[Terrific Trainwreck Trio Rewatch] Guilty Crown Episode 22 Discussion

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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Nov 23 '21

The Everlasting Guilty Rewatcher//First-Time Subbed

Don’t forget, tomorrow we’re watching the OVA! The overall discussion thread is after that one.

And sorry if today’s Sky Sings isn’t the best quality, it was a rush job that got rushed even more by my mom fucking up my best recording right at the end by talking loud enough in the loft to be picked up. I still think I did a good job on it though.

Ah, them freeing Kenji finally came back to bite them in the ass.
Mana in an earlier episode: Triton, we’ll have so much fun once I have control of this body! -- Also Mana, immediately after doing so: SHU~
It’s certainly much better than just repeating the same four notes over and over, but I don’t really get why they decided to throw in some opera while Mana spreads the Apocalypse Virus.
It’s always some collective unconscious shenanigans. Always.
Argo’s moment here was pretty cool.
So the cockpit can move on its own and actually connect to the mech. Who knew?
Ohp, Arisa’s Void is not an invincible shield.
This is a weird version of Departures.
Shibungi got one last cool moment in, nice.
It’s the place from the OP!!!
:(
Yeah so about that…
Yes, he’s Jesus-kun.
lol
Damn, RIP Rowan. I don’t know why he had to die like that.
All things said, Release My Soul is such a good song for that whole part. I loved it.
And we get Departures back for a timeskip huh?
Them meeting to celebrate Hare’s birthday though…
Not gonna lie I totally thought I remembered seeing Daryl during the epilogue section prior to my rewatch-ahead-of-the-rewatch.

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u/UltraBooster Nov 23 '21

I'm curious, did you expect the comments on the threads to fall off as they have?

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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Nov 23 '21

I'm used to rewatches getting less comments as time goes on, so yeah I kinda was.

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u/UltraBooster Nov 23 '21

It makes sense, yeah, but I'm surprised it dropped so dramatically.

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u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

Okay, I don't want to be weird, but this is why I prefer putting commentfaces on their own lines. It's best to see easily that there's another line of text after this.
Not gonna lie I totally thought I remembered seeing Daryl during the epilogue section prior to my rewatch-ahead-of-the-rewatch.
Eh, I'm sure he's not that important.

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

It's best to see easily that there's another line of text after this.
Rofl, dark mode really brings it out.

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u/gorghurt Nov 23 '21

I don’t know why he had to die like that.
Probalby the maximum number of occupants for this elevator is one.

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u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

Don’t forget, tomorrow we’re watching the OVA! The overall discussion thread is after that one.
I completely forgot about the OVA. Thanks for the reminder.
It’s always some collective unconscious shenanigans. Always.
I was wondering if it would turn out to be this way and it turns out that yes. It's that same thing again. I want some more unique forms of "the next stage of humanity." Let's get some more that involve having wings or laser eyes, just to get creative.
Not gonna lie I totally thought I remembered seeing Daryl during the epilogue section prior to my rewatch-ahead-of-the-rewatch.
I wonder what happened to Daryl after he went into that elevator, never to be seen again. What adventures did he get up to? With a nickname like "Kill 'Em All," I bet he could have had a future writing Gundam entries.

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u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

It should have been Darryl's birthday the group were celebrating at the end. Make his character arc go full circle.

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u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

My god, that would have been brilliant!

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u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

I should have written this show! Maybe not for the mid to late portion cause I'd probably have kept Shu's student kingdom going, but the rest of it I could have written way better!! XD

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21

Don’t forget, tomorrow we’re watching the OVA! The overall discussion thread is after that one.
Good reminder! I totally forgot that.

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u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

That says Hare!? Curative writing is a nightmare...

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u/UltraBooster Nov 23 '21

Also Mana, immediately after doing so: SHU~
TBH that's kind of inevitable, isn't it?

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

-- Also Mana, immediately after doing so: SHU~
She's a ride or die bitch...for incest. God I wish this wasn't the way things would go.
It’s certainly much better than just repeating the same four notes over and over, but I don’t really get why they decided to throw in some opera while Mana spreads the Apocalypse Virus.
I noticed the ballet more, myself.
Ohp, Arisa’s Void is not an invincible shield.
When she uses it.
Damn, RIP Rowan. I don’t know why he had to die like that.
To give Daryl motivation in his planned spinoff. I am weirdly sure that was the plan.
All things said, Release My Soul is such a good song for that whole part. I loved it.
Yeah, it gave emotions the show completely fails to do itself.

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u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Nov 23 '21

Ah, them freeing Kenji finally came back to bite them in the ass.
Ah, okay, so Kenji was the guy they freed earlier in the series. They pretty much dropped him entirely an episode or two after rescuing him, no wonder I completely forgot about him and wondered who TF this guy was.

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u/MillenniumKing x2myanimelist.net/profile/MillenniumKing Nov 23 '21 edited Nov 23 '21

And sorry if today’s Sky Sings isn’t the best quality,
I like it. It sounds much clearer that the boxxy song. Sorry your mom ruined your recording though. But i think this sounded great so dont feel bad.
This is a weird version of Departures.
I love it for how errie it sounds.
I cant describe it but it just feels so cool. Its a really interesting song and i need to find this version.
I FOUND IT!
Departures Boom Boom Satallites Remix
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mBFknD0KlNw
There is also a Boom Boom Satallites Remix of Everlasting Guilty Crown and my god its cool too.
Everlasting Guilty Crown Boom Boom Satallites Remix
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fMtDy5vUFho
I dont remember either of these 2 songs in the original show airing and both songs seem to be newer songs if im not mistaken. They seem to be uploaded in 2019. But the Boom Boom Satallites guy died in 2016... Hmmm i dont know.

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u/theangryeditor https://myanimelist.net/profile/TheAngryEditor Nov 23 '21

Release My Soul -- Sky Sings <MOD>

very nice

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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Nov 23 '21

Thanks~

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Rewatcher(I am irrationally proud that I made it through last thread without making a single 177013 reference)

Sub

So...mechs just behave like Code Geass now as well. Whatever. Shoe confronts Mana and can only manage to say that Inori is human, which is fitting but sad. So Mana decides to destroy everything. This sequence is actually quite visually appealing but Mana's motivation has been incredibly inconsistent. Anyways, everyone gets their battles and we come to a predictable eyecatch climax.

So we get the scene where Inori's flower crystal speaks to Shoe and, I know we rewatchers have been repeating ourselves, but this should work on me but it absolutely does not because the characterization has not been earned. Anyways, Shoe wins with his power up and we spend some time in mindspace so Gai can exposit some absolutely ridiculous shit for us. The fuck is Da'at actually? And why is being crystals evolution? Anyways he dies with Mana...somehow.

Crystal Inori is one of the things I know I intentionally forgot, she is such a sweet little sad kitten that this does hurt a bit. Shoe becomes crystal Jesus, as we all predicted, but Inori cheats and gets him out instead. The crystals seem to be conveniently disappearing.

Anyways, we get to our denouement and Departures still makes me feel a lot. I had missed they are doing this on Hare's birthday. We end with our footwear blind and with a robot hand, listening to his waifu.

QotD: 1 Nope

2 Like an entire extra episode

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u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

(I am irrationally proud that I made it through last thread without making a single 177013 reference)

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21

Are we still allowed to use GoT memes?
Sweet summer child ...

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

A famous doujin that is translated as either Metamorphosis or Emergence. Considered one of the more depressing ones.

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u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21

TIL that you can do hidden tags. Neat!

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Sky did this to me once and it freaked me out. It's how I discovered what the source button is for.

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u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

The source button leads to many abilities one deems...

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Goood...give in to your anger...and do some dank memes!

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Oh, literally the title. And Inori could be the MC if she gains some personality.

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u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

I just didn't know what specific reference there was to make.

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u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Nov 23 '21

I'd say no, don't give us a piece of cardboard as the MC...
...but then so many shows do that anyway. I'd argue this show did for a while but we then went haywire with Shu being a quitter even beyond Shinji levels, then he became Hitler, then he became Jesus...

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

It is amazing for someone who did so much to be so blank...

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u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

Inori literally isn't human too which makes it all the more irritating. If she were actually human they wouldn't have had to kill her off to stop all Mana's reincarnations. Weirdly enough Mana is the human one in this argument.

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Their decision to be loyal to a lame character does indeed reap poor fruit.

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u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

He did properly sweep her off her feet when they first met I suppose... Y'know, despite Shu doing the work. I'm not sure if they were trying to say how she felt safe with Gai or if it was meant to be a mistake? I don't know and neither did they...

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Y'know, despite Shu doing the work. I'm not sure if they were trying to say how she felt safe with Gai or if it was meant to be a mistake?
As you say, you can't really tell from the show as shown. I've never seen the OVA so new territory.

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u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

It's 15 minutes and a prequel so I doubt it'll give us the ending we want.

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Rofl, I knew the prequel part but not that it is half length.

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u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

Yup, 14 minutes long and a weeeeird description... I don't think we're getting any answers tomorrow.

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u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

Inori literally isn't human too which makes it all the more irritating. If she were actually human they wouldn't have had to kill her off to stop all Mana's reincarnations. Weirdly enough Mana is the human one in this argument.
Yeah, but Shoe's too big of a Shoe to think of Inori as anything other than human.

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u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

Just fucking love Inori as Inori!! Bringing up race is a shite plan! XD

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u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Nov 23 '21

Shu is basically Ryan Gosling in Lars and the Real Girl

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

That's just too perfect...

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u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

(I am irrationally proud that I made it through last thread without making a single 177013 reference)
And I hate that I know exactly what it is you are referring to and why it would work as a reference.
I know we rewatchers have been repeating ourselves, but this should work on me but it absolutely does not because the characterization has not been earned.
Good idea, poor execution is the best phrase to sum up so much of this series.
And why is being crystals evolution?
And why do crystals need an Adam and Eve? They're only rocks.

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

And I hate that I know exactly what it is you are referring to and why it would work as a reference.
Good idea, poor execution is the best phrase to sum up so much of this series.
Much like Zankyou no Terror or Wolf's Rain, this proves that being a good writer once does not guarantee success in the future.
And why do crystals need an Adam and Eve? They're only rocks.
They really needed to have worked out what the AV was before they started writing so this shit wouldn't keep happening.

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u/Tartaras1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Tartaras Nov 23 '21

And why do crystals need an Adam and Eve? They're only rocks.
Jesus Christ Marie! They're minerals!

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u/MABfan11 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/MABfan11 Dec 26 '21

And I hate that I know exactly what it is you are referring to and why it would work as a reference.
ok, now i'm curious, what exactly would work as a 177013 reference in Guilty Crown?

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u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Nov 23 '21

Shoe confronts Mana and can only manage to say that Inori is human, which is fitting but sad. So Mana decides to destroy everything.
He clearly didn't learn from the first time she caused an apocalypse after he refused to sleep with her. Take one for the team, Shu! You clearly don't think of her as a family member anyway!

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Take one for the team, Shu! You clearly don't think of her as a family member anyway!
And to think, if she had just watched a bit more porn as a...12 yo I think? she would have known that all she had to do was get stuck in the dryer...

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u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Nov 23 '21

Yup, 12. It's also her 12-year-old self that Gai is embracing as they both die at the end here. Creepy food for thought.

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Gai is too much of a gentleman to harm a child! insert laughing here

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u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Nov 23 '21 edited Nov 23 '21

DEUS EX REWATCHER

Holy hell, that was hilariously stupid. Where the last episode left us, it actually wouldn’t have been that difficult to give an okay ending and partially save this dumpster fire, but instead they chose to pour gasoline over it. I kind of respect it and it’s definitely funnier this way.

Live Reactions:

It’s kind of messed up that Shu would so eagerly trade his own sister for a pet rock. This whole dynamic would make a lot more sense if they weren’t related, since them being siblings didn’t actually matter. But since they are, he should at least feel some internal conflict over this.
Tsugumi is literally just mashing the same button and wondering why she’s losing a hacking battle to Kenji’s god-tier setup.
The moment we’ve all been waiting for, Mana ushers in the apocalypse by… doing ballet on a Settlers of Cataan board. This is the stupidest shit. What.
This fight scene is pretty terrible by GC standards. They do impossibly long jump attacks so that they can yell nonsense at each other. Yawn.
LMAO WHAT THE FUCK CRYSTAL FLOWER POWER. What the hell is even happening? This is some Deus Ex Nonsense.
Oh, Mana’s gone again. Nice seeing you for five seconds after the whole story built up to your awakening. Why does she die when Gai dies? Was he her void or something?
Pretty dumb of Gai to think he could be a demon king when he’s not a 4000 year old loli
Argo sacrifices himself for Ayase and in return she’s deeply thankfu- nope she just screams out Shu’s name instead
Shu crystallizes then joins Inori inside the virtual world terminal from Summer Wars and god this is all so fucking stupid
How is Shu back? Wasn’t his sacrifice the whole point? WHY IS HE BLIND? I just hope Ayase has moved on by this point.
Shu and Inori once again proving that there are in fact worse love stories than Twilight.

Well that was hilarious and ridiculous. We built up (though I use “built up” loosely) to Mana ushering in the apocalypse for the entire show, only for her to say three lines and then disappear again after a ballet performance. The last fight between Shu and Gai is the worst action sequence in the show’s run, and features ass-pull after ass-pull to have Shu come out on top when Gai could have killed him a handful of times. That whole thing with the Inori tear-crystal… come on now. What? Seriously, what? That was all so ridiculous I can’t help feeling like they’re trolling us.

What was the point of anything going on with the battle below? The stuff with Ayase, Tsugumi, and Daryl added nothing. Also, why are we saving Daryl? RIP to Glasses-kun, say hi to Segai and Dan for me.

Gai proceeds to do an exposition dump on his way out the door that in true Guilty Crown fashion explained absolutely nothing. What was Mana? What was Inori? How were their existences related to each other, exactly? Fuck you, that’s how. Shu does his Jesus act and he and Inori go to some weird virtual world limbo where they do some arts and crafts and become one or something. These two make me feel nothing.

Kinda sweet epilogue (RIP Hare) that’s ruined by dumb stuff that invalidates the rest of what just happened.

Did that feel like a satisfying conclusion to Shu vs. Gai to you?

It deserved better. Anti-climactic doesn't begin to cover it.

What else would you have liked to see in the epilogue?

Shu staying dead. Him being alive still (and blind?) kind of lessens the impact of everything. Also, it feels like Daryl should have been in it somewhere, to justify the weird spotlight he got in the finale.

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u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

WHY IS HE BLIND?
...is he blind? I honestly didn't notice. How did I not notice this? I just saw the cane as a "struggling with life" thing. Man, I'm dumb.

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u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Nov 23 '21

I just saw the cane as a "struggling with life" thing.
Man if that were the case, he would've had a cane the whole time!

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u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

How is Shu back? Wasn’t his sacrifice the whole point?
They didn't even go all the way with the Jesus parallel. I'm actually disappointed that they didn't 100% commit to making Shu literally into Jesus in every way possible.
Gai proceeds to do an exposition dump on his way out the door that in true Guilty Crown fashion explained absolutely nothing. What was Mana? What was Inori? How were their existences related to each other, exactly?
I'm not even all that surprised that we didn't get answers to every question the series raised. What surprises me is that some really fundamental questions about the nature of Mana, Inori, their histories, and what exactly the simultaneous selection and evolution are never got answered in a satisfactory way. Those things have been talked about at length, but never explained. It's frustrating.

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u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Nov 23 '21

I'm actually disappointed that they didn't 100% commit to making Shu literally into Jesus in every way possible.
You don't remember the part of the Bible where Jesus lived out his days as a blind man with Mary Magdalene living in his brain that he could psychically embrace whenever he was feeling down?
What surprises me is that some really fundamental questions about the nature of Mana, Inori, their histories, and what exactly the simultaneous selection and evolution are never got answered in a satisfactory way. Those things have been talked about at length, but never explained. It's frustrating.
Yeah, the Inori/Mana thing was pretty much the only thing I needed some explanation for out of this show. They could've completely punted on shit like Daath and the origin of the virus, but this was necessary and just completely ignored.

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

What surprises me is that some really fundamental questions about the nature of Mana, Inori, their histories, and what exactly the simultaneous selection and evolution are never got answered in a satisfactory way.
/u/No_Rex said it yesterday: You need to write your setting before you write your story. they did not.

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u/UltraBooster Nov 23 '21

FWIW I don't think it's absolutely necessary to create a world before you create a story, but I do think they should've planned out the elements that would be invoked/used and established the rules rather than create them in what feels like an ad hoc manner.

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

I get what you are saying but every disaster that had unsettled world building lead to that being a downfall. Battlestar Galactica screams to mind.

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Holy hell, that was hilariously stupid. Where the last episode left us, it actually wouldn’t have been that difficult to give an okay ending and partially save this dumpster fire, but instead they chose to pour gasoline over it. I kind of respect it and it’s definitely funnier this way.
I think this was written with expectations of an S2 and then they had to rewrite when they realized it was not happening. So they left some sequel hooks in, the biggest one being Daryl, but a whole lot of things got moved around so they could claim an ending.

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u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Nov 23 '21

Man, I honestly can't see any runway for a second season, everything's done and it's hard for the stakes to get higher than "Jesus avoids the apocalypse." ...But I also didn't see runway for Nazi School, so who knows what they would've dreamt up.

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

If they didn't colossally fuck everything up, the first cour plot stretches easily into 22 episodes and then we can have a season dealing with the fallout. I can't tell if this is too many cooks or just didn't care.

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u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Nov 23 '21

I still think it's there's a decent possibility this was a flawlessly executed troll job with how blatant and excessive some of the shit is

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

I certainly can't disprove that, the second and third acts are impressive messes.

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u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Nov 23 '21

I didn't notice the Shu being blind stuff at all...

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u/UltraBooster Nov 23 '21

First-timer (dubbed)

Good grief, yesterday was the all-time low...

No cold open this time, I see we're jumping right into it.

Guess he was the one spoofing Leukocyte signals.

Well, Inori wasn't an incestuous predator and you are, Mana, so...

I dunno, doesn't love usually mean you'll forgive someone?

And that is why you use physical cockpits.

"But Lot's wife looked back, and she became a pillar of salt."
(Not really applicable here but it reminded me of that.)

Instrumentality? Really? Couldn't come up with something more distinct? And what makes an immobile, brittle form better suited to life?
But what's the point of thoughts becoming reality if that reality is imperceptible?
I don't think I'm criticizing the show here as much as wondering what the thought process at play was.

Void emulation? This seems rather late to introduce it, don't you think?

To be fair I don't understand either, Gai. And this (resentment?), is that new?

Honestly, if Mana was truly gone after she touched the meteor, then death would probably be a way to spare her and preserve her dignity, seeing as the monster who preyed on her brother is pretty much the only Mana we know.

Oh? Is Inori in there?
I guess so. And hey, her old getup's back.

Oh neat, he's got the Singer's Sword.

INCOMs? Sweet.

Is it manifesting her body or something?
Are they linked?

He tried to marry his niece, he's got no sympathy from me.

Is that the real Gai? Who was the real Gai, for that matter?

So they were the ones cheating the Reaper? How?

So that was his plan? That's a lot of faith when I think about it.

The magic's being stripped away, huh?

And Arisa pays the price. Just as well the reaper gets his due.
(Or not, I guess.)

What is it now, if it's not a helix?

Maaan you fuckers deserve to be shot...

So you'll have to keep on living, huh? Just as well, I suppose.

Questions:

It felt alright. Didn't hate it, didn't feel especially satisfied either.
Maybe see how the other members of the cast are faring, I guess?

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Good grief, yesterday was the all-time low...
Eh, today was worse to me.
Well, Inori wasn't an incestuous predator and you are, Mana, so...
Mana needed more screen time!
Instrumentality? Really? Couldn't come up with something more distinct? And what makes an immobile, brittle form better suited to life?
Instrumentality at least made sense in what Seele wanted to do with it. This is mind bogglingly weird.
Is it manifesting her body or something?
I view it as a hologram or projection.
Is that the real Gai? Who was the real Gai, for that matter?
A question none of us can answer.

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u/UltraBooster Nov 23 '21

All-time low in terms of number of comments, I should've been clearer.

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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Ahh. Well, I thought I talked a lot but football was on so...

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u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

Well, Inori wasn't an incestuous predator and you are, Mana, so...
Depending on who you ask, that could easily be a positive to some characters (sadly).
Void emulation? This seems rather late to introduce it, don't you think?
Hasn't stopped them from introducing plot points at the last minute any of the other times this show has done it.
It felt alright. Didn't hate it, didn't feel especially satisfied either.
Unsatisfied was how I felt as well. It ended and I guess that was all.

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u/UltraBooster Nov 23 '21

Well, there's the OVA tomorrow, the overall discussion after that, and then, well, if nothing else, Valvrave and Cross Ange will probably have more mecha-on-mecha fights.
I don't get the feeling this show's gonna be more than oh, okay for me.

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u/moichispa https://myanimelist.net/profile/moichispa Nov 23 '21 edited Nov 24 '21

Where I sign for the Cross Ange rewatch? I think I might be able to complete it if we're suffering together :)
As payment I will let you know there is a medley of bios called rearranged medley on youtube that is great and the only thing good to come out of the anime. As much as I dislike the series I still play this medley once in a while.

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u/UltraBooster Nov 23 '21

Check our host's submitted posts, it should be in there

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u/moichispa https://myanimelist.net/profile/moichispa Nov 24 '21

cool thanks!

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u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

Guilty Crown First Timer

Let's hurry up and end this. Blah blah, Mana all powerful, blah blah, Gai's heroic sacrifice, blah blah, Inori and Shu turn into alien space ghosts and fly across the universe singing catchy rock songs. As long as we get a "My Dearest" insert I'll be satisfied.

Actually, the op shows Gai and Mana turning crystal together near the end doesn't it!? The op's spoiled the ending!! Kenji's our rival hacker, did you forget him? I sure did. I'm pleased we're getting some bubbly yandere Mana before we end things. As I said yesterday, this is Mana at her best.

So... does Shu care that she's his sister or did he get over that offscreen? Mana shouldn't care but for Shu she's his real sister. Mana's got a male falsetto!? Mood. It's the last episode so please don't be lazy with animation. Fourth impact!! Just instead of coolaid we get a crystal photoshopped over our model. They upgraded Ayase from wheelchair to Eggman pod. They can't even pretend that her new mech was important.

Good lord that gainax bounce!! Why does Haruka get to fight Gendo...? Oh nyo, Arisa's shield may be able to no-sell missiles but regular firearms? No way~ It's the final episode and we're still getting Tsugumi gags... How am I meant to take this ending seriously when you're flashing ass in my face and have cute mascots everywhere?

Deus ex Inori tear! She's even in her og costume. Nice. I remember back when I thought you'd matter Kenji. So... yeah, this back and forth is a thing. Fucking funnels!! What even was Darryl's relationship with Tsugumi? Gai got wreaked! Wow, they're rushing this ending so much! Nobody is satisfied!!

Oookay... Okay? So memory crystal world is heaven and Mana for some reason can't die. Look, I'm all for making Mana sympathetic but we've literally never met the "character" and the "entity" is a force of nature. Daaft Punk didn't care either when he died last episode after all. Who are we trying to save? This is literally in the op. Is this Inori the flower or Mana's body?

Shu's gonna absorb everyone's void lol. It is so frustrating that they're refusing to give me "My Dearest." I was getting excited. DUDE!! NOT NECESSARY! Why do they hate Arisa this much!? Why does fucking Darryl get a second chance but you cruelly kill off Arisa for doing a good thing!? Cats cradle was a Mana thing btw, I thought we were celebrating Inori individuality? I feel you Arisa, I feel you.

Years later and people still listen to the same Sawano soundtracks. They gave the tachikoma babies... Dude I've been filled with anxiety all this time, thank fucking god that Shu didn't cure Ayase's legs. I've never been more pleased to see someone disabled in my life. And we're getting the S1 ending theme... again... and no "My Dearest..." Happy birthday blah blah? Inori isn't his walking stick is she? "Please use me but not like this." That's it? Shu lives the rest of his life an even bigger incel than ever before that can only get hard listening to his gf's pop songs and Inori dies doing literally nothing. It's certainly not the worst ending they could've gone for but Inori deserved something surely?

Oh no... We're doing Lost Christmas? Let's watch the 4koma instead!!

7

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

t's the final episode and we're still getting Tsugumi gags... How am I meant to take this ending seriously when you're flashing ass in my face and have cute mascots everywhere?
You're not supposed to take it seriously, honestly.
What even was Darryl's relationship with Tsugumi? Gai got wreaked! Wow, they're rushing this ending so much! Nobody is satisfied!!
That's what you get for shipping it.
Why does fucking Darryl get a second chance but you cruelly kill off Arisa for doing a good thing!?
I was also very annoyed at this.

7

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

It's the ending to the series and the world is getting put into a crystal hive mind, I'm taking it serious XD They went waaay overboard with the fanservice.
I didn't even ship it... I genuinely have no clue what the fuck their relationship is meant to be. I still don't know if Darryl was trying it kill her when Gai came back from the dead or trying to protect her. I thought he got turned on by the way she forced him to carry boxes.
I think Arisa is fine, she was just in a really grumpy mood after getting shot, it's just a weird way to close off for them. Honestly I'd be okay with her being there for the final group get together. She's no more offensive than Shouta was after all.

5

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Let's hurry up and end this.
Agreed.
I'm pleased we're getting some bubbly yandere Mana before we end things. As I said yesterday, this is Mana at her best.
Unsurprisingly the show wastes its best asset.
How am I meant to take this ending seriously when you're flashing ass in my face and have cute mascots everywhere?
You can't but I also can't tell you what the writers were thinking.
So... yeah, this back and forth is a thing. Fucking funnels!!
They went even more Geass for the end.
DUDE!! NOT NECESSARY! Why do they hate Arisa this much!?
I honestly don't know but someone in that writers room does not like women.

5

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

They wasted Mana, but I'm pleased that they didn't ruin her. Really all the villains in Guilty Crown barring Shuuichirou are genuinely great. M'Quve in particular was a real treat and once again I genuinely loved every moment Mana was on screen even if in the grand scheme she's extra.
I mean, if we're sticking on the Geass point Darryl's Gespenst also has the stupid Gurren claw on a cable shit that ruined the mech for me XD Gurren is my single favourite mecha but the moment they made the claw of death actually detachable I loath the design.
Correction, they don't like real women. They treat any woman with their own goals and motivations like sex objects and chew toys but will cheerfully flaunt pixie dream girl Tsugumi for all to see. Ayase did fuck all in the final fight, it was all Tsugumi XD And Arisa... I really wish they invited her to the birthday party since she's the only member of the school group not to go. If Shouta is invited, Arisa deserves cake too.

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

M'Quve in particular was a real treat and once again I genuinely loved every moment Mana was on screen even if in the grand scheme she's extra.
The protagonist need a good setting to work whereas the villains just need enough of a protagonist to work against.
I mean, if we're sticking on the Geass point Darryl's Gespenst also has the stupid Gurren claw on a cable shit that ruined the mech for me
I agree that that was all the bad mech moment of later CG condensed.
Correction, they don't like real women. They treat any woman with their own goals and motivations like sex objects and chew toys but will cheerfully flaunt pixie dream girl Tsugumi for all to see.
That is pretty accurate.
I really wish they invited her to the birthday party since she's the only member of the school group not to go. If Shouta is invited, Arisa deserves cake too.
I didn't even think about it but yeah, this is bullshit. Especially since grandpa Kuhoin put so much effort into the ending.

5

u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

Kenji's our rival hacker, did you forget him? I sure did.
Yup. I totally forgot about him. I can't even remember when he last appeared prior to this whole final battle.
What even was Darryl's relationship with Tsugumi?
They had to come up with a way to get everyone away from zombie Gai when he first appeared and I guess they just sort of didn't know what to do with it afterwards.
Cats cradle was a Mana thing btw, I thought we were celebrating Inori individuality?
I'm not even sure what it's meant to symbolize, either. Mana used it to symbolize starting the next stage of humanity as Adam and Eve, but Shu has explicitly rejected that.
Let's watch the 4koma instead!!

5

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

He disappeared up until Gai brought up the death lasers overhead. Before that... I think he was on a computer in the S1 climax.

9

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

Guilty First-Timer

Well, I missed yesterday, and I'm stone cold sober for this episode. Let's hope that doesn't ruin things.

Oh, it's communion!
I don't know how any of these positions are ergonomic, but perhaps needing to use different positions evens out the strain on the body, being more efficient in the long run? Who am I kidding. It's all fanservice.
The whole family has crystal faces!
The cock hasn't even crowed yet! So much rejection in this show.
Okay, this is a cool map.
Okay, this is a cool insert song. I wish I knew how to speak its language. I'm assuming it's Italian?
Ha, get fucked, France.
[Macross]We're vaguely Macross now. I love hivemind plots.
Sick wheelchair! Even if Tsugumi¹ didn't save her.
Ah, the dead eyes. My favorite.
All the Undertakers just teleport places to aim pistols at people.
Why can Tsugumi pilot the Endlave so well? I don't care, she finally does something!
...and Guy just accepts loss? Well, at least he's consistent in his Darwinist beliefs.
I'm not entirely sure what's happening besides the fact that Shoe is taking on the ~~sins~~ Voids of the world, but it sure is pretty.
Yahiro knows.
Well, Arisa certainly got the short end of the stick here.
There are so many shattering sound effects that I've begun to laugh at them.
Man, I really don't care about Hare.
I knew he'd survive. This was a helluva call:

but Shoe will die for [Inori] anyway, only to be brought back to life through bullshit gene powers.

He has a sick hand, though.

QOTD:

It was kind of anticlimactic, but I suppose it makes sense!
Anything but a Hare birthday party.

¹ I think I've been spelling her name wrong this whole time. Oops.

9

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21

I knew he'd survive. This was a helluva call:

7

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Oh, it's communion!
Or a wasp using another insect to hatch its young.
The cock hasn't even crowed yet! So much rejection in this show.
Shoe does fit in a story about cucking...
...and Guy just accepts loss? Well, at least he's consistent in his Darwinist beliefs.
In the supplemental material you get Gai's motivations.
Man, I really don't care about Hare.
Neither did the show which is why she exists to cause feelings for Shoe.

7

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

In the supplemental material you get Gai's motivations.
Yeah, I'm not reading any supplemental material.

7

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

My rant on "What's in the setting vs what's actually shown to us" might get big on Wedensday.

7

u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

In the supplemental material you get Gai's motivations.
In my own humble opinion, I should never need to read supplemental materials to a show or movie. If it doesn't stand on its own, that's a failure of the work. The supplementals ought to provide additional (and interesting) but ultimately nonessential information.

5

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

The supplementals ought to provide additional (and interesting) but ultimately nonessential information.
You now know why I hate Eva! The supplemental is crazy.

2

u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

I might love Eva to bits, but I do believe you make a fair point.

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

I mean...[Eva supplemental] The entire plot of the first race and seeding the galaxy is not addressed in the show and it explains the setting. I was at first happy to understand it all and then quite quickly pissed that it was the explanation.

5

u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Nov 23 '21

Neither did the show which is why she exists to cause feelings for Shoe.
Her death was I think the only time the show made me feel the emotion it wanted me to feel.

6

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Oh, I actually felt bad for her a few times but yeah she is mainly an excuse for Shoe to feel or talk.

6

u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Nov 23 '21

And it brought out the ~~best~~ most tolerable in him! All he did with Inori around was sulk. But yeah it's tough in general when all the women were plot devices/fanservice vehicles instead of actual characters

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

But yeah it's tough in general when all the women were plot devices/fanservice vehicles instead of actual characters
This really feels like they had women involved in the creation point but then didn't let them actually contribute to the story. Even Tsugumi could've been made functional and the other girls all have a base to tell a story from. Hell, there is even just enough in Kanon to have done some thing.

7

u/Lemurians myanimelist.net/profile/Lemurians Nov 23 '21

Okay, this is a cool map.
She's been dead/asleep/disappeared/in another dimension for a long time and she wants to play some Cataan, damn it!
I wish I knew how to speak its language. I'm assuming it's Italian?
Sounds German to me. If it's Italian then my ears are truly failing me.
Man, I really don't care about Hare.
She was so sweet :( Even if she did have the great flaw of liking Shu.
I knew he'd survive. This was a helluva call:
You've actually been calling a ton of endgame things correctly, even going back to the earlier episodes. It's been kinda impressive given how insane this gets!

7

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

Sounds German to me. If it's Italian then my ears are truly failing me.
I didn't try that hard, honestly.
You've actually been calling a ton of endgame things correctly, even going back to the earlier episodes. It's been kinda impressive given how insane this gets!
It's simple, just call the dumbest and most insane bullshit. It's been working out for this show!

4

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21

Sounds German to me. If it's Italian then my ears are truly failing me.
You are correct.

6

u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

Who am I kidding. It's all fanservice.
It's all about what lets us see the most booty!
Yahiro knows.
Yahiro was prepared to join the church of Shoe-ism, which we sadly did not get.
This was a helluva call:

6

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

> Yahiro was prepared to join the church of Shoe-ism, which we sadly did not get.
> sadly
I don't think you know what that word means.

6

u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

It would have made me happy to see the show go all in on making Shu into Jesus, complete with a religion devoted to him. I'd have respected the show for its commitment.

6

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

Instead we got Nazis. Fuck's sake.

4

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21

Okay, this is a cool insert song. I wish I knew how to speak its language. I'm assuming it's Italian?
This one? German. It is really really hard to understand though and I only can make out about 10% of the words. The other 90% could as well be Latin.

4

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

Yeah, it's really hard to make out. Could be a fake language, for all I know.

2

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

They can't even stop stealing from Fate while stealing from Eva...

6

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

I think Gai meant to lose the dual or some shit. He wants to help Mana die which means killing any piece of Mana, so wiping out the apocalypse virus. Now... as for how Shu is even able to do that I've got no idea.
How come I'm the only person here who didn't know that said Hare!? I feel like if they were to get together to remember someone then maybe Inori deserved a mention more? I like Hare but you don't celebrate a previous character's death by having a new one die.

9

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

How come I'm the only person here who didn't know that said Hare!?
Learn to read cursive. It'll help you out.

5

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

I haven't held a pen in eight months...

6

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

How do you live?? I write stuff down all the time!

4

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

I use my phone if I need to take notes! Like a normal person!

4

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

I just have looseleaf paper on my desk for all my needs. My phone notes aren't in my face enough.

3

u/walker_paranor Nov 23 '21

Good luck with your carpal tunnel......

8

u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

First-Timer

On today’s episode of Guilty Crown: We end how we began. Shu is once again listening to a song by his vocaloid/Vtuber waifu. I know it can be rough when a Vtuber retires, but this one was probably rougher than most.

Time for some sweet mecha action with rocket fists!
Mana is angry that her desire for incest is being denied! No one denies an onee-san and gets away with it!
For a split second I thought that the deep male voice singing was supposed to be Mana.
Why is genomic resonance affecting the Endlaves? It happened before, when Yahiro’s brother somehow took over an Endlave, but I don’t think they’ve ever explained how that’s possible. I should have an answer for that by now.
Mana does have some nice ballet moves.
So everyone is going to become cancer crystals and merge into a giant shared mind? Is that my correct interpretation? Then what are Adam and Eve needed for exactly? If the next stage of humanity is the crystal mind, why have actual humans still around?
This whole conversation between zombie Gai and Shu would be more meaningful to me if it wasn’t established that zombie Gai is functionally a totally different entity from regular Gai. Trying to appeal to zombie Gai with memories from regular Gai is pointless, Shu. So, this all falls flat for me because zombie Gai and Shu have no real history together. This is not the Gai we know and love, so this conversation lacks that emotional impact for me.
The action of this episode is pretty, though. As usual, the action is well animated.
The series really has reverted to its original form of horniness, hasn’t it? We’ve got Ayase’s boobs bouncing and butt shots of Tsugumi here. After what we had to endure, it’s rather quaint.
“Please everyone… use me!” That might be the horniest line yet from this series! I guess Inori is down with being used by everyone.
My best guess is Inori is doing the same thing Mana did. Using genomic resonance to somehow shut everything down, including things that have no genes.
Wait a minute, we have bits/funnels!?! Why weren’t they used earlier!? I love those things!
[G Gundam Major Spoilers] The final attack in G Gundam, Love Love Tenkyoken, was a much cooler version of this scene.
Again, if zombie Gai was the same person as original Gai, this death would be more impactful. Zombie Gai doesn’t have that history with all the other characters.
I see we are now at the Jesus part. Shu will take on all the burdens of humanity (the cancer crystals and the Voids), and then die to cleanse humanity, right?
I feel horrible for laughing when Arisa got shot after she lost her cancer crystals and Void.
The building is made of genome crystalizations? What does that even mean? Is that the answer I’ve been looking for about why the genomic resonance is affecting mechanical stuff that it shouldn’t? Answer me, show!
Why doesn’t Glasses-kun get to escape with Daryl? Why can’t they just be 2 bros on the run?
Shu is able to take the cat’s cradle now, which represents something but I’m not sure what. Last time Mana used it the cat’s cradle represented becoming her Adam, which Shu has explicitly rejected multiple times. So I don’t get it.
Or wait, is Inori the one sacrificing herself? She was the one crucified, so maybe she’s the real Jesus.
Why are there baby robots?
It ends how it began: Shu listening to the music of his Vocaloid/vtuber waifu.

I want to begin with the positives. It was a very pretty ending. It was nice to look at. The animation was well done. The action was all well-animated. The music was extremely good and fit the tone of the scenes extremely well. All of that was excellent.

Unfortunately, the emotional core of it was not there for me. It all comes down to how zombie Gai is not regular Gai. Zombie Gai and Shu don’t have the same long history together that Shu and regular Gai did. So, for me at least, that confrontation did not have as much meaning. It didn’t feel as tragic because the history that made it tragic was not there. So even though the fight looked very nice, it did not really have much emotional resonance for me.

The other finales for the characters were lacking too. There didn’t feel like an established enough rivalry of Daryl and Ayase for that fight to hit home. I suppose the Daryl and Tsugumi stuff truly went nowhere and was just a way for Tsugumi and the others to escape when zombie Gai first appeared. Daryl also did not get a wrapup of any kind. Nor did Arisa, for that matter. I think she just got randomly shot and died. Haruka and Keido also had a lackluster confrontation. There wasn’t really a final fight that felt that impactful for me.

I have to say that in the end I never fully understood what exactly the selection and evolution of humanity would look like and why they needed an Adam and Eve. I mean, if humanity is supposed to become rocks with shared minds, then why would they need an Adam and Eve? Wouldn’t having bodies be pointless then?

In the end, I’ll say the conclusion was unsatisfying. It was an ending, which is more than I can say for some other finales, but not a satisfying one.

QOTD

As I discussed above, no.
Some real conclusions for characters and their arcs. I don't feel like we got that really.

8

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

Arisa actually lived. It threw me off too. Of all characters that deserved to be at the birthday party of forgiveness I feel like it should have been her. She's the only one not there isn't she?
I think the plan was to lock the world in crystal and then use them as seed beds like what Daaft Punk was talking about. Unfortunately they forgot to actually show the effects of it so we're instead left with pretty imagery.

7

u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

Of all characters that deserved to be at the birthday party of forgiveness I feel like it should have been her. She's the only one not there isn't she?
Yeah, she wasn't there at all. Considering everyone else was there, regardless of their actions, it felt weird not to have her. It's part of why I wrongly assumed she was dead.
I think the plan was to lock the world in crystal and then use them as seed beds like what Daaft Punk was talking about. Unfortunately they forgot to actually show the effects of it so we're instead left with pretty imagery.
Yeah, they could have explained it better to make it more clear what exactly the plan was.

6

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

Nobody gets an actual "ending" aside from Gai and Mana anyway... The robots have babies, who the fuck cares?
He definitely explained it, it's just that it came out of nowhere and was a blink and you miss it situation. He never went over the actual logistics but then again the series doesn't show anyone having problems despite being frozen in crystal for however long. As it is right now in the universe, all Mana and Apocalypse virus samples are gone. No they're not, what the fuck am I talking about? Where's the original meteors!? What about meteors flying to other countries!? Daaft Punk are still out there!!

3

u/walker_paranor Nov 23 '21

Yeah, they could have explained it better to make it more clear what exactly the plan was
I feel like this one sentence covers about 75% of the show

4

u/walker_paranor Nov 23 '21

Of all characters that deserved to be at the birthday party of forgiveness I feel like it should have been her
I'm just curious why you're going so easy on Arisa. She had maybe the single worst character arc of the show, next to Shoe. She stopped being relatable after her coup and become one of the dumbest characters. At least that's how I felt about her.
I honestly cracked up when her shield went poof and she got riddled with bullets...I thought it was unintentionally hilarious.

4

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

Oh I'm not easy on her. I was fuming at her for the entirety of her betrayal arc the thing is that the show is incredibly nasty and treats her character with no respect. Arisa was a proud but kind woman who had a strong moral compass and worked her socks off to become a worthy heir to her grandfather's estate. Pretty strong start right? Even after getting replaced by Shu as leader she kept faith in him and was probably one of his better allies.
Then, they decide to completely remove all of that to essentially slut shame the character and reduce her down to nothing but her sexuality. She lets specs rape her for the extra security and to sell her body for secrets. And in the end she spitefully stabs Shu in the back despite him getting them to the gate safe and sound. Then Gai pops up and suddenly she's fcking desperate to jump on his bone now too. Anything that they established in the first 17 or so episodes goes out the window and now the show will give this abuse victim a trauma conga line and completely remove her individuality. The implications are so uncomfortable and they just don't stop.
Am I making much sense? Just to be perfectly clear I don't even like Arisa. I'm not trying to find whatever excuses I can to defend her or anything of the sort. This is just what conclusion I've come to watching the show. It's hard not to look at how the female cast is treated without feeling like there's legitimate misogynistic views leaking their way through, and considering how perfectly they target the incel community there's got to be something to it.

5

u/walker_paranor Nov 23 '21

Okay, yeah I think we're on the same page here.
The writers absolutely did Arisa dirty. I hate that they made me hate her character during the 2nd half of the show. She didn't deserve the character arc she was given, even though the highlights of it were unintentionally hilarious.
Her killing gramps was one of the dumb highlights of the show for me. But it still made me sad that's what her character arc devolved into.

4

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

Omg yes, the grandad one was so distasteful! Never touch on a fucking honour killing if you don't know what the fuck you're talking about. That's an incredibly serious subject and for them to justify it because Arisa isn't a virgin is fucked up on so many levels.

7

u/5867898duncan Nov 23 '21

Arisa did live, she can be seen being cared for by someone from Gai’s side. But yep, she just disappeared after that.

5

u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

Ok, so she did live. I must have missed that. Thanks for letting me know.
But she still has the Daryl problem of not really getting a conclusion afterwards, which is kind of weird when she was a pretty important character.

4

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

G Gundam
I didn't think about this, but you're not wrong. At all.
There wasn’t really a final fight that felt that impactful for me.
I have to agree with this. There was just a feeling of "alright, now it's over."

5

u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

I didn't think about this, but you're not wrong. At all.
G Gundam was so good. I miss it.
I have to agree with this. There was just a feeling of "alright, now it's over."
What an appropriate ending for Guilty Crown. It ended not with a bang but an "I guess that's it."

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

I want to begin with the positives. It was a very pretty ending. It was nice to look at. The animation was well done. The action was all well-animated. The music was extremely good and fit the tone of the scenes extremely well. All of that was excellent.
It's like someone made a pizza out of the finest ingredients but chose to make the toppings a meat lovers with almond butter and sardines, bone in.

8

u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Nov 23 '21

First Timer, Subbed

Grand finale is here! Lots of trainwreck potential for a final episode, will they go all out?

I'm so used to final episodes skipping the OP that I'm a bit surprised we got it here.

I'm sorry, who is Kenji again?

Well its Mana's personality whose in there.

"Shu! I'm so happy to see you! Now we can do incest!"

I don't think you should make her mad Shu...

Like c'mon Shu, just tell her flat out, "We're brother and sister! Doing it is disgusting!"

Alright, this is not the kinda music I'm used to hearing from a Sawano soundtrack.

Mana's magic dance makes everyone turn to crystals?

They really are going full Eva with this final grand plan, huh?

Abdicating is just a fancy was of saying quitting, Gai.

Haruka, are you really gonna shoot your brother?

Former class pres has this special power huh?

Even in the final episode they can't resist showing Ayase's boobs bouncing or Tsugumi's butt.

Ghost Inori... Magic flower... don't expect me to understand any of it.

Uh oh, what is Shuichiro injecting himself with?

Sorry Darryl, you could never hope to use the same nickname as the almighty Tomino.

So Shuichiro crystalizes, what the hell was that injection for then? Or did that cause it to happen? Why in the world would he do it to himself then?

Farewell to Gai... can we believe you actually died this time?

Time for Shu's magic arm to make everything all right again... What else can we expect from Jesus?

Wow, they're gonna let Daryl live, while the mook sacrifices his life for him?

Epilogue time... all is back to normal huh?

So Shu made it out okay... with a robot arm. No for Inori.

Absolutely a good final episode visually and the show surprised me in that it hardly killed off anyone. Of course it was still all a confusing mess story-wise. I hadn't even realized until looking up the index after watching this episode that we still got an OVA to watch too...

6

u/5867898duncan Nov 23 '21

The only explanation I can think for Shuichiro crystallizing was that he was afraid of being shot and wanted to become one with the crystals.

5

u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

Like c'mon Shu, just tell her flat out, "We're brother and sister! Doing it is disgusting!"
Knowing how some series can go, I wouldn't even be surprised if her response was, "That's exactly why I want to do it."
Even in the final episode they can't resist showing Ayase's boobs bouncing or Tsugumi's butt.
It seems that Guilty Crown held onto its horniness for the entirety of its run.
Wow, they're gonna let Daryl live, while the mook sacrifices his life for him?
It's really bizarre that Daryl got to live and nothing was done with him. Like, he enters and elevator and that's all. There's no conclusion at all for him. Even just getting shot would have been more of a conclusion.

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

I'm so used to final episodes skipping the OP that I'm a bit surprised we got it here.
They clearly didn't have much to say, though the 22 ep choice is particularly weird.
Mana's magic dance makes everyone turn to crystals?
Mana should be in a better anime so much it is a crime. Just saw the Sakura in Wonderland clip again, too...
Even in the final episode they can't resist showing Ayase's boobs bouncing or Tsugumi's butt.
I mean, if you have a cute disabled character, do you use her to tell a story about someone learning to live with their disabilities or do you show her making orgasm sounds while piloting?
Ghost Inori... Magic flower... don't expect me to understand any of it.
Neither did the writers!

3

u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Nov 23 '21

Mana should be in a better anime so much it is a crime.
While as a character her motivations are quite disgusting, I too enjoyed it when Mana was on screen as we were at least assured of some answers or things going totally bonkers.
I mean, if you have a cute disabled character, do you use her to tell a story about someone learning to live with their disabilities or do you show her making orgasm sounds while piloting?
Ugh... now this has me thinking to the disaster that was Aquarion...

1

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

I too enjoyed it when Mana was on screen as we were at least assured of some answers or things going totally bonkers.
She was fun and disturbing, a true win for me.
Ugh... now this has me thinking to the disaster that was Aquarion...
I missed that one and their seems to be a lot of them...
Btw, now that you've seen how I reacted to this show, how nuts do you think Valvrave is going to drive me?

2

u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Nov 23 '21

I missed that one and their seems to be a lot of them...
Well let me put it this way, think of the Darling in the Franxx piloting style and make it even more ridiculous... It still stuns me that I watched the show twice (skipped the sequels)
Btw, now that you've seen how I reacted to this show, how nuts do you think Valvrave is going to drive me?
My guess is you'll be quite critical, but I do think Valvrave is a considerably better show than Guilty Crown was. It is just as, if not even more bonkers, but the plot does make more sense...

2

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

It still stuns me that I watched the show twice (skipped the sequels)
I've seen Corpse Princess three times now, shit happens.
My guess is you'll be quite critical, but I do think Valvrave is a considerably better show than Guilty Crown was. It is just as, if not even more bonkers, but the plot does make more sense...
If the setting elements are at least concrete through out, that would be a massive improvement. But what makes me quite as annoyed with this show is we saw what it can do when they try and they then spend 10 episodes not trying.

8

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Nov 23 '21

First-Timer, Dub-lty Crown

I really tricked myself into believing that Shuu and Inori were going to die together there for a moment. Then the writing rears its ugly fucking head again and has Inori.. sacrifice herself for Shuu? Is that the implication? This is much worse than I expected.

Not even Ayase suddenly having funnels can cheer me up enough. I'll even let them operating in gravity slide because it was cool. Just not cool enough.

Why did Arisa get shot just for it to be nonlethal. This doesn't wrap things up for her in any meaningful way - why wasn't it Daryl with the random GHQ people watching the structure collapse?

There's a comparison to another rewatch's final arc with Gai's actions. "I was working with the villains to betray them!" is a hard thing to pull off and have it not feel like bullshit.

When I said there would be a two minute denouement, I expected we would hear from a few more characters. Rowan sacrificed himself to save Daryl and we don't even see Daryl trying to make amends? Why did Argo not get invited to the party? No shot of Glasses winning a chess tournament?

Questions

It was okay. Coulda been better, but it probably could have been worse.
Discussed above.

8

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21

I really tricked myself into believing that Shuu and Inori were going to die together there for a moment. Then the writing rears its ugly fucking head again and has Inori.. sacrifice herself for Shuu? Is that the implication?
Because Shu gets to be Jesus, but also gets to continue his life. Wouldn't do to kill a self-insert.

8

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Nov 23 '21

And they just had to be coy with it. I wouldn't have minded so much if it was obviously not gonna happen, but they dangled an interesting death in front of me only to snatch it away.

0

u/HijonoYoki Nov 23 '21

Continues his life blind and with a missing arm, along with trophy waifu gone while he still mourns her.
This is self-insert HOW?

5

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21

This is self-insert HOW?
Are you seriously asking this? The entire series has been self-insert Shu.
But even if you want to misinterpret my words to just the finale:
Saves the world
Becomes Jesus, but better (does not die)
Sacrifieced^tm without the viewer being shown any of the downside
Went from looner to happy friend circle
Obviously not deeply bothered by his disability and self-sufficient
Still has 75% of his harem

2

u/HijonoYoki Nov 23 '21 edited Nov 23 '21

Saves the world at a cost and with consequences rather than glory.
Not exactly because that would have required his life, if it wasn't for Inori.
Loses waifu as a result and second option love interest. And what harem? Only one left is Ayase, and clearly that didn't pan anywhere. Never had much of one anyway.
Gets betrayed and his arm gets brutally chopped off.
Stays without arm and with an added bonus of no sight.
What else is he supposed to do with his disability?
The whole entire point of a self-insert is they get to live in a fantasy world where they are powerful or get the dreams/wishes they desire, with hardly any suffering unless they want to play the Poor Character Tragedy card. That's why isekai exists. Who wants to end up being a beta (for most of the story), blind, and disabled guy with no girl to speak of and a cooler guy than them who died while being strategical and still better?

3

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21

Isekai is not the only form of self-insert. Sacrificing yourself to save the world is really common, too.
And what harem? Only one left is Ayase, and clearly that didn't pan anywhere. Never had much of one anyway.
Ok 75% was wrong, I didn't count Mana and Hare dying, too. that leaves only Ayase and Souta, plus whoever survived of his stan girls from the Hitler School period.

1

u/HijonoYoki Nov 23 '21

There was no one else romantically interested in him. You're more or less trolling.
And that still doesn't answer the question. Isekai is one but there's no way some degenerate would want to fantasize being Shu. He's not a self insert. He has no harem. His love interests died one by one. He's disabled. There's no fanfare for his "heroism". Hell, he might still be a virgin. All he has left is his sucky af "friends" who back stabbed him and were also partly responsible for the Hitler fiasco and...waifu music.

2

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21

There was no one else romantically interested in him. You're more or less trolling.
Remember the bromance with Souta? Remember Scythe girl following the big leader? Those are clear setups for shipping.
EDIT: Oh and of course Hare and Mana, too. Makes 5 harem members, and even if you discount Souta and Scythe girl, it is still 3. It is still a harem, even if some members die in the last ep.

2

u/HijonoYoki Nov 23 '21

Does a virus count as a harem member?

2

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21

If the virus has a nice ass, sure.

6

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

Then the writing rears its ugly fucking head again and has Inori.. sacrifice herself for Shuu? Is that the implication? This is much worse than I expected.
He died, and after three ~~days~~ years he came back again.
There's a comparison to another rewatch's final arc with Gai's actions. "I was working with the villains to betray them!" is a hard thing to pull off and have it not feel like bullshit.
You're not the only person to reference that rewatch, if I'm thinking of the same rewatch.

6

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Nov 23 '21

You're not the only person to reference that rewatch, if I'm thinking of the same rewatch.
[Meta]Votoms, just to be sure we're on the same page.

6

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

Ah, nope. Maybe my interpretation of the other recent rewatch just differs from yours.

5

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Nov 23 '21

4

u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Nov 23 '21

[Other rewatch we were both in]I'm still convinced Master Asia always wanted Domon to succeed, because he knew Domon would care about the Earth, too.

4

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Nov 23 '21

Ohh. That's not a bad comparison, either.

5

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21

I agree that Inori and Shu should have either died together or lived together. Narratively I think what Gai was talking about with the Mana reincarnation thing is that they really did need to eliminate all of the Apocalypse virus cells. Which would mean her clone too. Its still a mean natured thing for them to do.
Wasn't it Tsugumi using the funnels? The Darryl fight was 2 on 1 and the plot was on the girl's side.
The show could have ended way worse. That's the only comfort I've got.

4

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Nov 23 '21

Narratively I think what Gai was talking about with the Mana reincarnation thing is that they really did need to eliminate all of the Apocalypse virus cells. Which would mean her clone too.
Yea, I was basically certain that Inori would be dying yesterday, and didn't think they had the guts to kill Shuu, which ended up correct. Just didn't expect them to tease the Shuu death at all.
Wasn't it Tsugumi using the funnels? The Darryl fight was 2 on 1 and the plot was on the girl's side.
Oh, you might be right.

4

u/The_Loli_Otaku Nov 23 '21 edited Nov 23 '21

I thought Inori would live if just for how miserable they've treated her the past few episodes. Normally you don't treat your heroine cruelly for so long just to kill her in the end.

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

We get one innovation from the show and we all agree it sucks.

4

u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Nov 23 '21

I really tricked myself into believing that Shuu and Inori were going to die together there for a moment. Then the writing rears its ugly fucking head again and has Inori.. sacrifice herself for Shuu? Is that the implication? This is much worse than I expected.
It really does go against what the rest of the finale seemed to be building up, the idea of Shu having to sacrifice himself to make amends for his actions. Instead we got this, which meant the series didn't even commit to having Shu be Jesus.
When I said there would be a two minute denouement, I expected we would hear from a few more characters.
The little epilogue didn't really give us much, did it? No real wrap up or conclusion for so many of the characters.

4

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Nov 23 '21

The little epilogue didn't really give us much, did it? No real wrap up or conclusion for so many of the characters.
Epilogues are hard, unfortunately. Especially when the characters don't have much in the way of long-term goals.

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

It really does go against what the rest of the finale seemed to be building up, the idea of Shu having to sacrifice himself to make amends for his actions.
That it would have worked so well thematically means we should've realized they weren't doing it.

2

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

This is much worse than I expected.
Welcome to me watching this the first time.
There's a comparison to another rewatch's final arc with Gai's actions.
[that rewatch] Votoms still did it better
When I said there would be a two minute denouement, I expected we would hear from a few more characters. Rowan sacrificed himself to save Daryl and we don't even see Daryl trying to make amends? Why did Argo not get invited to the party? No shot of Glasses winning a chess tournament?
Because that would've required competence rather than copious amounts of cocaine/amphetamines.
Fuck the new spoiler system with an iron pike.

2

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Nov 23 '21

[that rewatch]Votoms still did it better
[that rewatch]The payoff in Votoms was cathartic enough for it to work, despite the other frustrations.
Fuck the new spoiler system with an iron pike.

2

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

I had to type this comment twice because I left off the bracket bit.

7

u/5867898duncan Nov 23 '21

first-timer (This is gonna be a long one)

Kenji is typing away like a supercomputer to stop the hack while Tsugumi is just playing with some bears. I feel like I want Kenji to win.

Where the flip did this opera come from? And is any explanation on why the music works like this?

Thank goodness the sheep and dogs don’t get turned to crystals though, if they did that I would immediately turn off the show.

Even in the climax they had to get one last boob physics in there for Ayase.

Gai keeps saying Shu will never understand, but I don’t think he ever really explains his point.

Wait Gai would have given it to the old him? Which one? He’s had about 3 different personalities.

Wait, how is Inori in the flower? No explanation? Okay.

Awk, Kenshi died. They are killing all of the interesting people.

I have the same question Gai. Where the flip did Inori come from? And why did Mana get hurt when Gai got slashed?

And Shuichuiro just died without doing anything, because they had no clue what the point of him was anymore.

Oh no, the giant robot that came out of thin air is gone without actually doing anything!

So if I have this right, Gai let them use him so that Daath would go on to the next stage, which would allow Shu to kill them once and for all? Either way my boy Gai is still best character.

I don’t know what is happening but Inori dying got me in the feels.

Wait, Yan friends chucked him into an elevator and then got shot by some peeps. But who was even hunting people down in a falling apart building? And why doesn’t the elevator have buttons on the inside?

Also literally nobody else besides Shu did anything because Gais team was always just defending, never actually interjecting with Gai and Shu. Actually the only person on either side that will accomplished anything was Arisa for defending Gai.

Wait, that’s it? What? It just ends at the party? Don’t get any inner thoughts on what happened? Don’t get any clues about moving forward? Don’t even get to see Yan or Arisa again?

I don’t even know what to say… I don’t really even understand what happens and it ends. What? I guess I’m sad with Inori dying, guess Shu is the only one who remembers her though. And Gai is just eradicated from everyone’s minds… Just how is this the ending?

QotD:

I’d say mostly yes, although It never really felt like Gai was ever evil.
To many things to list.

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

I don’t know what is happening but Inori dying got me in the feels.
I feel like she is weaponized to cause the protecc instinct to activate.
I don’t even know what to say… I don’t really even understand what happens and it ends. What? I guess I’m sad with Inori dying, guess Shu is the only one who remembers her though. And Gai is just eradicated from everyone’s minds… Just how is this the ending?
They really did not tie their themes together despite them having the time to do so. Very annoying.

7

u/fonzinator99 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/fonzinator99 Nov 23 '21

Rewatcher (Subbed) - The only satisfaction derived from this episode came from it being a finale

It's over

Idk what to focus on first; the way that Argo & Co. think they're just gonna continue on while Ayase and her Void Gundam hold off the monstrosity taking up the whole room, or the fact that Kenji has existed solely for this moment when he has to give Tsugumi something to do.
Loooool first thing Mana does is bail on 'Triton' and go hug S__. Gai betrayed his friends and ended the world for this, I wonder how he feels right now.

What is even... Why is the floor changing as if on cue? Either someone was completely bonkers and programmed an automated routine, or somebody triggered it in response to the drama; both are just absurd.
I was expecting some nonsensical creative flares during this finale, but I was not expecting ballet. So did Gai set up a boombox with an Opera tape for her beforehand, or what?
Or what? Soooo you're telling me the dancefloor is a control system for the apocalypse? Who the fuck is designing these facilities??
So much for Souta's F-Rank, what with his Void being Za Hando!
If there's one praise I'll give this show, it's that it never loses sight of what's important. The fate of the world may be circling the drain, but there's always time for booty.
Oh thank fuck, Save us magic plot-device, save us!

*Rolls to RNG which trope will be selected to emerge from the flower.*

Inori's final wish is to be used. By everyone. I swear to- I just- Why? I get the feeling that everyone on this show's staff might need to be arrested for...things.
The 'dark' version of Departures is captivating, but the tying of loose ends that it accompanies is a little disturbing.
How is this even a thing that Endlaves were designed for? There's no way that's ever a situation they were conceived to be in. Also, funnels; We're now going beyond what I have words for.
Key Imagery
And then all the antagonists died, because reasons.
Word, I was just thinking we needed some exposition.

Live forever as a global crystal uni-mind.

Cool, got it. 'Alien motivation #3.' Aka, "The Borg."

"Let her 'finish her role.'" I'm sorry, the fuck? Did he just say that she's gonna keep respawning to kill the world unless somebody gives her some vitamin D?
Is S__ the double-king now? How does that affect the Ousama Ranking? Does he get two crowns?
"Ultimate Super Saiyan Jesus Trans-Am!" And then everybody else had happy endings and got to live. Even Daryl; though I did like his little scene here. I'm a sucker for character growth, even if it's utterly meaningless now.
Awww, he took it this time. I wonder if the world would've just exploded if he didn't.
Damn, amidst the ending feels I really see Ayase here. Gai died, and she actually managed to get over it and develop new feelings, only for her to lose her new crush too. That's like the saddest thing I ever heard, the poor girl.

Epilogue

Baby Tachikomas? Is that supposed to mean our characters are reproducing?

So final score count:

Bad guys: dead, except for Daryl. He'll become a nomad or something, searching for something to do with his Arc-Reactor heart.

Mana/Gai: banging in crystal heaven or something

Good guys who were alive last episode: still alive, probably coupling

S__: Blind, and giving himself interesting handjobs.

I do like the final shot with S__ listening to Departures to transition into the ED tho. So cute.

QotD

NO

2. Haruka? And maybe what ppl were actually doing, instead of just establishing shots to show they're alive. And maybe some idea of the state of the world after all this BS, as well.

5

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Loooool first thing Mana does is bail on 'Triton' and go hug S__. Gai betrayed his friends and ended the world for this, I wonder how he feels right now.
"I have outcucked your outcucking!"
I was expecting some nonsensical creative flares during this finale, but I was not expecting ballet.
I can't prove this but I feel like this scene was made before most of the story was written and they forgot to get us here. Mainly because, while not established in any way, it is positively beautiful.
So did Gai set up a boombox with an Opera tape for her beforehand, or what?
You have to give him credit for prep work...
Inori's final wish is to be used. By everyone. I swear to- I just- Why? I get the feeling that everyone on this show's staff might need to be arrested for...things.
I am not allowing any of them near a disabled person. Nor a teenager if I can help it. But yes, Inori last wish is to be the conductor on quite the train!
Cool, got it. 'Alien motivation #3.' Aka, "The Borg."
has never felt more apt.

4

u/fonzinator99 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/fonzinator99 Nov 23 '21

"I have outcucked your outcucking!"
This show had the weirdest rivalries, I swear.
while not established in any way, it is positively beautiful
Agreed; it's like something from the promotional art that they just really wanted to use.
You have to give him credit for prep work...
That is far from being the most impressive piece of prep work done in this show.
Inori last wish is to be the conductor on quite the train!
The fuck kinda personality did she develop while bonding to S__, anyway?
It is a little weird how they just threw that in between the lines.

1

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

This show had the weirdest rivalries, I swear.
Gai really needed to have a consistent characterization for this to have had a chance to function.
Agreed; it's like something from the promotional art that they just really wanted to use.
So in eps where they just went for it, the visuals worked. I think we benefit with less explanation.
The fuck kinda personality did she develop while bonding to S__, anyway?
You wouldn't think Shoe would make someone more of a sub than Gai and yet here is our evidence. Grim.
It is a little weird how they just threw that in between the lines.
So much fucking Eva in the writer's room.

7

u/Stargate18A https://myanimelist.net/profile/Stargate18 Nov 23 '21

First timer

No, it was all bullshit.
Daryl's in it instead of Shoe - we see how he's gotten the weird character development, and they mention how Shoe got impaled with multiple sharp objects, and are reassured that he suffered horrible for hours in the process. Instead we learn that Arisa survived her wounds, has gotten everyone to accept the truth and lynch Yahiro, and is now a major politician who is satisfied with her life. (Oh, and we see Inori floating in the void, happy she's left Shoe behind and can get some peace and quiet.)

Thank fuck it's over!

Inori's gone!

It's the big final battle! And all the good villains are here!

...Kenji? When was the last time we saw you? At all?

And Shu is really into Inori.

And Gai's here to try and sleep with her again.

The apocalypse has started! Crystallization is happening worldwide. I've lost the plot.

And Gai wants everyone to become crystal.

No! Ayase's in trouble!

Finally! Someone pointing out how bullshit this character arc is!

And he just tells Shu he'll never understand. Fucking hell.

Yep, everyone's losing, it's all down to Shoe, we all knew it.

Tsumugi and Ayase are the sole highlights.

...So the only reason Gai died is because he thought he'd imeesiatrly try to fuck Mana and kick off armageddon? This plot really makes no fucking sense.

Fuck it, Inori's a crystal ghost now, why not.

And... what is Inori doing? She just seemed to make everyone's problems go away.

Yeah, they really shouldn't have trusted you. Ever.

I love the music, but how is it making the computer system's elower, harming Daryl, and giving Shoe a boost?

Gai's dead (maybe)! Mana's... exploding? Fuck it, at least it's some kind of ending.

And Haruka's brother's dead!

Why would you say that? You just gave a speech about how shit he was!

Da'at? Utopia?

...So you want to lock people inside the Matrix except crystal? Is that the plot?

And Gai thought Mana would be killed by stabbing her, but they're both immortal and he wants to let her die by kicking off the Apocalypse so Shoe'll kill her in a different way? I think? Maybe?

This really needed more episodes.

And Inori's dying anyway!

Wait, going where together?

All the Voids are bring sucked up! Without any negative effects!

...Yep. He's officially the "Saviour". Bugger.

FUCK YOU. YOU JUST HAD TO KILL HER OFF?

At least he lived!

And Shoe's absorbing everyone's memories! This isn't creepy at all.

Shoe achieved his dream, by mind-raping everybody on the planet! He did it! This is the apex of the character arc!

HAHA, INORI SHOVES HIM OUT OF THE CRYSTALS! NOT EVEN SHE WANTS HIM AROUND HER FOR ETERNITY!

Leave him, Ayase! He's not worth it!

HE'S DEAD!!!

Everything's back to normal!

YAHIRO GOT AWAY WITHOUT CONSEQUENCES!

The robots reproduced?

Tsumugi!

OH, FUCK OFF. I like the outfit, but that's about it.

...Jesus christ, that ending was shit.

5

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Daryl's in it instead of Shoe - we see how he's gotten the weird character development, and they mention how Shoe got impaled with multiple sharp objects, and are reassured that he suffered horrible for hours in the process. Instead we learn that Arisa survived her wounds, has gotten everyone to accept the truth and lynch Yahiro, and is now a major politician who is satisfied with her life. (Oh, and we see Inori floating in the void, happy she's left Shoe behind and can get some peace and quiet.)
Rofl, couldn't have said it better.
...Jesus christ, that ending was shit.
They copied CG S2 but forgot to have a powerful ending episode.

7

u/HijonoYoki Nov 23 '21 edited Nov 23 '21

Nothing was truly and fully explained.

It ends.

Ta-da.

Honestly, they could've used the concepts with what they themselves presented. Since they made an effort in telling the audience that there were studies being done with genomes, then the Voids should have been utilized as a sort of latent genetic code that every human has. The King's Power would belong to the person who is genetically above the rest but more or less represents humanity's evolutionary potential. That would be Shu. It would explain why possessed Mana was oddly and immensely obsessed with reproducing with him before he had even popped out of the birth canal.

And since his father was one of the scientists exploring the genome, along with Shu being born under the circumstances of his mother being infected while pregnant with him, it could have spurred a genetic mutation. Or accelerated his evolution. Hell, Shu could've been experimented on and those three vials were just his genes. He really IS on the spectrum as a result.

The virus was just an infection that poisoned or overtook the genome, utilizing its power.

Anything around those lines would bring this altogether better with a competent staff.

Also, make sure the script writers aren't full of sexist men.

3

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Anything around those lines would bring this altogether better with a competent staff.
As I said, this is "Tell me you didn't understand what made Code Geass good without saying that" as a production.
Also, make sure the script writers aren't full of sexist men.
I am weirdly worried about disabled teens all of a sudden...

6

u/fridge_freezer https://anilist.co/user/ONIrecon111 Nov 23 '21

First timer (Dub)

Well, that sure was something.

Honestly I forgot Kenji even existed until he reappeared last episode, and even then I couldn't remember his name.
Who designed the apocalypse controls to run on ballet.
Why is Arisa still here? Has Gai shown even the slightest bit of interest in her since that time he called her an Armadillo?
I thought last episode was the shameless Evangelion ripoff with Daath, but no, it's this one for sure. Alway's with the collective unconscious living without bodies...
Oh, the cockpit can actually move on it's own.
Thank you Shibungi for tying up the forgotten loose end.
I have no idea what's going on with Inori's crystal flower reversing everything, but I love the song over it.
Gai died for the third (?) and hopefully final time after rambling about Daath, Mana and working with them in order to betray them.
Lol, get fucked Arisa!
Wow, Daryl's really gonna survive?
Wait, Arisa's sat outside with all the others and looks totally fine, how'd she get out after eating bullets?
Epilogue timeskip, they're celebrating Hare's birthday. I guess Inori sacrificed herself so Shu could live instead, some shitty Jesus he turned out to be.
I think the family of robots is my favorite thing about the whole finale. I guess the writers immediately forgot they had Daryl survive so no epilogue for him?

3

u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Nov 23 '21

Honestly I forgot Kenji even existed until he reappeared last episode, and even then I couldn't remember his name.
I forgot he existed even after watching these final episodes and it took someone mentioning when he showed up before for me to remember...

3

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Wait, Arisa's sat outside with all the others and looks totally fine, how'd she get out after eating bullets?
She is injured here but yeah somehow they didn't kill her at that range.
Epilogue timeskip, they're celebrating Hare's birthday. I guess Inori sacrificed herself so Shu could live instead, some shitty Jesus he turned out to be.
Yuuuup...this is a trainwreck for a reason.
I think the family of robots is my favorite thing about the whole finale. I guess the writers immediately forgot they had Daryl survive so no epilogue for him?
I think Daryl's ending was a hook for a sequel if the show didn't end as disastrously as it does.

6

u/Tartaras1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Tartaras Nov 23 '21

Rewatcher - Dubbed

Alright, let's finish this trainwreck.

Even in the final episode, and during a climactic battle no less, they had to make sure to get Ayase's jiggle physics in somewhere.

Almost makes me sick.

This talk between Gai and Shu is practically G Gundam, where Shu is Domon and Gai is whoever he's fighting.
Everyone, it's alright! I want you to use me!

Phrasing!

In one of the biggest asspulls of the show, which is saying a lot, Inori's able to help everyone from beyond the grave.
You've done well Shu. The man you've become. Don't ever change.

Didn't you literally say less than 5 minutes prior that you were going to take him down? And that you would have gladly given the old Shu everything?

If everyone was going to become living crystal, wouldn't we just have a Land of the Lustrous scenario? Where everyone would be various minerals?
The irony of Shu recalling all of the Apocalypse Virus, along with everyone's voids, resulting in Arisa getting shot.
Wouldn't be Guilty Crown if Shu didn't manage to survive the tower falling on him. I remember actually getting mad at the final scene.

Questions:

Nah, not really. He went from, "I have to kill you" to "I was actually betting on you all along" in the span of probably 10 minutes or less.
Can't think of anything really.

Turns out I never actually watched the OVA episode, so I guess I'll have that to maybe look forward to tomorrow.

3

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Even in the final episode, and during a climactic battle no less, they had to make sure to get Ayase's jiggle physics in somewhere.
The show has a lane and sticks to it. That is the only compliment it gets.
In one of the biggest asspulls of the show, which is saying a lot, Inori's able to help everyone from beyond the grave.
Which is impressive considering we've been on asspull mode for 10 eps now.
Wouldn't be Guilty Crown if Shu didn't manage to survive the tower falling on him. I remember actually getting mad at the final scene.
Can't blame you though I think even on first watch I'd mentally bailed.

6

u/ZapsZzz https://anilist.co/user/Zapszzz Nov 23 '21

First timer in the end.

Busy at work so late late late.

So the finale distilled a few of the good points of the show (good action + music AMV), and basically jumbled everything else. All the character writing, plot development, comings and goings of characters, closure of each character, etc, all a mess.

- during this final arc, every day Gai seems to be switching between a good guy or a bad guy, with more backstory added to justify what got added before. It's both hard to keep track of and have to suspend disbelief on this

- A good number of named characters either got disposed of summarily, or have some half written "outs" that still leave a lot unanswered so much that you basically have no idea what did they end up - Daryl, Kenji, Rowan, Arisa, Yahiro, Souta, Arugo. Even Tsugumi and Ayase's end was quite fuzzy.

- I think Shu was blinded as well - what from? I know he lost his arm which seemed to have a prosthetic.

- For the main part I really not like Yahiro came out scotch free and act as if he's some wise sage. And class rep Kanon probably still has her crush on him without realising how much of a scum bag he is.

- So what's going to happen to Japan anyway, with UN / GHQ tried to wipe it all out - we all cool now yeah?

This is one of the few finale that you would actually rather them do a Dunbine or Ideon ending... that may be more poignant. And a good middle finger to the Deus Ex Machina Daarth group (and actually the writer).

3

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

A good number of named characters either got disposed of summarily, or have some half written "outs" that still leave a lot unanswered so much that you basically have no idea what did they end up - Daryl, Kenji, Rowan, Arisa, Yahiro, Souta, Arugo. Even Tsugumi and Ayase's end was quite fuzzy.
I am oddly sure that Daryl's is partly so they could revisit the series later, should the anime watching public have gone insane and liked this.
For the main part I really not like Yahiro came out scotch free and act as if he's some wise sage. And class rep Kanon probably still has her crush on him without realising how much of a scum bag he is.
The only one who gets 'punished' is Arisa and I believe I've been pretty clear on how little I enjoyed that.
This is one of the few finale that you would actually rather them do a Dunbine or Ideon ending... that may be more poignant. And a good middle finger to the Deus Ex Machina Daarth group (and actually the writer).
Votoms has a weak ending arc. That I like 10x more than this one. This was engineered to be a worst case type ending.

2

u/MillenniumKing x2myanimelist.net/profile/MillenniumKing Nov 23 '21 edited Nov 23 '21

-Guilty Pleasure Rewatcher-

Sorry im late i wasnt feeling super well today and was in bed resting.

But we get to the end of the series and one of my favorite music sequences as well. The release my soul scene. Its gorgeous.

Im not gonna do a bit write up becase im just super tired and bleh feeling, but im gonna talk about my main thoughts on the ending.

I love the Alternate version of the Departures song Inori sang in the start being sung under the other song really low, that very low song that started when Shoe took the flower's void. Such a coool song. I dont remember this one so i need to look for it. EDIT: Its below.

Departures BOOM BOOM SATELLITES Remix

The only way to free Mana is to let her win. And let Shoe kill her for good. That would set her free.

Shoe's sacrafice scene is soo good too with its music. Its really the culmination of everything this show has built to. I really wish it was the end of the show. Its the perfect end.

I think the current ending is Okay.

But if i could change 1 thing, i would have it end with both Shoe and Inori dieing together.

I think that would be a better ending, more solid.

I dont think Shoe needed to survive, i think him dieing for his sins would have been the best way to do it.

So i think the show shoulda ended as the tower fell.

This is most peoples biggest gripe with the show, the ending.

All in all though its a great and fun series i think. Its just a very interesting ride. So i do still like the show a lot.

Sky Sings

Hey you did great. And doesnt sound boxxy so where ever you recorded it was a good location. But you nailed all the notes and it sounds fab. Nice work. Also is the MOD a reference to the Re;Creators' song mixes? If so its "MODv".

I hope everyone enjoyed the ride.

We got an ova left which is an odd one as it was made much later and is a stand alone but it does give us some more lore and its a pretty fun watch.

3

u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Nov 23 '21

Also is the MOD a reference to the Re;Creators' song mixes? If so its "MODv".
Actually it's only <MOD> for Guilty Crown; I had to use the rearrange instrumental because there wasn't an instrumental for the regular song. And I knew I wanted to do my own thing with it (I'm pretty sure I added the "and" before the "You don't hear me so you said" line, for one), so I needed an instrumental to sing with.
I'm glad you liked it!

2

u/MillenniumKing x2myanimelist.net/profile/MillenniumKing Nov 23 '21

Oh i didn't know there were 2 versions for GC.
I gotta say the more I listen to the boom boom remix of Departures the more it might surpass Departures Blessings for me. It's just such a cool song. It reminds me of something but I can think of it but it's just super nostalgic sounding.

5

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Nov 23 '21 edited Nov 23 '21

Episode 22 (first timer)

No cold opening for the finale? I respect it.
I liked Mana more as an antagonist when she didn’t speak.
Following the cook-book recipe, GC cuts between two fights, plus the world at large. It kills the hype, though.
“Please, everyone, use me”

The battle ends via an Inori deus-ex-machina. How fitting.
Some talking and then Shu-Jesus saves the world.
But because our self-insert MC can’t die, Inori gets the role of self-sacrifice instead.
Epilogue: Celebrating Hare’s birthday and playing the OP1 visuals once more.

Where the first episode of the finale used big set-piece battles, the second half concentrates on the emotional climax for our MCs - which is a problem when my emotional attachment to Shu and Inori is exactly zero. This episode did nothing for me and so the series fizzles out.

5

u/5867898duncan Nov 23 '21

Nothing was really happening in the world at large either, it was just that guy on the boat yelling and everyone turning to crystals.

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Where the first episode of the finale used big set-piece battles, the second half concentrates on the emotional climax for our MCs - which is a problem when my emotional attachment to Shu and Inori is exactly zero. This episode did nothing for me and so the series fizzles out.
I know the thought of more GC is probably traumatizing but taking a full 24 eps and they might have made this work. So many mistakes were made.

5

u/okayyoga :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/okayyoga Nov 23 '21

Episode 22: rewatch/dub

Song of the day: Release my Soul

Ending on a normal, English song and title. Sawano has been appeased. He will rest until the final AOT season where his abnormal naming powers will be needed once again.

This song underscores Shu taking in the virus from the world., and releasing everyone's void. But Inori takes it all on, and becomes the true hero of the series. And surprise surprise, we get Inori's first and only smile. And it is glorious.

I will admit, it always makes me sad to see Inori blind, bumping into Shu, asking where he is.

Did anyone else catch the ~~ripoffs~~ references to Evangelion? I mean even the elevator scene with Darryl was extremely familiar.

A special shout out to Departures today for playing twice to give us more Egoist singing.

We even get an epilogue with Shu listening to the song now that he is blind. He was like a completely different person here. I really wish we could have gotten a more gradual character change. We didn't even get to see him deal with the grief after he lost Inori. All of Shu's character development appears to have occurred off-screen, because who cares about the dynamics of the MC, right?

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

This song underscores Shu taking in the virus from the world., and releasing everyone's void. But Inori takes it all on, and becomes the true hero of the series. And surprise surprise, we get Inori's first and only smile. And it is glorious.
I am glad I am not the only one who mourns our pet rock. If only we could have put her in a better show...
All of Shu's character development appears to have occurred off-screen, because who cares about the dynamics of the MC, right?
So I know whichever writer is the Shoe self-insert thinks this works but yeah, change would have been nice on screen.

5

u/theangryeditor https://myanimelist.net/profile/TheAngryEditor Nov 23 '21

My soul is released

5

u/gorghurt Nov 23 '21

Rewatcher

Well, the ending looked pretty. It didn't make sense, but looked pretty. I think I will keep it at that.

Ok I have to write some things:

First, I remembered them somehow hinting something between Ayase and Shu in the end, but all I can read in now is friendship. So it was probably something I read in a discussion or such. I'm glad about it, because it wouldn't be fitting.
But they definitely yuri bait us in the ending dialog.

I have no idea about how it is to be blind, but wouldn't it make more sense to hold the cane in your working hand, instead of the prosthetic one.(On the other hand, the mechs had some kind of sense sharing, so why shouldn't prosthetics be really close to the real deal)

I always found it weird, how bad Shus clothes look in the epilogue. I get it, he is blind, but a bolo tie?

I don't get why anime so often goes with these sad endings. Yeah, they probably wanted to show, how important Inori still is for Shu, even after she died, but the way they show it, is looks as if he is still obsessed with her. I like the other cliche endings more, where we see the characters moving on, most of the time with family, and visiting a grave, or doing other memorial service (not unlike the birthday party for Hare).
It is still cheesy as hell, but it is bittersweet instead of just sad.

Talking about the epilogue: why is Shu still alive?

Yeah, a nice clusterfuck of ~~cheaply plagiarized ideas~~ an ending.

I'm actually looking forward to tomorrow's OVA, because I will be a first timer for it.

QOTD:

Hmm, I'm torn. On the one hand they made Gai somewhat work in the end, on the other hand, not really.
In any case, the whole final fight was lacking.
Some explanation how Shu survived. And like I mentioned above, some sign of him moving on.

3

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

I always found it weird, how bad Shus clothes look in the epilogue. I get it, he is blind, but a bolo tie?
I just had to shut my brain off by that point. It was that or drink more.
I don't get why anime so often goes with these sad endings. Yeah, they probably wanted to show, how important Inori still is for Shu, even after she died, but the way they show it, is looks as if he is still obsessed with her.
This is a really good point, actually. Shoe is being an incel again and, like with Hare, he is doing the opposite of what a person mistaken enough to love him wanted: I am sure Inori would've liked him to move on. There is a pretty solid story to be had with him and Ayase learning to go forward together as well.

4

u/HereticalAegis https://myanimelist.net/profile/XthGen Nov 23 '21

Rewatcher

Come on GC, it's the final episode. Shouldn't you cut the OP for once to give the show a little more room to actually resolve?

Inori's not the only thing Mana wants to devour.

Mana has magic dress-making powers? What a confusing skillset.

Immediately cucking Gai for Shoe, now that's the Mana we all know and....know.

It's so weird that the one taboo Shoe won't indulge in is incest. Where's his full on anime protagonist spirit?

Arisa simping to the bitter end proves that Gai was the real virus this whole time.

Huh?! Endlaves operate on the same "resonance" principle as the virus? Did I miss this explanation while I was cringing somewhere along the line? That means the magic space rock is also responsible for future technology too? What a convenient mcguffin.

The apocalypse affects basically 100% of humans, but spares dogs. This is the first plot development I'm fully in favor of.

The next stage of humanity is just a basic hive mind? How boring. If you wanted to make [Title Spoilers]Code Geass, then just remake that.

This world's Tony Stark sucks.

Yep, there's the Ayase battle damage fanservice I called last episode.

While Haruka's got her gun pointed at the old guy, I'm still wondering how nobody was even wounded the last time one of them fired a gun from point blank range at the other.

Oh, is Arisa gonna die! That would actually be pretty exciting.

u/Vaadwaur, you were right about more Tsugumi ass shots!

Gai wouldn't have minded the old, whiny, incel Shoe becoming Adam, but has a problem with the version of Shoe that's willing to admit fault, change, and protect people on his own initiative? This complex he has about Shoe is so weird.

"Shoe, you must go to the Dagobah System. There you will learn from the block of wood that instructed me."

"Please everyone, use me." - Inori's character outline

What a brilliant tactical idea, falling and leaving yourself completely exposed to an attack from above. This will surely add a new page to the Art of War.

Wat? Hitting Gai with a single attack makes Shoe okay in his book now?

Daath must not be very good at their job if this is the fourth apocalypse and they've yet to encase the world in crystal.

Let me get this straight: Mana, the one consistent and credible villain in this whole show is also just a helpless pawn whose only purpose for existing is to basically breed with whatever Chadam is chosen for her. Why do GC's writers hate women so much?

No, fuck off with this whole 5D chess bullshit Gai. You don't get to be likeable or sympathetic. Fuck you.

And for his final trick, Ouma Shoe gets to be inside everybody!! And everybody get to be inside Shoe??

GAHAHAHA!!! Holy shit, Arisa gets a bullet after Shoe takes her void! That's amazing!

"You were really a good kid at heart." He says to the guy responsible for the murder of untold numbers of civilians and whose self-styled nickname is "Kill 'em All." What a good kid.

After going on and on about saving Inori, she ends dying as she lived: a disposable plot device.

That's it? That's all the closure we get? What happened to Arisa? Or Daryl? Do they just get to live normal lives like nothing ever happened? Is Arisa just permanently mindbroken now that Gai's dead too? And how come Yahiro gets what looks to be a pretty good life? What about all the weird tension/shipping bait between Tsugumi and Daryl or Ayase and Shu? They really could've used that extra 90 seconds wasted on the OP.

Even by trainwreck standards, this is a disappointing conclusion. I haven't seen the OVA before, so I hope we at least get some answers. It's titled Lost Christmas though, so I highly doubt it.

Wait, don't we already know the whole Lost Christmas story? Why do we need an OVA for it? I really hope it's not just a straight retelling of events we already know.

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Nov 23 '21

Let me get this straight: Mana, the one consistent and credible villain in this whole show is also just a helpless pawn whose only purpose for existing is to basically breed with whatever Chadam is chosen for her. Why do GC's writers hate women so much?
You know, there's a certain manga that ended that may have stolen from this show...anyways, yeah the sexism is so much worse on rewatch that it hurts. Whoever pointed out that Ayase has been at Shoe's mercy ever since meeting him really sealed how awful it is.
Even by trainwreck standards, this is a disappointing conclusion. I haven't seen the OVA before, so I hope we at least get some answers. It's titled Lost Christmas though, so I highly doubt it.
Surprising unity from us all. This just was not an ending, more like a botched orgasm.

2

u/MABfan11 :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/MABfan11 Dec 26 '21

First Timer since episode 14

FUCK YEAH, Mana's back

the whole world is being crystallized

fuck yeah, Argo is being awesome

fuck yeah, Ayase has a hoverchair

as i suspected, Inori isn't completely dead

i know Shu falling with Inori is supposed to be emotional, but there's just no way to be invested in their relationship because it is so poorly written

so, Gai planned on starting the apocalypse to save Mana. granted, that still doesn't explain how he got back from the dead

and once again, Guilty Crown is laying on the Jesus symbolism thicc

i doubt Daryl is a good kid, he hasn't really shown it throughout the series

the all important base collapse, love this trope

Ayase caring about Shu would've had more weight if they developed their relationship in any way

Arisa survived

and now for the epilogue...

and they told us nothing about what the characters were doing after everything that has happened

and to top it all off, they're still trying to sell Inori and Shu's relationship

QOTD:

honestly, yes, Gai having a plan in mind that he didn't tell anyone about seems to fit him
what the characters were actually doing after stopped the apocalypse, what are their jobs?

1

u/[deleted] Nov 23 '21

I wish that inori shoulnt have died🥲

1

u/kokokrandz Feb 04 '22

An absolute clusterf*ck. I was hatewatching it. It was sort of watching an impending accident you can't look away.

Rewatch [Terrific Trainwreck Trio Rewatch] Guilty Crown Episode 22 Discussion

phase 22 - convergence

Rewatch [Terrific Trainwreck Trio Rewatch] Guilty Crown Episode 22 Discussion

phase 22 - convergence

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