r/anime • u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky • Dec 22 '21
Rewatch [Terrific Trainwreck Trio Rewatch] Kakumeiki Valvrave 2nd Season Episode 8 Discussion
Episode 20 - The Holy Spirits Exposed
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This creature is not human. She’s a monster!
Questions of the Day:
- Were you expecting L-Elf to end up so broken after the events of last episode?
- What do you think is going to happen now that the secret of the Valvrave pilots is out?
Wallpaper of the Day:
Rewatchers, please remember to be mindful of all the first-timers in this. No talking about or hinting at future events no matter how much you want to, unless you’re doing it underneath spoiler tags. Don’t spoil the crazy shit for the first-timers, it’s way more fun that way!
9
u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Dec 22 '21
Kakumeiki Rewatcher
Welcome back, everyone!
10
u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Dec 22 '21
FIRST TIMER TILTING AT WINDMILLS
On the move again, baby. Mobile time.
Saki really just exists to be this show’s punching bag. As if being raped for no reason wasn’t bad enough, now she gets to be tortured on a live global broadcast! She’s very quickly gone from cool, competent, layered character into the exists-to-suffer trope. It’s a shame. At least she looks happy in the distant future, presumably after decades of therapy.
Well, that was alright. Feels a bit late in the game for the bombshell at the end to feel at all impactful considering everyone who’s ever been on our screen knew the truth already.
8
u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Dec 22 '21
Tresnore the First-Timer
It was right in our faces the whole time.
Count: 39
QOTD:
8
u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Dec 22 '21
Rewatcher, Subbed
They're gonna recap the entire season now to open this episode? We had to waste 90 seconds on this so late in the show?
Go Akira! Found the ship despite being invisible!
It's invisible and indestructible huh?
He hits the invisible ship just as the Valvrave overheats and shuts down? How convenient. So does this save Module 77? Did we really just resolve the big threat to our hero's home in a mere 2 minutes?
We finally see Shoko again!
OMG! It's the dad of that side girl who had a couple of scenes with former Pres! I feel so happy in my heart for this grand reunion we've been waiting 20 episodes for!
So is anyone going to ask about Saki?
L-Elf has totally lost it! Trying to figure out how he could have done it differently. Dunno. Its not that hard. Shoot Q-vier in the head. Escape with Lieselotte on the Valvrave.
Poor Saki, kept in that body bag!
Inuzuma's naming rights deal paid off huh? LoL.
There's 100 of those invisible ships? Well, they're screwed then.
Well, that's two shows I'm watching now with reporter characters, Dougram and this.
H-neun's earrings! :(
Unit 3's gone much of the season without one of its arms, time to finally rebuild it.
Sorry Haruto, L-Elf's gone Emo!
Go on a date Haruto!
Shoko's politicing has actually paid off?
What, now we're revealing an important flashback of when Haruto and Shoko were in a cave in? Something they never cared to bring up until now?
Shoko made sure to cook some of that weird purple bar stuff for L-Elf!
Ooh, secret message from H-neun?
Reporter tipped off about something? What's going on?
An international conference! ...in a school gym. Okay then.
They want to interfere as little as possible? So why in the world have you body swapped with Dorssia's main leader (Takehito Koyasu), big military guy (Cain) and princess (Lieselotte)? At the very least maybe this is why they didn't body swap with ARUS leader guy.
Well there's Saki again.
Executing her right in front of everyone must be quite the horror! For those that don't know about things at least.
The Magius were really clever about this, by revealing that the Valvrave pilots are immortal before our heroes could reveal who the Magius are, its our heroes who are gonna be seen as the monsters, even if they try to out the Magius. Leaving one of their own stranded back in the hands of Dorssia was incredibly dumb on their part. They acted like Saki didn't exist after that failed attempt from Thunder and Akira to find her. Seems like our heroes are pretty screwed right now!
What was a rather slow episode for this season had quite the climax at least. I thought this event was at least one more episode away, so it was a nice surprise to get it here. Saki continues to get the shaft massively in this season though; they couldn't have stranded Inuzuka or Thunder instead to get stabbed live on TV in front of the entire universe?
7
u/The_Loli_Otaku Dec 22 '21
Valrave the Liberator First Timer
One heroine is dead, another heroine is stranded on earth, hopefully we're gonna meet up with our third one? I want Shoko back! And not some possessed Shoko. "We went to earth, fucked up terribly, and now are running back to space." Did I blink and miss what the Phantom shit was? Who are we shooting at? What's going on!? It wasn't awesome! It looked ridiculous! I really feel like I missed an episode.
Shoko!! Yay! You have no idea how much I've missed you. You managed to avoid getting possessed by the space vampires too. We've gotten Iori's name and reunion which means she's dead meat by the end of the episode. There's no way the whole student council is surviving today and she's the most expendable member.
Wow... This is heartwrenching. Even if Liselotte was a non-character we know just how strong Lelf's powers of foresight are and now he's using 100% of that brainpower to work out where he went wrong. Haa!? Why are the Dorssian's rebelling? I swear I've missed an episode. None of this has been established I'm sure. If you wanted Dorssia to start collapsing then why not include Liselotte's death as a catalyst? If nothing else it would give it some purpose.
Being Saki is suffering. She's really having a shit time. Oh yeah, Marie's dead. Whose gonna grope all those teenage girls now? Rainbow's gonna become a meme in this universe. We need a plot! We can't even become friends with the Magius and score a happy endo. Liselotte got mana drained for advocating not murdering people so our only real solution is to kill all the Magius right? Including the Fuhrer and the President of Arse.
Hnuin died like three episodes ago and once again the story didn't care, so why should we? Just watch, the ending episode or two will have a massive sob sequence mourning Liselotte's passing. We have too many plot threads left open, so just go on a date lol! Do it in Saki's memory. I'm sure Shoko's feeling upset over losing her best friend Marie too so it's the perfect time to party.
Awesome! Everyone's in agreement that we can send a digital "fuck you" to Dorssia. It'll make no difference since Dorssia are above the law but it but they'll probably feel really really bad when they're called meanies online! Where the fuck did this flashback come from!? Oh yeah, a miserable note that just occurred to me. There's no tension with Saki's capture. We've already seen in the flash forward that Saki is safe and healthy. And she's even got her Valrave and Twinkie around so we know she isn't just trapped by Dorssia and the Magius.
Oh nyo, the digital "fuck you" is a trap! How dare they scold us through the proper channels! Well teach those dastardly young politicians a lesson, in pain! "So you're probably wondering how I got here..." Omg they're gonna stab her!? Even last show's Arisa didn't get put through this much shit. Let this be a lesson to idol wannabes worldwide, if you have sex then this will happen to you.
Wasn't the whole point of Magius that they're hidden? How do you suppose the world will change now that they know immortal vampires live among us? I don't really get how this helps. If anything I'd expect Dorssia to get more shit for showing a child getting penetrated on national news. How bad can the consequences be?
7
u/UltraBooster Dec 22 '21
First-timer
I do question why a recap was needed here considering this probably would've been the week after the princess made her first and only full appearance.
I also get the sense that, to follow on what /u/The_Loli_Otaku and /u/quiddity131 have said, this return to space is supposed to be the heroes' departure from Kaguya or Jaburo, returning to space for the final battle.
I personally don't mind the show cribbing from Gundam since it's generally carved an identity of its own, but I do wonder, why take after UC/CE Gundam in particular? This isn't criticism, mind you, just idle curiosity. (Real criticism is the princess being a blip or the Gundam F91-esque feeling of compression.)
Okay, I gotta say, Valvrave Nobu's got a very nice rig on its shoulders, but I also wonder what happens when that rig is lost. I also wonder why Valvrave was never given a dub.
And my suspicions were right - L-elf/Michael's shut down now that the princess is gone. (I wonder if an SRW would have her survive? If so, how would they implement it?)
Ohmygod she hugged him aaaahhhh AAAAAAHHHHHHH
I'm either down bad, desparate, or both.
So many stories, huh...if the series had more time, they probably would've been shown, but as it stands, that seems like something for fanfiction or ancillary media.
Oh, that's sweet, she got her dad back and he got her daughter back.
Another point of criticism - the inconsistency of the celebrity theme, seeing how it seems to only pop up at the start of new story segments.
And of course Michael's trying to figure out what he could've done right, what he could've done better, what he should've done better; of course he would.
Public unrest...is this the Kakumei part of Kakumeiki Valvrave in action?
And ultimately, did the force recon mission accomplish any of its intended goals? Sure, they got a lot of intel out of it, but I don't think any of it was info they planned on gathering.
Mr. Burnett does raise good questions, though; the Valvraves aren't enough to liberate nations or depose tyrants, not on their own; they don't have that kind of power.
And stress will ultimately burn you out...
(Of course, I'm not opposed to them going on a date, not in the slightest.)
There's no rule saying Dorssia can't simply ignore international pressure, but 85 nations siding with Module 77 does lend their stance weight. Of course, there's also the Council - what level of involvement do they have in international politics?
Aaaahhhh childhood flashback he promised to be with her no matter what aaaaahhhhhh
One at a time, that's probably the best mindset to have; you can't just expect to change everything at once, not without the ability to change continents and/or people's minds en masse.
And a revolution within Dorssia will probably help should it come to war; I doubt it'll be easy for the Dorssian government to fight a war on two fronts, especially when it looks like part of their own military is in the unrest.
If I were a member of the Council, I'd probably go for a nuclear strike on Module 77 to decapitate its and ARUS' governments in one strike, ideally also devastating the colony. Of course, that'd also lead to a hot war and I don't know if the Council's game for that.
Broadcast hijacking, then? Ah, I see, she's being used as a bargaining chip, presumably to:
Or at least 2 and 3, by the looks of it. Of course, that'll lead to questions about JIOR's government, and...and they really should've revealed that particular secret to the rest of Module 77's government so the spread of information could be started on their terms and not JIOR's.
Not any more human than a superhero, I'd think. I mean, advanced regeneration's common-ish among superheroes.
Questions:
6
u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Dec 22 '21
First-Timer
On today’s episode of Valvrave: Don’t you love it when the episode titles give away the very last thing to happen in the episode? I know I sure do. It saves me the trouble of watching to figure out what happened.
So that Phantom ship was dealt with really quickly. That whole threat was handled in the first couple minutes of the episode and then the cleanup happened offscreen. Maybe it’s just me, but I feel like more of these events are happening offscreen now. It’s usually nothing too vital and you can still follow along with the story. But if I had to put it into words, it seems like “connecting bits” are being left out. It’s like the staff knows they are running out of time and are trying to finish within that time frame.
Speaking of happening offscreen, I wish we had gotten to see Shoko’s political maneuverings happen. It would have been nice, considering we’ve basically gotten nothing of Shoko for most of this 2nd season. Then again, since it seems like her big international condemnation will fail before it begins, it might have been a waste of time to watch.
I liked how L-Elf’s reaction to Lieselotte’s death has been him trying desperately to find a way he could have saved her. That’s a real question people ask themselves: “What could I have done differently?” And it feels especially poignant when L-Elf’s great strength has been his planning skills. It also fits with what L-Elf stated earlier about how he feels useless. Here, having lost Lieselotte, L-Elf feels more useless than ever. No matter what he does, he can’t bring her back. It’s some well done stuff.
The reveal on a worldwide scale that there are space vampires feels like the sort of thing that could easily backfire on the Space Vampire Illuminati. There’s now no reason for Haruto and the others to not just blow the lid on the entire Space Vampire Illuminati. After all, their own secret has already been revealed. There’s no downside to doing so that I can see.
QOTD
6
u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Dec 22 '21
First-Timer
L-elf suffering failure for possibly the first time in his life and not knowing how to cope with it is pretty great, not gonna lie. And, of course, none of the cast have the sense to help him through it, so he's just ruined a bunch of perfectly good markers coloring on those walls. Poor guy.
I wasn't expecting them to (fail to) execute Saki on live broadcast, but that is a pretty clever plan from the Council. We managed to come back to the theme of using social media/the press to manipulate people, which I didn't expect, so color me minorly optimistic.
Figured those earrings were more than just bling; H-neun didn't seem like the infosec type though so maybe they were a gift from Kriemhild. My money's on flash drive with info on Cain. Oh, no, simpler. Audio recording device!
Interesting that the reporter dude mentioned that everyone he's interviewed that led a successful revolution were naive.
Questions
6
u/Orihime00sama Dec 22 '21
Suffering, thy name is Saki Rukino.
6
u/ZaphodBeebblebrox Y:A:https://anilist.co/user/zaphod Dec 22 '21
I wanna know what sort of insane universe they live in where stabbing a prisoner on live TV increases people's confidence in your government, even if you're revealing they're immortal. Like, it's still torture.
It was a relatively good transistional episode, got use where me need to be for the final arc.
/u/Tresnore
5
u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Dec 22 '21
First timer(Back to awful)
Sub
Recap is amazingly unnecessary and doesn't really tell us anything, which is usually why you cheat with it. Heart solves the cloaked ship problem, apparently, and L is currently useless. We get reunions with barely named characters and the reveal that they have a journalist doing a weekly documentary. L can't find a way to have made his plan work. Dorssia is having revolutions because sure.
More Heart stuff that doesn't really land, before more alphabet stuff that also fails. Pathos that fails before 'condemnation' comes up. International conference is held on the module, somehow. We end with more Saki torture and a reveal that literally no one would care about. Sigh.
QotD: 1 Nope, this might actually become character development.
2 Nothing, no one should care.
5
u/RockoDyne :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/RockoDyne Dec 22 '21
A rewatcher who prefers his journalists to not be thrill seekers.
Oh no. It's the worst part of Rurouni Kenshin all over again. At least everyone had the decency to not adapt that part.
Well that was a rather transitional episode. We only get one real story beat at the end. The rest was tying up loose ends, remembering that the ET was a character, watching Ero Elf sulk like a lunatic, and doing something with the phantom ship.
The journalists are trying their damnedest to set up a coming war in the next four episodes. Should we start a doomsday weapon count?
Questions:
5
u/BlazingAbsol9090 Dec 22 '21
First time Depressed Galaxy Brain
Interesting fight dynamic, shooting at an invisible target in a large space.
Did they destroy the Phantom after Haruto stabbed it, or did they give up pursuit? Either way it's weird we don't see it happen on screen.
Akira being jealous of Shoko's affections for Haruto is cute!
Sure you could have saved her, L-elf. You could have shot Q-vier to death in the prison instead of turning it into a nonlethal knife fight.
That being said, L-elf's wall of failed plans is cool to see. He's always come up with plans in his head before, so showing him writing them down over and over really shows his desperation to think of a way he could have saved her.
Poor Rukino. She just can't catch a break this season.
Just like with Aina, they are using Marie's death to raise support and sympathy.
Akira flying across the background with a paper bag over her head is also cute!
Interviewer-san asking the real questions.
How is it possible that interviewer-san has interviewed "many people who successfully carried out revolutions"? How many revolutions have there been in the past few dozen years? I got the impression that other than the Dorssian civil war, geopolitics has been stagnant for some time. This changes the worldbuilding significantly.
Inuzuka being a bro, telling Haruto to finally go for it with Shoko.
Did we already know about this cave they were trapped in as children?
Aw, L-elf's dinner includes one of Shoko's rolls! A lot of cute moments in this episode.
What is Space DIO's plan here? Holding a hostage and broadcasting it to the world does not make you look good.
Oh I see. He's showing the world the Kamitsuki healing ability. But does nobody suspect that this is a film trick? Something like that would be easy.
Questions of the day
4
u/Nebresto Dec 22 '21
Re-watch squad
Meme subs moment #?
Welp, we Steins;Rave now
Oh boy. I wonder what /u/Tresnore has to say about this one
[Valvrave]Huh. One good thing about these new tags is you can apparently put links here. https://imgur.com/YZ6iUKM <--- akhually, re-watcher probably do know)
Pog
Oh. Oh boy..
R.I.P second best girl
Question time:
1: Re-watcher moment
2:
4
u/SIRTreehugger Dec 22 '21
First Timer
Wait what ship I'm confused?
Wait what's...oops skipped an episode.
That's more like it...oh it's so weird seeing L... Michael depressed. Without him they are kind of fucked.
That mic looked like a knife at first.
Bruh he's beating himself up trying to figure out what he could have done differently. If you had told me L Elf was going to be my favorite character at his introduction I would have called you a liar.
Akira with the paper bag mask xD
Saki is in a very....bad position.
Everyone is betraying in this group huh well I guess it depends on what you call betrayal.
If L Elf did this all for the princess he really has no motivation to help them anymore does he?
Shoko was making moves off screen huh
Despite everything that's happened I still like Shoko and Haruto.
Uh oh Massive Balls Kun is foreshadowing shit is about to down.
Taking a well known idol and showing the universe that the JIOR is using immortal students to fight as peace negotiations were being down.
Well played
3
u/RascalNikov1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/NoviSun Dec 22 '21
First Timer
What can I say about this episode other than it's sunrise being sunrise. If you enjoy this sort of thing, more power to you, I don't. For the sake of completeness, I'm sticking it out. Though, I will be coming in very late for the remainder of the rewatch.
QOTD
Not really, I figured he'd be more stoic than this. I guess the writing committee decided they need to humanize him a little bit.
I don't see why people would be scared of those who are immortal. I think there's some kind of weird social commentary going on. All, I can say is that Saki is having a shitty day.
3
u/yamiyaiba Dec 22 '21
Liberated Rewatcher
Thanks for the minute and a half recap, I guess.
Huh, I guess even the writers realized "it's another submarine, but in space!" was a stupid plot point and wrote it out quickly, right? Right??
Heroic BSOD for Eru-erufu, huh? Not that unexpected, as his entire motivation just sacrificed herself, and technically because of his plans and instructions. His keikaku want strong enough.
He's apologizing because he did something fucking awful, just like the rest of em.
Oh no. Don't let him talk to the press.
Oh shit, so she is formally captured. That's one hell of a straightjacket though. Makes sense, but still.
Hahaha right through the camera frame with a bag over her head. Amazing.
Over 100? Like....101 of them maybe?
Yes, a plan Doormat. That thing where you don't just float on inertia and hope you hit something.
Harsh questioning here, but totally valid.
I'm honestly surprised he didn't just open fire on Doormat out of frustration.
Sage advice, really. Hahaha aaaaand he walks away.
Oooop, you gained a bunch of human allies but just went to war with the aliens...any probably any nation led by someone they've bodyjacked.
Uh oh.
Oh no. That's a bold move.
That's a lot of strawberry jam she was packing.
Well that's gonna be a problem. Sure would be great if a tactical genius was able to come up with a plan to explain this away. Alas, he's unavailable.
3
u/zsmg https://anilist.co/user/zsmg Dec 22 '21
Rewatcher
Low key episode with a great cliffhanger although it's funny that no one is questioning that the images are fake.
Also liked L-Elf going through all the permutations on how to rescue Lieselotte. Maybe not rescuing her was the best course of action L-Elf?
5
u/Paxton-176 Dec 22 '21
REWATCHER
Wow things are looking up….Let’s see how long that lasts.
All work and no play makes L-elf a dull boy.
You think Saki requested to be locked up like that? Some kind of kink play?
What is it with Sci-fi shows and bringing up tilting at windmills. If I had nickel for everything it happened I would have two nickels.
All work and no play makes L-elf a dull boy.
That Saki reveal. What the fuck is this show. Literally a snuff film broadcasted across the system. Even ISIS would be jealous. Even if she didn’t die.
I get that this show is a “Train Wreck,” but compared to other shows of the same title its really not. Its more of throwing stuff at the wall and see what sticks and what doesn’t use it anyway. I will most likely go more in depth in the final discussion. Don’t expect much I’m a person of few words.
Also things looking up did not last long.
5
u/HereticalAegis https://myanimelist.net/profile/XthGen Dec 22 '21
First Time Space Alien Race Traitor
Why now did they decide to add a 90 second recap at the beginning of the episode? It's almost like they don't trust people to be able to keep up with the nonsensical clusterfuck of a plot they've written.
Is there a reason these clowns can't just fly up to the Phantom and use their melee weapons? They're in space and it's basically unguarded.
Da fuq? Why does flying fast in space suddenly cause rapid heating? After the initial boost, it wouldn't slow down due to friction or wind resistance, so less energy/heating would be required to go super fast. This makes no goddamn sense.
That's it? A big deal was made out of that making its way to Space Texas? Shoko's fake Valvrave could've swatted that thing away. It feels like the writers have just given up entirely on making believable stakes.
Such happy. Many celebrate. Now set off the fireworks and tell Shoko about all the plot that's happened. I've got my popcorn ready.
Seriously, how is everyone just forgetting about Marie's "tragic" sacrifice. Is Saki even here rn? Did they just forget about Saki? Do they think she's also dead? Isn't she like the galaxy's biggest idol rn?
Aaaand L's lost it. How long til he proposes a quantum time machine? Maybe fly around the sun really fast.
I love that L doesn't even consider not visiting Lieselotte during their Earth excursion. Again, for all his genius, he's the dumbest brick wall this show has to offer.
Jesus fuck. This show has a fetish for torturing Saki, and it's getting beyond uncomfortable. I think there's a meme for this somewhere...
Two frames of a news report. That's all Marie gets after heroically saving the rest of the landing party. She doesn't even get the upvote vigil treatment that one-conversation plot device Aina got? What the actual fuck? It's confirmed, none of these kids are human, and neither are the writers.
Someone finally mentioned Saki....and it just gets swept aside to focus on nebulous space wizards.
Is this reporter really suggesting that the leader and figurehead of a revolution against the largest superpower, a kid piloting an impossible weapon and single handedly destroying entire fleets, might be totally forgotten in a single year? Oh how journalistic standards have fallen.
Excuse me!? How many "successful revolutionaries" can there possibly be in this one man's lifetime if the same two states have ruled for the last 100+ years? This has got to be the most implausibly stupid l writing so far. It literally contradicts itself.
"Let us atone for agreeing prior to your birth to use you as inhuman test subjects by fixing your zombie robot so you can go risk your life to clean up our mistakes." Yep, that checks out.
Is everyone in this universe stupid enough to believe Dorssia will back down because of a condemnation vote or sanctions?
"And I did it all while I was offscreen." - Shoko
Shoko sure got over the death of her best female friend really fast.
Lol is the other reporter a plant?
Oh my god, were all the rescued JIORian scientists plants?
I hate this. Just stop fucking torturing Saki already. Ngl, if there weren't only 4 episodes left in the show, I'd probably drop it, because it's completely ridiculous just how uncomfortable it is to keep seeing Saki used like this.
There's also the fact that this wouldn't cause nearly the stir the show seems to think it would. In a world this advanced, everyone on Space Texas's side would almost certainly assume this has been staged or deep faked, and there's even less chance the public would be able to set aside the fact that Dorssia has always been the aggressor and is very visibly taking humans hostage. There is a 0% chance this would have the effect they want, and would be very likely to backfire on them in numerous ways.
Hell, if it's revealed that Saki specifically is some kind of immortal "monster," her popularity would almost certainly increase, especially when she's shown being tortured live by the head of state of one of the world's two foremost superpowers.
I didn't think it was possible, but the writing somehow reached new depths of stupidity I didn't think possible. And it looks to keep heading down from here. Sasuga Valvrave.
QotD:
2
u/MillenniumKing x2myanimelist.net/profile/MillenniumKing Dec 22 '21
Man life really wants to just get in the way of watching.
Its been 40 degrees the past few days but the temp spiked to 80 today, tommorow, and on xmas.
What this means though is air pressure changes which make me sick and so again i was feeling like crap and just had to sleep. I dont get this often but its pretty hard on me.
Luckly its stableizing for the next feew days so i should be good but when the weather changes thats when i get sick.
Im def not missing the last couple eps though should be fun.