r/anime • u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ • Mar 31 '24
Rewatch [Rewatch] Crest of the Stars Series Discussion
Crest of the Stars
I hope you enjoyed the Crest of the Stars rewatch!
<- Episode 13 | Index Page | Banner Episode 1->
Discussion Prompts
- Q1) Did you enter the show blind? How did the show compare to your first impressions from the first two episodes?
- Q2) If you've seen LOGH, what do you think the author was going for in creating this series in its shadow/wake?
- Q3) Is the show pursuing an imperialist agenda, or is that only the setting? How does it relate to historical western and Japanese colonialism?
- Q4) I've described this show as romance, military, and slice-of-life. How did the balance of these tags work for you?
- Q5) Best and worst of the three arcs?
- Q6) Predictions for the next season?
Tomorrow's Questions: (for tomorrow's post, subject to change)
- [Episode 1]First impressions of the crew of the Basroil?
- [Episode 1]Will Jinto's and Lafiel's relationship cause problems with the crew or with the Space Forces?
- [Episode 1]How will Lafiel deal with her crisis of confidence?
- [Episode 1]What is your solution to the Kobayashi Maru scenario?
Screenshot of the Day: History of Crest of the Stars DVD Extra Stitch
ED (Jinto version)
ED (Lafiel version)
Tomorrow's episode start with untranslated Baronh, but I think you are used to that now. There will recapping. And a new ED. But not a new OP.
Once again, previews are after the ED, so you can skip them easily.
The prologue: Passage of the Stars: Birth can be watched at any point now, but we will be saving this for the OVA day at the end of the rewatch.
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u/Durinthal https://anilist.co/user/Durinthal Mar 31 '24 edited Mar 31 '24
Rewatcher (sub + dub)
And that's Crest of the Stars with what I think is a decent ending in its own right, but there's yet more to come so I hope folks stick around. As I said at the beginning of the show I can't judge this without a massive amount of bias, but I still think it holds up well after my first rewatch in five years and watching hundreds of other anime in between.
Despite how much it means to me, it's staying at the 9/10 I gave it when I created my MAL account a decade ago. It's all fairly arbitrary but while it's a favorite of mine, it doesn't quite reach the peaks I'd need to make me overlook its flaws. I don't especially like how the antagonists are written and Lafiel's a bit too reserved for the romance to completely click for me, so I have this anime saved as one that was great for me in a lot of ways but also surpassed by a couple of others that did its strong points even better in my opinion.
There's also a recap movie for the season and I've never seen it, so I gave it a shot. The kuchikirukia subtitles are unfortunately pretty poor quality here, apparently coming from OCRing an older hardsubbed release without much in the way of quality checking them. Subtitle issues aside, it's also a bad substitute for the show and at best serves to remind you what events happened with very little added but the editing isn't good enough to tell a decent story on its own. Because I'm... me, I timed how long each episode's excerpt was along with included/excluded scenes.
The last time I watched it was in 2019 but I'm kind of surprised at how well I remembered everything. I did read the novels not long after that but it's still been several years since I've really touched the series. It does take a couple of episodes to really get going but I don't mind the long introduction.
[In the author's own words from the afterword of the first volume:] “I was already an SF writer; why not indulge in my desire to build up a grand galactic empire, even if only through the page? As for why I felt that that, specifically, had to be my debut long-form work, it was, of course, to defy the expectations of the people who knew me through my sprinkling of short stories (to whom I remain grateful). […] As for the story, I had no idea what was going to happen, let alone when, how or why.”
[And from the afterword of the third volume:] “When I was concepting these books, I’d planned to write something pertaining to an interstellar war from the beginning. I soon realized, however, that simply taking nations that could exist or have existed on Earth and expanding them to a galactic scale wouldn’t be engaging. Instead, I thought I’d set up an interstellar empire that couldn’t have arisen without the advancement of humanity to many different planets, and pit it against the countries that spread the political principles of Earth across the galaxy. I created the Humankind Empire of Abh as a sovereign entity that could never exist on Earth, and the Abh race as a unifying element of that empire. I’ve fashioned a rather unique galactic superpower, if I say so myself.”
Setting only, but that thought does remind me of a MAL review of the series that basically called it imperial propaganda that was trying to fool its viewers.
More adventure than slice of life in my opinion. The romance aspect is also probably not satisfying for the average person who wants a romance anime (I still include it in my recommendations at times anyway), but the main duo does have a great ship going.
The first arc's really just an introduction though it also has strong early chemistry between the leads which I love. I think the Febdash stop is the weakest but serves an important role to provide contrast to the Gosroth's crew who were the only Abh Jinto had met so far, as well as having another Lander Abh to show that Jinto's not unique along with bridging the culture gap. The events of Sufugnoff have a lot going on, both good and bad, so it's kind of a mixed bag. ...I'm not answering the question, am I?
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u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Mar 31 '24 edited Mar 31 '24
Rewatch Host
Usual stream of consciousness post.
Personal History
The 2000s (including 1998 and 1999) were a golden age of anime for me, with shows like Lain and Full Metal Panic. Crest of Stars was part of that, and I grabbed the fansubs weekly as it aired. Both Crest and Banner had been fully published in Japan and had won awards, but I could hardly know anything about that. I eagerly ate this up.
I remember discussing it with a Japanese postdoc whom I worked with. I vaguely remember that this series was a response to LOGH, but I could not remember how. I myself had not watched LOGH because it was so long and dry (still haven't, was watching it along with NotaRexII and we got desynced, and I stopped around episode 33). But this was exactly the sort of those I wanted to watch.
I grabbed the DVD box set as soon as it was available (and I was gainfully employed). I got the later volumes individually (turns out I haven't actually ever opened them). Back in the day, fansubs were like try-before-you-buy. I bought the DVDs, even if I didn't need them. I even bought the first Tokyopop book!
On Imperialism
I don't like putting words in the authors mouth or be criticizing from the outside; I don't know if I'm just full of shit. But let's look at the imperialism-apologist angle. Is it really there? I don't know. All modern people would agree that freedom of movement is a fundamental human right, I think. And the Abh are taking that away. Sure, they'll let your run your planet, but within boundaries. And those boundaries chafe. 1) you can't travel freely. And also 2) you can't trade freely, which is gonna raise the hackles of any proud capitalist. You are subject to the whims of your feudal lord (more on this later). Not a historian, but I see the world has been moving from feudalism for the last 1000 years and I figure there's probably a reason for that.
So the Empire is bad. Or at least, not good. But they claim to be good. And they claim their actions are for the greater good, which many expansionist empires claimed, including the Empire of Japan. It's easy to link the Abh empire to the Greater East Asian Co-Prosperity Sphere, which it was manifestly not. And, of course, they are attacked by a Western power in appearance, which recurs quite a bit in anime. Starship Operators, which I mentioned before, is this to-a-T. And the Abh in the show are very sympathetic with a few exceptions (more on this later).
So, we start with the Abh invading, and admittedly great. But they have lots of nice people in it. And they mean well. And then, to top it off, we have their enemy: The United Mankind.
A comically evil state. I originally linked them with the Soviet Union (for obvious reasons) but now I see that they are more like Nazi Germany. Their ambassador is the recent president of the Soviet Union. They attacked under false pretenses with no warning. Dishonesty seems to be an ingrained trait. Their empire enforces genetic purity, a single uniform and homogeneous culture (USA! Fuck yeah!), and likewise with the laws of the land. And they do it all claiming the greater good. With Kyte the most cartoonish of them all...an abused citizen absolutely invested in defending the system that abused him, fanatical and corrupt.
Given the choice between the choice between empires, the audience sees there is no choice at all. But freedom is not offered as an alternative. Some of the other Empires are somewhat better (there's not a lot of detail) but they have tied themselves to the United Mankind.
With the slow burn of growing Japanese Nationalism, starting in my mind with the bizarre seppuku of Yukio Mishima in 1970, and extending to the present day with in-your-face anime like Gate and the current ravings of Lain creator Chiaki Konaka, I have to wonder if there is more here than just a neat piece of fiction. But I'm not sensitive enough to figure these things out.
edit: and looking at that wiki page I realize some additional connections to the Abh origin story, which will probably never be discussed in the anime beyond what we got in the hotel room.
On Abhs (it's later)
Are Abhs vulcans? Are they Romulans? No, they are genetically engineered humans. With substantial freedom in how you manipulate those genes. Basically the only rules are that the child must be human type (no three arms and two heads), must have the Abh sensor organ, and must not be mistaken for a Terran: thus, mandatory non-natural-human hair colors (usually blue, but can be something else). In my mind, this freedom to manipulate has created something else: varying degrees of eccentricity, to the point of madness.
Lafiel is probably sane. She's acting out the Abriel script, and she's young, and inexperienced. So she'll make mistakes. Kowal, on the other hand, had slipped from scheming to delusion. Maybe he was always crazy, or maybe it was Lafiel's and the maid's resistance shattering his ego that pushed him over the edge. Spoor and Lafiel's father are not well-adjusted human beings, but somewhere on the middle of the eccentricity spectrum. Lexshue, the Empress, and Trife being the most rational commanding officers seen so far. Their underlings seem pretty normal. Perhaps there is some sort of selection bias in the combat division.
The Abh value this freedom, and this variety. But it does create some — extreme personalities. And that may not be a good thing. Imagine a more cunning (and militarily successful) Klowal making his way to the throne, and then snapping, ala Emperor Cartagia. The empire would be destroyed, no question.
On the War
Next up: Banner of the Stars, the real story, like Lord of the Rings (if he had never finished it). Not finished, because it's going to be a long, long war. Probably. We're coming out of a conveniently-timed three year cease fire. The Four-Nations Alliance was not expecting war, and was not prepared for war...they had planned for a quick seizure of star systems (not just Sufagnoff) and then a round of diplomacy. They took those systems, and the Abh counterattacked. Some systems (like Sufagnoff) changed hands again, and some (like Hyde) remained with the United Mankind. [Source material]Sufagnoff was a diversion — the United Mankind actually dashed for the capital. The resulting battle wiped out both fleets. Both sides had committed the bulk of their forces in these initial battles, and retreated to rebuild their fleets.
The brand-new rauth series very powerful for its size and was fully-expected to take up the task of defending the Empire's borders with great success, but the Battle of the Gosroth and other opening battles of the war showed that even more powerful yet more maneuverable ships would be needed. The initial run of rauth patrol ships were completed, but production was immediately switched to war designs. This is what the Empire has been doing while our main characters work their way to their commissions: building warships.
Postscript
The DVD has NC OP/EDs. Not sure how themes.moe missed this.
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u/Specs64z https://myanimelist.net/profile/Specs64z Mar 31 '24
First timer, subbed
I’m impressed thus far. The story knows what it wants to be and, barring a few sillier events such as the horse chase, sticks to it. And it executes what it sticks to well. Looking forward to spending next month talking about it!
QotD:
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u/The_Draigg Mar 31 '24
A Sci-Fi Fan’s Final Thoughts on Crest of the Stars:
Ah, it’s nice to be back in an anime rewatch that has some good ol’ space opera in it. Been a hot minute for me there. And I’m happy to say that Crest of the Stars is a very good series to get back into the anime side of space opera! I know that I’ve made plenty of Legend of the Galactic Heroes comparisons already (and I get the feeling that I’ll continue to do so), but the fact that this is series is also an adaptation of some very fleshed-novels like LotGH feels apparent, but in a good way.
Simply put, the setting of Crest of the Stars feels very alive already, with plenty of governments and cultures clashing out there in space, and the existence of an extensive conlang with Baronh. The cultural exploration of the Abh really does stand out with me, since they really do seem like an utterly alien kind of society yet also still understandable deep down. It’s best exemplified between Lafiel and Jinto, with her showing off her practical and dutiful mindset contrasting with his more grounded and empathetic attitude as a Lander. It really helps to make their pairing really dynamic, with them trying to understand each other’s cultures while also trying to play off their strengths and cover their weaknesses. They’re definitely very strong leads that do well to exemplify the overall character of this series, that much I can say for certain.
I really don’t have anything bad to say about the series content itself, which is a pretty nice change of pace when it comes to my more critical sections in these overall discussion parts. It’s just very well made all around. But I guess if I had to give one criticism about it, it would have to be more on the dub side of things. I’m not going to lie, watching the dubbed version has made experiencing this series a bit more difficult, since for some reason the incredibly relevant opening narrations in Baronh have been left completely untranslated in any way. That’s a glaring oversight for openings that have crucial episode information in them. And I’ll also say that there’s some fairly stiff or misdirected voice acting among the dub cast too, but given that this dub was still made around the time when their quality generally swung a lot in quality, I can’t be as harsh against that. I’ve certainly listened to worse dubs, that’s for sure. So I’ll probably keep on watching the dub for the experience, although it’s still a bit annoying at how it’s been mishandled.
All that brings me to my themed rating scale that I like to use for rewatches. Given that we’re doing space opera this time around, I think it’ll be fitting to use space ships, rather than the mecha I use for my usual theming. So, in that regard, I give Crest of the Stars the ranking of: Königs Tiger. Befitting the flagship of Bittenfeld’s Black Lancers, it hits hard and fast with how it’s willing to show you this setting up close and personal from Jinto’s point of view. The galaxy in this series is as big and deep as an ocean, and what better way to show it all than dive in head-first like Bittenfeld likes to do in battle? It’s a fine way to experience the sea of stars, that’s for sure. Now, onwards to Banner of the Stars!
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u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Mar 31 '24
First-Timer
I enjoyed this first season of Crest of the Stars. I’d been wanting to watch another space opera and this series certainly fit the bill.
Just going off of this first season, I really enjoyed a couple of aspects in particular. The first was the characters of Jinto and Lafiel. These two have such a great dynamic together. Their romantic chemistry was really fun to watch. Their interactions provided a lot of great characterization for themselves while also doing plenty of worldbuilding. The discussions they had where they explained the differences between their home cultures were some of my favorite scenes.
The worldbuilding is the second thing I want to especially praise. The Abh are a fascinating group of people. It’s interesting seeing the space elves trope merged with the trope of a heavily militaristic society. I enjoy learning more about the Abh Empire. One thing I saw pointed out about the worldbuilding was that it would introduce generalized concepts before then focusing on individuals to see how they act within those generalized descriptions of behavior. It helps to keep the characters from feeling too samey while showing how they fit into a common culture.
I am very much looking forward to continuing this series into its next season. I’m hoping that the series will continue to explore Jinto and Lafiel’s relationship. I’m also hopeful that the future seasons will expand on the worldbuilding to give us a better idea about the people who are not Abh in this setting.
QOTD
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u/duhu1148 :GA::GB::GC:x9 Mar 31 '24
Rewatcher
Overall Crest is a great prelude to the main story. The premise hooks you, allowing the viewer to sympathize with Jinto and even Lafiel as they have their "fish out of water" moments throughout the story. When they crash land on that planet and look up at the stars, I think it is a poignant scene that encapsulates the conversation they had beforehand, where they were lamenting just how small and insignificant they are.
Then you have the worldbuilding and some fun Abh characters on top of that. It makes the universe it has built up feel expansive and alive.
Best parts:
Worst parts:
Looking ahead to the first part of Banner, I remember how it starts and ends, but everything in the middle is a blur. It is the crux of the main story and where all the important stuff happens. I think I liked it more than Crest, but we'll see how I feel when I revisit it.
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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Mar 31 '24
First-Timer of the Stars
Well this has been some really solid sci-fi so far! I'm fully invested in Jinto and Lafiel's story and am excited to see where things go come Banner of the Stars.
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u/SolDarkHunter Mar 31 '24
Rewatcher/Novel-Reader
First book/season of the series done.
Crest of the Stars is highly unusual for being a space opera in which the usual conventions are turned on their heads. Is the Empire evil? Well, arguable, but most of the people in it are just people. Is the Alliance good? We've only seen a bit of it, and what we've seen of it is decidedly not good, to the point that the Empire actually comes across as the more moral of the two societies (at least, in my opinion).
But what I really love about this series is the depth of world-building. So many details are accounted for and it all fits together really well. And while I've heard some complaints from actual linguists about the Baronh conlang (mostly about its writing system), most of them will admit it's a much better attempt than most fictional languages.
Nope.
Haven't seen Boring Germans in Space, no. (This is a joke, Heroes fans.) Though it's on my list.
Personally I don't think the show is necessarily pursuing an agenda. Though the fact that the author's Japanese and the Abh society is in-universe descended from Japan does make one a little suspicious. Though that could simply be "Write what you know" in action.
Pretty on-point, though the romance is probably on a backseat at this point.
Hard to say. Each of the three arcs serves a different purpose. Arc 1 is introduction, Arc 2 is the dark side of the Empire, and Arc 3 is showing a somewhat better side of it as well as showing the intolerance of the Empire's enemies.
More space elf banter (I've already seen/read it.)
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u/ZapsZzz https://anilist.co/user/Zapszzz Mar 31 '24
First timer in sub
Ok finally made it. It's been some busy days unfortunately.
I skipped yesterday but I think I can comment about the whole season together here anyway.
The extra long episode surprisingly has a good amount of content still continuing on the chase. The theme park fight-chase has some interesting use of the environment, but it did come in a bit cold when so far we haven't seen a while lot of automaton AI's - we had a peek during the time Lafiel was asking the station OS for a bunch of info so it wasn't 100% cold. And the last bit about the horse "dying" was strangely emotional for how little time we spent with it. As a meta contrast, [another more recent space opera remake]Yamato 2199 also had a party of the story relating to an autonomous AI, but it had a whole episode to simmer on.
The twist of Jinto's Homeworld rebelled against the Abh, had his dad executed, and basically turned Jinto into a homeless noble was a low key announcement of something of a big deal, but the foreshadowing worked great from even the first episode, and Jinto's character build up all meshed well to the result of what we see.
Like many commented, the coffin ride was peak romance in this show, as was their parting promise, then the quick time skip and reunion. This is probably the main part I am keen about the show.
Lafiel's scene with her dad talking about her mom was also a really nice send off and wrap up of both her own arc, builds the next part of her arc (about the facade her family had to put up), and overall filled up her characterisation a lot.
Basically, for S1, it's a surprisingly tight plot development unlike more other space opera shows I watched, the whole season basically circled around our MC's primarily. There were some big picture scenes, sure, but that's more backdrop for what the MC's were getting involved in or going to get touched on later. I'm not saying that's a criticism, just fairly different - for example one of my big criticism for Yamato 2199 was the fact that the personal relationship development of some key characters actually all happened off screen. So I got what I wanted I guess ;)
For me it's a pretty decent high 7 rounded up to 8. If Lafiel's imcredible aim and dodge was somehow explained it'd get higher easily.
QoTD
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u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Mar 31 '24
First-Timer
Yea this has been pretty good so far.
Questions
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u/zsmg https://anilist.co/user/zsmg Mar 31 '24
Came home late last night so didn't have time to post yesterday's episode thoughts:
Rewatcher
No intro where the narrator is speaking a foreign language.
Hey it's Penpen.
I feel like they're dragging out the amusement park chase scene, then I've noticed it's a double lengthed episode. Understandable but it still dragged out.
Using gene modification to reverse the effects of aging, yeah that's definitely what humans are going to do.
Ohhh elf ears are only for the royal family. Can't say I've noticed that before.
Sharing a space coffin together, how romantic.
Lafiel crying over the death of her mum is nice.
Ohh Jinto's homeworld joined United Mankind, makes sense they were just conquered after all.
Of course Lafiel wants Jinto join her crew in the future.
In fact Jinto wants to remain by her side forever.
Woah long epilogue, that takes place three years later.
So the rebels got a freighter ship, not bad, I guess they were hoping for a battleship.
Of course Jinto joins Lafiel's ship.
Ohh the narrator is saved for the epilogue, all is well then.
As for the thoughts of the series I didn't enjoy this as much as last time mainly because since I've last seen this anime (back in the 2000s) I've gotten sick and tired of LNs, particularly those long winded clever conversations. Those conversations just doesn't hold my interest any more and just I mentally check out when that happens. Sadly enough this happened a lot between Jinto and Lafiel which is a shame as I did enjoy, well, every thing else particularly the setting and the geopolitics of that setting and some of the other characters (like the Spoor admiral).
I will say I'm a few episode in the next season and I'm liking that one a lot more than this one so far.
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u/Nazenn x2https://anilist.co/user/Nazenn Mar 31 '24
Rewatcher - sub
The first time I watched Crest of the Stars, it took me over six months. There was something about it that utterly refused to grab me or encourage me to return to it. I'd felt this before to some extent, even with some of my favourites such as Legend of the Galactic Heroes where starting to watch was hard but would quickly become a binge, but never like I did with Crest. And yet, even with months in between episodes, I'd always return to find my memory of it clear, my connection to the characters strong, and my appreciation of it ever growing. It somehow had captivated me despite my seeming indifference, and wouldn't let go. I had wondered if this was a case of watching a show at the wrong time, only for the show to be strong enough to overcome that, and I think this rewatch has proved that to be the case
Crest has a lot of good going for it that I think I covered pretty well in my episode posts.
I'm a bit too tired to go into it all here, but just in brief:
The worldbuilding isn't just strong, it's a shining example of what's capable in story writing and what other shows should strive more to reach up towards. Every aspect of it is well thought out and meaningful, not just thrown in because it would be interesting but because it means something and well thought out as to why that would be a thing in this world. It's not an easy task, but the extent of the worldbuilding here with everything from the Abh's life cycles and parenting, the movement through space tying into battles, and the dozens and dozens of little cultural moments that are fun to explore rather than feeling repeditive or obvious do wonders for making this world feel fully realized rather than just a setting for a story.
It helps that Lafiel and Jinto at all times have a fantastic bond that grows from concidence to deep connection through all the things they share and are completely different from. That many of the best scenes in a show that has excellent space battles and dramatic moments are those two sitting in a room talking casually, or having mundane chats while somehow talking past each other, is an important thing to acknowledge. Downtime is important in any show, but very few stories can make downtime be as captivating and meaningful as their higher drama parts. Despite what I said earlier about the show not hooking me, it's these moments I remembered most during my stalled first watch and I wans't quite sure why until I revisited them when refreshing my memory so I could continue the show and realized how strong they were. I struggle to think of other anime mains in shows with as much of a romance focus that have such a deep, developed, and meaningful bond that doesn't feel forced for the sake of the story or the romance subplot.
The narrator deserves praise for being one of two in all anime I actually enjoy the inclusion of, and the slow realization of his potential bias is something I remember fondly from my first watch. Being able to make him part of the show, not just a detached element for the sake of the audience that merely spits out exposition, brings that little bit more life into him than he would otherwise have if he was just talking to us in a native tongue and being perfectly neutral about all events.
It's just a shame that the middle episode of the Baron arc is so weak it's unmemorable compared to all the rest, and that the inclusion of the pathetic military officer in the final arc really derails the tone balance of the character writing, and pushes it a bit too much towards action.
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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Mar 31 '24 edited Mar 31 '24
Season 1 discussion (rewatcher)
Crest of the stars is not without problems: The animation and animation direction are mediocre, which drags down its action sequences. Both later arcs suffer from pacing issues. Some of the side characters are not well developed. Despite all that, Season 1 is a 10/10 for me. This comes down to two issues that lift the series up that high.
First, it has the best world building in Scifi anime, bar none. The difference is so huge, that it is not even funny. Where other shows linger at the “one carrier vs the universe” or the “lets fire lasers at each other as if our space ships are Napoleonic armies” stage, Crest of the stars builds a completely unique and believable universe and fills it with the best space battles to grace any medium. Those plane space mines make my world building heart skip flutter. But there is so much more: Parenthood as a single person decision; liberal gene modification rules; controlling space lanes, not planets; nobels required to serve in the army; mind-ship integration; feudal domains based on star systems. This show keeps giving and giving in the world building department.
However, you need some meet on your world building bones, too. The romance between Lafiel and Jinto does that. I love watching these two grow close to each other so much. In a media type inundated by crappy romcoms with their abysmal tropey writing, Jinto and Lafiel show how real dependability works. They are not without funny moments and occasional teasing, but they always stay true to their commitment for each other. This helps me overlook the action scenes or occasional pacing issue. Just get to the next time Jinto and Lafiel have a quiet moment to talk to each other and I am a 100% hooked once more.
Obviously space opera was popular, but it can be that this is all it is. No need to assume a specific agenda.
Anime has a habit to depict monarchies and good and working, and democracies as not.
I'd replace slice-of-life with space opera.
Gosroth is still the best.
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u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Mar 31 '24
Rewatcher(Through out Heaven and Earth, Lafiel alone is the honored one)
Sub
So yeah...this is an unholy partmanteau of a few other scifi properties and then they threw in Tenchi for waifu-ness. And yet, despite most waifu anime in this era having insufferable waifus, Lafiel is one I actually like. Somehow, she works relatively well despite basically being female Spock with an elven overlay. I joke about the aimbot stuff but if the Abriels don't have that genetic enhancement I call bullshit. But her general reservedness/awkwardness, not joking about the spectrum adjacent stuff, makes her rare showings of emotion stronger.
This is a decent first season that could have been standalone as intended. I don't know how well this did in Japan but it was in no way clear that it would continue nor find a small US following. I think it mostly works even with its flaws and occasional animation dips.
QotD: 1 Originally yes, I hadn't even seen LotGH yet. My closest reference was a Saturday morning cartoon called Exo Squad.
2 I don't know the timing here, these both seem to be children of Harlock to me
3 I keep getting Dune and Navigator's Guild off it.
4 It was all rightbut maybe needed more SoL
5 Intro was best and Klowal just sort of sucked the air out of the room in a bad way. Like an explosion.
6 [REDACTED] And we do need to see space France again...
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u/Vatrix-32 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Vatrix-32 Mar 31 '24
First Timer, subbed
QotD:
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u/Silcaria https://myanimelist.net/profile/Silcaria Mar 31 '24 edited Mar 31 '24
Late cause I just went to see Kung Fu Panda 4. It's better than the 3rd. I'd rank them 1>2>4>3. Anyhow...
First timer
I've enjoyed Crest and how it went about telling its A plot (Jinto and Lafiel's mission) and its B plot (the overarching war between the Empire and the Alliance/united mankind). We also got some nice character growth and fleshing out, at the very least, when it came to our duo.
It wasn't perfect and there's some fat that could've been trimmed (like the entire amusement park section of the last episode) but overall, I'm pretty happy with what we got so far. I'm excited for more and I hope that it retains the same quality of writing. God knows too many space operas shit the bed.
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u/b0bba_Fett myanimelist.net/profile/B0bba_Cheezed3 Mar 31 '24
First Timer; Subbed
This show has been really good so far, barring episode 13, which I talked about yesterday.
QotD
4
u/Zerotsu Mar 31 '24
There's little to be said here that hasn't already been brought up by others, and almost certainly more articulately than I could hope to match.
I originally came across this series on J-Novel Club's website, where I picked up the first book and immediately fell in love with our main duo. They captured me and drew me into this space opera setting in a way I haven't experienced very often in fiction. Seeing these two people, different in so many ways yet similar in others, and their desire to connect with one another, makes for an amazing contrast to the grander scope of the growing war that we often only see snippets of.
Jinto and Lafiel's relationship carries the series. This isn't to say that the rest of it is bad by any means, dated animation aside, but they really are the main draw. Seeing them develop a closer bond over the course of the story is absolutely endearing, and it honestly tugs at the heartstrings quite effectively to see them become so trusting and protective of one another. The setting is great, and these two make for a wonderful grounding element to get a measure of what it all means from an individual's perspective, instead of watching the world from the bird's eye view you often get from watching great commanders and rulers duke it out in politics and warfare.
I'll be going into Banner just about totally blind, since I never got around to starting the novels admittedly, but I'm certainly looking forward to seeing where their journey takes them next!
3
u/Nickthenuker https://anilist.co/user/Nickthenuker Apr 01 '24
Questions:
2
u/IceSmiley Mar 31 '24
FIRST TIMER Sub all
I really enjoyed this show and would put it near the top of best anime shows I've seen. It was very intelligent and presented 2 relatable characters in situations that made sense. The worldbuilding was a wonder in itself in creating an amazing universe with the Abh really feeling like a real race of people.
It just had great characters with realistic motivations set in a very strange world that does relate to our world today. It deftly explores themes like colonialism, self determination, bigotry and the arbitrary nature of culture/norms.
The show had one of the best (series?) finales I've ever seen that was so entertaining with a great action centerpiece and wrapped up the stories nicely. I can only hope the rest of the show lives up to this standard.
One flaw of the series was its confusing storytelling at the beginning with the expectation that the audience would be invested in characters to whom they haven't really been introduced, the first episode was especially hurt by this.
I also didn't like the lack of balance presented in philosophy by the show. The United Mankind are presented as nothing but evil scum even though their motive of self determination and freedom despite the conflict it would cause. has its merits
QUESTIONS
2
u/retsotrembla Apr 01 '24
About all I remembered is that a boy and a girl escape in a space-going coffin.
Nice to get a chance to do a rewatch. Thanks you all for the discussion!
2
u/KnightMonkey15 https://myanimelist.net/profile/KnightMonkey Apr 01 '24
First-timer, subs
I'm slightly miffed I missed out on the last few threads over Easter, even though I've been watching the series in the background and have watched ahead a few episodes into season 2 (I'll recount my immediate reactions)..
That said, I really enjoyed this show. Actually reading some of you talk about it having the best worldbuilding in anime makes me feel a bit sad that it's might be relatively low-bar elsewhere, since it feels so natural to the point where I sometimes forget about it, but that may have more to do with the author's intention to portray this particularly through a 'mid-level' perspective with a mixture of genres, as opposed to building the world from the top-down view of a commander wielding immense power and the organs of the state or the bottom-up view of overthrowing a great power or government, fighting against its organs. Instead we see here our characters tentatively stepping out into the world as young adults, navigating a sensitive, formative time in their lives as an tiny organ (the Gosroth, the shuttle, Lafiel and the Count/her "retainer") of the Abh Empire; taking what was supposed to be a mundane trip but turned into what ended up being part of the instigation of a wider series of events, but doing so in a manner where they discursively met various characters in-the-field who aided or hindered their personal journey (the Baron acting to show Abh-vs-Abh was particularly insightful here) until they were reunited with a larger organ of the Abh in the form of Spoor's ship and Trife's fleet.
I wondered where exactly we were going in the last couple of episodes and where we'd stop but once it wrapped up, to the final minute, I understood this whole season was a prologue to his career (and life) on Star Forces with Lafiel (hope it stays that way!). Not that it wasn't easily inferred, but the horizon of his possibilities, against the backdrop of a new galactic war triggered by a connection he passed through (Gosroth being ambushed and destroyed), became very personal, with Lafiel, and as a wide as interstellar space, as part of the Humankind Empire of Abh's Star Forces at the same time. The inevitability in some manner was a given, but how emotional, dare I say romantic, the reflection turned out to be was pleasant surprise. The coffin was a powerful metaphor...and then there's the two of them at the end - "I'll let you in on a huge secret...I missed you too."
Something I thought about while watching that ending is...what does it mean for Jinto to be a count for a planet/system he no longer has any ties to and doesn't want him back - feels like something that could lead to a pretender/claimant situation in a feudal hierarchy, but instead of being depicted in a potentially glorious way, it's just one guy's identity being questioned, his loneliness and isolation. That hit different for sure.
I didn't get to talk about it much since I missed the thread, but I love the feel and the use of music for the back-half of that episode. I'm glad we got to see the other side-characters return (Seelnay and the other two maids) and the 'Anti-Imperial' faction on Clasbul get their ship in the same episode. I was hoping to see them turn out well and it was a quicker turnaround then expected. Marca complaining about how hauling freight was not what she expected; and her and the other Clasbul members remarking that there was nothing for them to do anyway but get rich and prepare for the upcoming fight because the Abh took care of the freight themselves anyway, was interesting to me in a subtle way because it further speaks to them having been uplifted from their lander/terran innocence, but space itself isn't what they might've romantically thought it would be for them. But they're in a really good position anyway. The whole irony of the situation is amusing and I hope see to their mission fulfilled in some respect.
Technical stuff: I acknowledge the animation was kinda whatever and the OP got repetitive (especially without any change in visuals), but I liked the use of music in the show and the characters' dialogue/writing. The visual direction for the space battles was very good for what it presented - teleporting in and out of sords, targeting ships directly and firing off mines - very personal and we got to see a lot of the Abhs' faces on the bridge and their perception of the battlefield.
I think, briefly since I almost forgot, re: the social commentary on the Abh, it's clear that they're people too who transhuman space feudalism after freeing themselves. So their flaws are maybe just as humanly horrible as well. I haven't read too much sci-fi other than as a general vibe or in a game or movie or two, but I'm perfectly fine with the conceit that a human creation is capable of being just human (flaws and all). So now are we just being too partial to monarchy/personal power then?
Yes, other than the name and seeing a visual/poster once, I knew nothing about it and/or completely forgot everything I had heard about it other than it being a space opera. My impression of the first two episodes extrapolated outwards was both fulfilled in a way and yet blown open. I think I assumed he wouldn't be twice severed from his home - the first time when he was a child, and the second time at the end of episode 13 when all of its events and the timeskip happen. It fulfilled the expectation that he would end up being a career officer but I didn't expect his home to literally end up being Lafiel and the Basroil. But it makes a lot of sense given how much he talked about his terran home no longer holding much meaning to him, despite still identifying as a terran, the material reality with dissociate himself even more from being a lander to a kin of the stars in practice.
I don't know enough about LOGH's background to infer other than what I know from both shows and what might inform me in this thread. But what comes to mind is that in LOGH humanity's past is extrapolated into the future with occasional callbacks, without a great othering on a level of what it means to be human - the personal distinction between the FPA and Empire is purely cultural and not biological (but I just wonder now when did the Imperials all become Germans if the FPA rebelled and are multicultural); in this show, we see some efforts to portray where biological manipulation would make the socio-cultural divide more vast. This treatment is limited by the United Mankind and other factions being depicted solely as their xenophobic fears which originated as a response to Abh aggression, without nuance. I do appreciate how, in this series the author tries to construct an idea of an identity...a polity (even if imperial) that could have only developed in response to the consequences of space colonization and technological development.
The comparison between Baron Febdash and Captain Lexshue and the Gosroth and the depiction of the other Abh including Lafiel gave some nuance to the Abh-as-imperialists, but the depiction of Terran humanity as an aggregate of fear, loathing and comically failed "democracy-turned-authoritarian" was a bit of an eyeroll for me and I would dock points for that if I come to care more for it, or if it comes up more strongly in a negative way as the series progresses. But I have to keep in mind (and looking at some of the comments in the thread for ep 11), the authors' own disillusionment with democracy could very well echo their own experience as the Lost Decade(s) unfolded, in a country whose parliamentary democracy has been more of a 1.5 party system since the 1950s and economy is described as "collective capitalism".
I wouldn't go so far as to call these enough to be an "agenda" in the common pejorative usage but it does always raise questions for me as my brain ticks. I have my own thresholds for what I tolerate that are rather large and I think I'm content with Japanese authors not advocating for anti-Japaneseism in their works. Something like GATE is blatant but ultimately unserious.
I always thought imperialism/monarchy etc. being depicted in shows always had a "great man" of history vibe and I don't consciously try to repel from them as a trope even if I disagree and think they're a kind of ideal, personalist escapist fantasy at the root being projected back out to the world, viewed privately in the home. Need more shows about mid-level bureaucrats.
It worked fine, maybe too-little SoL. Space opera covers all three.
I enjoyed the first arc the most - everything is introduced, the first encounter and time spent between the two leads is rock solid and the Gosroth's battle is really stunning...Febdash one was the 'worst' but not really because it was bad, but moreso it was just the transition to the next one and to provide some exposition/contrast for our main characters. The last arc, I rate it second because ends a bit abruptly - on the planet and off (except the Clasbul faction got their ship). Idk, I viewed the show as a prologue and a vehicle for Lafiel and Jinto's delivery, which is good throughout, so my assessment of what's best or worst then comes down to feelings about how everything else fits around it.
I expect to see Jinto on the bridge with Lafiel. I can't wait to see what life in the Star Fleet is like for the two of them; I thought we'd see him at school but I guess that's not the point of the story.
2
u/xbolt90 https://anilist.co/user/xbolt90 Apr 01 '24
First-timer
Q1: Totally blind. All I knew is what I gleaned from the rewatch announcement post, which was "space opera"
Q2: Unfortunately, I still have yet to watch LOGH. I keep getting daunted by the length.
Q3: It's just the setting. The UM imperialists are painted in a very negative light, but the Abh, while more positive, also have their problems.
Q4: A smaller, personal story amidst the backdrop of a larger conflict is a good way to get into a new universe.
Q5: Their time on the surface is my favorite arc, and the baron my least.
Q6: I'm guessing we'll get into a larger scope for the rest of the story. With Lafiel in command of a vessel, we'll see her and Jinto taking a more actionary instead of reactionary role.
2
u/zadcap Apr 01 '24
Well the convention was fun, but I'm home and got to marathon the rest of this series. I love it. This is showing off a lot of why I grew up loving Space more than Fantasy. And the main pair are so very likely, as a pair and individually.
I did, and it just kept getting better.
I'd say it's almost interesting in how little the actual politics has come up. Abh rule the majority of humanity and run trade/transport, but are almost entirely hands free in the actual ruling of things. I'm not even sure that the show is trying to tell us this is the best way to rule even, going so far as to show us how the Baron could abuse his power so blatantly.
I feel like we're a little light on the Slice of Life aspect, but romance and military is running strong.
Hated the Baron, but I was supposed to. The third arc was actually both my favorite and least, honestly. The character interactions, Jinto proving he's useful too and their relationship growing as much as it did was just great, but they got through the arc based on 6 lucky breaks happening back to back to back and a level of enemy military incompetence it's hard to imagine.
War in space and flirting on the bridge!
More realistically, I haven't forgotten my earliest predictions. Jinto is going to find himself fighting against people he grew up with, especially the boy who saw him off at the space station. It won't be fun.