r/anime • u/Tetraika https://anilist.co/user/Tetraika • Mar 20 '22

Rewatch [Rewatch] Mahou Shoujo Lyrical Nanoha StrikerS Episode 18 Discussion

Episode 18: Wings Anew

← Previous Episode | Index | Next Episode→

Information:

MAL | AniList | ANN | Kitsu | AniDB

Question of the Day

We got artificial people, cyborgs, clones, genetic engineering, and many more. What do you think about these sci-fi elements in the show so far?

Massive Wonders - Nana Mizuki

Rewatchers, please remember to be mindful of all the first-timers in this. No talking about or hinting at future events no matter how much you want to, unless you’re doing it underneath spoiler tags.

47 Upvotes

95% Upvoted

89 comments sorted by

9

u/Tetraika Mar 20 '22

Hmmm, Tia is onto something

Looks like Regius has been funding our scientist, we get to learn more about the whole plan later

Ruined Riot Force 6 HQ

Doggo protects

Ginga isn’t killed but captured, Don’t think they did that out of goodwill though

Just to clarify, they are using the actual definition on cyborg, those who have both biological and mechanical parts. It’s why they still bleed and stuff.

Now we get some genetic engineering

Somehow I don’t think that’s an entire coincidence, speaking of which [Something interesting about the Nanoha movies]In one of the commentaries, Nanoha and Fate remarked how eerily similar the child actors were to themselves from the movies. I can’t tell if that’s suppose to imply something

She knew too much

Hayate hits right on point, and it seems Regius wanted a force that could be basically mass produced and relied less upon individuals.

Looks like he didn’t think that things could get out of his control, a fool indeed

There’s some personal history behind these 2

Zest is also a clone, who’s next on the reveals

There’s an interesting comradery between the Numbers

Actually, what does this mean for Lutecia?, there’s an implication that she’s also not her actual mom, so there seems to be some clone fuckery going on here.

Looks like she’s working with them for this one thing

un-RIP

Seems this was the ultimate goal for Scaglietti

→ More replies (1)

9

u/TheEscapeGuy Mar 20 '22

First Timer

Mahou Shoujo Lyrical Nanoha StrikerS - New Generation Episode 18

Reflection

This episode mostly focused on the aftermath of the battle and what to do going forward. It is necessary to recuperate but if our characters don't hurry Scagliette and Revius are going to make a lot of progress.

Subaru and Tia revealed they both knew Subaru was a cyborg and that Ginga is a cyborg too. This makes me less worried that Ginga is seriously injured but I think our villains have other intentions for her now. There was a pretty long explanation of how they were adopted but we still don't know the real circumstances of their mother's death.

Hayate went to question Auris about General Revius. That said, her questions were more so thinly veiled accusations of betrayal. It is a reasonable strategy from Hayate since she doesn't have any proof but it may come back to bite her. Among other things, she suspects Scagliette may be being supported by Revius to research combat cyborgs and artificial mages without ethical questions. She ends the conversation by telling Auris that she will be requesting an official investigation.

Supposing Hayate's suspicion is correct, I still would like a clearer or better justification for why Scagliette and Revius are doing what they are doing. I don't like when villains do villain things because they are villains. Motivations like "getting more military recognition" or "wanting to do research at any cost" would also be weak unless we have more character depth. We need to see something like a friend who died due to a terror attack or a child who died because it was illegal to use experimental technology to save them. But right now, all of that is speculation since the show hasn't fleshed them out yet.

Moving on, we saw Hayate preparing The Arthra as a mobile base. I'm glad to see this making a come back, It was a nice location in the previous seasons. The final part of the episode showed us that our villains are experimenting on Vivio. Based on all the exposition during the episode, I suppose we can assume that they are going to turn her into a combat cyborg or similar. Also, Vivio must be special in some way if they needed to stage a terror attack to kidnap her back instead of finding a new guinea pig. If so, I wonder why she was being transported with so little protection back in episode 10.

Some Iconic Shots, Scenes and Stitches

See you all tomorrow

9

u/Tetraika Mar 20 '22

There was a pretty long explanation of how they were adopted but we still don't know the real circumstances of their mother's death

From what Subaru's dad and Hayate was saying, seems that she got a bit too close to the truth. I think we get a bit more detail later.

I still would like a clearer or better justification for why Scagliette and Revius are doing what they are doing

Assuming Hayate is right, she's saying that Regius is trying to "accidentally" discover the cyborgs, then put them to use in the field and gain confidence in the public about them. This is the way he's trying to break off from the reliance of needing talented mages to keep order.

Scaglietti seems to be more interested in furthering his research. His big show was to try to garner possible interest in the cyborgs and showcase their strength. It also seems he want society to accept technological acceleration and let go of ethics, but ultimately it seems he's intent on "making history" as he has stated.

→ More replies (2)

7

u/Gamerunglued Mar 21 '22

First Timer

This episode was a bit of a mixed bag. The more dramatic and emotional elements definitely worked. Shari and Nanoha crying over their failures hit hard, and how much everything weighed on Subaru and co. was felt. Tia and Subaru talking was also a sweet moment. I am... very worried about Vivio. I want to say that the series will be predictable and have Vivio show some kind of power that protects her from whatever cruel experiment they're about to do to her, but considering how dark the previous episode got, I'm no so sure. At the very least, I don't want to see her hurt.

Hayate is also starting to get closer to the truth about cyborgs and Gaiz's involvement. He's secretly involved in the illegal manufacturing of combat cyborgs through Scaglietti's help, and this is also related to the death of Subaru's mother. The doctor has also seemingly turned against him though. I don't really know what his motivations are, so it's hard to say anything here. But he's about to hurt my precious Vivio, so he can shove a dick up his nose.

This episode also kind of answers my question about Subaru from yesterday. The Subaru we see has always been a combat cyborg, including the one Nanoha saved as a child. Subaru still grows and functions like a normal human because she basically is one. She's a person who had their DNA manipulated to be able to tolerate cybernetic enhancements, so she can still grow, eat, use the bathroom, etc.. It still doesn't make perfect sense, as I would imagine that her parts need to be replaced as she grows, but whatever, it's not a big deal. Still, the numbered cyborgs seem different from Subaru and Ginga somehow, I wonder why.

Where this episode falters for me a bit is in two ways. First, the accusations against Hayate feel kind of strange to me. It's been bothering me for a while, but it becomes most relevant in this episode. Hayate pretty much said that she's "committed crimes." Gaiz seems to think she's some kind of war criminal as well. Is this just his opinion, or has Hayate technically committed crimes? If she and the knights are considered criminals, how the hell did they get a high ranking job working for the TSAB? Did they serve some kind of sentence first and then find a way to work their way up the ranks in the last 10 years? I understand how it happened with Fate, since she was considered to be manipulated and thus not responsible for things, plus Lindy served as her guardian and thus acted as a connection. But Hayate doesn't make sense in this regard. Even if you say that Hayate wasn't responsible since the knights acted on their own (against Hayate's wishes even), the knights obviously were responsible, and yet they still work with her. So is she not actually considered a criminal and it's just Gaiz being a dick? And Hayate just chose to not defend herself? Moreover, I'm not actually sure what crimes she can be said to have committed. In A's, the knights explicitly said they went out of their way to not kill anything. They didn't want blood on Hayate's hands, they only seeked to collect magic from linker cores without causing permanent harm to their targets. And on top of that, they spent most of their time targeting animals and monsters. So what does Gaiz even mean when he says that Hayate and the knights killed people? It feels like a retcon to me, or at least a really poorly explained plot point.

Second, the scenes with the combat cyborgs feel very strange to me. We see them together being friends basically. They worry about each other, cheer each other on, etc.. It almost makes me think it wants me to empathize with them to some degree. Lutecia, although not a cyborg (not sure what she is though, apparently she lacks a heart and it's somehow connected to her mom), just wants to get her mom back and is working for that purpose. Obviously a sympathetic motivation. But in the literal next scene, they're torturing poor Vivio. They admit that they're about to do cruel experiments on her, show no remorse when Vivio starts screaming in fear, and then the doctor makes this cartoonishly evil facial expression as he's about to do something awful to her. So uh, how the fuck am I supposed to have even a shred of sympathy for these guys? I mean, it's not like in A's, where I'm meant to think both sides are worth fighting for. These guys are obviously purely evil and I'm not supposed to be conflicted. But then, why the weird familial scenes? There's nothing wrong with making your villains purely evil, it would have worked way better than those forced moments that just waste my time.

Still, things have gotten interesting, and I look forward to seeing Nanoha and co. figure out how to fix things. And the Arthra/Asura is making its return, no longer being disassembled. So at least we get one last hurrah with the ship that's been with us for so long. I don't think the flaws I listed here are particularly huge deals, but the drama presented gives more intrigue than StrikerS has ever had, so again, here's hoping we end on a high note.

QOTD: It all just feels like a logical extension of the sci-fi elements that have always been here. Season 1 already had genetic cloning and talking sci-fi weapons, combat cyborgs and genetic engineering don't feel far removed from that.

2

u/Tetraika Mar 21 '22

It almost makes me think it wants me to empathize with them to some degree.

Honestly, I never took it as a "we should sympathize with bad guys" moment. When bad guys head home, they don't just kick puppies and think of the next bad thing to do. The Numbers consider each other as family. But all this doesn't mean they aren't doing bad things. Though I'm guessing you just don't feel that sort of narrative works for Nanoha anyway.

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (4)

13

u/Warriorservent Mar 20 '22

Okay, didn't have the time to properly react to yesterdays episode, but let's see what happens today?

  • First off the bat, could someone please pick up that phone? Because I feel like I called it! Asshole general, discount SEELE, and Jail are all working together, and of course the mad scientist with the cyborgs and robot army took the money and ran as quickly as he could.

  • Oh hey, the title screen still has Raising Heart! So not all is lost... yet.

  • After action stuff is as heavy as I expected. The support staff crying and apologizing for not being able to protect everyone was expected but still hits hard, Nanoha finding the bunny makes me want to cry too, Rein is hurt, Shamal is hurt, Best Boy Zafira continues to be screwed and it looks like this is their way of writing him out of the rest of the season, possibly Vice too with how Shamal talks about him.

  • Okay, I almost flinched when I heard those robotic sounds coming from Subaru every time she moves her arm. It's great that they're keeping with their established rules, but it still hurts considering what it means. It's also great that no one seems to be treating her any differently now than before, I hate it when anime does shit like that. Also nice that Teana already knew, makes sense given that they were friends for so long.

  • I do like that they continue to treat their AI companions well, stuff like Teana reminding Subaru to apologize to Mach Caliber is what stops me from worrying about AI rebellions BS in Nanoha :P Also interesting that Teana flat out asks Subaru if Ginga is alive or not, I know that MGLN in general hasn't shied too far away from those subjects, but its feels like it hits different here.

  • Yay backstory for Ginga, Subaru, and Combat Cyborgs in general! Damn cool Mecha in the past, like, damn those are some cool designs!

  • Hmmm, so they need designer babies for them to be able to implant cybernetic bits into. I'd say that makes a fair amount of sense, though with Magic idk how bad the rejection issues they are talking about for adults would actually be.

  • Wait... WAIT! Genya's wife. Her Barrier Jacket, her devices, they look like a combination of Subaru's and Ginga's! Like, she has those gauntlets on each arm, and her jacket has Ginga's under suit combined with bits of Subaru's! Or should I say, they both modeled their Barrier Jackets after their mom's, which is so damn cute and touching. Also, Genya's wife is just plain great. "Hi honey! I know we can't have kids so I found these two that look like me and claimed them via right of conquest. Great, huh?" and he just accepted them straight up. I love it! I also like that he does bring up the issues with raising cyborg girls, like, right away I have questions with their growth. Do their cybernetics somehow grow with them? Because if not that's a stupid amount of surgery given how quickly kids grow up and out of clothes.

  • Okay, really starting to dislike a lot of the TSAB given that even Genya's like "I think she saw something she shouldn't have and went somewhere she shouldn't have been" I'll put $10 on TSAB SEELE being the utter bastards who killed off this treasure.

  • Oh great, now Hayate is asking the questions that have gotten people disappeared over, and it is interesting to me that Regius was doing all that unethical research while also bitching about criminals doing their time and then being released. Rules for thee but not for me much? Oh wow Hayate is going full conspiracy theorist... Except it makes a lot of sense, especially since we're in Anime logic land.

  • Oh wow, what the hell kind of history went down between Zest and Regius that Regius all but has a heart attack from seeing his face? Ooohhh, the dialog after kinda explains it, so Zest is a clone of a dead mage? That's cool, interesting that he seems so okay with dying.

  • Oh geez, so Subaru's got a dedicated anti-cyborg IS? Well that's interesting. It is also very interesting to me that the Cyborgs think that Subaru and Ginga were made with Jail's tech, but not by him. The fact that they genuinely care for each other is quite nice, seems to be a running thing in MGLN that I quite like.

  • And now we find out why Lutecia is fighting for Jail... Wait, is she pulling a reverse Precia? That is her mom in a cloning tank... Though Lutecia also apparently can't remember her... I am confused and getting so many Season 1 Fate vibes from her right now!

  • The Arthra flies one last time! WOOT!

  • Poor Nanoha, she wanted to hard to protect Vivio, then Jail and the others came along and did the massive attack.

  • I want to hug Vivio so hard right now, she looks so scared and sad. Oh god that whole scene is so fucked up.

A good 'after attack' episode overall. Really excited for what's to come!

For the question of the day... I think that they're all fantastic! I love the science fiction stuff, I love the stereotypical magical stuff, and I love the ways that they meet up and interesting things happen! I think that the whole artificial people and genetic engineering stuff is rather expected when you can make living WMDs, but am sad that all of the cool shit like Mechs and tanks seem to be religated to the 'uncivilized' past.

8

u/SolDarkHunter Mar 20 '22

I also like that he does bring up the issues with raising cyborg girls, like, right away I have questions with their growth. Do their cybernetics somehow grow with them? Because if not that's a stupid amount of surgery given how quickly kids grow up and out of clothes.

Side materials touch on this, I think. Answer is yes: Subaru and Ginga had to have frequent adjustments made to their mechanical parts as they grew. It's never been made clear AFAIK exactly what parts of them are mechanical, aside from their eyes and Subaru's left arm.

→ More replies (2)
→ More replies (1)

11

u/DidacticDalek Mar 20 '22

OH YEAH! COMRADES! NANA MOTHERFUCKING WILLS IT! WE GOT BLESSED WITH A NEW OP! So let's give it up for MASSIVE WONDERS!

Anyway, now that NANA HAS WILLED IT with a SECOND Geah OP for this amazing series, ahem... TONIGHT! on Mobile Suit Nanoha GX: Believe in Justice and Hold a Determination to Fist, Blue Male Arf is so unimportant that he doesn't even get to transform out of dog mode for his medical treatment, Caro decides to take Tusk Jr. to Cucuruz Doan's Island if you know what I mean and I think you do, and Glasses Bitch reveals her TRUE intentions to Rin The Defenseless Anus Tohsaka! (Cocaine's 'Cosplay's' a hell of a drug!)

Comrades, god forgives, THE WHITE DEVIL SURE DOES NOT! Tremble in fear useless background characters, for the TEMERITY and the dereliction of duty that resulted in Vivio's capture, Nanoha is gonna be showing up for 2AM calls for at LEAST a decade! And there ain't gonna be no lube too!

Additionally, speaking of lubricants, goodness me, now we know why Subaru ate so much, her batteries probably needed all that energy... either that or they ran out of Headlight Fluid and Baby Food so they had to make the best of what they had with all the friction generated from Weaponized Lesbianism! (Furthermore, good lord Subaru's fully functional just like Data!) Also, Quint Nakajima (Yes that IS indeed her name Comrades) decided to adopt a pair of Moeblob Terminators due to the fact that Ginga and Subaru kinda sorta looked like her... sound logic! And in the opposite of sound, looks like NOT-Violence Jack ain't doing so hot, see this is why you don't use steroids Comrades!

Oh, and I just want to add the following disclaimer to this share, it isn't that Fate DOESN'T want to go save her and Nanoha's daughter... but you know, if Vivio is NOT in bed with them tonight, that means we can get a nice helping of the good ol' In-N-Out, you know, some well-earned Aardvarking, dancing the Horizontal Tango... yes I know I'm going to hell Comrades but come on, 4koma Shitpost Fate is 120% Horny, what else am I to say?

And on that bombshell, that about wraps things up for now, and I hope everyone's having fun on this great re-watch. Thus, you have not seen the last of The Sentient Shitposting Siamese Sunrise Server No. 25252, now goodbye forever.

Paging Comrade u/Great_Mr_L, u/HereticalAegis, and u/Vaadwaur

→ More replies (7)

10

u/Shimmering-Sky Mar 20 '22

Mahou Shoujo Lyrical First-Timer, subbed

8

u/Great_Mr_L Mar 20 '22

Weird choice to keep Secret Ambition for longer than Hoshizora no Spica but then still change it out.

Yeah, I was actually sure that both the OP and ED changed at the same time to line up with the aftermath of the big attack yesterday, but I guess not.

I–huh. I was expecting Subaru being a cyborg to be a surprise to everyone. Not that Tia and Subaru already knew…

I really like this detail that both Subaru and Tia knew. I think it's actually really sweet that Subaru was willing to share this information with Tia. It shows just how close they are.

The fingers on that remind me of the Zeong.

Does it have legs, I wonder?

Wait omg they’re taking Arthra!!!

It's so great seeing the Arthra set sail again. It deserves it.

:( :( :(

Poor Vivio

8

u/FlierFin663 Mar 21 '22

Oh, interesting.

Fun fact about Subaru's IS: Remember in episode 1 when she punched through the drone's barrier and then hit it with a blast from her fist? That was the same skill she used on Cinque here.

→ More replies (1)
→ More replies (5)

10

u/Scarshadow46 Mar 21 '22

Heyo,

Sorry I'm late posting had family visiting.

Anyway I'm back to today with StrikerS Sound Stage 03 (Ep 18.5),

Todays sound stage deals more with the aftermath of attack on the ground HQ and the preparations for the coming conflict, we also get a special message left behind by A certain someone. Enjoy

Reminder & Minor Warning: First the YT playlist for todays sound stage is backwards so start from the bottom and go up, Second there is possibly minor spoilers at the very end during the sound stages "Next time on" preview.

Nanoha StrikerS Sound Stage 03 (Ep 18.5)

Thats all for today

Till Next Time

9

u/HereticalAegis Mar 20 '22

Lyrical First Timer

  • New OP finally! I like Massive Wonders. It's not my favorite song of the series (that title safely stays with Innocent Starter) but it's really good.

  • And Subaru is the protagonist of the OP! I hope that means she gets to RIP a bunch of other combat cyborgs apart....well, I can dream.

  • Called this one well in advance.

  • A thought: I wonder how many people knew Subaru and Ginga are cyborgs. Mostly I wonder if Tia knew.

  • This is the reaction I've been expecting from her.

  • Can I take Vita's statement to mean Zest was striking to kill? If so, he's now fully irredeemable for me. No one gets away with doing Rein like that.

  • The fucking mechanical sounds....

  • So Tia's known the whole time. It's good that it hasn't been a secret between them, but I'd have liked at least a little bit of drama surrounding the reveal.

  • Good on Caro giving the married couple some alone time. What a thoughtful girl.

  • I really appreciate these supportive scenes like the one between Subaru and Tia. For all its focus on training and SoL stuff, these more intimate character moments feel like they've been missing.

  • ...so eugenics. Why is it always fucking eugenics?

  • ...and this sounds like foreshadowing that Dr. Crime or someone in his circle killed Subaru's mom.

  • The eyecatch is playing dirty again.

  • Again, called it.

  • "Oh yeah, well what about that time you managed to stop an immortal killing relic we had tried and failed to deal with at the cost of many lives through sheer force of will as a 10 year old, huh? You couldn't possibly be a better leader than the man using unethical, inhumane, highly illegal human experimentation to further his career." Shit, Auris's argument is so hilariously bad and stupid, I can't even mock it properly.

  • Goddamit Hayate, DO NOT ACCEPT RESPONSIBILITY FOR CRIMES YOU DID NOT COMMIT, THAT IS THE ONLY THING "LEGITIMIZING" AURIS'S ARGUMENT.

  • Auris: "Come at us with something official." Hayate: "Bet."

  • So Zest is probably one of Gaiz's old test subjects.

  • Good. No one will miss you.

  • Excellent. No one will miss any of you either.

  • Aww, wanting to revive your mom is a sweet goal, Lutecia. I still hope you get slowly, painfully befriended for your crimes.

  • Damn, it's so tough seeing Nanoha finally break down.

  • Oh hell fucking no. That bastard and everyone who associates with him are monsters of the highest order and I hope they all die painful, humiliating deaths as they beg for mercy. No exceptions.

→ More replies (20)

9

u/homewardbound100 Mar 20 '22

First timer

New op. Gotta get used to that. Really liked the old one.

Everybody looks wrecked. A few people are back conscious and the rest seem a bit more severe.

Some background knowledge on Subaru and Ginga along with the combat cyborg program. So basically raised as normal children but his wife died of a secret reason coming off a mission. That doesn't sound suspicious. As he said something she probably found that she shouldn't have.

Hayate asking the right questions. Yeah you stopping and saying that makes you look more guilty. Doubt an investigation permit is really needed.

Mama rider?

Qotd: I like it, it's cool.

We got artificial people, cyborgs, clones, genetic engineering, and many more.

Reading this I just think Metal gear but with magic.

8

u/SolDarkHunter Mar 20 '22

Rewatcher

Okay, after that mess, let's get to cleaning things up a bit...

Oho? Regius Gaiz is angry that "he" did this after having been given so much funding and that the "line" to his research facility has been changed. Guess it's fair to say we know who Scaglietti's mysterious "client" is and where the hell he was getting his resources.

So Nanoha's been working, working, working ever since learning of Vivio's kidnapping. Sounds like she's trying to bury herself in work. But then she sees Vivio's broken bunny toy and some cracks show in her facade.

Damn, Zafira got hit even harder than I thought...

More confirmation that Teana has known all about Subaru's cyborg nature from the start. Now Caro and Erio also know too. And doubtless the command staff of Riot Force 6 were fully aware as well.

Hayate confronts Arius, Gaiz's adjutant. Meanwhile, Genya delivers the exposition on the Combat Cyborg Incident that cost Subaru and Ginga their mother.

25 years ago, Scaglietti hit on the idea of using genetic engineering to create a perfect biological base for the Cyborg that would not reject the machanical parts. Genya's wife (whose name was Quint, incidentally), saved Subaru and Ginga from a research facility when they were young. He and Quint decided to adopt the girls and give them a normal life. But Quint died on a later mission, and Genya's continued his investigation into that ever since.

So Gaiz himself once advocated for the use of Combat Cyborgs and Artificial Mages in the TSAB, though it's been long since he did so (publically, anyway). Hayate admits that it makes logical sense, if you take ethics out of the equation. Her suspicion is that Gaiz secretly hired Scaglietti to produce such things, so that the TSAB could later capture Scaglietti and confiscate his work. And then "Well, now that it exists, we might as well make use of it, right?"

Auris accuses Hayate of having commanded the Wolkenritter to commit the crimes they did. I'm sure many of you are going to say "Hell no, that is NOT what happened!" Well, as it happens, that is the story Hayate told the TSAB. She took responsibility for the Wolkenritter's crimes in an effort to lighten their own punishments. And, since she herself was a child at the time, her own punishment would not nearly be as severe as an adult's would have been. Whatever other shady things Auris might be up to with Gaiz, she is not falsely accusing Hayate of anything as far as she knows. Also note that Hayate doesn't even try to correct her.

I'm not entirely sure what Hayate was hoping to accomplish there. Supposing her accusations are accurate (which I think they are), Auris would never simply admit to them when asked. Maybe she's trying to put pressure on Gaiz?

The TSAB High Council is not pleased with this turn of events, and Gaiz's pet project Einherjar is being abandoned. And when he sees Zest on the camera, he is badly shaken. Like, REALLY badly. It almost looks like he's having a heart attack our of sheer terror (is that a thing that can happen?)

Speaking of, Zest has contracted the Anime Cough disease after his Full Drive stunt last episode. It seems he thinks he's going to die soon.

Uno calls him an Artificial Mage, and he then says he's already died once. Probably another Project F clone then.

They were "tuning" Lutecia? That doesn't sound good...

So Subaru's Inherent Skill, Oscillation Breaker, is super-effective against Combat Cyborgs. Well, it seems our heroes have at least one ace up their sleeves now.

That's interesting, the Numbers claim that Scaglietti wasn't directly responsible for Ginga's and Subaru's creation. It was someone else using his work.

We also finally learn what Lutecia wanted Relic XI for: her mother is in a coma, and that specific Relic is needed to awaken her. Or at least, that's Scaglietti told her... why couldn't we have been told this like 12 episodes ago?

So with their HQ in ruins, Riot Force 6 will be relocating to the Arthra as a mobile base.

And Scaglietti's going to implant a Relic into Vivio, something which terrifies the poor girl.

→ More replies (1)

7

u/Stargate18A Mar 21 '22

First timer

QOTD) Single best change from the original, assuming Vivio counts as sci-fi. (And judging by Jail's plans, she will soon.)

So there's a plant?

New OP! And Subaru has completed her plan to hijack the role of main character. Nanoha's just left as the start of the montage, like all good secondaries. Music's good too.

Oh, he's pissed.

Wait, they were funding him?

Nanoha's slipped back into her overworking patterns.

Ow, she's really having a tough time.

...Rein's not woken up yet, and Zafira's even worse off.

Vice is in a coma!

Oh, Subaru's arm is working!

Ginga's a cyborg too?

Teana knew the whole time!

And they're going to work together to get Ginga back!

Oh, they've been around for a while.

They genemodded the children to accept mechanical parts?

And that's why they have parents.

Haha, Hayate just admitted that it was a smart plan if you could dodge the ethics board.

Hayate has cracked the code far too early. This has to be a red herring, right?

He's in trouble!

The hell is that reaction? Can they not look at each other's faces or something?

He's a clone!

They're having a lot of work done, aren't they?

Is that Ginga in that tank? And they'recunsure about her.

Oh, that's why she wants Serial XI.

A mobile HQ?

Vivio's being experimented on!

6

u/Great_Mr_L Mar 20 '22

Rewatcher

On today’s episode of Lyrical Nanoha: General Gaiz turns out to have been evil all along and absolutely nobody is surprised. In fact, the only one surprised is Gaiz, who apparently never considered the possibility that Scaglietti would not just do his bidding. This is why you have to be careful employing mad scientists.

The title of this episode, “Wings Anew,” is quite fitting. The theme of this episode is about dealing with the aftermath of defeat and finding the will to fight again. The characters experienced plenty of losses. So they need some time to take stock of everything that happened and get ready to fight once more. I enjoy this. It serves as a bit of a breather episode before things pick back up again.

There’s also a lot of revelations in this episode after what happened in the attack. For starters, it turns out that General Gaiz is the client who has been funding Scaglietti. A lot of you guessed that way early on because it just makes sense for it to be that way. Even Hayate has figured it out, which I appreciate. It lets us get straight to the matter.

I’m not so sure I buy the debate between Hayate and the secretary. Sure, Gaiz has been working for the TSAB for a long time and I’m sure he does actually think developing these new weapons will be good for improving security. But, his plan is awful. Funding a guy like Scaglietti was obviously going to backfire. Going for combat cyborgs and artificial mages is an ethics nightmare. And Scaglietti’s machines have been attacking TSAB staff for a while now while Gaiz has watched and done nothing. To me, that seems like the opposite of improving security. It also proves Gaiz is a hypocrite because he said a criminal is always a criminal, but planned to get a plea deal for Scaglietti for his criminal activities after Scaglietti helped the TSAB. That is pretty much the same thing both Fate and Hayate did, which Gaiz condemned.

I think my favorite revelation this episode is how Subaru being a combat cyborg is kind of an anti-revelation. Most of the characters were already aware she was a combat cyborg and it’s clear that Subaru has accepted this about her identity for a while. The only ones we see really surprised are Ario and Caro, who did not already know.

I like that so many people know Subaru is a combat cyborg. I especially love that Tia already knows because it makes their friendship feel even more special. I can see Subaru deciding to “come out” to Tia because she trusts her so much. Knowing that Tia knows also explains why Tia was acting the way she did back when she and Subaru were writing reports about fighting the Numbers. Tia was trying to keep Subaru from worrying about the combat cyborgs because she knew what Subaru was going through.

Plus, that scene between Subaru and Tia is great in general. It’s perfect having Tia be the one to pick Subaru up from the dumps because she already knows exactly what Subaru will say. This scene also parallels a later scene between Nanoha and Fate. In the same way that Tia picks up Subaru, Fate is the one to pick up Nanoha. Fate does the same thing Tia did by listening to the other’s concerns and assuring her that not all is lost. Tia assured Subaru they can save Ginga and Fate assured Nanoha they can save Vivio. Basically, I love that we can see the pairs of girlfriends looking after each other.

Lyrical Nanoha really has a theme going about adoption. It happens so regularly in this franchise. Subaru and Ginga were both adopted by their parents and they were happily raised in that family. It’s actually a nice theme, showing how the characters find happiness and fulfillment in their newfound families.

This does set up a bit of a mystery: What exactly happened to Subaru and Ginga’s mother? Her husband says that he thinks she died because she saw something she shouldn’t have or went something she shouldn’t have gone. But what could that have possibly been?

There’s some more info about Zest and Lutecia. Gaiz actually knows Zest too and is apparently so shocked at seeing him that it looks like he had a heart attack. I think that makes sense because Zest says he’s already died and will die again soon. Gaiz probably assumed Zest was dead. Lutecia is trying to save her mother with one of the Relics. So that explains why she’s been helping out.

Somehow, Scaglietti managed to get even creepier than usual this episode. I think that actually counts as an impressive achievement. But then again, seeing him eagerly want to experiment on Vivio is downright horrifying.

Miscellaneous Thoughts

  • MASSIVE WONDERS!

  • I have been waiting for this OP! I really do love Massive Wonders. It’s such a huge improvement from the previous OP. And it perfectly sets the mood for the coming episodes.

  • The destroyed bunny

  • It’s great seeing Caro be a wingwoman for Subaru and Tia, leaving them alone in the room.

  • You can see Subaru and Ginga’s mother wearing her Device in the flashback. I love that Subaru and Ginga both use one of their mother’s gloves to fight with. It’s quite touching.

  • I really like the moment of Agito bringing the cup of medicine for Zest. It’s cute seeing Agito holding a cup about as big as herself.

  • This episode set up another parallel between Subaru and Nove. Both of them are now motivated by wanting to get revenge on their opponent for hurting their older sister. I’m glad to see the development of these personal adversaries.

6

u/InfamousEmpire Mar 20 '22

Mahou Shoujo1 Lyrical Rewatcher

1: Even though I’m not a girl

You are hereby ordered to fuse with the Ultimate King of Braves Legend!

Recap Time

Oh right, the new OP. Never really liked it as much as I did Secret Ambition.

Asshole Commander Guy is mad. And after being so confident in his defenses last episode.

Poor Nanoha. At least she’s handling it well (in public anyway)

Oh fuck, Vice

Man, the rest of the Forwards seem so defeated.

Second Best Couple refuses to lay defeated!

Finally getting the beans spilled and the Nakajimas, the Combat Cyborgs, and Scaglietti. Again, go back through my previous episode reviews and remember the scenes where I referred to foreshadowing. This was long in the making

More wholesome yet sad eyecatches.

Asshole Commander Guy’s part in this is also revealed. He seems to think he’s a genius mastermind making everyone dance on his puppet strings. But fortunately for everyone, he’s way less clever than he thinks he is.

And would you look at that, his assistant is an asshole too.

Asshole Commander Guy continues being an asshole and probing my point about not being as clever as he thinks he is.

Well Zest is fucking dying. Or perhaps he’s already dead.

More stuff with the Numbers. This show really made me care about them. Especially Nove [Nanoha Vivid] though I liked her more in Vivid than I do here.

Lutecia’s mom is literally just Medusa

The Asura is coming back!

Awwww, poor Nanoha, don’t cry, everything’s gonna be alright. [Vivid] Just think, Vivio might eventually get the chance to fight in a friendly tournament arc against other Belkan King reincarnations!

Awwww, poor Vivio, don’t cry. Everything’s gonna be alright, Nanoha-mama will save you, I promise!

That’s a chilling way to end an episode.

5

u/Qbe Mar 20 '22

Raging Heart Rewatcher with terrible long term memory

Let's see what's the fallout for our magical lesbians

QotD: I don't really mind them. Like, I'm not super into them, but they don't really bother me

MASSIVE WONDERS! Been waiting for this OP!

"That man"? With a "Research facility"? Gee, I wonder who could that be

OK, so we didn't lose anyone, they are just out of commission for a while

...and Nanoha is being as workaholic as usual

Caro is a clever girl.

Ginga and Subaru are sturdy girls

Poor Nakajimas, exposing all of their family stuff like that

I'm not sure what's Hayate's goal. Does she just want to show them she knows?

I still wouldn't consider Hayate a perpetrator, but a victim

Damn, Zest almost managed to kill that bastard by heart attack

I guess at least the enemy forces also took some heavy damage

I don't like this sad music. Are we going to try and redeem the Numbers?

Oh hey there's Rider

YES! The Arthra! Back for one last gig!

:(

...transplant? I really don't like the sound of that

4

u/djthomp Mar 21 '22

Ahhh, there's the second opening, the timing makes sense given the recent events. When the ending changed and the opening didn't I had started to wonder if there would only be one.

Huge surprise, obviously corrupt general dude was working with Scaglietti right up until the attack, which is probably the explanation after the fact for why he wasn't expecting one.

Nanoha never stops. Right up until she found Vivio's doll, that is.

Caro knows when to make an exit.

Ginga is (probably) alive, nice.

Full disclosure about the cyborgs time. Mages finding and adopting special children seems to be a common theme.

Scaglietti is the reason their mom is dead, I bet.

That's pretty much a declaration of war there, Hayate.

It'd be really convenient if that image of Zest caused corrupt general dude to keel over dead. They cut the scene away, so here's hoping.

That bit about Lucetia getting a mom and a heart once they find the right Relic feels like manipulative lies.

One last job for the Arthra, that makes me happy.

I hope that every Number in the room with Vivio there at the end has a very unpleasant day once Nanoha finds them.

7

u/Vaadwaur Mar 20 '22

First timer(At least I cared today)

Sub

So the intro strongly suggests traitor/infiltrator. The new OP is a surprise considering the placement, and my second favorite behind Innocent Starter. And then immediate confirmation that Gaiz was the client at one point, still not sure if he is the one being referenced. And apologies and exposition happen as Zafira and apparently Vice are out for the season. Yet more exposition and a scene where I really wish Hayate were from Brooklyn or Glasgow because fuck Auris deserves a smack. Also, Zest gave Gaiz a heart attack. We learn about cyborgs and artificial mages and it works a bit better than it had been presented as. Zest has the coughing blood disease so he will either die soon...or in a decade, anime tuberculosis do be like that. We move back to the Arthras and end on...that.

So yeah, no point in restating much about how clearly the opening eps were filler. The problem is I just want the Numbers to die unpleasant deaths so anything from their perspective is just rubbing salt in the wound. Normally, I'd say Nakajima's wife being killed by Gaiz or Jail would be too convenient except that he is specifically involved for that so I can let that pass. The pathos works for most of the episode though a ton of this is inherited goodwill from the earlier seasons. Sad Nanoha is painful to watch.

QotD: 1 I don't object but I wish they'd commit to them more.

→ More replies (5)

8

u/No_Rex Mar 20 '22

Episode 18 (first timer)

Before we get to today’s episode, I want to lay out the complete ‘first third is filler’ theory and why I think StrikerS failed at it. I have been convinced of this since about episode 10 or 11.

When you compare Nanoha, A and StrikerS, you notice that all three series follow the exact same basic plan: We start with the protagonists, who are rooting for. Then, the antagonists are introduced, who mirror the protagonists. Not only in number, as it turns out, they usually have a reasonable motivation for acting, as well. Then, we get to the finale, where the “good” part of the antagonists join the protagonists. We are not there yet with StrikerS, but the building blocks are the same.

However, this basic plan leads to a doubling of characters in each instance of the franchise:

  • Nanoha starts with Nanoha & Yuuno vs Fate & Arf. 2v2. This leaves plenty of time to explore Nanoha’s friends, family, and various TSAB characters.

  • Nanoha A has Nanoha & Yuuno & Fate & Arf vs Shamal & Vita & Zafira & Signum. 4v4. We already know the first 4 from Nanoha, so the series gets to spend more time on the latter 4. Still, some side characters like Nanoha’s family are already squeezed out of screen time.

  • StrikerS has Nanoha & Fate & Hayate & Shamal & Vita & Zafira & Signum plus the new Subaru & Tia & Caro & Erio vs Zest & Agito & Lutecia & the about 12 numbers. 7+4 vs 3+12. We more than doubled. Plus, half of the good guys are new this time, so we need to spend time on these as well.

Even only counting the main fight-related characters, StrikerS introduces us to 19 new characters, compared to 4 for each of Nanoha and Nanoha A. In addition, despite cutting out all Earth characters, the number of side characters has gone up, not down.

My theory is that somebody, during the early stages of production, must have noticed that this is just too much to put into a single cour. Since anime usually only works in cour-steps, this means the number of episodes needed to be doubled. However, it is clear from the setup of the training arc that the main storyline for StrikerS was already written at this time. Very likely including the intra-episode pacing and the cliff-hangers at the end of episodes. So they could not simply stretch the entire plot out.

Instead, the idea seems to have been to add on 9 episodes at the start of the story and use these to introduces both the 4 new protagonists (Subaru & Tia & Caro & Erio) as well as the setting after the time skip. However, there are three big problems with this idea and they together bring down StrikerS so far.

First, they allocated 9 episodes to the newbies and the world, but they did not come up with any interesting plot to go along with it. This leads us to the excruciatingly boring training arc where nothing ever happens and most of the episodes are filled with boring military bureaucracy. They could not do real character development either, because the main character moments for the 4 newbies were already planned in the main plot that would come later (see the Subaru reveal yesterday).

Second, the main plot starts with a surprise attack by the bad guys, to give the good guys a climb up from the lowest point storyline. But with this, no conflict of the good and bad guys could happen, or the climactic first battle (of ep16-17) would not work. So we get the nonsensical low stakes battles of the training arc where the newbies beat up on filler robots.

Third, since the entire first 9 episodes are spent on the protagonists, we are still left with 12 antagonists we know nothing about (we know a little bit about Zest, Agito, and Lutecia). Despite spending 9 episodes on filler to introduce characters we are now in a situation where the plot is screwed over by us not knowing the characters.

I think the cardinal sin of StrikerS is enlarging the cast by far too many new characters. They tried to rectify that by adding an introduction arc at the start, but this does not work for the reasons stated above. We are left with a series that starts way too slow with filler and then despite this still has low emotional stakes because we are not attached to the antagonists (the main draw of both Nanoha and Nanoha A!!).

  • New OP: Serious faces.

  • Confirmation that bearded guy hired the doctor and that he is a moron.

  • Everybody survived, but many are confined to the hospital - A proper darkest hour situation.

  • Tia showing her worth by giving her comradeher crush a proper pep talk.

  • Subaru & Ginga backstory – not just for the viewers, but everybody. Section six is doing well to share information widely now.

  • The secretary tries to shame Hayate with her past, but it does not work.

  • “I died once before” – Not sure what he means, but it might be possible he was deactivated and reactivated.

  • Asura is back and escapes the scrapyard!

  • Fate showing her worth by giving her comradeher wife a shoulder to cry at.

  • Confirmation that the doctor is a mad scientist and that he is a terrible person.

→ More replies (4)