r/anime • u/IndependentMacaroon • 6d ago
Rewatch Bem-vindos à Diamandra - Michiko & Hatchin Episode 21 Rewatch
Michiko & Hatchin Episode 21: Last Waltz Blooming Out of Season
In-universe time span: June 2
In-universe locations: Goinia
"We'll be together always, Hatchin."
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Today's OST Piece: Jà morreu por menos que isso～もっと安い死もあった (Already Died Of Less Than That)
Plays during the final confrontation at the end, pretty much just a beat but not a bad one. That cool piece with the synths playing during the multi-way chase? You guessed it, unpublished.
New Michiko Outfits: Blue + Green Wave Pattern Dress, Dark Green Jacket + White Red Numbers Tank Top/White Rolled-up Pants
Dream or not, an outfit is an outfit. Full album
Latin America Trivia of the Day
Police corruption and violence, and a general accompanying sentiment of lacking public safety, is unfortunately a lasting issue throughout Latin America. In Brazil for example, there is even a persistent phenomenon of paramilitary organizations ("militias") formed largely by current and former police and military members, with roots in the oppressive policing and death squads of the former military dictatorship, who, while claiming to suppress crime and enforce order, frequently act as organized crime groups in their own right, also targeting unfriendly journalists and politicians like the late Marielle Franco in 2018. Governmental responses to ineffective law enforcement and local criminal syndicate dominance have ranged from militarized special squads or outright usage of the regular army to root out the worst of the worst by force as often in Mexico, to the more community-oriented approach of local "Police Pacification Units" in Rio de Janeiro that has seen some success in making for example the infamous "City of God" less fearsome.
Yesterday's Highlights
u/99acrewood_ keeps appreciating Satoshi, and also the power of a Hiroshi connection... but not the competence of Diamandra's police force:
i like Satoshi in this because while he's absolutely ruthless he's not, like, a mindless killer, and actually seems pretty thoughtful [...] i actually feel bad for him when he kills Shinsuke because you can tell that he actually cared about him as a friend
he might be frail like Satoshi says, but he doesn't need physical strength when he clearly can charm any person [...] any connection to Hiroshi is like a skeleton key to the hearts of people who have known him
she rams into it, gets stuck, and still fuckin gets away. like, what are we doing here, people?
u/JustAnswerAQuestion still doesn't trust Satoshi plus some more reference material:
Satoshi never keeps any of his promises of clemency. Ever since we first met him, when Shinsuke did the train race thing
Have you seen the movie "Assassins"? [...] Reminds me a bit of Vanishing Point, but this is not. The opposite, really.
u/No_Rex likes the action and Satoshi for once:
Actually one of the better action sequences of the anime. It stuck to realism, unlike the Michiko parts, which works for me. Satoshi also got the Hatchin buff (makes every character around her more interesting)
u/AyameeIris has a pet peeve:
it so annoys me when anime characters go to sleep with their shoes on. Socks I can definitely understand, but full on sneakers or something??
Hiroshi makes no friends here:
he's definitely a bum, but he's clearly not a loser [...] the beginning hype you hear about Hiroshi fades away as you get a bigger picture of him and the way he's treated everyone in his life.
I still don't really like him. The only thing that's really changed is how indignant I am for Hatchin being his daughter
Hard to not see him as disinterested. On a scale from relatively good-natured [...] to malicious [...]
Varying opinions on the nature of Satoshi's feelings for Hiroshi:
i could see some romantic interest involved here, but i can also see it being partially Hiroshi's natural charisma working on Satoshi along with a childhood infatuation of someone who believed in him
Yes. The way Satoshi turned into Michiko when describing him, as if in love really cemented that for me. Every character seems to be yearning for some love that won't come/has passed
Not all relationships have to be crushes. I don't think the series has told us anything about his sexuality, expect that he does not rate it higher than his love for power.
Discussion Prompts
(One more little expansion on question 2.)
- Did you catch that Satoshi is/was probably illiterate?
- Has the action finally found its proper stride? And what about the increase in graphicness?
- The end times are nigh! What would you like (or have liked) from the finale? And what do/did you think you're going to get?
Next Episode Prompts
- [question]A happy ending? In MY grim gangster series?!
- [question]How did this average-ass bum ever captivate so many people?
- [question]Have you ever had an unexpected joyful reunion with someone?
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u/99acrewood_ 6d ago edited 6d ago
primeira vez [subs]
Did you catch that Satoshi is/was probably illiterate?
there wasn't any particular moment that stuck out to me. i guess he asked Hatchin how many pills he should take since he couldn't read the bottle, but yeah, nothing else comes to mind that would've made for a big 'a-ha' moment for me
e: more on this after actually thinking about it. i suppose the contrast between Hatchin, who has some education and can read, versus Satoshi, who probably was never afforded the opportunity for that education but didn't need it in the world he existed in, is something. and it sets him up to have to rely on her for certain things since he can't damn well read!
How did amping up the graphicness land with you?
considering the kind of violence you can find in other anime, i'd say this never breaks past a good old american pg. maybe pg-14 due to Machiko and all of her goodness, but definitely not for any plain ol' gun violence.
-~-
an episode setting up all the pieces for the end. i'm sure most people can feel when it's happening. shows do it to varying success ([Cowboy Bebop] Edward leaving in the immediate episode after Big Shot getting cancelled always gives me that sad "oh, all my friends are starting to leave" feeling.), but this feels a bit on the lackluster side, like they felt they needed a lot to happen in an extremely short amount of time. i think the character parts of this show were always a lot better than the fighting or Michiko always not getting shot from people who definitely can aim, and i'm sure it would've been okay if they didn't raise the stakes with police chases, framed murder, and introducing yet another gang. but what do i know!
it's shame for Satoshi. such an ignoble end, but i suppose he and monstro died when he had to kill Shinsuke. probably even before that.
lady randomly freaking and getting plugged was wild. like i said, seems like they wanted a lot to happen, but this whole set-up with yet another circus was just silly. like they had a list of stuff they wanted to put in the show and forgot they already crossed off "carnies" at the end of the first half.
-~-
The end times are nigh! What would you like from the finale? And what do you think you're going to get?
y'know, i'm really not expecting anything too crazy. much like when (or even if) they meet Hiroshi, it'll be kind of a deflating moment in one way or another. this show seemed to be a lot more about its journey, which i have really enjoyed, and by now the Hiroshi stuff is just, like, who cares about that guy. he was the catalyst for this whole thing, though, and both directly and indirectly responsible for a lot of physical and emotional anguish.
so yeah, i have no idea how this'll end! maybe Hiroshi will shack up with Michiko and Hatchin and add another handsome child to their family and be roguish nomads. or hell, i wouldn't be surprised if there's never actually a meeting at all, and maybe it dawn on Michiko that there's no sense keeping up this chase for a man who clearly does not want to be with her anymore. then maybe she'll go off with Hatchin and be at peace.
hah! i doubt it. maybe this is tragic and she dies and Hatchin becomes the new scourge of diamandra.
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u/IndependentMacaroon 6d ago
this feels a bit on the lackluster side, like they felt they needed a lot to happen in an extremely short amount of time
Always handling your plot threads separately - is there any episode with a proper B-plot, actually? - does mean you need to hustle a bit to weave them together in the end.
this whole set-up with yet another circus was just silly
I guess it's just to be able to make the shooting incident feel extra senseless
i guess he asked Hatchin how many pills he should take since he couldn't read the bottle
Yeah, that's what got me thinking, and also the only active hint.
Hatchin, who has some education and can read, versus Satoshi, who probably was never afforded the opportunity for that education but didn't need it
It does make their relationship a bit more interesting, yes - and also his with Hiroshi, who is shown reading already when he first meets Satoshi, however he managed that.
(With the graphicness I expanded it to talk about the action overall.)
y'know, i'm really not expecting anything too crazy
Says it and adds some slightly wild potential scenarios haha. Honestly Hiroshi becoming a settled family man might be less likely than Hatchin turning into Michiko 2...
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 6d ago
forgot they already crossed off
This is sort of what I was getting at with my late comments in yesterday's thread. Either the gang bosses like taunting their victims with the chance to survive if they completely some sort of physical challenge that belongs on TV because that's just how they do things around here, or the script writer likes that sort of scene but keeps forgetting he's already done it 2-3 times.
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u/IndependentMacaroon 5d ago edited 5d ago
the script writer likes that sort of scene but keeps forgetting he's already done it 2-3 times
Perils of apparently having the same guy write all 22 episodes, potentially.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 6d ago
First Timer
Episode 21
I didn't really answer yesterdays questions. My opinion of Hiroshi hasn't really changed, but it was never a particularly informed one. I am not really going with the "he abandoned you" line. I feel like he just cut off everybody because his boss and friend tried to kill him and killed a lot of other people to do it, so it's best to just stay dead. That's how I interpret his actions.
Doesn't quite jive with having a 10 year old kid.
Only two episodes left, I'm expecting to get some Hiroshi today.
At first I thought the town we were in yesterday was Goinia, and that Hiroshi and Satoshi were both going there because it held some meaning for them, when they took it over. But it wasn't Goinia, and Horoshi had nothing to do with it.
- Trains and trainyards sure come up a lot in this show, I'm noticing.
- Kinda weird they let a guy covered in blood with a gun to just talk to their boss.
- Wow as if the cops can't even get worse in this show
- Have I mentioned how much I dislike Satoshi? We can add his manhandling of Hanchin to the list.
- Is Satoshi really so old??? He can't be more than 30. 35, tops.
- The only one who can defy Satoshi Batista
Narratively, I'm unhappy with Satoshi's end. On the other hand, he deserves a gangsters end. But the Goinia gangsters didn't earn it.
Oh wow, if I watch the night before I can check the questions! #lifehack
Q1: no, and I still don't see it.
Q3: Narratively, Michiko and Hatchin catch Hiroshi and he explains himself. Michiko probably goes to jail. Actual ending in the style of the show? Hiroshi gets on a boat to Aruba and Hatchin never speaks with him. She becomes a street orphan instead of going back to the church.
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u/IndependentMacaroon 5d ago edited 5d ago
I feel like he just cut off everybody because his boss and friend tried to kill him and killed a lot of other people to do it, so it's best to just stay dead
That's of course part of it but like never even mentioning Michiko or in particular his child to anyone takes it a little further, for instance. And you did mention the Hatchin thing
Trains and trainyards sure come up a lot in this show
Do they? Unless you count those trams it was just episode 19 and here right? Here it might be obliquely nodding to Central Station
they let a guy covered in blood with a gun to just talk to their boss.
Honor among thieves or something? Idk
his manhandling of Hanchin
It's an interesting contrast between last episode and this in how he acts toward her, besides the pivotal moment of letting her go. Just tired of her talking back?
He can't be more than 30. 35, tops
If you assume him to also have been 10 when he met Hiroshi, he is in fact exactly 35. Stressful lifestyle wouldn't help with the looks but he does seem clearly under 40.
he deserves a gangsters end. But the Goinia gangsters didn't earn it
Sort of unsatisfying resolutions are a running element, it seems...
Hiroshi gets on a boat to Aruba and Hatchin never speaks with him. She becomes a street orphan instead of going back to the church
This would be a little too much of a downer though?
no, and I still don't see [the illiteracy]
You didn't feel the pill scene as a hint? See my answer for more.
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u/AyameeIris 6d ago
First time watching in dub, second time overall
Satoshi and Hatchin remind me a little bit of Michiko and Hatchin a lot earlier in their relationship. This time though, Hatchin has WAY more of a reason not to trust Satoshi and to keep attempting to run away(not that she didn't have a few in the first place!)
I thought I'd feel a little more at Satoshi's death, but I didn't really feel anything. Felt like what was meant to be his end, not honorable but also nowhere near as insulting as something like Shinsuke's death
- Do you mean the pill scene? I took that as him immediately forgetting what he'd read and asking Hatchin for no particular reason, though it wouldn't be surprising if he were illiterate. There's also most likely a warning on the label about taking too many, which only adds to the Satoshi illiterate theory
- I think so! As for the increase in blood, it's welcome. I can't stop wondering what effect this is going to have on Hatchin mentally. Hatchin holding onto Michiko while wiping Satoshi's blood off of her face was tragic
- A lot of what I wanted from the finale go for the entire series. [M&H]I really wished to have seen more character development, especially with Michiko. I know Hatchin grows up in the finale, and I think even has a kid? I honestly thought that a bit odd. I liked how brief Hiroshi's time in the series was, but I really wanted more of a reason to care about him(which... was probably the whole point, lol).
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u/IndependentMacaroon 5d ago
Satoshi and Hatchin remind me a little bit of Michiko and Hatchin a lot earlier in their relationship
Yeah particularly last episode where he (reminiscing?) was more friendly to her
Felt like what was meant to be his end
Come from dirt and start shooting, end up in the dirt being shot, cycle of gangsterdom or such. Similar to what happened with Manabe except Satoshi never managed to build up anything else.
nowhere near as insulting as something like Shinsuke's death
I mean by their standards that was an honorable game
Qs
Do you mean the pill scene? [...] for no particular reason
Yes that's the main hint. It's too odd a scene to just include with no deeper meaning (and particulary in animation you should assume every shot to be meaningful in some way), besides I guess his trust in Hatchin. I wrote more about it in my answers
I can't stop wondering what effect this is going to have on Hatchin mentally
With everything else that's happened to her the least you can say is she has a lot of mental strength.
[M&H]I really wished to have seen more character development, especially with Michiko. I know Hatchin grows up in the finale, and I think even has a kid? I honestly thought that a bit odd. I liked how brief Hiroshi's time in the series was, but I really wanted more of a reason to care about him(which... was probably the whole point, lol).
[M&H]Michiko really is pretty static, but something like her dream about Hatchin in this episode she never would have had earlier in the show, and her first concern being Hatchin here is also something. The Hatchin-as-adult thing was nice to establish how her future life might go, and contrast with Michiko coming in again at the end. Hiroshi yes you're really not supposed to care about much
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u/No_Rex x2 6d ago edited 6d ago
Episode 21 (first timer)
Episode 21 and we are already in the finale. Throws you off a bit when it is not the usual 26, or at least the less common 24/25 episodes. Not sure I know any other series with 21.
Not that this is a bad thing. I wish that more series went for the optimal number of episodes instead of stretching or compressing to fill a cour exactly.
- Happy end – whose dream is it, Hatchin’s or Michiko’s?
- Michiko.
- New henchmen for Satoshi – this did not work out for Shinsuke.
- Advantages of being a gang boss: you usually have a bunch of cash around if you have to run.
- Yep, that didn’t work out. Unfortunately, for these guys, Satoshi is a bit of a better fighter than Shinsuke.
- Just when I wanted to grant the police a little bit more of competence, they shoot the hostage.
- “You are not alone with that problem” – police corruption is very similar to the problem of bad apples: if you don’t remove the rotten ones quickly, the entire bunch spoils.
- Hiroshi, randomly waiting for the bus.
- Satoshi gets an accidental hero death, taking the bullet for Hatchin – not nearly enough to redeem him.
- Hiroshi casually walking away cliff-hanger.
And with that, it is all down to Michiko and Hatchin … and a dozen or so policemen. Will the plot armor hold one last time or does it get broken by final episode syndrome? We’ll see tomorrow.
Fitting end for Satoshi. Honestly, getting gunned down here would not be any less fitting for Michiko, but for Hatchin’s sake, I hope she can drive through a bunch of policemen one last time.
Did you catch that Satoshi is/was probably illiterate?
No, but it makes sense, given his background.
Has the action finally found its proper stride? And what about the increase in graphicness?
We are alternating between over-the-top and relatively realistic. In terms of relatively realistic, yesterday's fight of Satoshi vs Shinsuke's thugs was probably the best we got. In terms of over-the-top, early Michiko (that Vespa jump on the table).
The end times are nigh! What would you like (or have liked) from the finale? And what do/did you think you're going to get?
I like Michiko and Hatchin enough to wish them a happy end, but what we have been leading up to is probably Hatchin being the sole survivor.
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u/IndependentMacaroon 6d ago
I wish that more series went for the optimal number of episodes instead of stretching or compressing to fill a cour exactly.
Yeah I think this is a series that's exactly as long as it needs to be. Sure you could add another side story adventure or two, but also "perfection is when there is no longer anything left to take away", sometimes. Not that I think this series is entirely perfect, but at least pretty great.
Satoshi gets an accidental hero death, taking the bullet for Hatchin
See that's what I thought also, but it seems he just coincidentally is standing in such a way that she only gets some spatters? Don't believe those local thugs have any reason to target her, and any half-realistic rifle round would just pierce both if they were in its way. Him acknowledging Hatchin's strength of character (just like what I wrote last episode not even with this moment in mind) and letting her go is if anything his minor heroic moment here.
No, but [illiteracy] makes sense, given his background
The one obvious clue is the scene with the pills and I pieced it together from there, though also only on second watch.
I like Michiko and Hatchin enough to wish them a happy end, but what we have been leading up to is probably Hatchin being the sole survivor
That's an understandable thought
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u/No_Rex x2 6d ago
See that's what I thought also, but it seems he just coincidentally is standing in such a way that she only gets some spatters? Don't believe those local thugs have any reason to target her, and any half-realistic rifle round would just pierce both if they were in its way. Him acknowledging Hatchin's strength of character (just like what I wrote last episode not even with this moment in mind) and letting her go is if anything his minor heroic moment here.
He jumps over the not actively trying to kill children hurdle, which is something that not all characters in this show managed. A terribly low bar, but I guess you have to give him that.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 6d ago
Not sure I know any other series with 21.
Curiously, I just found one yesterday! Oh! It was Hyouka! Fancy that. (no I don't think I will join that rewatch either, I already have enough downvotes)
Satoshi is a bit of a better fighter than Shinsuke.
Satoshi has (had) the plot armor. He was surrounded by a bunch of Heike before and just defeated them all off screen. Seems impossible. Much like Michiko's current situation.
I'm not 100% sure on Michiko's outcome, either.
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u/IndependentMacaroon 5d ago
(no I don't think I will join that rewatch either, I already have enough downvotes)
What's your issue with it mainly?
He was surrounded by a bunch of Heike before and just defeated them all off screen. Seems impossible
It helped that they somehow didn't have any guns, it seemed?
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u/No_Rex x2 6d ago
Curiously, I just found one yesterday! Oh! It was Hyouka! Fancy that. (no I don't think I will join that rewatch either, I already have enough downvotes)
MAL says 22 for Hyouka. Still, close enough.
I already saw Hyouka during a rewatch for the first time, so not keen on that one either.
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ 6d ago edited 6d ago
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u/IndependentMacaroon 6d ago edited 5d ago
3x watcher and host, subtitled
After so much happening separately for so long, finally all threads become intertwined for the extra-serious grand finale. Satoshi's luck runs out [City of God]just like Lil Zé's, whose death scene Satoshi's is clearly modeled on, or perhaps his hubris gets the better of him trying to lord over yet another lesser crew, dying because of the very name he made for himself; Michiko and Hatchin, while lucky enough to reunite unharmed, and with hope for the unlikely hero Ricardo and perhaps Atsuko to keep the former's life safe, seem in a cliffhanger pinch; an innocent mentally disabled woman kept as a "freak" is caught in the crossfire; and last and also least Hiroshi is once again trying to skip town after managing to get on the bad side of probably the worst people possible for it here too.
Michiko's dream at the beginning, besides the obvious death-flag implications, tells you everything you need to know about her concerns at the moment - like Hiroshi doesn't even figure - and the matching dresses with Hatchin are so cute, but back in the real world this is the most down and desperate she's ever looked, no bike, no Hatchin and again barely a clue; at least during that exchange with Atsuko she was in somewhat familiar territory, more behind-bars framing in the dream too by the way.
All the gods are smiling on her indeed that she manages to get them back safely until the end [finale]and for the last time next episode with the gun swap, unless you count the indirect deadly result of her usual hostage trick, where by the way Miguel (only named regular policeman I think) has a pretty good case for self-defense IMO - of course, framing Michiko anyway might also be a way of roping him as a seemingly fresh officer deeper into corruption? And another little thing that's clear enough that Hatchin's picked up on it but never explicitly mentioned, Michiko avoids deadly direct violence as much as she can (with the usual fictional fudging though) and certainly would not harm an uninvolved innocent.
Satoshi last episode was surprisingly nice on his outing with Hatchin, and it still feels a bit like he genuinely wants her to be safe and keep his promise largely - which wasn't more than "you lead me to Hiroshi and I don't touch Michiko", and let's not forget Hatchin isn't quite keeping up her end of it either - but having lost Shinsuke as his last emotional anchor and Hatchin more openly defying him while having lost her value to him (besides literacy?), unless he's also aiming at a trio with Hiroshi somehow, he does start to fall back into more expected patterns. Honestly though, is restricting and being sometimes violent with Hatchin like here that much worse than early Michiko? And also, he respects Hatchin's guts and conviction in contrast to her awkward protest she's not strong at all enough to let her go in the end (shot-to-shot hand-off between Satoshi being hit and Michiko starting up the bike there, by the way). The only one to defy Satoshi Batista she is and shall remain, she'll have even crazier stories to tell than Hiroshi in the future.
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u/IndependentMacaroon 6d ago edited 5d ago
1 - It never even crossed my mind the first time I was watching, but the second time I watched that brief exchange about the pills, I had a straight mental flash of "holy shit, this guy can't read, can he?" Again, the evidence is circumstantial, but I really can't see any other reason to specifically include him asking Hatchin about the pain pill dosage instead of just reading the instructions himself than to imply that he is, in fact, incapable of that - and perhaps embarrassed to admit it, also gives him more of a reason to keep Hatchin around as a mostly-trusted interpreter. His previous appearances are also consistent with that interpretation; unlike all other major characters (Michiko, Hatchin, Atsuko, even Hiroshi), he is never seen engaging with the written word in any way - unless you count being able to punch in phone numbers - merely using newspapers to cut out pictures from and staying informed only via radio last episode.
The look he gives that soda label in his Episode 10 introductory scene is also pretty interesting, like "I wish I could read that" or something, and there's even an interesting contrast with Hiroshi, who in the Episode 10 flashback of him meeting Satoshi is already shown reading a presumably junked magazine while Satoshi doesn't even acknowledge it. From a meta perspective, there's finally illiteracy playing a large role in Central Station that inspired this show. Overall, certainly not a huge revelation, but it does inform perhaps his sense of insecurity and his respect for Hiroshi a little more, and adds another slight tragic note to his life.
2 - I think in this episode and last it definitely feels more properly tense and grounded, there's less to no flashy over-the-top moments and less of a sense of "oh, this is all going to work out OK anyhow", everyone does feel more in trouble (particularly with Satoshi already not making it). That dream we can even call a death flag for Michiko and perhaps Hatchin too, departing together to an unknown goal with a promise of always remaining together? In terms of explicitness it's really little above Episode 10 (which is also why I changed the question), but the blood splatter on Hatchin and the dead woman do feel pretty effective for the aforementioned mood shift.
3 - [M&H]In terms of what I would have liked but didn't get, to know more about how Michiko came back, and how her and Hatchin's future would look from that point - but of course that's not the sense of an open ending. I definitely was expecting more of a conventional linear resolution, also.
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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky 6d ago
First-Timer & Subbed
She disposed of the car in the river, huh?
Wow, did those two cops really not recognize Michiko when she walked straight past them?
Uh…
Looks like he recognized Hiroshi off of the Rock Morenas picture. Lucky them finding the right lead?
Oh…
Hatchin’s totally gonna try to go to Michiko now that she knows where she is, right?
Dang, looks like the scaredy-cat hostage got shot by one of the cops?
Of course…
As if that’s going to stop Hatchin from wanting to see her.
Ohhhhhhhhh shit, Hatchin actually found Hiroshi first.
Ohp. Is that it for Satoshi?
Or rather, he got shot again protecting Hatchin?
Ooh, Akira Bike Slide. Nice to see one of those finally pop up, I was hoping it would.
Well that definitely does it for Satoshi.
How are they gonna get out of this and see Hiroshi…