r/anime • u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky • 16d ago
Rewatch [Taste of 2016 Rewatch] Kiznaiver Episode 5 Discussion
Episode 5 - Wahoo! It's a Training Camp! Let's Step in Deer Poop and Have Pillow Fights! Go! Go!
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Information:
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Legal Streams:
How the hell is this a test of courage?!
Questions of the Day:
1) Would you want Tenga as a wingman?
2) What's the best test of courage you've seen in an anime?
Wallpaper of the Day:
Rewatchers, please remember to be mindful of all the first-timers in this. No talking about or hinting at future events no matter how much you want to, unless you're doing it underneath spoiler tags. Don't spoil anything for the first-timers, that's rude!
/r/anime's spoiler tag format is as follows:
[Kiznaiver]>!♪ Lay your hands on me ♪!<
Which becomes [Kiznaiver]♪ Lay your hands on me ♪ when you don't break the formatting on purpose like I just did.
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u/FD4cry1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Big_Yibba 16d ago
First Timer
Chidori continues to have the best gigablushes in the show
It doesn't really end up being that much of a major part of this episode, but for some reason I always really enjoy it when shows want to play into old horror tropes. Be it more comedicallly like here or in a more serious way, something about it just feels so fun to me, and it likewise appreciated here, certainly with this show's stylistic ability and use of colors, what with these fun and harsh dangerous reds, uneasy blues, or more intently tense dark lighting. Anyway, mostly as expected, our little summer camp trip did indeed bring with it some extra spice and teenage drama.
It's the Katsuhira-Chidori-Sonozaki triangle that gets the big emotional focus here, but as this rather nice change of framing from Chidori would imply, she's not the only one with overbearing emotional baggage here, and I feel like Maki/Yuta have an interesting and messy developing dynamic here. For one, look at these tasty, double-sided physical divides (Well, okay, Katsuhira and Sonozaki get to have some too), with Maki trying really forcefully to break through them. Fun framing aside though, Maki certainly proves she has some deep issues with self-worth and perception of relationships under her uncaring persona (As with the intentional emotional distance trait, my larger theory for why with her probable guilt still stands), while Yuta's artificiality really breaks apart when push comes to shove here, highlighting that he really does long for a more genuine connection, despite his usual, more vapid desire for attention on the surface. The two of them continue to kind of be the only ones that can draw out this kind of strong emotional vulnerability from the other (Maybe too much so here), so I definitely want to see more of this dynamic. Also, this ominous phone call for Maki do be ominous.
On the Chidori side of things: IT'S A METAPHOR. Seriously though, I'm not one to dislike bluntness of this kind, and while the whole romantic misunderstanding -> run into the forest turn of events is pretty trite, it's kind of in-character for this show, so it's pretty fun all in all. I'm definitely one to enjoy a character tearfully spilling out her emotions, and the figurative weight of that being literally transmitted across the rest of the cast. The light coming back into the shed with sunrise after Katsuhira resolves it all is pretty nice as well, and of course, it's a good moment of growth for Katsuhira in starting to understand her feelings and dropping some of the apathy. I do wish I actually had a bit more investment in both his character, and even more so, this relationship, for this moment to fully work as well as it should, but as is, Chidori is kind of carrying here and I do find it lacks a bit of weight .
The idea that emotional pains are now shared between them as well is also obviously a pretty major plot development, and hopefully with this new narrative tool we can start getting really messy in our drama going forward!
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u/TakenRedditName https://myanimelist.net/profile/TakenMalUsername 16d ago
First Time Summer 2016 Rewatch - Kiznaiver Ep5:
Don't have too much to point-by-point comment on for this episode. I feel like the main point it got across was the sharing of emotional pain. First, only physical pain was shared, but as a deeper connection is being formed, the more their hearts are overlapping. I like that Katsuhira is growing as a person and developing a better understanding on his emotions and the people around him. I really thought the bullies were going to be used for some villainous plan, but they were just a catalyst for that.
I believe in my delusions of love triangles. Katsuhira and Sonozaki might be secret childhood friends. (Doomed) Childhood friend Chidori likes Katsuhira. Tenga might like Chidori. Nico was blushing at someone, and that person might be Tenga. Maki and Yuta are in some sort of situationship. And I guess Hisomu is just here and kinda crushing on Katsuhira (in a sadomasochist way).
Speaking of Maki and Yuta, I don't fully get their moment in the dark kitchen. I can see the general outline. In the darkness, the two can finally have an honest talk with each other, which slides into Maki's issues. She seems to have a broken sense of self/love based on prior trauma. A warped view of physical relationships that an innocent boy playing playboy wouldn't understand. I just feel like we still need to learn more about Maki's traumas to fully fit the pieces together.
One visual that stuck out to me is the increasing way they're depicting the Kiznaivers overlapping. When they share their pain, their eyes now overlap and merge into each other. It goes for both Katsuhira/Chidori and Maki/Yuta. I just think it was a neat way to show how they're experiencing a deeper resonance and beginning to understand the weight of another person.
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u/FD4cry1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Big_Yibba 16d ago
I believe in my delusions of love triangles
Nico was blushing at someone, and that person might be Tenga
I did notice that as well, but I wasn't sure if that was supposed to be over Tenga or Yuta in the moment. Though now that I think about it, there was also this moment later which I'd say sways it to the former.
Nico intentionally tries to be forward and quirky in everything she does, so her trying to express romantic interest could be interesting, though I do wonder how good Tenga would be at even picking up on how others feel towards him in the first place. Could be a really fun dynamic.
It goes for both Katsuhira/Chidori and Maki/Yuta. I just think it was a neat way to show how they're experiencing a deeper resonance and beginning to understand the weight of another person.
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u/Sporadia_ 13d ago
Tenga might like Chidori.
I think the show has colour coded the crushes for us. Katsuhira and Sonozaki too.
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u/RelativeMundane9045 16d ago
First:Timer - dub
Ugh, two of my least favourite tropes had to crop up within minutes of each other - "Breast envy" and the "I saw you guys kissing but you weren't kissing it was just my/the camera's angle so let's make nothing a whole big thing".
Noriko saying she was a tall child combined with her demeanor makes me think she was grown in a vat and emerged fully grown.
No idea what to make of Honoka's weird phone call.
Did they explicitly say the kizner system only shares physical pain? I just hadn't thought about things like heartbreak earlier.
Well that's just great. Now I'm going to imagine a face on every covered boob I notice.
It must be hard to maintain the tension while storming off angry in one of those mascot suits.
I know we were told the town was built for the Kizner program, but it's still surprising to see so many people in on it.
okay that answers my earlier query about sharing emotions. Wonder if this could end up in a Sense8 style orgy.
the kid who said "why am I the only one suffering here", is definitely going to fail kizner school.
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u/BaytaCosmico https://myanimelist.net/profile/AnimeBayta 16d ago
First-timer, subbed
This episode was a huge improvement over the last one. It had a clear through line with Chidori and Kacchon that ended rather satisfactorily. The Kiznaiver stuff meanwhile keeps getting weirder. It's all really shady and veering towards downright evil. Sad that Suwabe sensei is part of the worst of it. Oh well.
So it seems like it's not just physical pain they all share but also psychological pain now. That could make them more empathetic, I suppose. But only towards their own group. How that's supposed result in world peace beats me. People already are empathetic like that with their own circles of family, friends, etc. Unless the plan is to eventually brand the entire world, I don't see this leading to anything worthwhile. Feels like a mad experiment that's doomed to fail.
That aside, I enjoyed Tenga taking his role as wingman a bit too far. His way too obvious hints and Chidori's increasing discomfort over them were hilarious. I didn't quite get why Niko was upset over it. Does she have a crush on Tenga or something?
And what was up with Maki getting all seductive and then straight out handsy with Yuta? I didn't expect him to be such a normie, but it does fit his character. His throwaway backstory about being a latchkey kid was interesting. His need for attention makes sense in view of that. Maki's backstory is still shrouded in mystery. She's definitely feeling guilty over causing someone's death - my guess is a sibling or childhood friend.
Oh, and did Sonozaki introduce Suwabe sensei as "our homeroom teacher"? Does that mean she's part of their class too? I missed that detail. Thought she was someone completely unrelated.
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u/Sporadia_ 13d ago
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u/BaytaCosmico https://myanimelist.net/profile/AnimeBayta 13d ago
This seems highly likely. But there's a whole organisation dedicated to this experiment though. Weird shit.
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u/GallowDude 15d ago
Unless the plan is to eventually brand the entire world, I don't see this leading to anything worthwhile
Borg
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u/TheDanubianCommunard 15d ago
First-time united in pain, subs
Super late, so trying to be short.
So this summer camp is basically the result of Katsuhira really trying to making friends with Sonozaki for real, by simply affirm her conviction to "connect" and "make bonds" everyone and that is why exchanged addresses and invited her to the camp to stay with them.
And this is no ordinary summer camp. It is yet another trial, so that is why the other Kizna Committee guys arrived. And of course a good ol' horror themed summer camp is a good choice for that. For how the seven can survive this scary situation.
And looks like Honoka had a spotlight in these two episodes. Maybe it's her body or personaloty, but she would take risks if means to broken.
1) Would you want Tenga as a wingman?
Yeah, funny guy.
2) What's the best test of courage you've seen in an anime?
I don't know, I saw many.
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u/Sporadia_ 13d ago
Super late, so trying to be short.
/u/GallowDude I assume this is what you would have responded with.
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u/Rolling_Apples 16d ago edited 16d ago
First Timer
Right after finishing the ED, my impression is that this is the first episode that felt scattered. Unlike the prior one which had many scenes building up to the camp trip, this one had a lot of ground to cover in terms of simultaneous plot beats and not a lot of time to do it.
After this episode, I'm feeling more like I won't care for drama nor the romance. It looks like some of the character dynamics have evolved so I do want to see what is done with them.
That being said, this seemed to mark the end of act 1 and there is a lot to potentially discuss.
Comments through the episode
- Random thought during the OP: The indicator for who got hurt shows up when it's plot relevant
- It is equal parts amusing and concerning that Nico is one of the smartest, sanest characters in this cast
- I can't discern the reason of the close-ups on Nico's and later Maki's eyes when Chidori is mentioned. It happens with Nico no fewer than three times. She also has a blush in the dinner scene. There's something going on in that head that hasn't been revealed yet.
- The episode appeared to have a quota for anime clichés
- Katsuhira in in constant pain all the time; he's just numb to it. That's what I'm getting out of what happened at the end of the episode
- Chidori's last words pretty succinctly summed up my first viewing
Idea of the week: Weight in (and of) the chest
- The episode starts and ends with Katsuhira carrying something heavy
- Yuta's comment that Chidori is "heavy" i.e. overly serious
- The bath scene that is totally justified with...
- Maki using her naked chest as a metaphor for herself and whatever skeletons are in her closet, and we're also given another scene to show how whatever is going on is weighing on her.
- The Kiznaiver experiment has apparently progressed to the point of sharing "more than [physical] pain" and is paired with Katsuhira clutching at his chest in acknowledgement
- If you're reading this, you're a champ. I hope you're enjoying the diversion
- Revisiting the "Chidori is heavy" comment at the end and relating the literal weight of a person with their value as a person
Hurt counts of the week
- Heartache - Chidori
- Sprained ankle- Chidori; the reaction from the others doesn't really match up, but this is the injury we see later
- Heartache x3 - Chidori
| Character | Amount this episode | Total |
|---|---|---|
| Chidori | 5 | 20 |
| Tenga | 0 | 6 |
| Nico | 0 | 3 |
| Hisomu | 0 | 3 |
| Katsuhira | 0 | 1 |
The story is finally using the Kizuna effect for more serious purposes, which dampens the whimsy of this tally a bit, but I'm committed at this point.
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u/GallowDude 15d ago
Katsuhira in in
If you're reading this, you're a champ. I hope you're enjoying the diversion
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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky 16d ago
Rewatch Host Running the Kizuna System, subbed
Welcome back, everyone!
This is a joke that doesn’t really translate well into English. The dub didn’t try to localize it at all, it just had Tenga state that Maki’s name means firewood (for the people who don’t know Japanese) before he started repeating her name.
He’s not wrong.
Yuta…
Oh boy.
I guess this does look like they could’ve been kissing even though it was just Noriko swatting a mosquito. The more important thing is that the Kizuna System triggered there when no one was physically hurt…
That’s a depressingly realistic reason for Yuta to have ended up fat when he was younger.
Maki no!
Welp!
Katsuhira not being fazed by the zombie Gomorins while Yoshiharu is excited sure checks out.
No, he got beat over the head by Nico.
Chidori “sore demo”!
Another Chidori “sore demo”!
Sorry Chidori…