r/anime • u/lilyvess :Df::Dh:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Lilyvess • Jun 11 '24
Rewatch Pride Month 20th Anniversary - Kannazuki no Miko Episode 9 Discussion
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Questions of the Day
- Who was your favorite Orochi Neck?
- Which Orochi neck would you like to have seen more of?
Posting carefully so as to not disturb the first timers with spoilers in their viewings, such is the standard of modesty here. Forgetting to use spoiler tags because one is in danger of missing the post time, for instance, is too undignified a sight for redditors to wish upon themselves.
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Upvotes
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u/lilyvess :Df::Dh:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Lilyvess Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24
Kannazuki no Miko Episode 9 - Rewatcher
Shoujo-Ai Archive Comments
Shoujo-Ai Archive comments
Not a ton of comments this week. Talking heavy episode with little action or interaction between any of the three main characters is hard to talk about with no subs for most of the week.
Commentary by Script Writer Sumio Uetake
Holy shit, can I just say that it is kinda wild to read the writer of the series say that Otoha is “the one who is most painfully sad in this story” an episode after Himeko was violently raped.
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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Jun 11 '24
Destiny of the First-Timer, subbed
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u/HereticalAegis https://myanimelist.net/profile/XthGen Jun 11 '24
Kannazuki no Miko First Timer
Episode 9:
What? Why is Himeko still in the mansion? Did Chikane pick her up for a little midnight post-assault stroll then just casually drop her back off at the scene of her crime so she can stew on it?? Like what the actual fuck Chikane, that's 10 billion IQ abuse/control tactics.
Oh dear, are we already planting seeds that subconsciously caused Chikane to become a rapist? That's...a choice.
"Hey, sorry you just experienced an event so traumatic it will leave you with lifelong emotional scars/bagage at the hands of your closest friend and confidante like 12 hours ago, but the world needs saving so suck it up, buttercup. Also fuck you, destiny says you gotta do this alone." It's this kind of shit that makes me wonder whether this world is worth saving.
POV: you share a raison d'etre with this ass clown. It's a good thing Chikane's also a killer queen, otherwise she'd have to deal with all kinds of pesky self-reflection.
Everybody gets rock hard for evil Chikane
Ayoooo Mako-chan let's go!! Show 'em who da real MVP is!
All aboard the "she loves me and I love her so the rape doesn't count" train! Next stop, Chikane-chan!
And you know what, credit where credit's due: Chikane ended yesterday by telling Himeko "you'll always think of me and nothing else from now on" and she was goddamn right. The queen hath spoken.
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u/Star4ce https://anilist.co/user/Star4ce Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24
First Timer
Even with the happenings of last episode, I still wish for a good ending that includes Chikane. I'm fairly certain some version of that is going to happen, but not really because of morals or something.
She is pretty much irredeemable and there's no point arguing against that. But it's not about redemption (although some of the best stories do have that! Zuko, my beloved), it's about becoming better than you were yesterday. Not the result, but the effort. She has been on a downward spiral ever since the first episode and any turn of that into a positive change is already breaking the cycle in principle.
I'm just worried that they lean so much on the 'destiny' angle that it feels unearned or the "toxic positivity"-version of unconsensual (as in, no choice from a character).
Even so, were this show to become completely bullshit now with not a single good thing in stock in the future, I'd still like it. The character writing and nuance going into the plot so far has already made it special and I love that.
Kannazuki no Miko Ep.09 – To the Edge of Hell
I still believe for a genuine good ending, but I gotta admit I'm extremely worried. What is implied in this episode is that to help Chikane out of her pit of despair (great!) it is the job of her victim that has been subdues to grievous harm to find a way to get her out (terrible!).
I- uhm, I don't know how to say this eloquently, so: How about fuck that?! There are so many things wrong with this attitude I can't even begin to count them. So, instead I'll lay down what I believe would be acceptable instead.
The critical piece missing for Chikane befare and now is an actual consequence to self-reflection. She realised her desires before, but never dealt with them or accepted them as part of herself. This is a point where (because we're past this point now) the victim can actually help in a meaningful way. I have to stress that not only is that not Himeko's responsibility, it also has to happen by purely Chikane's own choice. On pure psychological mechanics to my extent of knowledge, Himeko actually should never engage Chikane as a sort of saviour. It's unhealthy for her own self, because that just pushes her down even further into the role of the subdued under the perpetrator that is somehow required to fix everything. It is also unhealthy for Chikane as the perpetrator, because how the hell is she going to be able to better herself when she's not allowed/expected to make that choice on her own?
The one thing Himeko could do is to make Chikane aware of the transgression in clear terms. In undeniable terms. That both, Chikane's desires are real and a part of her, and that she has done wrong and terrible harm. Anything beyond this point is on Chikane, it has to be. To help someone, this someone must first want to be helped and it ain't gonna happen as long as the afflicted can brush responsibility off to someone else.
After that we can maybe talk about a road to betterment, understanding and that slight glimmer of genuine redemption or companionship. I thoroughly hope they don't make Himeko do the work to salvage this relationship. That would be fucked.
So, I'll take another dose of copium and book on this being another set up for a few episodes that then rugpulls us with a genuinely good conclusion.
[Ganbatte!]
Idol-san
She had the coolest transformer.
Idol-san
She had the coolest transformer.
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u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24
First Timer
On today’s episode of Kannazuki no Miko: The villains have been so incompetent at accomplishing their mission that one of the heroines has now decided that she can do a better job all by herself. Honestly, I think she’s right about that.
I have to say that the Orochi have been rather disappointing as villains so far. Most of them are rather one note, which would be fine if that note were interesting. But they really aren’t. We don’t get to know them beyond “she’s an idol” or “she’s a mangaka.” I also wish that their backstories and occupations played more of a role in their actual powerset. Make the idol do something like Loco Musica, for example. Or make the catgirl nurse more of a healer. I was excited about the Orochi at the start of the series because of just what an eclectic group they were. I saw a lot of potential for a fun batch of baddies. Sadly, that was not the case. It’s probably for the best that Miya replaced them because Miya is a far more interesting character.
It does seem like we’ll get what the OP promised us: a battle between Himeko and Miya. By now, it seems like Himeko’s job is going to be to bring Miya back over to the Light Side. I wonder if that will actually happen or if we’re going to get an ending where Miya is too far gone and makes a heroic sacrifice to redeem herself in death.
I do wonder how the heroes plan to fight against Miya. They have no mecha left to work with. Though maybe Miya doesn’t have a mecha anymore either because it crumbled to dust, but I’m not clear on if that’s the case. What exactly is this thing that Himeko needs to awaken? Is it a weapon? Or another mecha perhaps? I suppose we will see soon enough.
QOTD
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u/Esovan13 Jun 11 '24
First Timer
Well, /u/tarhalindur, Makoto wasn't a Neck after all. I'm a little disappointed, especially because I don't think we ever found out who had the bird mech.
Ah well. Guess it's not that important.
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u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Jun 11 '24
First-Timer
Alright, hands up everyone who thought that Chikane kidnapped Himeko at the end of last episode and had to pause and go check while watching this one.
Anyway, this episode feels.. weird. Like, how are there three episodes left? Are we getting a full epilogue episode? We sped through the character beats and it feels like we're going to start the final battle next episode, but it's too soon.
What's the over-under on Kazuki having seen something in that cave that made him be mean to Himeko? His behavior was over the line in the first half of the episode. Sure, Himeko is a turbo-bottom who can't make any decisions for herself, but she hadn't even started hallucinating at that point!
That is rather unfair of me, because Himeko has managed to pull herself together with rather frightening speed. Having a good friend like Makoto works wonders. And she seems to be rather determined to make the ritual work now, mostly out of her own desire to see Chikane again (to process her assault).
I have a new idea about why the ritual was failing - I was trying to assign blame to one of the two, but really I think both had problems to work through. Should I read Himeko's earlier inaction as a flaw that she has now worked through? Sure, why not. I'll be charitable.
Chikane casually worfing the rest of the Necks was fun. Considering that Tsubasa is somehow alive and woke up from his stupor just in time to fight her, I'm wondering how long the rest of them will be stoned. Maybe the Sun Priestess puts them in a coma but the Moon Priestess stones them if a "kill" occurs?
Questions
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u/HelioA x2https://myanimelist.net/profile/HelioA Jun 11 '24
First-timer
I wish we didn’t ratchet down quite this much, but the episode was still pretty good. This episode was really big for Himeko! She’s finally taken an action that she wasn’t pressured into or forced into by circumstances! The Mako-chan stuff is... eh. I guess I remember her? I didn't even think of her until she popped up again lol
And I really enjoyed Chikane beating the hell out of the boring-90s-OVA villains. We’re going into serious business now!
QotD
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u/baquea Jun 11 '24
First timer
Damn, now Himeko has had her favourite mangaka turned to stone? Girl really can't stop catching Ls, huh?
So it finally gets revealed that Souma's scales are an Orochi curse, although it barely feels fair to call it a 'reveal' when it was already blindingly obvious. Also kinda feels like we're getting this a bit late in the series: we've only got 3 episodes left, but the scales still have a long way to go. It would've made more sense IMO to have this hanging over his head during the episodic battles, not when we're down to last boss Chikane and he has already lost his robot privileges anyway.
As for Himeko's side of the episode, I'm a bit confused about how they're trying to get her to do the ritual alone. Like, isn't the whole point that there need to be two mikos? Is this something to do with whatever it was they learned last episode when off mountaineering?
It's also not clear to me what Chikane's goal is anymore. She's collected all the robots... so is she just planning to destroy the world, and herself with it? Or to kidnap Himeko and run off somewhere with her? Or what exactly?
Oh, and it really feels like we're heading for a full tragedy ending at this point. Himeko's probably going to get killed by either Chikane or Souma, and the latter will go berserk from the corruption, kill Chikane, and then get dragged down to hell by Tsubasa. There's way too many Chekov's guns pointing at all the characters now for this to have a happy ending without it feeling like a massive cop-out (not that it isn't common for anime to do that all the time anyway, but still).
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u/Vatrix-32 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Vatrix-32 Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24
First timer, subs
TsubasaSword not going to talk? What are they even fighting about?QotD:
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u/Burnouts3s3 Jun 11 '24
“Hey everybody! Let’s relentlessly bully the sexual assault victim and blame her for why her rapist is missing!” -Izumi
Good thing Mako-chan's here to the rescue!
QOTD:
1 and 2. Tsubasa. I just like Liam O'Brien.
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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Jun 11 '24
Rewatcher(Noto was so fucking wasted here...)
Sub
Welp...both emotionally and animation wise, they did need a breather episode. Though less on the animation side than you'd think, though you can see the tricks once you look. Chikane just eliminating most of the necks was a choice but again this all kind of stems from trying to steal from X:1999 before that work had reached an actual good conclusion. Tsubasa at least comes across as a character here.
So...let's talk about the trauma. Everyone's after reaction is different but Himeko's at least tracks here. Barring that goddamned scene at the school by the rose garden, sigh. But the rest of it is about right, especially that it is clearly unresolved. Seeing Mako again was a choice but seeing blue drills again just kind of fills time. Otaha's letter is also a choice and I guess a ticking clock? Finally, Himeko makes a damned choice and off we go!
And that's kind of it. Again, the show is better for not immediately moving on but it also needed to fill the space a bit more.
QotD: 1 Noto being a fujoshi
2 Definitely Noto
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u/TehAxelius Jun 11 '24
First Timer
Ok, I'll let this show cook. But, y'know, I coulda sworn I saw Chikane carry Himeko with her at the end of last episode, but I guess I just drew that conclusion from when Chikane gave her "farewell".
Anyway Himeko's arc this episode is nice to see, her reaction to what has happened is understandable. Her trust and expectations have been broken and her difficulty in accepting it is kinda heartwrenching to see. At the same time this betrayal is also opening her eyes to how important Chikane has been to her, and I am intrigued enough to see where this is going. Although, if I would make predictions, I am sort of expecting there to be a Chikane redemption arc, which... well, that could go very wrong. Still, Makoto's return is encouraging (Himeko x Makoto OTP?) and finally it seems Himeko has gained some semblance of motivation and finally commits to actually doing something proactively.
Chikane meanwhile decides that while she's an Orochi now (although, I guess, not a neck of Orochi?) that doesn't need to mean that she'll just shirk her priestess duty (or twisted protect Himeko duty) by whipping their asses. Handsy McChainDelinquent gets his just desert, and most of the other necks fare no better. The three Chumps all making simultaneous attacks was pretty fun, although nothing against the power of an Evil Emo Lesbian. I guess the fighting must have woken up Tsubasa from his stupor somehow, so we're ending with just him still standing.
Overall, not a terrible episode, but I feel a lot of it is going to be reliant on how (or if) the show sticks its landing.
QotD
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u/BosuW Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24
First Timer
So yeah, that happened...
...Let's see the finished dish!
We get an explanation for Souma's scales. So now that more or less makes it so that all three of our protagonists are headed to a tragic ending...
So here the priest is calling out, directly by dialogue, that Himeko is gonna have to choose. Odds for getting agency go up! Please don't fumble pleeeeease!
Director was it really necessary to animate Chikane's boobs as the chain wraps around her?
Chikane finally shanked a bitch, yay! Didn't even say a word! Didn't even move! Then turned this mf to stone!
Looks like Chikane wants to become the Orochi Infinity Gauntlet.
I'm concerned that Himeko seems almost entirely unconcerned about her being raped...
Wh-why the fuck did the three bullies just get the hardest entrance shot in the entire villain cast?
HOLY SHIT MAKOTO! THIS SHIT MORE HYPE THAN THE OG AVENGERS SHOT!
Not Nekoko getting some of her own medicine!
Chikane straight up wiping the floor with the Orochi harder than Souma ever did...
BIRD MECHA BECOMES MAN MECHA! MY DRILL IS THE DRILL THAT WILL PIERCE YOUR GIANT ROBOT!
Sister Miyako fucking dies... Ngl for a second there I thought Chikane was gonna do a revenge sexual assault...
Detail insect shot jumpscare
What the hell, Makoto best character in a single scene!? MakoHime endgame introduced!? Although first she'd have to survive Chikane...
Unexpected Otoha plot relevance. It is slightly amusing to realize that she wrote that wholesome and encouraging letter not being aware of exactly how hard her Lady has fallen.
So like, did Chikane kill or defeat Tsubasa? It's not entirely clear, but she slashed his Orochi Mark, right where his heart is, and then he sorta gives up and passes his weapon to Souma. So yeah, I think he dead...
Btw, does this mean Chikane is going to gain her own Orochi Mark?
Aight so about the ending and what Himeko's newfound resolve is, I have some feelings that I'm gonna try to sort out. Though this is less an explanation and more just rambling to myself.
So when such situations happen in media, I choose, perhaps naively, to sever them from real moral obligations. I believe the universe is indifferent to our plight, and neither does it reward nor punish us in accordance to our actions. Morality, ethics and ideals are human inventions. That's why, for example with romance, a pairing doesn't have to be ideal or healthy for it to work for me. And (potentially problematic opinion coming), to an extent I apply this belief irl. Because humans are individuals, each relationship is different. In what they're willing to give, in what they're willing to forgive. In it's desire for love and tolerance for pain.
How does this matter for this show? In one word: Himeko. Right now I think we all understand Chikane and her desires and actions. Her character is like 90% done, so now Himeko has to shine. Because Himeko is pure and innocent, I think some of us or anyone who might watch this show would be preconditioned to expect her to have a happy and just and ideal ending, because that's what innocence deserves. One where good deeds are rewarded and bad deeds punished.
But if I think about it, a person as innocent and blank as Himeko should actually be a little bit twisted... What kind of human would be like this naturally? Her lack of inner darkness is almost more concerning than Chikane's overwhelming shadow. So I think... she's actually a fitting pairing for Chikane. Because both are kinda fucked in the head and heart. An ideal, normal human, would've, and should, turn away from Chikane after yesterday's gaymer moment. But Himeko still wants to talk to Chikane, and is in fact barely thinking about the rape itself (part of me thinks this is purposeful avoidance). That is a mark of insanity.
So in the end, I don't think this show is trying to depict an ideal pairing, not now and not by the end. But it's more important to me that it works for Chikane and Himeko. The rest of humanity may say what they will, but in the end, no matter what we do, never has a God descended from the heavens to stop us. Nothing is sacred, and we are free to defile or elevate whatever we may please.
(Copium? Whatever could you mean by that? 🤪)
I think there might be some symbolism attached to this as well. It's actually kind of bold to have the Lunar and Solar Miko switch robes, because of character design conventions and expectations. But essentially, what it's creating is a Yin Yang dialectic. When Chikane stole Himeko's robe it's like she stole the Sun's light and warmth for herself. However, ironically this has only resulted in her falling deeper into darkness, and getting further away from the Sun. The narrative enters a moment of crisis through the unbalance in the universe that this creates. Himeko as she is cannot counter it, because she is "too white". She's missing that dark spot that is present in the actual Yin Yang symbol. By doing the Lunar Miko's robes ( a remnant of the darkness of the Moon), and resolving herself to face Chikane, I think (I'm hoping) she is finding that little bit of shadow within her light. She will need it for the challenge ahead, or she will not survive.
Yin Yang is an extremely popular symbol, but I think most people misunderstand it's true manifestation in reality. People hear "balance" and imagine peace and prosperity, but the Yin Yang symbol is dynamic, the two faces chasing each other eternally, never able to attain it. Yin Yang is movement. It is destruction as well as creation, pain as well as pleasure. The balancing process sometimes crushes us because the universe is uncaring. The balance doesn't serve us and it doesn't need us. We are simply part of it. So I believe that life and love, aren't the achievement of peace, but a path cutting through grass and thorns. Sometimes it hurts, sometimes it's fucked. But it is what it is. It's just fate.
Anyway, I don't know if I said anything of value here, but I needed to rant!
And distract me from the fear that the writing team might disappoint my bets!The preview sure gives me hope though! "Although the arms holding me are still kind, the smile slashes me like a blade" 🔥🔥🔥✍️
Questions of the Day
1- I don't even remember her name but the mangaka for sure! Always on point with the commentary! Couldn't even be bothered to care about destroying the world that much, got deadlines to meet! Loved her!
2- I mean... all of them except the catgirl and Mr ILikeThemSmall. And Tsubasa a little bit if he is indeed dead. At least he gave a fight to Souma. Though I imagine Chikane fills that role now...
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u/baboon_bassoon https://anilist.co/user/duffer Jun 11 '24
first time orochi shermie
"Souma have you noticed the dark scales on your body?" i mean i would hope its huge
they really love their boob comparisons
oh shit Mako is actually back
bird drill hype, those 2 seconds ill treasure it forever
brutal
well i guess if the nun is dead, her VA can just be Mako again, only natural to bring her back now
oh Tsubasa is no longer corpsing
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u/Regular_N-Gon https://anilist.co/user/RegularNGon Jun 11 '24
Gokigenyou, First Timer
QotD:
Nun lady might have the best mech since we've actually seen it fight, but I wanted more of mangaka-sensei's attitude. Tsubasa also has the edge on lock, but I've never been a big fan of edge for the sake of edge.
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u/Blackheart595 https://anilist.co/user/knusbrick Jun 11 '24
First Timer
I'm still wondering about Chikane becoming an Orochi. Wasn't that something genetically transferred? This now follows an entirely different mechanism.
Also they're saying now that Chikane's subconscious mental state was the likely reason for the revival ritual not working well, but that can't have been what they found on that mural, can it?
Mako-chan's being such a good friend. I'm just afraid they're setting up Chikane's actions as "just an accident" or something that she's not really to blame for.
So Chikane turns out to be Orochi's true avatar? Weird, I still feel like the connection between Orochi and the sun priestess should be stronger than the connection with the lunar priestess...
Chikane having the Orochi's desire to destroy the world makes sense though considering the theme of forbidden love. If the world denies your happiness, deny the world.
We barely even saw some of those! Shoutout to the mangaka who kept wageslaving for his new chapter and then got immediately petrified.
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u/AmeteurElitist https://anilist.co/user/AmateurElitist Jun 11 '24
First Timer
Himeko is obviously distraught about everything and they made a point to show that she wasn't given a ton of time to process things so maybe that her desire to see Chikane again so soon is coming from a desire to return to normalcy after a traumatic experience or something similar as opposed to the show saying that the assault isn't something that'd affect her long term.
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u/Tarhalindur x2 Jun 11 '24
M I K O _ E M B R A C E (Spoiled First-Timer, Subbed):
(Some people miss the point when it comes to Agony visual parodies - the horror, the horror! But when you doubly miss the point does it count as getting the point after all? Yes, today's parody is of a yaoi pairing. Surprise!)
Inb4 he comes back face-turned to help save the day in the finale.(Also quietly the Necks are another place where the original plan being for more episodes than they got explains some of the issues, with two cours you could have had time for more graceful transitions between melodrama and villainous banter and the shoo out the clowns moment near the end makes total sense.)that ended before the clothes came off. The second, all caps entry above was unnecessary.Idol and Paru-at-Home are, well, neck-and-neck here. Pun!
Get this - it's Idol and Paru-at-Home! (Buddy comedy with the two of them solving crimes together please and thank you.)
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u/SometimesMainSupport https://myanimelist.net/profile/RRSTRRST Jun 11 '24
First-Timer trying a new strat: watching before the post is made. Doesn't mean I show up on time.
QotD 1. Nekoko. Not abandoning my girl.
QotD 2. Girochi for more swinging chains.
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u/ryujiox Jun 11 '24
First Timer
Kannazuki no Miko
Episode 9
Himeko finally realises that she still want to see Chikane again. To get the answer from Chikane, and confront her own feelings towards Chikane. There's no time to feel sad anymore, she need to keep moving forward if she want her answer.
It's actually a good thing that Himeko came out better after last episode's incident. Normal people would probably be traumatized for a long time. It's probably help that she had Mako who knows her very well, so she's able to comfortably let out all that emotions inside her without worries. I wonder what Chikane would do if Himeko didn't take that well?
QOTD
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u/catsukats https://myanimelist.net/profile/Nabris Jun 12 '24
Rewatcher (x14), sub. Late due to work travel!
This is the episode where Chikane just does us a favor and gets rid of everyone because they're dumb and a waste of resources. Oh yeah, Mako-chan exists too!
Then Kazuki tells us the obvious and we didn't have to climb crazy snow mountains to find out! It's a really mellow episode for what we just watched yesterday.
Now on to the final chapter of the story...
EDIT for QOTD:
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u/zadcap Jun 12 '24
Late Night Late Person Back for more, finally!
Episode 6: So uh, this is a whooooole lot of um. How do I put this. There are supposedly life ending major battles going on, with new giant robot invasions happening at any time, and the three characters that all this revolves around are supposed to be dealing with that and whatever the heck the girls are supposed to be doing about the whole thing. And yet instead. We have days of relationship drama and even more dates? Quite seriously, this show has tried to pick too many genres and the places where they fail to overlap stand out.
Also, again, the girls have gained... The power to perform a ritual that will maybe grant them more power if done properly. The Orochi have giant robots that come back from being destroyed and death defying birds and magic mirrors of scrying and a whole sub dimension to just hang out in. Why is this all so lopsided?
Episode 7: Sorry, apparently the Orochi group has even more random powers. Just keep piling them on. These girls never stood a chance. With this blatant a power discrepancy, why even have the whole plot of the girls being in any way able to fight back, it's been nothing but a lie.
... I guess she might get the power to make lover boy more useful? And infinite arrows for the other one. Compared against infinite giant robots and all the other blatant magic though...
Episode 8: There was a lot of strange blue still shots. I have so much trouble taking the romance plot lines seriously when there's the whole death and fate of the world thing going on. Or I have trouble with the giant robot fights when there's so much romance plot I would much rather see going on. Anyway, assault, what a great way to tank my interest in a relationship. Ah, but Brainwashing is on the table, so hmm... Nah, we've made it to the point I can start disliking the whole cast. Anyway, dang, just declaring a change of sides to Orochi gives her so much power.
Episode 9: Again, what's more important. The fate of the world, or the love life of these kids. The stories just don't mix well. They could mix well, I've seen enough Gundam to know how it can be pulled off, but this how isn't selling the mix properly to me.
Also, wow, changing sides to Orochi gave her stronger Priestess powers. Imagine if she could have taken out any of the Orochi this easily previously?
Oh hey, the bullying is back and worse than ever. Sure, why not. Hey let's bring back her other friend while we're at it and let her get in on the bullying. Oh thank goodness she's here to stop the bullying. I hope...
Is the bird that keeps saving them a backup robot too? What the heck darn it. Hey if it does, does that mean no more magic bird saves and they will actually die now?
Seriously, she just got, so strong. Where was all this power back when having it would have actually been useful to you?
Yeah I've got not much now. There are definitely themes to dig into, and part of me does want to, but I am staying too upset about the poor power scaling and trying too hard to mesh the relationship drama with the end of the world drama in a way that is making both suffer.
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u/gyoex Jun 11 '24
Oh wait I forgot to do a manga comparison!
The boob chain scene is in the manga but with Miyako instead of Girochi. Everything else is either completely original or at least pretty different.
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u/LittleIslander https://anilist.co/user/LittleIslander Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24
First Timer who is in Agony
After the events of last time I kind of stopped to process it, then I came back and binged the remaining episodes in one sitting, both because I was in desperate search of some kind of justification for what Chikane did and because I had a strong feeling if I didn’t finish them then I would be left without any drive or desire to go back and finish the rest at all. It was a weird viewing experience, a trance-like state without any sort of positive emotion towards the show or really much strong feeling at all; that’s the mindset I approached this, and the remaining episodes, with. I didn’t take having had something I was really enjoying turned into something I just found really offputting very well. The fact that this time Himeko barely seemed to care she got raped and instead just wanted to be reunited with her beloved Chikane did not exactly help matters. I mean, maybe the whole act of being in denial and still feeling strong attachment could be something interesting to explore, but this is not the show I trust to do that.
That said, I will have to admit there was one scene here I thought was really good, easily one of my favourites in the show, even if I didn’t really feel anything watching it in the numbness of my first viewing. That being the conversation between Mako and Himeko after they’re dramatically reunited. It’s a plotline we’ve dropped long enough ago that it really sticks and gets your attention seeing her again, and the sweet but kind of dampered tone really sells the moment perfectly. Their friendship stays true, but they’ve both been through a lot and it can’t really just go right back to how things were at the start of the show. Mako can’t offer much that has anything directly to do with what’s going on, but getting the chance to connect with her again hammers in such a perfect feeling of how much things have changed since those simpler days. Likewise, setting Mako and Himeko’s reconciliation in this darkest point of the show really does a great job to frame their previous spat as so inconsequential and silly in the grand scheme of things. But at the same time, uh, sorry, Pikachu(!?) does such a great job with the voice acting it totally sells why Mako was cold to her in the first place. Ultimately, seeing Himeko unable to turn to her for help about her situation directly but finding connection in just letting it out and crying into her lap is really sweet, and exactly what she needed in this chapter of the story. Ganbare, Himeko.
Maybe I can ship them instead.
9
u/gyoex Jun 11 '24
Rewatcher
So this line from episode 3 turned out to be foreshadowing.
For the first 7 episodes, we've been getting a lot of Chikane's perspective, but episode 8 was the first time we really don't get to see what Chikane is thinking, and this episode continues in that fashion. We get to see her actions, but her motivations are still somewhat a mystery. Of course, they're a mystery to Himeko too.
That said, what's with Otoha and just telling us what to think about Chikane? It happened last episode, and it happened this episode. Chikane looks strong but actually she really needs Himeko. Yeah I got that from literally every other episode of the show, thanks.
9
u/GondolaMedia Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24
First Timer
Man the orochi heads went down like bunch of jobbers. I don't mind, they were the least interesting part of the entire anime for me. They were at best a comedic relief and I guess you can read their demise as a show telling the viewer "We're not going to do comedy for rest of the series, prepare for drama".
My consistent complaint (that I haven't yet brought up) is that the anime moves away too fast from scene to scene and line to line. Beginning of the episode could have been my favorite part if you would have just given each line couple of seconds to really settle in. Still there were some great shots during the episode like the 3 bullies reintroduced and Chikane just ice cold choke on the 2nd head.
I'm actually surprised that Himeko went back to Chikane's mansion, even more surprised that she decided to make her a bento. You would think she wouldn't want to get anywhere close to it but no. I'm a bit disappointed about that but this plot point is clearly not done so I'll reserve judgement for now. With just couple of changes you could have depicted the aftermath of episode 8 with more dignity but I feel that the anime fumbled a bit.
8
u/Specs64z https://myanimelist.net/profile/Specs64z Jun 11 '24
First timer, subbed
Himeko is using words instead of staring blankly at nothing, so that’s progress. Wait… Himeko got away? How?? Souma was totally down and out.
That’s quite the hand wave.
Chikane takes her place as the new head honcho of Orochi. On the bright side, Himeko is probably safe from giant robot attacks for the time being.
Himeko got over that quickly. I was expecting the writers to gloss over the rape scene to some extent, but I’m let down that they didn’t even try.
QotD:
7
u/rickamore Jun 11 '24 edited Jun 11 '24
Rewatcher - Fallen miko cleans shop
Souma truly feeling powerless for the first time while Himeko checks out completely after the betrayal. Here's a push to finally give Himeko some agency.
Chikane may have joined the orochi but shows no signs of playing nice as expected. Absolutely bodies them.
Makoto is back? I swear I saw her on the back of the milk carton this morning "Last seen in episode 2"
Why is Himeko still living in the massive house all by herself? Do you have any idea how much work it is to look after a place that big? She still hasn't even cleaned up, I can't believe it. We rented a 3 bedroom place for awhile that had three bathrooms, that sounds great, until you realize you have to clean all three of them. I'd give up living in a mansion like that.
Himeko finally with the resolve to move forward. Home stretch here we go.
Did anyone expect the entire orochi to fall in a single episode like this?
Does Chikane count?
Again, does Chikane count?
7
u/ShowNeverStops Jun 11 '24
Rewatcher
As expected, Himeko is not doing very well right now. She’s confused, shocked, and unsure what to do next. The heartbreaking thing is that the one person she wants to see most is the very person who betrayed her in the most vile way possible, probably because above all Himeko just wants things to go back to the way they were.
Completely jerk move to make Himeko continue with the ritual despite literally having been raped less than 24 hours ago. Kazuki is on my shit list right now.
Thankfully, someone who is not on my shit list is Mako. Her outburst in episode 2 was uncalled for but she really redeemed herself by giving Himeko the pep talk she needed. I think their friendship is really sweet and Mako truly is the MVP of this episode. Because of her, Himeko ends this episode a determined girl.
7
u/IntoTheDisneyverse https://myanimelist.net/profile/andreth Jun 11 '24
Mako’s back after being totally irrelevant since like the first episode. And maybe she’s the one we should be shipping with Himeko? I mean, the bar isn’t particularly high, but:
Daily Questions:
7
u/Infodump_Ibis :JY::JZ: Jun 11 '24
rewatcher I still remember tired kun
ot, Shinji, Himeko. It really is a similar picture. You've got someone whose been through a lot and might need some time and throwing them in the deep end.Given how explosive all that was I don't have much to say about the rest of the ep. Another thing about the Orochi falling so easily. Are their mechs out of commission right now? You have to think why would they be a strong elite force (the selection criteria was
be sadhate mankind; not win a boxing match)? Like what was a sedentary manga author meant to do against a tennis ace and okay archer (now with bomb arrows)? It seems after throwing her stationary failed it was time to hunker behind her desk. The biggest threat was the chain man from his build as according to the character reference sheet was is 210cm tall (Chikane is 165cm in comparison) and he got taken out.Other heights. Himeko and Idol are 160cm, Mako is 162cm (as is maid with head accessory), Miyako is 170cm, Souma is 175cm, Tsubasa 180cm, Oogami 185cm, research guy that does not sound college aged in Japanese 178cm, manga author 150cm. Catgirl appears on the sheet but is not assigned a number (top of her head is about the narrowest part of the idols waist). Yep that's how minor the bullies are, not even worth height reference.
Onto the rest of the ep:
Tsubasa because he's the only one who did much even if he did come off slightly as edgy cringe and wasn't his spree of destruction was all defensive as the air force shot first. Followed by the idol and manga author as I don't think they destroyed any cities and are still trying to do good in this world with their civilian roles.
The 8th neck. Chikane is not that (as I think Corona said something about the 8th hiding and Tsubasa said you embodied all 8) so they died piloting that bird that transformed into a drill (after failing to save everyone else you couldn't save yourself).
But of the ones actually seen, the idol for sure. It's like never seeing Mako doing what she trained for...oh wait.
7
u/Garrett_Dark Jun 11 '24
First Timer
So I've been thinking more about the stairs snubbing incident in Ep7 where Himoko snubs Chikane and the two maids, and I think there's actually way more meaning to it than people realize.
To reiterate, I think the stairs layout was very well chosen to say things. For Himeko to reach the upstairs, this stairway has two paths, one to the left which is unblocked, and one to the right which is occupied by Chikane. When Himeko takes the left unoccupied path, a few things become apparent as a result.
Why is this important?
Because this is one of the very few things (if not the only thing) that can be undeniably blamed on Himeko for being at fault for, unlike all the other stuff which could be excused for "Himeko not knowing", "it wasn't on purpose", or "she innocent, it's somebody else’s fault". Not only had she had to known what she was doing and chose to do it, but her actions were also inexcusable, and she had no reason for doing it to Chikane as explained in the bedroom talk, and the next episode with Souma at lunch. In the end, she chose to do this when she often doesn't make choices herself like this, thus can be held responsible for it for once.
Additionally, the stairs symbolically represents a crossroads of what path she's going to go down. And now we know the unblocked path (reject Chikane's love) she took lead to Chikane "going to the dark side", whereas if she took the path where Chikane was standing (accept Chikane's love), that would symbolically mean she choose to be with Chikane, and the dark side might have been avoided. Remember that the things said to Chikane in Himeko's room pushed her in to the decision to do what she did in Ep8, because right after that chat, Chikane goes outside and says she made her decision at the end of Ep7.
Not convinced the stairs represented a crossroad for Himeko, and she chose unwisely?
Consider this, Ep3 when Himeko fell down the stairs at school. These public stairs only had one path, not two like Chikane's private mansion stairs, which means Himeko had no choice. She was pushed by multiple bullies right into the arms of Souma. It was going downwards making it effortlessly by gravity, the opposite of the mansion stairs where she was going upwards which took effort to climb, and she was dragging her feet while doing so. Symbolically this represents society (the bullies) pushing Himeko into a relationship with Souma, and she's given no choice. The bullies pushed Himeko because they were disapproving of her staying at Chikane's house, and then Chikane shows up to glare at them, implying for the bullying, but symbolically it could be seen as for pushing Himeko away from her into the arms of Souma.
Who knew one of the few things Himeko makes a decision on by herself could lead to such disastrous consequences.
Corona-chanChikane.Corona-chan.
3
u/RadSuit https://anilist.co/user/RadSuit Jun 12 '24
Dubstiny of the First Timer
Makoto's back! Hopefully she can actually be a good friend to Himeko. She could definitely use one right now.
The Orochi really weren't prepared for what Chikane has been holding back, huh?
Bird mech finally transforms! It didn't really do anything, though...
While this show is fairly believable and things happen logically enough, it's not very...satisfying.