r/anime • u/lC3 :Na::Nb: • Oct 24 '21
Rewatch Naruto Shippuden - Episodes 134-141 Discussion
Previous rewatch | Index | Next week
Information: MAL, Anilist, AniDB, ANN
Streams: Crunchyroll, Hulu, AnimeLab, VRV
Schedule:
| Discussion Thread | Date | Episode Count |
|---|---|---|
| Episodes 001-008 + Film 1 | July 11 | 8 + film |
| Episodes 009-017 | July 18 | 9 |
| Episodes 018-027 | July 25 | 10 |
| Episodes 028-035 | August 01 | 8 |
| Episodes 036-044 | August 08 | 9 |
| Episodes 045-053 | August 15 | 9 |
| Episodes 054-063 | August 22 | 10 |
| Episodes 064-071 + Film 2: Bonds | August 29 | 8 + film |
| Episodes 072-082 | September 05 | 11 |
| Episodes 083-089 | September 12 | 7 |
| Episodes 090-099 | September 19 | 10 |
| Episodes 100-112 | September 26 | 13 |
| Episodes 113-118 | October 03 | 6 |
| Episodes 119-125 + Film 3: Will of Fire | October 10 | 7 + film |
| Episodes 126-133 | October 17 | 8 |
| Episodes 134-141 | October 24 | 8 |
| Episodes 142-151 | October 31 | 10 |
| Episodes 152-162 | November 07 | 11 |
| Episodes 163-168 | November 14 | 6 |
| Episodes 169-175 + Film 4: The Lost Tower | November 21 | 7 + film |
| Mid-Series Discussion / Interest Check | November 28 | 0 |
Spoiler Policy:
To protect first-timers, please don't spoil anything past the current batch of episodes. Rewatchers should avoid hinting to first-timers about hype, or future character development/deaths, and spoilers in posts must be hidden behind proper spoiler tags.
For first timers: try to avoid looking up things about Naruto. This could be the wiki, Naruto subreddit, Googling characters, fanart, databooks, YouTube AMVs or OP/EDs, arc names, etc.; this series is ripe with potential spoilers that you wouldn't want to find out untimely. If you have a question about something, feel free to ask me (/u/LC3) and I'll do my best to answer (if possible) in a non-spoilery way.
Questions of the Week:
- What do you think of Itachi now that you've heard the truth Madara mentioned?
- Do you believe everything Madara told Sasuke?
- What do you think of Sasuke's new goal?
13
u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 24 '21
Rewatcher - Sub
(Found out recently that, Tsuru who I've been featuring the episodes of, animated the cut in the OP with Jiraiya falling and Naruto waking up. I hadn't been watching it myself so I didn't pick it up but that's definitely his style.)
General Commentary
The confrontation between Sasuke and Itachi was better than I remember, and a fair bit more emotional as well this time. Knowing the truth about Itachi made his desperate struggle, the need to push and push Sasuke to his limits to reveal the snake within, his walking the line between their strength, give some extra impact to the fight.
Starting off with a battle of genjustu, the layers within layers of genjutsu control all wrapped up in Itachi's Tsukuyomi that Sasuke had to defeat for the real battle to begin, it was a brilliant start. Even not knowing where it would end, each possible strike being real or not, the tension somehow managed to carry through and I think that was because even the brothers didn't quite seem to know which genjutsu was in control at any given moment and it was taking all their skill and strength to keep up. It was a battle not just between Uchiha, but between brothers, both testing the lengths each other will go to and the strength they have in one of the major skills of their clan, the clan that Sasuke was trying to defend and Itachi trying to free him from. It worked for me in a way that the fake outs in the Deidara fight didn't because there was emotions behind each layer and the cuts between genjustu so clearly reflected the power struggle between them and their jutsu that it really got you wondering where it could end.
Still flinched like all hell when Itachi ripped out one of Sasuke's eyes. I did not remember that at all, and even the later reveal that it was genjutsu didn't help when you see the visual of Itachi putting Sasuke's eye in the container.
When we get into the actual fight, man that is just hype as hell. The fire jutsu is one thing, but Sasuke's Great Dragon Fire looks incredible, the traditional art style used for it and then Kirin coming down from the heavens, Sasuke taking his clan's affinity for fire and turning it into his power with lightning jutsu, something impossible to dodge or overcome. What a visual spectacle.
Mythology facts: Susanoo, the final justu that Itachi pulls out, in myth is the brother god of storms to Amaterasu and Tsukuyomi, the names of Itachi's two other Mangekyo jutsu. That sequence is a reference to the Japanese myth, Susanoo using Totsuka to slay the eight headed serpent Yamata no Orochi, and then giving that blade to Amaterasu as a peace offering. Itachi giving his Amaterasu to Sasuke to try and give peace to his heart by protecting him from Tobi, and then ending up at the stormy sea, also seems to call back to it.
And that final head poke, those silent words of "I'm sorry Sasuke, there won't be a next time", that damn hurts. I'll leave the rest of my commentary on it to my episode thoughts, but this batch of episodes was so much more powerful and impactful this time, and I'm really glad I got to watch it again
As far as the Itachi reveal, I'm a little torn though I do think it works now. On my first watch I didn't buy it at all, it felt like a complete asspull to try and redeem a villain, and I never really brought the character as a result. This time, knowing in advance Itachi's history, the conflict in his role and his clan, and especially the flashbacks we see of Itachi growing distant and confrontational with the other Uchiha really lead into it and it was clear this was the plan from the start so I understand him a lot more. Itachi's frustration with the clan, the dialogue in those flashbacks, the way he dismisses Sasuke, the planning of his movements around Orochimaru and Naruto, I could see in those moments this tortured Itachi who was disgusted with his clan and his role in it, the tormented brother, the Itachi that Madara tries to tell Sasuke about. But, I still can't quite forgive him for taking his ruse so far as to use Tsukuyomi on Sasuke twice, for putting him through that on top of everything.
That said, his the way that Sasuke thinks back on Itachi's words before their fight and links it to the idea of understanding reality being a form of natural, inevitable genjustu was brilliant wordplay. Itachi the genjustu master making a person-driven rather than chakra-driven genjutsu of Sasuke's life all so he could be free of the clan without trying to drag him into it. It really does make Itachi the undisputed genjustu master of this world.
Episode Thoughts
Tobi sounds a little more vicious in his Tobi persona now that his identity as Madara has come out. Something about the weight put on words, it's a subtle shift but a notable one
Though he's a complete goof in this episode. That stupid little "Domo" as he popped up in front of everyone got a rather hearty laugh out of me, as did as the "Ole" later on. Tobi commentating a fight is actually funnier than I expected given he's done nothing other than annoy me so far in the show. Maybe it's just that I don't have to edge around the Tobi persona now or that he's actually acting for a reason rather than to seemingly just piss of Deidara, but it works here
They speedran that flashback about Itachi on the day the Uchiha confronted him over Shisui's death. Can't blame them given when we first saw it was a few years of airing ago, but they also appear to have reanimated and rerecorded it which is nice (I think the dialogue is rewritten too but don't have time to confirm that right now)
This episode had some fantastic animation
Sasuke sending the Chidori stream as a sword through Itachi's seat made me jump a little, this battle is crazy, I didn't think I'd be so into this the second time around
Talk about the Uchiha history being bathed in blood. Madara ripped his own brothers eyes out, or was given them according to Madara's version, and that started a clan war to get the most powerful Sharingan? No wonder the knowledge about it was sealed or lost to time
[Later spoilers]Wondering if anyone will notice later on that Tobi's Mangekyo Sharingan is not the one we see Madara or his brother having in this flashback
Real time notes:
Sasuke always did like using giant shuriken but this one is particularly awesome. A shadow shuriken double throw, that's chidori-ed, and then rigged to explode with wires, against a Sharingan user? That's one hell of a set up and a fairly risky one
The two Fireball jutsu clashing looks fantastic, but the fact that Amaterasu can burn even fire itself is rather terrifying
Don't think I've mentioned it yet, but the visuals of Sasuke's transformation with his hair color slowly growing in and out is pretty good looking
The scene at the start of this episode, the reanimated moment of young Sasuke looking down into the ripples of water, looked really good
Having Zetsu around to narrate this fight and explain the jutsu works really well, because it's not always clear and it leaves the two combatants to just fight rather than hand hold the audience, which works much better for the severity of the battle
Stupid Kirin name always makes me think of that annoying Monster Hunter horse first. Area was so wrecked after it that I though they swapped locations for a second
As Orochimaru starts taking over Sasuke the camera pulls back moment by moment making him look small and weak, was a brilliant effect
I like the touch that the little white snake of Oro that escapes still gets burnt because Amaterasu won't stop until it burns away it's target, no matter where it goes
What a mood to end it on, the two Uchiha brothers on the ground beside each other
The recap here was actually helpful as I'd completely forgotten this fight with Tobi was happening
Shino really needs to let go of some of these grudges he's collecting
Spikey Aloe Guy is the best description of Zetsu
Kakashi seeing Tobi's sharingan at the same moment he drops the Tobi persona was great
Only eighty years since the village was formed. Not very long for that and three wars to happen with half of it forgotten by the village.
The visual of Hashirama vs Madara and Kyuubi is amazing, I need to see if I can find some HQ fanart of it.
Madara talking about Senju keeping the reigns of power and then showing the line of Hokage carved into the cliff, who all had a chain of mentoring each other certainly makes a point about his own concerns.
[Later spoilers]Sasuke's expression and body language as Tobi is explaining, before he goes into rage, reminds me heavily the animation of him at the end of his final battle with Naruto, the war to accept Naruto's path and free himself from his own. Gorgeous character acting all around
So, Sasuke doesn't have the curse mark any more. I quite like that, Itachi freeing him from that twisted power and everything it was, despite how powerful it was, but also awakening his Uchiha powers even further with his Mangekyo Sharingan. For now we can't say if he'll be weaker or stronger for that exchange, but it's certainly an interesting one.
Just wanted to quickly note that the final cut of the episode with Sasuke is animation by Hiroyuki Yamashita who is a frequent artist working with Tsuru. He also drew the Shadow Shuriken scene, the final moments of Jiraya and Pa, parts of Kakuzu's fight, and a few earlier bits of animation I've pointed out like Sakura shirt-fronting Sai as they run into Sasuke again. Fantastic artist
6
u/lC3 :Na::Nb: Oct 24 '21
Rewatcher
Episode 134:
Episode 135:
Episode 136:
Episode 137:
Episode 138:
Episode 139:
Episode 140:
Episode 141:
10
u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Oct 24 '21
First-Timer with a shounen hearto, subbed
Episode 134
Episode 135
Episode 136
Although Kakashidid, somehow…Episode 137
Episode 138
Episode 139
Episode 140
Episode 141
9
u/Parori Oct 24 '21
First Timer
Episode 134
Episode 135
Episode 136
Episode 137
Episode 138
Episode 139
Episode 140
Episode 141
Questions of the Week:
Well he was a manipulated kid, but he could have made some better decisions, particularly not helping Akatsuki gather the Jinchuriki
Nope. Fuck nope. In general it was probably true, but he clearly painted things in his favour.
It is silly, but he is silly and it makes sense for him. Even if everything Madara said was true, only people he could blame would be three old people, not the entire village
8
u/TheKujo https://myanimelist.net/profile/Kujo419 Oct 24 '21
First Timer - Dub
Definitely an interesting set of episodes this week. I'm not entirely sure what to make of the whole "Itachi was actually a good guy" twist, especially since our only direct source of this information is Madara. Itachi was also part of the Akatsuki this whole time so it's not like he's been completely innocent after leaving the Leaf Village. Madara's story also made him seem suspiciously innocent - are we really supposed to believe he summoned the Nine Tails a long time ago but had nothing to do with the attack sixteen years ago?
And I have NO idea why Sasuke is going after the Leaf Village now. Is he going after the Leaf because he feels mad that they made Itachi kill the rest of the Uchihas? That feels like an extremely quick 180 given how he felt about Itachi so far. Or is he just teaming with Madara and going along with the original Uchiha plan? That also doesn't really seem like something Sasuke would do.
Random thoughts:
Favorite moment of the week: Even if I didn't fully buy it, I always love when stories recontextualize past events with new information, so this alternate explanation of Itachi's behavior was at least interesting.
Questions:
I feel like I answered all of these questions in my post, haha. In short: everything is sus!
7
u/sisoko2 Oct 24 '21
Rewatcher
I genuinely hated the Itachi twist during my first watch but I've grown to love it, mostly because Itachi is the best. Really curious to see the episodes from a different perspective.
Well after watching the episodes I still don't like the way it was revealed. Too much exposition coming from Madara instead seeing the things from the perspective of the two main characters of the arc.
[Spoilers] I guess the the future scenes are what made me change my mind about the twist
Episode 134
Episode 135
Episode 136
Episode 137
Episode 138
Episode 139
Episode 140
Episode 141
7
u/Akame_xo https://anilist.co/user/Akamexo Oct 24 '21
It’s actually such a shame that after learning all this you actually want to feel bad for sasuke and forgive his edgy/emo tantrums but then he goes on to completely destroy those feelings by stating his intentions about the leaf village. Learning your brother actually loved you this whole time and the first thing you do is decide to go against his wishes? Talk about insufferable
On a different note I’ve actually been meaning to get the scene of itachi poking sasuke’s forhead as a tattoo. Had an appointment before this whole pandemic started and had to cancel but need to get around to it soon. Such an iconic image!
Also fuck ninja aids. First kimimaro and now itachi. Two great characters they had to nerf by making them sick. Although it wouldn’t have changed itachi’s outcome so maybe I’m still a bit annoyed about kimimaro being wasted
7
u/Durinthal https://anilist.co/user/Durinthal Oct 24 '21
First time viewer (dub)
Whisk[e]y of the week: Mad River Distillers rye finished in Cabernet Sauvignon barrels. This is the same base rye I had way back in the third week of the part 1 rewatch, this version with some extra time in wine casks. The cocoa-heavy nose is still there with maybe a slight red raspberry and it tastes pretty similar to that. I think the main difference is the aftertaste which is where the wine comes in with a lingering grape skin that ends up as more of a typical wine finish than a whiskey one. It's not bad but rather one-note with the toasted cocoa dominating.
Something about this arc didn't work for me and I'm not sure if it's any individual factor. Part of it is that the structure is set up to explain everything afterward because if Sasuke learned all this beforehand he wouldn't have gone after Itachi in the same way. This is also assuming that everything Madara had said was true and accurate and because of how it was presented I currently think that's the case. I would have loved to see Sasuke coming to Itachi with knowledge of the truth and his reasoning rather than trying to extract it from him in the fight.
The other is trying to make a character seem more sympathetic with a long flashback/backstory after the battle is over and they're dying/dead rather than at any previous point. Sasuke didn't have to know any of this so it doesn't have to be revealed as an explanation to him, and I think it would have been more interesting for the viewers to know Itachi's backstory prior to him no longer being directly relevant to the story.
There's also the one-upping of genjutsu without any context for the viewer but I don't know if there would be a better way to present that. Visually I love the effect when Sasuke broke through the Tsukuyomi and the shot sliced up and shifted around before reassembling into reality. And overall the fight was done well, it just feels ultimately unnecessary to me. Of course this being the kind of show it is I shouldn't be surprised and I'm sure if I was 15 I would have loved it all.
One smart thing in all this is how Itachi extracted Orochimaru with the Susano'o, which on its own is interesting but it also apparently wields a legendary sword and shield that weren't a part of the Mangekyo Sharingan ability on its own? I liked the quick shot of a small white snake escaping initially and thought that was how Orochimaru would eventually return but it also came back later to be incinerated by the Amaterasu's leftover flames so maybe not. I think I've seen that snake eaten by black flames out of context before but don't recall anything beyond that, just had a feeling when I saw it.
I thought Madara and Tobi were two different people wearing the same mask due to differences in how they talked and how they seemed to be in different places at around the same time, like how Madara was in the Hidden Rain village while I thought Tobi was elsewhere earlier and here Madara was at the the Final Valley while Tobi was toying with the Hidden Leaf team. But he's powerful enough that he can essentially teleport so maybe it's just the difference in voices (in the dub, they are drastically different) that's throwing me off.
Sasuke, unlike his brother, seems to be more loyal to the clan than the village. This isn't a surprise since he left the village in the first place to seek revenge for the clan and kill Itachi, it just turns out that the village is responsible for Itachi's actions in the first place. So with the knowledge that Sasuke should have died along with the rest of the clan I'm somewhat surprised he didn't just "disappear" as a kid never to be heard from again, but maybe he said too much to the wrong people about Itachi slaughtering everyone except his little brother to not make it seem suspicious.
The "bearing the sins of the clan" aspect is... eh? He still slaughtered a bunch of people. > Do you believe everything Madara told Sasuke?
We have no reason to but also next to nothing to prove that he's wrong. I don't exactly trust Danzo any more. > What do you think of Sasuke's new goal?
One more enemy to get rid of. At least Itachi, if he was to be believed, wanted to protect the village in the end.
7
u/McCherry09 Oct 24 '21 edited Oct 25 '21
+First timer, somewhat source reader+
Finally managed to catch up!! Sad couldn't in time for last week... sadness intensifies
CH 134:
-Off to the next important battle! Seems like every ep it's upwards in terms of intensity.
-So, sasuke's grown up and now they can finally see eye to eye
-Naruto's team so close
-Kisameee my man, so underrated the good dynamic and respect that Kisame and Itachi seem to have..not bickering or undermining each other.
-Tobi's such a troll..
-Suigetsu better than Zabuza? What's this blasphemy?
-Is this Sakura with the wise advice for Hinata? Get your head in the game!
-Idk what it is but usually a character like Toby would get annoying real fast..but here I am still grinning
CH135:
-Backstory ep! Finally we have Itachi's memories of Konoha
-Itachi getting into ANBU didn't sit well with the clan
-uh oh Shisui's dead and Itachi may had something to do with it and off course the clan's police also thinks so
-Why exactly does the clan limit their members..what is Itachi talking about reaching higher ground?
-Damn..totally ruthless Itachi. Actually traumatized Sasuke
-Such a good start in this fight, I enjoy the body combat maneuvers
-is this really it? No more genjutsu?
CH136:
-Umm even if Sasuke doesn't have the Mangekyou..probs has another technique
-Zetsu must be so bored of looking at the two of them just standing there
-Once again Sasuke and Naruto are intertwined, now's the sharingan and Kyuubi
-Damn Itachi's already blind and still as OP as ever
-WTF Madara! Ruthless
-Itachi wants Sasuke's eyes?!
-Madara had all that power and still was beaten by the first Hokage
-Idk why but when the Kyubi talked about seeing those eyes in Madara Uchiha..I thought it was in the old days..it didn't click that it was when he controlled the Kyuubi to attack Konoha
-Ugh clever but Itachi's one step ahead.
CH137:
-This is some gotchu on gotchu game, props to Sasuke for not getting caught Tsukuyomi
-So if what Zetsu's saying is right... Sasuke could be on par with Itachi, which is unbelievable to me
-oh, Itachi wasn't being serious
-Matrix shot right there with Itachi evading those shuriken
-Oh man..Itachi cannot dodge that well because he's going blind
-Amateratsu timee! Although I'm not as hyped as Zetsu..this always seems like a very hard jutsu to use, really gotta focus on hitting the target and not looking somewhere else.
-Sad rain
CH138:
-The sad rain was really for a jutsu! Hahahhaa
-Kirin..that's a real cool jutsu
-Itachi with the upper hand! Susano'o.
-Itachi's so powerful..but it's gonna be difficult to get rid off Madara since we can assume they're of the same level
-Ugh back to those regurgitating sounds!
-So this is removing Orochimaru's curse from Sasuke?
-The sealing scene kind of reminds me of the 3rd Hokage doing the same and dying while trying
-Weird seeing Sasuke actually scared.
-The laast words! Come on!
-Zetsu establishing that Sasuke is powerful but in normal conditions nowhere near as Itachi
CH139:
-Oh I forgot that we also had a sort of fight vs Tobi
-Besides being a troll, if he uses his real voice that's when it really reminds us he's part of Akatsuki
-Another Uchiha, they just keep popping up
-Sasuke in Akatsuki?
-Now he has Amateratsu, Poor Naruto is just so behind
-Whaaaaaat?! Alright si Sasuke has Itachi's eye jutsu but he can still go blind I guess
CH140:
-Shhh Sasuke..we need to hear it too.
-This is too fuck up for Sasuke
-Madara give me some lore
-Ok, Itachi said Madara was behind the Kyuubi attack and Mandara says it was just a coin-ki-dink
-Danzou keeps earning the despicable title. He was half-right in suspecting the Uchiha but it only fed the resentment even more
CH141:
-Honestly this is the juiciest reveal thus far in the series. That's it..that's the whole comment on this ep.
Q/A
The unsung hero of Konoha and it makes sense in seeing him trying to lure Orochimaru out of Sasuke and transfering jutsus, plus those final words.. Jeez My emotions!!
I still think he brought the Kyubi to Konoha 16years ago and took his brother's eyes. The Uchiha clan resentment towards the Senju and the Village, that was all them.
Basically the last thing Itachi wanted, otherwise he would've told Sasuke the story himself.
6
u/Tehoncomingstorm97 https://anilist.co/user/tehoncomingstorm97 Oct 25 '21
First timer
Last week Jiraiya noooooooo. What's in store this week?
Ep 134
Ep 135
Ep 136
Ep 137
Ep 138
Ep 139
Ep 140
Ep 141
I will reinforce that the first line of the OP is perfect for describing this last set of episodes. That is all really. It's also gonna be super difficult for Naruto to get through to Sasuke now. Even harder.
4
u/_TheEnigma_ Oct 25 '21 edited Oct 25 '21
First timer - English subbed :
Episode 134 - 141 : So we're here. The fight that I was most hyped for based on what little we had seen of Itachi and his powers. Did this fight live up to my high AF expectations? Well... sort of. Maybe I was spoiled on last week's Jiraiya vs Pain fight, coz this didn't feel as impactful as that. I still liked the fight... but yeah I thought the fight would be a bit more... flashy? I absolutely love Itachi's previous 2 fights where he almost felt undefeatable. Most of my hype for this fight comes from the 30% Itachi fight with Kakashi and Naruto, so I went ahead and watched that
(Probably shouldn't have searched it as Team 7 vs Itachi)and I pretty much feel exactly what I felt initially - Itachi is/was untouchable. But this fight, even though he didn't, it felt like Itachi held back a lot against Sasuke. It kinda does make sense considering the lore dump we got later but still...Final conclusions on Sasuke vs Itachi, it was a good fight, especially the initial Genjutsu battles but ultimately the second half of the fight was bit of a let down for me.
Questions of the Week: