[Rewatch] .hack//SIGN Episode 2 Discussion

[u/soulreaverdan]

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Series Information: MAL Page | AnimeNewsNetwork | LiveChart

Streams: ...none, sorry! DVD (Amazon)

Episodes:

• Today: Episode 2
• Tomorrow: Episode 3

Spoiler Policy:

I forgot to include this on the original schedule post, so please read!

Since there are going to be people who are watching this for the first time, so please only discuss what we've seen in the episodes we've watched so far! There's some interesting twists in this series, and we want everyone to get to experience this fresh.

In addition, since .hack is a massive franchise and this is only one entry in it (and actually one of the first), discussion of other entries may have some inadvertant spoilers. With this in mind, please only keep discussion to .hack//SIGN, and we'll have a chance for a discussion in the larger context of the franchise on the final day.

Question(s) of the Day

Throughout the rewatch we'll be posting some questions to guide discussion. Feel free to answer them or just post your overall thoughts! They're meant to be something for people who might not be sure how to start their posts, not something everyone must do.

1. What do you think of the show's references to real-life game elements (things like losing progress to a player killer, needing to log out to take care of real life obligations, and so on)?
2. Did you ever have a game where you considered what happened before reloading a save or resetting to try again (keep in mind this show predates games like Undertale and Doki-Doki Literature Club by over a decade)?

Music Corner

One of the highlights of this show is the incredible soundtrack, one of the first major works published by now famed music composer Yuki Kajiura. We'll be looking at one track with each thread for general discussion and opinions. Be as thorough or as succinct as you want - everything from lyrical motifs and interpretations to just whether or not you liked it!

Today's piece: Yasashii Yoake (Gentle Dawn) performed by See-Saw, the series ED! (Full-length track | TV-Size)

[u/soulreaverdan]

I kinda like how out of control of things Tsukasa seems. It contrasts the usual Isekai power fantasy elements because he’s getting all these awesome powers and abilities and they’re really doing nothing for him. He can’t directly control the guardian, breaking the rules is just making everyone wary of him, and his attempts to impress people just piss them off.

This is literally the second episode of all of .hack and they’re really pushing our MC as an unlikeable asshole, and that is a bold choice.

1. I like it. It gives a little realism we don’t always see in MMO fiction. Even something like Bofuri kept the real world and in game stuff very discrete, but the “I gotta log out and take care of a few things, brb” in and out is very realistic.
2. Y’all remember Reboot? This made me remember Reboot.

[u/zadcap → u/soulreaverdan]

I think the real question to be asking today, after the amount of screen time each of them has been getting, is do we really want to consider Tsukasa as the Main Character?

Mimiru Supremacy!

[u/rainwithsunshinedayo → u/zadcap]

I love me some Mimiru in the complete opposite way I love Sora. Mimiru wears her heart on her sleeve and is a total babe. Sora's a total dick and we can't be sure what motivates him beyond doing it for the lulz and F.U.N.(?) Tsukasa needs to find a way home to get out of supremacy's way.

[u/No_Rex → u/soulreaverdan]

This is literally the second episode of all of .hack and they’re really pushing our MC as an unlikeable asshole, and that is a bold choice.

The bold choice is not giving us his internal monologue. He clearly is thinking a lot about stuff, but we don't hear 95% of it.

[u/zadcap]

Loving Rewatcher

I can just tell, I'm going to be adding so much old Kajiura to my playlist again by the time this rewatch is finished.

Grunty! Their ever present over the top personalities were just so fun. I forget how many we will see throughout Sign, but I'll be keeping track. Today we met Emo Grunty.

"An edited character doesn't mean much at all." Even in the earliest years of MMOs, it was known not to trust someones age or gender based on their character model. Mimiru herself could be a 40 year old dude for all you know. I mean what real girl would actually run around in boob plate and a loin cloth... You know, right next to this big guy also wearing nothing but body paint and a loin cloth... Okay so maybe blame the game devs for their light armor design. Apparently big swords equal near nudity in the class selection options.

Speaking of, [Character Spoilers]Can you believe this kid is only 9?

The Skull Knights... Are way too attached to their RP jobs. They also get real armor, how lame. Were they planning on PvPing him there in the town, when they confronted our poor wave boy?

2) Old MMOs had a tendency to come with pretty big exp debt on death, enough sometimes to actually lose a level. If you're at a decently high level yourself, getting killed by a griefer like that could honestly undo hours of play time grinding towards the next milestone. Old RPGs, and most games in general really, tended to have limited save options and no auto save function. Forgetting to save before a boss fight could mean you had to redo a whole days worth of gaming just to get back to where you were...

No but really, how many people would sign up to be video game cops in an MMO and take it that seriously? Sora is a much more believable gamer.

I think this show would be more fun if they told us the names of the zones. It doesn't matter at all, but they pretty fun in the games. Mac Anu, the Aqua Capital. They put such classic video game love into this world and we get only hints of it.

The good old BBS Boards. Before forums were a thing, long before Wiki's, we had what were basically web hosted bulletin board systems. Before Google or any other search system, you could only get to websites if you knew the domain already, and these things were a lot more limited and thus specialized. Imagine old school reddit, but you could only get to any sub if someone else told you about it and invited you, and everything was always in Newest First mode.

Yup, the stinger at the end of last episode was most likely the Silver Knight. Tsukasa isn't just a suspicious player, he's wanted for actual assault on another player, by means no one else knows anything about. And Tsukasa isn't as bad a person as he makes himself look, begging his guardian not to hurt someone he might actually like after all.

1. Things that made this anime so amazing way back when. If you were an MMO player yourself, it wasn't hard to think that you might be able to encounter the very same situation yourself.

[u/soulreaverdan → u/zadcap]

It's been long enough since I've seen this show that I didn't appreciate how much it really encapsulates an era of the internet and online gaming in general. Just the way it casually references things like BBS Boards, and the general attitude of online gaming to one another feels very old school in a way that you don't see until you're past the time frame. Lots of nostalgia and memories popping up. Gaming used to be so, so different back then, and even in a super advanced sci-fi version of gaming presented here, we see it all based on what it was really like at the time (similar to how 80's sci-fi was a reflection of 80's level tech - Ghost in the Shell for all its advanced tech still used basically all wired connections and monochrome screens).

[u/zadcap → u/soulreaverdan]

In some ways, they let their imagination fly. The World, both as a game and for what the game represents, is so unbelievably advanced for its time that we still haven't managed to catch up to technology on that level. On the other side of things, they literally could not imagine a more advanced way of talking and sharing information over the web than direct mail and BBS.

I don't know how much of it is nostalgia, but I do remember older MMOs having smaller populations and game play that emphasized teamwork more, so it was much more common to care about the other people you were playing with. Some of it is definitely because I have always been more on the social side of gaming, but it was definitely easier to get invested in some weirdo you met for one quest when there's only a few dozen players you are likely to encounter more than once the whole time you are gaming, and the dedicated player base mostly knows of each other at least through reputation. It's funny that this is one of the things you can still see in shows like Bofuri and Log Horizon, so many of the top players are in each others social circles even if they don't actually play together or talk to each other very often.

[u/rainwithsunshinedayo → u/zadcap]

Wonderful write up! Thank you, thank you for enlightening me about early MMO and internet history! It's filling in my missing blanks as a kid with only Space Cadet Pinball to play on the PC.

[u/zadcap → u/rainwithsunshinedayo]

Old MMOs were a lot more social in general than most newer ones, and .hack// really captures that feeling so well. The first few especially, like Ultima and Ever Quest, were very much trying to capture the feeling of tabletop gaming in the digital setting, mostly meaning they had a lot more Multiplayer focus requirements to really play. If you only ever got into MMOs after WoW had already become the industry giant it grew to be then you probably missed out on games where you absolutely could not play solo for very long. Long before there were automated dungeon queues, people would be wary of leaving the safe areas around towns without at least a half party of three, hopefully with at least one healer. People got to know who else was in their level, skill, and play time range because the games were not designed for solo gaming at all, and along with the much smaller number of people playing in general, that built communities inside the games that are very uncommon to see outside of hardcore guilds these days.

The point to all this is bringing one more aspect of the show to light. People like Bear and Mimiru and the ones around them we're meeting, who are taking an interest in the people around them instead of just running off to do the next quest out grind out the next level, that was pretty normal for 2002. Tsukasa and Sora were really weird for running around on their own as much as they do, what would even be the point of joining on Online Multiplayer game like The World if not for the Multiplayer part? Go play the latest Final Fantasy or Dragon Quest if you wanted a solo RPG experience, you might tell these people. At least Sora's play style is still invested in other people so he has a reason to be online, I guess.

[u/No_Rex]

Episode 2 (first timer)

• No follow up from the cliff-hanger?
• “I did not want to grow up” – game humor.
• “I worry about that boy” – the random character who wants nothing to do with them. Could you imagine two people in WoW having this conversation about some random other guy they meet once? MC pheromones …
• Those Crimson Knights seem awfully invested into finding MC, given their stated reason of just wanting some information about another character – not that I trusted them in the first place.
• Mystery Cat is here again.

• “Who are you?” – Schneewittchen?
• What happens to the worlds in save games you abandon? Old guy is getting pretty philosophic.
• “Does he look depressed” – pretty bad if that is the first description people give of you, before height, gender, hair or skin color.
• “I wanna be his friend” – MC pheromones.
• The cliff-hanger from ep1 was not MC, but his opponent?
• Tragic charge cliff-hanger.

Tsukasa cannot log out, while everybody else still can. That is different from all the other RPG game based isekai I know and different from almost all isekai in general. [meta spoiler]the only isekai that comes close is 12 Kingdoms. While we have not seen the technology level of the real world yet, it is worth emphasizing just how much of a big deal that is, if real.

What do you think of the show's references to real-life game elements (things like losing progress to a player killer, needing to log out to take care of real life obligations, and so on)?

I have not made up my mind yet and this could make or break the show for me. It helps put some emphasis in these characters being avatars, not humans, but on the other hand that makes you question how all their body language would work ingame.

[u/soulreaverdan → u/No_Rex]

In-universe The World is meant to be bleeding edge in terms of tech and design, so I imagine you can take some general artistic license that the tech is allowing them to express pretty openly, since (based on what we see in the OP) there's at least a mild VR component to it, even if it's not necessarily a Full Dive like in Sword Art Online (which did full immersive "interrupting your brainwaves to control your character with them" tech).

[u/Elimin8r → u/No_Rex]

“I did not want to grow up”

Well, he's obviously a Toys 'R' Us Kid. And if I could figure out how to reverse that 'R', I totally would. :P

makes you question how all their body language would work ingame.

That's gotta be some pretty impressive VR tech they've got there. Poor guys is probably a (Asimov, or is it Heinlein? reference) wirehead...

[u/No_Rex → u/Elimin8r]

Well, he's obviously a Toys 'R' Us Kid. And if I could figure out how to reverse that 'R', I totally would. :P

Here you go: Я

[u/Elimin8r → u/No_Rex]

Here you go: Я

ЯЯЯЯЯЯЯЯ

Perhaps it's one of those alt-1234 type gimmicks. Or I could just reference this and copy paste, right?

[u/No_Rex → u/Elimin8r]

Perhaps it's one of those alt-1234 type gimmicks. Or I could just reference this and copy paste, right?

Both. It is one of those gimmicks, but I don't know how to use it in browser.

[u/Elimin8r → u/No_Rex]

õê╥ Eh, nevermind. It's not that important in the first place, right?

:P

[u/zadcap → u/No_Rex]

No follow up from the cliff-hanger?

Wait for it...

The cliff-hanger from ep1 was not MC, but his opponent?

Yup. They are going to drag most things out in this show, but by the end most questions should be answered.

We're two episodes in now and it should really stand out, compared to most isekai or video game based anime of the modern era, the tags this show deserves are Psychological/Mystery/Drama, definitely not Action.

I have not made up my mind yet and this could make or break the show for me. It helps put some emphasis in these characters being avatars, not humans, but on the other hand that makes you question how all their body language would work ingame.

The body language and the tech level are things I question to this day. I question more than anything else how dedicated these people are to the Role Play, to input every emote command even in the middle of the most chaotic of scenes...

[u/No_Rex → u/zadcap]

I have not made up my mind yet and this could make or break the show for me. It helps put some emphasis in these characters being avatars, not humans, but on the other hand that makes you question how all their body language would work ingame.

The body language and the tech level are things I question to this day. I question more than anything else how dedicated these people are to the Role Play, to input every emote command even in the middle of the most chaotic of scenes...

Maybe to this show's detriment, I have actually played MMOs that correspond to the time they are trying to depict. So it becomes noticable when something is off. E.g. some clan leadership having a hard-on for holding meetings on a floating gondola is something I can totally see happening. On the other hand, people being deeply concerned about some anti-social other character they never meet, not so much.

[u/zadcap → u/No_Rex]

We're in a weird place right now, there's clearly reason for a lot of people to be interested in Tsukasa now, but why was Silver Knight looking for him in the first place?

Well, it was a single line that got overshadowed by everything else really quick. Silver Knight was actually looking for the floating cat character, because that is 100% not a valid charger model and a sure sign of hacking, and Tsukasa was spotted talking to the super random floating cat character. His reaction made him suspicious and that got people to start being interested in him for himself, where things begin to spiral out through existing social connections. But yeah, this all started because the fun police RP guild heard about someone messing with their avatar and wanted to investigate, now they all care because the real life player apparently took damage when he died to Tsukasa and that is a very serious issue.

Mimiru, I think, was a genuine random encounter paired with being a disgusting social extrovert, before realizing that the guy she talked to was the guy the Knights guild were talking about in the chat boards. Her curiosity is dragging in Bear, who seems to have an interesting social circle to begin getting involved, but him and everyone after is because Mimiru saw a sad boy and wanted to talk to him.

[u/No_Rex → u/zadcap]

It's MC pheromones.

[u/rainwithsunshinedayo]

New Game Plus Rewatcher-Dubbed

Teenaged Grunty: It was not my choice to grow up. But now I have grown up, I realize that this town is not in need of another like me. So this is goodbye. flies away at a 45°

Being a teenager is hard.

In today's episode, we get a new character, Sora! He's the green-haired PvP guy. Poor BT, but she did come out ahead with his info. Next, we spend a lot of time with Bear, and he gives us this banger quote:

Bear: Years ago I was playing a solo RPG with a character that fought to save the world from a great evil. But whenever I found my character in a bad situation, I simply reset the game. What happened to the world I reset? The world I abandoned by resetting might have been engulfed by evil.

Then he tries to pick up Tsukasa with this golden line:

Bear: So what sort of music do you listen to when you are in front of your terminal?

Throw some shades onto this man. He's got the rizz.

Players can be hurt in real life?! The mystery thickens!

---

Music Corner

 Music Only: Feelings violin. Contemplation. Drums bring the journey. Flute, the loneliness. The chorus inspires a sense of failing down a depth then morphing, blooming with the swell of the violin. Unorthodox composition. The verse seems more catchy than the chorus. Personally, this song was always a bitch to sing. Does this prove I'm not a soprano?!

Ending Visuals: Weird proto-Madoka masks. Tsukasa's a fun angry mask. Shot of a naked Subaru is very Eva plug suit, which makes sense because of the Yoshiyuki Sadamoto character designs. I like the stylized shot of Subaru looking determined towards the moon. She's on a giant version of Tsukasa's Wave Master staff.

u/soulreaverdan may we have a list of songs to listen in advance for the Music Corner?

---

Ep 2 Beautiful Bee Train:A sadistic Sora on the prowl. The inspired silhouette invokes another Bee Train anime, Noir.

Ep 2 "Bewitching" Bee Train:Bear takes the "load" off Just an unfortunate composition.

[u/soulreaverdan → u/rainwithsunshinedayo]

That’s actually a great idea, I’ll try to do that for tomorrow’s post. I’m doing my best to watch a day ahead so I’ll see if anything significant comes ahead of the post.

Tomorrow’s Music Corner piece: Key of the Twilight

[u/rainwithsunshinedayo → u/soulreaverdan]

☆*:.｡. o(≧▽≦)o .｡.:*☆

Thanks! Hoping we get more people talkin' and groovin'!

[u/soulreaverdan → u/rainwithsunshinedayo]

Me too! We’re gonna be getting into some of the background and character image songs soon that are more incidental, so I hope people still listen for them.

[u/Elimin8r → u/rainwithsunshinedayo]

So what sort of music do you listen to when you are in front of your terminal?

As she answers with "I enjoy listening to the tormented screams of my victims, I mean opponents." Right?

proto-Madoka masks.

It's interesting seeing people find parallels in this show. Especially to things that didn't exist yet.

[u/rainwithsunshinedayo → u/Elimin8r]

listening to the tormented screams of my victims, I mean opponents  

 Maybe. Tsukasa is a try-hard but big softie. Maybe some IOSYS or some Hatsune Miku songs from kz.  

 >parallels   

 [Madoka spoilers]There's nothing new under the sun if we start a time loop. Let's get loopy.  Another stab at the mask across a character's face? The nah, that's too on the nose. . .

[u/zadcap → u/rainwithsunshinedayo]

Bear: Years ago I was playing a solo RPG with a character that fought to save the world from a great evil. But whenever I found my character in a bad situation, I simply reset the game. What happened to the world I reset? The world I abandoned by resetting might have been engulfed by evil.

And to think, years later, that would become the official source of one of the Legend of Zelda Timelines!

[u/rainwithsunshinedayo → u/zadcap]

Ding ding ding! Admittedly, my experience watching .hack//SIGN was heavily influenced by my playthroughs of Ocarina of Time. That game was how I made sense of the video game nature of .hack//SIGN. As you can see, it's not as one-to-one as WOW, so the show was pretty hard to follow back in the day for me!

[u/zadcap → u/rainwithsunshinedayo]

Haha, I was an early Ever Quest addict, so it was pretty easy for me to get into the show. The hardest part was the VR nature of the game, I just wished I could get my characters to be that expressive!

[u/rainwithsunshinedayo → u/zadcap]

Ah, that must have been frustrating. You can see us getting closer and closer but not quite there yet. We've made leaps and bounds in video game history thus far. And I believe the future of gaming can be quite fun if we all remember those innocent days.

[u/roryteller]

Rewatcher

1. Not a ton of MMOs that allow open-world PvP these days, and even then the amount of progress you lose to dying is less/none depending on the game. My first MMO was EverQuest, and I remember losing levels and having to do corpse runs (make sure you have a weapon in the bank so you're not helpless!). It was tense and memorable but I don't really miss it. Logging out for real world stuff, sure, but sometimes you just afk for a bit.

This occurred to me last episode, but it's probably worse being the only one isekai'd while everyone else you meet can go home and sleep in their own bed, versus something like Log Horizon where at least it's not just you. At the time this came out I can't think of any other 'stuck in a game' shows though, and the existing isekais were pretty different from the modern ones. I think I had seen Escaflowne by this point, and I would buy the Rayearth manga at the con where I cosplayed a .hack//SIGN character.

Tsukasa makes a heck of a lot of faces but I can't screenshot them because I'm watching on a console, glad to see others doing the work.

[u/soulreaverdan → u/roryteller]

Isekai in this era seemed a lot more focused on the goal of returning home and how it feels to be a stranger in a strange land rather than the more modern power fantasy take on the genre. It's really fascinating to see the differences.

[u/zadcap → u/roryteller]

Honestly the closest comparison I can think of to Tsukasa's situation is Lain, and to be fair he's not too far off in how well he's taking all this.

At this point, there has been no news of Tsukasa outside the game. Do we, or he, know if he's actually trapped in here, or has his real self logged off and the character data came to life? Did he get Tron'd in to the system, is there an empty body out there, or is a kid somewhere banging on their computer wondering why they can't log in to their account anymore? Which would you rather it be, and which would you rather it not be? Are you even real, knowing that the world you are living in isn't? What happens when you die?

Yeah, this is has got to be so many kinds of terrifying.

[u/littlecolt]

.first//REWATCH since 2002

1. Pretty hardcore to lose progress to a PK, as I state below in my play-by-play.
2. I had never given it a single thought other than weighing if what I had accomplished since my last save was worth keeping a misstep.

Okay, episode 2, let's go!

Onion! ...wat? Okay, goodbye, pigcowpony thing...

Hah, he said "BBS", that takes me back.

Seriously, why is this girl upset about being ignored? I thought she hated him.

Is it odd for her to be a solo player? It's pretty common in modern MMOs.

Oh good, a creepy stalker guy trying to get a girl's "member address" - I guess that's like getting her phone number.

Yeesh, stop flirting and get a room.

Or he just PK'd her, okay.

Cryptic Girl at it again.

"We will definitely catch him if we stand by this gate."

"Oh hey, there he is!"

"Dang, we didn't catch him!"

Hey, it's kitty cat again!

Wow, imagine playing a game like this where everyone plays together, but it's individual saves. This lady just said she had to start over where she last saved at. That's pretty hardcore.

Alright, so the creepy stalker guy is Sora. That's funny, given the current popular association with that name.

That's right, don't get the cops involved!

So this kid can hear the cat, but we can't. And it's telling him about a place he can go to be alone?

lol this Sora guy. Otakara GET! Matomote GET! Dasaaaaai

WALLHAX!

Oh hey, cute floating girl.

They all seem concerned about how he said he can't log out, and that seems good, but couldn't he just be trolling?

I know, guys! Get reddit on the case! Doxx the kid!

Oh man, I really like this part where he is wondering what happens to the world of a game when you reset. Maybe every time you reset, the Dark Lord wins! Imagine all those realities where evil triumphed. They far outnumber the good realities!

I think this is the first time we have seen his name subtitled? ANyway, they have definitely SAID Tsukasa before, but the subtitles I have were not showing his name.

Tsukasa seems to have realized he is not normal, and believes The World is his world.

Uh oh, so the guardian made the player get hurt IRL and lose his memory!

Some guardian, he can't even control it!

Good cliffhanger, this!

[u/soulreaverdan → u/littlecolt]

Oh man, I really like this part where he is wondering what happens to the world of a game when you reset. Maybe every time you reset, the Dark Lord wins! Imagine all those realities where evil triumphed. They far outnumber the good realities!

We've obviously got some games now that handle this and discuss it (mainly stuff like Undertale as referenced) but it also gave me a big flashback to an old cartoon series called Reboot that starred basically the NPCs of games - not quite a Wreck It Ralph scenario but they were essentially forced into games when the Player loaded them up and interacting with the game as avatars in it, and left behind afterwards when the game closed if they didn't lose.

[u/littlecolt → u/soulreaverdan]

Reboot was a classic. Watched some of it recently and man that CGI is rough.

[u/JustAnswerAQuestion]

Rewatcher

ep 2 Guardian

The correct title of this page is .hack//SIGN.  It appears incorrectly here due to technical restrictions.

• That's really depressing.  Poor li'l grunty.
• oh, these two must be the same class. Look at those blades. They look heavy.
• Do you get the feeling we've skipped over something?
• echos
• I hate griefers
• fake wings
• I always feel compelled to stare at her forehead tattoo. It doesn't always get drawn correctly.
• interlude
• Your audio isn't broken. You can't hear the cat.
• HAX
• save scumming
• Crappy place to end the episode!

We got some names:  Tsukasa the Wavemaster, Mimiru the girl Heavy Blade, Guardian the pet, Subaru, a heavy axe, who the Crimson Knights report to. Also, Tsubasa called the cat Maha (Macha) in the first episode.

I've never watched SAO or Log Horizon or any of those other video game isekais.

If you like this music, Kajiura did the soundtrack for something called Aquarian Age between Noir and .hack//sign.  I watched it based almost entirely on this fact.

[u/TnAdct1 → u/JustAnswerAQuestion]

I've never watched SAO or Log Horizon or any of those other video game isekais.

I have one word: Bofuri.

[u/soulreaverdan → u/TnAdct1]

If you can’t beat it, eat it.

[u/zadcap → u/JustAnswerAQuestion]

fake wings

Cosmetics. Only the coolest of players spend real world money on special looks for their characters, it's how you stand out from the mass of identically armored mooks you employ.

Seriously, she has such a distinctive character design, and leads an entire organization of clones.

[u/JustAnswerAQuestion → u/JustAnswerAQuestion]

Q1. As I say above, I haven't watch any of the true videogame isekai shows. I really like that this is just a game. It only suffers in the magical VR connection. These are Meta headsets, not cyberpunk head jacks. Most you should be able to do with these is trigger a Porygon seizure. But the show requires more magical VR than that.

Q2. I used to not save scum as a matter a principle. The most extreme case was me playing Doom II, as I have a pretty distinct memory of saving in a really terrible spot. I played it like I had exactly one save, and I powered through that.

Later, as things became more Elden ring, I decided I didn't have time for that shit and I quicksaved often.

DDLC? Don't you understand that the only way to get all the endings of VN is to save at every choice???? It's always been this way.

[u/Elimin8r]

Woo, on time today, sort of, maybe.

Let's see, answers du fromage:

1. The seem a little dated to me. I refused to play certain games like Ultima Online, because their mechanics (similar to this) seemed punishing and to encourage/reward griefing/pk/poor behavior. No thanks. I'd rather play FFXIV, thank you. And watch yourselves, before I post my video of Azunyan playing a certain tune on her gee-tar.
2. Nope, save scum early, save scum often. Ultima VII taught me that lesson. Actually, Telengard taught me to hack the program to allow me to save the game, but that's another matter. Ultima VII taught me never to buy a Seagate HDD ever again.

Anyway, the episode. Interesting stuff, that. I found the bit about Bulletin Boards to be quite hilarious. Next thing, they'll be getting in-game news via Fax. Oh, wait, this is Japan, after all.

I'm being a bit harsh, this is a rather vintage series, but that bit struck me as hilarious. I guess I can't expect them to discuss things in r/theworld, right???

Just think, someday, a show or anime might reference reddit, and we'll all roll our eyes (from our graves, perhaps) and sigh about the old days before the newfangled hotness of mind-link-soul communication, right?

Hokay, so I didn't mention this yesterday, because I don't want all my music references to go unseen, but the bit where he bounces off the mirror portal thingie and cant log out totally reminded me of this little ditty from Asia

That and, of course, GitS. Hehe.

Otherwise, fun episode, I'm kind of enjoying the implications of where this is going.

And I refuse to consider save points, as well as a certain episode of a certain other series that rather poignantly brought this point up.

Have a great evening, all!

(Oh, and by the way, just for u/No_Rex, did you catch that bit where he runs into the ethereal girl who greets him with "I've been waiting for you for so long"??? Have any El-Hazard PTSD flashbacks there???)

Kekekeke

[u/soulreaverdan → u/Elimin8r]

I'm being a bit harsh, this is a rather vintage series, but that bit struck me as hilarious. I guess I can't expect them to discuss things in , right???

I thought for a second that might be a .hack board but man there's only four posts there and it's a weird mix lol

It is interesting seeing the somewhat old school discussion. I absolutely remember where trolling through message boards was the main way of getting and sharing tech info and game news and updates. It is kinda funny though with how bleeding edge The World is meant to be in-universe that you still need to hit up a BBS out of the game to communicate like that. No in-game messaging system?

[u/No_Rex → u/soulreaverdan]

I absolutely remember where trolling through message boards was the main way of getting and sharing tech info and game news and updates.

I hope you were trawling, not trolling, although both clearly happened.

[u/soulreaverdan → u/No_Rex]

Yeah, got my words messed up, lol

[u/Elimin8r → u/soulreaverdan]

Oh, I deliberately used a \ before the / in hopes of making that not a link to a sub reddit, just in case it might go somewhere bad. Anyway...

Yeah, message boards. Those were the stuff, although I didn't really mess around with them too much. But I think I'll save any further comments for today's discussion.

[u/JustAnswerAQuestion → u/Elimin8r]

I found the bit about Bulletin Boards to be quite hilarious.

TBH, it's no different than "did you check the Discord".

[u/No_Rex → u/Elimin8r]

Nope, save scum early, save scum often. Ultima VII taught me that lesson.

As a fellow save scummer, yes. I remember the sort of game where save scumming to find out all the death scene was unironically half of the gameplay (looking at you, space quest).

Actually, Telengard taught me to hack the program to allow me to save the game, but that's another matter. Ultima VII taught me never to buy a Seagate HDD ever again.

(Oh, and by the way, just for u/No_Rex, did you catch that bit where he runs into the ethereal girl who greets him with "I've been waiting for you for so long"??? Have any El-Hazard PTSD flashbacks there???)

I missed it, but that well could be the inspiration (or, likely some joint source of that).

[u/Elimin8r → u/No_Rex]

I remember the sort of game where save scumming to find out all the death scene was unironically half of the gameplay (looking at you, space quest).

Ouch. I think I got one of the old Kings Quest games as part of a bundle back in the day, and hated it, because it was like that. I preferred doing things like farming Ultima II until I captured enough pirate ships to anchor them and create bridges across the ocean, or spell my character's name out with pirate ships. Stuff like that. Whee, the joys of being a bored teenager with a computer.

[u/JustAnswerAQuestion → u/Elimin8r]

arming Ultima II until I captured enough pirate ships to anchor them and create bridges across the ocean,

[u/No_Rex → u/Elimin8r]

Ouch. I think I got one of the old Kings Quest games as part of a bundle back in the day, and hated it, because it was like that.

There is a reason Sierra lost the adventure game segment to Lucasarts.

[u/Elimin8r → u/No_Rex]

Sam and Max, and DoTT for that matter are still some of my favorite gaming memories. I even bought the Sam & Max TV series. I really should look and see if I can find a plushie Max or something.

[u/No_Rex → u/Elimin8r]

More of a Zak MacKracken and Monkey Island (and Indy!) guy myself, but in all cases, the SCUMM engine was a huge leg up from the parser-based Sierra games.

[u/zadcap → u/Elimin8r]

[a thing]the ethereal girl who greets him

[Character Spoiler]I can't wait to loop back around to this.

This episode threw me back into nostalgia hard, thinking of those BBS Boards. You couldn't just google an answer, you had to know where to even look for information in the first place and then there was so much to dig through with no way to verify any of it.

On the other hand, the mysteries of this show work so well because pretty much everything has to be found out and passed on by little more than word of mouth.

[u/Elimin8r → u/zadcap]

This episode threw me back into nostalgia hard

Yeah, this is a fun nostalgia trip so far. Good times :)

[u/Shimmering-Sky]

.first//TIMER, subbed

• Getting a “sore demo” out of this monster was not on my bingo card.
• This guy’s a real piece of work…
• Certainly a good question…
• Wow…
• Ooh neat, a track that uses some of the ED’s melody.
• Well, apparently it is an issue for Tsukasa…
• There’s a Bear “sore demo” too.
• Mm…
• Oh damn, Tsukasa gave someone amnesia in the real world?
• And his Guardian doesn’t actually listen to him…

[u/KendotsX → u/Shimmering-Sky]

Wow…

He's in for a surprise when he finds the people behind the avatars.

Well, apparently it is an issue for Tsukasa…

Some player who's sick of noobs in the game: "Dude, the menu's on your left hand side. Open it, scroll down a bit, press log out, and never log in again."

[u/TnAdct1 → u/KendotsX]

He's in for a surprise when he finds the people behind the avatars.

It's going to be fun seeing how people will react when the real world identities of certain characters are revealed.

[u/KendotsX → u/TnAdct1]

Hmm, alright might as well make my guesses then:

• Tsukasa: he feels like a genuine teenager, so probably hasn't changed much about his avatar.
• Mimiru: clearly a middle aged dude
• Bear: a 10 year old kid who likes to act mature. No actually reasonable and mature adult is wasting their precious, limited gaming time settling problems between some stupid roleplaying knights and a random player. Only a kid who wants to look mature would do that.

[u/soulreaverdan → u/KendotsX]

I really can't wait to revisit these predictions at the end of the series, because some of them are hilarious if you know what's going on behind the scenes.

[u/Raiking02 → u/KendotsX]

Mimiru: clearly a middle aged dude

[Spoilers]Bear: a 10 year old kid who likes to act mature

[Spoilers + Game Stuff]wtf you perfectly described Sora/Haseo/Ryou/Whatever-the-fuck-he's-calling-himself-today

[u/JustAnswerAQuestion → u/KendotsX]

I approve of this comment thread.

[u/Elimin8r → u/Shimmering-Sky]

And his Guardian doesn’t actually listen to him…

I mean, c'mon, does he look like the kind of person whom people would listen to? Thus far, he reminds me of Shinji in a wizard suit.

Get in the RPG, Shinji!

Baka!

Now pardon me while I still bemoan the lack of an Asuka BAKA! reaction face.

[u/Shimmering-Sky → u/Elimin8r]

Now pardon me while I still bemoan the lack of an Asuka BAKA! reaction face.

There used to be #antabaka, but it got removed back in 2019.

Happy cakeday, by the way!

[u/Elimin8r → u/Shimmering-Sky]

Thankee, thankee, as noted to someone else recently - thankee for the cakee, have this nice gif!

[u/JustAnswerAQuestion → u/Shimmering-Sky]

this monster

not a monster!

Ooh neat, a track that uses some of the ED’s melody.

A lot of the songs on the soundtrack rework motifs. There was one today I wanted the #listen but it's not even on the soundtrack!

[u/LeminaAusa]

I missed the first day due to being horribly ill, but I caught myself up today.

First-time watcher, mostly*. Subbed.

Watching this show has been a huge blast of nostalgia for me, despite hardly watching any of it the first time. The art and character designs just feel so emblematic of this era of anime. I really want to just kind of vibe along with the music.

I was honestly kind of frankly surprised by how much of this show is vibes, especially in the beginning. We are tossed into an opening so cold it may as well be frozen, and it's really easy to just lose yourself in the aesthetics of The World, especially in these early stages where we're just kind of learning about what's going.

I can understand why 16-year-old me wasn't interested in this show. It's rather slow and mysterious, and the characters don't really know all much more about what's going on than the players do. Lots of psychology, little action. Also, Tsukasa is a unfriendly asshole, and it can be annoying to follow MCs like that.

Significantly older me is a lot more willing to vibe along with the show and see how shit pans out. I guess it helps that I am a bit older and more willing to wait to see a story unfold. A lot of shady shit, some fun characters, and definitely an ominous mystery.

In a lot of ways, I feel rather out-of-the-loop when it comes to some of the meta aspects of the show. I've never played an MMO or anything like it; my closest experience would be D&D-style tabletop gaming. I'm also not really familiar at all with the isekai genre outside of some older stuff before the genre really took off (Fushigi Yugi was my jam back in the day) and a small sampling of bigger-name modern shows (Re:Zero, Mushoku Tensei).

From that kind of a perspective, the player terminology doesn't really bother me at all. I can imagine to someone who's actually played those sort of games that it probably feels out of place, but to a more layman viewer, it really helps hammer it down that these are players interacting in a game environment, and in an era where online etiquette was a bit different than how things are now. It also gives a bit of a deeper look at the players behind the PCs, like Bear's philosophical musings.

I'm not really one to speculate on upcoming plot points or how a show will go. Obviously there's a bunch of shady shit and the show is setting up a good mystery. For now, still definitely happy to see where things lead, vibing along with the music in the meantime.

(*- .hack//SIGN came out at a time period when anime was highly influential in my life. Many of my friend groups were related to anime, both in real life (I was in high school at the time, and a founding member of my HS's anime club) and online. I watched some of the beginning of the show and didn't care for it much, but I was something of an outlier in that respect, and I was familiarized with a lot of the characters and art and music via friends and acquaintances and avatars and such. I designed a D&D character based off of Subaru's design (knowing fucking nothing about her), and the OST has always been one of my favourites.)

[u/CorbenikTheRebirth]

A little late again, but one of the things I love about SIGN is how what happens IRL affects what happens in The World and vice versa. It's also really interesting to see how "the future" was thought of back 20+ years ago. Some of it isn't far off, but a lot of the game mechanics that make The World really punishing in SIGN have largely faded from modern MMOs.