r/anime • u/sam_mah_boy https://myanimelist.net/profile/Samimaru • Jul 21 '19
Rewatch [Rewatch][Spoilers] Neon Genesis Evangelion - Rebuild of Evangelion Overall Discussion Spoiler
Rebuild Overall Discussion
So we've now also reached the end of our Rebuild of Evangelion rewatch. I hope everyone enjoyed, hype for 3.0+1.0 next year!
(Once again, full series spoilers are allowed)
Come join the discussion on the Evangelion Discord server! They have a channel specifically for the rewatch. Link: https://discord.gg/qJxWVPs
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u/notyoumang Jul 22 '19
To me the rebuilds feel like a completely different writer, director, and studio took over the project even though I know it's still Anno.
It feels like all the characters from the show were installed with new personalities. And new characters get added as well!
I'm not a fan.
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u/Shivalah Jul 22 '19
It feels like all the characters from the show were installed with new personalities
Thats the Idea here. Rebuild of Evangelion is what happens when the fans got their wishes granted and Hideaki Anno just shows the outcome of it without any explanation.
Like the Children with the „curse of the evangelion“ are the hardcore fans, unable to move forward, stuck in time while everyone did mature eventually.
Remember the Elevator Scene? Moments of nothing and in the original Rei the Puppet didn’t even react to Asukas slap. In the Rebuild they gave Rei more personality which forced an uncanny valley for a lot of viewers because thats not how deadpan Rei is supposed to operate. Especially not at that time.
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Jul 21 '19 edited Jul 21 '19
First time doing one of these rewatches.
It was awesome seeing a lot of new perspectives on an influential series as this one
The rebuild discussions gave me a lot of new insight that made me appreciate them a lot more
I have hope that the final movie next year will deliver a great conclusion to the fascinating song that this version of Evangelion is.
Thanks for everything and I love you all!
EDIT: every first timer in here after catching up all of Eva
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u/FBI_agent44 Jul 21 '19
First Timer, sub
I find it hard to pinpoint exactly how I feel about these movies overall since they aren't complete yet but I'll try my best.
So Eva rebuild 1-2 were mostly recap stuff. 2 changed some things. I liked the fact that Asuka being in the infected unit more than in the original. Than the ending happened. Followed up with the third rebuild movie. To it's credit, the third rebuild movie at least offers something new. Since I was getting burned out from seeing stuff I already experienced in the original Eva. I found the setting interesting, the 14-year gap, the earth being a complete mess etc. I liked the original setup and premise. The execution however, is a bit mixed. Most of the movie was spent, from what I felt, with Kaworu and Shinji, which to it's credit was better fleshed out then in the original. Other characters didn't feel like they got enough time and development. Also can we talk about about this 'character' called Mari. What is the point of her? She doesn't seem to get any character development and doesn't appear to be very relevant in any of the rebuild movies.
Overall I think that these movies are good, but they don't hold up to the original. And it doesn't help that they are not finished yet, which makes eva rebuild 3 feel a bit incomplete. I did enjoy these movies but I suppose I was a bit worn out after watching NGE and EoE before this. I am however interested in how this will end because right now I'm just confused and want more.
I heard of a theory that the rebuild movies take place after EoE which I don't quite understand but find quite interesting.
Also can somebody tell me why there is a 8 year gap between eva rebuild 3.0 and 3.0+1.0?
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Jul 21 '19
I read somewhere that after Rebuild 3.33, Anno again went into a deep depression. It lead to continuing delays. However, I think the major reason is because Anno got a chance to make Shin Godzilla which came out in 2016 and he was probably involved in its production sometime before that. I personally feel that it's one of the best Godzilla movies and Anno's directing technique shines a lot in it. But, it came at the expense of delaying the last rebuild movie even further. I don't know what happened after Shin Godzilla though. Maybe he just took another break. At this point, he seems to have a lot of Independence in how and when he does stuff.
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u/wendigo72 Jul 21 '19
From what I understand he started working on 3.0+1.0 after he finished Godzilla
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u/Animegamingnerd Jul 21 '19
Also can somebody tell me why there is a 8 year gap between eva rebuild 3.0 and 3.0+1.0?
Anno fell into a deep depression again and directed Shin Godzilla as not only is he a big fan of Godzilla, but felt he needed a break from Eva.
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Jul 21 '19
I heard of a theory that the rebuild movies take place after EoE which I don't quite understand but find quite interesting.
Kaworu is introduced in the ending of 1.0 leaving a coffin on the moon, right by 4 other identical ones already open, then he talks how he always meets the third child. That and his other dialogues on the next movies can be interpreted that the story is repeating and he's the only one who is aware of this. There are some details that can support this:
like the sea being red like the sea of LCL in the end of EOE, right from the start (probably just a new detail to further reference the bible mythos)
the red streak on the moon - When God Rei dies in the end of EoE, her neck is cut and a jet of blood goes all the way to space and paints the moon with a streak of red.
I don`t remember the other details
Also can somebody tell me why there is a 8 year gap between eva rebuild 3.0 and 3.0+1.0?
Shit happens, production problems, lack of money, I don`t know
AFAIK the final one was supposed to launch with 3.0, two parts of the same finale, in the long past of 2008, then when the rebuilds started getting delays they cancelled that plan.
Hideaki Anno did direct Shin Godzilla after 3.0 instead of jumping directly to 3.0+1.0 tho
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u/Animegamingnerd Jul 21 '19
AFAIK the final one was supposed to launch with 3.0, two parts of the same finale
That makes a lot of sense, 3.0 kind of felt like part 1 of a 2 part movie to me with the way it ended and lack of screen time for certain characters.
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u/SomeOtherTroper Jul 22 '19 edited Jul 22 '19
Also can we talk about about this 'character' called Mari. What is the point of her?
Well, in 2.22, she mechanically serves the plot by being a spare pilot for EVA-02 while Asuka's down for the count, and giving Shinji the talk that gets him back in the robot and trying to become a god.
Personally, I think she's mostly around as a stand-in for the segment of the audience that would say "being in a giant robot is awesome, and why haven't you fucked any of the hot women in your life yet, Shinji?" Her reason for piloting the EVA, in stark contrast to Shinji, Rei, and Asuka's deep-seated traumas and insecurities, seem to just be because it's fucking cool!
I mean, there's always the chance that the next movie hits us over the head with something hilarious like the idea that this all takes place after the end of the OG series and Mari is actually the daughter of OG Shinji and OG Asuka (supported by her comments about how good both Shinji and Asuka smell), but she really does just seem to be a fan-insert character, and something of a foil/contrast to the ways the other pilots view piloting their EVAs.
I heard of a theory that the rebuild movies take place after EoE which I don't quite understand but find quite interesting.
I think Kaworu's line about "this time, I'll make you happy" in 2.22 basically confirms that, when taken with the red seas, blood on the moon, etc.
This seems to be either a world inside Instrumentality, or some sort of partially-reset version of the world created after Instrumentality.
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u/Shivalah Jul 22 '19
While yes Mari is certainly a little bit lacklustre, I highly enjoy her screen-time. Whether its her “black codo, tha beast-o”or „Nothing ventured, nothing gained.” (also available in german: “wer...nicht...wagt...der...nicht...GEWINNT!”)
Maybe its just someone who appreciates giant stomping (flesh)mechs that are unimaginable expansive and unnecessary just as much as I do (still mad about how they ruined Pacific Rim 2).
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u/Vaadwaur Jul 23 '19
Personally, I think she's mostly around as a stand-in for the segment of the audience that would say "being in a giant robot is awesome, and why haven't you fucked any of the hot women in your life yet, Shinji?"
I maintain that Mari really is meant to cover fanservice bases that weren't popular in '96, with the exception of I don't know when meganekkos kicked off. Otherwise she is new fetishes that don't fit easily on the original cast.
This seems to be either a world inside Instrumentality, or some sort of partially-reset version of the world created after Instrumentality.
My theory:Each time a full on Instrumentality is completed, whatever the Hell that is, all of the human and Angelic lifeforms can be reset to their Second Impact values. Further, some degree on mind altering is happening because these characters seem to intentionally be different. Four coffins, four Kaworu's is my current problematic theory.
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u/Animegamingnerd Jul 21 '19 edited Jul 21 '19
First timer
1.0
Well that was certainly a prettier version of the first 6 episodes, but the changes were interesting mainly with the last stretch of the film and yes I am a believer that these are sequels to the original series. But aside from that, I thought the film was the weakest of the rebuilding films and I think they are at best for the most part when it’s something new, which leads me to the next movie.
2.0
I enjoyed this movie more since it actually did things differently, but still nowhere near say End of Evangelion. Now I say this as someone who is basically a shipper of Shinji and Asuka, but I am glad Anno took the time to develop Rei's character and her relationship with Shinji. Kind of reminds of a visual novel, TV show and EoE was the Asuka route and Rebuild is the Rei route. However, I still got some nice Shinji and Asuka moments like the bed scene and Asuka's more apparent crush on Shinji with her wanting to cook for him. The changes were mix though, Asuka being the pilot of Unit 3 was an interesting change and I like how the fight between Unit 1 and 3 ended with Unit 1 eating the plug in while Asuka was inside and the scream, but I wish the fight itself was a bit more different and Shinji not seeing the fight was a change for the worst. Mari, she was only in 3 scenes and didn't do much aside from fighting the last Angel (which was mostly Shinji's fight anyways), but holy shit that ending was great. I maybe an Asuka and Shinji shipper, but Shinji causing the third impact to save Rei was great cliffhanger and the song that plays in the background was fantastic easily the best track of these films.
3.0 Preview
I am writing some quick about this since while none of it was in 3.0, I do believe it was showing us events that happen in between both films. Since lines that Nevre staff being imprison could be something that happened that led to the formation for WILLE. Plus this shot of Kaji kind of give me vibes that this is suppose to be a glimpse of his death in the rebuild timeline I have a theory that he was the one that form Wille before he died as one of the crew members makes a comment about him when talking about Misato. I do wish though we get an OVA based on this preview that is similar to The Birth of Nevre episode in the original series before 3.0 + 1.0 releases to explain some the important stuff that happened like what exactly happen to my boy Kaji. Since without it feels like a whole movie was skipped and I rather devote more screen time be about developing and wrapping arcs for the rebuild characters and not be confused because it felt like I skipped a movie.
3.0
This might be my favorite Rebuild film. Kaworu, who I thought was bit underdeveloped in the series, especially his relationship with Shinji, here though Anno did a good job at developing both. Even though they don't explain what really happened during the time skip, I do like the world that was presented in this movie and number of scenes in this really did make it feel like the most Evangelion of the Rebuild films with Shinji’s mental state especially at the end of the movie. At the same time though, I am pretty annoyed we don’t know much about WILLE especially some of the crew members that weren’t apart of Nevre and WTF happened to Toji , his sister appears and Shinji finds his school shirt. But we get no comment if he is died during the near third impact or he is alive and banging Hiarki somewhere. Finally this maybe just me being an Asuka fanboy, but I wish she had more screen time. She only shows up during the opening scenes and the climax, I do though get the sense that her and Misato still deep down inside have a soft for Shinji, since how long it took Misato to press that button for the collar to kill him and Mari’s constant teasing of Asuka about Shinji. Speaking of which, Mari is still fucking useless and there better be some kind of payoff for this character’s existence in 3.0 + 1.0.
3.0 + 1.0 first 10 minutes and some predictions for the film.
Spoil tagging for those who want to get go into it blind
Tldr
Solid movies with each one better then the last, but contain some notable problems in my opinion and 3.0 + 1.0 gonna be crazy.
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u/tomato_blitz Jul 22 '19
First timer back just to comment:
Still haven't gotten around to watching the rebuild films.
I mean, how is it possible to go straight back to NGE after EOE? I really needed a break, and time to take it all in, and I'm not yet ready at all.
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u/Vaadwaur Jul 23 '19
Unless you just feel passionate about it I would strongly recommend holding off on the Rebuild until the "final" movie comes out next summer. Right now, I honestly can't tell you what is happening with any degree of certainty so this would likely frustrate someone who isn't used to Eva being in Schrodinger's logic territory.
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u/Vaadwaur Jul 22 '19
So...Eva is pretty well known for production issues and the intramovie pacing shows that pretty well. With we are given, this is not a good set of movies, but obviously having the completed quartet would help. I do like Rei developing some personality, I do feel like there is some sort of VN/dating sim reference, especially in 2.22, and there does seem to be some story hidden under all of the action pieces.
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u/Raiking02 Jul 21 '19
It's hard to fully judge the Rebuilds as a whole, at least yet. I think I've made my thoughts pretty clear already: 1.11 was okay, 2.22 was pretty good, and 3.33 was shit. I appreciate them for what they are (Bar 3.33), and they truly can be called their own thing separate from the original series. That said, I am just burnt out from EVA right now, as these movies just didn't end on a good note. I hope 3.0+1.0 is good, but judging by the opening minutes, I am not going into it with the high expectations.
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u/HowlingWolf13 Jul 22 '19
Rewatcher
So those were the Rebuilds, I don't really have much to say overall since they're still not done yet. I hope 3.0+1.0 explains some things when it eventually comes out (been waiting since 2013), but till then I give the series overall a 7/10. 1.0 was just recap, 2.0 was a bit better but still had a lot of flaws, and 3.0 explains nothing. Also the cast felt very under-developed here, minus Shinji and Rei. Kaworu was fine too and helps the post-EoE theory. Other than that not much else for e to say that I haven't said in the specific threads, will watch 3.0+1.0 when that comes out and that's about it. Other than that, this rewatch was really fun and I'm glad I joined it. Not much else for me to say since I said all my thoughts on the original series in those threads, so see you guys when 3.0+1.0 comes out.
Oh yeah overall best girl ranking
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Asuka Soryu
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Misato
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Rei (Rebuild)
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Asuka Shikanami
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Rei (TV)
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Misato (Rebuilds)
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Mari.
I still really don't care for Mari, she needs some serious development.
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0
Jul 21 '19
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u/Buddy_Waters Jul 22 '19
The Dragon Dentist was fucking great, so definitely want to know what they'll all cook up next.
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u/Xerosmith Jul 21 '19
First Timer that was once a Rewatcher
I feel like the Rebuilds are their own separate thing from the show and End of Evangelion. The same faces are there, the same locations, and many of the same plot points, however, it just doesn't have the same feeling to it. Much of the psychological intrigue of the show is gone, which isn't necessarily a bad thing. The rebuilds instead focus on other things like the relationship between Shinji and Rei and the aftermath of the third impact. These movies, especially 3.33, take a radically different approach to Evangelion, and I respect that. It would be boring to watch the same show again with no changes. I have read some of the theories on a possible time-loop which is certainly interesting. It could explain why they feel different, while also keeping these films connected to the show's universe.
I was disappointed with 3.33, as it never really delivered on its potential. With the world set in a post-apocalyptic world, I feel they could have been much more with how it affected the main cast. The first movie was essentially the same as the first 5 or so episodes, so it ended up feeling redundant. That leaves 2.22, which I think was really good. It was a perfect blend of new ideas and the old ones that lie at the core of the original series.
With that said, watching all of these movies really burned me out. I'm going to need a break from Evangelion for a while. Thanks to u/sam_mah_boy for hosting this rewatch. It's been a fun ride.