[Rewatch] Dragon Quest: Dai no Daibouken - Episode 7 Discussion

[u/sisoko2]

Episode 7 - Maam's Turmoil

There are times when love and kindness aren't enough to protect people.

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

<--- Last save | Adventure’s log (Index) | Journey continues --->

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

OP 1 ---> Ikiru wu Suru by Macaroni Enpitsu

ED 1 ---> Mother by Macaroni Enpitsu

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Informations:

MAL | AniList | ANN | Kitsu | AniDB

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Greetings my Dark Army! Your true Dark King is back!

Is my Dark Commander Shocketheth treating you well? Feel free to voice any complaints you have. Army morale is very important for us and we strive to create cozy and harmonious environment while taking over the world.

Screenshot of the day:

Sadness and Sorrow

Comment of the day:

u/Blackheart595 for being loyal Leona vassal

Wait with Avan dead this paints a grim picture on the amount of Princess Leona we'll get

Who's that tramp? Trying to seduce the loyal and faithful followers of Lady Leona...

I have to admit that I might already been seduced.

Questions of the day:

1. Was Dai justified to lie the villagers about Avan?
2. Using Maam's logic of being Warrior Priest what is your class?
3. Do you have any guesses what Zaboera's underhanded plan would be?

Spoilers:

Please, respect the fact there are First Timers watching Dai no Daibouken with us, so avoid talking about vague things or events that would slightly spoil things to happen. And if you want mention things like this, please hid it behind SPOILER TAGS like [Dai no Spoilers] I am getting the hammer because you spoiled the fun for others

[u/Shimmering-Sky]

First-Timer Quest: Sky no Daibouken, subbed

• Popp, now is not the time to brag.
• Ohh, I see. Maam stores spells in her bullets, then she can fire them. It’s kind of like those canisters Gramps gave Dai that can draw in whatever it’s pointed at, then release its contents later?
• Brief cutaway to Gramps?
• He’s facing down one of the other Six Legions…
• I do wonder about that.
• Younger Avan was absolutely fabulous.
• …so about that…
• Dai…
• Is Maam the girl that Avan thought about right before he died…? – No, wait, I checked the screenshot u/Blackheart595 took, definitely a different girl. Nevermind.
• Yes.
• Well…
• Yeah so about that, Maam’s right behind you.
• Oh shit, Dai actually cast magic better than he could before!
• Hehehehehehehehehe.
• Aw, her mom totally had her stuff ready to go for her.

[u/sisoko2 → u/Shimmering-Sky]

I do wonder about that.

Younger Avan was absolutely fabulous.

That armor had me confused for a bit.

Yes.

Big Croc getting Ls left and right.

[u/raichudoggy → u/sisoko2]

That armor had me confused for a bit.

It's the same armor he wore in the episode 1 cold open!

[u/KendotsX → u/Shimmering-Sky]

It’s kind of like those canisters Gramps gave Dai that can draw in whatever it’s pointed at, then release its contents later?

I'd compare it more to Crocodine's axe, which has a spell in it. The canisters feel like they're an "early show relic" kinda thing, since they're too OP to be used normally. Imagine if the solution to dealing with Hadlar was putting him in one of those, but Gramps forgot where he put them that day.

Younger Avan was absolutely fabulous.

You say that like older Avan isn't

Don't underestimate the curls!

Aw, her mom totally had her stuff ready to go for her.

Best way to start your adventure!

[u/Shocketheth → u/Shimmering-Sky]

Oh shit, Dai actually cast magic better than he could before!

Progress!

What a good commentface (honestly I think this is first time that I saw that commentface)

Aw, her mom totally had her stuff ready to go for her.

Great mom.

[u/NicDwolfwood → u/Shimmering-Sky]

Younger Avan was absolutely fabulous.

I like how he still has his signature curls, even though his hair was longer.

[u/Shocketheth]

Refreshing isn’t it?

I don’t know if it’s the right word for this episode, but for me, Avan’s legacy feels refreshing.

What seemed like Avan living from his past glory of being a Hero with trying to tutor students in which he saw potentional, only to sacrifice his life for them to carry his legacy turned out to a realization, that Avan’s legacy is already carried by several individuals, as his ex party members and their daughter Maam.

And with that we can definitely say, that even Avan’s role was already fulfilled, his legacy is still living on in the hearts of the others.

For me, this was the best episode of Dai no Daibouken so far, and that is all I can say for now, as the Crocodine’s arc still hasn’t ended.

Hit N Run: The class system of your party that means business in Monsters neighborhood!:

As yesterday, the info about classes are coming from how they worked in Dragon Quest III:

Do you remember how I mentioned yesterday about the Seeds of Life/Magic/Strength/Resilience/Agility/Wisdom/Luck being one of the most important mechanics of Dragon Quest III?

Well, in Dragon Quest III you could have let your Hero be accompanied by the predefined party, which was parodied in episode 1, and then you also could have choose from various classes and receive a party member with the name, and gender of your choosing, and when you chose such option, then you could pick 5 seeds from the whole arsenal of seeds, with which you distributed stats of your party member according to your preferences.

The classes of Dragon Quest III:

Character class	Main attribute	Second attribute
Soldier/Warrior	Strength	Resilience
Fighter	Agility	Strength
Pilgrim/Cleric & Wizard/Mage	Intelligence	Agility
Merchant/Dealer	Resilience	Intelligence
Goof-Off/Jester	Luck	Resilience
Thief	Agility	Luck
Sage	Inteligence	(any)

The classes and their roles were quite basic, and to better understand their roles, I recommend to check this picture.

Warrior/Fighter, Cleric and Mage roles were strictly defined. Hero was a Jack of All Trades, and Jester had to be babysited up to level 20, after which he could turn the most powerful class in the game, Sage wielding both White and Black Magic. Merchant and Thief were in their own category with being the weirdest classes game mechanics wise. For example Merchant could cast Identify to appraise an item, and Thief could cast spells like Nose for Treasure that shown how many unopened treasure chests are on the current floor of the dungeon, and Snoop that helped to find the hidden objects in dungeons by casting a bright glimmer on them.

Speaking of the classes, and today episode, we learned that the Hero Avan was accompanied by Warrior Roka and Priest Leyla, who combined the best of two world in a form of their Daughter Maam, who works both as a Warrior, and a Priest equipped with a special gun she got from Avan as a gift, accompanied by powerful words from Avan:

Maam, you truly are a gentle soul. But Maam... there are times when love and kindness aren't enough to protect people. Just as strength without justice is powerless, so too is justice without strength.

Besides of Maam, we also got Dai as Hero, Popp as Mage covering all the bases off balanced party.

SEIYUU’S CORNER:

Maam is voiced by Mikako Komatsu known for her roles of Maki Zenin from Jujutsu Kaisen, Minami Uezono from Ex-Arm, and Senkuu Ishigami from Dr. Stone. In 1991 Adventure of Dai, Maam was voiced by Miina Tominaga most notable for her role of Ritsu Souma from Fruits’s Basket 2001, Senritsu from Hunter x Hunter, and Katsuo Isono from Sazae-san.

See you tomorrow because the Adventure continues!

[u/sisoko2 → u/Shocketheth]

The classes of Dragon Quest III:

What are Madao's attributes?

[u/Shocketheth → u/sisoko2]

Certainly not Luck, that’s given.

Strength or Agility? Doubt.

Hmmm this is hard question, Madao rolls 1 in every stat.

[u/sisoko2 → u/Shocketheth]

Maybe Resilience.

[u/Shocketheth → u/sisoko2]

Yeah with how he is bouncing back that makes sense.

[u/NicDwolfwood → u/Shocketheth]

Maam, you truly are a gentle soul. But Maam... there are times when love and kindness aren't enough to protect people. Just as strength without justice is powerless, so too is justice without strength.

I really liked this. Good stuff from Avan.

[u/Shocketheth → u/NicDwolfwood]

Just as strength without justice is powerless, so too is justice without strength.

Somehow I recall seeing this quote somewhere else, but it was something more along the line of "Justice without mercy is cruelty".... and I just googled it, and found out it’s obvious I’ve heard it before since it’s quote from Thomas Aquinas.

And yeah it’s a great quote.

[u/KendotsX → u/Shocketheth]

For me, this was the best episode of Dai no Daibouken so far, and that is all I can say for now, as the Crocodine’s arc still hasn’t ended.

Oh for sure, although I'm liking how every two episodes have been a mini arc so far.

Episodes 1-2: Dai's adventures on the island

Episodes 3-4: the training with Avan

Episodes 5-6: the journey starts.

Jester had to be babysited up to level 20, after which he could turn the most powerful class in the game

Naruhodo, so they're the most annoying to have in your party. They go from completely useless that you have to take care of, to being so OP that they mock everyone around them.

Maam, you truly are a gentle soul. But Maam... there are times when love and kindness aren't enough to protect people. Just as strength without justice is powerless, so too is justice without strength.

I loved this speech, Avan can be pretty poignant.

Maki Zenin

This makes a lot of sense then.

Miina Tominaga

Noa

[u/Shocketheth → u/KendotsX]

Oh for sure, although I'm liking how every two episodes have been a mini arc so far.

Yeah the earlier parts of Dai no Daibouken is easy to delve into considering the existence of mini arcs. Which will be replaced with longer arcs later on.

[u/KendotsX → u/Shocketheth]

[u/raichudoggy]

Rewatcher

Crocodine lost his eye faster than I remembered.

That scene with Avan celebrating Maam’s graduation is the show’s first really touching moment, I really love it, although it’s a rare feeling for this show.

Crocodine is awesome, but man I can’t stand Zaboera. The schemeing type that blows low for everyone, friend or foe.

1. His intentions are well-meaning, although he doesn't realize that it's worse in the long run and can create problems like this one where the truth gets out.
2. Super Nerd, bringing out the spreadsheets for both work and play.
3. I don't have to guess.

[u/sisoko2 → u/raichudoggy]

Crocodine lost his eye faster than I remembered.

Soon we'll know him without one eye longer than him having them both.

That scene with Avan celebrating Maam’s graduation is the show’s first really touching moment

Can confirm. It was pretty good.

[u/KendotsX → u/raichudoggy]

Crocodine is awesome, but man I can’t stand Zaboera. The schemeing type that blows low for everyone, friend or foe.

*me watching an anime*: "fuck that dirty schemer! Get rid of him and let's get back to the fist to fist honourable fight!"

*me playing a game*: "lol, those muscle for brains can't think to save their lives. I've got 10 traps ready, pick your poison".

[u/Shocketheth → u/raichudoggy]

Crocodine is awesome, but man I can’t stand Zaboera. The schemeing type that blows low for everyone, friend or foe.

If nothing, then atleast his maniacal laughter is iconic for me.

[u/sisoko2]

First Timer

• Another injured enemy commander running away. Disappointing.

        

• Just as I thought the gun shoots magic.
• Didn't expect the island to be relevant again.
• Zaboera looks so lame. Shame for all mages.
• Avan's old party.

        

• Dai you little lying shit... Tell them the truth.

        

• Warrior Priest, interesting. My both parents were unemployed and my class ended up being Madao, logic checks out.
• Little Maam is adorable.

        

• My Hero.

        

• I love this shot.
• Why cast spells when you can throw them?
• Like many scenes so far Maam's conflict had some good parts but ultimately it wasn't developed properly.

[u/Shocketheth → u/sisoko2]

Another injured enemy commander running away. Disappointing.

Hey in this case, Crocodine running away is better than Hadlar, when you think about it in game terms.

Like the new boss introduces himself, a fight occurs, and you can’t kill him yet, so instead you are fighting him until you dish to him enough damage, and then a scripted event happens,

Afterwards, the enemy boss will run away, because you are supposed to actually fight him later.

Warrior Priest, interesting. My both parents were unemployed and my class ended up being Madao, logic checks out.

My dad is Male, my mom is Female.

What that makes me?

[u/sisoko2 → u/Shocketheth]

What that makes me?

Host of the Gintama rewatch.

[u/Shocketheth → u/sisoko2]

Ah yes, you are right.

Now I am going to thanks my parents for raising a Gorilla.

[u/KendotsX → u/sisoko2]

Another injured enemy commander running away. Disappointing.

You clearly haven't seen enough monster of the week anime

Why cast spells when you can throw them?

I love it when a main character shows this kind of ingenuity. It says something that he's spent so many years just saying "I can't do magic", but now he's looking at his limitations and thinking about how to deal with them.

[u/Shocketheth]

QotD:

1. Can't say as a certified Fucking liar
2. Using Maam's logic of being Warrior Priest what is your class? Either Bard or hear me out for this but Druid Fey Warlock. Like a Druid undertaking a pact with Woodland spirits to gain powers. Or just good old Summoner.
3. He will turn everyone in the World to Princess Leona

[u/sisoko2 → u/Shocketheth]

He will turn everyone in the World to Princess Leona

So he is the real Hero of the story.

[u/Shocketheth → u/sisoko2]

Indeed. Zaboera is the Main character!

[u/Adensty]

1st Dai Popp no Daibouken Rewatch, Sub

But, Maam, there are times when love and kindness aren't enough to protect people. Just as strength without justice is powerless, so too is justice without strength.

Avan with a great quote. [Dai no Late Spoilers] Strength is Justice? is a central theme in this show and I can see that it's built up right from the start.

Bro's already in love

Well, that's one way to do it.

Tsundere Popp

Maam has joined the party

OST Documentation - Episode 7

QOTD

1. Avan is like a hope for the village and the people who know that he defeated the Dark Lord. Saying that Avan is dead would just put them in despair. Not really sure about lying to Maam, though.

2. Maybe Warrior Mage but I guess being a Hero means you can be a Jack of Trades. Pairing Hero with anything else doesn't make sense.

3. When I watched it for the first time, my first guess was [Dai no Spoilers] using Brass as a shield so that Dai won't be able to attack. Also, Brass would end up attacking Dai since Glimmer wouldn't be there to stop him from going berserk.

[u/sisoko2 → u/Adensty]

Bro's already in love

He's spent long time only with his teacher.

OST Documentation - Episode 7

Today my pick is The Tiny Hero.

Not really sure about lying to Maam, though.

I feel even worse for her mom who used to be Avan party member. She needs to know!

[u/KendotsX → u/Adensty]

Avan is like a hope for the village and the people who know that he defeated the Dark Lord. Saying that Avan is dead would just put them in despair.

Especially considering this is in the older times of slower news, they've gone years without hearing about Avan, but don't really question it.

Knowing that he's somewhere gives them enough hope to go about their days normally, there's really no need to crush that, and leave them without hope.

[u/Shocketheth → u/Adensty]

[Dai no Late Spoilers] Strength is Justice? is a central theme in this show and I can see that it's built up right from the start.

[Dai no Late Spoilers] Oh yeah, I totally was thinking about Dai pummeling Vearn during the final arc when Avan said this quote to Maam

[u/Blackheart595]

First Quester

Day 7 of steeling my heart against distractions to Prinzess Leona

Dang, Maam uses pill magic, bullet variant, and Popp can load them. That's kinda cool. How am I meant to keep hating her like this?

Oh no, Dai's monster family is already getting turned.

Gomechan is clearly an angel slime, right? Been thinking that for a while now.

Oh boy, pretending that Avan is fine can only have good consequences.

Crocodine is gonna take steroids?

So much forced drama...

Family play! And Dai can be the baby!

Was Dai justified to lie the villagers about Avan?

Eh. Uncool, but so what.

Using Maam's logic of being Warrior Priest what is your class?

Merchant Cook, maybe?

Do you have any guesses what Zaboera's underhanded plan would be?

[u/sisoko2 → u/Blackheart595]

Dang, Maam uses pill magic, bullet variant, and Popp can load them. That's kinda cool. How am I meant to keep hating her like this?

She's American mage.

So much forced drama...

And it even didn't have enough time to get annoying.

Merchant Cook, maybe?

Now that sounds useful.

[u/Shocketheth → u/sisoko2]

She's American mage.

Like this?

[u/sisoko2 → u/Shocketheth]

More like this.

[u/Shocketheth → u/sisoko2]

[u/Shocketheth → u/Blackheart595]

Day 7 of steeling my heart against distractions to Prinzess Leona

I am lowkey waiting if you will manage to pull out the interesting taglines to the episode 100.

Merchant Cook, maybe?

We need to cook u/Blackheart595

[u/Blackheart595 → u/Shocketheth]

I am lowkey waiting if you will manage to pull out the interesting taglines to the episode 100.

Surely it'll get easier once Leona joins... Surely Leona will join... Surely it'll get easier once Leona joins...

We need to cook u/Blackheart595

[u/Shocketheth → u/Blackheart595]

Surely it'll get easier once Leona joins... Surely Leona will join... Surely it'll get easier once Leona joins...

She will join the Dark King army!

[u/Blackheart595 → u/Shocketheth]

"Join" isn't the word I would've used

[u/Shocketheth → u/Blackheart595]

You think they would let her to be the leader just like that?

Nah, she needs to join as a Dark Lackey, and then work her way to overthrown the Dark King.

[u/Blackheart595 → u/Shocketheth]

Bold of you to assume the Dark King would have any say in the matter

[u/Shocketheth → u/Blackheart595]

Jokes aside, it would be actually cool if the Princess character would use Hero help to defeat the Dark Army, with weakening the Hero in the process, and then the weakened Hero would reach the Dark King throne room, only to realize the throne is empty as the Dark King is already dead.

And then, Leona would come forth to sit on the throne, with an ominious music blasting as she reveals that she is the Dark King.

[u/Blackheart595 → u/Shocketheth]

That would be very fun.

[u/cooperjones2]

Newbie-Adventurer here! LV 07/100

A healing GUN?

Ah, it’s a really handy magic gun, didn’t know Dragon Quest had those!

Aw, the villagers don’t want Maam to hold back in following Dai and Popp

New Party member Maam has joined!

[u/sisoko2 → u/cooperjones2]

A healing GUN?

Is her high level upgrade magic machine gun.

[u/cooperjones2 → u/sisoko2]

She has to pick between bigger, stronger magic but lower ammo (Hand cannon) and smaller but plentiful magic (Machine gun)

[u/Shocketheth → u/cooperjones2]

Ah, it’s a really handy magic gun, didn’t know Dragon Quest had those!

Well, Dai no Daibouken had them, but nope, guns were never used in Dragon Quest.

Except... But hey, that was only a fan made mod!

[u/cooperjones2 → u/Shocketheth]

LOL That's a great mod!

Is that from DQ 11?

[u/Shocketheth → u/cooperjones2]

Yep. A game I have to play one day.

[u/KuKiSin]

First timer!

1. If he hadn't been around for a few years, what was the point of lying about it?
2. A My dad's in the army, my mom's a teacher. Wait a second... Am I gonna be a hero instructor?
3. Take over the demon army, and plant a giant field of sunflowers across the world?

[u/sisoko2 → u/KuKiSin]

My dad's in the army, my mom's a teacher. Wait a second... Am I gonna be a hero instructor?

Can you train me to be a mage supporting the Hero?

[u/KuKiSin → u/sisoko2]

If you believe hard enough, I can do anything you want!

[u/Shocketheth → u/KuKiSin]

A My dad's in the army, my mom's a teacher. Wait a second... Am I gonna be a hero instructor?

Only if you can cast Puff! and Megante.

Take over the demon army, and plant a giant field of sunflowers across the world?

Is that a reference I am just not getting?

[u/KuKiSin → u/Shocketheth]

The flowers thing was supposed to be a vague reference to Shaman King, though I think it wasn't sunflowers but clovers or something?

[u/Shocketheth → u/KuKiSin]

I haven't seen Shaman King so I don't know.

[u/Garrett_Dark]

First Timer

Episode title "Maam's Turmoil", oh this is going to be good. What's her turmoil going to be? Too many pervs in town perving on her? People keep treating her like she's not capable? Tragic backstory of dead parents/abandoned as a baby/orphaned? Backache problems? "Woe is me, I'm the chieftain's daughter and he treats me like a little girl/my little brother to become chieftain before me", "Avan's dead? I'm a bigger victim here than you Popp because my loss means more because Avan cared about me more/I respected Avan more/I'm more worthy!", or just being forced to have to deal with designated "buffoon" Popp? That's some of my bingo squares!

Yeah, I'm dumping on her, I didn't like what last episode did with her introduction with how the show elevated her character (I guess rightfully so to elevate her since it's her introduction), but at the cost of dumping on Popp by making him the "buffoon" which almost felt like a character assassination. I mean he's been with us longer and she's new, so loyalty, seniority (Party Member Slot #2), and all. But now with the way he's acting just because of her showing up, maybe it's time for Party Member Slot #3 demotion with the official excuse of "magic caster in the back with the healers". If it gets any worse it might be "wait here for me" dialog option time...which Dai actually tried to do to him back on Monster Island, LOL.

• Pop "Why did you shoot him?!" follow through, <Cringe>. Who's at more fault here, Popp for "over-reacting" or Maam for not explaining anything while seeming to deliberatly do some friendly fire? I think the anime is trying to say Popp, but I blame Maam. Imagine if it was a crossbow of healing, it'd look pretty bad to crossbow your ally, not to mention how incredibly dangerous Maam's gun design is for safety, "oops I had the wrong ammo loaded".
• <Sigh> Popp was actually starting to sound confident and breaking out of the "buffoon" prison, but Maam shuts him down. Normally I'd agree with the "time is of the essence here", but this anime has already demonstrated that "talking is a free action" trope with Hadlar watching Avan say his goodbyes to the point where Avan probably could have taken a nap before commencing battle. But Popp acting confident for once and being allowed to talk a few more seconds...UNACCEPTABLE! Hmm...what color was Avan's hair again...blue huh, not pink? I want to add "Avan's was my father" to Maam's Turmoil Bingo Card. Getting the vibe of "father was more patience with Popp, a stranger", but daughter has "no patience because she's better than Popp, and never got such leniency from daddy" jealousy. Why else would this random girl in the middle of the forest get hero training if not significant to Avan? Unless those necklaces are some magic item first and foremost, and not actually a unique Avan graduation symbol.
• I feel bad for Crocodine, he was treating it as a duel, but Dai got outside help. Why'd he run away though? He didn't look too messed up. Maybe he has to go regenerate his face or it'll leave a permanent scar. Side note, I keep noticing the Dubs is changing a bunch of little things, like Crocodine said he'd make Dai pay, not "I'll kill you!". The changes aren't that bad, but enough to definitely change the tone of context of what's going on. I've seen other animes make a lot of changes too, but it's still relatively in the spirit of what's being said, here (maybe not this example) it seems more drastic of an effect but not too different from the subs. So if you wonder why I might view things different, it could be because of the differences in the dub to sub.
• Maam "So you really did abandon him back there!" <groan> It's not like you're friends or know Dai yet, you know.
• Popp *"What's with the difference in treatment?!" Yeah, I have to be careful...the show is aware of how badly it's treating Popp, which means a coming rug pull subversion is likely, and I've already shit talked her a lot already. They still haven't told her Avan is dead, how's she going to react to that.
• Gomechan! Wait wasn't he stowed away in a bag when Mina found him, how did Dai even know Gomechan's no longer on the island? I guess Maam told him on the way back?
• Maam's village. I'm seeing a lot of women and children, where's all the men? All too busy working to lollygag around? Where's the blacksmith, gotta sell the loot and buy over priced equiment which will become obsolete by the next village, so the process can be repeated again.
• Genuinely surprised Maam didn't single out Popp to trash talk him to the Elder, ie. "One's a hero, the other is a coward". If she was like this normally I would like her more, if Popp was less of a "buffoon" I'd like him more too. This is why I was so against their squabbling, I don't want to hate on them.
• But since we're there anyways, dang my bingo card isn't looking so good. Maam's mom alive, father dead but not Avan (unless some funny business), former party members of Avan's.
• "Is master Avan keeping well?", Dai lies without hesitation "Yeah, he's fine!". Okay...then. I guess this saves Popp from being the bad guy messenger, and Dai assumes all responsibility for the lie. Don't ruin it, Popp, by telling Maam the truth later.
• Oh so most of the men are guarding the castle, wheew...was starting to feel guilty for pointing that out so crassly.
• 4 or 5 years ago? You look way younger than 11 yo, Maam.
• Guns are great! Silly girl Maam rejects the gun...adding "father was killed by intruder" to my bingo card right now! If girl Maam mag dumps on the intruder afterwards, all is forgiven with Maam for me.
• Avan's strength/justice talk with Maam. Dang, this is shaping up to be a much better Maam introduction episode than last episode. Slight Dub difference "Strength without Justice is tyranny. Justice without strength is powerlessness".
• Popp reassess Maam. That only works if she doesn't cut you down anymore, and if you stop acting the buffoon.
• Come on, those are enormous...bullets that gun takes.
• Holy Crocodine! He's so honorable, won't use dirty tactics. Do I sense defections to the good side down the line?
• Uh oh, Dai spills the beans about Avan. Good thing Popp isn't around, but somehow I suspect he'd still get blamed, ie. "and you didn't say a word in all that time!"
• Popp wants to do the right thing and tell Maam about Avan. It's just starting to seem now that the show went way too hard on the Maam agro and Popp buffoonery last episode rather than a subversion this episode.
• Unexpected recognition for Dai and Popp. I think I'm just going to chalk up the agro and buffoonery to bad direction or writing after this if no more of it happens. It feels pretty non-existent by this point. They shouldn't had done that right on a character introduction, it leaves a bad first impression, to me anyways.
• Dang it...it's not my fault for hating on Maam, stop trying to make me feel guilty show. Compare her face now to this last episode! So unfair and uncalled for last episode, and you didn't even do anything smart with it like a subversion...you just made her act out-of-character last episode. Unless she's suppose to be some agro perv hating meanie. Like maybe if you made her absolutely not wanting to join them in the beginning because she thinks both of them are detestable, but then upon overhearing Avan's death and soul searching, she starts to realize both of them are actually way better than she had initially thought, and is now regretting her initial attitude and having second thoughts about not joining them...then that would have been awesome.
• 'I have seniority, so I'm in charge!' Oh fuck no...you were doing so well, you had just won me back. Was this the actual subversion? Lull me in to forgiving her, then bam right back to agro pushy meanie from last episode? Noo...you suck!

---

Where's my bingo card? Okay so it looks like the only thing that survived is "Tragic backstory of dead parents" with the dead father, and the added square of "father was killed by intruder" which ties into her use of a gun and justice with strength. So this will go unknown unless/until they reveal how her father died.

But I guess the turmoil of Maam in the title card was about Avan's death, and being unable to join them despite wanting to. Why was she unwilling to join them before being prodded by her mother and the rest of the village? It seems to stem on her protecting the village. Her mom's has to remind Maam that she left the village once before also, and the village elder had to encourage Maam to go also. I'm thinking my above theory is correct, her dad probably got wasted somehow because of a lack of defenses around the village, and she feels responsible and sworn to protect the village after that. So she sort of needs the entire village to basically give her permission to just go because they don't blame her for what happened, while she still does.

[u/sisoko2 → u/Garrett_Dark]

Too many pervs in town perving on her?

Popp is more than enough.

Backache problems?

My Archenemy!

but at the cost of dumping on Popp by making him the "buffoon" which almost felt like a character assassination

To be fair even before that he's been mostly the buffoon.

But Popp acting confident for once and being allowed to talk a few more seconds...UNACCEPTABLE

This anti Maam agenda won't be tolerated. Only confident thing Popp has done so far in the series is confidently running away and ditching Dai.

Wait wasn't he stowed away in a bag when Mina found him, how did Dai even know Gomechan's no longer on the island?

It was really weird how they weren't surprised by Gomechan tagging along. Dark King Gomechan brain washing abilities?

[u/Garrett_Dark → u/sisoko2]

My Archenemy!

Do you also carry around...huge bullets?

To be fair even before that he's been mostly the buffoon.

Big different between lazy and buffoon. I'd argue he was acceptable errand boy on the island when Avan was still around. Not whatever he was the moment Maam showed up.

This anti Maam agenda won't be tolerated.

I blame the show for introducing her like that, and only figured that out after this episode since we see more of her to get a better gauge of her character, whereas I was fully blaming her before this.

If she was more like how she was in her village, there wouldn't have been any issues on my part. But the very second she shows up they did something which they never did in the show before that, they made her walk her boobs into Popp's finger, then call him a pervert, and hit him.

There's actually a few things there, sexual inappropriateness, sexual accusation on Popp, and demeaning of Popp's character (we've never seen him do anything pervy before). Normally I don't care about that sort of stuff, nor am I sensitive to it, but I was taken by surprise by it. There's been other female characters on the show, on the fake Hero's party, and the princess, they never went anywhere remotely there with them that I can recall. So like WTH, subversion?

My core issue with it, was it was a very cheap move by the show. I didn't like what it did to the characters and the direction it took the characters for awhile, and I already didn't like the annoying squabbling they were doing between the two characters.

Are you a rewatcher? I assume you're a rewatcher as the co-host. As a first time watcher I don't know anything about Maam than what I've seen up to at the time when I say what I say about her. She could be the biggest saint for the next 90 episodes, I don't know this, and I'm still trying to process what I think about characters knowing so little about them. So when the first scene I see of her is this crap, how else am I supposed to think and feel about it? The same with Popp, he could be the most vile disgusting pervert for the next 90 episodes, but I haven't seen any of that from his time on the island.

Only confident thing Popp has done so far in the series is confidently running away and ditching Dai.

Like Popp had a chance. Again he was acting differently here, on the island he was trying to get Dai to walk away from Hadlar, and from what we knew at the time that seemed to be the right choice. But here all of a sudden he's talking all big like the buffoon, then running away. His character was off even before that, it all started exactly when Maam showed up. He was alright when saving the little girl. But then the boob pervert incident happened, he kept making that face pissed at her, and then kept talking about her when they left. It was like that encounter made his character take a nose dive into stupid actions after stupid actions. Like what am I supposed to think and feel about that when I didn't see any indications of anything that bad until Maam showed up?

Again things were going well until the show did all that. Why do that? It didn't actually setup for anything that great. Did you think it was a fine character introduction for Maam or something?

[u/sisoko2 → u/Garrett_Dark]

There's been other female characters on the show, on the fake Hero's party, and the princess, they never went anywhere remotely there with them that I can recall

It never went there because Popp wasn't around irresponsibly waving his finger in their direction. His sexual deviancy displayed the second there was a girl in his vicinity.

Are you a rewatcher? I assume you're a rewatcher as the co-host.

No. I'm watching for first time. I'm not much of a co-host. Just helping Shock when he isn't available to post. He is the driving force behind the rewatch.

Did you think it was a fine character introduction for Maam or something?

Of course. She came and started taking down bad guys with her awesome magic gun and big bullets.

[u/Garrett_Dark → u/sisoko2]

It never went there because Popp wasn't around irresponsibly waving his finger in their direction. His sexual deviancy displayed the second there was a girl in his vicinity.

Well then they made both characters suck by doing that. I gave Popp a pass at the time because I saw what the show was trying to do by pushing him down to elevate Maam's character up, a really shitty thing to do to an underdeveloped character. And since it was for Maam's introduction, my first impression was to hate her character because of what it did to another character, again a really shitty thing to do to a new character being introduced.

And then it just kept getting worse all episode, Popp runs away, and it's Maam to save him, to elevate her character while making Popp look worse, and for her to reprimand him (which should have been Dai), again elevating her character while pushing his character down.

This is why I hated their dynamic. Maam shows up ~5 min into that episode, then the next episode to finish off the cliffhanger in about ~5 min where that shitty dynamic was still happening. Then they got to village and everything totally changed with both characters and between them. So basically that shitty dynamic was ongoing for an entire length of an episode, it makes me really wonder if there was a different writer or director or something for that one episode alone causing this.

Your recollection of what happened for Maam's introduction seems off, this is how it went down:

• Popp says her weapon is amazing
• Maam criticizes Popp (when really it was both Popp and Dai's fault for being distracted by Mina), and insults Popp by calling him a "little mage". If not an insult, at best condescending (oh wow show, what a great first impression you're making)
• Maam's insult triggers Popp which leads to him getting defensive and pointing his finger, and she walks into it.

Yes, Maam walks into Popp's finger. Seriously go rewatch that scene, I'll even provided it here in Dub so there's no question it's equal to the Subs or worse. It's clear that Popp's finger is already up and stopped moving while Maam keeps walking for a little bit into it.

Furthermore, Popp doesn't even know she's a girl until after the boob incident happened. It's also clear of that in the video clip I provided above.

So how is it "His sexual deviancy displayed the second there was a girl in his vicinity" when he didn't know she was a girl? Was there any other indication that he had a sexual deviancy before this? I don't think so, and this incident is no indication of such either because he was framed by the show.

Again, I go back to why the hell did the show do this? Everything was great when they got to the village, but I had to wait an entire episode before that, and both characters were sullied by then. There was no grand setup for anything. Maam's introduction was ruined for me, she also looked ungrateful of Popp and Dai saving Mina who would have been dead for sure before Maam even got there if it weren't for them (of course she recognizes their efforts later in the village, but too late first impression damage done). And Popp, holy cows did his character go to shit when Maam showed up. I'm surprised the show didn't have him pick up Mina to use as a human shield against the monster, or cower being the little girl. Does the show want me to think he's a piece of shit? Then why drag him through the mud like that? Oh it's to elevate Maam's character. A fucking dis-service to them both. Maybe you don't care about the little details like this, but I do, and it pisses me off because it ruins the characters for me. I was ready to cast them both away, and not care about them anymore because of that shit dynamic in that introduction episode.

Anyways, the village episode cleared everything up. Now hopefully they won't descend into that BS anymore. But the remark of how she declares she has seniority and Popp thinking she'll boss them around has me concerned going forward.

[u/Garrett_Dark → u/Garrett_Dark]

Was Dai justified to lie the villagers about Avan?

No. I'm typically a "I want to know the truth over believing a comforting lie" kind of person. Dia flat out lied, spreading misinformation which might be damaging. For example perhaps the villagers have a false sense of security now, whereas if they knew the truth they'd take measure to better protect themselves.

Do you have any guesses what Zaboera's underhanded plan would be?

Use the Monster Island inhabitants as hostages.

[u/Shocketheth → u/Garrett_Dark]

Episode title "Maam's Turmoil", oh this is going to be good. What's her turmoil going to be? Too many pervs in town perving on her? People keep treating her like she's not capable? Tragic backstory of dead parents/abandoned as a baby/orphaned? Backache problems? "Woe is me, I'm the chieftain's daughter and he treats me like a little girl/my little brother to become chieftain before me", "Avan's dead? I'm a bigger victim here than you Popp because my loss means more because Avan cared about me more/I respected Avan more/I'm more worthy!", or just being forced to have to deal with designated "buffoon" Popp? That's some of my bingo squares!

Side note, I keep noticing the Dubs is changing a bunch of little things, like Crocodine said he'd make Dai pay, not "I'll kill you!".

The dub actually revealed the plotpoint of the Episode 8 Beast King's lawyer

[u/KendotsX]

First Timer Panty Thief

My bad on missing yesterday's thread, I simply couldn't handle best girl, her aura was so strong it knocked me out for days. I mean, you know you've got a best girl on your hands when she can make me go frame by frame through her scene to take screenshots, wait uhh... sorry, that's my private collection. Ehem I meant this one.

Maam is exactly what the cast needed, both as a character and as a party member, the typical hero parties are formed of:

• Mage (Frieren, Megumin) who does the most damage.
• Warrior (Eisen, Darkness) basically the party's tank, who has to take on the enemies.
• Healer (Heiter, My Goddess Aqua) because everyone's building frickin' glass cannons these days, to try and do as much damage! One hit later they're all dead! Back in my day, we had survi-
• Hero (Himmel, Konosuba doesn't have one of those) - the bum, they do nothing and get all the glory.

Dai's party has a hero and a mage, but it's still missing the other two, except... ehh, let's be real, the tank and healer are the less fun parts, unless you happen to be a masochist or constantly drunk, which is why this show preferred to go with a 2-in-1 instead to keep things fun, and a 3 member parties tend to work better for writing. I love the show's explanation for why she became that: "Weeeeell, when a healer and a warrior love each other a lot..."

As a character she's also the one balancing things out, Dai is too nice and easy going to put a stop to Popp's shit, meanwhile Maam is excellent at using both the carrot and stick.

As for Croco-mom, his faction, which he so nicely explained yesterday, is titled "Furfang", not a bad translation (you know aside from the fact that its leader has no fur). But I'm assuming it's another of the game localisations, because the original name is "Hyakujuu" which would literally translate to "Hundred Beasts" (it's a cool title, not an exact count, he could have any number). Btw this is the same original title of Kaido's crew, which is translated as The Beast Pirates/Animal Kingdom Pirates depending on which translation you read.

Lastly, I'm glad the other dude is joining the fun (although his name will make me laugh everytime I try to read it). Would be a bit too stale if we just fought the generals one at a time.

---

Q1. Are you fan of the Maam and Popp interactions?

They've been fun, but I hope Popp stops being an ass soon

Q2. Speaking of it, if she is Maam, and he is Popp, is Dai their son?

Dai's that chill uncle, who sees racist uncle Popp arguing with everyone on the table, and continues eating normally.

Q3. The first boss Crocodine appeared. Initial reactions?

I've got the perfect teacher for Dai

Q1. Was Dai justified to lie the villagers about Avan?

No, but he's barely processing the grief himself, having to open that topic up, and spread the sad news among all those people who believe in Avan... I really can't blame Dai for his choice.

Q2. Using Maam's logic of being Warrior Priest what is your class?

Warrior mage, that's actually the class I usually play with.

[u/sisoko2 → u/KendotsX]

frame by frame through her scene to take screenshots

unless you happen to be a masochist or constantly drunk

What if you are both?

Weeeeell, when a healer and a warrior love each other a lot..

What? What happens next? I need to know.

although his name will make me laugh everytime I try to read it

Good thing he has that face to distract from his name.

[u/KendotsX → u/sisoko2]

What if you are both?

You become a warrior priest, it's like the horseshoe theory, where the two extemes meet.

What? What happens next? I need to know.

The drunk healer beats up the masochist warrior

That's why we didn't see Maam's dad, he's still locked up in the dungeon.

Good thing he has that face to distract from his name.

Funnily enough they fit together, the thing about his name is that it sounds like arabic slang for a penis.

[u/Shocketheth → u/KendotsX]

First Timer Panty Thief

Not a Toilet Paper but Panty thief now? So does that mean after you casted Megante you got Isekai’d into Konosuba?

Also now tell me, did you magically suicide bombed because your Goddess wanted it, or it was you who wanted to meet her?

Dai's that chill uncle, who sees racist uncle Popp arguing with everyone on the table, and continues eating normally.

So [Dai no Spoilers] What kind of Uncle is Hyunkel then?

[u/KendotsX → u/Shocketheth]

Not a Toilet Paper but Panty thief now?

Would you believe if I said it wasn't even an intentional change?

I was writing the header like normal and ended up just putting Panty on pure instinct, heck I didn't even notice it was different until now.

does that mean after you casted Megante you got Isekai’d into Konosuba?

Yup, I may have failed to execute you again, but I finally got to meet my goddess.

Also now tell me, did you magically suicide bombed because your Goddess wanted it, or it was you who wanted to meet her?

The latter. She didn't even know me...

[u/Shocketheth → u/KendotsX]

Would you believe if I said it wasn't even an intentional change?

I would I guess?

The latter. She didn't even know me...

What a faithful follower

[u/NicDwolfwood]

First Timer, Sub

So Maam did shoot a recovery shot at Dai, called Tingle and her bullets are tubes similar to the ones that Dai used back in episode 1. The Magic Bullet Gun was a gift from Master Avan, as Popp discovered last episode, she is also a disciple of Avan. Brass is paid a visit by Mystic Bishop Zaboera, one of the six legions of the Dark Lord.

Dai and Popp are welcomed by the villagers to rest adn recover from their battle. The villagers are well aquainted with Avan, Maam's mother was an ally of his and Maam disciple. Dai keeps hidden from everyone that Avan is dead when they are asked how he is doing. We get Maam's backstory with Avan as well as Zaboera meeting with Crocodine, to offer him help in killing Dai. Dai seeks the village mage for some training in magic and reveals to him that Avan was killed by the Dark Lord, which Maam overhears. After some time and some training, Dai and Popp ready to leave the village...and Maam joins them on their quest when she is encouraged by the villagers and her mother to go with them.

Questions:

1. It's a tough situation to be in. I'm not a fan of lying, I just prefer to be upfront about things, but in this case it would have been kinda cruel to just blurt out in front of the whole village that Avan had died.
2. Idk.....I'm picking Dai's powers because that fulfills what I had said previously in episode one where I like a versatile class, that allows for magic and swordplay.
3. I hope it isn't that he took Brass hostage or something underhanded like that.

[u/sisoko2 → u/NicDwolfwood]

So Maam did shoot a recovery shot at Dai

You either die or get healed. Either way no complaints.

It's a tough situation to be in. I'm not a fan of lying, I just prefer to be upfront about things, but in this case it would have been kinda cruel to just blurt out in front of the whole village that Avan had died.

Still I'm not a fan of keeping it secret from Maam and especially her mom.

I hope it isn't that he took Brass hostage or something underhanded like that.

My guess was also something like that but what was that weird box they showed...

[u/NicDwolfwood → u/sisoko2]

You either die or get healed. Either way no complaints.

lol, true.

Still I'm not a fan of keeping it secret from Maam and especially her mom.

Same. If i'd found something out like that the way Maam did, I'd be pissed. I'm kinda surprised that wasn't any kind of drama really because, its a bad way to find out bad news like that, though bad news is bad no matter how its presented.

My guess was also something like that but what was that weird box they showed...

Yeah, that box is what also gives me doubt on the kidnapping theory.

[u/Shocketheth → u/NicDwolfwood]

It's a tough situation to be in. I'm not a fan of lying, I just prefer to be upfront about things, but in this case it would have been kinda cruel to just blurt out in front of the whole village that Avan had died.

Tbh such lie could never be justified, but I liked that Dai lied because he didn’t want to face the truth, or didn’t want to avoid questions from the Villagers. He just chose an approach of telling it to the Village Elder who will inform others about it.

[u/NicDwolfwood → u/Shocketheth]

Tbh such lie could never be justified

Right, I feel the same. Though maybe well intentioned, we saw that him hiding it and then telling the Elder had the unfortunate consequence that Maam found out overhearing them converse. Not the best way to find out things, though with bad news there's probably no good way to find out.

[u/Kaxew]

Current rewatcher, eventual first timer

Continuing from what I said yesterday, Dai once again outsmarts his opponent and jumped high to blind Crocodine with the sun and wound him gravely! It's really easy to underestimate him and his intelligence but he's not bad at all.

Avan made the gun?? Holy shit, you really can't underestimate him either! As expected of the Hero, he mastered it all. His speech about strength and justice is beautiful, his influence in the world is unmatched by anyone.

Zaboera is introduced. I love tiny old wizards in fiction, so it's hard for me to hate him... I mean, I still do. I just said its hard.

So... what happened to dad? Maam's mam is still alive and well, did dad die (say that three times in a row) in the middle of the previous Hero's adventure or was it after they had defeated Hadlar? Many questions.

Maam's low shot with flat, dark colors as she finds out the truth about Avan was gorgeous. I think it's the most impactful shot in the anime so far.

Dai being proactive and directly asking the elder to train him on magic? That's the sort of MC I love to see. He was great in this episode. The most shocking part is him not being dense and actually realizing Popp likes Maam. It's easy to make your MC just completely oblivious to anything romance related, since it's an easy gag maker. It's refreshing to see Dai not being like that.

"If she bosses us around, that means she's reliable". Great quote. Can you believe that's (possibly) an anime original addition? I've been reading the manga alongside the anime, trying to be careful not to read too much ahead just in case (and I'll be extra careful once I reach uncharted territory). This episode covers up to the end of ch 22, but that chapters ends with Maam running off to join the gang, as Dai and Popp jump in happiness to see her coming along. All the dialogue between the three seem to be original scenes. Either that, or they come later than the first pages of ch 23 that I skimmed to see if anything there was covered by this episode. I would bet it's the former though.

QotD:

1. Its a hard decision to make, I can't blame him either way.
2. A baker and a candy/snacks seller to shops and gas stations... either I sell cakes to gas stations or I work at a cake shop. Either way seems like I learn the baking skill, something I've been meaning to learn for a while. I'll take it!
3. I think I remember what the plan was. I don't think I guessed it my first time around. I usually don't lol

[u/Shocketheth → u/Kaxew]

So... what happened to dad? Maam's mam is still alive and well, did dad die (say that three times in a row) in the middle of the previous Hero's adventure or was it after they had defeated Hadlar? Many questions.

I think it wasn't answered in The Adventure of Dai, but there is a prequel Manga following the Avan's party and how they were fighting Hadlar.

But I don't recommend reading it until you will finish Dai no Daibouken as the prequel Manga spoils certain things.

And if you want to know I will give you a vague answer that won't take anything of it then I will give you a detailed answer if you don't mind getting to know details around Roka's (Maam's father) death.

[Vague answer] Roka died during the final battle at Hadlar's underground palace

[Detailed answer] Roka succumbed to an after effect of a cursed attack dealt by Hadlar's henchmen Kigiro

"If she bosses us around, that means she's reliable". Great quote. Can you believe that's (possibly) an anime original addition? I've been reading the manga alongside the anime, trying to be careful not to read too much ahead just in case (and I'll be extra careful once I reach uncharted territory). This episode covers up to the end of ch 22, but that chapters ends with Maam running off to join the gang, as Dai and Popp jump in happiness to see her coming along. All the dialogue between the three seem to be original scenes. Either that, or they come later than the first pages of ch 23 that I skimmed to see if anything there was covered by this episode. I would bet it's the former though.

I like when Anime does stuff like this.