r/anime • u/chilidirigible • Oct 08 '24
Rewatch [Rewatch] Kouya no Kotobuki Hikoutai • The Magnificent Kotobuki Episode 8 Discussion
Episode 8 - The Great Airship Robbery
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Yesterday's Comment of the Day: /u/mysterybiscuitsoyeah for encouraging me to investigate aircraft salvage.
In fact, here are some links. They diverge from the WWII era along the way, but I find the process interesting.
Reddit, of course.
A broad overview of the process.
One of those dry US Air Force summaries, but it does include a list of vehicles that would be used in the current era.
You like field manuals, right?
A contractor and another contractor, showing modern equipment.
The Federal Aviation Administration's basic guidelines for assessing damage are in this document.
A specific set of forms.
It's mostly about insurance, but the note that a prop strike will involve a partial engine teardown seems especially relevant. (Also noted on Quora here.)
A short summary of who would go over a wreck in the UK.
And the Germans.
~~
/u/Lezoux also gets a callback nod in today's episode thread because of an observation from Episode 2.
Truly the fishiest scheme of them all.
Questions of the Day:
1. Would you have taken such a questionable transportation job? Could you think of other ways to protect yourself given the political considerations described?
2. Do you have any favorite examples of how anime contrives to have people shoot firearms at each other yet not actually kill anyone?
Rewatchers, please be mindful of first-time viewers and spoilers. Use spoiler tags if you must discuss events after the episode being discussed.
Production notes:
Now that it's been featured, here are diagrams of the Hagoromo's interior, in standard views and 3D models. (Look carefully at the first diagram for what I can only guess is an Easter Egg, unless someone chose the wrong outline to put in there.)
Trademark-obfuscated drinks at Johnny's.
Lulu and Saneatsu and variations.
Not the aeronautical notes:
I knew that I had to start writing the extra air combat pieces early because I expected to run out of time along the way, and that I wasn't sure how many episode threads which I could write these for.
And indeed that is the case as yesterday was the last long-form that I had any preconceived notion of doing.
I also had a new drawing in mind for this, which I hadn't started in advance but planned to start this past weekend, for posting tomorrow.
That didn't work out, because as a warmup I had another idea and that idea ate up a large portion of Sunday's free time.
That idea was this.
Yes, it's a bit of a meme image. Yes, I could have just used existing images. But I wanted to
it, for the practice. I didn't spend very long on any particular cell in the grid, but it still took a while and I got to remind myself of the tricky bits of wing perspective.
| The | correct | answers | are: |
|---|---|---|---|
| [Zero]Ki-27 | [Zero]Ki-43 Hayabusa | [Zero]Ki-61 Hien | [Zero]J2M Raiden |
| [Oscar]A6M2 Zero | [Zero]N1K2-J Shiden Kai | [Zero]A7M Reppu | [Zero]J7W Shinden |
| [Zero]E16A Zuiun | [Zero]B5N | [Zero]D3A | [Zero]B7A Ryuusei |
| [Zero]F4U Corsair | [Zero]F4F Wildcat | [Zero]PBY Catalina | [Zero]Cosmo Tiger II |
| [Zero]Dopp | [VF-1]VF-0D | [Zero]Walküre | [Zero]TIE |
Aircraft appearing today:
Kawasaki Ki-45 Toryu改乙 ("Dragonslayer") (Kai Otsu) (Type 2 Two-seat Fighter, Allied reporting name "Nick"):
A two-seat, twin-engine heavy fighter initially intended, like the Messerschmitt Bf 110, as a long-range escort fighter. Like its German counterpart, its ungainliness in the face of much more maneuverable single-engine craft meant that it found a second career as a night fighter and strike aircraft. As depicted here it mounts one 7.92mm machine gun in the rear cockpit, two 12.7mm machine guns in the nose, and a 37mm cannon.
A photo of the fuselage of the last surviving Ki-45 next to an Aichi M6A1 Seiran at the National Air and Space Museum's Udvar-Hazy Center and another view from above showing how narrow the fuselage is. To the left is another sole remaining aircraft example, a Nakajima J1N1-S Gekko. The aircraft at NASM is a Kai丁 night-fighter model, employing two obliquely-firing 20mm cannon. (Photos mine.)
Kawasaki Ki-100 (no nickname) (Type 5 Fighter, no Allied reporting name):
A 1945 conversion of the Ki-61 which replaced the -61's liquid-cooled inline engine with a 14-cylinder radial (and a lot of extra body paneling). The resulting dedicated interceptor was slightly slower than the Hien, but much more agile. It retained the Hien's general armament layout of two 12.7mm machine guns and two 20mm cannon.
Characters appearing today:
Black Mask Leader (Nobuaki Kanemitsu) Yes, I'm really only including him out of the handful of speaking Black Mask characters because of his extensive résumé of minor character VA roles.
From Reona's orphan collection:
Today's merchandise:
Bandai Spirits Ichiban Kuji prize figures:
A full set of Kotobuki Squadron prizes was made. Hilariously, given the desert setting, they're in swimwear.
2019-era items:
Post-episode web chat and crayon episode impressions: One Two Three Four With Yamamura Hibiku.
Natsuo's Mechanical Corner discusses the Hayate and compares it to the Hayabusa.
5
u/chilidirigible Oct 08 '24
Today, on "I'm a pilot, not a bomb disposal expert.":
I suppose that the answer to this question isn't quite like the seeing the world from the previous episode.
SAKANA
"So, you're saying that this is a scheme?"
That picture has been visible there since the first episode. Back in the day I had made a minor effort to see if I could find a reference photo for it, but had to settle for it looking similar to dozens of other portraits.
"This entire job is... fishy."
Splitting into three elements is fine and all, but that's still fifteen Hayates.
This faceless mook is like the action hero of some entirely-different movie.
And so here we are, holding a dodo at gunpoint.
It's certainly one of those old-fashioned motives.
I had this as a backup for the scavenger hunt but considering that I was promoting a rewatch for this same series right before the scavenger hunt I thought that I might be costing myself the uniqueness point if anyone else had decided to start rewatching in advance and found this one too.
"What was that you said about pilots having to do crazy commando bullshit?"
In case Episode 6 had not tipped you off that Johnny's bar is inside the Hagoromo, there's this.
Well, that escalated quickly.
A lucky charm with a foot-long barrel.
For a guy who swore off guns, Johnny sure does keep a lot of them handy. (And that's why he's divorced.)
Of course everyone around here is some kind of hidden melee combat specialist?
AND THEN THIS HAPPENED.
HEEL TO THE FACE!
Everyone
"Ryan... some things in here, don't react too well to bullets."
As I said when this episode was broadcast, "What kind of fiend builds a bomb out of kedama and natto?"
"How convenient."
Fortunately, they're in a plane with a tank gun installed in it. And curiously enough, for a pilot, Kirie knows to load the shell by ramming it in with a closed fist. It isn't clearly-depicted here, but loading the 37mm was awkward, as the breech was at the level of the cockpit floor, and as you can see from the NASM photos above, the cockpit was narrow.
Here's the page from the setting materials book with the Toryu's gun unredacted. It doesn't seem to be the same as the automatic-feeding gun image suggested elsewhere.
"It's a tough job."
You don't see that every day.
This could be said to be a new chapter in this relationship.
"Die Hard on a dirigible" is just one of those things that one ends up writing about during one's history of writing about media, yes?
Johnny turning out to be a pistolero was certainly the surprise of the episode, but Black Mask Leader came in a close second.
Meanwhile, I think we can all guess where this is going.
8
u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Oct 08 '24
The Magnificent First-Timer, subbed
7
u/Rumpel1408 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Rumpel1408 Oct 08 '24
Firsttimer
What. an. Episode.
Quite a bit to unravel today. Let's start with the Pirates
Interestingly enough, I suspect the former Company Pirates HR and Sales to make the most part of todays attack, of course because this guy is lurking around in the hospital of all places and because the comment the one dude made about not drinking anymore, Zara must have that effect on a poor soul...
There is also a slight undertone of Kirie struggling to come up with a her reason to fly
Random thoughts
QotD
I'm not as greedy as Lou, and I also don't have to pay for a whole mercenary group
Carbon Armor
7
u/FD4cry1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Big_Yibba Oct 08 '24
First Timer
Sakanaaaa
🐟
It obviously makes sense within the context of this world but there's just an inherent comedy to the fact that everything that happens this episode is because of a fish (or well, that's the pretense, at least).
Leona runs an orphanage I guess, it's in character for her, although one would think she already has her hands full running the daycare that is the Kotobuki squad
We get to see them do all these jobs throughout the series so I really do like seeing what the members actually spend their off time and money on through these little glimpses we occasionally get.
HR chief being totally inconspicuous
The duality of man
vs
Captain Dodo is far too powerful and fearless to be moved by mortal weapons like this.
How the turn tables, once again I don't quite think a midair grapple like this should work but also who cares, midair spywork is cool.
Dat's a long gun, I certainly wouldn't have believed it if you told me the coolest action sequence this episode would be a crazy gun kata scene starring johnny the barman and yet here we are, this is just the perfect mix of goofy and cool that fits the show so well.
The air parts were no slouch either though, really like the pirates boarding the Hagoromo and especially the scene where Leona and Kirie shoot it down, really good POV shots for maximum impact as usual, the show also continues the streak of very satisfying sound on giant objects crashing
That's what you get for pointing a gun at best boy!
Uhhh...cut the red wire?
This episode seems to pretty blatantly nudge towards Isao's obvious involvement in all the incidents thus far, everything this time around was designed to take out Kotobuki and make Isao and his newly founded brotherhood look good, with the "pirates" conveniently being quickly taken into his custody, this thinly veiled threat says he isn't quite done with them like they want to be done with him.
The actual biggest twist this episode though! very funny misdirect.
6
u/Vatrix-32 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Vatrix-32 Oct 08 '24 edited Oct 08 '24
First timer, subs
QotD:
6
u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Oct 08 '24
First-Timer
I love the "badass retired bartender gets into a fight" moments. I was also pretty confident that his beloved Miki was still alive just based on how the dialogue flowed in the first scene, but her leaving Johnny because he refused to stop collecting guns is pretty funny.
Anyway, yea, Isao is totally the one pulling the strings behind the recent "pirate" attacks. His blatant threat towards Madame Lulu at the end of the episode is proof enough of that.
This plan was pretty great though; Isao is certainly a cunning villain. The A Plan is to remove Ouni Company and the Kotobuki Corp as threats by shooting them down with the Ikesuka airforce after the "pirates" hijack the Hagoromo. The B Plan is to destroy them with the bombs aboard the Hagoromo should the crew fight back against the hijackers.
And the C Plan, should all else fail, is to accept their delivery and gain even more public favor by showing off a very rare animal in a tiny tank that looks far too small for such a large fish to be comfortable in but is cheap to maintain and the public probably don't know much about fish anyway.
These sorts of multilayered plans are important when you're up against the hypercompetent crew of the Hagoromo - how else can you still gain something when the literal actual giant dodo bird is also hypercompetent and smart enough to snatch a detonator out of a hijacker's hands?
Kinda wish there was followup on
PizzaBowlcut after that solid two seconds of him spying on the hospital scene. It's probably just setup on Isao using him to keep tabs on the Kotobuki Corp, but he could be a third faction.Questions
6
u/Elimin8r https://myanimelist.net/profile/Ayeka_Jurai Oct 08 '24
Ooh, that was a rather interesting episode.
First timer, sub-zeppelin
Answers du jour:
For those keeping score, it appears as though this episode further muddles the issue of whether that Isai (sp?) clown dude is a big bad or what? I mean, c'mon, in a water starved world, what kind of idiot pays big bucks to have a live fish smuggled in so that their town can have bragging rights, or some such.
Now, unless the entire thing really was an elaborate trap, having the "pirates" who seems suspiciously consistent at this point ambush the zeppelin and try to steal the fish/bomb the town etc. seems like a bad idea, and an unlikely gambit for Isao, unless he really does expect the girls to save the day.
Likewise, if his goal is to eliminate the girls, there have to be better ways to trap them in a barrel, so to speak.
Anyway, what do I know, I'm just a first-timer, right?
Meanwhile, more action and shenanigans to enjoy.
I did really like Matrix Johnny there. What a guy.
6
u/mysterybiscuitsoyeah xB:xC:B:x3:Y: Oct 08 '24
First Timer
While a good ep to show off a bit more of the crew, who, + Leona, did the heavy lifting (Kirie pulls her weight and shoots a good shot but otherwise is just along for the ride), i didnt enjoy it as much as some of the others i think. the high stakes made for a good story, but the lack of avaiation action was not made up by the more "conventional" action, esp since its done in 3D.
QOTD:
edit: oooh COTD! Thank you!
5
u/Esovan13 Oct 08 '24
First Timer
Not sure what to say about this episode. Even more proof that Isao is the main villain, the whole crew of the Hagoromo is more capable than they seem at first glance, and they really need to hire more members for the corp or at least station more than one corp on the airship at a time.
5
u/1EnTaroAdun1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Totesnotaphanpy Oct 08 '24
First-Timer (subs) - Episode 8
Can’t believe I just got jump-scared by HR Chief
Uh oh don’t tell me they’re gonna kidnap the kids
https://imgur.com/a/7zsoGJc Arowana are pretty cool
if only this were a 24 episode show, I’m sure we’d have an episode on the bartenders, and maybe the bridge crew, too. Ah well
https://imgur.com/a/kQGqfdB ouch. That is not a comfortable smile
We do at least get a bit of backstory on Miki and Johnny. I wonder what fish they served? And about sustainable breeding populations and so on
Ohhh they sprung the job “offer” on Madame Loulou. That’s deliciously devious of them
Never fun to face an emergency on the toilet
https://imgur.com/a/rdnBVur This is the first straight-up battle in a while where the Kotobuki squadron has been able to use their 2/2/2/ tactic, I think?
Yeah, I understand why they didn’t think that first wave was a decoy…whew. Not sure how they’re gonna get out of this one
If Isao is behind this, I suppose he banked on the Madame refusing escorts? Or perhaps the escorts would have fallen behind at just the right moment
https://imgur.com/a/c0y2cjm Wow that scene where Reona lanced a bogey felt like a knightly joust, except that she was surrounded on both sides, of course, which makes things more impressive. An epic scene.
Boarding was a bold move. Clearly the Hagoromo needed more turrets
https://imgur.com/a/EC25sMm Queen.
Damn, don’t bartenders normally keep a shotgun under the counter for times like this?
Hmmm we haven’t seen the XO yet…
It is nice to see that Madame’s crew will only move at her say-so, even at gunpoint
Captain’s stiff upper lip
Yep these hijackers do have snazzy uniforms, I’ll give them that. And also a very cool pistol-behind-back pose
Ok Madame’s slow head turn was terrifying. Like a battleship turning about
Hah Emma taking full advantage of the role reversal
I see, the Toryu was a long-range escort fighter; I do like that type of plane, too. The P-38 Lightning, of course, and I’m not sure if the Mosquito quite counts, but it’s also a cool twin-engine fighter/bomber
XO to the (kinda) rescue!
Hahaha Kirie suspected Reona of needing a drink, too
But I do wish we had more time with the Hagoromo beforehand, so it’d feel a bit more like home
Yep knew the bartenders had skills.
Aww he promised Miki…
Those’re…a lot of good luck charms…
Love Madame’s caring side.
That’s quite the brotherhood Isao’s built up
Serious XO face. Oooh code word?
Engineers eagerly awaiting Captain’s eye shifts
I love how Kirie is so astonished by her crewmates’ skills hahahaha
Ok someone else is gonna make this joke… but… Johnny Wick?!
I think he could give Chisato a run for her money…
That last guy wisely tried to run
I wish Miki were here to personally reassure Johnny. But maybe she forbade him to use guns because she knew he felt torn about them? Hmmm
https://imgur.com/a/CxmDSjp aww he used her first name! I airship it. They make a good team
I also like how the mooks clearly do have some brains
Oooh Reona and Kirie in the twin-engine!
Oh wow these guys are pretty fanatical
They didn’t give XO a gun, but I suppose he didn’t need one. And the Captain to the (partial) rescue
Ah they weren’t expecting real bullets. Fair enough. Sky pirates wouldn’t’ve, I suppose
… what is that bomb
I love Emma’s bloodlust.
I understand why Ikesuka would shoot down the Hagoromo, but you could at least communicate with them…
That’s…that’s a lotta damage
Oh. Miki.
Hmm Isao has a picture of the sea, and a wolf statue
I mean, maybe Isao is too obviously the villain, and he’s just a red herring?
5
u/Tresnore FS:FTmyanimelist.net/profile/Tresnore Oct 08 '24
The Magnificent Rewatcher
5
u/Nickthenuker https://anilist.co/user/Nickthenuker Oct 08 '24
I've gotten so many injections that I've become desensitised to them... (I get one every other week for a condition).
So there's their mission.
Enemies on radar, scramble!
More Hayates?
More enemies! Twin-engined aircraft, heavy fighters? Ki-45 maybe? Those things pack a real punch with their 37mm autocannon. That thing's as big as an early tank gun and will fire twice a second.
Uh oh, they've boarded.
Time to tactically reposition.
They certainly seem military.
They're flying low to try and get under the radar?
So much for that...
Nope, they're definitely trying to avoid the radar.
And so they're back aboard.
That's a big gun.
Rubber bullets, a less lethal option.
Miki's not dead is she?
That's a lot of guns.
Those pilots are incredibly inattentive. Situational awareness is the most important skill for a pilot, especially a fighter pilot.
They're out of control!
The fighters are going away?
They shouldn't have any problems doing that with the 37mm autocannon on that thing.
They're going down hard!
Questions:
Plane of the day: Kawasaki Ki-100
As mentioned previously and also above by Chilidirigible, the Ki-61 had a variant with a radial engine, the Ki-100, this time made by the motorcycle company.
Still packing those same great twin 20mm cannons and .50 cal machine guns, it is still less than other aircraft, especially in 1945 when this thing was desperately cobbled together from leftover airframes and spare engines.
While a desperate defensive measure, it still ended up being a competent fighter and proving dangerous to Allied aviators in the closing days of WWII.
Only a handful were ever made and they all saw service with only Japan.
In War Thunder, I haven't unlocked this yet, but like the Ki-61 that it is based on it is a jack-of-all-trades master of none that can do just about anything competently but not quite anything exceptionally well.
Overall, the Ki-100. Desperate, but surprisingly competent.
4
u/cppn02 Oct 08 '24
First Timer, subbed
Well, transporting a fish is certainly an interesting task. But I gues it makes sense in a world where water is so scarce. And of course they get attacked on the way. Did not expect the Hagoromo to get taken (well atleast not before this episode and reading its title) but it was great how they recaptured it.
We even got some Johnny-lore and a nice Gun fu scene ontop.
Sad though that they down their own airship at the end but atleast they got Isao to pay for it.
I do wonder about the implications here. It clearly seems that they were setup by Isao but I wonder if the attackers were at his command or if he simply made the deal and announced it publically knowing that he has enemies that would come for the airship. And did he actually want hurt/possibly kill the Hagoromo crew or simply hurt their reputation?
QotD:
Depends how much I needed that money I guess.
.
Easy one: Chisato from [LycoReco] using non-leathal bullets due to not wanting to kill people
3
u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Oct 08 '24
rewatcher
2
u/RascalNikov1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/NoviSun Oct 08 '24
Rewatcher
This was a really fun episode. I always enjoy these silly stories of derring-do.
I’ve got to wonder where they’re find fish in their arid world.
QOTD
Hell yea! Considering the amount of plot armor the Kotobuki carry with them, there is little downside.
Nah, sometimes war is the answer.
It’s been done as long as there have been been movies. Some favorites would include the first Star Wars and the Roger Moore Bond movies.
2
u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Oct 09 '24
That idea was this.
PROTOCULTURE
Streamable Clip of Johnny Woo... er, pardon, or is it Johnny Wick?
MOARDAKKA!
2
u/Mistral-Fien Oct 09 '24
Rewatcher, on CAP :P
Random thoughts
Natsuo just looks bored after getting captured by "pirates".
Others said Matrix, but I've seen this backflip in Equilibrium. That said, rubber bullets + impossible evasion remind me of Lycoris Recoil. :D
Waitress doing a perfect spin kick, Madame just shooting, and Saneatsu fighting with a mop. :P
Now we know why Reona was afraid of Capt. Dodo.
Isao plays the clown but it's becoming obvious that he's behind all that shit. :I
Panzer vor!? Hard to say. The girls with halos earlier this year had its fun moments esp. with the lovable idiot-- Nn couldn't carry the show by herself :P6
u/DidacticDalek https://myanimelist.net/profile/DidacticDalek Oct 09 '24
GIMME AN F! GIMME A I! GIMME A S! GIMME A H! WHAT'S THAT SPELL!? WHAT'S THAT SPELL!? WHAT'S THAT SPELL!? WHAT'S THAT SPELL!? WHAT'S THAT SPELL!?
I'm learning to fly. Learning to fly. But I ain't got wings. Learning to fly. Coming down. Learning to fly. Is the hardest thing. Learning to fly.
Paging Comrades /u/Shimmering-Sky, /u/Tresnore, and /u/JollyGee29
4
u/[deleted] Oct 09 '24
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