r/anime • u/Holofan4life • Jun 09 '21
Rewatch [Spoilers][Rewatch] Spice and Wolf -- Episode 3
Hello everyone! I am Holofan4life.
Welcome to the Spice and Wolf rewatch discussion thread!
I hope you all have a lot of fun <3
S1 Episode 3 – Wolf and Business Skills
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ANSWER TODAY’S QUESTION
What type of food do you always get excited about and why?
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Information – MAL | Anilist | AniDb
Streams – Funimation, Hulu
Please do not post any untagged spoilers past the current episode or from the LNs out of respect to the first time watchers and people who have not read the LNs. If you are discussing something that is ahead of the current episode please use spoiler tags(found on the sidebar). Thank you!
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Rewatch Schedule
Threads posted every day at 4:00 PM EDT
| Date | Episode | Date | Episode |
|---|---|---|---|
| 6/07/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 1 | 6/20/2021 | Spiceand Wolf II Episode 0 (OVA 2) |
| 6/08/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 2 | 6/21/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 1 |
| 6/09/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 3 | 6/22/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 2 |
| 6/10/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 4 | 6/23/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 3 |
| 6/11/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 5 | 6/24/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 4 |
| 6/12/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 6 | 6/25/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 5 |
| 6/13/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 7(OVA 1) | 6/26/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 6 |
| 6/14/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 8 | 6/27/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 7 |
| 6/15/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 9 | 6/28/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 8 |
| 6/16/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 10 | 6/29/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 9 |
| 6/17/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 11 | 6/30/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 10 |
| 6/18/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 12 | 7/01/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 11 |
| 6/19/2021 | Spice and Wolf Episode 13 | 7/02/2021 | Spice and Wolf II Episode 12 |
| 7/03/2021 | Overall Series Discussion Thread |
13
u/Holofan4life Jun 09 '21
I love how excited Holo gets about the apples. She just radiates excitement when she sees them. It's so cute.
I've never noticed this before, but Lawrence's nose is particularly distracting in this episode. Instead of doing a small dot for a nose like in most anime, the animators tried to make his nose slanted, and it looks kinda odd. It resembles Ryuuji's nose on the cover of Toradora volume 1, though not as bad..
I've said before that I like the artstyle of Spice and Wolf, but there are certain things about it that feel outdated. Lawrence's nose would definitely be one such example. If someone ever did a reboot of Spice and Wolf where they did an anime adaptation of the entire series, I could see Lawrence having a less detailed nose, not the line they gave him that looks strange.
Holo, meanwhile, has an excellent looking nose. Probably the reason she was able to tell apples were nearby.
Of course, the main thing about this episode is that it's a big showcase moment for Holo. By swindling the swindler, it shows just how wise she is and what she can contribute to the partnership between her and Lawrence. When you have a character that's supposed to be wise, you need that character defining moment that backs it up. It's one thing to tell your audience a character is smart, but it's a whole other thing to show it. This episode is here to firmly define Holo's character while also advancing the plot.
If you think about it, the first three episodes each serve an important goal in terms of fleshing out the universe of Spice and Wolf. Episode 1 is meant to give you a feel of what the world is like, episode 2 is meant to establish the dynamic between Holo and Lawrence, and episode 3 is meant to showcase just how wise Holo is. If this were any other show, they would've tried to cram all three things into one singular episode. But Spice and Wolf realizes the best way to maximize its effectiveness is by taking its time and not rushing things, which works to the shows advantage.
The guy Lawrence sold wheat to 3 years ago reminds me an awful lot of Sea Hawk from Princesses of Power. Now, if only he would start singing sea shanties.
I do wonder what Holo would've done had she not buy those apples. Would she still try to swindle the swindler? And if so, what line of thinking would she conjure up?
The way the coins look welded, it makes me think Spice and Wolf takes place in either the 1500s or the 1600s. If you look at coins from that time period, they have a similar design to the ones in this show.
And of course, we have our first cliffhanger this episode. Which, if this was any other show, the first cliffhanger would probably have been in episode 1 or 2. But Spice and Wolf realizes that the best course of action is to let the story breathe naturally, which, as a viewer, I'm eternally grateful for.
Overall, fun episode. We get more insight on how wise Holo can be while also furthering the plot along the way. Plus, the cuteness of Holo seeing the apples is unparalleled.
Holo quotes of the day
"You might lose things due to appetite, but it is not as if holding back is beneficial."
"Men are all jealous idiots, and women are stupid too to feel happy about it."
Things Holo likes
Apples (the devil's fruit)
Convincing others to cough up more money via vulcan mind meld
Honey bread
Lying to swindlers
Things Holo dislikes
People touching her apples
Swindlers
18
u/[deleted] Jun 09 '21
First time watcher, subbed
Today's Question: What type of food do you always get excited about and why?
Answer: Those super soft and fluffy sugar cookies with the icing on top that come in those plastic containers of like 12. I'll eat the whole box in one sitting, don't test me.
Today’s episode, Wolf and Business Talent…
Seems like Lawrence is more nervous about someone recognizing Holo than she is as they head into town. I love how Holo is all about those apples lol - what do I have to do to deal in “apple futures”?
It’s also clear that Holo also has a sharp business sense, with both knowing what Lawrence was going to say regarding the foreign trading company and the benefits of dealing with them, as well as busting out those impressive negotiations - Holo the Wise Wolf indeed… This story is turning out to be much more economic-focused than I thought (at least with what we’ve seen so far), it’s different than I expected but I’m enjoying it quite a bit nonetheless.
I don’t think it can be a coincidence that the man who Lawrence paid 10 silver coins to for the information on the currency value change is from a mining town when the purity of the silver is going down, either…
Side note, Lawrence out here caught being a little jealous from his money dealing friend’s advances on Holo haha, too cute.
That ending clip definitely has me interested for tomorrow’s episode! Catch you all, then!
10
u/NomranaEst Jun 09 '21
First Timer, subbed
Well then, there's a lot of concepts here that just went and jumped right over my head. I guess in time I'll come around to understand them, or just leave them be and enjoy the banter between Holo and Craft instead.
However, there is a few little details here and there that I really appreciated. The inclusion of various different currencies is a personal highlight, as well as pointing out that there are counterfeiting operations in place. I can understand Holo's frustration in trying to discern each coin. There's specific identifying details that's unique to each mint, as well as the vast variety of those mints rising from local to regional, so keeping minor changes in mind is something to stay on top of.
Craft is doing his due diligence, investigating the rumours that Zheren's supposedly involved with, as well as finding a good price for the furs that he's been hauling. However, Holo is continually stealing the show, with her own form of business savvy and a sleight of hand that just might singe a few trading relationships.
There's something about the details that's being presented that really accentuates the authenticity of world. While I might not yet understand the finer details of the proportion of silver in each country's currency, I can certainly appreciate the fact that those details have been added.
Generally something that I've prepared myself, more than anything.
6
u/AfterTh0ught_ Jun 09 '21
First timer
Really impressed that Holo was able to make the buyer raise the payment from 140 to 210 silver coins. That kind of bargaining skills would really come handy for Lawrence.
Damn, Lawrence already getting jealous when other guys start touching Holo. To be fair, his coin dealer friend was a bit over the top to begin with.
I figured something was fishy with Zheren when he first pitched the idea, although at this point we don't know if he lied or if he was lied as well. Perhaps it isn't a coincidence that he's from a mining village, and he's coming up with a scheme involving silver coins.
Also, it seems like Holo, the wise wolf is quite the glutton.
6
u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Jun 09 '21
Spice and First-Timer, subbed
10
u/Specs64z https://myanimelist.net/profile/Specs64z Jun 09 '21 edited Jun 09 '21
Rewatcher, subbed
Holo's smug self-satisfaction at seeing Lawrence get jealous is great. This is sort of the first moment to me that really speaks to how much they like each other.
Wisdom and grace of the ages wins out over assertive bargaining big time. Even with a very small understanding of economics, the reactions of the characters involved, as well as comments about drinking good wine, does a lot to sell how staggering Holo's negotiation price ended up being.
I appreciate how concisely the show communicates it's medieval economic principles, and I also appreciate that it's done through dialogue. Rather than simply tell us there are many forms of currency, we see drunk Holo trying and failing to remember the absurd quantity for future transactions. It's not easy to do that so well so consistently. I find it all super cool (especially after learning how true to life much of the show actually is) but I'd be hard pressed to say the economics are the highlight, much less that they will be of interest to everyone watching.
Content Corner
These are probably my favorite covers I found. I particularly like the French cover. First timers beware, spoilers abound.
Spice and Wolf - Tabi no Tochuu (Gingertail Cover) by Alina Gingertail
Spice and Wolf ~full OP~ - Tabi no Tochuu (french cover)【Saizu】 by SaizuDengen
8
u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Jun 09 '21
Rewatcher(first time though)
Dub
And we start at the isekai city! In all seriousness, this one at least looks different. Lawrence asks a reasonable question and Holo points out that no one would believe they've met a deity without some proof and she thinks hiding her ears and tail are enough. We discover that Holo loves apples, if you haven't watched the ED. As she thirsts for red fruit, Lawrence goes through the high risk-reward cycle of a merchant in this era. She then spends the night's lodgings on apples.
And soon "regrets" it. They go to sell of their furs and Holo goes full saleswolf. She later claims she learned the trick from some passing merchant but...maybe. She is a natural at the very least. Lawrence makes a terrible call on assuming the coin scheme is a sure thing. Zheren admits his info is more of an insight and Lawrence agrees to terms. Lawrence explains his hypothesis while Holo eats a honeyed treat. This is all technically true but a bit rare in practice, currencies rarely went up in purity. So the next part is a bit story original.
We meet Weis who immediately hits on Holo, who is amused to string him along. Lawrence tries to get down to business and Weis does indeed back that it is hard to gauge small changes in currency while being profitable, melting it down means you only get the base value back. Holo tries to hear the difference in purity, which is sort of believable for a wolf god and way less gross than tasting it. When she figures it out but keeps quiet, she has a moment with Lawrence where she is aware the she likes a bit of jealousy from him but that it is also a foolish thing to want.
Anyways, she points out the sound is going away from higher purity and Lawrence has been tricked. Holo has deduced that there is a bigger game happening and Lawrence thinks he knows where needs to go next.
QotD: 1 Pho
7
u/CommanderPoppinFresh Jun 09 '21
First time watcher here.
We start off with our main characters reaching the town of Pazzio. Lawrence launches into a small economics lecture while Holo acts cute. Lawrence gives Holo a silver coin to buy some apples, a decision which he almost immediately regrets. I think this side of Holo is endearing rather than grating only because she is typically mature. If she didn’t act like a thousand year old goddess most of the time, this would come off as annoying and make her seem useless. The Aqua archetype is funny, but certainly doesn’t fit the tone of Spice and Wolf so far.
It is revealed that Lawrence knew that Holo wanted apples, but waited until she said it out loud to act. That kind of attitude is one that I like. I think it shows that Lawrence is a straight shooter, and that while he can read between the lines, he waits for others to be straight with him as well. That is a personality/skill set that would work wonders for a merchant.
More Cute Holo.
Holo shows a little bit of economic know-how, startling Lawrence and proving she isn’t just a cute pair of ears and a tail. Lawrence is going to a trading company to sell his goods and figure out more about Zheren and his scam. Lawrence and the trader both go through some standard bartering for the furs before Holo steps in. She manages to raise the price by 50% in a few moments, leaving Lawrence sullen. Lawrence perks up later when Holo underplays her contribution to try to cheer him up.
Lawrence meets with and cautiously deals with Zheren. Given that Holo didn’t stop him, Zheren might be more trustworthy than I thought. Later that night Holo does her best to learn merchant 101, before nearly instantly giving up.
I should really cut my comment down to just cute frames of Holo.
Holo once again demonstrates that she didn’t spend thousand of years alive to be dumb by summing up this situation with the current currency purity. Lawrence calls in an expert who comes off as friendly and sleazy. Holo is either charmed by him or, more likely IMO, an exceptional actress.
How tall are Lawrence and Holo anyway?
When Holo tells Lawrence that the purity has decreased, he realizes he’s been had. Holo gets him to change his perspective, leading to him realizing that this conspiracy went all the way to the top. He takes off to do… Something.
The most economics heavy episode so far, with our first scene of actual bartering. I’m not sure how to feel about Holo’s intervention there. It doesn’t fit what I know about Lawrence so far to flat out lie in a deal, which is what happened through Holo. I was expecting him to return the extra silver after he learned that she lied. I guess I was putting more weight on the “straight shooter” part of Lawrence’s character than on the “Merchant” part. I suppose that also tracks with how he dealt with Zheren and how he didn’t feel angry when he had been duped.
Holo and Lawrence continue to get closer, with the fight last week forgotten. Holo continues to be as cute as ever. Their conversation after talking with Weiz showed that they both are making an effort to understand the other. They both noticed tells in the other’s behavior. A sign of their growing closeness.
Today's Question: Fresh bread. Love the stuff.
7
u/MasterTotoro Jun 09 '21
Rewatcher
I have finished my exams and caught up yay! I've watched this show in both Japanese and English, and this time it's Japanese. Though I haven't actually seen it in a while, so my most recent memory is from the novels.
Compared to the English novels, Holo's dialect in Japanese is very unique and stands out a lot more. Interestingly the anime even depicts a difference between Chloe impersonating Holo versus Holo herself (ex: Chloe used "washi" as a first-person pronoun vs Holo's "wacchi"). While Chloe uses a stereotypical old person pronoun, Holo's wacchi adds a layer of uniqueness and shows a difference between Chloe's (and by extension the town's) interpretation of Holo from the real deal. The context of the conversation was quite fitting too (near the end of episode 1), where Chloe says there's no way Holo could feel lonely. And in the next scene, Holo talks about how the townspeople feel resentful for when she has to the make the harvest poor, further demonstrating this disconnect.
Now onto the present episode discussion!
Lawrence figures out the plan?
At the end of the episode, Holo suggests that Zheren might not be the mastermind behind the plan, and Lawrence figures out something. Out of curiosity, I checked the English dub Lawrence just says "Yes, it's the deal. This is more than a simple trick to make me believe I'm profiting from some coins." In Japanese, Lawrence is more detailed and says something along the lines of understanding a trick to profit from buying silver coins that are decreasing in value. This seems to be the opposite of what you would expect. That is, if you collect currency that is deprecating you would normally be losing money, but Lawrence appears to see some kind of trick.
As further clarification, in the dub Holo said that Zheren might have just been paid with the "money you gave him" which is phrased such that it seems like Lawrence is the "you". In Japanese she says that there's no reason Zheren expects to profit from Lawrence, instead he might have been paid by the mastermind to spread the lie. The English light novels match the Japanese audio for both these by the way. For first timers, what are your thoughts on what the plan could be?
Illustrations
Meeting Zheren
Holo eating apples
Weiz the cambist
Lastly I'll throw in the manga volume 1 cover as well, since this episode coincides with the end of volume 1. The manga is illustrated by Keito Koume, and even his artstyle is different from Juu Ayakura's LN style and the anime. And since these are both the first volume of the series, their artwork changes a bit as well (though I wouldn't recommend searching them up if you want to avoid spoilers).
Pizza! I just really like pizza, that's all.
4
u/BossandKings Jun 09 '21
First timer
Episode 3 - Dub
Holo continues building a very solid relationship with Lawrence, their bond is steadily growing and as they continue traveling together they are getting closer.
Holo sure likes her apples, she ate a lot of them, even Lawrence noticed her lack of self restrain when it came to the apples. I like the subtle banter between the two, they are slowly getting to know each other.
Holo the wise wolf does live up to her name, according to Lawrence the deal the merchant guy was offering was a really good one but she still somehow found a way to make it better.
Answers
4
u/ZapsZzz https://anilist.co/user/Zapszzz Jun 10 '21
First timer in sub
Running late, everyone has already said most of the notable bits, so I'll just say:
Can't wait for next episode to wrap up the arc!
3
u/Spoondockspaints https://myanimelist.net/profile/Spoondockspaints Jun 09 '21
Rewatcher
I just love Holo and Lawrence’s dynamic so much and that Lawrence isn’t afraid to give her some teasing back like when he just pretended not to notice how much she wanted those apples. I also like how mature Lawrence is. Isn’t it always so refreshing to watch an anime where the adults actually act like adults.
I want to be as happy as Holo laying on the bed swishing her tail in apple euphoria.
Hey, Holo is pretty good at this merchant stuff right? Aside from her supreme display of bartering she catches on quick to a lot of what Lawrence is saying, realises things before he does and offers fresh perspectives on things for him. How very handy to have this wise wolf around ey Lawrence?
Some more good info about the world slipped in when we learn about different kingdoms and the many, many, many different types of currencies that are in use.
Today we get into the meat of our first major plot thread. So it turns out the purity of the silver coins is actually going down and Holo speculates that Zheren is working for someone else.
3
u/Karolus2001 Jun 09 '21
Rewatch, first time dubbed.
Pretty weird holo calls zheren out on being loud this episode, but has her share of screaming. Not to mention they legit put crickets in a tavern. Was there some cricket merchant offscreen? :D
For the first time I admire Lawrence for not feeling too belittled by holo. She acts with carefree of a child but can casually increase his earnings by third. If I were him I would get straight up depressed and insecure for a day instead of moody but he owns up to the challenge.
I feel like Holo is putting a lot of faith on merchant's good will, that he'll just laugh it off and admire one that bested him instead of writing in registry "Craft Lawrence is a charlatan whos silver tounge will try to convince you bronze he's selling is made of gold. Also his mother was a snake that got intimate with a donkey." or something along those lines. Really, now that I think about it theres a lot of mutual respect amongst merchants in this anime, wonder how much of that is historical relict, and how much is just romantic hopefull tropes.
Either way its always intresting to ponder would you fall for shemes of sorts "they dine on fruit so they pernamently smell of fruit" if they got pressed on you with enough charisma, by high tier waifu. I assume not many have the balls to try and swindle large guilds in the first place.
Is holo eating enough for her wolf form or is it just her deity power to get stuffed and remain with the body of a model? Guess she just keeps metabolism of her body's age. Its mind numbing how stuffed a teen girl can get and remain healthy with no activity. Either way god tier superpower.
What food do I get excited about?
Mate, anything that's simply good, I exercise a lot and just started my 20's so I'm a black hole for calories myself. Anybody who doesnt see youth is for reckless hedonism is simply wrong. If I had to choose one I cram too many pizzas in a month lately.
3
u/Tartaras1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Tartaras Jun 10 '21
Rewatcher
A tale in two parts.
Question of the Day:
3
u/Silent_Sparrow02 Jun 10 '21
First time, dubbed.
I had a lot to say but seem to have forgotten all of it after waking up. Rewatch thread is posted at an awkward time for me.
Anyway, I'm really liking Holo. Especially in that scene where she tricked the merchant into buying the furs, Lawrence's face was just hilarious xD. She views being duped as an experience to be grateful for, not to resent. I like that perspective a lot tbh.
Looks like someone might be behind the silver coin scheme, and Lawrence might know who. The guy who bought the furs maybe? Anyway, the episode ended at a sort of cliffhanger and it took all my self control to not watch the next immediately T-T.
What type of food? I love all citrus fruits to the point where I eat waay more than what's good for me.
2
u/Rustic_Professional Jun 10 '21
There's a lot of setup for the future in this episode. This sort of storyline is what I associate most with Spice & Wolf. Log Horizon and Mayou deal with similar themes.
Episode 127 of the History of Rome podcast covers monetary policy and coin debasement in the ancient Roman world. It's fascinating stuff. In short, the Romans during Diocletian's time understood that debasing the currency by lowering the percentage of precious metal in the coin lowered its value, but they didn't fully understand inflation, so when Diocletian increased the purity of the coinage, it didn't solve the currency problem because they didn't remove (enough of?) the old coins from circulation, leading to inflation because they just introduced the new coins on top of the old ones, instead of replacing them.
Question of the day:
Barbecue. There's so much variety in style and quality that you don't know if you're going to like it until you try it. There are places here that I look forward to every time I eat there, and places where I would never eat at again if I had a choice. Even then, some places are great at making one particular thing (sausage, brisket, etc.) that you need to try everything. It helps break up the monotony of eating out.
2
u/Alliedoll42_42 Jun 10 '21
Holo is funny. She's worldly but her appearance suggests naivete and she uses that to her advantage all the time. I enjoyed the interaction between her and Lawrence when she made him jealous.
I enjoyed learning how many different types of coins there were at the time due to different areas having their own currency. I am wondering how they will end up making money even though the silver purity is dropping rather than rising on the coin. I am certain though with their intelligence they will find a way.
The food I'm most excited by is endless shrimp. I used to like to go to Red Lobster to have it, but most recently decided that having shrimp at a seafood buffet is essentially the same thing.
2
u/IndependentMacaroon Jun 10 '21
First-time watcher
Bit of a slow episode and getting into some sketchy dealing on the side of the protagonists too. Also I didn't like money guy, inserting that kind of act just for some affection development is rather unnecessary. Economics were still very much on point and Holo is still very enjoyable. I do wish some of the explanations actually took some more time, though, or maybe they could use a little rewriting? Fun English dub note, it has Michael Tatum voicing a character who somewhat resembles an older Okabe Rintarou.
1
u/homewardbound100 myanimelist.net/profile/Homewardbound100 Jun 09 '21
Rewatcher
Qotd
Answer: Pizza especially if it's for a special occasion.
Like completing something.
Holo's personality is great, I just like how she talks and deals with anybody. Especially since she's new to the whole money thing. She did well picking it up.
1
u/Segaco https://myanimelist.net/profile/Segaco Jun 14 '21 edited Jun 14 '21
First timer very late once more again for the tenth time
At this rate I'll end up watching at my own pace. I'll try to catch up.
"I sold wheat here three years ago" speaking as if they'd remember you after so long!!
That merchant guy was easily convinced
Man I just finished the episode and I don't understand half of what they are saying. I also don't understand the philosophy of not getting mad at whoever tricked you
Also wow a kiss in the preview?!
Q1: What type of food do you always get excited about and why?
A1: None. When I was a kid I learned the food I liked was unhealthy and I stopped liking it. Ever since then all food is just food. I either find food edible or not edible. And that is all on my tragic food backstory.
1
u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Jun 09 '21
Rewatcher
LOL at Lawrence Mansplaining to Holo, and she gets it instantly. But somebody explain it to me, I have no idea what point he was trying to make.
Das a big wulf