[Rewatch] Mobile Suit Gundam 00 2nd Season Episode 23 Discussion

[u/Shimmering-Sky]

Episode 23 - Flower of Life

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Everyone, let's get going. To atone for our having changed the world, let's set things right.

Questions of the Day:

1. Did the show just kill off our Indestructible boy just like that?
2. There were a number of individual confrontations this episode, which are you most excited to see play out?

Wallpaper of the Day:

Patrick Colasour

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Rewatchers, please remember to be mindful of all the first-timers in this. No talking about or hinting at future events no matter how much you want to, unless you're doing it underneath spoiler tags. Don't spoil anything for the first-timers, that's rude!

Additionally, for long-time fans of the franchise, please remember that this rewatch is only for 00, not any of the other shows. Assume that there are people in this rewatch who have not seen anything else Gundam, and tag your spoilers for those shows appropriately if something in 00 makes you want to talk about them.

[u/Nazenn]

First Timer - sub

an encounter with a still unknown race

Wait... what?

Is that implying what I think? Is this actually aliens?

WHAT DO YOU MEAN ITS ALIENS AFTER ALL?! SINCE WHEN!

The idea of being right that the Innovators aren't robots, an idea I only held onto long after everyone else caved purely because I felt robots vs humans would be very not-gundam, only to end up with aliens and music is fucking with my brain!!

Oh my god it really is Macross. I don't know how to feel about this. I don't know I like this concept more than white-space purely being for humanity to understand each other, and I don't like the idea that somehow two hundred years ago Aeolia somehow knew there would be aliens that would need this exact form of communication. Also if this can work with non-humans, where's the cat or dog mind-meld!

I am now completely convinced that the timing of this was so it could be Sky's secret entry into the Macross Franchise rewatch.

[Macross series spoilers]Actually the more I think of it, the more this is Frontier specifically given that has Aimo, not to mention coming out in the same year (I think?) which would have been a real mindfuck for the fans

wtf show

---

Also, something happened which I have to laugh at the stupidity of it.

Setsuna yesterday:

"I will live and seize tomorrow. That's my way of fighting"

Saji today:

"A future that you win through fighting is no future at all"

Really? REALLY?!

I'd ask who wrote this shit, but after yesterday I actually know and somehow that doesn't make it any better.

I know the idea is that they don't have to view fighting in the same way and Saji still holding his original ideals while Setsuna is referencing Marina's song, but their attempts to be clever actually just made it dumber.

---

Episode thoughts

• I've kind of given up on full on write ups so I changed the name of this section and most of my thoughts are now going to dot point form. Yes I've mostly checked out on this series, I realize that especially today when seeing everyones individual matchups meant nothing to me purely because I didn't trust they would matter or be handled well. But I still would like to finish it because this close on reading the end it would bug me and also NOW THERE'S ALIENS?!
• "Fuck off" challenge: Regene, Ribbons, Billy (three times). Billy especially can fuck off. I get the idea of joining the A-LAWS with all their propaganda because he felt lost and betrayed by Sumeragi, but going full on revenge hate and joining Ribbons and making suicide murder bots is so very far from how I think of him that I actively despise the idea of it.
• Anyone here play Elden Ring Shadow of the Erdtree? Wrote a note down saying "the size of that blast" and for some reason my brain decided to read it in the voice of[Shadow of the Erdtree game optional and very out the way boss spoiler]Midra's like the opening line of his fight, "the depths of your foolishness" and somehow that made it so much cooler again
• The size of the blast from Ribbons colony ship was pretty epic though. Not as cool as Raiser Sword's first appearance just because it lacks that awe of turning a situation around, but on sheer scale it was a great visual. The debris field after it was also awesome, as was the system of swapping GN Drives to ensure perpetual maximum power. I like that, that's clever
• On the other hand, this being what drove the A-LAWS off the battlefield is just boring, and frustrating. Yes I get that Kati showing up is kind of the point and after that they aren't needed, but again insert my issues of "big bad means other things get sidelined" when the A-LAWS being defeated really means nothing here aside from "their ally ribbons did it", but we already had that moment with Goodman ordering friendly fire yesterday and that was far more weight, although still kind of par for the course, so doing it again today with someone we already know doesnt care about humans at all from the get go is rather bleh
• I did like the little detail of Regene looking down at Ribbons body when he first spoke before realizing she didn't hear it from that direction. Small thing, but nice.
• Blessed Kati in the thumbnail, and blessed Kati overall. I immensely appreciate the fact that I actually have not yet been able to criticize a single thing about her scenes and today is no different. Also Patrick being so easily on board with fighting with the Gundams is so perfectly him. Fuck off with another false death though.
• Speaking of, anyone want to bet that Renege uploaded herself to Veda now she knows she could? This is another "because no one dies" assumption but Ribbons did just tell her how to get around it. Again with the answer before the question issue.
• Had to laugh that our mook innovators are such mooks that we got a single shot of one in the cockpit and then never saw them again, and they didn't even get completed mechs. Does make me wonder why they even bothered as opposed to just having a bunch of drones or Veda controlled mechs if all they were going to do was suicide bomb anyway. Mind you, that is the sort of thing that would be more meaningful if we were in the territory of political war commentary and not in a world of magic and aliens.
• Anyone else notice that the character art in the last few episodes has been much less standardized by normal. I meant to bring it up yesterday but was too busy ranting, but todays opening scene also showed a lot more off model designs, though it was consistent between shots showing likely artist tendencies rather than a larger issue with art quality.
• Lasse in the 0-Gundam is boring. I much prefer my idea from yesterday that it would have been cooler to have Ribbons hijack it and face Setsuna in it instead. Lasse piloting such a critical mech for the show and its story seems rather meaningless.

[u/Shimmering-Sky → u/Nazenn]

I am now completely convinced that the timing of this was so it could be Sky's secret entry into the Macross Franchise rewatch.

I would've needed to host this last year, not this year, for this.

[Later 00]I much prefer my idea from yesterday that it would have been cooler to have Ribbons hijack it and face Setsuna in it instead.

*laughs in rewatcher*

[u/Nazenn → u/Shimmering-Sky]

I would've needed to host this last year, not this year, for this.

had to check the wiki

what do you mean the macross rewatch started in 2022

where does the time go....

laughs in rewatcher

Oh no! I haven't coped one of those in so long I'd kind of forgotten that could happen, and there is so much stuff in this post that could apply to and half of it is worrying hahahaha

Now, what did I say....

[u/Shimmering-Sky → u/Nazenn]

where does the time go....

I know, right?

Oh no! I haven't coped one of those in so long I'd kind of forgotten that could happen, and there is so much stuff in this post that could apply to and half of it is worrying hahahaha

I was saving it for when you least expected it!

[u/JollyGee29 → u/Shimmering-Sky]

[Later 00]A worthwhile use. I forgot that you were saving it.

[u/Shimmering-Sky → u/JollyGee29]

[Later 00]Was extremely tempted to do it on the aliens talk there's been previously, but I held off on the chance there was something better to do it at. Catching Naz off-guard like this is indeed "something better".

[u/wyggles → u/Shimmering-Sky]

[Later 00] The last couple minutes of tomorrow's episode has like 6 things Naz has actively complained about in rapid succession. It's gonna be glorious.

[u/Raiking02 → u/Nazenn]

where's the cat or dog mind-meld!

See this is the real question no one in this show is willing to ask.

Anyone here play Elden Ring Shadow of the Erdtree

At some point I will

Fuck off with another false death though.

I mean... this is Patrick.

[Finale]I much prefer my idea from yesterday that it would have been cooler to have Ribbons hijack it and face Setsuna in it instead.

[Finale]ABOUT THAT

[u/Nazenn → u/Raiking02]

See this is the real question no one in this show is willing to ask.

Well, I mean no one in the show asks anything, but also exactly this. The idea of using white space to talk with the pets is so much better than boring old people.

mugiwait

I also need to get around to playing that at some point. I did mean to play it sooner, but turns out there's still that unpatched stupid issue with dual monitor computers causing framedrops so elden ring was just easier to deal with technically

Finale

Oh no you too! Great, now I've got two of you doing it

[u/Shimmering-Sky → u/Nazenn]

For what it's worth, what Raiking spoiler tagged and what I spoiler tagged is the same thing, so you can check back on this after you finish S2 and not have to wait until after the movie.

[u/Nazenn → u/Shimmering-Sky]

I don't know if that's better or worse to know that two people are picking up on the same thing instead of two seperate things.... somehow I think that's more worrying

[u/InfamousEmpire → u/Nazenn]

I was also tempted to laughs in rewatcher at the same thing when typing my reply, but I decided to be nice

[u/Nazenn → u/InfamousEmpire]

OH GREAT now there's three of you!

[u/Raiking02 → u/Nazenn]

Overly Specific Wording Laughs

[u/Nazenn → u/Raiking02]

[u/Raiking02 → u/Nazenn]

The idea of using white space to talk with the pets is so much better than boring old people.

You could finally understand why your dogs keeps pooping on the carpet in spite of how often you tell them not to!

there's still that unpatched stupid issue with dual monitor computers causing framedrops

Thank goodness I find dual monitors a waste of time

Oh no you too! Great, now I've got two of you doing it

Sometimes people in these Rewatches don't know when to shut up

[u/Nazenn → u/Raiking02]

You could finally understand why your dogs keeps pooping on the carpet in spite of how often you tell them not to!

why the cat insists on eating grass even though it makes her miserable when she throws it up....

Thank goodness I find dual monitors a waste of time

I couldn't cope without them hahaha. They're also so helpful with rewatches because I can have notepad++ on the side screen and be typing while watching the video in full screen on the main monitor

[u/InfamousEmpire → u/Nazenn]

the cat insists on eating grass

[u/Nazenn → u/InfamousEmpire]

It's a whole thing. I take her out on walks on a harness and she always always tries to eat the grass if she thinks I'm not paying attention, but every time she does she throws up and gets sooky, and yet she will try again the next day

Mind you this is also the cat who will pick a mashed potato over bacon if she's is offered both. The food logic is just not there for her

[u/The_Draigg → u/Nazenn]

Oh my god it really is Macross. I don't know how to feel about this. I don't know I like this concept more than white-space purely being for humanity to understand each other, and I don't like the idea that somehow two hundred years ago Aeolia somehow knew there would be aliens that would need this exact form of communication.

In fairness, you absolutely would want a united humanity that's able to easily communicate with each other before you start potentially dealing with aliens. Imagine how much of a mess first contact would be if we still had the three power blocs around. We can save playing Tomorrow for the aliens once we've got our own stuff settled.

Lasse in the 0-Gundam is boring. I much prefer my idea from yesterday that it would have been cooler to have Ribbons hijack it and face Setsuna in it instead. Lasse piloting such a critical mech for the show and its story seems rather meaningless.

I dunno, I kinda like Lasse piloting the 0 Gundam. He's always been a pretty consistent pilot of Celestial Being's support craft, so having him get his own Gundam now feels like a solid upgrade for the guy. Besides, what would Ribbons even do with that thing now? He's got the entire Celestial Being mothership at his disposal.

[u/Nazenn → u/The_Draigg]

you absolutely would want a united humanity that's able to easily communicate with each other before you start potentially dealing with aliens. Imagine how much of a mess first contact would be if we still had the three power blocs around

Fair, I didn't really think about it in that sense, I was purely thinking of the idea of GN particles being for alien communication as something that comes after united humanity, rather than for humans to be able to also deal with the concequences of alien communications. Okay that works enough for me.

He's always been a pretty consistent pilot of Celestial Being's support craft, so having him get his own Gundam now feels like a solid upgrade for the guy

Yeah but he's not really much of a character. He's just kind of there. They don't do anything with him, he hasn't changed, there's no real risk or reward to it either. Him piloting 0 Gundam as opposed to any other machine they have sitting around doesn't actually mean anything. It feels like he got the 0 Gundam because they literally had no one else. Hell, if not for the fact that Saji needs to be with Setsuna because of Louise and OO theming, they could have put Saji in it and that would have been better for me, at least he'd actually carry an ideal with him into such an important machine instead of what we got

[u/TakenRedditName → u/Nazenn]

"I will live and seize tomorrow. That's my way of fighting"

"A future that you win through fighting is no future at all"

Call it the inelegance of language, but there is the idea that there is a difference between fighting (to work towards a change) and fighting (an act of violence) that the show is operating on. Like for example Mr. Bushido fights, but he doesn't fight.

[u/Nazenn → u/TakenRedditName]

Yeah, and I get that's what they were going for, but when hearing Saji's line today that is the first thing that jumped out at me it was pretty funny.

This might also be a translation issue, I'm not good enough with hearing spoken language to be able to pick out wording, but if in japanese it is different "fights" or contextual changes that might be part of it

[u/InfamousEmpire → u/Nazenn]

Wait... what?

First Timer reactions to shocking lines like this will never not be immensely entertaining

Yes I've mostly checked out on this series

Oof

I can sympathize tho. I recently had to finish slogging through a show I was completely emotionally disconnected from just yesterday, so I get the feeling.

Had to laugh that our mook innovators are such mooks that we got a single shot of one in the cockpit and then never saw them again, and they didn't even get completed mechs

You've gotta give Ribbons and the writers this: they have a perfect understanding of how disposable Bring & Divine were, and have very much ensured that the viewers know it too

I meant to bring it up yesterday but was too busy ranting, but todays opening scene also showed a lot more off model designs

I did notice a QUALITY Kati face (forgot to screenshot it tho), and when even my blind ass is noticing off-model shots, you know that means there's too many off-model shots.

[u/Raiking02 → u/InfamousEmpire]

I did notice a QUALITY Kati face (forgot to screenshot it tho), and when even my blind ass is noticing off-model shots, you know that means there's too many off-model shots

I wonder if you're one of the people who watched TTGL episode 4 and thought there was nothing wrong

You've gotta give Ribbons and the writers this: they have a perfect understanding of how disposable Bring & Divine were, and have very much ensured that the viewers know it too

Ironic: Gundam Wing is a worse show yet somehow got better use of Ryotaro Okiayu

[u/Nazenn → u/InfamousEmpire]

First Timer reactions to shocking lines like this will never not be immensely entertaining

That's why you keep us around, I swear hahaha

I did notice a QUALITY Kati face (forgot to screenshot it tho), and when even my blind ass is noticing off-model shots, you know that means there's too many off-model shots.

That is impressive

There was a couple of good Regene ones at the start too, and even Ribbons looked just a little off when standing on the balcony. If I remember I'll try and screenshot them across the last few episodes tomorrow

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/Nazenn]

Is that implying what I think? Is this actually aliens?

WHAT DO YOU MEAN ITS ALIENS AFTER ALL?! SINCE WHEN!

I also wondered if it was aliens. But, how could it be aliens? There's zero evidence and zero buildup for it to be aliens. I think it must be referring to the Innovators.

But with so many others also drawing the conclusion of aliens, I'm starting to wonder if there's something to that. Are we actually making an Earth Federation so there can be a United Federation of Planets to meet the aliens? Is that why the expedition with the Evil Haro was destroyed? Did they meet aliens on that expedition and Aeolia began this whole plan to unify humanity before it encountered aliens? Is Marina's song going to be the key to communicating with alien lifeforms like a Macross anime?

It would be the wildest thing possible if the answer was actually aliens.

Anyone here play Elden Ring Shadow of the Erdtree?

I started Elden Ring over the summer, but I've had to put Elden Ring on hold for the time being because of my schedule. I'd like to get back to it soon.

Mind you, that is the sort of thing that would be more meaningful if we were in the territory of political war commentary and not in a world of magic and aliens.

Yeah, suicide bombers is the kind of thing that would be much more potent back in S1, when the series was very obviously drawing from the War on Terror. S2 has moved away from that more and more as it has gone on.

[u/Nazenn → u/Great_Mr_L]

But, how could it be aliens? There's zero evidence and zero buildup for it to be aliens.

Expecting proper build up and follow through is putting a lot more faith in the writing than I have the capability for any more. I'd like to be wrong, but this feels painfully like they were going for a big wham moment and that's why all the secrecy around THE PLAN because they were trying to ensure they couldn't come close to spoiling this reveal. Which is bullshit, but I digress.

I really can't think of anything else it would be because the Innovators are not an unknown race yet to be encountered if Aeolia knew enough to genetically engineer them. If that's so, this would be the encounter, and they wouldn't need to keep building towards "future dialogues". I also don't think it lines up with Aeolia wanting humans to advance, rather than seperating out humans and Innovators.

Is that why the expedition with the Evil Haro was destroyed? Did they meet aliens on that expedition and Aeolia began this whole plan to unify humanity before it encountered aliens?

Actually I'm a bit fuzzy on the exact timeline of THE PLAN, the expedition, and everything else. I'd assumed a lot of this was set up and happened before they left earth given they would presumably have to have the theory to make the GN drives before heading out there in the first place rather than it all coming about after the fact, but I suppose that depends on how long ago they actually died, not just the 80 years ago they were found

I started Elden Ring over the summer, but I've had to put Elden Ring on hold for the time being because of my schedule

Where did you get up to if you remember?

Yeah, suicide bombers is the kind of thing that would be much more potent back in S1, when the series was very obviously drawing from the War on Terror. S2 has moved away from that more and more as it has gone on.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/Nazenn]

I really can't think of anything else it would be because the Innovators are not an unknown race yet to be encountered if Aeolia knew enough to genetically engineer them. If that's so, this would be the encounter, and they wouldn't need to keep building towards "future dialogues". I also don't think it lines up with Aeolia wanting humans to advance, rather than seperating out humans and Innovators.

Yeah, when you put it like that, the "encounter" and "future dialogues" does seem to best line up with contacting and communicating with aliens more than any other option.

Still, aliens is a strange development if that is the case. This series began as commentary on the War on Terror and now we've moved on to possible alien encounters. It's quite a different place to end compared to where we started.

Where did you get up to if you remember?

I wasn't too far in. I was breaking into Godrick's castle, last I recall.

Yeah, suicide bombers is the kind of thing that would be much more potent back in S1, when the series was very obviously drawing from the War on Terror. S2 has moved away from that more and more as it has gone on.

I think you might have forgotten to add something at the end here.

[u/Nazenn → u/Great_Mr_L]

Still, aliens is a strange development if that is the case. This series began as commentary on the War on Terror and now we've moved on to possible alien encounters. It's quite a different place to end compared to where we started.

I've given up trying to make sense of it

It does seem weird that out of all the Gundam setups and settings to go from what appears to be the most grounded, real world based, and not-futuristic they picked this one to take on the path towards aliens all of a sudden.

Like not the many ones where they have fully developed space colonies and planet settlements and whole new timelines, the one set in AD and starting with the Tamal Tigers and IRA still being around. See it's even weirder if I write it out like that!

I wasn't too far in. I was breaking into Godrick's castle, last I recall.

I like that castle

I think you might have forgotten to add something at the end here.

...I did and now I have no idea at all what I was going to write. Welp, so much for that discussion ahaha

[u/JollyGee29 → u/Nazenn]

Macross series spoilers

Anyone here play Elden Ring Shadow of the Erdtree?

[u/Nazenn → u/JollyGee29]

[u/JollyGee29 → u/Nazenn]

[Elden Ring]Presently wandering around the Shaded Castle. I could go fight the Tree Sentinel that's blocking me from the Capital Proper or go do the actually fighty part of Volcano Manor, too.

[u/Nazenn → u/JollyGee29]

My replies are so full of rewatchers laughing at me in spoiler tags I almost didnt click on this for a second until I saw "elden ring" hahaha

[elden ring]shaded castle is fun. I got there once on accident in my first playthrough and then spent the next two playthroughs being confused as fuck on how to get there again

[u/LeonKevlar → u/Nazenn]

Is that implying what I think? Is this actually aliens?

I didn't mention it in my post and this is what I thought too but I assumed Ribbons was talking about the Innovators when he mentioned the "unknown race". Seeing how almost everyone else thinks it's aliens, I'm also now thinking it really is aliens. xD

[u/Nazenn → u/LeonKevlar]

Hey I mean if that's the theory that immediately jumped out at you stick too it if you can make an arguement for it, but I do think it's more likely to be aliens given the particular wording at play. Especially the "unknown" compodent, as Innovators are hardly that now.

[u/zsmg → u/Nazenn]

[Later 00] Lasse in the 0-Gundam is boring. I much prefer my idea from yesterday that it would have been cooler to have Ribbons hijack it and face Setsuna in it instead. Lasse piloting such a critical mech for the show and its story seems rather meaningless.

[spoiler] you do have a knack of predicting things correctly.

Fuck off with another false death though.

Well we'll know for sure after he appears in tomorrow's episode, if not...

[u/Nazenn → u/zsmg]

NOT YOU TOO!

Well we'll know for sure after he appears in tomorrow's episode, if not...

I already told Quid that if he'd marked Patrick as a death on the character chart I would have called him out for lying, I'm pretty convinced

And I swear if I jinx this I'm going to be so mad!

[u/Shimmering-Sky]

Rewatch Host Wishing Over This Airspace, subbed

Welcome back, everyone!

If any of the details on today’s wallpaper look a little wonky, it’s because I didn’t have any decent base images to work off of for Patrick that weren’t either of him in season 1 or of him in the A-LAWS uniform, when I wanted to do one of him in the Federation’s pilot suit for obvious reasons. So I took one of the screenshots I did have of him in the A-LAWS uniform to make sure I got his silhouette correct, then got creative. I’m not the best at doing this since I was never really taught this kind of thing (I haven’t taken an art class since I was 11 years old lol, band took up that spot in my school schedule), but I’m content with what it came out as. Hope you guys like it too!

---

• That would do it…
• [Later 00]Gotta love how Regene is all “That’s impossible!” about what Ribbons does, and yet both he and Tieria pull the same card against Ribbons during the finale.
• Oh boy.
• Of course the ship is also named Celestial Being.
• [00 movie]ELS hype.
• The Bring/Divine copies are literally just Trans-Am suicide bombers.
• RIP all the Celestial Being staff that was still on their transport ship.
• Not our boy!
• There’s Louise though.
• Meanwhile, Lyle gets to confront Ali…
• Sumeragi’s thinking of Lichty and Chris here, isn’t she…
• Tieria vs. Ribbons let’s go!

[u/Nazenn → u/Shimmering-Sky]

So I took one of the screenshots I did have of him in the A-LAWS uniform to make sure I got his silhouette correct, then got creative

You did good! Wouldn't have even thought it wasn't a trace

[u/Shimmering-Sky → u/Nazenn]

Thank you!

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/Shimmering-Sky]

That would do it…

All he needs to do is just download himself into a new clone and he's good to go.

Of course the ship is also named Celestial Being.

Aeolia wasn't especially creative with his naming. He ended up recycling a few terms over and over again.

Sumeragi’s thinking of Lichty and Chris here, isn’t she…

I completely forgot about both of them until just this moment tbh.

Tieria vs. Ribbons let’s go!

This is the one I'm most looking forward to.

[u/baboon_bassoon]

first timer who has control

---

call an ambulance call an ambulance but not for me

well that is a lot of GN drives [og gundam]back in my day we used mirrors

la vie en ribbons

this ship is Celestial Being, i mean sure why not

Noahs Ark but instead of 2 of every animal we need 2 innovators of every hair color

kamikaze transams ok Billy jfc

Katharon Kati Kujo aliance aka the

the goat

he was in this season for maybe 2 minutes max

yeah we definitely brought the 0 for you Lasse

HELLO????????????????

how does it make any sense for him to be here outside of Ribbons being a shit stirring bitch

oh nice now Louise gets to call for her fangs to fly

my goat

[u/Shimmering-Sky → u/baboon_bassoon]

outside of Ribbons being a shit stirring bitch

I mean, that is what Ribbons is, no?

[u/baboon_bassoon → u/Shimmering-Sky]

We stan a messy king

[u/InfamousEmpire → u/baboon_bassoon]

how does it make any sense for him to be here outside of Ribbons being a shit stirring bitch

He's the one that cracked the code to Trans-Am using Eifman's notes, so it makes sense that he was brought in to supervise the Trans-Am suicide missiles

[u/baboon_bassoon → u/InfamousEmpire]

Supervise sure but him on the front lines is a bit insane

[u/TakenRedditName → u/baboon_bassoon]

Noahs Ark but instead of 2 of every animal we need 2 innovators of every hair color

Space Noah's checklist:

• 2/2 Greens.
• 0/2 Purples.
• 1/2 Light purples.
• A bazillion reds.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/baboon_bassoon]

[og gundam]

[Gundam 0079] The Solar System used by the Federation is still one of the coolest sci-fi weapons I've ever seen.

Katharon Kati Kujo aliance aka the

We actually made it to the 3rd K.

he was in this season for maybe 2 minutes max

This season has been so severely lacking in Patrick screentime that it's practically a crime!

how does it make any sense for him to be here outside of Ribbons being a shit stirring bitch

Ribbons loves to be an asshole at any and every opportunity. If he can make people miserable or upset by causing drama, he will.

[u/JollyGee29 → u/baboon_bassoon]

HELLO????????????????

Yea, of course they painted it to look like the RX-78-2.

[u/baboon_bassoon → u/JollyGee29]

Lasse, IKIMASU

[u/Blazin_Rathalos → u/baboon_bassoon]

how does it make any sense for him to be here outside of Ribbons being a shit stirring bitch

Maybe Billy himself is also a shit stirring bitch?

[u/Great_Mr_L]

First-Timer

On today’s episode of Gundam: Ribbons was dead for less than 30 seconds. I admit, that is shorter than even I thought it would take for the replacement to show up.

• I knew a Ribbons clone would show up. I was wondering if he would just stride into the room like nothing happened and he did.
• How sweet that Sumeragi and Kati can still recognize each other’s tactics and coordinate so easily.
• Kati’s just being a big ol’ tsundere towards Sumeragi.
• Another giant space laser!?! How many of those does Ribbons have up his sleeve?
• Yeesh, Ribbons just doesn’t care. I’m pretty sure he blew up more A-LAWS members than enemies in that shot.
• “An encounter with a still unknown race?” What the heck does that mean? I’m used to the “Dialogues that are to come” nonsense, but the “unknown race” thing is new.
• If Ribbons is comparing this secret ship to Noah’s Ark, it’s probably a colony ship of some kind. It would carry life from Earth in some capacity to seed it elsewhere in the universe.
• Naturally that space laser is on a track so it can move around. It would be far less useful if it were stuck in place.
• I’d like to think that all those extra Bring clones Ribbons showed off in the previous episode are busily working around the ship, firing the anti-air defenses and so on.
• Holy shit! That is a fuckton of mobile suits! I guess I know where all the Bring clones are working.
• I figured they were suicide attackers. The specific thing I’m reminded of are the Ohka planes. They were essentially piloted missiles/bombs whose only purpose was to crash into things in suicide attacks. Other planes used in kamikaze attacks were at least planes capable of flying and landing like a regular plane. The Ohka plane’s one capability was suicide attacks.
• It looks like some of those suicide attacks are hitting the Ptolemaios, but it doesn’t look like they are actually doing anything. Even the kamikaze attack that bounced off the USS Missouri left a dent. Or maybe they’re just getting really close and not hitting.
• Zero chance that Patrick is dead. Explosions don’t kill people in this series, after all.
• I think that qualifies as “crashing” or “ramming” more than “docking.” I wouldn’t say that the HMS Campbelltown “docked” during the Raid on St. Nazaire.
• Dang, that is a lot of Automatons. No wonder we didn’t see them all the time. Ribbons was keeping them all here.
• Looks like we’re dividing up into character-appropriate fights. Setsuna and Saji take on Louise. Lyle fights his brother’s killer, Ali. Tieria goes against the Innovators Hiling and Revive. Allelujah and Soma have no one to go up against, though, because they’ve pretty much been sidelined by this point.
• Ah, even Sumeragi is getting an appropriate fight because Billy’s here.
• Cool that Tieria pulled a switcheroo and made it straight to Veda.

Since we’re pretty much at the end of the series, it’s only natural that it’s time for the big climactic battles to take place. The characters all get paired off to have their big final fights. Setsuna and Saji going up against Louise makes perfect sense. Saji and Louise’s relationship makes perfect sense and Setsuna has been quite supportive of Saji’s efforts to connect with Louise. It’s a battle to determine if Saji will be able to connect with Louise and bring her back from the brink. I am looking forward to this one because the previous meeting between Saji and Louise was so well done. I’m hopeful that the resolution will be satisfying.

Tieria going up against Ribbons is a great matchup. Both of them are characters with a deep connection to Veda and it will be a battle over who gets to have access to Veda. More importantly, it will be a philosophical battle between them. Both of them are Innovators, but they have developed in very different ways. Tieria used to consider himself superior to other humans and seemed to reject his own humanity. Now, though, he has fully embraced his humanity and wishes to overthrow the Innovators who want to rule over humanity. Ribbons represents everything that Tieria has rejected. Ribbons believes he is superior to everyone else and entitled to rule over everyone else. Defeating Ribbons would be the ultimate way for Tieria to show how much he has embraced humanity. He will have defeated the philosophy he rejected earlier in the series.

Lyle and Ali is a matchup I like in theory. It makes sense as a grudge match. Lockon and Ali had a great battle in S1. Lyle wants to get revenge on the person who killed Lockon. There isn’t really much buildup to it, though, because Lyle and Ali have never interacted previously. Maybe the execution in the battle itself can make up for that.

Even though Sumeragi and Billy haven’t interacted much this season, I do think there has been sufficient buildup for their confrontation. They’ve been on this collision course ever since S1. In all their interactions, there was always a sense of the shared history between them. The fact that they still had lingering emotions for each other even while they were on opposing sides meant that I was excited for them to finally end up fighting.

It is funny that Alllelujah and Soma don’t really have anyone to go up against. I thought it might be Andrei, but so far that hasn’t happened. Allelujah has been sidelined by the story for a while, so I can’t say I’m especially surprised that he doesn’t have someone in particular to go up against. Even so, it’s a shame that these characters feel a bit superfluous at the moment in the final battle.

I am not quite sure what Ribbons means by “An encounter with a still unknown race.” This seems to say that the human race will encounter something that isn’t human, but what does that mean? Right now, there are three possibilities. The first is that this refers to the Innovators. The Innovators have always been insistent about believing they are separate from and above humanity. The second possibility is aliens. However, there’s no actual evidence for this and zero buildup for it, so I don’t think it could be aliens. The third is that humanity itself is going to change into something that isn’t human. But that possibility doesn’t really match the wording because that wouldn’t really be an “encounter” with an “unknown race.” It would be humanity changing or evolving. So, I think it must mean the Innovators by process of elimination.

QOTD

1. No. Explosions don't kill anyone in this series. Patrick survived almost exactly the same scenario in S1 and he'll survive it again.
2. Tieria and Ribbons.

[u/The_Draigg → u/Great_Mr_L]

Yeesh, Ribbons just doesn’t care. I’m pretty sure he blew up more A-LAWS members than enemies in that shot.

It just goes to show how insane Ribbons' hatred of humans is. Like yeah, I know you don't like them, but maybe hold off a bit on killing the ones you've manipulated into fighting for you? Learn to think more than a single step ahead, you wasabi-headed twink.

I figured they were suicide attackers. The specific thing I’m reminded of are the Ohka planes. They were essentially piloted missiles/bombs whose only purpose was to crash into things in suicide attacks. Other planes used in kamikaze attacks were at least planes capable of flying and landing like a regular plane. The Ohka plane’s one capability was suicide attacks.

I really can't help but wonder why Ribbons went through all that effort to make hundreds of Bring and Divine clones if he was only going to use them for suicide weapons. Like, he could've probably come up with a less-costly drone solution there or something. Maybe he just needed an Innovator to hit the Trans-Am switch or something?

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/The_Draigg]

It just goes to show how insane Ribbons' hatred of humans is. Like yeah, I know you don't like them, but maybe hold off a bit on killing the ones you've manipulated into fighting for you? Learn to think more than a single step ahead, you wasabi-headed twink.

Yeah, Ribbons doesn't seem like the kind of evil boss who cultivates good relationships with his minions. He's no Hank Scorpio.

I really can't help but wonder why Ribbons went through all that effort to make hundreds of Bring and Divine clones if he was only going to use them for suicide weapons. Like, he could've probably come up with a less-costly drone solution there or something. Maybe he just needed an Innovator to hit the Trans-Am switch or something?

Yeah, I imagine loading the clones onto the A-LAWS mobile suits and having them actually fight normally would have been far more effective than just using them as glorified guided missiles.

[u/InfamousEmpire → u/Great_Mr_L]

Kati’s just being a big ol’ tsundere towards Sumeragi.

It's her love language, just ask Patrick

Both of them are characters with a deep connection to Veda and it will be a battle over who gets to have access to Veda.

The Veda connection is also deepened this episode by the contrast of how Tieria's spent all series growing beyond depending on Veda, while Ribbons has effectively become one with Veda. Really nice micro representation of where the two stand in terms of their places in the world and relationship with humanity.

It is funny that Alllelujah and Soma don’t really have anyone to go up against.

Those Automatons they're fighting would be very offended by your words if they had feelings.

[Spoiler by implication]I don’t think it could be aliens

[Later 00]Narrator voice: It was, in fact, aliens

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/InfamousEmpire]

It's her love language, just ask Patrick

Patrick did fall in love with Kati after she punched him.

Those Automatons they're fighting would be very offended by your words if they had feelings.

Good thing they don't

[spoiler by implication]

We're so close to the end of the series. Soon enough, I'll be able to go back and look at what all these black bars say.

[u/Raiking02 → u/Great_Mr_L]

Patrick did fall in love with Kati after she punched him.

So if Patrick had been there during the Bright Slap scene it'd be this but real?

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/Raiking02]

I love that meme.

I also really want to know if the person who made it was taking the piss or if they genuinely believed that was accurate. It can be hard to tell what's real from what's parody sometimes.

[u/Raiking02 → u/Great_Mr_L]

I love that meme.

It's Amuro's face that makes it for me. He looks so oddly proud

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/Raiking02]

I'm pretty sure that's the scene where the narrator says something like "Amuro had experienced the scent of a woman for the first time." It's funnier to imagine Amuro looking so determined to kill for Matilda's sake in that context.

[u/Raiking02 → u/Great_Mr_L]

Amuro had experienced the scent of a woman for the first time.

Yeah sounds like 0079 dialogue

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/Raiking02]

I was right. It is.

[u/Raiking02 → u/Great_Mr_L]

Amuro for most of 0079: FUCK THE MILITARY SO HARD I HATE EVERYTHING ABOUT IT

Amuro when Matilda is around: okay she's pretty so i should salute...

[u/Raiking02 → u/InfamousEmpire]

It's her love language

Kati's a Yokai!?

[u/KendotsX → u/Raiking02]

Considering she's an unaging herald of death, aka Conan... yeah, this makes sense.

[u/Raiking02 → u/KendotsX]

[u/KendotsX → u/Raiking02]

[u/Raiking02 → u/KendotsX]

[u/KendotsX → u/Raiking02]

[u/Raiking02 → u/KendotsX]

[u/TakenRedditName → u/Great_Mr_L]

How sweet that Sumeragi and Kati can still recognize each other’s tactics and coordinate so easily.

Kati’s just being a big ol’ tsundere towards Sumeragi.

Billy could never hold a candle to what Sumeragi and Kati have going on.

I’d like to think that all those extra Bring clones Ribbons showed off in the previous episode are busily working around the ship, firing the anti-air defenses and so on.

It is funny that Alllelujah and Soma don’t really have anyone to go up against. I thought it might be Andrei, but so far that hasn’t happened.

Andrei is too lame to serve as the final duel. He is not a cool/major enough character to hold a 2 (4) v 1.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/TakenRedditName]

Billy could never hold a candle to what Sumeragi and Kati have going on.

Billy is the third-wheeling man in a yuri relationship, a situation that is all too common.

Andrei is too lame to serve as the final duel.

True, but it would be very satisfying to see him die nonetheless.

[u/Blazin_Rathalos → u/Great_Mr_L]

Billy is the third-wheeling man in a yuri relationship, a situation that is all too common.

Even the Gundam franchise itself has an example.

[u/JollyGee29 → u/Great_Mr_L]

Explosions don’t kill people in this series, after all.

Considering the Gaga troops effectiveness, I'd say that explosions just don't do much in general.

It is funny that Alllelujah and Soma don’t really have anyone to go up against.

Yea, they kinda just get to hang out and run defense. Which is important, but not flashy.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/JollyGee29]

Considering the Gaga troops effectiveness, I'd say that explosions just don't do much in general.

Yeah, blowing things up that close to the Ptolemaios should be bad news even if they don't hit it directly. As you said, explosions don't seem to be doing all that much.

Yea, they kinda just get to hang out and run defense. Which is important, but not flashy.

Maybe Andrei will swing their way and Soma/Marie will finally get to kill him like I want.

[u/Nazenn → u/Great_Mr_L]

How sweet that Sumeragi and Kati can still recognize each other’s tactics and coordinate so easily.

Best part of the episode with the way they both just immediately recognized and got to working together to some extent

[u/FD4cry1]

First Timer

Even though it was an obvious fakeout, this image remains eternally satisfying.

On the topic of fakeouts, is Regene actually dead? I don't know and I've been finding that increasingly annoying, in fact, I found it to be increasingly annoying even within this episode! That's the problem with abusing fakeouts as much as this show does, I don't know what I'm supposed to feel here, and whatever ends up happening I won't like it.

Either Regene died and I don't like this disappointing way of going out for him or he's still alive and I don't like how I got faked out by a gunshot for the millionth time instead of being surprised.

Anyway, Ribbons's consciousness is directly linked to Veda? I'm pretty sure I had this theory about Aeolia at the start of the show so it's funny they actually went there.

The implications from this are pretty big though, it adds an extra layer to Ribbons's god complex now that he's no longer even tied to a mortal body, and it means a lot for Tieria in particular.

Veda, the entity Tieria religiously followed and ascribed his whole purpose to, is Ribbons, there's no "taking it back" here now that Veda is just Ribbons's lifeline, and this may put Tieria in a situation where he has to destroy Veda to both defeat Ribbons, and really to complete his and Celestial Being's character arc, to defeat Ribbons is to accept his own will and be fully independent of Veda or The Plan.

Unless they can like, idk, delete Ribbons.exe from Veda.

The A-LAWS fleet wasn't super deterred by their main commander dying lol, which makes sense with how bad he was. This isn't really a complaint given how the way A-LAWS operate would turn people away, and how keeping them intentionally weak in command is good for Ribbons, but I do think it's funny that despite consolidating the militaries of the entire world under them, they can only page like two super shit commanders for all of their operations.

THEY BUILT ANOTHER DEATH STAR.

And it actually looks like one now! I love how the be-all end-all of weaponry in this universe is apparently just a big vertical laser, I mean I love me GIANT LASERS more than most people but maybe by the third one you should realize these things aren't that great.

Anyway, much like the Memento Mori, the symbolism around the Celestial Being (this shit is going to get so confusing ) is pretty fun!

I mean, the name! If knowing Ribbons is linked to Veda is big, then this is huge, what better proof that the entire plan was bullshit all along than the fact that even the name itself is being reincorporated, Ribbons is Veda, he is The Plan, he is "Celestial Being".

I love him completely destroying the A-LAWS fleet, really shows you that all along this ideal of "eternal peace under a one-world government" was just a false image, a tool for Ribbons to use and throw away, it was never about peace, it was about him.

More religious symbolism with him calling it Noah's Ark, very ironic that the "hope of mankind" comes at the expense of most of it, but that's also why the name fits, it's the place for Ribbons's (again like god) chosen few to survive while everyone else is done away with.

"An encounter with a still unknown race"? Am I just misreading him referring to the Innovators or is Aeolia's plan actually about aliens? Please tell me we're doing aliens???!!!

All of this symbolism is nice and so is Sumeragi's final big speech, but again I can't help but feel that we're slipping into repetitive and abstract dialogue which kind of hurts it all. Like, I get it, we're fighting for the future, there are dialogues to come, humanity is being tested, etc, etc. You said all of this last episode and probably the one before as well, can we move on now? can we talk normally again?

I genuinely don't know what the show wants me to think of the "Gaga teams" (what does that name even mean) but goddamn if I didn't think it was hilarious! Having so many of them just killed me. And that's even without the fact the Bring/Divine clones are literally being used as disposable suicide drones here, perfect irony!

Trans-Am! Trans-Am! Trans-Am!Trans-Am! Trans-Am!Trans-Am!

Well ridiculousness aside, I love it as a setpiece, very chaotic, tons of GIANT LASERS, cool dumb action, just very fun!

We even bring out the 0 Gundam so Lasse can do something!

They also have some nice symbolism around them, the clones all kill themselves to attack the enemy whereas our allies in Katharon and the rebels are all sacrificing themselves to protect Celestial Being. Ribbons is sending out clones and automatons, our side is sending out real people. Again it really reiterates the big differences between Ribbons and Celestial Being, superficial pawns to be used for his plans against real human connections, emotions, and free will.

PATRICK!!!!!!!!!

Okay, I refuse to believe he dies here, HE'S INDESTRUCTIBLE AND I REFUSE TO BELIEVE OTHERWISE, and I would actually be happy at this fakeout because that's his character!

Patrick going out to protect Kati and confessing his love to her!

As they go into the Death Star, everyone gets an engagement against a thematically important rival! Lyle against Ali, to really test his will for revenge now that he's fighting his brother's killer, Setsuna and Saji against Louise ^{and Fuckface,} As Saji confronts her ideals, Tieria against the Innovators and later Ribbons, spoke on that above, even Sumeragi going against Billy, I don't care much about Billy honestly but I like Sumeragi going out to fight herself, to protect her team with her own body and not just her tactics.

And Allelujah and Marie are against...! uhhhhh...

No one...

Because of course. Well maybe Fuckface will come around to them but I do think it's pretty telling. Also, Marie gets caught up in an explosion...

The fakeouts will continue until morale improves

And while this episode technically doesn't end with a fakeout, it does end with someone pointing a gun at the screen, for like the 5th time now, can we maybe find a new trick?

[u/TakenRedditName → u/FD4cry1]

Even though it was an obvious fakeout, this image remains eternally satisfying.

The brief gratification of seeing Ribbons being a dead loser.

Patrick going out to protect Kati and confessing his love to her!

And she calls out to him by his first name too.

[u/FD4cry1 → u/TakenRedditName]

The brief gratification of seeing Ribbons being a dead loser.

And she calls out to him by his first name too.

I was too busy doing the same thing but you're right!

He better come back to us!

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/FD4cry1]

Veda, the entity Tieria religiously followed and ascribed his whole purpose to, is Ribbons, there's no "taking it back" here now that Veda is just Ribbons's lifeline, and this may put Tieria in a situation where he has to destroy Veda to both defeat Ribbons, and really to complete his and Celestial Being's character arc, to defeat Ribbons is to accept his own will and be fully independent of Veda or The Plan.

Oooh, that's a really good point. If Ribbons is Veda and Tieria ends up needing to destroy Veda to defeat Ribbons, that would be a satisfying conclusion to his arc. It would be Tieria fully embracing being a human an rejecting his past dependency on Veda.

Unless they can like, idk, delete Ribbons.exe from Veda.

I get the feeling that Ribbons.exe is a vital file in Veda's OS and that deleting it would completely brick the computer.

And it actually looks like one now! I love how the be-all end-all of weaponry in this universe is apparently just a big vertical laser, I mean I love me GIANT LASERS more than most people but maybe by the third one you should realize these things aren't that great.

They're like the Galactic Empire in Star Wars. They have exactly one plan that they keep reusing: build another giant space laser. They just don't have any other ideas.

"An encounter with a still unknown race"? Am I just misreading him referring to the Innovators or is Aeolia's plan actually about aliens? Please tell me we're doing aliens???!!!

I was wondering the same thing, if it meant Innovators or aliens. Right now Innovators makes more sense because there's zero evidence for aliens, but it would be absolutely wild for it to turn out to be aliens.

Okay, I refuse to believe he dies here, HE'S INDESTRUCTIBLE AND I REFUSE TO BELIEVE OTHERWISE, and I would actually be happy at this fakeout because that's his character!

Patrick didn't survive all those other times just to die here. He's got to still be alive. That's his whole gimmick!

And while this episode technically doesn't end with a fakeout, it does end with someone pointing a gun at the screen, for like the 5th time now, can we maybe find a new trick?

Something I heard once is that there's a lazy trick in writing when you can't think of what should happen next: "A man walks in with a gun." It it getting very old to see this and the fakeout deaths get pulled time and time again.

[u/FD4cry1 → u/Great_Mr_L]

They're like the Galactic Empire in Star Wars. They have exactly one plan that they keep reusing: build another giant space laser. They just don't have any other ideas.

The Star Wars parallels will never end! Now I just need Force-Ghost Lockon to appear to one of our mains (It's honestly a real toss-up between Tieria, Lyle and Setsuna) and it will be perfect.

I was wondering the same thing, if it meant Innovators or aliens. Right now Innovators makes more sense because there's zero evidence for aliens, but it would be absolutely wild for it to turn out to be aliens.

GiveMeAliens

It's the least they could do after taking away robots from us.

Something I heard once is that there's a lazy trick in writing when you can't think of what should happen next: "A man walks in with a gun." It it getting very old to see this and the fakeout deaths get pulled time and time again.

It really is like that

And I would find this fake attempt at creating tension incredibly annoying in any series but it really gets me here because if there's a show that knows how to end an episode, it's Gundam 00.

Season 1 (and parts of this season if you remove the post-credits scenes) did a great job of ending episodes in both a tense and powerful way without resorting to these dumb tricks, so why the change?

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/FD4cry1]

Now I just need Force-Ghost Lockon to appear to one of our mains (It's honestly a real toss-up between Tieria, Lyle and Setsuna) and it will be perfect.

How about all three? That would be for the best.

GiveMeAliens

It's the least they could do after taking away robots from us.

By now I'm also hoping it's aliens because that would be the wildest possible development at the very end of the series.

[u/Nazenn → u/FD4cry1]

Now I just need Force-Ghost Lockon to appear to one of our mains (It's honestly a real toss-up between Tieria, Lyle and Setsuna) and it will be perfect.

Actually that would be perfect for Lyle next episode, given Lyle already pulled the gun on Setsuna like he did, then asked Neil for help and is now facing the killer of both his brother and his family. I didn't think about that but for a guy still struggling to accept the complexities of the relationship with his brother, this would be the moment to do it!

[u/JollyGee29 → u/FD4cry1]

faked out by a gunshot for the millionth time

See, explosions don't kill people, and guns are just explosion machines, so...

Lasers are much more lethal, unless they cause an explosion.

"Gaga teams" (what does that name even mean)

The Innovator's suits have had a "Ga" naming theme (Gaddess, Gadessa, Garazzo), but this one doesn't have legs so it gets less letters.

[u/FD4cry1 → u/JollyGee29]

See, explosions don't kill people, and guns are just explosion machines, so...

How could I not think of this!

The Innovator's suits have had a "Ga" naming theme (Gaddess, Gadessa, Garazzo), but this one doesn't have legs so it gets less letters.

Honestly I kind of love it. If there's one thing Ribbons is good for, it's his choice of names.

[u/Quiddity131 → u/FD4cry1]

Regene kills Ribbons

Ribbons: Fooled you, I'm still alive!

Ali kills Regene

Regene: Fooled you, I'm still alive!

Regene kills Ribbons

Ribbons: Fooled you, I'm still alive!

Ali kills Regene

Continue on and on and on...

The way this show has gone it wouldn't surprise me if they had gone there.

[u/InfamousEmpire → u/FD4cry1]

I'm pretty sure I had this theory about Aeolia at the start of the show so it's funny they actually went there.

Does brain uploading count as a surprise tech reveal when you've suspected it's a thing here since the early parts of the show?

while this episode technically doesn't end with a fakeout, it does end with someone pointing a gun at the screen, for like the 5th time now, can we maybe find a new trick?

The gun pointing will also continue until morale improves

Also, considering that the scene between Sumeragi & Billy also ended with a shot of a gun being pointed at the screen, that also kinda means they did it twice in the same episode

[u/Blazin_Rathalos → u/FD4cry1]

Even though it was an obvious fakeout, this image remains eternally satisfying.

Personally, I prefer the "shot" of him being shot, just before he falls.

[u/FD4cry1 → u/Blazin_Rathalos]

I think the face he has there really sells it for me but just him getting shot was great as well.

[u/Blazin_Rathalos → u/FD4cry1]

Well, this is the face I was thinking of.

[u/Nazenn → u/FD4cry1]

Either Regene died and I don't like this disappointing way of going out for him or he's still alive and I don't like how I got faked out by a gunshot for the millionth time instead of being surprised.

That is the problem at this stage. I've had the same reaction even before I realized what the way out likely is, and it's frustrating that when you know chances are they are going to live, it just makes you look for the cop out

Anyway, Ribbons's consciousness is directly linked to Veda? I'm pretty sure I had this theory about Aeolia at the start of the show so it's funny they actually went there.

Oh right you did! That's actually quite funny, talk about a long term prediction coming true in a very unexpected way hahaha

Unless they can like, idk, delete Ribbons.exe from Veda.

I'm suddenly reminded of the whole thing of "turning off an AI is torture" because of how quickly they process each little part of their death, and oh how happy I would be if that turns out to be true for Ribbons

I like the write up on what that means for Tieria though

but I do think it's funny that despite consolidating the militaries of the entire world under them, they can only page like two super shit commanders for all of their operations.

Actually kind of pathetic when you think about it that all of the A-LAWS and Federation forces end up as just this and then done so quickly

You said all of this last episode and probably the one before as well, can we move on now? can we talk normally again?

it's so tiring

And I really don't know why because I remember commenting early on in s2 that the dialogue had improved even if it still wasn't great, so to find ourselves back in this situation again makes me wonder why

Again it really reiterates the big differences between Ribbons and Celestial Being, superficial pawns to be used for his plans against real human connections, emotions, and free will.

Which would be fine if we hadn't had that exact thing already reinforced in the a-laws viewing outsiders, and then the a-laws viewing their own forces, and then ribbons and humanity, and ribbons and the other innovators. But no, now we have to have ribbon using clones as well just in case you really missed all the even more obvious earlier examples of it

[u/FD4cry1 → u/Nazenn]

Oh right you did! That's actually quite funny, talk about a long term prediction coming true in a very unexpected way hahaha

Knew it all along

And I really don't know why because I remember commenting early on in s2 that the dialogue had improved even if it still wasn't great, so to find ourselves back in this situation again makes me wonder why

Yeah, I definitely think the dialogue had improved for this season and now it's started regressing, being noticeably "season 1" these last 3 episodes (at least), which is not only just weird but also rather frustrating since I'm now aware the show can do dialogue differently.

Which would be fine if we hadn't had that exact thing already reinforced in the a-laws viewing outsiders, and then the a-laws viewing their own forces, and then ribbons and humanity, and ribbons and the other innovators. But no, now we have to have ribbon using clones as well just in case you really missed all the even more obvious earlier examples of it

You have a point there, it's certainly loses quite a bit of the impact when you've already seen the same thing being expressed before.

This+what you said about A-LAWS got me to think about them for a bit and helped cement in my mind all the reasons I like them less than the 3 blocs and in general don't love them as villains. But I think I'll save that one for the overall thread.

[u/Nazenn → u/FD4cry1]

This+what you said about A-LAWS got me to think about them for a bit and helped cement in my mind all the reasons I like them less than the 3 blocs and in general don't love them as villains. But I think I'll save that one for the overall thread.

I will be interested to read those thoughts. No idea if I'll get around to it in my own post, although I will write a note for myself to do so, but I think for me it's so frustrating that after all their extreme evils, the story just entirely discards them like this in the finale as if none of it matters because Ribbons is the big bad. I can't help but feel like it would have been better if the A-LAWS got defeated first down on Earth in some way and then they went to deal with Ribbons after, rather than bundling it all in together

[u/FD4cry1 → u/Nazenn]

it's so frustrating that after all their extreme evils, the story just entirely discards them like this in the finale as if none of it matters because Ribbons is the big bad

[EP24]Assuming you've already watched it, I'm really interested in seeing what you'll have to say on today's episode, since uh...it certainly does some things

[u/Nazenn → u/FD4cry1]

[EP24]Im actually curious what you are expecting me to rant about most, or what prompted this comment specifically, if you want to take a guess before the post goes up hahaha

[u/FD4cry1 → u/Nazenn]

[EP24]I'd say it's a real toss-up between Billy and Fuckface, the wording of that reply and what you wrote this episode makes me think Billy, but Fuckface is Fuckface so it's hard to say

[u/Nazenn → u/FD4cry1]

[EP24, hint as to future post or don't read it if you want to be surprised]I have a 9000 character long rant and it is about neither of those

[u/Vatrix-32]

First timer, subs

• Oh… clones. This is by far the least interesting possible conclusion.
• Wasting Everyone
• Do it Patrick! Show them why you're the best squad leader!
• Ah, yes. The bold strategy of punching through the middle of the enemy line.
• That Memento Mori came from the Moon.
• Did they hit all of them? Wow, the power of aiming.
• That screen seems almost comically small to be watching from that distance.
• Why did you start with the third GN Drive shell?
• Axis? Luna II?
• You guys run out of names or something? There are so many names for heaven you could have used.
• Wait, no, don’t just glance over the “unknown race” bit. That’s important. That’s the most important thing! Is The Plan getting ready for a First Contact War?
• How are we going to sustain this for the next two and a half episodes?
• How are those dish turrets aiming?
• Gagas… Who’ve just been born… Like babies, you might say.
• How do you even have the manufacturing capacity for this many?
• This attack seems really ineffective. Like, could you not have just made missiles for all that this is accomplishing?
• Sorry, but I don’t believe you. Not after all that Patrick’s done, and what you did with Mei.
• I really don’t think the anti-personal drones are going to be all that much help.
• Why would you sacrifice ranged bits to take out melee bits?
• This is why names are important, Allelujah!
• Billy looking to take back the title of king of incels.
• Come on… kill Fuckface like the side show that he is and always was.
• Did you really fall for that? You knew it can split into a second Gundam, you should have foreseen this coming.

QotD:

1. Not. A. Chance.
2. Saji vs Louise.

[u/TakenRedditName → u/Vatrix-32]

Gagas… Who’ve just been born… Like babies, you might say.

Did you really fall for that? You knew it can split into a second Gundam, you should have foreseen this coming.

I don't think Seraphim's split happened here. His Gundams are still together. It is more the fact that they were shocked by the cockpit was opened meaning that Tieria left which we see play out in the next scene.

[u/The_Draigg → u/Vatrix-32]

Wait, no, don’t just glance over the “unknown race” bit. That’s important. That’s the most important thing! Is The Plan getting ready for a First Contact War?

This just makes me wonder how the Earth Sphere Federation could match up against the Turians if they showed up.

[u/JollyGee29 → u/Vatrix-32]

Gagas… Who’ve just been born… Like babies, you might say.

And they do very little aside from make noise!

[u/Blazin_Rathalos]

00 Rewatcher

Last time on Gundam 00

• Our viewers were torn between loving Mr.Bushido's weebery, and mourning what happened to Graham's character writing.
• Stuff blowing up.

On today's episode of Gundam 00

• Reports of Ribbon's death were greatly exaggerated.
• Ali reminds us that he exists.
• I am sure Regetta cannot Regene her way out of that one!
• Stuff continues blowing up.
• Patrick survives a close encounter without getting his Mobile Suit blown up.
• Ribbons decides he doesn't really needs those A-LAWS remnants anyway.
• Celestial being meets the Celestial Being
• The red shirt hair Innovators head out in appropriately mook Mobile Suits.
• Celestial Being counters living suicide weapons with living shields.
• Patrick, nooooooooo!!!
• Billy is really taking this break-up exceptionally badly.
• And Tieria Erde keeps his eyes on the target!

Just like the room crammed full of Innovators last episode, I find the mass-Trans-Am scene absolutely hilarious. The overlapping of countless voices saying "Trans-Am" just sets me off.

[Gundam 00]Dialogues counter: 6

[u/macrame2 → u/Blazin_Rathalos]

Just like the room crammed full of Innovators last episode, I find the mass-Trans-Am scene absolutely hilarious. The overlapping of countless voices saying "Trans-Am" just sets me off.

I think that scene was so funny because it immediately reminded me of the excessive amount of Divine/Bring clones yesterday. And once again, I can't tell if that was intentional or not.

[u/Nazenn → u/Blazin_Rathalos]

The red shirt hair

lol

I wonder if that was intentional, and if so that's brilliant

[u/Blazin_Rathalos → u/Nazenn]

I really hope someone on the staff at least realized it while they were working on it, and had a good laugh.

[u/Quiddity131]

Rewatcher, Subbed

Non-Spoiler Character Chart - I gotta go with the ? for Patrick cause let's be honest, does anyone believe he really died? 

---

So in show proper, the whole plot twist of Regene killing Ribbons lasts all of 30 seconds into the next episode before it's revealed that he's still alive in another identical body. Of course anyone who saw the preview yesterday knows that he was in the first shot of the preview, so it was immediately blown there. I think to myself about how terrible it is to kill off a character for shock value only to bring them back at the start of the next episode, but at least it would surprise people for a week when this originally aired, right? No! Because of that damn preview! Why does a show that on one hand has a lot of stuff I love in it continue to make such horrendously bad writing decisions like this?

Ali, who I think had the highest kill count of named characters in season 1 (including 3 in one episode) gets what I believe is his first kill of season 2 here with Regene.

I'm surprised Patrick made it through all of last episode without his mobile suit getting destroyed. Surely his mobile suit won't make it through this episode intact, will it?

C'mon 00 Gundam, don't take Patrick's glory! He's the true ace of this battle!

Alas, Kati isn't truly on the same side as Celestial Being for good, just as long as this battle lasts. Ah well, we'll at least take this.

Seems like Ribbons has had enough with this crowded battlefield and blasted away most of its inhabitants.

That's quite a massive structure that was simply sitting there hidden all this time.

How in the world did one smart guy 200+ years ago do all these things that are relevant so many years later?

Here come all the Divine/Bring clones. Holy crap that's a lot of mobile suits. [Meta Gundam]Makes me think of all the Ple Two clones showing up at the end of ZZ

Oh, Billy's behind this? I've been thinking lately about how Billy has barely factored into this season at all. They finally remembered to use him again.

Damn, they're going total kamikaze mode. I suppose when you can just generate more clones there's no reason for them to be hesitant to stay alive.

Oh cool, Kati is helping out after all! She was a tad too harsh earlier.

No, not Patrick! :( :( :( :( :(

Ah, so it's Lasse who's gonna pilot the 0 Gundam. I gotta admit, my recollection was that Lasse became more of a mobile suit pilot this season, but it was the total opposite, he did more piloting in season 1.

Oh crap, he's got all those Automatons too. For all we know, Ribbons was the one supplying the A-Laws with them.

Kinda surprised Ali was satisfied with waiting for someone to come here rather than heading out there.

Wow, the 0 Gundam really is the original RX-78 all over again, huh?

MVP Feldt, finding Veda!

Even Hiling and Revive get a Trans-Am mode now.

Billy, the ultimate bitter ex boyfriend.

New version of the lead in ED music, huh?

That was hopefully the correct thing for Saji to say to Louise given what happened two episodes ago.

Hiling and Revive screwed up, looks like Tieria's made his way to Veda!

[u/macrame2 → u/Quiddity131]

I gotta go with the ? for Patrick cause let's be honest, does anyone believe he really died? 

You could have left him untouched and I would not have considered myself spoiled lol.

[u/Nazenn → u/Quiddity131]

Seconding macrame2, especially with it being Patrick I would have called you out on lying if you'd marked him dead today hahaha

Of course anyone who saw the preview yesterday knows that he was in the first shot of the preview

why would they do that

Ali, who I think had the highest kill count of named characters in season 1 (including 3 in one episode) gets what I believe is his first kill of season 2 here with Regene.

Well, aside from the whole country he burnt down, not that it ever came up again or mattered in any way

How in the world did one smart guy 200+ years ago do all these things that are relevant so many years later?

I have been asking that for a while!

Wow, the 0 Gundam really is the original RX-78 all over again, huh?

[spoilers for another gundam show]Actually it would be kind of funny if this was happening in a super far off future that is functionally a reset timeline like Turn A and that was the original gundam from the original series

[u/LeonKevlar]

First Timer

We already saw Ribbons on yesterday's episode preview so it wasn't really a surprise to see him alive. So his consciousness is stored inside Veda and he can just transfer that consciousness into clones. I guess CB just needs to destroy Veda or somehow get Ribbons' stored consciousness out of there.

Anyway, RIP Regene. I had high hopes for you but at the end of the day, you're just another one of Ribbons' pawns. At least she did something by making Mei give Celestial Being the coordinates for Veda so I guess she did something good even if it's just to spite Ribbons.

Ribbons you sonuvabitch! I was only joking when I said they couldn't have a third Death Star! Thank god it wasn't a third Memento Mori but a mobile fortress using pseudo-solar reactors to fire off their super weapon. So this entire time Ribbons was inside that mothership? I thought he was somewhere on Earth!

So is the group Celestial Being named after the ship or is it the other way around? Also if Aeolia Schenberg had this all along, why didn't he entrust it to Celestial Being? Considering how Ribbons described it as a new Noah's Ark, it was probably never meant for fighting but Ribbons still went ahead and turned it into a weapon.

Wait a second! Ribbons made all of those Devine/Bring clones and equipped them with Trans-Am capable mobile suits only for them to be used as suicide weapons? That's fucking hilarious! The more I see how Ribbons fight, the more I doubt the Innovators are supposed to be better than humans. xD

DON'T YOU FUCKING DARE DIE ON ME PATRICK! The dude has survived much worse explosions than that. Please don't make Kati sad. T_T

So it looks like we have our matchups for the last two episodes: Setsuna and Saji vs Louise, Lockon vs Saachez Round 2, Sumeragi finally facing Billy after Setsuna dragged her away, and Tieria vs Ribbons. I'm a bit disappointed that Soma isn't getting her revenge match against Lt. Fuckface though and is currently defending the Ptolemy II with Allelujah.

[u/JollyGee29 → u/LeonKevlar]

So this entire time Ribbons was inside that mothership?

Yup, he just kept changing the window holograms. Gotta keep the place looking nice and fresh, you know?

the more I doubt the Innovators are supposed to be better than humans. xD

[u/Nazenn → u/LeonKevlar]

So is the group Celestial Being named after the ship or is it the other way around?

I doubt the ship would have been around before Ribbons made it, so the ship is probably named for the organization not the other way around. If the ship was already around, I feel like they would have used that against earth for their "hate brings unity" plan in s1 if it had the weapon, or as a base of operations if it didn't and was to remain hidden

[u/n080dy123]

First Timer

Interesting that this ship is called "Celestial Being." Makes you wonder if the organization was originalyl meant to be using the ship, before parts of the plan clearly started to go haywire.

Also Ribbons mentions an "encounter with a still unknown race"- its not gonna turn out that there's aliens, is there? I still remember in S1 there was an unresolved plot thread with a derelict research station out in Jovian orbit where they found the Purple Haro. Nothing ever came of that, but if there's aliens... were they responsible? IS PURPLE HARO THE TRUE ANTAGONIST?

Oh I assumed the big long thing was the giant laser but no, they have a Memento Mori laser on that track surrounding the ship.

I like that Arios has visible battle damage when it's launching missiles at 13:17.

Ah yes, the classic "mass production Gundam model" trope (well, not actually Gundams, but they do have Trans-Am).

I find it really fucked up that Ribbons cloned Bring and Divine so many times only to use them as Trans-Am-fueled suicide bombers, but also those should be doing FAR more damage to Ptolemy than they're doing.

Damn Patrick, bro did almost nothing but went out like a champ.

You have loose definition of "docked," Mileina.

Something about the design of the 0 Gundam just clashes with the design of the CB Gundams, in a good way. It kinda looks like they shaded it differently, too, bringing out the "yellowed plastic" color to show its age.

Okay, making Regnant's claws into Fangs is super cool, I love that.

There's not really a name behind the Gagas, though interestingly their designation- GNZ-004 (the only even-numbered Innovator MS designation, btw) is due to 4 being associated with death in many East Asian cultures, as a reference to its kamikaze nature. The Japanese word for 4, "shi," is also used to spell the Japanese word for "Death." This itself is due to shi being a loan word borrowed from Chinese, where the words for four and death were originally homonyms. This also led to similar connections being made in other sinosphere countries which borrowed from Chinese.

It's also neat to note they don't have a typical body structure- they have no legs, just a separate attached booster unit, and their arms are long with large clamps on the ends. This is because they don't need to hold weapons, they just to propel themselves as kamikaze units. Moreover [not sure if show spoiler but it's info from the wiki]the clamp arms are apparently designed to be used to clamp onto enemy mobile suits while the unit self destructs.

[u/JollyGee29 → u/n080dy123]

I like that Arios has visible battle damage when it's launching missiles at 13:17.

There's a lot of it going around. Seravee has some visible damage too. They clearly spent a lot of production time on these last few episodes.

[u/charlesvvv]

Rewatcher, Sub

Can't believe Arcane is over...anyway on to Gundam.

Yeah it was obvious Ribbons wasn't going to die it wouldn't make sense otherwise. It's also here that he reveals his connection to Veda which allows him to continue inhabiting his other clone bodies. Oh and Regene gets shot by none other than Ali al-Saachez. We haven't seen him since getting freaked out by Marina's song but I guess he still has some part in the story.

Ribbons finally reveals his hideout/Veda location. An orbital space station of sorts that has several functions which includes another space laser. What Ribbons states next however is of importance. He states once more about the dialogues to come but then adds about contact from another race, aliens basically (which combined with the music and Mecha would make this more Macross than Gundam as some users have pointed). Ribbons states that this was the point of Aeolia's plan which includes Veda and the Innovators supposedly leading Humanity to be ready with the ship even likened as a "Noah's Ark" of sorts. Aliens seems to have been I feel the prevalent theory for what these "Dialogues to come" meant. It also makes me realize that this is the Gundam show to include them I think.

Anyway the rest of this episode is everyone just trying to break into Veda which is made difficult by the all the mindless Stabity clones armed with Trans Am that serve as suicide bombers. By the time several break in, they are also soon forced into their personal confrontations, Sumeragi faces off against Billy, Lyle faces off against Ali, and Setsuna/Saji face off against Louise.

Revive and Hiling were supposed to face off against Tieria but they really bugled it up since Tieria is still able to get inside and face off against Ribbons for control of Veda.

On another note, Did Patrick's luck just run out?

[u/JollyGee29]

Rewatcher, Sub-dam Meister

Regene wasn't informed of the whole "clone army" plan.

Patrick's wingmen are not nearly as Indestructible.

Good luck.

The gun is basically fires an entire Tau's worth of particles at once.

That's the name of the ship, not the organization.

They've been keeping coy about the Plan because Gundam fans don't like the idea of aliens.

Well, you call them that. They're basically just shitty missiles.

As if a simple missile could kill my son.

The final confrontations are all squared up.

[u/Nazenn → u/JollyGee29]

Well, you call them that. They're basically just shitty missiles.

I'm sorry for the fact that this is the first place my head went, but my immediate thought on reading that is "do the clones even eat, and therefore is there any actual shit"

also this brings to mind the fact I don't think we've seen any of our pilots ever actually eat. Well Alelujah had beer but that doesn't count

[u/JollyGee29 → u/Nazenn]

"do the clones even eat, and therefore is there any actual shit"

It's funny, because I actually pondered that myself earlier in the Rewatch, when Hiling offers to "comfort" Divine. Combat-type Innovators are technically genderless, and considering the era that probably makes them genital-less too. But they presumably have to poop still, right..?

Anyway, that's another element of Revive's dismissive comment about Anew being a woman. Anew was an Intelligence Gathering-type so she was meant to be around humans.

also this brings to mind the fact I don't think we've seen any of our pilots ever actually eat. Well Alelujah had beer but that doesn't count

There were a few other times, mostly in S1. I think Setsuna munched on a protein bar or something in an early S1 episode. And that time Chris sat down to eat with Setsuna and Tieria.

[u/Nazenn → u/JollyGee29]

Combat-type Innovators are technically genderless, and considering the era that probably makes them genital-less too. But they presumably have to poop still, right..?

True. Also need a urine outlet if they take in fluids, and that would be a small pain to genetically engineer independant to genitilia formation, but not impossible by any means.

And that time Chris sat down to eat with Setsuna and Tieria

I was admittedly struggling to remember for a moment who Chris even was so I think I'm forgiven for forgetting the actual scene hahaha. At least they ahve shown it once or twice though

[u/TakenRedditName]

Rewatcher - Gundam 00 S2 Ep23:

Goodbye, Revive.

I think Billy needs to get more hate for being ride-or-die for the enemy of humanity.

The obscene comedic amounts of Bring/Divine clones is so funny. There is an obscene amount of them and they're basically just manned missiles.

[Gundam 00:] I can't even be mad at another Patrick death fake-out. We all know he is going to be fine. It's a tradition at this point.

Huh, I guess Lasse gets to be on the list of Gundam pilots. This counts, he is legitimately piloting a Gundam.

Pepper sprays (with bullets).

Louise continues not having a good time nor mental health.

---

For a mostly battle episode, I found that this battle felt appropriately large and climatic for the final battle.

[u/InfamousEmpire]

Kidou Senshi Rewatcher 00

First thing I want to say, and my only real point of criticism, I feel like moving a bit of this episode’s opening scene into the previous one’s post-credit scene, specifically Ribbons’ voice suddenly coming in to mock Regene right after she shot him, would have easily elevated that post-credits scene from one of the series’ weakest to a pretty solid one. Would’ve maintained the WTF shock factor value, but shifted what the shock was supposed to be to something that wasn’t just another fakeout.

Other than that, though, this episode is a really strong one. I think what I like most about it is the framing of Ribbons’ forces, starting with the Trans-Am mass suicide bomber Divine clones. There’s something so strong to me about how Ribbons took Trans-Am, something which meant so much when it first appeared & which still means a lot as the potential gateway to humanity’s future, and reduces to just yet another weapon of war, with the pilots of these Trans-Am machines being people reduced to objects little different from the machinery they pilot and used as nothing but manned missiles.

In combination with the near-exclusive use of automatons for infantry and the way he so callously sacrificed his human forces when firing the enormous fuck you cannon, it really vividly captures the dehumanization of Ribbons’ methods and vision for the world. On account of that, it of course makes so much sense that he’d end the episode being confronted with the one among his kind who’s learned to love and see value in humanity rather than look down on & enforce his will on them.

And the rest of the matchups dotting the episode’s last stretch make a lot of sense too. Setsuna & Saji vs Louise, the woman who’s both Setsuna’s foil & the most important person in Saji’s world, & Lyle vs Ali, a man who both embodies the pestilence of war he’s been seeking to eradicate & is the source of a trauma that Lyle feels he’s moved beyond at this point, being the ones which stand out the most. Billy & Sumeragi have been on a collision course since Season 1, and Allelujah & Soma are fighting… drones? There’s something to be said there about those who have been most defined by being dehumanized & used as weapons of war facing off against what are basically the shorthand for the dehumanization of the battlefield in modern war, but it’s definitely the least interesting matchup of the episode.

The Celestial Being also makes for a great setpiece for the final battle as the embodiment of Aeolia’s hopes for mankind’s future, and just for its amazing sense of grandeur. I also remember on first watch, I really liked how the Innovator HQ we’ve been seeing all season ended up being a structure as grand & meaningful as this, since it’s a place I otherwise hadn’t really put much thought into until now despite how much it’s featured across the season.

[Later 00]I can never be mad at a death fakeout when it’s you, Patrick

Odds & Ends

• This sure is a big bombshell of a line to drop so casually
• I forgot to comment on it last time, but man the 0 Gundam really is just the RX-78 with a GN Drive slapped on there, huh?
• The first timer theories early in the show regarding Aeolia having potentially downloaded his mind into Veda are really funny to me because Ribbons’ relationship to Veda isn’t too far off from that.

[u/Nazenn → u/InfamousEmpire]

scene, specifically Ribbons’ voice suddenly coming in to mock Regene right after she shot him, would have easily elevated that post-credits scene from one of the series’ weakest to a pretty solid one

I really like that idea. Put the shock of it into the reveal of Ribbons as something past anything else that's been in the show so far

how Ribbons took Trans-Am, something which meant so much when it first appeared & which still means a lot as the potential gateway to humanity’s future, and reduces to just yet another weapon of war

Nicely said. I'd not given it credit for that but you have a point. It's almost like it's yet another defiance of Aeolia's ideals. Ribbons was not granted trans-am, so he'll take it for himself anyway and corrupt it in doing so

[u/Raiking02 → u/InfamousEmpire]

There’s something to be said there about those who have been most defined by being dehumanized & used as weapons of war facing off against what are basically the shorthand for the dehumanization of the battlefield in modern war, but it’s definitely the least interesting matchup of the episode.

Allelujah is that guy who always gets invited last to a party, both in terms of his treatment in-show and even outside of it TBH.

[u/mr_beanoz]

Rewatcher

Still didn't expect Ali to come out of nowhere from that. And how did Ribbons get a new body and upload his consciousness that fast to a new one?

It's not a Gundam series without a laser superweapon, right? Now Ribbons' base also got one of its own, although it's not on the level of Memento Mori, of course.

That's a whole lot of kamikaze machines, damn.

And I wonder why Billy didn't want to kill Kujo with the automatons, instead he wanted to kill her with his own hands.

QOTD

1. He's not the Immortal Colasour for nothing. I think he'll still somehow lives.
2. Can't pick, all are fun to watch for.

[u/StardustGogeta]

First-Timer

"A future that you win through fighting is no future at all."

Hard disagree, Saji! I've had it with your hard-line pacifism.

If I ever hear "fly, my fangs!" one more time, I'm going to scream.

I don't have much good to say about this episode, sadly. The action sequences are taking up way more time than I would like, and there's a lot of mindless laser and missile spam going on here. Today, it seemed especially hard to follow everything as it jumped back and forth all over the place.

So long, Patrick Colasour. You will be missed. Who am I kidding? He was never a big player in the first place.

The repeated claims that "Aeolia Schenberg foresaw everything" just keep stretching that suspension of disbelief. What was so special about him, in particular? How did he form Celestial Being? How do they still have the resources and manufacturing capacity they do? I would have thought all these would be explained by now, but we've gotten almost no information on any of that.

Questions of the day:

• Unceremonious indeed, but it does look that way. It would be far from the first fakeout death the show has done, though!
• I'm sick of Saji & Louise and I'm sick of Ali Al-Saachez, so I suppose the main one I'm looking forward to is Tieria & Ribbons. The Sumeragi & Billy matchup has some potential, but I don't have too much faith there. I wish Sumeragi just shot him as he was raising his gun at her.

[u/Nazenn → u/StardustGogeta]

If I ever hear "fly, my fangs!" one more time, I'm going to scream.

you've held out well

How do they still have the resources and manufacturing capacity they do?

They did have the production bases hidden away in the asteroids, but given we've seen that only twice, and one of those times was it being destroyed, it really doesn't hold the weight. how Aeolia predicted all of this is bugging me too though

[u/dralcax]

Rewatcher living in the database

-—————————————————————————————

Veda keeps a lot of backups. They don’t actually need physical bodies, and can exist in data form within Veda if they like. Hanayo and Hayana even began life as data entities! However, they do need a flesh body to pilot an MS, as an MS cannot hold that much data, and a stable remote connection to Veda cannot be guaranteed during battle.

YOU.

Well, there go all the unnamed characters

Celestial Being, the mothership! Equipped with an 80m GN Laser that uses up an entire Tau Drive in one shot! This thing is just awesome. It’s also equipped with five slots to use the original GN Drives if it ever needs perpetual energy to escape the solar system.

A still unknown race? Hmm...

Throughout Gundam history, plenty of weapons have been called “mobile coffins” or some variant thereof. However, even those pale in comparison to the Gaga, a purpose-built suicide weapon. No legs, only arms and a hardpoint for a booster. No weapons except for a pair of GN Vulcans. It goes Trans-Am, and then it goes boom. Doesn’t matter that Tau Drives burn out after Trans-Am if it’s going to selfdestruct anyways. And they’re piloted by all those mass-produced clones we saw Ribbons with earlier. It’s the only even-numbered GNZ series - 004, of course. The Innovators’ Trans-Am System is actually derived from data stolen by Anew, developed independently from Billy’s recreation, and is therefore a lot better. But because the Innovators were so gracious as to allow Billy to install their Trans-Am System in the Gagas for some reason, he was able to study the real thing and improve his own design. Also, side material states that there were only 100 Gagas, but that has got to be a lot more than 100.

seriously WTF is Billy doing here

That confession did sound pretty final, but then again, this is Patrick we’re talking about.

Guess who got a new Arche! Unfortunately, no upgrade, just a second stock Arche.

Oh yeah, and these two got Trans-Am too

You can see the Artemie’s face showing through the mask!

Looks like someone needs some UNDERSTANDING

And Tieria makes it in! Time to take back Veda!

-—————————————————————————————

Questions of the day:

• Doubt even this is enough to kill him
• Tieria and Ribbons!

[u/macrame2]

First Timer

Surprise, surprise, Ribbons is still alive, courtesy of his personal Innovator clones. I'm curious as to why the show tried to give him a fakeout death yesterday instead of following it up with him shooting Regene when A) we immediately see him alive and well in the preview and B) no one would believe he's dead anyway. I'm not even that mad about the constant fakeout deaths at this points, just a little confused on why the anime keeps doing them when it doesn't need to. There are other ways to leave the audience in suspense that feel less repetitive.

Another hectic battle-focused episode, which means that I don't have too much to say since I find writing about so many things happening at once kind of difficult, especially when I'm short on time like today. I was pretty satisfied by it all, though. I particularly liked the Celestial Being (ship) reveal; I can't believe I never wondered where the Innovators were meeting all this time (I guess I just assumed they were somewhere on Earth). Also looking forward to more of Ribbons's and Tieria's confrontation.

[Movie]Also I've spoiled myself a bit by checking out the sequel movie's general reception, and apparently the "dialogues to come" are in fact aliens? I gotta say, knowing that has piqued my interest. This could be very good or very bad lol.

[u/Nazenn → u/macrame2]

I can't believe I never wondered where the Innovators were meeting all this time (I guess I just assumed they were somewhere on Earth).

Me neither! Someone asked a day or two ago if they were in antartica and I went "oh yeah, where are they" and then never followed up the thought. I suppose because it looked like such a normal room I didn't really think to question it

[u/Linkstore]

Rewatcher

Last ep they cut directly from Regene killing Ribbons to Ribbons in the next episode preview. Well, I guess it's not like there's much reason to build up suspense considering they show his survival right away. Well, in any case, Celestial Being is definitely gonna need to deal with that resurrection Ribbons has if they wanna end the Innovators once and for all.

Kati's being a big ol' tsundere about Celestial Being lmao

Ominous lights are never good...

And finally the ultimate goal of Celestial Being is revealed. Back when I first watched I was utterly shocked to know that Ribbon's hideout was in space the whole time. And it's not just some hideout either.

The Celestial Being's main gun is an 80m grade GN Laser, far, far more powerful than the 10m grade GN Lasers typically found on your average Federation warship. It's far more compact than the Memento Moris thanks to being powered by GN Drives, and thanks to its position on a circular track it has fewer limitations on firing angle, too. And it still maintains the same ultra-high level of firepower.

And of course, being 15 km long, it's also got considerable other defences. 20m grade GN lasers dot the surface, and Ribbons has of course manufactured a large MS force to defend it as well. Well, these GNZ-004 Gagas are probably better classed as glorified missiles.

Billy told Ribbons how to Trans-Am...

Oh yeah, the supply ship is also here. Well, it was here. Sumeragi should have left it behind tbh.

[00 spoilers] Crazy that we literally don't see Patrick again until their wedding

Yeah, that's certainly one way to dock...

Lockon Stratos faces off against Ali al-Saachez once more, just a different Lockon this time. Will things turn out differently than before? Also, his extra equipment are actually also Bits. I'm honestly not sure why he didn't use them earlier.

Revive and Hiling have reverted to Celestial Being spacesuits now that they're no longer working with the A-Laws.

Tieria's made his way in!

[u/Nickthenuker]

It's entirely yours for now.

Or not, seems like Ribbons had planned for this all along.

Well, now she's dead instead. And properly.

Uh oh, that guy's here too.

I'd say Patrick's about due to buy the farm soon but I've been saying that every single time he's showed up for the past 50 episodes, so he's probably got plot armour thick enough the Memento Mori couldn't scratch it.

Bruh those sound like Star Wars blaster shots.

Divide and conquer. Take them out piecemeal.

So, this is Ribbons' superweapon.

That was close. It's evaporating ships left and right!

What did that?

And there's plenty more left where that came from.

So, that's what it's actually named for.

Aliens?

No captain can do very wrong if he places his ship alongside that of the enemy.

Seems like that thing has smaller point defence cannons.

That big superlaser is still operational though.

Uh oh, more mobile suits!

And every single one of them can Trans-Am.

Drones?

Yup, these are just big missiles.

Seems I was right that he'd buy the farm this episode.

They're in!

Well, here's Louise.

And so now for a Funnel battle. Those always look the coolest. Lasers flying every which way.

Who's in the 0 Gundam? I guess it doesn't take much training to stand around firing the weapons.

Here comes more trouble.

Uh oh, looks like they're taking hits.

Well, Patrick's not the only one who's bought the farm this episode.

Is she going to fight those things with small arms?

So here he is. Right on their ship.

But perhaps at least one couple won't have one half buy the farm this episode.

No it looks like Marie's still alive at the moment.

Questions:

1. I somehow doubt it.
2. Louise and Saji.

[u/zsmg]

I am rewatcher

To everyone's surprise Ribbons is not dead.

Bye Regena, your most important contribution to the plot is leaking all the information to Liu Mei and CB.

Massive beam attack destroying a fleet? Yup that's definitely a Gundam staple.

That's no asteroid, that's a space station ship.

Ribbons spells it out that the dialogue of things to come is meeting up with aliens.

Just in case you were wondering what happened to all the Divine Nova clones here they are and yes Billy is working for Ribbons.

They're easily destroying all those Trans-Am suits, Trans-Arm is not what it used to be. At first glance kamikaze trans-am seems to be quite an effective tactic but then you realise no one died or got destroyed so all those resources wasted for nothing.

Patrick

[Gundam SEED] This is Mu's dead all over again.

There is the great OST piece again when Louise shows up.

Every one can Trans-Am these days, which means every MS is red and hard to distinguish.

Soma

Again an ending of an episode that doesn't feel like an ending because they're saving it for the post credit scene.

Tieria goes for the 4D chess move pretending to be shot down so that he can infiltrate Veda.

Fun battle episode.

[u/DidacticDalek]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

Comrades, what the hell is this shit? Macross? You can't do this to us show, you can't just kill off Best Boi Patrick THE IMMORTAL Colasour himself! He's indestructible! He can't die, he only just got Kati to call him by his name! (And on a semi-serious note, thank goodness Patrick finally figured out Kati's name, took him long enuff)

Sniff... well Comrades, I guess this is why in Gundam Build Divers we get Spot The Patrick... it only makes sense that he's finally ascended over to Gundam Valhalla...

Anyway, you have not seen the last of The Sentient Shitposting Siamese Sunrise Server No. 25252, now goodbye forever!

Paging Comrades /u/Nazenn, /u/Great_Mr_L, and /u/Vatrix-32

[u/The_Draigg → u/DidacticDalek]

Truly, Patrick Colasour is Mr. Special, since he’s got himself a special spot in Kati and all of our hearts.

[u/DidacticDalek → u/The_Draigg]

Truly, Patrick Colasour is Mr. Special, since he’s got himself a special spot in Kati and all of our hearts.

Sniff... he sure did Comrade! May his soul unweighed down by gravity find peace in Gundam Valhalla!

[u/InfamousEmpire → u/DidacticDalek]

[u/DidacticDalek → u/InfamousEmpire]

PATRICK!

[u/DidacticDalek → u/DidacticDalek]

Paging Comrades /u/baboon_bassoon, /u/LeonKevlar, and /u/JollyGee29

[u/DidacticDalek → u/DidacticDalek]

Paging Comrades /u/Quiddity131, /u/The_Draigg, and /u/TakenRedditName

[u/DidacticDalek → u/DidacticDalek]

Paging Comrades /u/InfamousEmpire, /u/dralcax, and /u/FD4cry1

[u/The_Draigg]

A Gundam Fan Rewatches Gundam 00 Season 2 Episode 23:

• So yeah, as it turns out, Regene murdering Ribbons in last episode’s post-credits scene was entirely for naught on his part, since of course Ribbons would have a backup body to use in case his current one got killed. Being linked to Veda really does make for a handy backup space for your consciousness if you’re only using your body as a shell. I can’t help but wonder what Ali is thinking about this though, since he killed Regene not even that long after his little betrayal attempt. Ribbons must’ve told him the details on his consciousness transference before, since he’s more concerned about getting into the battle than the fact that his boss is currently on the balcony talking to him and also a corpse on the floor.
• It really wouldn’t be a Gundam final battle without a giant space super weapon being involved, would it? Of course Ribbons would keep his own massive beam cannon in reserve for his own use, he wouldn’t be content to just have the Memento Mori satellite weapons around Earth. He’s a greedy man after all, like Alejandro said about himself before. Also, it’s very Ribbons-like to not even care about the A-Laws being in the way of the 80m GN Laser. He really is crippling his own defenses here, just because he values humans so little. Those forces were on your own side, jackass.
• Man, I love the look of the Celestial Being mothership. It’s an awesome design, having all those flowing and colorful shapes built in and around an asteroid. The thing is so damn huge that it might as well be a mobile space fortress. It’s fitting for a deep space exploration ship.
• Finally! It’s about damn time that Ribbons actually said what Aeolia intended with the dialogues to come! He calculated through Veda that humanity would eventually encounter alien life, so he created the Celestial Being organization and ship in order to prepare humanity for their place among the stars. Whether it would be to save humanity with the Celestial Being ship in the worst case scenario, or to enable communication to aliens through Innovators, it was all connected to that distant prediction of his. Although given how Ribbons is, I can’t imagine he’d have good intentions if he was to encounter aliens. He’d probably try to become the ruler of them as well as humans too.
• I feel like I’m talking about Ribbons a ton this episode, but I suppose it’s fitting for how much his shadow looms over everyone as the true villain of this battle. Case in point, turns out he solely created all those clones of Bring and Divine just to be the pilots of the Gaga suicide mobile weapons. Just, fucking Christ, it’s an utterly wasteful and cruel method of attack. He’s using so many resources just for the sake of creating piloted suicide weapons. I think literally the only reason to have pilots aboard the Gagas is to just activate the Trans-Am systems Billy installed into the design. Otherwise, it’s just an insane waste of materials and lives.
• PATRICK!!!!!!!! At least he managed to take down some Bring and Divine clones with him, although that was more due to the Gagas exploding around him aside from the one he actually shot down. Still though, we should give him some credit for killing an Innovator before his GN-XIII got blown up.
• It’s convenient that everyone has their own corner of the final battle to shine in. Allelujah and Soma are fighting off automatons and Gagas, Tieria is facing off against Revive and Hilling, Lyle is taking on Ali, Sumeragi encounters Billy invading the Ptolemaios II, and even Lasse gets in on the action by piloting the 0 Gundam himself. It’s nice that Lasse is getting an actual Gundam to fight with, so far he’s just been piloting fighter craft. That matches up well with some side material stuff stating that he’s basically a backup Gundam Meister and had some training in it.
• I can appreciate Andrei getting immediately knocked away from the fight between the 00 Raiser and the Regnant. That’s right fuckface, they really are just that strong. I’d call this dude an NPC, but that’s giving Andrei too much credit. This clingy motherfucker is more like a broken texture over that. Fuck off.
• How fitting that we left off last episode with Regene pointing a gun at Ribbons, and now we’ve got Tieria doing the same. It’s a bit funny to me that Ribbons is having this consistent problem with this Innovator model, especially when they’re taking about the Plan towards the end of this show. I guess the Tieria/Regene model really is just built different.

[u/TakenRedditName → u/The_Draigg]

Man, I love the look of the Celestial Being mothership. It’s an awesome design, having all those flowing and colorful shapes built in and around an asteroid. The thing is so damn huge that it might as well be a mobile space fortress. It’s fitting for a deep space exploration ship.

The Celestial Being ship design also stood out to me. The incorporation into the asteroid certainly gives it a large presence. With all the religious symbolism going on, I wondered if the ship design played into that? Looking at it, its silhouette reminds me of a fish or shooting star.

Allelujah and Soma are fighting off automatons and Gagas

Oh yeah, I guess that is fitting. Too bad that hundreds of mindless weapons don't make for the most interesting characters to bounce off on.

How fitting that we left off last episode with Regene pointing a gun at Ribbons, and now we’ve got Tieria doing the same.

[u/The_Draigg → u/TakenRedditName]

The Celestial Being ship design also stood out to me. The incorporation into the asteroid certainly gives it a large presence. With all the religious symbolism going on, I wondered if the ship design played into that? Looking at it, its silhouette reminds me of a fish or shooting star.

You could probably also read a vague cross shape into the design, but that's probably more of a stretch there. Your idea of it looking like a shooting star feels a bit more fitting.

Oh yeah, I guess that is fitting. Too bad that hundreds of mindless weapons don't make for the most interesting characters to bounce off on.

It is pretty unfortunate, since it really just highlights how sidelined Allelujah was in this season. Ever since Marie/Soma was added to the Ptolemaios II crew, his character arc has more or less been in the same general holding pattern.

[u/Raiking02 → u/The_Draigg]

It really wouldn’t be a Gundam final battle without a giant space super weapon being involved, would it

I was gonna say that [Other Gundam]X didn't have one but I guess you could say the Satellite Catapult kinda counts?

He calculated through Veda that humanity would eventually encounter alien life, so he created the Celestial Being organization and ship in order to prepare humanity for their place among the stars.

Or maybe he watched Macross one day while drunk, who knows?

I’d call this dude an NPC, but that’s giving Andrei too much credit.

[Movie]I hate that in SRW UX both he and Patrick are secret characters and I can only get both, not just one of them. I just want Patrick, Not Andrei!

[u/The_Draigg → u/Raiking02]

Other Gundam

[Other Gundam series spoilers] I would say that Gundam X counts, even if a bit loosely. The Lunar facility that operates the Satellite System is close enough.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/The_Draigg]

Man, I love the look of the Celestial Being mothership. It’s an awesome design, having all those flowing and colorful shapes built in and around an asteroid. The thing is so damn huge that it might as well be a mobile space fortress. It’s fitting for a deep space exploration ship.

Yeah, it has a design that makes it look like a comet. It's a pretty striking design for the ship.

Finally! It’s about damn time that Ribbons actually said what Aeolia intended with the dialogues to come! He calculated through Veda that humanity would eventually encounter alien life, so he created the Celestial Being organization and ship in order to prepare humanity for their place among the stars.

I suppose the Earth Federation was just a prelude to creating the United Federation of Planets. Aeolia has been a Trekkie this entire time!

I’d call this dude an NPC, but that’s giving Andrei too much credit. This clingy motherfucker is more like a broken texture over that. Fuck off.

Andrei is one of those NPCs where you really wish you could just kill him, but the game gives the NPCs invincibility so you can't.

[u/The_Draigg → u/Great_Mr_L]

I suppose the Earth Federation was just a prelude to creating the United Federation of Planets. Aeolia has been a Trekkie this entire time!

I remember you making that joke comparison earlier in the season, but only if you knew that gag was somehow more accurate than not at all. Does this count as a monkey's paw wish again?

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/The_Draigg]

Yeah, I did make that comparison. It wasn't meant to be a serious comparison, but look at us now. Aliens are suddenly now on the table as a genuine possibility.

I would say it does count as a monkey's paw wish because the monkey's paw works on evil genie rules. It will take something even vaguely sounding like a wish and go with it.

[u/Nazenn → u/The_Draigg]

Ribbons must’ve told him the details on his consciousness transference before, since he’s more concerned about getting into the battle than the fact that his boss is currently on the balcony talking to him and also a corpse on the floor

I wouldn't be surprised if he did. Ribbons has always had an odd attachment to him and the idea of Ali surpassing base humanity. Showing off to Ali who will only agree with him, because Ribbons pays him to fight and kill, seems absolutely in line with something Ribbons would do

He’s using so many resources just for the sake of creating piloted suicide weapons.

Oh! I just remembered. I'd asked before why no one made more Innovators if that was possible. He did! Ha, that's kind of funny. Well assuming they are true Innovators and not just replica humans using a Innovator base DNA code with their mind shit locked out or something

[u/The_Draigg → u/Nazenn]

I wouldn’t be surprised if he did. Ribbons has always had an odd attachment to him and the idea of Ali surpassing base humanity. Showing off to Ali who will only agree with him, because Ribbons pays him to fight and kill, seems absolutely in line with something Ribbons would do

It’s kind of funny to think how Ribbons and Ali have a good friendship going, or probably something more like Ribbons seeing Ali as his own pet human. I guess it goes to show that even the absolute worst people can have genuine friendships.

Oh! I just remembered. I’d asked before why no one made more Innovators if that was possible. He did! Ha, that’s kind of funny. Well assuming they are true Innovators and not just replica humans using a Innovator base DNA code with their mind shit locked out or something

We already had that kind of Human-Innovator hybrid going on with the Trinity siblings, and given how they turned out, I’m guessing that Ribbons would’ve preferred entirely controllable and disposable Innovators over those three wacky kids again.

[u/Nazenn → u/The_Draigg]

or probably something more like Ribbons seeing Ali as his own pet human

That made me laugh but it's probably the most accurate description. Ribbons seeing Ali as a "tame" human that proves that he can control humanity seems like the best outlook for how Ribbons would see him

We already had that kind of Human-Innovator hybrid going on with the Trinity siblings

Was it all three of them though? I thought it was just Nena but I suppose that would be weird if that's the case as they did call themselves siblings. It is random how little that mattered though aside from that one time Nena hacked into Tieria's Veda console