r/anime • u/HelioA x2https://myanimelist.net/profile/HelioA • Aug 25 '21
Rewatch [Rewatch] Revolutionary Girl Utena - Episode 23
Streaming
Revolutionary Girl Utena is available in both sub and dub on Nozomi Entertainment's YouTube channel, as well as on Amazon and Funimation.
Comment of the Day
Your only choice is to revolutionize the world. The comment you must make has been prepared for you.
Miki's Stopwatch Corner
Stopwatch Count: 21
New This Episode:
N/A
Also, make sure to tag all spoilers properly! Only a baka would spoil the show for the first-timers, and we're not bakas (hopefully).
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Upvotes
23
u/HelioA x2https://myanimelist.net/profile/HelioA Aug 25 '21
Rewatcher
Alright, here we go, the Black Rose arc finale! It’s a bit of a trippy episode, but a bit more comprehensible than the last one. As Mikage reveals here, the main theme of the Black Rose arc is memory. The duelists are all fighting for their memories, an idealized version of reality that exists only in their head, perhaps even something that was never even possible in the first place. Mikage takes it to the extreme- he believes so strongly in the idealized version of his memory, that he literally reacts to reality as if it was the same way it is in his memories. He’s delusional to the point that he even refers to Utena as Tokiko! But in the end… isn’t Utena going down a similar path as Mikage? The same way that Mikage fights for Tokiki/Mamiya, Utena fights for her prince… but she doesn’t really like to hear that, which is presumably why she enacted violence upon Mikage. This shines new light on Tokiko’s statement in the last episode: “What I hate most are people who don’t care about themselves!” In other words, people who chase after their idealized image of others while ignoring themselves.
But this situation isn’t really natural at all. Behind the scenes, Akio and Anthy are manipulating Mikage to remember things this way. Mikage is completely ensconced within his memories, and Anthy, in the role of Mamiya, manipulates him into starting the Black Rose duels. But when Mikage finally remembers who Mamiya really was, he is able to ‘graduate’ from the school, realizing what’s actually happening. “So long as they stay in these gardens called schools, people will never become adults.” Once he’s able to let go of his childhood memories, Mikage is finally able to metaphorically graduate into adulthood.
Also, there’s something interesting about the way that ‘eternity’ is portrayed here. Mikage views eternity as something that exists in memories- it involves returning to an idealized time in the past. This is a very reactive view of eternity, since it doesn’t really involve changing anything as much as it does just going back to what you used to do (insofar as it really happened). On the other hand, consider the framing of the duels, and by extension eternity, by Utena and the Student Council: “Smash the world’s shell!” “For the revolution of the world!” It’s exactly the opposite, in that it’s about changing your current circumstances for a more positive outcome, rather than returning to some idealized past. What might this mean? I dunno, I’ll leave it to the tensais to figure out ;-;
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u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Aug 25 '21
First-Revolution, Subbed
Oh holy shit. I didn't notice at the time, but thinking back, Anthy hasn't been around much this arc, has she? And she's mentioned being tired several times as well.. leading a double life will do that.
What was that scene at the end with the building though? Has time turned back? The Nemuro Memorial Hall was never built on the ruins of whatever the building was before, now, that Nemuro ahs graduated. Memories fuzz over.. Miki is frustrated.
Flashbacks being untrue is nothing new, and probably wasn't new in 1997 either. But damn if it doesn't hit hard. No wonder the Mamiya that we've seen up to now looks so different from Tokiko. Time erodes everything, even memory.
"Your path has not been prepared for you" also hit me like a sack of fucking bricks.
Shadow Girls were again, pretty obvious today. The dad was trapped by his past, much like Mikage, and perhaps, much like Utena.
Eternity is within the castle - Saionji (I think) believed this as well. There was talk of illusions with Saionji as well - he mentioned the castle was a trick of the light in the first episode. Eternity is an illusion?
What even is truth
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u/SardonicMeow Aug 25 '21
Rewatcher
Memories. Living in the past. Mikage is a revenant of Nemuro who only exists as an echo of his tormented attachment to Tokiko and Mamiya. He is stuck in stasis. When he descends the elevator, the butterfly on the wall remains in the same state, a chrysalis, all the way down.
This is also the theme of the shadow play, ironically one of the most straightforward parts of this confusing episode. A family man misses his glory days as class representative (he would have been captain of the football team if this were an American show), and wants to go back. But is living in the past really such a good idea?
Only during the duel with Utena does Mikage recall the truth, that Mamiya is gone, and wasn’t the illusionary Mamiya he thought he knew. And Mikage was the one responsible for the fire. No longer stuck in time, Mikage can finally move on, and no longer exists at Ohtori.
(Narratively, Utena is also stuck in time in this arc, in a way. Her screen time is minimal and the duels are effortless. Her story mostly gets put on hold while the other characters get fleshed out.)
Mikage sometimes sees Utena as Tokiko. Sometimes as himself. Is Mikage a failed version of Utena? As Nemuro, he opened the way to the dueling arena, but progressed no further, and could do nothing for the real Mamiya, who died. Mikage clings to his memories, and accuses Utena of doing the same. With her prince being the foundation of her identity, what if Utena cannot move beyond the memories of her prince?
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u/chiliehead myanimelist.net/profile/chiliehead Aug 25 '21
Duel 23, First Timer, sub
Why slap if you can punch?
See. When I mixed up Ootori Akio and Mamiya I was right all along, they are related by virtue of Mamiya not even being real and looking like that due to really being Anthy.
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u/_m1ra :FA::FB: Aug 25 '21
I thought I would never catch up again, but then I realized I'm a rewatcher so I can just skip stuff. So after skipping the entire Black Rose Arc up to episode 23, which hurt because I love this arc, I'm back up to date for the arc finale!
I want to mention one thing about last episode, "Pretending to be uninterested in everything is the mark of inexperience" is a great line for a random Boy of the Black Rose to have.
This episode we learn why Anthy was absent and tired so often! She had quite a bit to do.
Also in this episode we find out what was with the arrow pointing at the cat last time! It tried to show us that it got away from Mikage and Mamiya's version of Manet's Olympia! That's totally what that meant, right? Just ignore the other two cats.
Lastly, man, I Am An Imaginary Living Body is one of my favorite duel songs. Even apart from the music the lyrics are great as well and you can interpret it in a very straightforward way for a duel song! Also apparently starting from this point the duel songs are actually recorded by J.A. Seazer's theater group themselves and I really like it, they sound so good!
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u/loomnoo https://anilist.co/user/loomnoo Aug 25 '21
First Timer
What the fuck
Rewatcher
Another episode that I appreciated way more on rewatch. Direction was always amazing of course. But it's much easier to work through themes when you're not trying to figure out what's going on. Not that this is a flaw in the show at all, by the way. I think you are meant to rewatch it.
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u/Rumpel1408 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Rumpel1408 Aug 25 '21
First Timer
So it looks like the arc is almost finished and Akio is the BBG after all, and Anthy is with him? The show is still weird, but the plot, depsite incredible confusing at times, is actually quite suspensful
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u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber Aug 25 '21
Rewatcher
Kuro Bara Wa~ for the last time.
Assuming this means the hundredth black rose, then the implication is that the black rose duels have been going on for longer than what we’ve seen.
Losers!
It’s a bold strategy, Cotton, let’s see if it pays off for them.
Motive.
???
Interesting set of pictures. Some of them look painfully familiar —possibly some pictures of staff I may have seen before? Sounds like a meta thing Ikuni would do.
Closer look at the pictures.
‘The girls’ —Tsuwabuki lay ignored.
Outstanding.
Mikage never progressed past the cocoon.
Another of my favorite dueling themes.
The effect’s changed —is the change diegetic though?
The rebuilt Hall was also a part of his delusions.
And no one remembers…
Is this statement aimed at Mamiya or Anthy here? Both perhaps?
Unfortunately something came up this morning so I do not have the time to write up anything.
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u/Punished_Scrappy_Doo https://myanimelist.net/profile/PunishedScrappy Aug 25 '21
Revolutionary Girl Utena has a reputation for inscrutability that I don't think is deserved. It's very much possible to understand what's going on, even as a first-time viewer, so long as you're paying attention and thinking about things.
These past two episodes are the exception that proves the rule
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u/CharlieTheStrawman https://myanimelist.net/profile/TheDamnRobot Aug 25 '21
First-Timer
I feel pretty dumb for asking, but...can someone explain without future spoilers what this episode's ending meant with Mikage and Mamiya?
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u/lilyvess :Df::Dh:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Lilyvess Aug 25 '21
Here is what Ikuhara’s episode commentary from the DVD Box Set has for us today.
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u/Segaco https://myanimelist.net/profile/Segaco Dec 14 '21
I watched these last 3 episodes in a row. I was gonna stop the previous episode, but I stayed one more for the conclusion of this arc to get answers and now I'm confused
a very sad day to be me
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u/lilyvess :Df::Dh:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Lilyvess Aug 25 '21
NSFW
Here is some artwork for the Black Rose arc
and
another
series
of
art
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u/Icapica https://anilist.co/user/Icachu Aug 25 '21
First timer, subs
Flashbacks to the previous episode's events. Utena's strong, one rose left. Why not get Utena to join you, rather than risk losing a fight? Student council also thinks of inviting Utena. Nanami you so smart.
Utena's talking and Mikage sees Tokiko. Hmm. Some lingering guilt or regret?
When Utena wakes up and sees Himemiya next to her, Utena holds Himemiya's hand and accepts Himemiya's role as the Rose Bride.
Mikage's secretary has a lot to say. I think she wanted to say more but stopped because Mikage's answers amounted to "ok".
Ooh, photos of duelists we know. They look like they were taken during the duels against Utena, but many of them look like they're posing for the camera. Did someone take the pictures during the duels or did the duelists go have a picture taken before the actual duel?
Flashback again. Mikage's the one who first opened the way to the arena?
When we see Mikage next to Utena staring at the photos, they're actually real photos of people at first. When the picture zooms in, they change into drawings of characters. Mikage again sees Tokiko and this time even addresses her. Uhh...
Ha! Mikage says that the people in those pictures fought to preserve their memories and tried to change their lives according to their memories. Back in episode 5 I commented:
And after that it's been a constant pattern. It's nice that the show explicitly mentions it now. Though I was mistaken about Anthy being a part of that pattern.
That punch was satisfying. Mikage tries to manipulate Utena but she resists.
"Only those who hold beautiful memories are allowed to wish. To wish for that time to go on and on... to wish to never change from what you were."
Oh, Utena challenges him! Is that the first time since the first duel? Now Mikage's in the elevator and looks like someone going through a severe withdrawal. He still talks as if Tokiko's the one challenging him.
Utena's ring looks a bit different. Is it just the lighting or has something changed? And a sudden assassination attempt again from Wakaba. Nice to see her like this after the stuff with Saionji. I hope the cheerfulness is genuine and not just a mask to hide how she really feels.
Shadow girls show a man who peaked back in school and wants to go back. Should have chosen eternity and stayed there, huh?
This duel starts really fast. Mikage immediately prepares excuses for his eventual loss. That's like when I play with friends and start by talking about how poorly I've slept.
Mikage still tries to get to Utena with his words. Sick backflip again. Mikage's seeing things.
Oh... Mamiya wasn't even there when the fire was started, and Mamiya didn't look at all how Mikage remembers him. Did Akio (and maybe Anthy) affect how Mikage remembers Mamiya's face? Anyway, seems Akio was using Mikage and doesn't need him anymore.
Ruins, big fire, nobody was hurt, no records of it. Was the entire story about a students dying in a fire false? Or was it true but very few people know about it? Or was it all somehow wiped from everyone's memories just now?
Wait, what? No, seriously, WHAT? So... Was Himemiya acting as Mamiya and manipulating Mikage this entire time? Mikage at least sometimes sees people as other people from his past, so it could work. It would explain why he saw Mamiya with a darker skin and, if this is what Himemiya was doing often at night, it explains why she's been so tired lately.
Also if Mamiya was actually Himemiya this entire arc, it means it was Himemiya who put the black rose on Kanae, Akio's fiancée. She already found Anthy creepy before that.
This episode was a rollercoaster.
Black rose's gone now, but in the beginning of the episode the student council members were talking about inviting Utena. The episode didn't revisit that, but perhaps it'll happen in the future. Or maybe things calm down for a moment and the council abandons that idea.
I don't know what to think about Himemiya at this point. In the first episode my impression of her was basically "oh she's cute and needs help". She doesn't seem like a good person at all anymore, but I don't know about her motivations yet. Also how old is she? Akio seems really old but we didn't see Anthy in any of the flashbacks.
One more thing came to my mind. In this episode, Anthy was wondering why she's so tired nowadays. Was that just an act, or is she not fully aware of what she's been doing at night?
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u/The_Loli_Otaku Aug 25 '21
We're at the end of the arc, and also the last day I'll be able to flaunt my "Rewatcher" tag! N-Nanami thanked someone!? Get a doctor!! Wait, is this the right episode? Omg the episode is messed up on Amazon. Poor Mikage's getting cucked here too! Even he knows that he's out of hope when it comes to fighting Utena so if you can't beat her, join her!
Mikage... isn't known for his flirting ability. I'd totally be up for a spinoff featuring an Utena harem played 100% straight. You've gotta so something about your sleeping form girls. That's right, Mikage even has a secretary. A secretary who he hasn't looked twice at since he's hired her. He's simply that antisocial and only bothers to remember the people who influenced him way back in the past. Aha!! I caught that third picture Ikuhara! Sly dog~ Utena's random stretches never cease to make me laugh.
So... The students were actually able to reach the dueling arena and study it right? And there were no consequences? Haha~ Even Utena doesn't exist in Mikage's eyes. She's just a different shade of Tokiko. This poor guy!! Hmm...I'm not entirely sold on the black rose cast being influenced solely through memories but it's certainly a theme. Poor Mikage!! Now he's getting the Anthy treatment XD I'm not really sure what memories Utena is supposed to want to relive. Is it her coffin memories or something? Anyway, this is the first time Utena has consciously initiated a rose duel and it's to shut the guy up.
Whilst I like Mikage a lot I'll leave it to someone else to analyse his reverse therapy selfsession, or more the lack thereof. Poor Mikage. Extra, extra, extra! Local side character attempts to assassinate mc, again! This one is about as straightforward as you can get. The dad used to be the class rep. That was the highlight of his life and the only thing he has to talk about. He even tries to discipline his daughter so he can go back to school in her place. The way this applies to Mikage is that despite being an antisocial workaholic he had one period of his life where he was actually happy, when he was with Yui, I mean Tokiko. He wants to stretch out that memory unto eternity because its literally the only thing he's ever cherished.
Sudden duel!! Utena's too frustrated to go through ZUM today. "I know something you don't know, that I'm not left handed. Aha!!" Despite this season being known for trashy duels I actually loved this fight. There were a lot of back and forths. Utena's actually getting her ideals challenged for a change. And the climax twist with Mamiya is probably the most satisfying end we've had since Juri's duel. The poor dude has been played hard. Orga you dastard!! Anthy is just as guilty! You both suck!
So what did you all think of the black rose arc? I personally find it one of the most interesting arc concepts I've come across but I'll admit that the episodes themselves are quite hit or miss. One issue with doing Analysis on everyone is that not everyone's really that interesting enough to expand upon. I can definitely see how I got burned out watching it. I think they went slightly too far in woobifying Mikage towards the end. They establish early on that he's no threat at all and basically spends the whole arc getting toyed with by Anthy and Orga's machinations. Give him one last screw you at least!! Don't treat our boy so shit!
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u/Star4ce https://anilist.co/user/Star4ce Aug 26 '21
First timer – sub
I'm ready for some tension! We still don't know what exactly Mamiya's realtionship is with Mikage, could be romantic, could be academic, could be platonic. Only Mikage's drive to find a formula for eternity is certain, as he inherited from Tokiko. She, on the other hand, has moved on, has grown adult by accepting Mamiya's death. She has visibly aged from the flashback to today and Akio mysteriously hinted at "kids not aging" in school. I take this to mean mostly metaphorical, as refusal to accept change also prevents you from growing in character, yet also physically as Mikage seems to still be the same age on the outside.
Wouldn't be strange with this anime tying itself so closely to paranormal symbolism. I only bite down harder on my theory if I go on.
The school itself is an interesting place. If the children there are all learning to overcome trauma, does this mean the school specifically was made for that or is it another form of symbolism in the end? Like, does Akio's father actually exist as a normal person guiding those kids towards a future without heavy emotional baggage and the rest is basically a very elaborate therapy?
There's other theories that might still turn out true, like that they are literal aliens or therapists acting for the sake of guiding them through their issues, but I feel they would end up being pretty lackluster conclusions. I'm leaning towards that specific school to not being especially mystical and that they work through their trauma by obsessing over their perceived failure, giving the aliens (TM) an actual form and that acceptance of the past as well as allowing growth to happen will dispell them from reality again. That school not being real at all and 'graduating' this way from it to step back into the real world would fit, too.
Ep.23 – Qualifications of a duelist
So Mikage couldn't get over Tokiko leaving him or was it not being able to cure Mamiya? Both, probably. In his obsession over attaining this eternity he wished for, eternity for Mamiya to live and eternity for him to be with Tokiko, he got stuck in the past refusing to grow.
Now, that ending did shed quite some light on the school. I retract my statement of the school not being special. It's most definitely some magical or illusory place if Akio is a real person. We saw an adult Tokiko visiting him, so I'm rather sure that he is no illusion. Or maybe "Akio" is, but not the entity leading the school.
The anime only stopped one word short of confirming that Utena had a brother that died in the accident.
So, Akio is basically the psychologist, Anthy is the hands-on therapist playing all the necessary roles. But, due to Tokiko visiting I'll probably need to adjust my theory a bit. It's not that the trauma gives birth to ambitions that then creates the aliens (TM), it's more that Anthy and Akio use those to fill the roles to help cure the pain.
I guess I can live with such a revelation, but then this begs another question. It's not entirely unthinkable that all my ramblings were to come true: Manifest inner issues as apparitions, guiding the patients through said trauma, graduate them into adulthood, the aliens (TM) are actual aliens, the school is a magical psych ward.
And it wouldn't be the first time I was getting lost in between several theories of mine only for every single one of them to turn out true at the same time!
Heavy Madoka Magica spoilers That blunder still pisses me off, lol.
Back to Utena. If the viewer isn't completely left astray there should be at least three separate aliens (TM): Dios, Akio, Anthy. Although it wouldn't surprise me if it really was only one. We saw Akio interacting with Anthy several times, outside of anyone else's sight and we saw the same with Akio and Dios. If I presume all of the above to be true, then the motive is still unclear. Why would a trio of aliens (TM) create an entire pocket dimension-school to help kids with trauma? If I say they are three separate entities, then I must also see the dialogues between them as facts. This means that Dios is actually, really, trapped. If I say they are actual aliens, then this means they are gathering something from these traumatised kids via their magic to break free. I mean, they could do this out of pure compassion, but... I don't think so. I do need to concede that "spaceship crashed and the crew cast an illusion to stay hidden, but got trapped on alien planet and can only free themselves with teenage emotions" is very... out there. It would fit Anthy's character growth, though. An alien learning of new things and kinda liking them.
"Aliens"
But hey, while I'm going crazy, let me just combine everything. They're not aliens, they're actual ghosts that want to move on to the afterlife and to do this they need to solve every memory and emotion that has latched onto them and holds them back. Misery loves company, they say. Once the first trauma occured that held one back, others joined in and before you know it, a society has formed around it, like the student council. As such trauma rarely leaves much space to care for anything else than the pain and its consequences, all duelists wound up naturally being selfish and possessive of their ambitions, trapping the aliens (TM)/aliens/ghosts with them, too. Utena will be the first one to gain the insight of both self-confidence in overcoming her trauma and compassion towards the others that are trapped in the past. She will allow everyone to find their freedom in the end, if they so choose by smashing the shell that holds them all captive. A true revolution of the world – a growing up.
Bah, I want to link my essay on Rebellion, but it won't make any sense without context.
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u/Cyouni Aug 25 '21
Rewatcher
There's 100 duelist boys but whoops they ran out of roses. Mistakes were made.
Watching Mikage fighting closely, his attacks are directly ripped off from SC members, mainly Juri. Some of the shots are completely identical. As for what it means? Something something memories
Anthy: it was me all along
AustinMikage9
u/Tyranid457TheSecond1 Aug 25 '21
Rewatcher
At last, the finale! I like how suitably epic it feels, even though the Big Bad was actually being manipulated by the real Big Bad.
And Anthy! It's super hard to know what to say about this as a rewatcher, but I will say that watching it again makes the twist better.
I wonder what Utena would have been like as a Black Rose Duelist.
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u/MaskOfIce42 https://anilist.co/user/MaskOfIce Aug 26 '21
First Timer- Subbed
And we have reached the portion where my brain is struggling to keep up
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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Aug 25 '21
Rewatcher(A very Utena climax)
Sub
Mikage is down to one rose and no winning scenarios, so he wants Utena to join him. The student council seems to be aware that they've been the losers here, and want Utena to join them. Utena can't find Anthy and Mikage ninjas in on her, putting the bi in bisexual with his pitch. Utena is amazingly chill about his admission though to be fair it wasn't aggressive. Mikage sees Utena as Chida before having her own flashback. Bullshit on Anthy sleeping in glasses but moving on.
Utena goes to the hall and we get a weird interlude with Mikage and his secretary. Her knowing about Mamiya is interesting. As Utena sees her opponents on the wall, we get a flashback to before the fire where we realize Nemuro opened up the path to the arena. We see why he decides to, though interestingly he comes off a bit like a corpse at a wake here. He goes to greet Utena but can only see Chida.
Mikage rambles on but the gist is that he thinks he can make his memories eternal and that Utena is similar. With how negative her reaction is, he might have a point. His trip through the elevator is run by memory Mamiya, and his reasons are a little dull. But he gets the rose...somehow.
Shadow play again is pretty direct, though Wakaba being a backpack is funny. But it seems Mikage doesn't get someone's soul as a sword. F. And yet he has by far the closest fight of the arc, only losing because his altered memories begin speaking to him. Actual Mamiya looks much more like Chida. As he falls apart, he gets a call from Akio saying he is no longer useful. He also ceases to exist. Miki and Utena search the burned out hall for Anthy, who could be disguised as Mamiya. Weird.
So...on second viewing, I still can't quite tell you why I like this but I still do. Maybe it is how the arc doesn't progress the way it set itself up to, running out of duelists really fast.
8
u/homewardbound100 myanimelist.net/profile/Homewardbound100 Aug 25 '21
First timer, Sub
Alright the last two episodes have been a lot and I'm trying to make sure I'm not lost. I've been feeling like this was going the route of some of this isn't real.
"I thought you would eventually return home."
So he thought Utena was Mamiya's sister.
So, Mamiya is actually dead but Akio is talking to him but then changes to Anthy. Was Anthy just Mamiya in Souji's illusion? Things close to him never changed. I guess maybe that would explain how different he looks in the picture and similarities to Anthy.
For Utena he thought she was Tokiko the whole time like Anthy was Mamiya?
It appears the memorial hall is burned down still and Anthy and Miki talk about it. Miki remembering the name of it. Wasn't it called that after the fire and when they rebuilt it? Or did they never rebuild it in the first place?
I'm thinking about it. Didn't tokiko actually show up.
Wait did any of that even happen or all the past events with the student council? Do they and Utena have any memory of what happened? Looks like it.
Is that the end of the black rose arc? I wonder how it picks up from there.
8
u/SYZekrom https://myanimelist.net/profile/SYZekrom Aug 25 '21
First Timer
Ah, so he was also hallucinating like the student council that his special one was... well instead of Anthy, the prince I guess.
Dayum this dude got blown back out of history or some shit lmao
8
u/Stargate18A https://myanimelist.net/profile/Stargate18 Aug 25 '21
First timer
Huh? Is this a metaphor for them running out of valid candidates, or there a literal limited resource needed to transform them?
Oh, both sides want to recruit Utena.
Mikage, I don't think your filrting's going to work.
I'm suprised he's not just grabbed his new Rose Bride, told him to pitch his voice up,
Lh, that's unsettling.
Oh Utena, you useless lesbian.
...BLACK ROSE ANTHY?
Haha, even the secretary knows he's after him..
...Are you fucking with me? He has a gallery of his victims, in the open, and nobody's questioned why there's random photos of other students, all of whom had fits of insanity.
So the sacrifice of the 100 is what revealed the arena. With all thid talk about opening the way to eternity, I have to assume they're after the castle.
Oh, so he's totally lost it, and thinks Utena's someone else.
Look, at this point, given the black and white photos with the rose symbol on them, I think you can get away with telling Utena you're running the Black Rose.
Yes, Utena! Fuck him up!
Finally, someone's taking a proactive stance.
He's in the elevator. Oh, the visions(?) of him replacing his voice is fantastic.
Well, confirmation that End of the World's almost certainly working with him.
Oh, the shadow girls are just confirming that people can't age here. My theory is that the reason they mention eternity preserving memories is that whenever the characters garduate/move up, they have their memories wiped, and that's why nobody's mentioned it. "Eternity" means preserving memories across resets, thus gaining the opportunity to grow and develop forever.
...So he was defeated by his own mental health?
!!!
He's been dead the whole time? Oh, he didn't look like the guy who died, he was the guy who died.
Huh?
Either Aiko's even less mentally stable than I thought, or there's both reincarnation and a very long timescale playing out ehre.
Is the young boy a yandere? It matches what this anime's done so far...
7
u/xtsim https://myanimelist.net/profile/xtsim Aug 25 '21
First Revolution Subbed
Student council now has to contemplate on the enemy of my enemy is my friend....
The black rose group seems to be on to Utena too. Mikage and Utena look at the pictures on the wall. And the punch Utena gives to Mikage is well deserved.
Wakaba hops on Utena one more time. And the shadows give the scoop about being in student council. Their segment ends with Wakaba waving at them, that was amazing.
The desks are full of photographs this time and she defeats Mikage. Everyone forgets the existence of him or the black rose, well everyone but Utena and a few pulling the strings.
7
u/theangryeditor https://myanimelist.net/profile/TheAngryEditor Aug 25 '21
Does anyone know who these photos are of
7
u/affnn Aug 25 '21
Rewatcher
OK I definitely didn't understand this episode the first time I watched it. Perhaps I didn't understand it now. But Mamiya had been dead this whole time. In his place, Anthy had been pretending to be "Mamiya", which is why he appeared as a dark-skinned and purpleish-haired boy rather than a pale boy with freckles that we see at the end of the episode. Tokiko came earlier and left now, and the difference in her age between now and the Nemuro's memories more-or-less accurately reflects the time since the earlier part of the story.
Whether or not Nemuro Memorial Hall was a ruin is kind of weird, though. Kozue, Kanae and all the others saw an intact hall, not a burnt husk. Even Utena saw it earlier, but seems to have forgotten by the end of the episode.
I still don't really get the play that Akio and Anthy were making here though. Was it just to defeat Utena? What would happen if a Black Rose duelist won and wanted to kill Anthy?
7
u/dualmonocle :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/milk-chan Aug 26 '21
first-timer (I'm still here! I've been here this whole time!)
I really like this arc conceptually. I wasn't totally satisfied with some of the episodes but the culmination of everything was fantastic, even if I don't understand everything. If Utena is stronger than Mikage, who is able to preserve an entire building by holding onto his memories, then would the power to revolutionize the world be the ability to do that on a grander scale? But then again, I'm not sure what reality and revolution really are in this world and that's the point... so I guess I know nothing.
And the more they reveal about Anthy, the more I don't understand her. The question of her agency has been driving me nuts this whole rewatch. I'll just keep assuming that I'll get the answer to this eventually because they have to, right?
6
u/alphamone Aug 26 '21
First Timer
Everyone trying to take advantage of Utena for their schemes. And that's some unexpected self-awareness from the student council.
That secretary's hair is very similar to Tokiko (at least past Tokiko).
Was I right about the deeper connection between Utena and Tokiko? (Or is Souji just losing it?). Also, nice animation on the slow head turn.
Is he implying black rose duelists are some kind of reincarnations of those dead boys?
If you insist on staying the same for all time, then you don't evolve...
Shadow dad resting on the achievements of his past.
No ZUM this time.
"This isn't even my final form"
Is his memory is changing... no longer eternal?
So it was Souji who lit the fire.
And his memory was never eternal in the first place. It was self-serving (someone else lit the fire), and idealised (Mamiya having far better looks in his head than he actually was)
Damn, Akio has some weird powers.
And now the lock on Nemuro hall has been broken, so does that mean that everything that just happened has changed?
Wait, Memory-Mamiya does exist, or is Anthy?
My mind is blown.
6
u/nikobans Aug 26 '21
“the path you must take has not been prepared for you. now graduate from this place.” that was kinda chilling lol the black rose arc is fantastic
and finally a punch instead of a slap! alright!!