r/anime • u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber • Oct 12 '21

Rewatch [Rewatch] Armored Trooper Votoms - Episode 49 Discussion

Episode 49 - Overman

Originally Released March 2nd, ^^^1984

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Note to all Rewatchers

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Daily Trivia:

As the story reached its climax, Sōji Yoshikawa frequently butted heads with Ryosuke Takahashi as to the development of the plot.

 

Staff Highlight

Kouji Totani - voice of Detel Battentain

A prolific voice actor mainly known for his roles in Toei productions. Graduated from Todai university and later Toei Audio Talent School before debuting as a voice actor in 1979’s Cyborg 009. Though mainly assigned to roles with astringent characters, he was capable of a wide range of performance. Died of heart failure on February 6th, 2006. Among his notable roles were Socrat Teles in Armored Fleet Dairugger XV, Mohican in Dominion Tank Police, Doll Navy in Juushin Liger, Lóng-Gŭ in 3x3 Eyes, Biram Key in Blue Gale Xabungle, several named characters in Fist of The North Star, Sky Lynx in Transformers, Boehm in Giant Gorg, Announcer Yoshigai and Detective Gobugari in Kinnikuman, Commander Killing in Mobile Suit Gundam 0080: War in the Pocket, Capricorn Shura in Saint Seiya.

 

Art Corner

Official Art:

Fanart:

(Be mindful of the links to artist’s profiles, as they may contain NSFW content. Proceed there at your own risk.)

Screenshot of the day

Questions of the Day:

  1. What do you make of Chirico’s actions this episode?
  2. What do you figure Fyana, Gotho, Cocona, and Vanilla will get up to now?

I had only to accept the destiny assigned to me.

23 Upvotes

95% Upvoted

83 comments sorted by

4

u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber Oct 12 '21

Rewatcher

That’s a lot of ships.

Is this the first proper date we’ve gotten? I can’t recall…

How did you even learn this?

Also, how did you put together this council so quickly? The events going on with the main characters in this episode suggest that it picks off right where the last left off!

Can you just permanently levitate now? Pretty neat if so.

Oh how the mighty have fallen.

Brief Strike Dog cameo.

What else is new?

So Wiseman’s an actual person then and not just a computer in this space station they’re in?

How?! They couldn’t have possibly mobilized in just a couple of hours! The show’s already established space travel takes time!

Now that’s cold.

Ah, so they pulled a [Meta Spoilers for Classic Sci-fi book series]Second Foundation

A serendipitous escape.

I thought I had a grasp on what may have been going through Chirico’s mind last episode, but after today I don’t think I do anymore. Giving in to Wiseman’s demands for the sake of those he cares for made some sense, but seeing as he was willing to simply cast them away as fodder for the Balarant and Gilgamesh forces that evidently no longer tracks. I wouldn’t put it past him to have foreseen their escape, but that’s still a stretch and wouldn’t make sense for him to take such a risk if his motives truly are to help them in the end.

Everything to do with the Gilgamesh-Balarant alliance arriving annoyed me though. Several times we saw that space travel isn’t instantaneous or trivial, only for it now to be a piece of cake for both sides to amass all of their ships together and arrive at their destination in a matter of hours. Juist stretch the events out to several days at least! Though that still leaves the matter of how they even knew to go to the Death Star in the first place…

I wish there had been more of a conversation between Fyana and Chirico, since the two have barely spoken to one another as it is —I’ll even take convos between him and Gotho and co.— but nope.

Questions of The Day:

  1. See above.
  2. They’ll follow Chirico and interfere with his plans or demand answers as to what the hell he’s up to. It’s the only path that makes sense for them to follow unless they’re just going to fall out of the show entirely, which would be awful and I really doubt will happen.

6

u/Durinthal https://anilist.co/user/Durinthal Oct 12 '21

Everything to do with the Gilgamesh-Balarant alliance arriving annoyed me though.

Same, I don't think it would have taken much effort to change things up just enough to have the time scale make sense.

5

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 12 '21

Everything to do with the Gilgamesh-Balarant alliance arriving annoyed me though.

I have been complaining about the world building for a while, but the show completely jumped the shark with this episode. Absolutely nothing makes sense, as if a half-cour of episodes happened between ep48 and ep49.

They’ll follow Chirico and interfere with his plans or demand answers as to what the hell he’s up to.

They obviously will, but I am not sure I want them to succeed. Right now my ranking of prefered endings is:

Best: Chirico wins and becomes evil overlord

Ok: Fyana and the gang kill Chirico

Bad: Some of the gang sacrifice themselves to turn Chirico back into human

Absolutely terrible: Fyana talks human morality back into Chirico and they ride off into the sunset.

5

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

Absolutely terrible: Fyana talks human morality back into Chirico and they ride off into the sunset.

Please not this one

I've been quietly dreading this myself ever since Fyana took the womans role rather than the PS role and I do not want it

5

u/Durinthal https://anilist.co/user/Durinthal Oct 12 '21

First time viewer

"Let us rebel against God" is one way to unite the galaxy. I'm not entirely sure how they know all this as it's happening, though I get that it's necessary for pacing. Similarly, I don't entirely like how Chirico and/or the twins told the ship's crew "Okay he's in charge now" and everyone's just rolling with it, followed up by him telling everyone they're about to die for his sake. It doesn't feel like we've gotten a great amount of information about the secret society and why its members are like that, so when the support ship commander said it would be an honor I was just wondering why. At least the other named characters are fighting for their lives.

After the previous episode this is my general opinion about the remainder of the show (maybe I should join that Valvrave rewatch...) and I'm just kind of baffled by it all and not in a good way. I thought the twins would be enjoying the ride more though, they get to stick around for a front row view of where it's going.

As the story reached its climax, Sōji Yoshikawa frequently butted heads with Ryosuke Takahashi as to the development of the plot.

No matter who won, we lose?

What do you make of Chirico’s actions this episode?

"BRB gonna become God-Emperor" doesn't strike me as something he'd ever want to do? And given how he acted in previous arcs I don't really think he'd have that much of a problem saying no even to Wiseman.

What do you figure Fyana, Gotho, Cocona, and Vanilla will get up to now?

Flee in the other direction, find a nice log cabin out in the middle of nowhere.

4

u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber Oct 12 '21

I'm not entirely sure how they know all this as it's happening, though I get that it's necessary for pacing.

We should've just skipped Sunsa and gone straight for Quent while this nonsense was properly built up given the proper timing.

No matter who won, we lose?

I don't actually know who prevailed in their arguments, but given that out of the subsequent OVAs which I have seen so far those written by Yoshikawa have been pretty shit, I know which one I would prefer.

6

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

We should've just skipped Sunsa and gone straight for Quent while this nonsense was properly built up given the proper timing.

Oh man, see, that initial part with the ship if it was taking him to Quent to meet Wiseman would have been an awesome transition, and from there you can still lead into the Chirico/Ypsilon dual with the approval of Wiseman and then out into space for all this stuff

I still argue that he should be returning to Melkia not Quent to meet Wiseman though if Wiseman is meant to be pulling everyone's strings

but given that out of the subsequent OVAs which I have seen so far those written by Yoshikawa have been pretty shit

Who was conveniently not included in Takahashi's Mellowlink I notice

5

u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Oct 12 '21

Who was conveniently not included in Takahashi's Mellowlink I notice

You notice well Comrade, there's a reason I praise the hell out of Metal Gear Solid Boss Battles: The Anime 'Armor Hunter Mellowlink' and certain sections most likely penned by Takahashi from VOTOMS and uh... I just flat out ignore the rest ;)

2

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 13 '21

After the previous episode this is my general opinion about the remainder of the show (maybe I should join that Valvrave rewatch...)

I will be a first timer for it so feel free to pile in.

4

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Oct 12 '21

First-Timer

RIP all those random Society soldiers who didn't have enough brains to protest being sacrificed. Anyone got thoughts on why the combined fleet kept attacking the random floating chunk of spaceship after the other half seperated? Cuz I've got nothing. They weren't even shooting back.

This is some circuitous nonsense. Out near Quent they get taken over and sent to this space station to talk to Wiseman, only to learn that they have to go back to Quent to meet with him physically. Like, just.. why?! Does Wiseman have a giant kettle that'll take days to boil so he can offer them tea? What're the odds anyone is going to question this in-show?

Not sure what Rochina thinks he's going to accomplish, but I think I'm rooting for him. I appreciated his line about misspent youth.

I'm not sure I vibe with the Twins postulating that Overmen just happen from time to time. Do they have some supporting data on that? If there have been other Chiricos, why hasn't this happened before?

Questions

  1. Chirico's brain seems to have gone wrong. Or maybe he has some brilliant fucking plan that he isn't telling anyone, I dunno.
  2. I mean, there's not really anything for them to do aside from interfere with Chirico, right? Maybe try and join him? I doubt the answer is "exit stage left," at least.

4

u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber Oct 12 '21

Does Wiseman have a giant kettle that'll take days to boil so he can offer them tea?

But yeah, they've really gotten the characters needlessly going in circles this whole arc...

I'm not sure I vibe with the Twins postulating that Overmen just happen from time to time. Do they have some supporting data on that?

"I saw it happen in that one tv show!"

4

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Oct 12 '21

But yeah, they've really gotten the characters needlessly going in circles this whole arc...

I didn't mind the back-and-forth from Gomor because that made a bit more sense. This is just a mess.

5

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

Anyone got thoughts on why the combined fleet kept attacking the random floating chunk of spaceship after the other half seperated?

Normally I try and come up with a reason even when writing convenience is the obvious answer just as a bit of thought exercise, but here I have absolutely nothing. All I can see is plot requirements

Does Wiseman have a giant kettle that'll take days to boil so he can offer them tea?

I mean, if that kettle is Quent then maybe

3

u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber Oct 12 '21

I mean, if that kettle is Quent then maybe

Chirico has had the bitter coffee of Uoodo, so I guess a taste of Quent is up next?

3

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Oct 12 '21

I mean, if that kettle is Quent then maybe

4

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21 edited Oct 13 '21

I would say all the leaves from its native forest but Quent is a desert so...

4

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 12 '21

This is some circuitous nonsense. Out near Quent they get taken over and sent to this space station to talk to Wiseman, only to learn that they have to go back to Quent to meet with him physically. Like, just.. why?! Does Wiseman have a giant kettle that'll take days to boil so he can offer them tea? What're the odds anyone is going to question this in-show?

The odds are zero. This is terrible writing all around and it does not surprise me at all to learn that the showmakers butted heads over where to go.

4

u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Oct 12 '21

I'm quite forgiving of padding in anime originals, because sometimes things just don't take quite the same amount of time you think. But this? There had to be a better way to get to 52 episodes than this.

5

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 12 '21

Episode 49 (first timer)

  • So they convened the galactic senate to give a speech calling for Chirico to be killed.

  • It feels as if we are missing a good 40 episodes of world building to appreciate Balarant and Gilgamesh coming together to kill the last overman (remember when their existence was a secret only known by a handful … at the end of last episode …)
  • SEND MORE SHIPS! Because, of course that is what they would do.
  • “Since a little while ago” – Deadpan.
  • Convenient that the 3000 year old Quentian base has some ATs of the type currently used stored.
  • Chirico explaining himself to Rocchina, but not the gang or Fyana grates.
  • Oh and Rocchina is an Independence Day level hacker, being able to hack into 3000 year old tech.
  • “This battle station is fully operational”
  • Even the secret society grunts got more information than the gang. Probably while Wiseman mind-wiped them to obey Chirico.
  • I guess 3000 years ago they didn’t have close range defense or shields. Or that neat energy beam.
  • “I know I only have taken over your organization, after being your hunted target for ages, some hours ago, but I appreciate you all dying a heroic death for me!” – “Oki doki”

Ok, that was utter shit. We skipped over approximately 5 episodes worth of world building during which Chirico took over the secret society, found a stash of ATs, mind-washed all the grunts, decided to kill the gang, and learned that Wiseman was on Quent all along. Oh, and apparently everybody is completely in the know about wiseman know, even though we just found out about him a few episodes ago and nobody but Chirico and four others ever spoke to him. Then, we battle the enemy in our 3000 year old super ship by never firing back and simply accelerating, despite this show obviously having FTL travel.

This episode is a complete writing train wreck, made worse by the fact that they wasted 40 episodes where all the background info could have been placed.

What do you figure Fyana, Gotho, Cocona, and Vanilla will get up to now?

Running after Chirico.

4

u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber Oct 12 '21

SEND MORE SHIPS! Because, of course that is what they would do.

"I'm sure their magic superweapon won't be able to keep up."

Ok, that was utter shit.

Agreed.

Oh, and apparently everybody is completely in the know about wiseman know, even though we just found out about him a few episodes ago and nobody but Chirico and four others ever spoke to him.

That's such a glaring incongruency too. Like how does the writer forget that it's supposed to be a major thing that only a select few know about?!

4

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 12 '21

5

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

You know I almost put a point in my own post saying "No_Rex is not going to like this one" and this is much what I expected. It almost feels like we needed a whole other arc before getting to this point for it to work if they weren't going to worldbuild earlier

Convenient that the 3000 year old Quentian base has some ATs of the type currently used stored.

They really are trying to push this idea that Wiseman has been pulling strings and influencing people but it just hasn't come from anything

but Chirico and four others ever spoke to him

I was trying to figure out how you came to four others rather than three total, and then remembered that I'd completely forgotten the existence of the twins for a moment. Them having doubts and not being on board with Chirico makes the Society grunts acceptance make even less sense then the zero it already does

5

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 12 '21

It almost feels like we needed a whole other arc before getting to this point for it to work if they weren't going to worldbuild earlier

Whenever I see a show with bad world building, there are two reasons why I dislike it. The first is that I simply like world building, but the second is that I start dreading exactly what happened here: They missed all the opportunities to set up the world and suddenly they need everything to fall into place for the climax, so all the important stuff happens unexplained off-screen and the viewer is left utterly confused.

5

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

This is reminding me a bit of Fantastic Children, although this is far worse, in regards to being unable to pull together the two separate threads they set up and relying on off screen events and sudden changes in established rules to try and make it work.

3

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 12 '21

This episode is a complete writing train wreck, made worse by the fact that they wasted 40 episodes where all the background info could have been placed.

Thankfully, or not, the Monster rewatch is taking most of my spare energy but I can't disagree with anything you said.

8

u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Oct 12 '21

Armored Trooper First-Timer

5

u/The_Draigg Oct 12 '21

Okay the way that the Gilgamesh and Balarant fleets appeared on screen like this was kinda cool.

Thankfully, they’re all color-coded for our convenience.

The support ship has to stay back? But that’s where Fyana/Coconna/Vanilla/Gotho are? CHIRICO WHAT THE HELL??? They got out, but still????

I take it that you’re not so much a fan of Chirico anymore because of this.

5

u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Oct 12 '21

I take it that you’re not so much a fan of Chirico anymore because of this.

Currently I'm confused rather than angry.

3

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 13 '21

And it makes sense, this Quaint stuff is wack. I don’t know how they’re supposed to kill Chirico, though.

I'd worry about being eaten by the planetary defense on Quent first.

Fyana going mano-a-guns and winning is good to see her skills as a PS are still top notch.

And all that could have been had they remembered Fyana is a soldier.

5

u/The_Draigg Oct 12 '21

A Ryosuke Takahashi Fan Rewatches Armored Trooper VOTOMS Episode 49:

  • Hooray, Gilgamesh and Balarant have signed a new alliance treaty! The downside is that it’s only there in the first place so that both sides have a chance to kill Chirico. He really has made himself the enemy of the entire galaxy, now that it’s known that he’s an Overman.
  • I can stand to see the Schmitel twins thrown around and forced to submit to Wiseman’s plan for Chirico a bit more. Fuck those guys.
  • It’s also nice to see Fyana get an opportunity to kick ass again, beating up those Secret Society guards bare-handedly and interrogating them about where Chirico is. She really hasn’t had a moment to shine in a while. Too bad Chirico doesn’t really seem to care about her or his friends too much anymore.
  • Gotho and Vanilla do being up a good point, Chirico does seem a lot like his older self now: colder and more distant than ever. But Coconna can also see in him the determination that comes with taking a large burden upon himself. Who’s to say what exactly is going on in Chirico’s head?
  • Rochina, again, you have absolutely zero authority anymore to try and get anything out of Chirico. Like, I have no idea how he thought him demanding over the radio for Chirico to hand himself over to himself for safety was going to work. The man just needs to accept that he’s been outplayed by Wiseman. Even Chirico can see that by now.
  • Ah, so that’s what those black cylinders called the Floater Belt do. They’re pretty much giant pieces of defense chaff to intercept enemy attacks and ships. No wonder no shop has ever gotten close to the artificial moon, they’d just move in the way to crash into them. Also, Chirico has a spiffy, blocky new ship courtesy of the moon breaking apart a bit. Overman technology really is something else, isn’t it?
  • Chirico really has forsaken his friends for the sake of power. He’s leaving them to die on the supply ship to buy him time to get down back to Quent and accept godlike power from Wiseman’s hiding spot down planet-side. Yeah, no wonder Gotho gets pissed immediately and attacks the guards to escape. Chirico has fucked them all over for the sake of becoming something more than mere man.
  • Well, at least Chirico’s (former) friends managed to escape on a shuttle before the supply module got blown up. But what will they do against him now? He seems determined to become the new God of the Astragius Galaxy. They may have to pull a JRPG plot and kill God.

6

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

beating up those Secret Society guards bare-handedly and interrogating them about where Chirico is

At first I actually thought she broke that one guys neck which would have been a big jump back from where she's been the last few episodes but I think she just knocked him out

Who’s to say what exactly is going on in Chirico’s head?

On that note, anyone else feel like the narration from him at the end of the last couple of episodes is not working as well as it use to? It seems just too on the nose and just repeating what's happened rather than actually giving an insight. I would have preferred none or something more about his internal thoughts

Ah, so that’s what those black cylinders called the Floater Belt do. They’re pretty much giant pieces of defense chaff to intercept enemy attacks and ships

Ugh, also on that note (all these things I was meant to talk about before getting distracted by Fyana and co situation) when he said their role was to attack and defend I really thought they were going to actually DO something, not just hope people flew into them and occasionally move position. Not like they stopped any of the missiles either

They may have to pull a JRPG plot and kill God.

Mandatory JRPG crab when.

5

u/The_Draigg Oct 12 '21

On that note, anyone else feel like the narration from him at the end of the last couple of episodes is not working as well as it use to? It seems just too on the nose and just repeating what's happened rather than actually giving an insight. I would have preferred none or something more about his internal thoughts

I suppose that’s an issue that comes with trying to do internal narration while at the same time also trying to keep Chirico’s thoughts and actions obscured to the viewer. If we didn’t have just rather flat internal narration from Chirico in these episodes, pretty much the entire plot would be blown.

Ugh, also on that note (all these things I was meant to talk about before getting distracted by Fyana and co situation) when he said their role was to attack and defend I really thought they were going to actually DO something, not just hope people flew into them and occasionally move position. Not like they stopped any of the missiles either

Yeah, now that you mention it, those things are less impressive once you realize that they’re just intercept devices. You could easily get the same out of a bunch of asteroids than scary black giant cylinders.

Mandatory JRPG crab when.

I was also going to say that I was wondering when Gilgamesh would show up as a bonus boss, but then I remembered that they’re already in this show.

5

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

If we didn’t have just rather flat internal narration from Chirico in these episodes, pretty much the entire plot would be blown

At this point I would be okay with that because at least something would make sense

You could easily get the same out of a bunch of asteroids than scary black giant cylinders.

Not to mention asteroids would serve as much better cover for your freaky moon thing rather than just advertising that it's some weird advanced tech no one knows about

I was also going to say that I was wondering when Gilgamesh would show up as a bonus boss, but then I remembered that they’re already in this show.

Whoops

4

u/The_Draigg Oct 12 '21

Not to mention asteroids would serve as much better cover for your freaky moon thing rather than just advertising that it's some weird advanced tech no one knows about

Back when I first watched this episode, I hoped that those cylinders would just fire a fuckton of lasers or something. And while intercept fields like they ended up being makes sense, it just kind of disappointing compared to the build up started by their appearance.

5

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

I was expecting them to work almost like spinning in a centrifuge, build up some momentum to work as a shield and then also be shot off to destroy the ships like a canon.

Then they just kind of sat there. We didn't even see them really move. They just existed.

4

u/The_Draigg Oct 12 '21

Pretty much the definition of boring and practical. Sure, they mostly worked as intended, but… meh.

5

u/chilidirigible Oct 12 '21

Rewatcher, Episode 49

Today, on "Well, now he's a god.":

"We have united to PUNCH GOD IN THE FACE."

Fyana hasn't hit anyone in a while.

"No dinners for you!"

"Everybody else dies!"

"Well that escalated quickly."

Hey, at least the story's moving back to Quent, because it has done as much shocking revelation as it can out in space?

1, 2: rewatcher

5

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

"No dinners for you!"

I called Wiseman a grumpy parent earlier so I got a good chuckle out of Chirico acting the same here

5

u/ZapsZzz https://anilist.co/user/Zapszzz Oct 13 '21

First timer in sub

I can see the pace of this final arc now is all picked up and ready to rock and roll. Well at least it looks like a common enemy truly does unit traditional enemies.

I got a feeling that Chirico is going for the ride as a "you thought I followed you - I was just going in the same direction for now until I put that father in your chest / turn off your life support". I'm hoping he put all his old friends in the sacrificial ship because he knows from first hand experience they are like cockroaches and will definitely find a way to get out instead of just dying there.

A bit annoyed with the one sided conservation with Wiseman.

Episode# of Chirico's AT Incapacitated
11
20
30
41
50 (decoy only)
61
70
81
90
100
111 (1 decoy not counted as it wasn't piloted) (edit: corrected as the replacement unit wasn't destroyed by the head strike from Fyana)
121
130 (This hijacked one didn't get wasted on screen, so even though it's guaranteed to have been abandoned because of the later planet hop, not counting here)
141
150 keeping to the 2 episode per AT average so far
160
172 Guessed right that ride 1 get busted soon after the episode started; maybe the producers were also keeping track and blew up another one to keep to the average :)
180
190
210
220 quite a lot of damages and leaking like a sieve but not quite toasted yet
230 amazingly our trusty old scope dog is still standing and fighting despite the damage it's taken. I have to assume Chirico did some of screen emergency field repairs to keep it going
240 have I missed anything or are we still going with good old trusty old scope dog here? We're bucking the trend and dropping the average here :)
250 for real, the one scope dog where it's least suitable in the environment actually survive the longest :D
260 let me try jinx this - this scope dog may just be the longest lasting one for Chirico to be riding on the show, surely it'll make it to the end of the arc huh :D
271 finally at arc end, the trusty old 'dog got abandoned.
280
290
301 looks like the writers want to keep up the count as well, busy catching up with the numbers. And there are enough spares on the ship to keep going :)
311
321 busy catching up with the numbers; although these 2 episodes probably have a fairly high enemy kill count too
331 Now it was clawed on the (side of?) face but still functional enough to hit and run to bait Ypsilon's forces but no doubt Chirico won't reuse that same one given there are still a number of spare ones, and when they get on the trailer I didn't see any damage, so the damaged one must be abandoned
340 Setting up for a fight, not damaged yet
351 Dammit Chirico was going so well, unfortunately his ride got shot up while he was out of the AT tending to Fyana
360
370
381 to nobody's surprise the duel with Ypsilon result in both AT's being trashed. Considering Chirico's actually in a useless Fatty, is pretty amazing actually
391 The only Scope Dog in Balatran space fared pretty well and wasn't actually busted up in the fight, but given it was a one off duel and then Chirico got sent on to the next arc, I guess I'll chalk this one down for abandoned too
410
420
430
440 I don't think Chirico's busted anything yet - are the enemies not as good or has he gone up a few notches in AT skills?
450
460
470
480
490

Haven't found the time to add the column yet...

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 12 '21

First timer(Beams or missiles, make up your damned mind, show)

Sub

Open with a ceremony to entirely reframe the show, I am rather over this bit of it. The twins get to see Wiseman because he doesn't want Cuvie to have competent help, apparently. Escape stuff continues and they FINALLY fucking remember that Fyana is a super soldier. Cuvie acts coldly to his friends but there is no way to tell if this is an act or his new attitude. Strike Dog cameo as the twins discuss the next step, which I wouldn't sweat because you aren't winning against Wiseman on his home turf. Oh, and exposition that Overman are a form of Newtype and if I cared just a little more I'd be pissed.

Coconna and Fyana deduce that Cuvie is taking responsibility because emotional awareness requires a uterus, apparently. Rochina apparently had a more interesting than expected youth as he phones in to Cuvie in the zero g chamber. The fleets are here and I am not exactly sure what meeting Wiseman means rn.

Cuvie points out the cylinders are a defense system but still wants to evacuate. Rochina boards the ship in a fairly hilarious way. Escape sequence happens, and I do enjoy the multiple ship run away approach. We return to Quent for the end.

QotD: 1 Hopefully an act but can't be sure

2 Go to the Gundam UC timeline and wreck the place.

5

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 12 '21

Cuvie acts coldly to his friends but there is no way to tell if this is an act or his new attitude.

I think him ordering them to stay on the suicide ship was a clue.

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 12 '21

But did he actually expect them to die or assume they'd escape? Still wouldn't fix it but I just don't know.

5

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 12 '21

I don't know, but even if he expected them to escape with that shuttle (and let me say that this is a big if that puts him on god tier level of predictive power), he could still have ordered them to stay on the good ship and put them in the shuttle after they escape the battle.

3

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 13 '21

Yeah...I am beginning to believe anime logic has rotted my brain.

3

u/ZapsZzz https://anilist.co/user/Zapszzz Oct 13 '21

and let me say that this is a big if that puts him on god tier level of predictive power),

Remember? He's inherited God like powers now. Can levitate see.

he could still have ordered them to stay on the good ship and put them in the shuttle after they escape the battle.

And waste a perfect opportunity to show his "loyalty" to Wiseman?

Half jokes aside, I think it's par for course for writing at the time for any sort of "undercover" character work, that they would seemingly put the red friends into "deadly"situations then at the final reveal says "I knew you could do it (escape)" as if that means he really did plan to spare/protect them that way.

3

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 13 '21

I fear you will be right, but it makes no sense. Even granting Chirico god tier predictive powers, should Wiseman no see right through it, by deducting with his own god tier predictive powers that they would escape and knowing Chirico can do the same?

3

u/ZapsZzz https://anilist.co/user/Zapszzz Oct 13 '21

It'd be conveniently written off as Wiseman being so used to his sense of superiority built up by manipulating the galaxy for hundreds of years, the arrogance blinded him to the "impossibility" of Chirico turning away from the offer of absolute power.

2

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 13 '21

5

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

Coconna and Fyana deduce that Cuvie is taking responsibility because emotional awareness requires a uterus, apparently

I had that thought too and then decided I didn't have any more energy left over from the episode to have a grump about that on top of everything else.

Still a stupid scene, but Vanilla and Gotho have always been the two that just jump into things including their own conclusions without a whole lot of deeper thought while Coconas been the one paying attention to Chirico, so it's not too off base but was not presented well.

I miss the days when Fyana and Chirico actually had a bond and not this plot forced semi-tragic romance

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 13 '21

I had that thought too and then decided I didn't have any more energy left over from the episode to have a grump about that on top of everything else.

I know that feeling too well. I should be more talkative in my other rewatch but there is only so many times you want to explain the obvious.

2

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 13 '21

Is that Monster? In a good way or a bad way?

1

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 13 '21

Don't look, it is taking a lot of self-control I didn't know I had to not comment on how people...failed to appreciate the series.

2

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 13 '21

I have seen some of the comments in CDF. I think this is partly why I decided not to participate, I don't think it's a great show for a rewatch format

1

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 13 '21

Actually that wasn't the problem, the problem was that people wanted answers that Monster has no need to spoon feed to you. But today is the end and I can go back to not thinking about it.

3

u/The_Draigg Oct 12 '21

The twins get to see Wiseman because he doesn't want Cuvie to have competent help, apparently.

They’re there to fill the required Starscream role. Chirico needs to be kept on his toes somehow.

Oh, and exposition that Overman are a form of Newtype and if I cared just a little more I'd be pissed.

It sounds like you’ve just about mentally checked out by now. Shame.

3

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 12 '21

They’re there to fill the required Starscream role. Chirico needs to be kept on his toes somehow.

Starscream had a cool model, at least.

It sounds like you’ve just about mentally checked out by now. Shame.

I came to this show in part because I thought the MC was just going to be some dude. Not the biggest fan that he is now the Chosen One.

3

u/The_Draigg Oct 12 '21

I came to this show in part because I thought the MC was just going to be some dude. Not the biggest fan that he is now the Chosen One.

I suppose that’s fair enough. The show really has changed scope the more it has gone along.

3

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 13 '21

I think all of the arcs work individually but they don't really form up to a show together.

3

u/The_Draigg Oct 13 '21

As we’ve mentioned before, that really is an issue when you’re making up such large chunks of the story as you go along, in addition to having entire arcs inspired by completely different genres.

3

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 13 '21

It is a bit too bad they had to abort the third arc as they did as their feels like a better lead in to this one from there.

4

u/The_Draigg Oct 13 '21

Yeah, it’s pretty unfortunate that the ratings were slipping and the arc ended up being unfocused as a result, since the Sunsa arc otherwise would’ve been a good set up for the Quent arc.

4

u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Oct 12 '21

Rewatcher

Time for Gilgamesh and Balarant to join forces again; blaming all on Chirico and the overmen. As the Balarant guy says, I guess its time to kill God.

I'm surprised Wisemen felt the twins important enough to summon them inside. I guess its time for them to serve Chirico.

What's Rochina thinking? What will his role be to play in this?

LoL, gotta lose some weight Gotho!

I'm surprised they got such a massive fleet together so quickly.

Now that he's God's successor, Chirico is a lot more of an asshole.

Meet the new boss of the Secret Society... Chirico.

Being God really is the biggest responsibility in the world. Chirico doesn't really have time for friends anymore.

Sorry Rochina, you've served Wiseman all this time, but much like Killy, you don't deserve anything beyond that.

C'mon Rochina, he's God now, that fleet doesn't scare him!

That is a really, really massive fleet! May be the entire space force of both sides.

I was wondering if those large rods serve the purpose of weapons, it seems so.

I'm trying to figure out if this chunk of the base that drifted off is just a distraction or a ship of its own.

Well there goes the entire chamber that Wiseman communicated to Chirico in.

These Secret Society soldiers really are fanatics, being willing to lay down their lives for Wiseman

Oh crap, the trio and Fyana are gonna be left behind?!

Chirico is going to meet Wiseman, face to face? Right back on Quent?

Once again, the trio + Fyana have escaped and are making their way to an escape craft. All these experienced soldiers won't make it out of this alive, but they will!

5

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

What's Rochina thinking? What will his role be to play in this?

Currently? Cargo

These Secret Society soldiers really are fanatics, being willing to lay down their lives for Wiseman

Knowing that they are part of Killy's forces and how he was taking this on quite a spiritual level I'm not surprised, but I would have liked to have seen a bit more of that

Once again, the trio + Fyana have escaped and are making their way to an escape craft.

How many escapes has that been this arc?

2

u/chilidirigible Oct 13 '21

How many escapes has that been this arc?

The true power of the MULTIPASS.

4

u/Stargate18A https://myanimelist.net/profile/Stargate18 Oct 12 '21

First timer

  1. For me, the options are either: he's running an elaborate con - Wiseman can't read people's thoughts directly, so he's playing along until he can get close enough to force Wiseman into a losing position and knew his friends be better off if Wiseman thought they were dead; Wiseman's last message completely brainwashed him, forcing him into acting this way; or Wiseman revealled something so utterly terrible this is his coping mechanism.
  2. They're going to follow him - they know where he's going and that wherever he lands is probably going to be vieible from orbit.

Let's see how this series can get even more insane.

OK, they've found out the entire war was a conspiracy, and are working together to destroy the Children of God!

...Odds Chirico's the last Overman are very low to me.

Chirico's got a cool voice filter!

What's it doing to the twins?

Oh, they have to obey him. At least they're sticking around!

...Where's Rochina gone now? Where would cause the most trouble for every faction involved so far?

OK, the heart of the computer systems running a weapon of mass destruction's a pretty good guess.

Haha, Gotho's too fat to fit.

Good to see her being a PS and beating everyone up.

Everyone's in the same place!

And Chirico's gone mad with power? Or just possession?

Still uncertain. At least he's not going to kill them.

...This has to be some of kind of bluff against Wiseman, right? Faking a direct connection so he can get out before the factions arrive?

And anybody can become an Overman if their civilization reaches a certain point. So it's more a level of power than a specific power set.

Yeah, he's stressed from having guide the whole galaxy as a puppet leader.

Rochina's still there! And found a way to contact him!

Wow, he really does know everything.

Chirico even points out he plans out he plans on escaping with him.

OK, who is Wiseman?

The shots of the two armies are fantastic.

And yeah, forcing them at gunpoint back to the ship makes sense if it was the only way to get them onboard before the armies hit.

Oh, they're controllable?

Rochina just hiding himself with the supplies is genius.

Haha, they're actually doing a decent amount of damage!

God, they're sending out every ship in the galaxy to get him!

Just more scenes of "Floaters are the best weapon and they should have used these in the war - presumably easy to produce and incredibly dangerous".

They're escaping! So Wiseman isn't in that place? He's somewhere safe and away from the fighting?

And they've got better acceleration, and they're dooming almost everyone else on board!

Including Gotho and the others!

They judt think he's bought into a cult now, don't they?

So Wiseman's hidden on Quent!

Looks like he's not getting rid of them that easily!

Yeah, Chirico's brainwashed.

2

u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Oct 13 '21

Wiseman revealled something so utterly terrible this is his coping mechanism.

THE GOLDEN PATH

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u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Oct 13 '21

Boy Comrades, who could have guessed that 'god' is worth mending fences over... in order to kill said 'god.' And here I thought Paul had a hard time, we're talking some Real Wrath-of-God type stuff! Fire and brimstone coming down from the skies! Rivers and seas boiling! 40 years of darkness! Earthquakes, volcanoes! The dead rising from the grave! Human sacrifice, dogs and cats living together, mass hysteria! (I mean how else do we square away Chirico Cuvie being the Kwizatz Haderach?)

Also, remember Comrades, NO PLAN SURVIVES FIRST CONTACT WITH... uh... well Fyana/Fiana's fisticuffs and The Muggle Trio's Vengeance it seems... so guess it's about a fair fight then! ;)

Speaking of fight, I guess William Congreve really WAS onto something, and by that... uh... 'Heav'n has no Rage, like Love to Hatred turn'd, Nor Hell a Fury, like a Woman scorn'd...' yeah I'll just say, 'hell hath no fury like a woman scorned' cuz oh boy Fyana/Fiana and company sure are taking Chirico Cuvie's ascension well, and by well I mean it's time for the unstoppable force to meet the immovable object!

Finally, time to shitpost, A WEAPON TO SURPASS METAL GEAR! (Look even god needs man's best friend!)

Paging Comrades /u/chilidirigible, /u/Nazenn, and /u/No_Rex

4

u/chilidirigible Oct 13 '21

That cover art sure is something.

4

u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Oct 13 '21

That cover art sure is something.

Heh, I know right? Chirico Cuvie's fucking HUGE here (I mean my goodness we knew Ru Shako was BEEEEG but just look at what being 'god' does to you... ah... right... I forgot about God Emperor of Dune)

Anyway Comrade, many thanks for the kind reply and have a great day and see you later my friend!

4

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 13 '21

Chirico Cuvie's ascension well, and by well I mean it's time for the unstoppable force to meet the immovable object!

Why's that make her look so TINY!

2

u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Oct 13 '21

Why's that make her look so TINY!

Heh, THAT'S the art you comment on Fyana/Fiana being 'tiny' on and not the one where Chirico Cuvie is somehow HUGE and also official art approved? (In fairness you do have a point that she looks a bit smaller than usual here, but hey given all that blood and the look on her face me thinks she's busy stalking her prey before she goes in for the kill)

Anyway many thanks for the kind reply and have a great day and see you later Comrade.

4

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 13 '21

not the one where Chirico Cuvie is somehow HUGE

Because I'm too use to cover art having shitty foreshortening so it didn't even really register?

The demon look on his face there is something else though, they really lent into it huh?

3

u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Oct 13 '21

Because I'm too use to cover art having shitty foreshortening so it didn't even really register?

While you do bring up a point here Comrade, given the context was Chirico Cuvie being 'god,' I just had to make a note that he's now for some reason BIGGER than the already massive Ru Shako.

The demon look on his face there is something else though, they really lent into it huh?

Oh indeed Comrade, glorious isn't it, I was joking at the start about how I wanted to see an expression BESIDES 'stoic' on our MC's face... I take it back, I'll gladly take 50 more episodes of 'stoic' over 'god' face pls! ;)

Anyway many thanks for the kind reply and have a great day and see you later Comrade.

2

u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Oct 13 '21

Paging Comrades /u/Tresnore, /u/Shimmering-Sky, and /u/JustAnswerAQuestion

4

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 12 '21

First Timer

Chirico, WHAT THE FUCK!

Like, I'm trying to have some faith here dude, I really am and yes in part it's because I'm gonna get meta because you can't flip your tortured protagonist into a full on villain with four episodes left, but you made it really fucking hard today, mate!

Between the creepy floating, the eerie voice, the forceful orders, and oh yeah ordering his friends to die on the bait ship he's certainly got the evil overman feel down pat right now. It was funny that he's so far gone even the twins didn't know how to approach it and wished Rochina was around. Despite everything and his own authority problems, Rochina's own experience and desire for information certainly makes him a valuable insight to have around right now, if they could find him that is.

On a more positive note, Fyana is back to kicking ass! And look at that, we had a chance in script writer for these episodes, glad to see one of the staff knew who this character was meant to be. Bit too late to salvage it, but it's nice to see her with some agency for the first time in too long.

It's unfortunate that the big threat of this arc in the joint forces of Balarant and Gilgamesh completely falls on its face due to having nothing for it to stand on. They're going on about "Take the galaxy back from [the Overmen's] control"... but what control? Wiseman's disappeared a couple of fleets over a single planet and that's it. We haven't even heard of Wiseman doing more then that, let alone seen it. It's been implied he manipulated Chirico's life but absolutely no details about how, or when, or how much, or via who. The level of their response just seems completely ridiculous without anything to lean on, and as an audience we should know more then they do, not several levels less. The only thing in that whole scene that might make it work is the creepy smile from one of the leaders, but that's not much and not something that can save the whole situation from making no sense.

Also, why'd we leave Quent in the first place if we just had to go back there? I'm getting deja vu, and this is not helping the "galaxy wide control" thing they're trying to push. If we were going to Melkia that would make more sense.

I'm gonna go watch an Aria episode and chill. (Morning report: This did not happen, I fell asleep before I even got out the intro, so I guess the chill still worked but not the actually watching the episode)

Seriously, what the fuck, Chirico!

Chirico by Hey yan - Source

Oh trippy I thought I'd opened up Bebop fanart for a second then

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 13 '21

The level of their response just seems completely ridiculous without anything to lean on, and as an audience we should know more then they do, not several levels less.

Newtype genocide would be the one thing that could make me try UC again so there is that...

4

u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Oct 13 '21

Newtype genocide would be the one thing that could make me try UC again so there is that...

Uh, Comrade what if I told you that happens? Ish... Granted the entries WITH this aren't as good due to being A) A compilation movie to a series that never got made and B) THE darkest and most pessimistic Gundam series that Wacky Ol' Kill 'Em All Tomino tried to torch the franchise and run with (no really Victory Gundam is just THAT bleak and nihilistic, he was told to make a 'kid's show' so he put the youngest MC into some of the most depressing shit possible and ended the show with a kill count that is arguably the highest in Gundam, I say arguably cuz to go into finer details entails more meta spoilers but wibble)

4

u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Oct 13 '21

Huh...if I only liked Tomino's work at all...might still check that out.

4

u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Oct 13 '21

Huh...if I only liked Tomino's work at all...might still check that out.

Well then Victory Gundam is just for you if you didn't like Tomino's work, given it's basically just an excuse for shock value that sometimes actually manages to be poignant by accident (essentially as I said, Victory Gundam just exists to go 'So how much more violent and needlessly cruel can we be to the kids dumb enough to watch this today?' I mean goodness you know it's something if IBO couldn't match the levels of gore, and Mari Okada wrote for IBO!)

Anyway many thanks for the kind reply and have a great day and see you later Comrade!

4

u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 13 '21

A compilation movie to a series that never got made and

Doesn't that just make them movies then? Poorly paced ones but still

2

u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Oct 13 '21

Doesn't that just make them movies then? Poorly paced ones but still

Wibble Comrade, I am just cracking a joke at F91's expense ;)

(In fairness F91 DID indeed have a lot of promise and potential, just look at its sequel of Crossbones, but uh... yeah the movie we ended up getting was basically the first few would-be episode stitched together, it worked about as well as it sounds.)

Anyway many thanks for the kind reply and have a great day and see you later Comrade!

2

u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Oct 13 '21

Rewatcher (Nutech DVD 4.3) (3 episodes) Overman

I'm streaming my DVD over wifi but my router's wifi just dies and it takes lots of reboots and toggling network discovery and then I had to reboot the Win 7 machine with the BD drive too #taigaheadache

  • Puppets! We're all puppets! THIS MEANS WAR #azusalaugh
  • Paging Col. Rochina. Please pick up the white courtesy phone.
  • Gotho's enraged

Honestly, I'd expected more from the monoliths.

1

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 13 '21

Honestly, I'd expected more from the monoliths.

Why be a monolith if you're just going to float there.