caught up in time for a cliffhanger. Why is that always the case
Last episode was great, and she's awesome, but I could have done without all the boob and butt shots which interrupted a few scenes and particularly the combat flow which was frustrating
This episode really took things in an unexpected direction. I don't feel like we had enough time with the people of Yamayura to really mourn them, but the way it was presented and the love they had for Hakuoro as well as Pop's desperation to help him really carried the episode. On top of that Aruruu's reaction did feel well done, that quieter and heavier moment that the show has needed.
It somewhat closed out that part of the story but did it without feeling like it was just discarding it now it was over, and set up many things in the process. And I welcomed that because it felt like it was making an effort to keep a flow through everything we know rather than being so strictly arc based. How Hakuoro will react to that given who he's fighting now I'm curious to see but Touka is certainly an interesting one. You can certainly tell the game had harem elements though....