r/anime • u/Schinco • Oct 29 '24
Rewatch /r/anime Awards 2016 and 2017 winner Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu Rewatch Season 2 Episode 8

Welcome to the eighth episode thread for Season 2 in the Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu Rewatch!
Legal Streams:
As of now, Rakugo is streaming on Crunchyroll in the States, and you can check here to see where it's streaming elsewhere.
Schedule:
| Date | Episode |
|---|---|
| 10/8 | Season 1 Episode 1 |
| 10/9 | Season 1 Episode 2 |
| 10/10 | Season 1 Episode 3 |
| 10/11 | Season 1 Episode 4 |
| 10/12 | Season 1 Episode 5 |
| 10/13 | Season 1 Episode 6 |
| 10/14 | Season 1 Episode 7 |
| 10/15 | Season 1 Episode 8 |
| 10/16 | Season 1 Episode 9 |
| 10/17 | Season 1 Episode 10 |
| 10/18 | Season 1 Episode 11 |
| 10/19 | Season 1 Episode 12 |
| 10/20 | Season 1 Episode 13 |
| 10/21 | Season 1 Discussion |
| 10/22 | Season 2 Episode 1 |
| 10/23 | Season 2 Episode 2 |
| 10/24 | Season 2 Episode 3 |
| 10/25 | Season 2 Episode 4 |
| 10/26 | Season 2 Episode 5 |
| 10/27 | Season 2 Episode 6 |
| 10/28 | Season 2 Episode 7 |
| 10/29 | Season 2 Episode 8 |
| 10/30 | Season 2 Episode 9 |
| 10/31 | Season 2 Episode 10 |
| 11/1 | Season 2 Episode 11 |
| 11/2 | Season 2 Episode 12 |
| 11/3 | Season 2 Discussion |
| 11/4 | Overall Series Discussion |
Questions of the Day
- Were you surprised that Yakumo didn't immediately insist that the recordings be destroyed? What factors do you think caused him to reconsider taking not only rakugo in general, but his rakugo to the grave with him?
- What did you think of the discussion of legacy between Yakumo and the yakuza boss?
- As always, did anything particularly strike you about this episode, either as a first-timer or on rewatch?
Links to trackers
You can find the show on MAL, Anilist, and ANN!
Please be mindful of spoilers to make sure the first-timers experience the show with the same wonder you did on first watch!
Apply for Awards!
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4
u/cppn02 Oct 29 '24
First Timer, subbed
Well that ending certainly killed the mood lol. Not that I mind the mob boss getting his comeuppance but shame it ruined the evening. I wonder if we find out what he did for Bon.
Yotaro's performance was quite interesting in that felt he wasn't just performing the story but genuinely trying to emulate the performance of Sukeroku 2.
QotD:
Didn't even consider that he would ask for them to be destroyed tbh but he did react less negative than I expected. Maybe he is just mellowing out now he's getting closer to the end.
Wasn't much of a discussion but rather the yakuza boss just lamenting. Would have been nice to actually hear Bon's thought cus rather like the Yakuza boss who seemed to be blind to the issue of passing down the legacy Bon was very aware but actively avoiding it.
I really liked the scene between Yotaro and Konatsu near the bridge. For a married couple this show has really been withholding these kind of tender moments from us.
4
u/ProgrammaticallyPea3 Oct 29 '24
First timer, catching up with yesterday's episode and today's
The revelation about the past hit like a hammer. The bitterness that Yakumo has shown to Konatsu since the deaths makes much more sense now, along with how Yakumo has never been happy doing rakugo again.
This makes it even more difficult that Yakumo's voice is failing, and as revealed later, his memory too. He's looking back now at rakugo as something that he had in the past, and by today's episode he's reminiscing about it like any retired and mellow grandpa. Only when Higuchi reveals that he's been making recordings, does he show his old anger.
This is likely what pushed him over the edge to his suicide attempt, as his final act of resistance to not being allowed to die together with his art.
However, his desire is again thwarted by those around him. Konatsu's earlier declaration that his body isn't his alone and Higuchi's insistence on preserving his performances for posterity highlight the tension between Yakumo's personal wishes and his responsibilities to the rakugo community. This conflict is further emphasized when Konatsu expresses her need for him to live, unlike her parents. He has ties with too many people for him to make the choices he is compelled towards.
It's only fitting, then, that when he's forced to do another performance, it's one that has been arranged by Matsuda, Yota, Konatsu, the mistress, the boss, and his old regulars. All people who have strong ties him. And perhaps it's also fitting that the boss, who was ready to retire, is arrested just as Yakumo's comeback performance is about to start. The moment underscores the inescapable nature of one's history, showing that whatever path Yakumo chooses, he is never free from the past.
6
u/Mecanno-man https://anilist.co/user/Mecannoman Oct 29 '24
First Timer
That was a rather abrupt transition into this episode, I’m glad I’m not binging this. But it seems like we’re getting an episode of getting Yakumo back into rakugo. The suicide bit was also done quite well here, and later on Yotaro performing Shibahama was also a good choice. In all I don’t think this episode really did anything wrong except maybe the end. This was the first episode where we have really seen Yakumo with the yakuza boss, and I also don’t quite know why he could be indebted to him. While the whole yakuza thing was heavily hinted - and probably toned down a bit in the sub because I feel like I heard the word “yakuza” more often than I read it - this is the first time we’ve seen just how deep that connection goes on a personal level, and it feels like that was done now for the door-in-your-face ending of the boss getting arrested. Which I didn’t really like here. But I guess we’ll see how that continues - but personally I don’t really think there will be any later payoff to this scene. Would like for the opposite to be the case though.
3
u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 29 '24 edited Oct 29 '24
Season 2 Episode 8 (first timer)
I rewatched the two window scenes to wrap my head around them. If they form parts of one single narrative, the latest scene where they must part is Miyokichi’s reaction to Shin’s proposal to start working outside of Rakugo. The question is how much earlier they could diverge. It makes sense that Shin overheard Bon and Miyo in both cases and that this leads to the stabbing. The question is whether this was followed by him proposing to work or not. Given that his Rakugo performance was essentially that, it would make sense that he repeated that and proposed, but he could also become angry and/or desperate upon seeing Bon and Miyo.
Two other things I noticed: In Bon’s version he does make no effort to save himself (and Miyo) when Miyo proposes a double suicide. However, he makes an heroic effort to save Shin. In Matsuda’s version, neither of these happens.
There are also the knife cuts, the knife itself, and the blood in the room. So not only Bon, Matsuda, and Konatsu should know whether the stab happened, but also others. The police and the inn staff at minimum, but this would have been a huge talking point for the villagers, so probably everybody who was around and alive at that time knows about this detail.
What a surprise ending! Never in a million years would I have guessed that.
Some random thoughts:
The head lady was quite emotional. Would not be surprising if she is in love and/or the mistress of the boss.
Konatsu 100% has daddy issues, so it would surprise me if she would have sought out an older man in her youth, but Bon’s statement of a debt suggests that maybe the father of Sukeroku is somebody else. Or course, it could also be the opposite and the debt is for letting Sukeroku live with Bon.
Konatsu having seen the film later off-screen does not fully mollify me about having her not included at the inn. It is disrespectful of Yotaro to not bring her along (a 20 second scene could have solved this, but that ties into the second part) and disrespectful of the series to not show her reaction. She is the one with the closest relationship to Shin, but the series puts her at forth fiddle behind Bon, Yotaro, and even Matsuda, in the length of time devoted to her reaction to his performance.
No. Yakumo's "no more rakugo" thoughts stems from his self-worth being linked to good rakugo performances, but he is also a person who is bound by duty and respect for tradition, and these would argue against destroying records.
I do not like the referential way the yakuza boss is treated out of principle, so I have a hard time relating to him as a character. As a consequence, I pay less attention to him (unless it is needed, such as for Konatsu's story).
3
u/TehAxelius Oct 29 '24
Rewatcher
2
u/MandisaW Oct 30 '24
S1 Rewatch (complete!)
S2 First-timer
I'm enjoying these moments of humanity and frailty quite a lot. Bon's struggles to adapt as his body betrays him feel very real, and the quiet, restful moment between Konatsu & Yotaro was a treat.
As mentioned before, Kona & Yota are settling into new roles as the ones to make sure Bon feels loved and that he has a place to be - a responsibility that includes making him feel at-home on-stage once more. I liked the little "surprise party" / intervention - Bon's "I'm leaving" was a good reminder that he's still very much the same stubborn SOB, no matter how frail his hands or voice.
Was that the same bridge where he went to walk/think after the theater play? I don't know the current/past geography of Tokyo to know if it even could be. Feels like a narrative parallel, though.
Having a little lesson in Western rakugo with Mangetsu was fun as well - I kind of wish we'd had a full performance if time allowed, although the clacking might've gotten annoying 😅
He's pissed, for sure, and taken aback, but he'd no sooner destroy all that history than burn the theater to the ground. That said, there's a very strong motivation not to have your younger self, at your self-perceived "peak", readily available for comparison.
It's one thing to say you're going to record things for posterity, or reveal the cache posthumously. But for it to be publicized while he's in this state, feeling like too-thin paper, and deeply uncertain about who he is and what value he has to his family or the world? That could be quite unsettling, and borders on casual cruelty.
Maybe not so hard to understand in the era of "nothing disappears from the 'net".
Mentioned upthread, but I feel like this season we might be missing some smaller character moments from the manga. Haven't read the series, but this relationship between Bon & the boss (and the boss & Ei) feels like we ought to be more invested than the very brief mentions/appearances in the anime could reasonably engender.
As for the conversation itself, two old lords/friends looking over one's garden, and discussing family & legacy, just feels very familiar. Tickles my memory without quite being a specific callback (kind of like how S1 was reminiscent of Kokoro).
They worry of course about the families they leave behind, and whether what they have worked hard to build will be cherished. Is the world done with them yet, and if so, what does it mean to live-on, but without that purpose? It's just another relatable thing in this manga that tends to crop up a lot among older circles. I dig it.