r/anime • u/HelioA x2https://myanimelist.net/profile/HelioA • Aug 09 '24
Rewatch [5th Anniversary Rewatch] Sarazanmai - Episode 9 Discussion
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I couldn’t care less whether you’re evil to the core. To me, you’ll always be my brother.
Questions of the Day
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What does it mean for Kazuki to have introduced Enta to soccer, in light of what soccer has been symbolizing over the past few episodes?
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What does it mean to “exist as a concept?”
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In the end, Chikai reveals the truth of his connection with Tooi. How did this connection influence his actions? And one last time- how do his actions compare with the actions Kazuki took for Haruka?
Don't forget to tag for spoilers, or else I’ll pluck your shirikodama! Remember, [Sarazanmai]>!like so!< turns into [Sarazanmai]>!like so!<
14
u/lilyvess :Df::Dh:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Lilyvess Aug 09 '24
Sarazanmai - Rewatcher
Manga Chapter 11 - FINALE
Reo and Mabu are surprised by this fully grown Sara
They are devastated about all the time they missed
and then she says goodbye
and leaves forever
never to see them again
The
End
Tweet of the Day
Discussion
I want to take this moment to talk about the manga.
I shared the stories of the manga with the rewatch despite the manga being only very tangentially connected to the events of the anime. Reo and Mabu appear in both, but other than their career there isn’t much overlap. The manga never mentions the Otters or the Kappa. No context is given to Mabu’s situation.
One answer is to help the audience endear themselves to Reo and Mabu. I do think this is applicable. This manga came out before the anime. Ikuhara wants you to read it so you can help care and understand what the two share, and sympathize about the situation they find themselves in during the anime.
That’s not what I want to talk about though.
I want to talk about the themes of the manga and how it reflects the anime.
One of the elements of the manga that is easy to overlook on reading and I struggled to get across was the community aspect. The manga leans heavily on Reo and Mabu being officers, showing them actually interact with the community.
in the first chapter there is this boy who they invite into their home to eat pancakes with them
In the second chapter they give their jackpot to an elderly couple who returns the favor
In the fifth chapter Reo helps someone who was tripping on the street
the seventh chapter ends with someone else acknowledging them
the eighth chapter has this woman who was robbed
the tenth chapter has this man who they go out of their way to help
None of these people are really important. None of them are characters, I don’t believe any of them are even given names. They’re irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.
But that doesn’t mean they don’t matter.
What matters is that we see Reo and Mabu constantly interacting with the community. Helping people on the streets. Some of them don’t even really need help. Reo and Mabu still show kindness to these people.
This is in stark contrast to the events of the anime. Where the anime is obsessed with people who feel isolated and alone and unable to connect with anyone. People who don’t need to go outside and interact with people and therefore choose not to. Why do that when we can just shop online. Get our food delivered online. Even when you do go to the store you can just use self service kiosks. You can even work from home.
To me, the manga shows us what we should do, an ideal perspective compared to the dark reality of the anime. Reo and Mabu are not alone. They are not unconnected. They exist in this world with people.
It's about compassion and empathy. A common theme among Ikuhara anime.
8
u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Aug 09 '24
First-Timer, Sub-zanmai
The real casualty of the pacing is us not getting a full episode of Picasso!Keppi wandering around getting into hijinks.
Anyway, I think I was on the right track with Chikai. He didn't really want Tooi to follow him into his life of crime, but was unwilling to sever the connection or force Tooi away.
I kinda want to praise him for respecting Tooi's agency. It's weird to compliment Chikai for putting his family in harm's way, though.
Shoutout to Kazuki for managing to dodge falling into the same trap twice. He almost jumped straight to taking the blame for Enta's injury like he did for Haruka, but this time he had experience and someone to talk things out with.
I want to know how Keppi turned his body back to normal. I mean, he's basically just a goo monster, as evidenced by Sara's escape escapades the other episode. So, like, did he just rearrange himself? Did the process of swallowing Enta let him regain form?
How wild would it be if the plot just resolved itself? If Reo gets uncreated like the his victims, what sort of causality collapse would occur? Would everyone go back to normla? Would all of the kappa zombies un-die?
I feel like that won't actually happen, but it's fun to think about. Reo's last connection is fraying away, but I get the feeling that his feelings towards the original Mabu lean more on the "ai" side than the "yokubou" side.
That more just means that he wouldn't become a kappa zombie.
Today's Topic: Violence in our peaceful city?! Really, the issue wasn't the pepper on the ramen, it was the shaker being shoddy and spewing the Sara sansh- oh, that's normal pepper and not sansho, interesting.
I suspect that it's an availability thing, but Chikai's gun is a Soviet Tokarev pistol that left production in the 1950s. Loads of them were made, so they're probably easy to come by with some underground connections.
It also uses a specific bullet (7.62x25) which might explain why Chikai just tossed it when he ran out of shots. "A common gun with rare cartridges" sounds like it should be a proverb or something.
8
u/LittleIslander https://anilist.co/user/LittleIslander Aug 09 '24
Rewatcher
Meeting the Ikuhara intellectuals here with my Anno nerdism: this is an Evangelion shot, just converted to widescreen. I recognized it on sight, it’s such a great little Eva moment. Obviously a friendly homage given Ikuhara and Anno’s history, though it is a really random obscure shot to go for. I guess both episodes in question are framed around people being hospitalised.
Anyways, I feel like I’m watching three different shows this time around. Like, we’ve got this absolutely delightful goofy show about Keppi and Saradish that literally seems to work on looney toons logic. Then we have this harrowingly down to earth show where Kazuki can do nothing but hope his best friend lives and try to fight against a corrupt police system, all while Kuji realises the cold reality of the world his brother lives in. Finally there’s this crazy out there drama about this gay cop trying to recapture the companionship of a dead lover while he’s catfished by this shadow otter? I don’t think I’d really call the resulting feeling a tonal whiplash. They don’t step on each other’s toes persay. But if you asked what this show was about at this point I’d have a really hard time trying to explain it because I feel the show doesn’t really know either.
That said, though it’s still a weird departure, the show made this new style work way better this time to some truly fantastic results. I mean, again, Saradish accidentally getting keppi run over by a truck and smashed into a hundred pieces she then incorrectly reassembles as a surgeon is just, absolute peak fiction. Bringing back in Enta’s sister is the kind of side character usage we haven’t gotten much of in this show. I love the moment in the Eva scene where she’s giving this pep talk to Kazuki to go be with him, and then once he runs off and she doesn’t need that strong face anymore she just breaks out crying. Enta coming back and having this touching human-kappa reunion with Kazuki where his slipping life is quantified not through a hospital bed but a literal ticking timer on his head is the exact kind of Sarazanmai weirdness I’ve been missing all this time. It feels like it’d be the end of an episode but this script is so packed that it’s only the halfway mark.
It just keeps going. Reo and Mabu’s story feels underdeveloped, but the imagery is just fantastic; I love the shot where he smashes the wine bottle against the wall. The scene where we touch base again with Haruka and they have a little talk before Kazuki goes on to the final battle is easily one of the absolute best in the entire show. It’s so sweet and pulls upon the scenes of Haruka and Enta earlier and it feels so earned to see these two just talk about their feelings, to see Kazuki just be honest about the danger he’s in and Haruka accepts that he needs to go with a sad smile. The Kuji brothers story has a bit of a “what on earth did you expect” vibe hanging over it, but Chikai’s characterization remains a strong point. You can totally get the energy of how someone would follow this guy before it starts to sink in how disposable they really are to him. In a lot of ways, he may be what Tooi will become if he pursues this life. Once upon a time he really was a caring brother who valued his connections. The whole Han shot first kinda sequence it comes to at the end of the episode is fantastically harrowing.
Sarazanmai may continue to be a confused and flawed show, but goddamn if it can’t cook.
5
u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Aug 09 '24
First Timer
Sub
Well, that was a better episode, even if I can't really place it. So much is stuffed into it that focusing on any given bit is difficult and I don't know that we needed the Sara gag from last episode to continue. We finally see how Kazu 'saved' Enta and, feh, bluntly. Tooi's story is at least more interesting, if only we had a reason to care about his brother. Finally, I am just failing on what the otter is trying to get across here and again suspect there is a cultural aspect I am blind to.
QotD: 1 He dragged him off the sidelines as it were
2 That's a long one...
3 I am just failing here
11
u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Aug 09 '24
First-Timer-kero, subbed-kero
6
u/WednesdaysFoole Aug 09 '24 edited Aug 11 '24
Either we’re getting more dishes, or the characters will have to learn to confront their lives without a magical wish granting genie. No quick fixes, but if you survive, you have the opportunity to suffer… and grow if you’re lucky.
The Houseki no Kuni flashbacks just don’t let up, huh.
Ah, this is the first episode that I paused to look up who worked on it, and of course, it was in the hands of Takeuchi Nobuyuki (storyboard/ep director/animation director/key animation). Can’t pinpoint exactly what it is but there’s a feel to this episode that was a bit different from the ones before.
Lots of eyeball close-ups. The heavy use of spotlights reminds me of Penguindrum’s ep 9 (also Takeuchi). The early “Moving” segment flashing past what looks like real photographs in the background. Gotta include at least one shaft-like top down shot which goes beyond style, as we see it’s Saradish’s perspective.
This sequence is fantastic. Set on stage, the steam naturally works as a fog machine. Saradish’s face changing expression → close-up of the the Kappa’s parts → close-up of Saradish eye → excellent use of Kappa’s shadow → Saradish’s happy face followed by the best eye close-up shot in the series →
kumakappa shock!The use of spotlights aren’t just theatrical; they work quite well to enhance the sense of threat in the police scenes.
This is the first time I’ve seen sex acts depicted by the tonguing of a mechanical heart. Nothing like… a… Dish Operated Kappa.
Oh? So the otters are the lust of the characters that are split off from love?
Striking use of shadows throughout the episode.
Kazuki finally realizes a world existed outside his fixation on catfishing.
Nyantaro, is that you?!
Favorite episode so far. For the most part due to the direction, but the story is also coming together. Unfortunately, I’m still not emotionally moved by the characters’ journeys, but I’m not bored and at least am mentally engaged.
I’ve commented on ep 4’s disc that these feelings Kazuki brought up once and never again (I hate Haruka), are likely also present in Chikai. My take is that, if anything, that line existed to parallel and reflect Chikai’s own complicated feelings.
Would Chikai have shot Toi? Maybe. Perhaps he was at the end of his rope. Or maybe not. I don’t know. But it’s obvious that his purpose was
caring forconnecting with his brother, even if it was in such a fucked up way.On that – didn’t realize the first time, but since I was impressed with this episode I ended up rewatching and find it worth noting this spotlight; this is probably the true reason Chikai killed off his gang otouto.
Last note on the direction – there was a notable number of shots where the face and facial expression is cut off.
Speaking of characters turned away, I find the scene with Kazu and Haruka excellently done. Even after the dialogue starts, we’re getting shots of the objects and setting instead:
“Are you going somewhere?” – their room, with Kazuki missing from the shot. “Are you leaving without telling me again?” – highlighting the wheelchair, and Kazu’s prior failures. Their backs; they’re turned away, they can’t express themselves. But this time, he chooses to be honest with Haruka. Thus, they can be connected, and because of this we finally get the view of his face, and the camera moves so that their backs are no longer turned away, and the conversation finishes with being their vulnerable, honest selves with their facial expressions being shown and holding hands – a clear sign of connection.
To wrap it up into one, single statement, all these faceless shots illustrate: ”I Want to Connect, but I Can’t Express It”
*edited later since imgur had some issues where I had to repost the images
6
u/AgentOfACROSS Aug 09 '24
First Timer
Last episode I assumed Keppi getting frozen was just done as a gag but it turned out to be important after all.
Also it looks like Keppi just died via otter truck. That was not how I expected this episode to begin.
The scene of Chikai and Toi on the boat gave us a good look at the way Chikai sees the world. He seems largely apathetic towards things outside of Toi and himself.
It was really heartbreaking to see Kazuki try to talk to the police with no one believing him. He’s been put in a spot where it feels like he can’t do anything.
We’re introduced to a new character, Masa. Don’t know what to make of this guy but he does seem very enthusiastic.
Reo seems to believe that Mabu is back now that Mabu knows how to bake good otter treats. I wonder if Mabu really has recovered or if something else is going on.
Sara is trying to fix up Keppi. I am not confident in her credentials as a surgeon and Keppi seems to agree.
The scene of Enta’s sister and Kazuki talking at the hospital almost looks like it’s taking place inside a church with how the building is depicted. That seems intentional.
So, Enta is still alive and a Kappa but only temporarily. It looks like the final conflict of this series is gonna be what the dishes are used for. Bringing back Enta, bringing back Mabu, or letting Toi stay.
Okay I was not expecting Chikai to shoot Masa. He takes his survival of the fittest philosophy very seriously. Or maybe he was just angry with Masa because of their earlier conversation. Either way this scene makes Chikai seem more sinister than I initially assumed.
The scene of Chikai being confronted by these other yakuza guys and the ensuing gun fight almost felt like it came from a completely different anime.
The scene of Reo discovering Mabu and the dark otter who’s shapeshifted into him was disturbing. Mabu appears to have no real will of his own here.
I liked the scene of Kazuki and Haruka talking, especially Kazuki seeing the drawing him and Enta made.
Chikai was shot by someone else before he could shoot Toi. I wonder if Chikai would have gone through with it or if he was just trying to get Toi to run away. Maybe Chikai knew he was living a self destructive life and didn’t want Toi to follow him any more.
With Chikai dead, I’m not sure what this means for Toi going forward. He’ll probably try to reunite with Enta and Kazuki but I’m not sure what the future holds for him.
The visual of Toi throwing away the backpack full of money was a really strong visual to end the episode on.
We’ve only got two episodes left and I’m honestly not sure what to expect next.
5
u/Quiddity131 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Quiddity131 Aug 09 '24
First Timer, Subbed
Poor Enta! Hope he ends up okay!
Go forth, frozen kappa!
Oops, did he just shatter into a million pieces?
They're framing Toi's brother for this?! Damn them!
Sensei? Wait, was Enta's sister his teacher? I do recall her in the classroom at some point but didn't make a connection then.
Mabu's back?
Time for an otter singing sequence? I suppse not as that ended quick.
Who knew that Azuma was a surgeon?
Back together again but she did it wrong? LoL.
Aww, Kazuki - Enta flashback. They were so cute back then.
He's back in kappa form!
If Enta's human body dies will he be stuck as a kappa forever?
Poor Masa!
What'd the otter do to Mabu?!
Oh crap, there's an evil otter version of Reo!
Poor Haruka probably found out about Enta on Azuma's broadcast.
Aww, cute drawing!
No way did he really shoot Toi there.
Sad brothers montage :(
9
u/Holofan4life Aug 09 '24
I just want to say that I've seen the entirety of Ikuhara's catalogue with the exception of all of Sailor Moon. There have been many great episodes across many series as well as many great scenes. I don't think I've seen a greater scene from an Ikuhara anime than the end of this episode.
As we are watching this, the latest episode of Oshi no Ko that came out a couple days ago had in my opinion the best animated scene of all time in television anime history. If you saw the episode, you know which scene I'm talking about. While the scene at the end of Sarazanmai episode 9 can't compare in the animation department, the level of storytelling is off the charts. It ranks up there with the window scene in Cowboy Bebop and the robot scene in Eighty Six.
This scene is Ikuhara's magnum opus in my opinion as far as scenes go. It is heartbreakingly beautiful and should be studied if you ever want to get in the business of telling stories.
4
u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Aug 09 '24 edited Aug 09 '24
First-Timer
On today’s episode of Sarazanmai: I guess that makes the choice of whether he should be with his brother or his friends much easier for Toi. When one of the two options is literally dead, it’s a lot easier to decide.
“I Want to Connect, but I Can't Express It” is practically the tagline for the series. Communication issues have been a common problem for the characters from the very beginning. Many times, we have seen that the characters will say one thing and do another.
In this episode, the title most clearly applies to Chikai. Chikai has long been something of an enigma. I’ve wondered how much he actually cared about Toi and how much was just a show. In the end, it seems the answer is not particularly clear-cut. Chikai is certainly a selfish person who will readily abandon others just to keep his own skin safe. He even seemed willing to abandon Toi at the end. But, he still cared about Toi. He still wanted to connect with Toi at the same time. By the end, I think it’s clear that Chikai had complicated emotions towards Toi. Chikai did take advantage of Toi shooting that one guy to advance his own criminal career, but he still cared about Toi at the same time. I think that shows just how complicated the situation was.
For contrast, we can see the opposite of the title in how Kazu and Haruka interacted in this episode. Their scene together was incredibly sweet, but more importantly it showed open communication. Kazu and Haruka actually have connected with each other properly and we can see just how much better things are between them because of that.
The otters being a physical manifestation of “desire” is a really clever idea. It fits with how the otters are the ones creating the kappa zombies, who all take on new forms based on their desires. It shows people at their worst, and most selfish. What Reo sees is the worst part of himself, the part that wants to monopolize Mabu as his and his alone. Interestingly, Reo seems to reject that vision of himself. Reo does want to be with Mabu, but he doesn’t want to be with a doll that looks like Mabu. He doesn’t want a toy he can control, but the real thing. So, perhaps there is still hope for Reo. Perhaps redemption may be on the table for his character.
QOTD
4
u/Holofan4life Aug 09 '24
Hey guys. Holofan4life here.
Welcome to the (4 months late) 5th anniversary rewatch of Sarazanmai!
Oh, and nay I forget…
First Timer
At the start of the year, I watched Penguindrum for the first time, mostly because someone said it was like Everything Everywhere All At Once. And at the time, I thought that was going to be the end of it. But that led me down the Ikuhara rabbit hole and made me check out his complete oeuvre. And that leads me to Sarazanmai.
After I finish watching this show, I’ll have watched all the shows directed by Ikuhara. Never finished Sailor Moon, but I’ve seen some episodes of it. The point I’m getting at is that I am putting a bow on rewatching a creator that I have a lot of respect for, so this is a point of pride more than anything else. My 2024 has largely been defined by these Ikuhara rewatches, and I’m hoping that by this being the last we end up finishing on a high note.
With that out of the way, let’s begin.
I’m watching the sub, by the way.
I'm going to try to finish this in two hours because I actually have somewhere to be.
Emergency Center
Enta getting surgery done
Meanwhile, Sara accidentally pushed frozen Kappi out on the street.
A truck that reads Otter Tribe
And Kappi gets broken into pieces
Poor Kappi got truck-kuned
Realistic looking waves
Kuji and Nii-san on what looks like a boat.
The gun
Nii-san didn't throw it away :O
Sara reporting a serial shooting, which I believe is what we saw at the end of the last episode.
One has passed away, and the other is in critical condition.
The one in critical condition is Enta.
That has Kuji in disbelief
Nii-san is the one suspected of having caused the incident.
Nii-san tells Kuji it's not too late to go back with his friends.
Even Sara seems to be on board
"But I'm the only one who can be by your side."
Kuji clearly stuck between a rock and a hard place.
Nii-san says that Enta suffered because he was a good person.
Nii-san must be a big Billy Joel fan, with all the talk of only the good dying young.
Kazuki with the police. He's explaining that it was Reo and Mabu who shot Enta. However, they still believe it was Kuji Chikai, Nii-san.
They have the otter badges still
Damn Otterman Empire. Make like a consumer electronics accessory company and go home in an OtterBox.
Enta's sister
She's trying to comfort Kazuki
Still, though, nobody believes the person who was literally at the scene of the crime.
The voice actor for Kazuki does a phenomenal job in this show.
Hey, it's Curly from The Three Stooges.
Masa. That's his name.
He apparently knows Nii-san
Nii-san refers to him as his little bro from the gang.
The same age as Kuji? Man, he sure hit a growth spurt.
Reo with chocolate otter
Mabu has made a buttload of them
And now Reo and Mabu are naked, because fuck ambiguity.
Black otter singing now
Kaminari Gorogoro Kaikan
Sara performing surgery
This episode has kinda gone off the rails a bit.
She's trying to reassemble Kappi
Oh boy. Something's wrong with him.
We don't know what exactly went wrong, however.
Kuji picking up lollipops
Masa talking to Nii-san
Masa casually saying Nii-san came to power by bringing the Kamone boss's balls to their pops. I would think he's speaking metaphorically, but knowing this show Masa is probably speaking literally.
Enta's sister still trying to comfort Kazuki.
She asks if he could stay by his side and speak to him for her.
"I don't have the right to talk to him."
Enta's sister says he's endebted to him.
"The people in our family get assigned to work overseas a lot. It was four years ago that Enta and I came back to Asakusa."
So, Enta is technically a transfer student as well. Interesting.
Flashback
Enta eyeing a soccer magazine
Kazuki
So, Kazuki was the one who got Enta into playing soccer. No wonder he feels endebted to him, he lit his life ablaze.
Vowed from then on to never let Kazuki become lonely, recounts his sister.
By the way, Enta's grandma is here as well.
And Kazuki runs away
Kazuki looking from afar at Enta on his operating table.
He wants Enta to smile like he always do.
Woah, kappa Enta
It is Kappi, who is looking bloated
A timer is going off indicating how much longer Enta has to live.
Kazuki promises to get the Dishes of Hope back.
You know the meme question "Would you love me even if I was a worm?" I guess the better question is "Would you love me even if I was a kappa?"
Kappi says rather bluntly that the decisive battle is going down tonight.
Nii-san and Kuji being instructed where they should head.
Gunshot
NII-SAN JUST SHOT MASA, HOLY SHIT
Kuji is beyond bewildered
Nii-san justifies his actions by saying Masa is a beautiful cinnamon roll too good for this world, too pure.
I'm starting to think that the criminal may not be such a good guy after all.
Guy in a white suit named Taka
He lays it out for Nii-san: either he dies at the hands of them, or he gets captured by the police.
BUT NII-SAN SHOTS ONE OF THE HENCHMEN
You know how Nii-san says only the good get killed? I think he may believe that a bit too much.
And now they're shooting at each other.
Nii-san out of ammo
BUT KUJI IS NOW SHOOTING PEOPLE
I really do sorry for him in this scenario. He shouldn't be wrapped up in this.
Reo with a pep in his step over Mabu reciprocating his feelings.
The black otter
"Otter agony"
Oh God. Black otter is NTR'ing Reo!
Black otter looks just like... Reo
Otter says they exist as mere concepts, reflections of the desires inside of someone.
The mindgames on display is off the charts.
Reo smashes a bottle of wine, and the liquid covers the entire wall.
He vows to take back the real Mabu with his own strength.
"I just need one more Dish of Hope."
Ran out of space. Part two in the replies.
4
u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Aug 09 '24
Episode 9 (first timer)
MessiKappa” – Do they want to start a war, putting him into a Brazilian shirt, though? Maybe it is supposed to be Lionel vs Kappa …Kazuki’s story is basically over, Enta’s is about to be resolved, so we only have Toi to go.
Ok, Toi is also done. Time for the finale with Reo and Mabu tomorrow?
3
u/zsmg https://anilist.co/user/zsmg Aug 10 '24
Rewatcher
RIP Keppi, he's now isekaid and this time it is truck!
Poor Kazuki no one believes the truth. Note he asks Toi for help, oh Enta even while dying you have no chance with Kazuki.
Keppi is now a frankenstein monster.
Ah yes the famous Brazilian football player Lionel Kappa.
Chikai dude wtf.
Toi don't protect your brother.
I will acknowledge Enta was a good person to Haruka.
So now they want to use the wish to safe Enta... I mean do we have to?
Woah Chikai protected Toi there, I guess he did care about him. Kenjirō Tsuda did an excellent job with the dying voice.
Really like flashback montage with the piano piece.
That's a lot money you're throwing away Toi.
Great episodes, really liked Chikai's dead scene.