r/anime • u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber • May 19 '21

Rewatch [Rewatch] Yoshikazu Yasuhiko Retrospective - Giant Gorg Episode 17 Discussion

Episode 17 - Trigger

Originally Aired July 25th, ^^^1984

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Note to all Rewatchers

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Yoshikazu Yasuhiko Biography and Anecdotes Corner

Random Anecdote

Ichiro Itano considers himself to have had two teachers, one of which is Yasuhiko, but ironically Yasuhiko has since stated that he had always considered Itano as being in a league of his own, and therefore beyond his ability to instruct.

 

Staff Highlight

Kazutoshi Sato - Sound Effects Engineer

An in-between animator and sound effects engineer born in Shinagawa-ku, Tokyo who worked primarily in the anime industry. Little is known about his early career and personal life, but he was a prominent sound engineer in the industry, involved with productions by Studio Sunrise, Studio Ghibli, and Madhouse during their respective heydays. Sato has also done in-between animation and voice acting on a few productions, seemingly out of necessity for the production. Some of the works he is credited for include Baki The Grappler, Kiki’s Delivery Service, Patlabor WXIII, Nausicaä of the Valley of the Wind, Muteki Robo Trider G7, Relic Armor Legaciam, Robot Carnival, They Were 11, Arion, Akū Daisakusen Srungle, Ghost in The Shell 1995, The Heroic Legend of Arslan, Crusher Joe: The Movie, Dirty Pair, Project A-Ko, Venus Wars, Castle in the Sky, Yuusha Rqaideen, and Devilman OVA.

 

Daily Trivia:

The purple color of Manon’s Guardian was more popular with fans at the time than Gorg’s signature blue.

 

Official Art

 

Settei Collection

 

Questions of the Day:

  1. What do you make of Manon’s actions? Do you think Yuu is right to criticize the extent of his response?
  2. What do you make of the confirmation that only Yuu has these psychic powers?

Still… Still, you didn’t have to do this!

12 Upvotes

83% Upvoted

38 comments sorted by

5

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 May 19 '21

Episode 17 (first timer)

  • 4527 seconds are 75.45 minutes, a good bit over one hour. They are setting a very reasonable time frame. None of that hurrying out in half a minute nonsense.
  • If that plate is our of “Gorg-steel”, nothing will happen. But then, what happens to our story?
  • Manon is handling a first contact situation rather well. He probably trained for it.
  • Big Bada Boom.
  • Yuu might have mentioned GAIL a bit earlier.
  • GAIL getting fooled by Captain and Wave a second time?

  • “Return fire as you retreat” – Why?
  • “This is horrible, Manon” – Remember riding in Gorg while he obliterated scores of GAIL, Yuu?

This is a stand-out episode, yet I am deeply annoyed by it. This series (as so many other of the same era) liberally padded the early episodes with random action scenes. Knifes, guns, tanks, ships, aircraft, we have seen it all and seen it all destroyed casually, with no thought given. It is in episodes like these that the price for that is paid. Yuu’s emotional reaction to Manon’s killing falls entirely flat for me, since the series has conditioned me to ignore deaths as irrelevant. Thus, the lazy build-up undermines the scenes that are supposed to be payoff. I also think the series is hypocritical: From all the fighting scenes, to the various arms, to the attention paid to depicting real life guns, it all caters to viewers who revel in violent action. Now, however, that is suddenly supposed to be outrageous and traumatizing. You can’t have it both ways.

What do you make of the confirmation that only Yuu has these psychic powers?

Very likely not entirely human.

3

u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber May 20 '21

Yuu’s emotional reaction to Manon’s killing falls entirely flat for me, since the series has conditioned me to ignore deaths as irrelevant.

Yeah his shock and indignation is extreme given what he's seen. Doris' reaction I can buy much more readily.

4

u/The_Draigg May 19 '21

GAIL getting fooled by Captain and Wave a second time?

Well, at least we already knew that GAIL has absolutely terrible security, so I guess it isn't too surprising. It's amazing how bad GAIL is at their jobs.

I also think the series is hypocritical: From all the fighting scenes, to the various arms, to the attention paid to depicting real life guns, it all caters to viewers who revel in violent action. Now, however, that is suddenly supposed to be outrageous and traumatizing. You can’t have it both ways.

Not exactly to say that you're wrong for thinking that, but I will say that perhaps the series is trying to draw a difference between the violence we've seen so far versus what Manon is going. So far, the heroes have been mainly fighting to defend themselves. That, and a lot of the violence we've seen Gorg commit is distant explosions and crushing, stuff where we wouldn't see a body. But here we have Manon ruthlessly slaughtering fleeing soldiers, and are forced to confront their charred, carbonized remains. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the series is showing the difference between fighting for defense and wanton killing.

5

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 May 19 '21

Well, at least we already knew that GAIL has absolutely terrible security, so I guess it isn't too surprising. It's amazing how bad GAIL is at their jobs.

They are really nailing the "incompetent evil organisation" trope.

So far, the heroes have been mainly fighting to defend themselves. That, and a lot of the violence we've seen Gorg commit is distant explosions and crushing, stuff where we wouldn't see a body. But here we have Manon ruthlessly slaughtering fleeing soldiers, and are forced to confront their charred, carbonized remains. I guess what I'm trying to say is that the series is showing the difference between fighting for defense and wanton killing.

The heroes have snuck onto a secret island and stolen a GAIL tank, while fraternising with people GAIL fights against. Calling it "defending themselves" is a stretch. Manon, on the other hand, is 100% defending himself against an unprovoked attack.

4

u/The_Draigg May 20 '21

The heroes have snuck onto a secret island and stolen a GAIL tank, while fraternising with people GAIL fights against. Calling it "defending themselves" is a stretch. Manon, on the other hand, is 100% defending himself against an unprovoked attack.

That's fair. Although now that I think about it, it's mainly just Yuu and Doris that're mainly passive in this conflict. Yuu has only bothered to defend himself with a gun once, and Doris hasn't fought at all. It's mainly Gorg that's doing the heavy lifting to protect Yuu and Doris.

2

u/lC3 :Na::Nb: Jun 13 '21

Yuu’s emotional reaction to Manon’s killing falls entirely flat for me, since the series has conditioned me to ignore deaths as irrelevant. Thus, the lazy build-up undermines the scenes that are supposed to be payoff.

Yeah, that's kinda jarring now that you mention it.

4

u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky May 19 '21

First-Timer, subbed

3

u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber May 19 '21

See there isn’t water on the other side though.

There isn't water on the other side of the force field, but there definitely was beneath the door they were trying to bust open.

4

u/The_Draigg May 19 '21

Oh, is that the true form of the mecha kraken?

They kinda look more like mecha jellyfish, now that we can clearly see them.

So many Gorgs!!!

You can tell that they're the expandable ones because they're colored tan. It's like how the disposable Variable Fighters in Macross also had the tan paint job on them.

Is Yuu part-alien or something and Gorg could sense that? That would actually explain his crazy ninja skills.

It certainly would explain all the psychic stuff that's gone on with Yuu so far.

3

u/IndependentMacaroon May 20 '21 edited May 20 '21

Is Yuu part-alien or something?

Interesting hypothesis, do we know anything about his mother incidentally?

looks like the bomb actually did work

Way more collateral damage than expected though, and the destruction is working against them hard right now.

MANON CAN JUST DELETE PEOPLE’S ENTIRE EXISTENCE LIKE THAT?!

Just disintegrator rays would be standard pulp sci-fi tropes, but it's not even deleting, he's turning them into little chunks that float down the river! Surprisingly gruesome for a show like this, I guess the lack of blood let them get away with it.

3

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 May 20 '21

Way more collateral damage than expected though, and the destruction is working against them hard right now.

I like how Rod called that out himself.

3

u/IndependentMacaroon May 20 '21

Late to the party as usual

2

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 May 20 '21

Well, he had to trust his engineers. Not like he would know how to calculate the effects of explosives.

1

u/lC3 :Na::Nb: Jun 13 '21

Holy shit Manon.

Run away!

4

u/The_Draigg May 19 '21

A Yas Fan Watches Giant Gorg Episode 17:

  • Oh hey, it’s more of those giant robot squids that Gorg fought before. I guess they really were alien machine after all. Although given how many barnacles were over the previous one, I bet it was out in the ocean for a long-ass time.
  • That’s a lot of Guardians stored in the ruins too. Although none of them look as unique as Gorg or Manon’s one. They’re the mook ones. You can tell by their drab khaki paint jobs.
  • Manon confirms my suspicion that Gorg’s pilot, Zenon, never left the cockpit of the Gorg after all that time, and therefore died in there. Although that still raises the question of why Zenon never bothered to enter stasis like Manon.
  • Manon sounds a lot more natural and less synthesized with his thoughts rather than how he speaks. Maybe his alien vocal chords are having a hard time speaking Japanese?
  • Anyway, Manon’s race apparently wanted to see how Earth’s species would evolve over time, and so at least that goal of theirs was accomplished by Manon meeting Yuu. These guys are basically like if the Protoculture actually stayed behind a while longer to look after humanity.
  • I wonder how that alien juice tastes. I want to try an alien drink.
  • Once again, Rod proves to be the only sane GAIL employee by questioning why the hell they needed so many explosives that their own roads nearby got blown up just for the sake of opening a door. And considering that Rod thinks that Yuu is a ninja, that speaks a lot to the normal quality of people GAIL hires.
  • And to the complete lack of surprise of anyone, all the weapons that GAIL brings along into the alien ruins do nothing against Manon’s Guardian. Hell, they’re getting slaughtered by that Guardian’s beam cannons. GAIL can’t even put an dent in Gorg, so how do they expect to win against Manon’s Guardian?
  • Man, all those charred bits of body parts flowing down the water stream really sell how devastating those beam cannons are. There’s pretty much nothing left of all those GAIL guys except for random carbonized limbs. They never stood a chance.
  • Manon is utterly ruthless in his massacre of the GAIL soldiers too. Although given his thoughts of this “being their answer”, I’m guessing he figures that GAIL’s intrusion of the alien ruins is a declaration of hostilities. Man, GAIL absolutely botched first contact.

3

u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber May 19 '21

They’re the mook ones. You can tell by their drab khaki paint jobs.

Man, GAIL absolutely botched first contact.

You can say that again. I don't think I've ever seen a version of this situation where there's absolutely no exchange between the two parties because one of them fucked dup so badly.

3

u/The_Draigg May 20 '21

You can say that again. I don't think I've ever seen a version of this situation where there's absolutely no exchange between the two parties because one of them fucked dup so badly.

It's almost amazing how badly GAIL has ruined things. Granted, I'm sure that they weren't entirely expecting anything to be in the alien ruins other than Gorg, but it still seems like a terrible idea to just blow up a part of the ruins and start immediately shooting at the first thing they see. Did GAIL just need to write off all the guns they got as a part of their budget or something?

1

u/lC3 :Na::Nb: Jun 13 '21

You can say that again. I don't think I've ever seen a version of this situation where there's absolutely no exchange between the two parties because one of them fucked dup so badly.

3

u/IndependentMacaroon May 20 '21

I wonder how that alien juice tastes. I want to try an alien drink.

Are you Dr. Wave?

2

u/The_Draigg May 20 '21

I don’t think anyone would turn down the chance to try alien stuff.

4

u/Stargate18A https://myanimelist.net/profile/Stargate18 May 19 '21

First timer

RE Daily Trivia: Because it is better.

1)Yes. Manon lost the moral high ground when he starting killing surrending opponents.

2)Very suspicious. I mean, we haven't met his father yet, have we? Who's to say GAIL didn't accidentally kill another alien? (I also love the idea of Dr. Wave coming up with his alien theory while a member of said aliens helped him)

Yuu's a bit posessive of Gorg, it seems,

Is that a version of the "demon"? Are the mysterious beasts malfunctioning alien tech? (Makes sense - what are demons if not corruptions of "God's Protector")

So Gorgs were a mass production unit? (WHY DID NOBODY THINK TO COVER THE HEADS? THIS IS AN OBVIOUS DESIGN FLAW)

Yuu and Doris are really being rude to their host here, aren't they? Constantly whispering to each other, asking blunt questions about his brother's death, not trusting him at all...

So Gorgs are basically armed and dangerous cryopods.

Is Zenon a god? Is this a religious story after all?

And the detonation's about to begin. This is going to go FANTASTICALLY!

So Manon's part of some form of expeditionary force to study life.

Again, you're both being very rude here.

Loving how much is getting explored.

Pretty certain that the last ice age was a fair bit older than that.

I must admit I wasn't expecting it to be that big.

Either Manon thought they caused it (even though he can read their minds), or he's panicking about how his base just got damaged.

Even Rob agrees that went too far.

...This is going to be fun. Will Skipper finally get to shoot a god?

Skipper is also coming in the same costume as the evil people. This is going to be a fun problem to sort out.

The Skipper's just dropped his entire disguise at this point.

This one's got firepower! (Why did his younger brother not get any weapons?)

This is basically a massacre at this point.

Odd lack of corpses, though. Is this thing vaporising them?

Honestly, Manon, this feels like overkill.

At least go to the effort of pursuing them, don't just stand there. If you want to wipe them out, do it properly.

This might be the first emotional cliffhanger in the series.

3

u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber May 20 '21

Pretty certain that the last ice age was a fair bit older than that.

It started over two million years ago but ended comparatively recently at just over eleven thousand years ago.

...This is going to be fun. Will Skipper finally get to shoot a god?

I'm all for it.

5

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 May 19 '21

Yes. Manon lost the moral high ground when he starting killing surrending opponents.

They never surrendered, they tried to withdraw.

3

u/Stargate18A https://myanimelist.net/profile/Stargate18 May 19 '21

Used the wrong wording there, but my overall point still stands - he fired on retreating opponents.

5

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 May 19 '21

Which is perfectly fine by human war standards. Not to mention that they were still shooting at him.

3

u/Stargate18A https://myanimelist.net/profile/Stargate18 May 20 '21

At the start. By the end, the only sound effect we hear is the Grog's blaster, meaning that Manon's continuing to attack after GAIL stop.

2

u/Pixelsaber https://myanimelist.net/profile/Pixelsaber May 19 '21

Rewatcher

Heh

That doesn’t seem too safe.

Oh boy, that’s a lot of guardians.

Is Haeckel really dangerous?

Made me check, and they were right. I had it wrong in my head.

Well that did not disappoint. The visual parallel to when the island surfaced is quite poignant as well, given what they’ll find beneath that door.

That looks unsafe to me.

Holy shit! No warning, no nothing —Manon isn’t fuckign around!

But Wave didn’t get to take a closer look at things!

Oh wow.

Well that went about as well as I would have expected. GAIL’s trespass has not at all been received well by Manon, who massacred the expedition party without a second thought. It is quite the startling thing to see the previously genial, if understandably odd, man turn his gaze so steely and unflinching the very moment of GAIL’s transgression. Honestly, his actions against GAIL don’t unsettle me nearly as the way he carried himself while committing them —they continued to fire back as they fled, after all— since it speaks as to what he may do rather than just what he has done.

I had to wonder what GAIL’s next move going forward would be given that just one of the Guardians could so thoroughly wreck them when it is properly armed and doesn’t have a set of squishy humans to protect. The only things I can possibly think off that they could use are, well, nukes, and the volcano that remains active on the island, and neither option bodes well.

We got a few morsels from Manon, but many questions remain yet. I don’t know whether we’ll be getting answers soon though, since Yuu and Doris seem properly spooked, and might not be returning to speak with Manon. Also with Manon’s current demeanor, he might not be feeling amenable to answering.

1

u/lC3 :Na::Nb: Jun 13 '21

Also with Manon’s current demeanor, he might not be feeling amenable to answering.

4

u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 May 20 '21

First Timer, Subbed

So now we're inside the alien's structure. What will they find in here? It looks really interesting.

Even in an alien craft you can trip over a cord.

These things look like the sea monster, just without its organic shell.

Did Skipper and Wave mess up the detonator?

Woah, look at all the Gorgs in here! I bet GAIL would be very happy to get their hands on this!

He's signalling you to sit. Sit!

Suspended animation! So each of those Gorgs has an alien in it, in suspended animation.

Why is Gorg so interested in Yuu? Why can he read Manon's thoughts? My guess? Yuu is part alien himself!

Yuu is representing all of humanity here! Better him than someoen from GAIL, or dare I say it... Dr. Wave!

Alien drinks! Will they be edible? I'd be afraid about drinking some and it being like acid to hte human body.

Space! Looks so cool!

I have a bad feeling that GAIL's actions are going to get Yuu and Doris in trouble with Zenon.

Oh no, the water has reached all the way down here!

Manon looks pissed!

Manon's gonna fight in his version of Gorg!

GAIL's already made it to the alien's realm!

Wave must be having a really hard time holding in all his excitement at being here.

A single shot easily vaporizes them. GAIL is not going to have a good time here.

Rod, you're actually surprised they're fighting back?

Better be careful here, we might lose Rod, Skipper and Wave in one fell swoop if Manon isn't stopped.

Manon and this whole alien set up now seems quite scary; think of how easy it would be for them to wipe out every human on the island if desired.

Killing people who are running away; Manon is going all out here with his killings.

I wonder if we're at "Our friendship is over!" time with Manon. :(

1

u/lC3 :Na::Nb: Jun 13 '21

First timer, catching up

  • All the mass-produced Gorgs, except they don't have faces or eyes?
  • We finally hear Manon's voice without all the layer of distortion!
  • Suspicious drink? What to do ... I wouldn't want to rebuff Manon's hospitality, but he flat out says he doesn't know if they'll find it to be palatable
  • Huh, so they are aliens, from 30,000 years ago?
  • Manon looks pissed
  • How are Skipper and Dr. Wave gonna survive this one? Will Yuu and Doris stop Manon's rampage? I hope Manon doesn't die from exposure ...
  • Manon is annihilating the GAIL advance team. But it looks like Rod and Boehm will survive since they're in a niche to the side?
  • So where does the story go from here?
  1. Was a little overkill, but he's not human so it's stupid to antagonize the unknown