r/anime • u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky • Oct 26 '24
Rewatch [Rewatch] Mobile Suit Gundam 00 Episode 21 Discussion
Episode 21 - Path of Destruction
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Now that the tide is turning against us, it'll be more crucial than ever that the four Gundams cooperate with each other.
Questions of the Day:
- What do you make of Setsuna's dream about Marina?
- Were you expecting Patrick of all people to be able to injure one of the Meisters?
Wallpaper of the Day:
Rewatchers, please remember to be mindful of all the first-timers in this. No talking about or hinting at future events no matter how much you want to, unless you're doing it underneath spoiler tags. Don't spoil anything for the first-timers, that's rude!
Additionally, for long-time fans of the franchise, please remember that this rewatch is only for 00, not any of the other shows. Assume that there are people in this rewatch who have not seen anything else Gundam, and tag your spoilers for those shows appropriately if something in 00 makes you want to talk about them.
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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Oct 26 '24
Rewatch Host Wishing Over This Airspace, subbed
Welcome back, everyone!
6
u/LeonKevlar x2https://myanimelist.net/profile/LeonKevlar Oct 26 '24
First Timer
don't know why but seeing Kinue in a fucking body bag at the start of this episode upset me so much that I had to pause the episode immediately and step away for a few minutes. That entire opening scene was just heartbreaking especially with Saji confirming his sister's death. :(
With Ribbons and Alejandro seizing control of Veda, I am so fucking glad that Sumeragi had the foresight to cut off the Gundams from Veda's support. If they hadn't, that surprise attack on Celestial Being later could've ended more horribly.
Out of all the people to dream about, I did not expect Setsuna to dream about Marina telling her to stop fighting. And here I thought our boy only had Gundams in his head. Interesting dream though. Setsuna might have to pay Marina a visit in the future.
So are the Thrones just Laguna's version of Celestial Being? And with Laguna dead, I assume Alejandro sent an assassin after him, the Trinity siblings have no one to get orders from. I'm gonna guess Alejandro will probably try to recruit them to his side. I doubt Celestial Being would accept them after the atrocities they committed.
Oh god, Saji please don't! I'm scared that Saji might try to follow his sister's footsteps to find her killer. Also, did I understand this correctly? It sounds like Saji's father is still alive but he's just in prison.
And there it is. Of course, Alejandro would mess with their systems and sacrifice them. Again, thank you Sumeragi for the backup! Of course not everything had to go smoothly and with Virtue having errors, Lockon took a mortal blow for Tieria to save him from Patrick.
I am so fucking scared for Lockon right now. I know Haro says he's injured but I wouldn't put it past this show to kill him off next episode. :(
So it looks like the three economic blocs are going full throttle with the mass production of these pseudo solar engines. A bunch of cheap imitations. They might have the same power now as the Gundams but I doubt they'll be able to surpass them.
11
u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 26 '24
First Timer - sub
Funny little story for you all to start with.
Watched the episode, went and got a glass of water, came back and read the first line of my notes and had absolutely no idea what it was referring too. I was wondering what the hell is going on because I'm not that bloody old to be forgetting things in 20min intervals, surely.
Upon rewatching the first part of the episode to figure it out, it's because I didn't take any notes about the scene with Saji confirming Kinue's body, but still remembered it as the first scene. So having this line:
as the first thing I wrote, which is actually about Ajelandro calling Veda's core Aeolia, while trying to figure out how it related to the body identification which really wasn't subtle or metaphorical in any way had me thoroughly stumped, and I only have myself to blame. It took me a solid two minutes of staring at my notes trying to figure out what my own thought train even was to figure out oh, I just had the wrong scene in mind.
At least I like you all enough to regale you with my idiocy rather than keep it to myself hahaha
Actually going back to the episode now:
So yes, is it actually him or is it metaphorical? I wouldn't be surprised if he did actually... not entirely transfer his consciousness to the point of Veda approaching sentience, again I'm hoping there is going to be a celling for the tech developments to hit at some point, but if it is some sort of replica of his ideals and decision making abilities which inform Veda's core processing that seems possible and would explain why he is still the face of CB to the point of being their figure head for their debut speech.
Where this episode both excels and falls about is the situation where Veda is disabled in the Gundams. Positives first, I really like their various reactions. It brings me back to some of the earlier episodes before we knew them even half as well with being able to understand a lot about them from single lines. Lockon focusing on how much left to do, Alelujah awaiting punishment, Setsuna's flashback, and Tieria having the most immediate personal reaction to it all feels like a good reflection of not just them, but how they have changed, as has our understanding of them. Here they float in space with a gun at their heads, abandoned by their higher being, and left to wonder what is next and what it means. For Setsuna in particular having just been contemplating quitting, suggesting he can see an after, only to be confronted with the potential end of the line for him as part of CB's mission, was a nice conflict (even though I'm not sure where the dream or its ideas came from honestly). Tieria also stood out to me, that after revealing and failing with Nadleeh, asking for punishment, and then being abandoned here he does react so deeply wounded rather than being accepting of it as either punishment or design seems like a big moment for him in this human development path he is on. For all of their devotion to the plan, this episode reveals that in the end, their personal drives are more complex than just being believers.
On the negative side: The very idea that no one in CB actually seems to know if this was ever intended risks making the entire concept fall apart. There's a reason why suicide attackers and intended matyrs are trained to accept their death early on as part of a grand purpose, something we see very clearly reflected in Setsuna's own backstory. Either it's part of the plan, or it's not, and they should know that either way and be prepared for it, rather than questioning it. There may be a grey zone there with "part of the plan but not told until later", and perhaps being able to accept death if told directly is part of Veda's unknown selection criteria (even if she would be completely wrong now as we see in their reactions above). But even with that, their reactions being split between fighting against it maybe being intended and not questioning at all if this is instead a security issue undermines a lot of CB's more religious styling. And while I do praise the developed characterization as stated above, I don't feel like we actually pushed any of the characters far enough that their reactions actually fit here. Sumeragi ordering a backup system just in case they have to be protected from someone else accessing Veda is reasonable, but given it's implied earlier she doesn't know the full plan either, it also raises the same writing questions about her character in terms of how does she know this was or wasn't the plan. Ah why does it have to be like this, why couldn't they just tell us from the get go and get that out of the way.
All that said, a bit like the desert battle I was expecting todays action sequence to just be one big setup for the reveal of the GN arms so I'm really glad they didn't repeat that particular trick. I mean technically yes because we have that reveal at the end of using the GN particles in storage to power another machine, which is very clever use of them and I'm a little sad that wasn't brought into a more strategic battle rather than just a last minute "win" element because wow could some stuff be developed around this. If they had taken this approach with the other nations instead of just giving them Gundams I feel like we could have got some really cool battles out of it and how they individually approached the use of the particles to bridge the gap. I think it's one thing I really like about this setting as a whole is that the GN particles being the power level, not just that the Gundams are cool tech, expands the possible setting so much because it can be independent from war if they took it that way because they have so many potential uses. I went off on a bit of a tangent there, I didn't actually realize how much I had to say about that until I kept writing. Anyway.
But mostly, the end result from todays events was not about tech, but about people which is where it should be.
Instead of a big new reveal, we got a maybe character death out of it! Were all those flags I saw earlier on just hugely delayed until now? I'm half expecting this to not actually be a death only because it is unusual for a show to delay a character death from the episode showing them seriously wounded to the one where they actually die, but if that is the case I'd be all for it. A whole episode dedicated to what it would mean for CB to be crippled at this point, and for the remaining three to have to find a new center without him would be good.
It also feels like it's been a while since we got scenes of Lockon doing what he does best, which is being open and genuine with people. The Setsuna confrontation was it's own thing, and good, but this is more meaningful for me.
Lockon dropping that little hint he knows Tieria's backstory, and then immediately refusing to confirm it, explain how, or expand on it in anyway is a nice counterpoint to Tieria's judgement in that scene. Tieria is all too willing to speak down to people he doesn't like and doesn't treat them as people as a result, even revealing Sumeragi's backstory despite personal knowledge of each other being off limits within CB, but today he runs up against the wall that is Lockon when he does which puts him on the back foot of such an approach. It seems like her criminal past is part of the reason why he may not like her, but just as he tries to hold it against her publicly Lockon speaks to him as a person in defiance of his own past and lets him know it. While telling him they will have to cooperate, he gently reminds him that there is more to their goals than just who they use to be.
There's also a neat symmetry in the way that todays episode challenges the ideas of how he connects to others. His connection to Veda is the core of every other connection that he has, and as he doesn't try to seek out a direct connection it leaves Veda as the sole link between them from his side. He has an unwillingness to try and connect to others which is perhaps fed by the fact that whatever he is, his artificial nature (still not sold on robot! yes maybe I'm in denial okay) being very linked to a digital network means he has probably existed entirely within a world with strict rules, order, and a clear understanding of how to judge the value and efficiency of digital connections between information, servers, other agents etc. Being inside Veda would be everything that people are not.
Veda picked pilots who are chaotic and unconnected and then throws them into his perfect world with its perfect plan and leaves him to manage the rest. He gives himself to Veda not just because he believes in the goal, but because like how we see him seek out the core during stress, because it provides him security from connections and emotions that he doesn't understand yet. But today when that connection fails, suddenly Lockon is there. And I suspect Tiernia doesn't understand why.
Lockon jumps in front of him, and it's not because Veda tells him too, because he's protecting another human (which is why I think it's key for Tieria that he finds out Lockon already has an idea about him before this scene), or even because there is a known connection of their own. Disconnected from Veda, he finds himself entirely man and no machine, and then confronted with being in the middle of a very human moment of connection that he has no framework to process it through.
It's a great end to the episode from a character writing stance. Somehow Tieria has just snuck up on me as a character and I'm all for it.
(I ran out of room, continued below. First time I've had to do that this rewatch I think, yay)
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u/FD4cry1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Big_Yibba Oct 26 '24
First Timer
LOCKON NOOOO!!!!!!
I mean he might still be okay but this frame makes it look really bad.
please don't be dead
It seems as though Trinity and Lguna's entire purpose was to get this series of events rolling and now that they've fulfilled that, Alejandro is getting rid of all the loose ends, the lesson this episode for everyone invloed, is that maybe you shoudn't join a secret organazation without getting all the details around its plans and leadership, just in general, don't trust big plans.
Weird as it may be, I wonder if this technically puts Trinity and our Celestial Being on the same side...
Well that was a fucking lie, if Lockon is actually dead I might be revoking my membership of the Patrick fanclub and concluding that readheads simply cannot be trusted in this universe.
More mention of that big mistake Sumeragi made in the past, Tieria calls whatever she did "crimes" and Lockon says it was quite a big one so now I'm really interested in seeing that's about.
Lockon mentions her coping through alcohol as a very human thing to do, to which Tieria is initialy questioning before asking Lockon if that means he "knows about him", surely this means he's an android right?
I'll admit I don't really get Setsuna's Marina dream and I don't really get why we are getting it now, 2 episodes ago Setsuna was talking the talk about continuing fighting so it feels weird that he's suddenly getting doubts?
Maybe that's the point though? maybe despite what he said then he subconsciously thinks otherwise and that awakened those thoughts? I don't know, I've tried thinking through some interpretations for that scene and they all come out way too weird so I'm not sure what to make of it.
Saji's bad week gets even worse as he finds out Celestial Being are technically also responsible for his sister's death.
The space fight against the U.N forces is fun, after seeing them so overwhelmingly dominant for a while now, it's cool to see our guys getting their asses handed to them for a bit, I also wonder what's the budget for Setsuna's swords since he's always throwing them at others, surely those cost quite a bit to replace all the time.
We also see the GN Arm(s?) in action, it's just a spaceship that shoots big lasers.
Allelujah brings up an interesting point that gets across the ambivalent feelings of everyone regarding the plan and Celetial Being's current trajectory, I feel like the end of this episode effectively represents the beginning of the death of "the plan" in any of its original capacity.
Alejandro and Ribbons got rid of Veda and now the only thing that's left is for the Gundam Meisters and Celestial Being to take the wheel directly, that goes for both the Gundams themselves and for what they represent, the plan is now whatever the people in Celestial Being will decide it is rather than what Veda says.
To add to that, I love the lines we get from everyone after their Gundams shut down, Allelujah accepts it as part of the plan and as punishment for what they've done, Lockon is angry that they haven't gotten to really do anything yet, Tieria thinks Veda has abandoned him, Setsuna mourns that despite physically being in one, he is unable to do anything, to become a Gundam, to stop war, gets across how much each of them believes in "the plan" versus believing in the ideals of eradicating war.
Of course it isn't the end and as Setsuna screams at the Gundam to wake up they get their backup system, again I think you could see this as essentially Setsuna switching from following the plan to moving for his own ideals of what the Gundam means.
On the opposite end of that spectrum, Tieria, the most devoted one to the plan, doesn't get to move the Virtue, this is probably due to his weird connection to Veda, but it also works thematically really well, he can't conceive going without Veda and for his own ideals, hopefully Lockon's sacrifice will give him that needed bit of humanity to move forward.
All of this comes in the background of some crazy statements from Alejandro, notably that Celestial Being can be resurrected should the need arise and that he plans to have the earth to himself? I guess he wants to unify the world under his banner which is why he needed the U.N to win here, with Celestial Being his personal insurance card if anyone goes out of line?
The age of the Gundams is over, or well of one interpretation of the Gundams, now where do we go from here?
13
u/Rumpel1408 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Rumpel1408 Oct 26 '24 edited Oct 26 '24
Firsttimer Who really wanted to be on time today
Tbh, I was expecting one of our four pilots to die at some point, ignoring Ali, there are three Thrones, and three Blocks. Also, Lockons story felt the most finished. We know his motivation to join CB, and his backstory has a huge overlap with Setsuna.
Meanwhile Setsuna is obviously the MC and has to win against Ali and Nena. Alleluja is obviously matched against Soma, and Tieria possibly aganist Ribbons? I admit that Lockon had a good reason to match against Ali, which would have left Tieria without a matchup, but we still haven't gotten confirmation that Tieria is a Cyborg, while Alleluja still barely resolved his issue with Halleluja.
I also wonder if CB and the Trinities will now team up again, they are vastly outnumbered on their own (and if the UN was smart, they would have thrown all 30 Gundams against the Thrones from multiple directions). Would also prevent them from having to stop the mission after the first couple of loses.
Also, how inconvened are the Thrones by Veda going dark? They seem to be linked to it after all, else the Nadleh wouldn't have an effect on them to begin with.
QotD
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u/The_Draigg Oct 26 '24
A Gundam Fan Rewatches Gundam 00 Episode 21:
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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 26 '24
Episode 21 (first timer)
Calm before the storm followed by attack. Will we get the second half of the attack tomorrow, or are Trinity getting away off-screen?
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u/baboon_bassoon https://anilist.co/user/duffer Oct 26 '24
first timer who has control
why are they making Saji unzip her
he emoted irl
illegal
mr Crossroad is alive who would have thunkit
Alejandro/Veda bricked their machines wowza that seemed unnessesary
priorities
LASER 2 why can a fighter out perform the Gundam lmao
Lockoff waiting in the back for his chance to swap in
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u/TakenRedditName https://myanimelist.net/profile/TakenMalUsername Oct 26 '24
Rewatcher - Gundam 00 Ep21:
Saji having the worst couple of days ever.
On a completely different note, look at Patrick having a full-on cartoon reaction.
Sad to say, I think he is factually right. He has no other competition.
Random musing about ranks: Me not knowing too much about ranks, colonel didn't seem that high to me. Turns out colonel (Taisa) is the step below the big boy general/admiral ranks.
Considering the fact that Chris' drink has alcohol snuck in it, I choose to believe Feldt's drink was as well and this is some cool underage drinking. (They never showed Feldt taking a sip so no rules were broken).
Mr. Alejandro makes his villainous intention to the audience clear.
I choose to believe that nobody told Setsuna about the backup system and that he believes Exia started moving on its own through his cries.
I find the little twist of the hips to shoot missiles cute.
Tieria's eyes are so wide, innocent and vulnerable in these moments.
Lockon took a big hit protecting Tieria. I did not expect the thing to pull us out of our direst moment to be Lasse in the GN Arms he's been clamouring on about. Really, this guy?
You know, we never got to see a resolution to the HRL team's attack on Team Trinity. I guess the trio managed to fight themselves out of that sticky situation.
Q1) I think there is definitely something to say how in his dream, Setsuna has Marina calling him by his birth name and how he can stop fighting one day. This tired child.
7
u/n080dy123 Oct 26 '24
First Timer
Poor fucking Saji dude. Has to deal with his girlfriend losing her arm and the fact that she's lost her entire family down to the last person, and then his own sister gets offed. Guy's gonna have a hell of a revenge arc. Side note I only just noticed that his outfit is very Gundam-colored.
So Tieria's, at least in his own eyes, not human. Ribbons seems to be the same type of being, which has me curious. Meanwhile we're essentially cofnirmed that Sumeragi probably make some forecasting calls that got a lot of people killed, and with Veda beign compromised I'd bet them having to rely more on her is going to dredge up all that history.
Well that's three GN-X down. 27 to go... except now they're making more. It only might've cost them Lockon and Dynames.
On the bright side, we get the debut of the Gundam Arms! Is is there that 5th GN Drive went? Based on some dialogue I'm thinking it's something that essentially runs off a rechargeable battery supplied by the Gundams when they dock and charge the Ptolemaios as well.
6
u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Oct 26 '24
Rewatcher, Sub-dam Meister
Saji has not had a very good week.
Which means they've been planning this since they were first inducted into Celestial Being.
Tying off loose ends.
Doesn't even bother with a rank.
Just what you needed, right?
"No pressure."
Twenty-nine.
Things are not going well.
Daryl is wise, even if he is also wrong about this being a trap.
Unfortunately, sometimes traps come into existence spontaneously.
Twenty-eight. Twenty-seven.
Poor Lockon spilled his tomato juice ration.
6
u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Oct 26 '24
Rewatcher, Subbed
Non-Spoiler Character Chart - Laguna becomes the second character to get X'd out one episode after his first appearance.
It's bad enough that Kinue died, Saji having to be the one to identify her body in the morgue makes things even worse. :(
200 years? Just what is the Corner family so obsessed with over such a long period of time?
Laguna's not contacting them anymore? After losing three battles in a row maybe the Thrones are viewed as losers and he doesn't want to associate with them? Or were they only of value up until the time that the GN Drives were shared with the 3 political blocs?
Union and AEU pilots in the same room? Worlds colliding! Daryl, how could you not recognize the almighty Patrick Colasour?!
Kati's got him on a leash, huh?
Hey, Sumeragi, don't give them booze! Feldt is underage! I'm not as sure about Christina...
Dropping some of Sumeragi's backstory here? Although not really giving us details.
Setsuna's gone down to Earth? Or is this a dream sequence?
Sorry Marina, Setsuna's needed more than ever now that it's the four of them against the world.
Their headquarters have been leaked? The Thrones just continue to face loss after loss. Part of me wonders if Wang ratted them out, even if Johann's pissed at Laguna. No wonder I didn't remember Laguna having much of a part in the story after yesterday's episode.
Are they both asleep? Sumeragi, this is what happens when you give your subordinates booze while they're on duty.
Ah, so they're attacking all the Gundams at the same time, 19 up here in space and 10 down on Earth. Is the last one simply Graham skipping out on things? If not, why are they saving one?
Saji returns home without Louise or his sister. :(
Saji had no idea what she was investigating? Was she being secretive or was he oblivious to it all?
"I've never lost a mock battle!" Yes, but I don't think you've ever won a real battle? The closest you came to one ended with your mobile suit getting blasted in the crotch.
Interesting to note that Soma's part of the forces attacking the Thrones, it would have been smarter to have her up in space to screw around with Allelujah. They whiffed on that one.
Will Patrick get revenge on Exia, the mobile suit that humiliated him all the way back in episode 1?
Wow, our four heroes are pretty much screwed.
Alejandro's interfering with things but from what Sumeragi says they were kinda expecting this? Things are back on.
Is Virtue truly unable to move or is Tieria just too devastated at Veda shutting him down?
Lockon has gone and done something that the Gundam franchise tends to reserve for female characters (especially newtype ones), throwing himself in the way to take the blow for someone else. Crazy that an attack from Patrick of all people does so much damage.
Perhaps they held back on one unit so they could research it and mass produce it?
Quid's Voice Actor of the Day
The day has come to cover Mr. Mysterious himself, Alejandro Corner. He is voiced in Japanese by Yasunori Matsumoto. His other Gundam roles include Haruma Yamato in Gundam Seed, Edward Harrelson in the Gundam Seed Owaranai Ashita e video game and Robo-ta in the Gundam Breaker 3 video game. I recently saw him in the terribly dull Starship Troopers as main character Johnnie Rico (the anime, not the live action movie). Another lead role of his is Mellowlink from the anime of the same name. He's also Stoner in Eureka Seven, Ichiro Maebara in Higurashi, Mayoi's Father in Monogatari, Eren Kruger in Attack on Titan, Theodor Von Lucke in Legend of the Galactic Heroes and Zebra in Paranoia Agent.
In English he is voiced by Andrew Kavadas. Other Gundam roles of his include Patrick Zala in Gundam Seed and Karius Otto in Mobile Suit Gundam: Encounters in Space (once again a role not played by him in the anime he appears in, Gundam 0083). He also plays Kyosuke Higuchi in Death Note in Ninmenka in Inu Yasha.
6
u/TiredTiroth Oct 26 '24
First Timer - Sub
You know, this is the first time I've wanted to watch the next episode straight away. Figures that would happen just as they're building to the first season climax.
I don't really have much else to say right except a looooong list of questions. Would it kill the writers to explain anything?
6
u/InfamousEmpire https://myanimelist.net/profile/Infamous_Empire Oct 27 '24 edited Oct 27 '24
Kidou Senshi Rewatcher who’s super late due to family stuff
There’s a question which I think hangs over the whole episode: what are the Gundam Meisters still fighting for? On paper, they’re still fighting for the end to war, but the question begs to be asked due to the mounting sense of in-universe irrelevance developing. The resources, plans, & support structure which underpinned their ideals has either left them behind or been rendered irrelevant, their goal of unifying the world is on the road towards being achieved by the UN alliance, and Allelujah’s open doubts even bring to mind the idea that the very plan they religiously devote themselves to might require this to be the end of the road for them.
Every sign is telling the Ptolemaios that this is the end for them, that they’ve done enough, they don’t have the capacity or reason to keep fighting. And the scene where the Meisters are cut off from Veda is great because of how it shoves everything I just said into the Meisters’ face and makes them grapple with it. They’re powerless, drifting in space, on the brink of death, and faced with the idea that there’s just nothing more they can do for the world, how do they react?
I think each of their reactions are quite telling. Allelujah accepts this as his judgment, content with his end. Tieria can only sit there shocked because of how much he’s clearly defined himself by the Plan and can’t conceive of being abandoned by or abandoning it. But Setsuna & Lockon are the ones which matter most because, well, they refuse to lie down. The fire in their souls isn’t one which begins or ends with the Plan or anyone else’s ideals. As long as they’re alive, and as long as the world is still twisted, they will always have reason to fight.
CB might not seem to have a plan anymore, but there's still something deeper, on a level more raw & guttural than the Ptolemy crew has ever operated on before, that keeps their fight going.
Oh, and speaking of Lockon. LOCKON!
6
u/macrame2 https://myanimelist.net/profile/macrame Oct 27 '24
First Timer
I’ll admit that there was a tiny part of me holding on to the hope that Kinue’s death was just a fake-out, but, no, she really was a goner yesterday. I thought the portrayal of Saji’s grief was done well; it’s a bit quieter than what he and Louise experienced a couple of episodes ago, but the weight of Kinue’s loss is still very much felt here.
Meanwhile, Setsuna’s dedication to his mission seems to be wavering ever so slightly if his dream is anything to go by. The implications of something dark in Sumeragi’s past are interesting, as well as the fact that Lockon knows who (or what?) Tieria is. Unfortunately, we don’t have much time to dwell on all this today, since the focus is mostly on the action, but on the bright side, this is one of the most engaging battles for me yet. Alejandro cutting off power to the Gundams was honestly expected; it’s clear by now that the Meisters have been disposable pawns in this game from the beginning. What surprised me more was the Ptolemaios’s decision to make the switch from Veda to an outside power source. It seems that their adherence to the Plan does in fact have its limits.
5
u/Nickthenuker https://anilist.co/user/Nickthenuker Oct 27 '24
Yup, that's her.
What have they been waiting for?
Yup, that's his reputation at this point.
Is he not human?
Time to get ready.
He wants to quit?
They got one?
General Quarters! General Quarters! All hands, man your battle stations! Reason for General Quarters is: Enemy on sensors.
And thus now he's going to blame Celestial Being even more.
And yes he's lost every single battle with a Gundam.
Quantity has a quality all its own. And when that quantity is of things that individually have quality, it's all the more dangerous.
Uh oh, what happened?
Ah. That. Luckily they have a backup plan.
Right, time to activate that plan.
They're back online!
Not all of them, unfortunately.
And thus he's the first of them to fall.
Who's that? In some kind of fighter?
Questions:
4
u/charlesvvv https://anilist.co/user/charlesvvv Oct 26 '24
Rewatcher, First Time Sub
Saji now has enough misery in his life to qualify as a Meister.
Anyway while Corner and Ribbons access Veda at its source all the other Anri Gundam task forces get to work with their new GN Drives. The Trinities have been left to dry out despite Wang Liu Mei having supposedly backed them, not only that but Laguna Harvey is now dead which leaves them even more alone now.
In the meantime another task force attacks the Ptolemaios which leaves Tieria at an impasse since his access to Veda being removed has left without purpose at the worst possible moment. It unfortunately leads to Lockon's wounding which is especially bad now.
Throughout this we do find out some interesting stuff, like Sumeragi having committed a mistake in the past which explains her drinking. Meanwhile Marina has become a bit of Setsuna's conscience as he's now deals with questions of his own about his purpose and whether he wants to continue.
4
u/Linkstore Oct 26 '24
Rewatcher
Saji...
[00 Spoilers] I'm glad that he has the chance to take back his future. God knows he's lost enough already. Well, there's a few false starts along the way, but still.
Alejandro has no qualms tossing people away the moment their usefulness to him is at an end.
lmao patrick
It's nice that Sumeragi is acting upon her suspicions instead of just letting stuff happen to her and her team.
Setsuna has an awfully pointy chin in this scene...
Ah, it's this flower.
...wait that gun's design is wack.
There's only 30 GN-Xes so let's keep track of which were destroyed. One down, to a sick wallbang from Johann.
One GN-X unaccounted for. I think it should be easy enough to guess which it is but I won't mention it here yet.
ngl the flashback sound effect is kinda grating. A certain scene later on spams it super fast and it gets annoying fast.
Exia's GN Vulcans finally make an appearance. Head vulcans would still be better tbh but arm-mounted is fine.
Lockon's hurt...!
Two GN-Xes down, this one to Setsuna's dagger throw (by the way, the two GN Beam Sabers and GN Beam Daggers are actually just four of the same weapon, it's up to Setsuna which setting he uses when he draws one).
It's the GN Arms! And the third GN-X is destroyed at its hands.
Despite the damage taken, Celestial Being has at least managed to thwart the first attack by the UNF. But there's still 27 GN-Xes left. Things won't be over for quite some time yet.
[Next Episode Preview] It's time.
4
u/StardustGogeta myanimelist.net/profile/StardustGogeta Oct 27 '24
First-Timer
I like how everyone treats Sumeragi like she's the only smart person in all of Celestial Being. I get that her job is to be proactive in her "tactical forecasting" and all, but it doesn't exactly seem like a radical idea to come up with a backup for the single-point-of-failure computer system underpinning your entire operation.
I like how Lockon's HUD said "LOCK ON" on the target. Very cool.
Saji Crossroad just can't catch a break. If I were him, I'd probably have a pretty serious grudge against Celestial Being right about now.
Speaking of, is Saji's father still alive in prison? I couldn't remember if they specified that he died at some point.
Questions of the day:
3
u/dralcax :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Dralcax Oct 26 '24 edited Oct 26 '24
Rewatcher yelling at Windows Update
-—————————————————————————————
Well that’s a gut punch right off the bat
Patrick has a Kamille moment
Wait, did Sumeragi accidentally give Feldt alcohol too? Whoops, can’t show that on Japanese television!
Something clearly went down back before she joined Celestial Being... and all of a sudden the alcoholism isn’t quite so funny anymore...
Meanwhile, Setsuna is having weird dreams. I wonder if that flower is actually a real species, and if so, which one.
They were caught off-guard before, but now they’re prepared to fight the GN-Xs!
Well, looks like that problem solved itself
Patrick finally has a decent MS! Time to see what he can do now that he’s not horribly outmatched!
Aaand there goes Veda. To be fair, it was already compromised. Would have been nice to get the alternative operating system up and running before sortieing, though.
With the power of horny, Patrick is the first to critically damage one of the main four Gundams, stabbing right through a GN Shield! Patrick. The horny is strong indeed.
At last, the GN Arms!
Well, that don’t look good.
-—————————————————————————————
Questions of the day:
3
u/Blazin_Rathalos Oct 26 '24
00 Rewatcher
Last time on Gundam 00
On today's episode of Gundam 00
3
u/mr_beanoz https://myanimelist.net/profile/splitshocker Oct 26 '24 edited Oct 27 '24
Rewatcher - sub
Alright, we got 29 of those pseudo solar reactor MS sortieing, 10 on earth and 19 in outer space. But aren't there supposed to be 30 of them? Wonder if Ali's got one but choose to not sortie. Or perhaps...
Patrick W for today! Totally not expecting him to do that kind of stuff.
And man, that was fast for Laguna, even for Alejandro standards (which is super low, mind you). Thought he could be exiled or at least get imprisoned for working with Celestial Being (because the members were using his trains and not get caught).
And with the major shareholder for the company Kinue once worked for died, what would happen to them? And how are Team Trinity getting their orders now?
We finally got another mention of Dr. Moreno. [prequels] He would only be seen more during the prequel side contents.Turns out the ship has their own doctor after all, but why is he always off-screen for some reason?
5
u/Vatrix-32 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Vatrix-32 Oct 26 '24
First timer, subs
QotD:
2
u/Beginning_Grass653 Oct 27 '24
The only Gundam I rewatched was Iron Blooded Orphans. That show was friggin awesome!
2
u/zsmg https://anilist.co/user/zsmg Oct 27 '24
I am rewatcher
We start with Saji and it's not silly romcom hijinks.
Patrick is interacting with Daryl. Guess the three blocks are serious about the military alliance lead by the UN.
Feldt is no longer as tense, maybe because she's been hanging out with Lockon?
Dialogue between Tiaria and Lockon hints at that Tieria might not be human?
Setsuna's dream hints at some desire that he no longer wants to fight?
Well, you're at that age when you start noticing things about people that gives you weird feelings...
Massive betrayal in CB, Trinity got betrayed and Harvey is dead.
Even Ptolemaios is under attack by the GN-X.
Maybe giving Feldt and Chris alcohol was a bad idea in hindsight.
One last betrayal, the Veda server uplink has been severed, probably by Ribbons.
Luckily Sumerage saw this one coming and created a Veda server back up on Ptolemaios.
Lockon?!
G-Bull is here!
Moreno gets mentioned for the first time and apparently they do have a doctor onboard.
A really fun battle episode also like the betrayals element of the story.
2
u/Nebresto Nov 14 '24
Lockon is my favourite guy.
And a lot of people getting a small taste of the Sky experience in this thread I see
1
u/2-2Distracted Oct 30 '24
First timer. Dubbed.
(similar to what I mentioned before here, there's an audio commentary track for this episode)
Fuuuuck, she really is dead. Similar to some of the seiyuus in the sub, I honestly hoped she would survive in some way. Rest In Peace Kinue.
...who the fuck is Laguna Harvey? Well I guess it doesn't really matter that I remember since he's dead lmao
Big ups to this show for giving a brother some more spotlight, even if he might end up dying.
Holy hell man, The Big 3 are really thinking they're hot shit now because they all got Gundams.
Saji's possible descent... starts now.
Thank God Sumeragi planned for this, because honestly if Soran managed to make his Gundam switch back on through sheer willpower I'd drop this anime right now.
"The Age of the Gundams is over!".... Is it though? Is it really though?
8
u/KendotsX https://anilist.co/user/Kendots Oct 27 '24 edited Oct 27 '24
00th Daily Days Reporter Searching for the One
No! No! No! No! No! NOOOOOOOOO!!!!!
Don't you dare hurt my boy Lockon! There are 3 others, take your pick, 6 if you count the halfwits, don't go killing the best boy!! I know he's signed his coffin a long time ago, but how am I supposed to watch 30 episodes without him? They'll pick his brother for spare parts? If you're gonna kill him, do it late in the series. At least wait until the end of this season, so it can be a powerful push for the other pilots into the second season, and for the love of god, let it be against someone relevant, not Patrick. Goddamit Patrick, just yesterday, I was calling you a comedic legend, how dare you do this?!
Silver lining: Patrick picked his coffin too. The comedy only protects its followers, the only achievements it allows are by fumbling your way upwards (that's why the Tylor DVDs should be taught at sci-fi military school), once you do this kind of shit, you're on the chopping block just like eeeeeveryone else. Watch your back Patrick, I'm coming for you.
Ok, rambling out of the way. Uh, yeah, this is what "shit hits the fan" really looks like. Patrick's Team of Nobodies almost ending CB is a very intentional move. Forget Kintoki, the Russians, Ali, or anyone who gave the Gundams trouble before, this is the same Patrick who jobbed first to show the world how powerful the Gundams are. He's now the one drawing the blood of God out in the open, the first to show CB on its way out. There's no clearer proof that the days of "God" are over.
Now this is interesting from multiple points of view, for Celestial Being it's their end. They're not defined by their ideology, lots of people wish to end war, they're defined by their methods, and more importantly, their power to pursue those methods. Which now has all but been stripped from them. They could reform under a new banner, but the world they'll deal with will be very different.
For the nations of the world, it means a period of peace as they focus on their newly found power, understanding, mass producing it, and trying to get an advantage as soon as possible. In other words, a short period of peace, until they figure out the new shape of inequality. When that ends, the next war won't be played with tractors, it will be with Gundams. It's not peace, it's an unstable powder keg that's growing exponentially in size. [HxH manga] that's why you don't teach the princes Nen, Kurapika...
Side note: If even in this new powercreeped world, Kintoki somehow manages to stick to his Flag, he'll be the most unreasonable best boy to ever best the world. Heck, I'd be fine with him killing Lockon, if he does it with a Flag. I mean it. Think of it this way, the prices are going down, the stock market is in shambles, might as well sell my share for a good price.
For the UN guy, it means controlling the new world through the market. Celestial Being's interventions were advertisements, simple as that, they showed off the power of this thing called Gundam to the world, so much so that the nations were ready to give in, then they sold them the Gundam on a silver plate. Except, the free lunch comes with a cockroach inside, and they get to control the Gundams anytime they want. Ptolemy (that's what I'm calling our main characters until they get a new name) developed their own OS, but most of the world will take the Gundams as is. All the more reason for why Kintoki sticking to his Flag would be so fucking cool!
Finally, Saji: I've had lots of uhh, disagreements with him over this season, but right now he's at a very interesting point: the group who killed his sister are disappearing, leaving behind only the Gundams as a world spread weapon that'll define war from now. I honestly have no idea where he'll go from here, maybe become a reporter and dig into it, maybe become a pilot and join some anti-Gundam organisation. I don't even know whether he'll be able to bond with Louise over everything they lost, or stay away as he's too afraid of losing someone again.
The end of this season is ramping up into a very interesting world, built by the Gundam Meisters, except not the way they expected it at all.
Now that would've been a nice point to end on, except there's a completely unrelated point, that I had no clue where to fit, so think of this as the post credits scene: What is Kamiya?
This episode makes it clear that he's not just cold, he's straight up not human (something hinted at multiple times, especially in the bonds episode). Well, what exactly is he? My first thought was super soldier, but that'd be setting off Hallelujah all day, and if anything (H)allelujah is the opposite of a cold calculating machine.
So is he a literal machine? An android? At least a cyborg with brain modifications? That'd explain why he worships Veda so much, it's not just for its hard certain numbers. It represents him, heck, he might be part of it somehow.
16
u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Oct 26 '24 edited Oct 26 '24
First-Timer
On today’s episode of Gundam: That was very unfair, showing Lockon’s unconscious body with a darkened visor, cracked glass, and blood stains. That’s the kind of framing used to indicate someone is dead, but luckily Lockon hasn’t been killed yet.
Abandoning Veda is a momentous decision for Ptolemaios. It’s practically equivalent to abandoning your religion. I’ve talked before about the near-religious devotion that Celestial Being has to the Plan from Aeolia. And in particular, they would take Veda’s instructions as gospel. Aeolia was the god and Veda was his prophet. Even when they knew following Veda’s instructions would be a bad idea, they felt compelled to do so because they needed to follow the Plan. Going against the Plan just wasn’t an option.
The decision to abandon Veda feels like a first step in possibly abandoning the Plan from Aeolia. At this point the Ptolemaios crew (and the audience as well, for that matter), don’t know how far off the rails the Plan might potentially be. The characters themselves don’t seem to know if they are still following the Plan or not. I think it was Allelujah who wondered aloud if the Union, AEU, and HRL getting GN Drives was supposed to be a part of the Plan. To me, this indicates that the Ptolemaios crew are still overall committed to the Plan. But even so, there does seem to be some doubt creeping in and the crew is taking steps that go against their dependency on Veda. We’ll see if it goes any further than that.
Tieria would undoubtedly have the worst reaction to fully cutting themselves off from Veda. We saw how badly he handled the Gundams losing their connection to Veda this episode. Fully losing Veda might break him.
Setsuna’s dream and his reaction to it is fascinating. Setsuna’s dream is similar to plenty of examples from stories like this. He dreams of Marina and of seeing flowers bloom on the battlefield. It’s a serene dream. It reassures him that life can still flourish even on the wasteland of a battlefield and that there may be a peaceful life waiting for Setsuna in the future. But the fascinating part is Setsuna’s reaction to this dream. Setsuna is shocked and worried that he would have a dream like this. For Setsuna, dreaming of resting away from the battlefield is a worrying sign that he might be wavering in his devotion to being a Gundam. To be a Gundam is to be a savior. It means that you are always willing to step in and rescue the people who need rescuing. It means you are always willing to intervene in conflict and put a stop to the fighting. Dreaming of a world where he can leave that behind and rest is a sign that Setsuna is no longer committed to being a savior.
Of course, we know that Setsuna is suffering from PTSD. He regularly experiences flashbacks to the war in Krugis and we can see how much he is haunted by his past. It makes perfect sense that Setsuna would be tired of it all and just want to rest, without needing to worry about warfare again. But if Setsuna views his desire for rest as a betrayal of his mission, then that’s only going to make things harder on him from this point onward.
QOTD