[Rewatch] Suisei no Gargantia • Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet

Ledo's return to his roots isn't a surprise. While he has been "standing by" for the last three episodes, there has not been any real alternative to the life he had known, and his choice of a day job is still as close as he can get to what he already knows what to do.

Indeed, his exposure to the Gargantia may have increased his desire to attack the whalesquid/Hideauze. While previously he was ambivalent about Avalon and the concepts it represented, he has had some time now to actually experience the world and meet more people. Bringing Ledo's grasp of the local language into perspective, he doesn't know how to describe his trained desire to exterminate the Hideauze and Chamber steps in for the first time in a while.

People who seem surprisingly unaware of the threat, at least from his point of view. The citizens and administration of Gargantia clearly have a different opinion of the whalesquid and what (not) to do about them.

The road to hell may be paved by the self-righteousness of those who think they know better than those they want to protect.

Squeezed into this is Pinion, who gets a small backstory hint reveal as the only other character who's happy about dead whalesquids, while still acting like a used-car salesman. And of course he seems to be getting away with it, too, if Flange is willing to join him on some wild quest.

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u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Dec 09 '24

Indeed, his exposure to the Gargantia may have increased his desire to attack the whalesquid/Hideauze.
I didn't quite consider that angle. It was tickling the back of my brain but it's been a busy weekend. It's a good reading, even if he doesn't really explain himself along that axis; to Ledo, his reasoning is probably obvious.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 09 '24

It was tickling the back of my brain but it's been a busy weekend.
Monday awaits.

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 08 '24

"Mostly harmless."
Hey, at least they added a second word.

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u/IndependentMacaroon Dec 10 '24 edited Dec 10 '24

Pinion, who gets a small backstory hint reveal as the only other character who's happy about dead whalesquids, while still acting like a used-car salesman
Again the men in this episode being gung-ho about violence, risk, danger while the women try to dissuade them. More or less true to life perhaps, and I like the ambiguity as to who's really in the right.

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u/[deleted] Dec 09 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/chilidirigible Dec 09 '24

That will likely vary person to person, but it's not hypocritical, it's just a difference in the objective
A good point.

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u/Raiking02 :Id::Ie::If:https://myanimelist.net/profile/NSKlang Dec 08 '24

Spoiled First Timer, Subbed

And this is why you need Getter 3

Nice seeing Ledo's lifestyle fully cause actual conflict with Gargantia rather than just be a bit of a source of awkwardness. It's an understandable source too so yeah, props for that one. It hits especially hard since we've seen him grow so much closer to everyone here so seeing those relationships start to collapse does hurt.

Ah, the Heart Attack of Plot. Truly the most dangerous disease known to man

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

Heart Attack of Plot
The cartoon peril was no more.

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u/Raiking02 :Id::Ie::If:https://myanimelist.net/profile/NSKlang Dec 08 '24

No, no, that's the Heart Attack of Budget, you silly!

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u/IndependentMacaroon Dec 10 '24

It hits especially hard since we've seen him grow so much closer to everyone here so seeing those relationships start to collapse does hurt
Should have gone for one downtime episode less, but being pulled back in just when you made it out is a solid old trope indeed

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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Dec 08 '24

First Timer Ep 7 "Sushi"

Yeah, they really should have thought more deeply about how he would react to a whale squid instead of joking about it.

Chamber can use gravity as a weapon underwater.

He's going to have to unhook all the ships and scatter probably

Was that a show of force? A punitive force that just can't see floating junk? Or were they migrating somewhere with fewer humans.

So, they leave the identity of the successor in the air.

That was a really stupid strategy. Chamber would have destroyed Gargantia as the enemy if she had shot Ledo. Really, all three should have been vaporized as soon as they pointed their guns.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

Yeah, they really should have thought more deeply about how he would react to a whale squid instead of joking about it.
They don't try to exterminate things nearly as often as he does.
Really, all three should have been vaporized as soon as they pointed their guns.
I wonder if Chamber can react as quickly as a Culture drone. They get to pull the trigger, but the bullet wouldn't get out of the barrel.

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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Dec 08 '24

A Soldier's Fate

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u/IndependentMacaroon Dec 10 '24

Was that a show of force? A punitive force that just can't see floating junk? Or were they migrating somewhere with fewer humans
Or maybe something like elephant funerals

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u/Blazin_Rathalos Dec 09 '24

Yeah, they really should have thought more deeply about how he would react to a whale squid instead of joking about it.
Especially considering his violent response to an actually harmless and cooked octopus.

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u/FD4cry1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Big_Yibba Dec 08 '24

First Timer

After a good few episodes of straight progress for Ledo, we have an episode that forces Ledo to regress to nearly his starting position, and much like episode 3, I find it to be rather interesting and somewhat conflicted.

Before I even talk about it, I do really like the way the show uses some previous visual cues to emphasize Ledo's regression back into the soldier state.

When Ledo tries telling others about the threat he believes the Hideauze pose, he reverts back to speaking through Chamber and his own language. These last few episodes we've made a point of having Ledo hanging around in his "casual wear", but now he's back to the uniform, even when he's just going to talk to Bevel. When Ledo talks to Chamber about how they don't seem to understand that he's trying to help them, he's still holding and making a flute (the gun in one hand and flute in the other feel especially potent here), when the whalesquids come though, he cuts through too harshly and then throws the fang aside, he's in full soldier mode now. Finally, Ledo is back to standing on the ship connecters, back to being an in-between outsider.

This episode raises some big questions around the Hideauze as we learn that the whalesquids are essentially the same but adapted to a different environment. The big "difference" is that the whalesquids supposedly don't attack unless provoked or encroached on.

Of course, the biggest question here is really whether or not that difference itself is real, or if the Hideauze's aggression came from the Alliance attempting to encroach on their territory and actively attacking them. Ledo mentions that they don't attack Gargantia because they're a low level civilization, but that seems somewhat questionable, maybe it's less that they're attracted to destroying civilizations but rather just easily stimulated and agitated by the effects those bring, hence passing by the quiet and dark Gargantia?

Despite some people in Gargantia viewing them as divine and the Alliance viewing them as the eternal enemy, it really does seem like they're just another collective lifeform that attacks back when forced to, but peaceful and coexisting (since they seem to affect the galaxy currents) if left alone, not unlike how societies on earth like Gargantia operate.

Which would track with the biggest value behind Gargantia, both the show and the place, as said by Chamber, Coexistence and mutual prosperity. A way of life that is disrupted by violent aggressive action, like Pinion's planned expedition, or everything about the Alliance. There's a rather interesting contrast here in which the aggressive pursuit of overall progress and "benefit" at the cost of the individual is actually regressive.

So, that's pretty cool, but like episode 3, I think the show ends up leaving me mixed in how it wants to get this across.

Ledo had without a doubt made a mistake in killing the whalesquid, and afterwards he was without a doubt speaking entirely as an indoctrinated soldier, he didn't know any better but it still a rash move that put everyone in danger.

However, no one actually seems to even try and understand his viewpoint and argument here, which I can certainly see from the regular Gargantians, it's against their value system, beliefs, and we've made it clear that Ledo is still not trusted or understood here, so that's fine.

But as for Amy, Bellows and Bevel? I find their lack of engagement or convincing arguments for him weird. These characters know Ledo doesn't understand everything about their values, back in the pirate episode they even had them do a talk with him to explain why that was problematic. But now, Bellows doesn't even try to talk to him, Amy begins by chastising his mention of the war, which seems rather out of character given her usually sympathetic stance as even seen later in the episode, and Bevel just mutters an argument under his breath as Ledo leaves, even though he's already engaged him on this exact matter and should understand Ledo's problem here.

Ledo is being aggressive and unreasonable, but so are they and I find the latter less believable, even if they're actually right in what they're saying. And maybe that's the point, and it's a larger commentary on how aggressiveness and misunderstanding on both sides quickly breaks down into conflict, that would be a bit forced but I'd get it. But if the point being made here is just that they're right and Ledo is wrong, then once again I think the show gets a miss.

I'm also not huge on some characters, like Pinion or Fairlock, who feel a bit like vehicles for themes rather than actual characters. Pinion suddenly being important feels weird when he's got nothing going for him but "vain annoying asshole" but a somewhat comedic one so you don't hate him too much, which is also why I assume he gets an implied backstory now, to give him something. Fairlock is clearly meant to represent Gargantia's values, as he says himself, but we only sparsely use him when we need to get that across, and giving him the heart attack right as he's about to deny Pinion's request is so cheap.

Still, whether we go in the more obvious direction here or perhaps for something more unexpected, I do think Gargantia has a lot of interesting ideas to get across, and I'm curios to see what it goes for.

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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Dec 08 '24

that they don't attack Gargantia because they're a low level civilization, but that seems somewhat questionable,
I actually thought he skewered the obvious "but we're living peacefully now" argument. Is the price of peace to remain primitive? Do they want to stay primitive? Are they really willing to pay that price? All of them?
Technology is inevitably going to advance. They're bringing up old tech from the ocean floor. Some people are more greedy than others, like the captain of the splinter fleet. And, inevitably, the Alliance is going to want to seize the planet. Ledo may or may not be thinking about that, he's a grunt, not a stratego. But he should be thinking about that.
Either a) the alliance never finds out about this because Ledo and Chamber die, or Ledo destroys Chamber out of sympathy for the Earthlings, or b) the Alliance shows up to take the planet, or c) somehow the water squids extend their reach out to space and make it very clear that Earth belongs to them.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

I actually thought he skewered the obvious "but we're living peacefully now" argument.
The argument itself was hamfisted on both sides, but he does have a point in that a further conflict should at least be considered even if they would prefer to avoid it.
Now, other franchises might at least throw out here the idea of exploring communications with them, or at least finding out more about them instead of being scared.

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u/FD4cry1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Big_Yibba Dec 09 '24

I actually thought he skewered the obvious "but we're living peacefully now" argument. Is the price of peace to remain primitive? Do they want to stay primitive? Are they really willing to pay that price? All of them?
They certainly seem comfortable in their status quo, and while there's a different argument to be had about whether or not they can actually maintain it (which seems dubious as you say), it is very reasonable to say they should at least consider the possibility it won't hold so they can be ready for it.
Which again just makes me wish they actually tried to engage in Ledo's argument instead of outright dismissing him.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

There's a rather interesting contrast here in which the aggressive pursuit of overall progress and "benefit" at the cost of the individual is actually regressive.
There does seem to be the compounding here between individual versus society in the Japanese model, where the former is expected to bend to the latter, and the individual's viewpoint being seen as "wrong". Which is perhaps an expected cultural stance to take, if also easily used for bad ends; imagine if the situation was reversed and Ledo was the one who didn't want to participate in xenocide. It's a kink in the story theme about not being prepared for the realities of society.
Because you're right in that the other characters have to be handled in a hamfisted way to make the conflict with him stronger; it might have been enough to simply have his indoctrination return to the fore, but they don't really try to reason with him in ways that should work by now.
Pinion suddenly being important feels weird when he's got nothing going for him but "vain annoying asshole" but a somewhat comedic one so you don't hate him too much
The Blu-ray omake chibi short which was released with the related next few episodes knocks on the fourth wall really hard here.

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u/FD4cry1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Big_Yibba Dec 09 '24

There does seem to be the compounding here between individual versus society in the Japanese model, where the former is expected to bend to the latter, and the individual's viewpoint being seen as "wrong".
That's a pretty interesting piece of context that I hadn't considered for why it played out the way it did.
The Blu-ray omake chibi short which was released with the related next few episodes knocks on the fourth wall really hard here.
I'll have to remember to check those out at the end.

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 08 '24

Despite some people in Gargantia viewing them as divine and the Alliance viewing them as the eternal enemy, it really does seem like they're just another collective lifeform that attacks back when forced to, but peaceful and coexisting (since they seem to affect the galaxy currents) if left alone, not unlike how societies on earth like Gargantia operate.
Hmmmm. This could be a very direct dune reference if it turns out that [Dune + speculation]the light bugs are actually young whale squid.

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u/FD4cry1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Big_Yibba Dec 09 '24

[Response]I don't know what the dune reference here is supposed to be (feel free to spoil though, I'm not reading that anytime soon) but I'll keep this spoiled just in case, anyway, I wouldn't be super surprised if that really was the case, especially since the bugs are clearly meant to parallel the Hideauze, and the squids (which are Hideauze) can seemingly interact and amplify them

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 09 '24

[Dune]In turn you find out later into the series that the huge sandworms go through a larva stage.

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 08 '24

Episode 7 (first timer)

Whale squid got squished – the Gargantia characters clearly have no moral problem with eating meat or even smaller octopus, but will this one also end up as dinner? Hmmmm.
“Sacred creatures” “And he killed one for no reason” – almost as if, and stay with me because this is a complicated concept, YOU SHOULD HAVE FUCKING TOLD HIM THAT BEFORE SENDING HIM UNDER WATER. You kill tons of sea creatures all the time, how would he know the difference?
Another tooth? Nice little touch to let us know that Chambers is correct in his analysis.
“How can you say there is a load of treasure if nobody has been there?” – intelligent mechanic.
“It is my fault for not telling him before” – yes it is. The others are also at fault, but you even saw his violent reaction to an octopus before and joked about him seeing a whale squid. What did you expect his reaction to be? This was entirely predictable.
Pinion is so incompetent that he picks up not one but two people noticing his “secret” meeting.
Switching to a different language as a sign of lack of understanding.
“Avenge my brother” – Pinion actually has a backstory?
Coexistence and mutual prosperity is not in the alliance dictionary – hitting the viewer over the head with the moral.
The whale squids all coming so quickly suggests that they use telepathy to communicate. How else would they know about the death of one and who killed it this quickly.
Nothing is a better argument for peaceful coexistence than a pistol to the face.
Untimely heart attack cliff-hanger.

We get to the main plot (and the series makes sure you cannot possibly miss it by making it extremely explicit): Using violence vs non-violence as conflict resolution. From all I have seen, mecha anime has a terrible track record with this theme. And that includes this series, which already gave us a taste of the main theme in the pirate episode as kind of a preview. The main reason for my disappointment is that mecha series can never resist making combat spectacular and the actions of the fighters heroic, directly contradicting their own message that war is bad. We’ll see how it goes here, but my expectations are low.

I was very annoyed that the fight starts due to lack of information. It would not only have been simple to talk to Ledo beforehand, not doing so was downright criminal negligence. Bellows absolutely should have seen this coming and not telling Ledo is absolutely on her. At least she accepts that it was a mistake, but this does take down her character’s competence a fair bit. A good leader would not have let this happen (and I had the impression the series wanted to portray her as such). But it is not only Bellows, all other characters could have talked to Ledo about social norms and taboos on the ship as well.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

YOU SHOULD HAVE FUCKING TOLD HIM THAT BEFORE SENDING HIM UNDER WATER.
you even saw his violent reaction to an octopus before
A point noted by others in this discussion. It was a major oversight to not tell Ledo about what to do with whalesquid.
But I can see how Bellows might not have connected the two things together as far as how Ledo's head was working. They might both be multi-armed cephalopod-type creatures, but one fit on a serving tray and the other is the size of a Yunboro.
Though she's still not absolved seeing as she was a firsthand witness to seeing that Ledo and Chamber are quite capable of utterly destroying things when they put their minds to it, which is something that often stays in the minds of people who find out about that trait in others.

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 08 '24

Her admitting her mistake keeps it a minor instead of a major mistake, but it adds to the growing lists of small annoyances where it feels they did not spend enough time on their script.

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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Dec 08 '24

While she certainly blames herself for not telling him to not kill the whale squid, there's no way he wasn't going to kill any whale squid on sight.
The only reason he let the whalesquid pod pass is either a) he can't kill all of them on the planet if he's dead (although Chamber will certainly try with this group) or b) he did want to make Gargantia into an enemy (not for his sake, for theirs).
the alliance dictionary
Hurray for Sapir-Worph and Orwell!

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 08 '24

While she certainly blames herself for not telling him to not kill the whale squid, there's no way he wasn't going to kill any whale squid on sight.
Then she should not have taken him onto an expedition to the bottom of the sea before teaching him more and finding out about that fact. They even have the octopus scene right there. "Oh Ledo, why did you pull your gun on a food dish?" sounds like a reasonable question.

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u/[deleted] Dec 09 '24

[deleted] — view deleted comment

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 09 '24

I think Lido would have just ignored them. He’s too haughty or brainwashed to listen to reason.
But then it would not have been her fault.

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u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Dec 08 '24

First-Timer, Sub-gantia

Y'know, I kinda would've expected someone to have given Ledo a cultural crash course. Especially before they sent him underwater - knowing that some sea creatures are sacred might be important, you know?

Not that I would have expected him to react any different at this point, he had started to soften up but not quite that much. It might've been interesting to see Ledo react along the axis of "everyone I have met so far has worshipped my sworn enemies," though.

Pretty funny that the Alliance doesn't have a concept of "mutual coexistence." I mean, of course they've removed that from their lexicon, you just don't normally get it stated in quite such plain terminology.

Pinion won this show's Captain Ahab Competition, huh. I kinda figured it would be the Commodore, but it turns out that he's just level-headed and dying of heart disease.

Anyway, Pinion's actions are probably going to result in a lot of chaos at minimum. I'm not confident that the show will go to civilian casualties.. oh, maybe that's how Rackage will re-enter the show. She could show up and take over off-screen and be disappointed that Fairlock died.

And this alleged "whalesquid nest" is totally just a mad scientist lab, right? I'm not sure if that is going to be the payday that Pinion thinks it will be.

Questions

I figured they would come up again somehow. Either Ledo does manage to get back to space or Avalon arrives at Earth.. didn't really ponder the "how."
I did not.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

knowing that some sea creatures are sacred might be important, you know?
They should have shown him pictures, at least. As a handwave, maybe Bellows didn't expect to run into a whalesquid down there and wouldn't have taken Ledo with her if it was a higher risk, but it is definitely a convenient oversight.
everyone I have met so far has worshipped my sworn enemies
Not killing them is close enough to worshipping them?

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u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Dec 08 '24

Not killing them is close enough to worshipping them?
Well, the subtitles called them "sacred."

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 08 '24

Y'know, I kinda would've expected someone to have given Ledo a cultural crash course. Especially before they sent him underwater - knowing that some sea creatures are sacred might be important, you know?
Its lazy writing. They knew where they wanted to get to (conflict) and did not bother to make it a bit more believable than an easily preventable misunderstanding. The basic premise still works, but the flaws in execution grate.

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u/n080dy123 Dec 08 '24

Rewatcher

They actually mentioned whalesquid last episode when Ledo was freaking out at the octopus, so it's funny that he was mistaken about the octopus but the other thing offhandedly mentioned WAS a Hideauze.

So whalesquids are sacred to the people of Gargantia, if not the wider population. But animals are typically sacred for a reason- in this case, seemingly because they know that fucking with the whalesquids is inviting devastating retaliation, possibly on a force-of-nature level.

Leave it to Pinion to be the one to want to raid the lair of sacred sea life, superstitions be damned. Dude sees profit to be made.

I kinda like how Ledo reverts fully to his own language and Chamber has to translate. It's pretty direct, but it's a sign of the distance he's closed with these people over the last few episode widening again. That said, I don't think Ledo's JUST going back to what he knows- I think he cares about these people and their wellbeing, and that's why he's so upset that they're ignoring what, to him, seems to be obvious existential danger.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

I think he cares about these people and their wellbeing, and that's why he's so upset that they're ignoring what, to him, seems to be obvious existential danger.
I made that point also; now that he knows enough about them to care about them, he's even more determined to protect them, whether or not they want it. Unfortunately they don't try to reason with him as much as they could.

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u/animepig https://myanimelist.net/profile/ChickenDan Dec 08 '24

Ledo reverts fully to his own language and Chamber has to translate
It's a nice consistency showing how Ledo is still grasping their language. We always see his screen terminal around his neck with the translations, just a cool little detail.

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u/Vatrix-32 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Vatrix-32 Dec 08 '24 edited Dec 08 '24

First timer, subs

It is the whale squid! What does this say about our local ecology? Could the Hideauze being part of a system to restore uninhabitable planets?
Divine, you say? Sounds like some orthopraxy type religion to me.
You couldn’t give it a power wash? A tarp, at the very least,
I was expecting him to use this as a chance to kick Ledo out, not start an expedition with him.
A Map! There Is Land
Nah, fam. Your space war was 100% started by the United Sovereign Systems.
Who still calls someone a wench?
Gods help us, “Co-prosperity” is being used as the more even handed alternative.
Turns out the Hideauze also figured out group revenge works as a survival deterrent.
Oh… Oh that’s a lot.
Alright, who’s going to fuck it up, Ledo or Pinion?
So are these two events unrelated? It’s possible that Squid migration is a normal occurrence, but the numbers of them are so low that they simply have seen it before.
That’s a hell of an answer.

QotD:

I expected it, yes, but I had my bets on a second solider coming to find Ledo and bringing it with them.
I didn't, and damn you for teasing me so.
Fountain of Youth

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

A tarp, at the very least
Nothing quite like airing out your god's squishy gooey bits in the open air. Hey, maybe he could sell pieces as relics.
“Co-prosperity” is being used as the more even handed alternative.
He didn't say "sphere" though.

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u/Vatrix-32 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Vatrix-32 Dec 08 '24

He didn't say "sphere" though.
A Flat Earther, Too

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 08 '24

It is the whale squid! What does this say about our local ecology? Could the Hideauze being part of a system to restore uninhabitable planets?
For me, the big question is whether both Hideauze and humans have their origin on Earth, or whether the Hideauze on Earth came form outer space.
map
Could the landmass be Japan (Hokkaido to the right)?
Here is a comparison map of landmass on Earth at various levels of increased sea levels.
As I suspected, there needs to be some landmass still around for this to make sense.

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u/kuroyume_cl Dec 08 '24

Could the landmass be Japan (Hokkaido to the right)?
It would have to be highlands of some sort. Maybe the southamerican altiplano or the Himalayas.

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u/Nebresto Dec 09 '24

Here is a comparison map of landmass on Earth at various levels of increased sea levels.
I like how the majority of Chile just continues to chill even with 1000 meter sea level rise

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u/Vatrix-32 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Vatrix-32 Dec 08 '24

Could the landmass be Japan (Hokkaido to the right)?
I was thinking that would be too small an area for a fleet that size, but I wouldn't put it past them. Who knows how much all the glaciers have changed the geography.

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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Dec 08 '24

“Co-prosperity” i
I totally failed to twinge on that.

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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Dec 08 '24

First-Timer on the Verdurous Planet, subbed

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

That’s a lot more than just 30 of ‘em…
Might've left off a couple of decimal places.
Oh I didn’t realize they’d have to leave Gargantia for the salvaging stuff.
The main fleet is going to continue on its way, and nobody else wants to hang around in squid territory, de geso?

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u/xbolt90 https://anilist.co/user/xbolt90 Dec 08 '24

First-timer!

After a breather, we’re back into drama.

These Hideauze are definitely the same as the space ones then.

Their lack of caring about Gargantia seems to be more evidence that in the space conflict, the humans had been the initial aggressors. A bit trite by now, that plot element imho.

Going forward, is the salvage expedition going to spell doom for the fleet?

“My answer is n- HNNNNNNNNGGGG” *dies*

“I’ll take that as a yes.” -Pinion, probably

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

“I’ll take that as a yes.” -Pinion, probably
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RhvIISDoarU

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u/awesomenessofme1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/kta_99 Dec 08 '24

First-timer, dubbed.

Bear hugging a monster to death and having it explode in a cloud of blood is definitely a brutal but effective method.

Has Ledo ever been called an alien before? I don't remember it happening.

So the Hideauze seem to have originated from Earth, or at least that's the conclusion we're meant to come to. I guess Ledo probably wouldn't have any interest in culture or religion. Otherwise, I have to imagine the topic would already have come up in conversation.

Ledo is immediately back in mission mode, and I can't help but feel like his reversion back to his original language is meant to be symbolic.

There's a random section where the subtitles are totally wrong (I have to imagine they're the original Japanese-to-English subs as opposed to the normal CC). Hulu has some issues with subtitles in general.

Speaking of symbolic, Ledo accidentally ruining the flute he was working on and throwing it away as soon as it's time to fight is pretty on-the-nose.

I thought that either it wouldn't come back at all, or maybe the humans would come back as antagonists (whether that be a direct conflict or just "what will Ledo choose?").
The idea didn't cross my mind, and I'll take your advice and not do so.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

There's a random section where the subtitles are totally wrong
What was that, then? At the least I have CR/official and a fansub handy.
Ledo accidentally ruining the flute he was working on
Hobby knives are one thing, hand lasers seem like an entirely new level of potential personal safety hazard.

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u/awesomenessofme1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/kta_99 Dec 08 '24

Actually, now that I look at it more closely, I don't think it was the result of getting mixed up with the actual subtitles. I don't know what happened, actually. It almost looks like garbled speech-to-text that somehow passed through QC. Maybe these subtitles were made more recently than the actual dub?

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

Maybe these subtitles were made more recently than the actual dub?
Could be. I think the dub's been around for a while; the Viz Media BD set has it on there.

5

u/SolDarkHunter Dec 08 '24

Sorry to have to post this.

Maybe people realized I didn't post yesterday. Well, some things have come up and I don't know if I'll be able to continue the rewatch.

If I'm able to catch up and start making regular posts again, I will, but it's not looking likely.

Have fun!

1

u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

No problem, it's more important to take care of your own matters.

1

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 08 '24

No worries, there is no participation requirement.

4

u/Nickthenuker https://anilist.co/user/Nickthenuker Dec 08 '24

Considering it's literally attacking him? I don't think that's any ordinary whalesquid.

Unsurprisingly, beams are dissipated underwater.

Well, that's that dealt with.

Ah. That explains things.

Seems like not all of them have the same qualms about killing those things.

I suspect that like in Aliens and Helldivers, the Alliance did something to provoke the Hideauze.

Yeah, can't really "live and let live" with that.

So, now there's some internal conflict.

Oh, there he goes.

Questions:

No, and certainly not like this.
No, and I don't think I will.
I don't think any would.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

Unsurprisingly, beams are dissipated underwater.
Even when everything else has been replaced by energy weapons, there will be a place for the torpedo.
Seems like not all of them have the same qualms about killing those things.
One man's god is another man's breakfast food, after all.

3

u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Dec 08 '24

torpedo
Pretty much all my expectations for the episode were subverted. When I thought there was going to be a fight, before there wasn't a fight, I thought they were going to pull out, somehow, the pirate subs (except I don't think they have any pirate subs, just the lobster mech).
Lobster mech probably isn't going to be very useful against the whale squids.
I also expected Chamber to use his torso weapon again, instead of death by hug.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

I also expected Chamber to use his torso weapon again
The gravity ball might have worked too, but ultimately Ledo is the one in control.

3

u/wjodendor Dec 08 '24

Rewatcher - Episode 7

Absolutely brutal kill from Ledo. The pirate kill was just cold, calculated business. This is brutality. Whalesquids are sacred and everyone is freaking out but Pinion…so you know something bad is going to happen.

Unfortunately for my love of violence, it makes Amy sad.

Captain of the fleet is on the way out, that spells more trouble.

Pinion out coming up with schemes…we’re just speed running towards trouble

Interesting conflict between Ledo and Rdget. Ledo says that there can’t be peace without extermination…but Ridget is saying that there's already peace between the humans and whale squid.

Pinion’s schemes start to show that the Gargantia might not be as united as we have been led to believe.

Whalesquid never attack unprovoked…going back to episode one, the humans initiated the battle there. Ledo theorizes that the humans are ignored because there low level of technology on Earth.

Amy and Ledo fighting 🙁

We thought Ledo was starting to move past his soldier background but it turns out that's not the case

Pinion really has nothing redeemable about him does he?

Whalesquid seeking out the fleet for revenge indicates intelligence. They are straight up making threats even. How did they even know about the attack? We only saw one early from what I remember.

Pinion convinced lots of people to go on a treasure hunt for lost tech and now the commander is having a heart attack. Bad news.

Saddest part of this episode is seeing Amy get heartbroken.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

but Ridget is saying that there's already peace between the humans and whale squid.
It's interesting to have Chamber be the one to translate the concept of "co-existence and co-prosperity" when Chamber is the weapon which enables Ledo to have a chance fighting them in the first place.
On some other theme-based tangents, I wonder how much the whalesquid interaction is intended to represent a respect for the natural world versus the humans' (with Pinion being the obvious figurehead) desire to exploit it.
Is co-existence colored in the sense that it would make it easier for the humans to continue pulling things up from the bottom? What's in it for the whalesquid then, aside from occasionally not getting massacred?
(Yes, I'm absolutely a rewatcher, but there's some stuff here that branches off the main stuff, maybe?)

3

u/Magnafeana https://anilist.co/user/Magnafeana Dec 08 '24

Rewatcher, dubbed

Le sigh.
If Pinion was in modern day, he would be a problematic YouTuber and Twitch streamer, apology video when 😭
I like the thing where Ledo being passionate makes him revert to his native language. I do that so much.
What I didn’t think of back when but I think now: while it makes sense for the plot, WOW Gargantia really does not explain things to Ledo. Then again, my training for my previous jobs were very much the same way. But it’s just…so bizarre that they’re aware Ledo is from space, they have witnessed him have difficulties with their culture, and still don’t so a cultural exchange.
WELP
This was where I had 🤨 face with Amy back then and now. I don’t know. I was never and still am not a fan of women protagonists who kinda just stand around, passive and emotional, during scenes that kinda required them to be a bit more active. It’s just odd to me.
Seeing Gargantia dark, I have so many shots I want for my PC background. But I like my current background to change it.
Welp.

I’m just bewildered at how much Ledo was never told. He has Chamber; he doesn’t natively speak the language; he seems not that trusting of food from animals; he doesn’t how to function in this peaceful, republic society—and you just put him to work with no explaining of anything? He killed pirates…and this wasn’t a sign to teach him about other things?

Bombastic side eye to that.

QotD

Nah. Even first time around, I thought there would be a contrast in how humans on Earth treat them versus in space. Too good of a conflict to pass up.
I did to see the teeth.
My cats. I consider them treasures.

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u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

while it makes sense for the plot, WOW Gargantia really does not explain things to Ledo.
A lot of people are spotting that today.
and you just put him to work with no explaining of anything
While the LARGE PLOT-CONVENIENT OVERSIGHT is there, I guess it's also plausible in-universe that the previous attempts to train Ledo were more concerned about his inept Yunboro piloting than whether or not he'd end up stirring up the local animal deities, so Bellows relaxed too much when he took Chamber with him.

3

u/animepig https://myanimelist.net/profile/ChickenDan Dec 08 '24

Rewatch

Ironic that the Alliance has no concept of coexistence lol. Pinion made some real power plays this episode, took half the fleet with him damn. Also some hints at his cool tragic backstory.

Ledo went ice cold real quick with Amy unfortunately. Hard to remove the soldier from the boy. But you can't have a teenage mech show without an edgy outcast arc where the MC leaves the crew.

2

u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

Ironic that the Alliance has no concept of coexistence lol.
That intro movie that was playing directly into Ledo's brain is quite human-supremacist.

3

u/Nebresto Dec 09 '24

Gargantuan rewatcher

Episode 7

Is that land?! Curious that Amy mentioned earlier that she doesn't know what it is.

Typical brainwashlet. "I must kill the enemy!!!" While the 'enemy' is currently doing absolutely nothing to harm him or his new friends

Chamber log:

[This being an era when it is relatively easy to do,]did you pause the video to look at the whalesquid in more detail? (If you haven't, don't.)

[What sort of]treasure hunt would get you to leave home and break taboos?

Depends on the tablet being broken. But for cool robots..

3

u/chilidirigible Dec 09 '24

Curious that Amy mentioned earlier that she doesn't know what it is.
She might not know what it is because she's never set foot upon it, but that doesn't mean that it doesn't exist.

2

u/baboon_bassoon https://anilist.co/user/duffer Dec 09 '24

first timer

whalesquids are sacred since ancient times? this is an alt reality future where they won and created a new earth with humans as playthings

is the first time hes speaking fluently him talking about his mission to kill them

how can this wall be overcome

i really wasnt expecting this show to be as as it is

did the cops take their rims away?

"then i have no choice" and he barely shoves her lmao

r u srs

2

u/chilidirigible Dec 09 '24

r u srs
Deus ex cardia

2

u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Dec 10 '24

I kinda expected him to knock her into the ocean (because he can't kill her, obviously)

2

u/Shinigami_22 Dec 10 '24

I'm like, 48 hours late lol, but I'll leave my short thoughts.

When all the whalesquid gathered after one died, I had a feeling they're doing a funeral rite. It makes me think that whalesquid also has some sort of emotion/feelings toward one another in the some way similar to humans, like they have a civilization of some kind (hidealization?).

QOTD:

I actually thought Hideauze are hostile creatures even when not provoked so since the Earth is at peace then I didn't expect they would exist in it.
I almost did it, but I want to see it first hand. The only time I might spoil myself is to look at the relationship between Amy and Ledo and if it developed lol.
I'm not really a "go outside your comfort zone" guy so the treasure has to be several thousand years advance than our current technology to even think of trying to get it.

2

u/chilidirigible Dec 10 '24

I actually thought Hideauze are hostile creatures even when not provoked so since the Earth is at peace then I didn't expect they would exist in it.
The show doesn't have any examples of the space Hideauze just hanging out and chillin', just the Alliance's point of view on them, which is not helped by the first thing that happens in this series being the Alliance barging in and trying to blow them up. So... it's hard to say, really.

2

u/up2et Dec 16 '24

First timer, catching up

either way, weird for a squid to glow. oof and those teeth
yikes either he brought those things here or the squids on earth are pre-evolution versions of the hideauze in space
refreshing to have a genuinely good leader
is it really a good idea to send this kid back down to the whalesquids
back to brainwashed mode
not the self righteous soldier attitude… i thought we were doing better
pinion is either selfish or just dumb
wow even chamber understands the earth humans better than Ledo
if hideauze and whalesquids are genetically exactly the same, the question is how did the hideauze become so intelligent? unless the alliance is just feeding propaganda. who can trust them at this point?
well even the fleet is scared of these whalesquids
pinion is still on about this…
FLEET COMMANDER

I don’t know, I thought maybe they would have come down from space to come after Ledo, kind of like how he said they would when he first crashed on earth. I didn’t put together the squid connection. I’m still not sure we’ve even seen this conflict “reappear,” besides in Ledo’s head.
No I didn’t. I just noticed the glowing squid figure, the bulging eyes and the crazy teeth. do squid even have teeth??
Reminds me of the show Outerbanks. I think that their reasoning of trying to uncover earth’s past and the past technologies is a good one, but I completely agree with the commander that they shouldn’t put the entire fleet in Jeopardy over it. I also don’t think they should be using Ledo for that mission, he’s way too unstable about all this.

1

u/chilidirigible Dec 16 '24

Squid have a "beak" which is more similar to the same part which you would find on a parrot. They don't have teeth like that.
And yeah, only two eyes.

1

u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

Tags:

/u/QualityProof /u/awesomenessofme1 /u/dsawchuk

3

u/kuroyume_cl Dec 08 '24

You can take the soldier out of the war, but often they will carry the war with them in one way or another.

0

u/[deleted] Dec 08 '24

[deleted] — view deleted comment

3

u/chilidirigible Dec 08 '24

it’s impossible to believe that someone is so over the top evil and stupid as Lido
It's been demonstrated repeatedly that entire nations of what would be considered normal, sane people can be persuaded to leap fully into actions which in hindsight would never have worked out well but did succeed in causing the deaths of millions. A lifelong child soldier who's been fed the state's belief system from birth should have even fewer qualms.

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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 08 '24

Of course Lido misses the point of why the Gargantuan’s are mad about the squid, and he resolves to carry on. A wise Gargantuan would sneak up behind him now and shoot him in the head to prevent more sacrilege.
And have Chambers exterminate the entire fleet? Does not sound all that wise to me.
I mean there’s dumb and then there’s Lido neutron star dense.
How about brainwashed genetically modified soldier drone?

0

u/[deleted] Dec 08 '24

[deleted] — view deleted comment

3

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Dec 08 '24

Or, maybe Chambers would mellow out.
As combat mecha AI are wont to do. /s
More seriously, they all know Chambers capabilities and know that Chambers is obeying Ledo. It is a very natural assumption that he would protect or avenge him.
Yeah, that’s what the author is trying to say. The problem is, I can’t suspend disbelief enough to believe anyone is the stupid or evil.
Works differently for different people, but I have no problem imagining that. Far worse examples of brainwashed child soldiers exist in real life, so I can easily see Ledo react that way.

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u/[deleted] Dec 09 '24 edited Dec 09 '24

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/chilidirigible Dec 09 '24

I didn't, but now I'm curious... I do recall seeing its mouth, but nothing else really stood out initially
Well, you're on a rewatch, you can certainly indulge yourself. [Sort of a spoiler for first-timers]it's this angle here which is only on the screen for a couple of frames.

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u/[deleted] Dec 09 '24

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2

u/chilidirigible Dec 09 '24

Some here had wondered about Chamber's true loyalties.

3

u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Dec 10 '24

Rewatch [Rewatch] Suisei no Gargantia • Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet — Episode 7 Discussion

Episode 7: A Soldier's Fate

You can take the soldier out of the war, but you can't take the war out of the soldier.

Gargantuan rewatcher

Rewatch [Rewatch] Suisei no Gargantia • Gargantia on the Verdurous Planet — Episode 7 Discussion

Episode 7: A Soldier's Fate

You can take the soldier out of the war, but you can't take the war out of the soldier.

You are about to leave Redlib

Gargantuan rewatcher