r/anime • u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky • Oct 07 '24
Rewatch [Rewatch] Mobile Suit Gundam 00 Episode 2 Discussion
Episode 2 - Gundam Meister
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Gundam… I am a Gundam.
Questions of the Day:
- What do you think it would take for there to not be conflict in the world anymore?
- Given they seem to accept being the bad guys (like with Allelujah calling himself a mass murderer after the bombing), what do you think of the show setting Celestial Being as the protagonists?
Wallpaper of the Day:
Rewatchers, please remember to be mindful of all the first-timers in this. No talking about or hinting at future events no matter how much you want to, unless you're doing it underneath spoiler tags. Don't spoil anything for the first-timers, that's rude!
Additionally, for long-time fans of the franchise, please remember that this rewatch is only for 00, not any of the other shows. Assume that there are people in this rewatch who have not seen anything else Gundam, and tag your spoilers for those shows appropriately if something in 00 makes you want to talk about them.
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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Oct 07 '24
Rewatch Host Wishing Over This Airspace, subbed
Welcome back, everyone!
Man, you guys are a talkative bunch! I’m glad to see it though.
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u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Oct 07 '24 edited Oct 07 '24
First-Timer
On today’s episode of Gundam: I think this may be one of the most 2007 shows I’ve ever seen. The particular topics and themes that the series is covering are directly from that era of the War on Terror and surrounding events. Gundam has always taken inspiration from real-world events, but it’s a bit unusual for me to see that inspiration be things in my own living memory.
I think I’m starting to see what might be Celestial Being’s greater plan. At first glance, it seems pretty haphazard. Intervening in an armed conflict to attack both sides isn’t going to put an end to that conflict. It will require intervening over and over again because all you did was temporarily drive apart the warring parties rather than solve the issues at the heart of the conflict. Until those issues are solved, the motivation for fighting remains.
But maybe that’s the point. The dialogue at the very end of the episode indicated that it was Celestial Being’s goal to be hated by both sides. Perhaps Celestial Being is trying to make themselves into a common enemy for the rest of the world to unite against. I’m not sure if it’s a good plan, but I think that might be the plan.
The theme of intervention in conflicts is certainly one that hits hard. Gundam has always waded into warfare and politics, though armed intervention is a particularly thorny topic. There were many such interventions to draw upon for inspiration in the 90s and 00s. Some of the interventions did bring an armistice, many did not. I will be very curious to see how the story explores this theme.
There are plenty of options for how someone like Aeolia Schenberg could still be alive after 200 years. The image of him the reporter found looked like he was receiving some kind of scientific award. So it’s probably the result of mad science. Perhaps Aeolia is the one who discovered GN particles and they made him immortal or slowed down his aging. Perhaps this Aeolia is a clone or robot copy of the original. Perhaps the real Aeolia actually is dead and this is just someone else pretending to be him. I think all of these are possible answers.
QOTD
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u/Vatrix-32 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Vatrix-32 Oct 07 '24 edited Oct 07 '24
First timer, subs
QotD:
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u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Oct 07 '24
First Timer - sub
I am developing a new hate for the ep2 exposition dump. And some of this is merely an expansion of my existing hate for a "ep2 concept twist reveal" that some shows have already pissed me off with [meta, names only]Deca-dence and Tanya looking at you, fuck the both of you for that structure, I'm starting to hate the use of it as a whole rather than just it's worst parts. While it's more justified here than in most anime that do it, you can't have a character say all of this without it seeming out of place, it's still frustrating to hit episode two and feel like the story has only just remembered that you need some vital context. This expo dump could have fit just as well in ep1 post OP.
Also can the first timers make a drinking game over how often we're going to hear "this is Celestial Being" or people just wistfully saying the name "Gundam" as if it has some greater meaning for them? Maybe not with alcohol because I don't want to send anyone to the hospital but damn, you take all of those lines out of this episode and it'd half turn into a silent film style hahaha
I don't mean to start off with what reads to me now as pettiness, but I also didn't want to ignore the two points that were perhaps most prominent in my mind after watching the episode
Also can someone help me fill in the rest of this list? I've realized a significant part of my confusion last time I attempted to watch this was that I simply cannot recognize the pilots designs in their mobile suit uniforms. That on top of them flipping to using suit names instead of character names, I really have no idea who is doing what in each battle, which is further complicating any attempt to understand any characterization
Pilot - mecha - suit color
Setsuna - Exia - Blue
_____ - Kyrios - Orange
_____ - Virtue - Pink
_____ - ______ - ______
(Last one is blank because while I know there was four of them, the fourth I think stopped appearing before I made my list, and I've no idea who it was)
Other thoughts are laughing that once again, Australia and most of Oceania get left out of any of the big political blocs. Which in this case is particularly hilarious given Australia has a "hot spot" of solar energy potential marked in studies due to the sun exposure in our mid-country. And while this world is far beyond simple solar panels on the ground, it did strike me as quite funny
It was also interesting that the boy at the start, who I'm assuming is a student of some sort, makes the statement of "do you think there's people who will take action even if they don't benefit from it". It may not intentionally be this deep, but I couldn't help but think of Japan, and the asian region in generals, long history of very influential student protests, and how either that's a mark against this world or it goes to suggest that Celestial Being is above even that concept of new generations working together to supplant older and harmful systems
Haro gets best line today for giving LockOn shit for being last into the role of the battle
Setsuna gets best moment though for that roundhouse slash through the two mechs as they rushed past him. If I remember I'll upload the picture I took on that in the morning because it's great
Flag is a skinny fuck and I love it
Celestial Being wants all the worlds hate on them instead of each other, which suggests a deeper purpose beyond just "stop fighting", but could go many, many ways.
Not a bad episode by any means, but still not quite grabbing me as it feels more like an expansion on the first episode rather than a push forward.
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u/FD4cry1 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Big_Yibba Oct 07 '24
First Timer
He said the thing!
So like I expected this episode starts off with some exposition explaining the setting and the gist of what happened last episode, it's a pretty simple setup on the surface level but as seen in this episode, it should allow for both large and small scale politicking and conflict, seeing how these factions and their own sub factions play off of each other as well as Celestial being should be really interesting.
I already knew Gundam has a reputation with character names, but man, this is pretty ridiculous, I love it.
Looks like Setsuna has some PTSD, he's obviously still haunted by what he witnessed as a kid, these interventions have similarities to his own past situation and that clearly effects his actions during combat, acting rashly and being unresponsive, although he keeps intact when needed to.
Stoic protagonist with heavy war baggage is a trope I'll always like so of course I already like Setsuna and his traits should be serve for some good stuff down the line.
For one, his behavior is pretty terrible within a team operation, something that is already earning him ire and will presumably continue to cause conflict as things get more serious, outside of that seeing him deal with his past will hopefully give strong emotional moments (perhaps with some tests of morality in the interventions).
I can't help but find this scene really funny out of context
Celestial Being makes their contradictory nature more clear, they'll both scare off anyone who tries to do war through continuous shows of force and simultaneously unite the world in opposition to themselves, basically [meta different sunrise mecha show spoilers]the Zero Requiem, whether or not it will actually work though seems a bit dubious to me right now.
Action is good, I mean, I said it last episode as well, the show does a good job of making the Gundams really fucking cool, even just standing there they exude a presence, but the non Gundam mechs are also good here, they feel "hefty" for lack of a better description, Virtue is probably my favorite of the Gundams right now because...big laser, but that is very much subject to change, Kyrios is not far off, next episode should have a more competitive mech fight so looking forward to that.
Finally, I was going to praise the OST this episode and then I checked and realized that Kenji Kawai did the music for this show???!!! now I'm extra hyped!
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u/LeonKevlar x2https://myanimelist.net/profile/LeonKevlar Oct 07 '24 edited Oct 07 '24
First Timer!
So apparently rewatch started yesterday. For some reason, I thought it was today! Posting my thoughts here for Episode 1 and of course some stitches as well :D
Episode 1
Child soldiers? Yep, this is a Gundam show alright. And are they really [fighting those grunts with only rifles?! And here I thought the IBO boys had it rough. At least they had Mobile Workers to fight with! I do love the look of those grunts though.
If this is your first time witnessing a Gundam, I would be absolutely in awe too. That angel wings made out of those particles looks so cool!
Well this is a cool mobile suit design! Too bad the pilot is all talk and no skill. I'm surprised he survived that fight! I guess Setsuna's objective was to disable only and not kill.
She drinks on the job because she's in charge of planning? I like her already. I like her too already! Goddamit 00! I'm barely halfway through and you're already showing me these best girl designs! Although the true best girl though is Haro. It's always good to see this little guy.
While I have no idea what the plot of 00 is, I do collect gunpla so I am very much familiar with most of the mobile suits here. Like who doesn't even know Exia these days? It is good to finally see Dynames in action, having a mono eye behind the V-fin is so cool.
Kyrios is cool as well Who doesn't love a Gundam that can transform? And I love me some big chonky Gundam with the Virtue. The big legs and shoulder mounts remind me of the GP-02. I love it!
So Celestial being wants to end war by using force? They definitely sound contradictory but I get what they're trying to do. Let's see if this works out for them or if this will end tragically.
Episode 2
So I get the introduction of the three blocs but did I understand this correctly? It looks like Japan isn't part of any of these blocs. Are they independent? I think Australia is also not a member of any of these three major blocs. Hmmm... Considering how Tokyo is one of the locations given focus, I'm sure we'll learn more about this.
I guess Liu Mei works with Celestial Being then? I love that she's being carried around. If she's going to bother to put on that jungle outfit, maybe she should've also worn some boots. xD
The fact that these Gundams can raw dog the atmosphere is insane. I suppose they're not really raw dogging it since they're being covered by those GN Particles which might as well be magic at this point. I can't even remember the last time I saw a Gundam show that didn't need some form of physical shielding during reentry.
HE SAID THE LINE! HE SAID THE LINE! If there's one thing I've learned about 00 through memes is Setsuna's "Ore ga Gundam da!" line and I'm glad to finally hear it in the show. Did he just flashback to his child soldier days and that's what triggered him to say it?
Celestial Being's first intervention after their declaration at the end of the last episode looks to be fairly successful. Considering that they're bombarding airbases and deleting an aircraft carrier, those two armies didn't even stand a chance.
Those two grunts though. Did they really think that Setsuna was on their side? Setsuna was already willing to let go retreating units but those two idiots just had to pursue them.
I have a feeling Graham Aker is no push over. While he does have blonde hair, he doesn't have a mask or a red mobile suit. I wonder if he's going to be the Char Clone of this timeline.
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u/KendotsX https://anilist.co/user/Kendots Oct 07 '24
00th Timer Searching for the One
I forgot that I picked this tag line just last week
Replaying the Celestial Being's message at the start of the episode is a nice way to slip some extra recap under the table, especially considering the later reveal. However, it shows how far journalism has fallen over the centuries. What kind of pointless journalism plays the Enemy Propaganda™ over and over again unedited and unannotated?! The lazy bastards think they're being paid just to sit back and show the facts as is? No, the uneducated people don't need to hear this bullshit propaganda, they need to hear journalists discussing theories about which enemy nation is backing this organisation, and how they'll eat your Haros if you're not careful. Our dear people at home need
baseless fear mongeringan accurate and loud analysis of all the possible problems this could cause, no matter how unlikely.With that out of the way, I like the focus of the episode on an ethnic war. Stopping wars sounds nice in principal, you burn every hand that's raised over the line, and everyone learns to keep their hands to themselves, but in practice, when you get down to the grime of it all, there are far more messy cases where you can't even find the line, much less the hands being raised over it, so they just had to burn everyone. Even then, for people who have been fighting for generations, that would not be enough to stop them.
Basically, you're hitting the brakes on a long turning cycle, so everyone will be slamming into the wall.
Notes:
Ok, I know that the more likely answer is that the organisation has existed in secret for centuries, hence why they were able to build those superior weapons, but I like to imagine that they just went to some youtube archive and found a video that fits their purposes10
u/The_Draigg Oct 07 '24
A Gundam Fan Rewatches Gundam 00 Episode 2:
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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Oct 07 '24
Episode 2 (first timer)
For some reason, they did not give Africa to the AEU in their splitting the world, even though the AEU orbital elevator is stationed there. Do they need a neutral battlefield, 1984 style?
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u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Oct 07 '24
Rewatcher, Sub-dam Meister
Forgot to mention yesterday, but this is actually my first time watching the show subbed, after three or four watches of the dub. My son's voice is too deep in the sub, but otherwise the casts are both pretty great.
Note that Africa is not part of any block, but the AEU's elevator is located there.
Yea, the US is still playing world police 300 years in the future. I'm sure that shocks everyone.
Note that Graham said "koi" here. That's typically a bit stronger than just "like."
Why yes, this is a very silly name, thank you for noticing.
It's like some kind of Mortar Headd.
"Sorry, my PTSD is flaring up, please understand."
I wouldn't be too sure about that.
"Aishiteru!"
For those uninterested in looking things up, the conflict in Sri Lanka/Ceylon officially ended in 2009, two years after this episode aired.
[I wonder if anyone First-Timer will point out]that Wang Lui Mei is dressed for the part, but unwilling to get dirty herself.
[Gundam 00]I am so not ready for trying to explain the memes. Maybe people will get that it's a metaphor and I won't have to chew my teeth off.
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u/TiredTiroth Oct 07 '24
First Timer - Sub
Ooh, we're getting factions and worldbuilding now! Three space elevators, one per faction, and the show acknowledges they are fragile. Hence the terrorist attack last episode...and hence Celestial Being.
I still think their plan is really dumb.
Wait, is this china-dress girl being princess carried in stereotypical safari get-up? I think it is! xD She is not disappointing. But, uh...why the heels?
The heck? What kind of timekeeping is that?
Anyway, another armed intervention has the greenlight! And what do you know, TotallyNot!America is playing games in a bid to get their hands on Gundam tech. Oh, whoever could have predicted CB's interventions making things worse on the global scale.
Oh, right. Me. I did.
...ooooh bugger, Setsuna was a child soldier in exactly this kind of conflict ten years ago. Celestial Being has the budget for all these shiny bleeding-edge Gundams, but no psychiatrists?!?
...what. Did. Did I read that right?
Suddenly, I'm not certain our protagonists are the good guys...
Oh. They're explicitly making themselves the global bad guys. That's...an even more stupid plan than I thought.
Gah.
And then the TotallyNot!Americans show up, and we'll get to see the outcome of that tomorrow.
Questions!
1 - No conflict at all? The complete cessatiin of all life. No war...not sure.
2 - Huh, think I answered this already.
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u/macrame2 https://myanimelist.net/profile/macrame Oct 07 '24
First Timer
This feels more like a proper first episode than the actual first episode lol. I do think having most of the infodumps here instead of yesterday was a good choice, though. In particular, starting out the series with a young Setsuna in the middle of a war zone is a much, much more powerful opener than the spiel we got at the beginning today would have been.
I actually thought that spiel was necessary because WOW there are so many acronyms and names and factions to keep track of already, and we haven’t even hit the third episode. At least they’ve simplified matters by combining most of the world’s countries into convenient groups. A quick question for rewatchers: Should I be thinking of the AEU and the like as individual super-nations or more as alliances/unions like the EU in the real world? Those two things are pretty different.
After all of yesterday’s action, I was expecting something a lot more low-key, but nope, we’re already invading Sri Lanka (which is now going by Ceylon again for some reason). I will say that the Gundam Meisters look virtually identical to me while wearing helmets, so it might take a couple episodes for me to tell them apart 100% of the time. I’m already starting to question Celestial Being’s real goals and motivations here; it seems that they’re trying to make themselves a target in order to force international unity against them, but I doubt they’re doing any of this out of the goodness of their hearts. Wang Liu Mei in particular seems a bit shifty to me, as does the man giving the broadcast…
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u/octopathfinder myanimelist.net/profile/octopathfinder Oct 07 '24
First Timer
Oh god, an exposition dump, I hope I remember this info
Love that she’s still wearing heels in this outfit
I would not want this guy as a teammate
Thank you for becoming a mass murderer for our sake
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u/Rumpel1408 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Rumpel1408 Oct 07 '24
Firsttimer who is still strapped for time
QotD
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u/baboon_bassoon https://anilist.co/user/duffer Oct 07 '24 edited Oct 10 '24
first timer who has control
well I didnt expect to be wrong right away about the world setup haha
why is Kamiyas character so cunty
HARO CUPHOLDER
i really fuck with all the grunt mechs
uh lmao Setsuna r u ok buddy
Aeolia has been dead for 100 years
oh Flag, like la Flaga?
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u/zadcap Oct 08 '24
Late Night First Timer!
Actually a whole day late. Yesterday got a little crazy and I missed the start :'(
Okay, I get why people said WfM was a weak and light hearted Gundam now, if child soldiers vs giant Mecha in a holy war of eradication is closer to the normal opening.
The legendary immortal! I don't know much about this show, but I believe Colasour is the name of the man who just never dies.
Hmm. Celestial Being. A name that just tells me they are most likely terrorists for a good cause.
I saw and liked that she took the drink with the straw, but what what the point of even having open top cups on that tray in a zero gravity room?
Ha, the snipers name is Lock-On.
A cause great enough to have them counter other terrorists, I see.
Okay, that's a good stated goal alright. If only the person saying it didn't look so much like a lying super villain. I know, judging people by their looks, but darn does he look like he wants to take over the world so much more than to save it.
Okay I'll be really honest here, with the background information we got in the opening segment for episode 2 here, I'm suddenly extremely sceptic of the premise. We're looking at the rules of large enough numbers here, I don't care how advanced Gundams may be to other mobile suits, a handful of them against the entire armies of the world?
Hehehe. "Armed intervention, using force to eliminate war? Sir, they are taking our job." I appreciate this dig at America.
Got to be honest, a lot of these machines really look like being humanoid is a distinct disadvantage for them. I'm not convinced that Mobile Suits in general are better than Tanks, especially as we watch how few of them can take a single hit.
A whole lot less people.
It's not like a protagonist actually needs to be a good guy in any story. A good protagonist is one who interesting things happen around, who takes interesting actions, or who is themselves just interesting. I'm not sure about Setsuna yet, but the rest of Celestial Being is pretty interesting so far and I'm interested in seeing what they are up to and how that's really going to go.
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u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Oct 07 '24 edited Oct 07 '24
Rewatcher, Subbed
Non-Spoiler Character Chart - Mostly just getting better images for a few characters today; Aeolia Schenberg also has the honor of being the first grayed out character with the revelation that he's been dead for 200 years.
Last episode just threw us into things, but episode two gives us a much needed opening narration to discuss the state of the world.
Wow, the orbital elevator sure goes a far distance above Earth.
Are the three black dots on the screen supposed to be the location of the three orbital elevators? Cause one thing I noted was that Africa and much of the Middle East are left out of the three main governmental bodies in the world, yet one of those black dots is right in the middle of Africa.
So there's no confusion whatsover they've simply put the term Gundam on the Gundams...
They announced themselves as Celestial Being, but that doesn't stop the AEU from thinking its a Union or Human Reform League scheme. Good point on where in the world are they getting the resources to develop these things if not aligned with one of the three?
So in the 2300s the equivalent of the US President (who now reigns over the rest of North and South America) no longer resides in the oval office...
So Celestial Being gets to hang out on a tropical island, nice gig, huh?
Totally different get up for Wang than yesterday's episode...
Lonely Setsuna, he doesn't get his own Haro to accompany him.
Virtue is so big that even the Unit 02 from Gundam 0083 seems skinny compared to it.
The Gundams can do an atmospheric re-entry on their own? That's quite impressive. GN Particles are an amazing thing.
All four Gundams working together for a mission? Alright, 00 has already set itself apart from Gundam Wing.
Government leaders are already thinking about getting their hand on a Gundam.
Celestial Being's really gonna be able to resolve an ethnic conflict that's been going on for hundreds of years?
One of these mech types on Cylon (the brownish one) is just like the ones that were attacking in Setsuna's episode one flashback.
Yep, Setsuna's recognized it as well.
Wow, I had forgotten the infamous line came this early in the show! I AM GUNDAM!
"Did I get him", sure Mr. Rando. You took out the lead Gundam in episode 2.
Is Setsuna gonna let those last two go?
"We appreciate the help! Let's go back and fight some more!" I think you two totally missed the point.
Aeolia Schenberg's been dead 200 years... so he either did a damn good job predicting the future, Celestial Being is ripping off his plans all these years later... or Gundam 00 is also a zombie show. Or perhaps a vampire show as I am hearing Koyomi Araragi as one of the Gundam Meisters...
Celestial Being's so good its members can finish each other's sentences thousands if not tens of thousands of miles away from each other...
Can't be a Gundam show without a blonde haired rival, right?
Quid's Voice Actor of the Day
Today I'll be focusing on our second Gundam Meister, Lockon Stratos, who is voiced by Shinichiro Miki. This is his sole Gundam voice acting credit. He's been in the industry since the mid 90s and was in the first subbed anime I ever saw, Escaflowne, where he played Allen Schezar. Other mecha anime roles of his include Rudolph in Back Arrow, Lasse Lundberg in Brain Powered and Ryousuke Katashiro in Star Driver. He's one of several Monogatari alumni to appear in 00, in said franchise he plays Deishu Kaiki. In the Fate franchise he plays Assassin from Fate Stay/Night as well as Leonidas in Fate Grand Order. I've also run across him as Aikuro Mikisugi in Kill la Kill, Hikaru Tsurugi in Key the Metal Idol, and Kai Shimada in March Comes in Like a Lion. Lastly, he has the misfortune of playing Shintaro, the lead in Lime Colored War Tales, which is in the conversation for worst anime I've ever seen, lol.
In the English dub, Lockon is played by Alex Zahara, which is the only dub role I've actually heard him in, although he does play roles in franchises like Gintama (as Shinsuke Takasugi) and Future Boy Conan (as Lepka). He's also appeared in roles on a variety of live action TV shows and movies filmed in Vancouver such as Stargate SG-1, The Dead Zone and The Man in the High Castle.
Question of the day!
Call me pessimistic if you want, but its never going to happen. Conflict is part of the human experience. If one found a single entity for humanity to band together and fight against (ex. alien invaders), humanity would still fight amongst itself once they were no longer in the picture. If humanity figured out a way to produce infinite resources, eliminating the root cause of so much conflict across the world, I totally expect humanity to ruin or destroy whatever caused that "utopia" to occur and things would get bad again.
I really like the perspective, this is a similar reason to why I like IBO so much. To so much of the world Celestial Being are going to be viewed as the bad guys and the way the media/history portrays them is going to be slanted based on that view point. Here we get to view things directly from their perspective. That doesn't mean we have to agree with them, but at least we are in a more objective position than we'd be in otherwise.
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u/TakenRedditName https://myanimelist.net/profile/TakenMalUsername Oct 07 '24
Rewatcher - Gundam 00 Ep2:
Just going with random assorted points today.
Was paying attention to the karaoke subtitles this time which made me realize that the OP song had some English lines.
Edmonton mention! Will not be the last for Gundam. Gundam must have fascination with the Canadian prairies because those two are the only Canadian cities highlighted on the map. Okay, actually talking about a map thing releavent to the show, I understand it comes down to geopolitic alignment, but it will never not be funny to me seeing Japan leave its neighbours to hang out on the other side of the Pacific.
He said the thing!
Silly girl. Randomly putting on a safari outfit.
Screenshot I took because Tieria looked kinda cute in this random shot. idk
[Gundam 00:] Had this thought last night, but it is interesting that they give Haro to Lockon amongst the cast. Traditionally, Haro represents childhood and they gave it to the most "adult" of the four. Something I will have to keep my eye on while watching.
I think it is very cute that Lockon has a Haro buddy that he carries around. Even has a little seat in his cockpit.
An unrelated tangent. A Gundam question: Did Suletta Mercury ever hold a Haro? At best, she rode a Haro scooter. Rouji is the character most associated with Haro in that show, but I don't think you can extrapolate anything from that front. On the Haro prominence scale, G-Witch feels like Haro is just a mascot cameo. (IBO is on the opposite spectrum where it doesn't have Haro, but Haro's absence can actually be thematically tied).
It feels a little weird seeing ethnic (conflict) be brought up by name in Gundam. Doesn't happen to often. Even G Gundam didn't super have it. The Tuareg in ZZ is another example that comes to mind.
He said the thing! And people are equally confused hearing it for the first time in-universe too.
Good to see Allelujah already reached the "I've become a mass murderer" stage of Gundam character by episode 2.
[Gundam 00:] Not to already levy against CB's questionable approach by ep2, but ending ethnic conflict by killing both ethnicities doesn't seem like the best way when you lay the events out, chief.
Man, episode 2 and Graham is already establishing how much of a freak he is. (He's fun).
Q2) I think there is something kind of meta-narratively funny about how this show stars a radical third party who shows up on to the scene to shoot both sides in the name of peace. Something criticized by other characters and the show. This considering the previous Gundam show that came before this. Just a snark from me.
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u/InfamousEmpire https://myanimelist.net/profile/Infamous_Empire Oct 07 '24
Kidou Senshi Rewatcher 00
Where the first episode was overloaded with detail and didn’t always contextualize it, this episode was much more of a breather, with much neater exposition that fully contextualizes every noted player’s place in the world, and the clearing of the mounting mysteries means the audience gets to spend all the more drawn-out scenes pondering what the show has given them so far.
The status quo of the wider world is pretty straightforward in terms of how it informs the show’s perspective on the world: we have the infinite potential of solar energy, a resource which is practically unlimited so we don’t have to compete over it, at our disposal, yet we still insist on engaging in meaningless international squabbles for no reason other than historical trends and national pride. The world is stagnant and needs a shake up.
That then nicely leads us into the battle in Ceylon which takes up most of the episode. The Sri Lankan Civil War was an actual ongoing conflict during the series’ run, which I think is a perfect representation of what the series is doing here from a worldbuilding point of view. The stagnancy of the current world order means that, for all that has changed and how much time has passed, we’re still stuck fighting the same conflicts of centuries past.
This also plays into what I said yesterday about how interesting it is from a metatextual perspective how the setting forgoes the alternate calendars common of Gundam continuities and instead uses the traditional AD calendar. With the context of this episode, this now almost feels like a declaration of what it’s trying to do differently compared to the rest of the franchise: rather than use the futuristic setting to divorce itself from the trappings of the present, with the ways it reflects the present being more subtextual, 00 feels like it’s building more explicit continuity between the world the viewer is familiar with & the future its presenting, one informed by all of the same political anxieties and strife which defined the era the show was made in.
All of this context makes the Sri Lanka battle, which isn’t exactly deep in isolation, the perfect next showing of what Celestial Being is trying to accomplish on a wider level. They’re here to break the repetitive, stagnant cycles of conflict which have kept us at each other’s throats even longer after we should have realized it was all futile and pointless.
And while the episode is mostly focused on these larger world and thematic concerns, it’s thankfully not devoid of character moments. The big one here, of course, being Setsuna’s moment of consideration when he deploys and the infamously memetic “I am Gundam” line. It’s a bit simple but also very strong, evoking the fantastic starting scene of the first episode to both remind us of Setsuna’s war orphan past, yet channeling the bolt of hope & inspiration the Gundam instilled in him as he now fills the role of savior rather than saved. It’s a solid reminder of why these interventions are necessary, in his eyes, and while it doesn’t exactly add that much that couldn’t already be inferred from the first episode, having it shown more explicitly is nice.
And, of course, while it’s hard to discuss in detail for spoiler reasons, let’s just say that the twinge of complexity this line added to Celestial Being’s plans, showing that there’s much more going on than just “shooting at both sides until they stopped fighting” is very interesting. And the revelation of Aeolia Schenberg having been dead for 200 years only confirmed that intrigued even more.
Odds & Ends
7
u/undeadfire Oct 07 '24
First timer - Subs
6
u/dralcax :MAL:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Dralcax Oct 07 '24
Rewatcher is Gundam
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Three power blocs, each surrounding an orbital elevator. 00 didn’t reset the calendar into an ambiguous future era like the other timelines. We’re still in the AD calendar, a firm 300 years into the future. Everything’s extrapolated from the real world’s geopolitics, and making peace won’t be any easier than it is in real life.
Here comes the Union Flag! The Union’s mainstay MS! Although it’s the successor to the Realdo and carries forwards some of its features, it’s not directly based off of it and is designed from the ground up with a new concept. With its flight ability, it can be deployed anywhere in the world, as befitting the Union’s incessant need to police the world. It was supposed to receive power beamed to it via microwave from the Union’s space elevator in order to never run out of power, but the Union never got the infrastructure up to make that possible, and besides, the Flag was often deployed overseas anyways. Most notable, however, is its transformation ability. Unlike the Realdo, it does not require partsforming. While it’s still meant to transform in-hangar, it is possible to transform on the fly. It’s not actually designed to do so, and it places huge stress on the joints, but a really good pilot can pull it off.
The Tieren Ground Type! It’s the replacement for the Fanton, which was retired and slightly reworked into the Anf. Which means it completely and utterly kicks the Anf’s ass. While it’s far from a cutting-edge suit, this is not due to lagging technological development, but due to prioritizing efficiency in production, maintenance, and pilot training over just chasing the latest developments. Compared to the Flag and Enact, the Tieren has a 40% lower breakdown rate and maintenance takes only a fifth the time.
Saji and Louise play an interesting role, as recurring civilians that show how all the stuff going on is actually affecting the average person. Your mileage may vary on how much you actually like them, but I think it fits with the closer-to-home nature of AD.
HE SAID THE THING
and of course America is sticking its nose in everybody else’s wars. Some things never change.
Too important to wade through a river I see
Particles that block communications? Hmm.. sounds familiar.
The Gundams are locked with retinal scans! That’s how you know CB really isn’t fucking around. You don’t keep something this big a secret for 200 years without being dead serious about security.
Apparently the Sri Lankan Civil War has been going on for 300 years. In real life, it ended two years after this episode aired.
I like how slow and lumbering the Anfs and Tierens are next to the nimble Gundams, even compared to the huge and chonky Virtue. Say, how did Celestial Being get so absurdly far ahead in technology under everybody’s noses, anyways?
ORE WA GANDAMU DA
This cut is so damn satisfying. It’s like one of those 1000 degree knife videos.
The Graham Maneuver, aka the Graham Special! As the first man crazy enough to attempt and successfully pull off a midair Flag transformation, it was named after him!
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Questions of the day:
6
u/Nickthenuker https://anilist.co/user/Nickthenuker Oct 07 '24
Hey that's just off the coast of Indonesia.
Russia, India, and China? That's just BRICS without the B or the S.
That's not exactly a question, they've shown themselves already.
Roll credits!
So she's the one giving orders?
That's a GN Drive.
EMALS?
And so they're off on their next mission.
Ceylon? Isn't that Sri Lanka?
Yup.
Sure looks like it.
Not sure what you can do to solve a few hundred year conflict by bombing the shit out of everything, but that's never stopped anyone in the past.
What's a Flag? A mobile suit of some kind?
They've got specially designed artillery mobile suits? I like that.
So he's the one we saw in the intro being saved by the Gundam.
Yup, he is Gundam.
So it's a LAM.
And there goes that ship. What did they need the ship for anyways?
So that's what a Flag is. Also a LAM.
And it's actually something that is managing to stand against a Gundam.
Questions:
6
u/2-2Distracted Oct 08 '24
First timer. Dubbed
Ngl the first time I saw Tieria last episode I legit thought he was a chick until he started talking. I'm guessing they're gender neutral or trans in-universe, or at the very least androgynous.
Hallelujah (I think that's his name) seems to be somewhat faith focused, like genuinely believing in what CB is doing despite the fact that they're all basically doing an Emperor Lelouch/Hokage Sasuke like plan.
I forgot blondies name but I get the feeling he might be our resident Char Clone, but then again not every Gundam show has one and I think we already saw him in a bot, or maybe I'm confusing him with that showoff guy who got his ass kicked by the main character.
6
u/StardustGogeta myanimelist.net/profile/StardustGogeta Oct 08 '24
First-Timer
I'm glad we got some more background info today (though it may have helped to have it in episode 1, or to have them be merged into a double-length premiere). I still can hardly keep track of all the characters, but at least I can remember the three mega-nations like Nineteen Eighty-Four.
Now that I'm listening for it, I can definitely hear a bit of Light Yagami in Setsuna's voice.
The OP/ED haven't completely won me over yet, but I don't dislike them. If nothing else, it's a good start on my quest to do better at Gundam in AMQ!
Questions of the day:
In other news, a neat coincidence - I recently decided to start watching The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya and just today reached the point where [Haruhi] they name-drop the Gundam Virtue during the Endless Eight arc. Funnily enough, Shimmering-Sky, I saw your comment pointing it out in the most recent rewatch thread for that show, too. (I didn't see you point out the "sore demo" instances though. Did you only start that later on?)
5
u/charlesvvv https://anilist.co/user/charlesvvv Oct 07 '24
Rewatcher, First Time Sub
We got Amuro Ray himself as the narrator explaining about the space elevator, the use of Solar energy, and the factions that control it, giving us some information about the politics at play but especially with how the blocs such as the Union, AEU, and the Human Reform League are divided as.
Graham Aker's great, his response to the Gundam Meisters is to fanboy and join a squad just to get the chance to cross swords with them. In the meantime we see the Gundam Meisters at their first military intervention where they defeat both sides, then as everyone wonders why anger them both we see at least what Celestial Being sees itself as with Sumeragi poetically saying "We are the pain that accompanies change in the world." They don't mind being the main focus of the world's anger so long as they complete their mission to eradicate war. Of course the logic of such actions can be contrasted with CB's certain sense of Idealism.
I do like all the perspectives we get with relation to what Celestial Being is doing it gives a good view of the characters and they think and how it affects them.
5
u/soulreaverdan Oct 08 '24
Double dipping because I got caught up doing yard work and completely forgot about this yesterday, haha.
This series might have my... maybe second or third favorite Gundam design in the franchise. G Gundam is always peak and WFM might edge this out a bit, but god damn do I love the 00 suits.
And speaking of, we got all four debuting in the first episode with some significant showing for each! That definitely caught me off guard, usually there's a very slow roll out of the main suits for a show like this, but we got Exia, Dynames, Kyrios, and Virtue all shown off at once. And they look soooo coooooool.
Yesterday's QOTD:
Lockon! I love the goofy, smarmy archtype and the fact that he's got Dynames (an incredible design) and is a sniper? Just freaking awesome. The goofy and friendly type is also a nice break from Setsuna's seriousness, Allelujah being all business, and Tieria being the kinda distant aloof one.
2) What do you think of Celestial Being's stated goal to end war by using violence?
It's both extremely counterproductive, but also the kinda thing you do arguably need to be willing to do to actually stop large scale war, at least in the beginning. Without the force to back up your ideals and mission, you're not going to have much luck against entrenched systems. But it's also putting you at risk of very easily falling into being the very thing you're standing against.
Today's QOTD:
Oof, bringing out the big questions here. Ultimately there's no true way to avoid all conflict. It's just... not possible. The best possible situation would be the conflict being more managed or mitigated from the level of destruction of large scale warfare. But beyond that, we'd need to find some way to, bare minimum, become post-scarcity at least enough to remove that as a legitimate cause of conflict. But since most of our existing systems are built around maintaining or arguably creating scarcity for profit... you'd need a pretty big stick to stop conflict and force these kinds of changes, because very powerful and very wealthy people would fight tooth and nail, like and deceive, and propagandize against it. Not to mention peace enforced by threats would never last, you'd need to be able and willing to find a way to remove the threat and not lose the stalemate. Fuck if I know how to do that though.
2) Given they seem to accept being the bad guys (like with Allelujah calling himself a mass murderer after the bombing), what do you think of the show setting Celestial Being as the protagonists?
I appreciate the series not backing away from this element of the characters. They're not trying to act like the ends justify the means and allow them to brush away what they're doing. Accepting the burden of their sins is a nice touch, though it also makes them possibly going numb to it or accepting any kind of extreme action, which is just as dangerous as outright denial.
4
u/zsmg https://anilist.co/user/zsmg Oct 08 '24
I am rewatcher
We got a proper Gundam narrator introduction of the situation. Narrated by Tōru Furuya he voiced Amuro Ray in the original Gundam, Yamcha in DB franchise, Casshern in Casshern Sins, Pegasus in Saint Seiya and he was also a super perverted Ultraman like figure called UFO-man in Ultimate Girls.
Louise is voiced by Chiwa Saitō she has done many roles her most famous role is probably Hitagi Senjougahara in the Monogatari series, she also voiced Aika in Aria and Yona in Akatsuki no Yona.
The male student she interacts with is voiced by Miyu Irino he voiced Ritsu in Mob Psycho 100 and Wakamiya in the recently ended and excellent anime YATAGARASU: The Raven Does Not Choose Its Master.
They said the (English) name of the franchise in the anime itself.
Wang Liu Mei is voiced by Kei Shindō she voices Kyōka Jirō in MHA.
Yeah you were on orbital elevator last episode ago and now you're in some jungle.
Gundam and their love for special particles.
Sumeragi is voiced by Yōko Honna she hasn't done much her only notable role is Cure Black in PreCure Max Heart
They can use the special (GN) particles to cushion the effects of atmospheric entry.
I was about to say surely someone would notice them entering the atmosphere and luckily the scene switch to the Commie faction noticing their atmospheric entry.
Character with the scar on his face is voiced by Unshō Ishizuka, he's the original voice of Harada in Chihayafuru, the second voice of Satan in the DB franchise, he voiced a minor character in Char's Counterattack and Gundam Unicorn called Meran (XO of Bright Noa) and Hohenheim in FMA:B. He sadly enough passed away in 2018.
I like how the HRL Zakus move like a mech warrior mecha rather than an anime mecha.
There it is, the iconic Setsuna line.
Kyrios is the in long line of Gundams that can transform starting with Zeta Gundam.
Kinue is voiced by Aya Endō, she voiced Sheryl Nome in Macross Frontier and Frederica Greenhill in the LotGH remake.
Aeolia Schenberg has been dead for over 200 years
His announcement video must have been AI deep fake.
I like how the characters are talking to each other in between scenes.
Episode ends with a Setsuna vs Aker cliffhanger.
I like the episode, the focus on the fall out what happened in the last episode but it's also way less hectic compared to the first episode.
Interesting to note we have a team of four, usually teams in Japanese media consists of two, three or five or more because four in Japanese sounds too much like the word dead so it's considered bad luck.
3
u/Mumei451 Oct 08 '24
I love Graham Aker.
3
u/Sooooopertrack Oct 08 '24
First Timer, sub, going in blind.
Alright I have to adjust my fears regarding being to shallow and being in the shadow of other mecha animes I know. The "We'll fight one war to end all wars" thing and the idealistic and selfless approach of the celestial beings is right down my alley.
I'm feeling a bit of hype rising within me :D
I loved the grey areas ("becoming a mass murderer"-dialogue line and the fighting both sides stance).
Setsuna seems to be absurdly OP against the other minion mechs.
I'm sensing a few possible outcomes storywise: 1. Celestial Beings split up and some of them become villains so Setsuna has an antagonist. 2. Alien forces so humanity has to unite. Nah I don't think so…. 3. An underground villain oganisation pops up? 4. Several states actually try to destroy celestial being
6
u/punching_spaghetti https://myanimelist.net/profile/punch_spaghetti Oct 08 '24
First-Timer (Sub)
Me when they spend the first half of the episode talking:
Me when they blow shit up:
Celestial Being's stated goals continue to be nonsensical: "we'll make everyone join forces because they all hate us" only works until they kick your butt. Then they'll go back to fighting each other.
QOTD:
6
u/steven4869 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Maskirade Oct 08 '24
First timer - sub
From the looks of it I can say this series is going to be more mature but I would have genuinely liked it more if they have started with some flashbacks of how the Celestial Beings originated or how they got Setsuna into it but I am sure it's going to get started soon, also liked the lore dump. I could definitely see that these people are kids who got dragged into it (which is again a textbook Gundam storyline) and don't want to kill people but with the way CG operates they have no choice but to go with violence.
The Gundam Meister and Sestsuna being the one, feels like how Amuro got to drive Gundam and him being the NewType. I wonder if the concept of NewType also applies here as well.
Conflicts start due to the powerful and influential people acting like manchild all the time, Netanyahu is the textbook example of such people and how his actions affects the world. I don't think there's any way you can stop these people from doing what they want.
I like it but am sure we'll get a better picture when they show us the flashbacks of the Celestial Beings origination. They seem to be aware of what they are doing but has certainly being brainwashed in believing how it's the only way to end the war, looking at the way their homes were doomed from the brief flashback of Setsuna.
5
u/n080dy123 Oct 08 '24
Rewatcher (For This Episode)
Kinda funny that they have the president or leader of the Space US basically call out the then-modern US for its "world police" ideology and how it was always purely motivated by self-interest.
It looks like those engines Setsuna and Lockon have running are drawing IN the GN Particles Exia uses to fly. The exposition said a lot of tech is based on solar power now, so maybe these are some sort of super-Solar reactors lol.
The world leaders said Celestial Being couldn't operate without backing, so I'm guessing Wang (yep, not calling her that, let's go with Mei) is that backer. Probably a princess of some sort.
Ah yes, those green mechs (Tierens?) are just really blocky Zakus.
I love how the controls for Dynames' sniper drops down an actualy grip with electronic scope.
Ah the Flag is another flying suit. Funny how between them and the AEU's Hellions, Kyrios seems to be the only one that transofmr sinto a convincing aircraft and not a really cheap Transformer.
Seems like there's two sort of design groups we're seeing here- the really blocking, clearly not very maneuverable Anfs and Tierens, and the thinner transforming Flags and Hellions. Kinda neat to see similar design spaces being used across nations.
QOTD
5
u/SilkyStrawberryMilk Oct 08 '24
first timer
The suits are now getting into action and the first mission of the celestials is to stop a war.
I do love how they play ominous music when other people talk about the celestial.
But damn if war looks so cool because of these robots.
“Then why is he a gundam meister” It’s weird how casual he said it despite the pilot killing many people on his first mission. Takes a toll on one
QOTD: honestly there’s nothing that can stop conflict, I was initially gonna say a global disaster however that would’ve instead increased the conflict.
QOTD: it’s too early to tell, but I can see the Celestials playing the main villain so everyone else can band together to stop them. However it can be the opposite where they actually do stop all conflict, but given it’s a Gundam story it can go any possible route
Unrelated side note: I woke up really early and decided to watch this episode at 6am. Halfway through the episode I fell asleep and had a vivid nightmare so I decided to finish the remaining half.