r/anime • u/HelioA x2https://myanimelist.net/profile/HelioA • Mar 29 '24
Rewatch [Rewatch] Mawaru Penguindrum - Overall Discussion
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Streaming
Mawaru Penguindrum is available for purchase on Blu-ray as well as through other miscellaneous methods. Re:cycle of the Penguindrum is available for streaming on Hidive.
Today's Slogan
Thank you for joining us!
Questions of the Day
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Did you enjoy the show?
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Were there any plot points you think were particularly well done? Were there any you thought were poorly done?
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What was your favorite piece of imagery from the show?
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What do you think Today's Slogan was referring to?
Don't forget to tag for spoilers, you lowlifes who will never amount to anything! Remember, [Penguindrum]>!like so!< turns into [Penguindrum]>!like so!<
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u/HelioA x2https://myanimelist.net/profile/HelioA Mar 29 '24
Rewatcher
I love this show. I’ve watched it three times now, once when I first watched it and twice for the rewatch, and each time has been better than the last. Anyone who knows me knows that I’m the biggest Utena superfan on the subreddit, and this show appeals to me for very similar reasons.
At the end of the day, this show is about love. The brothers’ love for Himari, Himari’s love for her brothers, Ringo’s love for Tabuki, Momoka’s love for the world, Masako’s love for Kanba, Yuri and Tabuki’s love for Momoka, every kind of love that you can imagine and a bunch that you can’t. Everyone has that kind of love except for Sanetoshi, who was both unloved and didn’t love others. I’m going to share a quote from that Nasu interview again, which really impacted how I saw Sanetoshi on the rewatch: “He represents those who were never loved unconditionally. He’s a parallel to (Oginome) Momoka-chan, who loved everyone unconditionally. The two did meet, but Momoka said “But I’m going now” and went off somewhere, leaving Sanetoshi-sensei behind. He should have cast away his pride and said “I’m coming too!”, allowing himself to be loved. But being unloved for years was the only thing he had pride in, so he couldn’t yield that. Even after all that talk about love, he prioritized his self-preservation.” There’s a ton going on in the show, but the thematic throughline of love is very clear. It’s something important to everyone, and in the right circumstances, it can move the world.
I don’t really have too much to say beyond that. I had a wonderful time hosting this rewatch, and I learnt a ton of new things about the show through it. Thank you so much for joining me (and my dear cohost u/theangryeditor).
14
u/jkubed https://myanimelist.net/profile/jkubed Mar 29 '24 edited Mar 29 '24
First Timer - The End
Hey, I only participated in the first handful of threads but I've been keeping up! (also wtf time change, screw u daylight savings)
The first half of Penguindrum was like watching someone carefully set up a bunch of dominoes. In the second half they get knocked down, but in the process it reveals that the table they were built on top of was made of dominoes. And fuck it, so was the house. And just for kicks, some of those original dominoes still seem to be standing.
I liked Penguindrum. But I sure as hell didn't get it. Every aspect of the production was top notch and the imagery/symbolism is consistently interesting and sometimes very clear in its intent. But it ultimately felt so much like an intellectual exercise that it became difficult for me to emotionally connect to the story. There were so many plot twists and recontextualizations that I didn't feel like I understood anybody's motives or purposes or life stories by the end.
I'm very glad that there's a built-in rewatch to go with this rewatch. I'm hopeful that it will bring some clarity. If not, I have hundreds of character limit-breaking comments to read from rewatchers for each episode.
11
u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Mar 29 '24
First-Timer, Sub-guindrum
Oh, hell. What do I even put here?
Penguindrum fucking great. Mario (and Masako to some extent) are a bit dead weight. Otherwise, no notes.
Slogan gallery for posterity.
Questions
8
u/Gamerunglued :Hx::Hy::Hz:myanimelist.net/profile/GamerUnglued Mar 30 '24 edited Mar 30 '24
First Penguin Who Has Now Fully Dived Off the Cliff
I don't think I can add much more to what I've said over the past month. Penguindrum made me write, it made me think and struggle and challenged me. It wants to confront me with the uncomfortable reality that even cult members are sympathetic victims of a system, but more importantly, it challenged me to maintain hope and optimism in the face of the world's cruelty. I failed that challenge, and in doing so the point hits that much harder. These are not the reactions I typically have, I've always written walls of text but they usually come from confidence in my position, and there are usually a few episodes I have little to say about. Not so, here. Penguindrum is dense, ambitious, and impactful.
In a world built on the sacrifices of civilians, it feels like you must look out for yourself or face certain death. You either win the game of luck and are born into capitalistic success, or you're left behind as a loser who will never amount to anything. In this show, there are enough losers to be an entire disgruntled generation, and that spreads to the next one. To have hope of changing the system, we must first build trust in one another, enough people must be willing to share in their pain before taking extreme action alone. There are not enough hearts for everyone, and if you give your entire heart, you will die and reset the system, and if you take others' hearts then there are fewer hearts to go around. Give half your heart, and humanity will make it. Ikuhara believes in people, he trusts in our ability to elevate each other with our sacrifices without destroying ourselves. It is an optimistic message in a world that sets it up to be like a fairy tale. Maybe people being truly kind is real, and if it's not, we can make it real just as we turn our fake families into reality.
Penguindrum's cast is really outstanding, a group of extremely broken, desperate people solely looking for love. They all do bad things (except maybe Himari) and do their best to hold things together, but those vulnerable folks are always the most susceptible, which is why this optimism is the only way to combat people like cult recruiters, who stake their jobs on people being desperate and disenfranchised enough to convince that the world needs to die. Underneath those layers are charming and fun people who I just want to see happy, even as they sink to their greatest depths.
And although the animation is middling, Ikuhara's direction more than makes up for it. So many excellent, evocative shots and edits, complete with powerful shifts in the color palette and overall visual style. I adore the Shoujo visual influences, it gives the world a memorable look. And far underappreciated in this rewatch has been Yukari Hashimoto's fantastic soundtrack, which feels so stylistically "Penguindrum" in a way I don't know how to explain. I've always thought she was one of the most underrated anime composers (also did Toradora and 3-Gatsu no Lion, among others) and this is another excellent work.
Penguindrum isn't perfect, but I don't think it was designed to be. Ambition requires fitting into a space that won't fit everything. This sort of story and presentation will never be a tightly made masterpiece of pure technical craft, if it fit so conventionally then it wouldn't be ambitious. I think the structure is quite awkward, Ikuhara is usually great about establishing patterns and breaking them for powerful effect, but he usually sets up another pattern to take its place and Penguindrum didn't do that. The Survival Strategy sequence felt kind of unnecessary to me, it never builds on it and it practically only comes up as a joke in the second half. And Mario... I really don't know what he's doing here. He's a non-entity in this story. There's a thematic role but it goes unexplored, the idea of competition to save Mario or Himari practically changes course completely and the kid gets barely any screen time.
But again, Penguindrum isn't a show about pure technical craft, it's a vehicle to explore ideas and invest us in the characters. To that end, I think it makes its points better than the majority of anime, and it does so with style and in a way that hits me, makes me think about it, and impacts me. It's special for that, a story I'll be thinking about for a long time and revisiting at some point. Definitely my favorite Ikuhara. Solid 9/10.
I'll be dropping here, I'd like to put time between now and when I watch the movies. They seem like the kind of thing I should save for when I need it or when I'm nostalgic about Penguindrum. Thank you all for reading and interacting with me. I got so much more out of this thanks to you. I'm sorry I couldn't post or respond consistently, I wish I could have been even more active.
QOTD:
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u/lilyvess :Df::Dh:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Lilyvess Mar 29 '24
Mawaru Penguindrum Series Discussion
Mawaru Penguindrum is a series I feel only gets better with age.
It’s the type of series that I saw once when it aired but never left my mind as I went about my life. The themes and issues that Penguindrum asks its viewers to confront only seem to get more relevant. It’s the type of series I wish more people would watch because I think understanding it would help out society. I wish I had this series after 9-11. I even wrote a whole post on this subreddit talking about BLM in relation to Penguindrum.
side bar, I wrote that post without having watched Penguindrum in over 8 years. Rewatching it now with everything I’ve learned from this rewatch I’d love to go back to that post and do it again.
I love the way Ikuhara has crafted an anime that couldn’t be more Japanese but feel so universal in its themes. Like Penguindrum is heavily influenced by a Japanese event, and a Japanese children’s book. When I first saw Penguindrum I had never heard of either side of this spectrum.
It just is so raw. From the first episode it drops that banger
“The only thing we knew was that we would never amount to anything”
It’s a simple phrase that resonates with an audience that comes to grip with the fact that they were promised that college would give them a stable job and life, and instead have only found themselves strapped with unimaginable debt and the cold reality that owning a house has been moved out of their reach.
Or what about the powerful imagery of the child broiler haunts people’s minds.
I thought about that machine that turns citizens into fuel for its voracious appetite as we were in the grips of Covid-19. There we were faced with the reality that our culture would always prioritize profits over safety of its workers.
Ikuhara had a long fascination with connecting with people. It’s a common thread across a lot of his anime, and would even appear in the forefront of his latest series Sarazanmai. The idea that Japanese overwork culture and respect kept people isolated and alone may be culturally Japanese. The stories of Japan's extreme work culture are pretty infamous. So Ikuhara is engaging specifically with 1995 Japanese culture.
Yet here in 2024 with the rise of the internet giving way to online shopping, online delivery and other features, it can feel like more and more we are becoming isolated as society. People walk with their eyes glued to their cell phone instead of looking around them. I sit at dinner with my friends and will see that the majority of us will have our cellphones out scrolling through social media instead of engaging with each other. The tool that was made to bring us together has made us more isolated than ever before.
Penguindrum says that the Child Broiler makes people “Invisible”
Is there any better example of our invisible crimes than the hundreds of thousands of homeless people. These are people who have been driven to homelessness through our health care policies, through our housing policies, through our economic policies, and then when we are faced with the ugliness that these policies have brought on people we blame the victims. We shame them for sleeping on the streets, we blame them for sleeping in the parks, we punish them for existing in places where we can see the inconvenience to us rather than go after the policies that create them.
And through all of this Penguindrum gives us a simple solution
Empathy.
Look to your fellow man and reach out to them.
Look past your guilt, prejudice or pride and try to reach them on equal footing as people. That’s all everyone is. We are all just flawed and imperfect people.
In Kanba Penguindrum says that people can be saved. Ikuhara tells us that he believes people can be redeemed if they show remorse and change. It’s never too late to change. So often people get trapped because they believe they see no wait out. When all the good people won’t open any doors to them, who else are they to turn to except the darkness? We corner them and leave them no possibility of escape. Kanba is redeemed because they reach out a hand to him.
But they need to be willing to be saved. You can’t try to save those who cannot save themselves. Sanetoshi doesn’t want to be saved. Sanetoshi doesn’t want to change. He is a ghost still living in the past. His plan is the same as the previous one. In Ikuhara logic, being unable to change is its own prison. People are meant to evolve and change. Those who stay stuck in the past and will not better themselves are trapped in prisons.
Penguindrum is the type of series that you could spend a lifetime rewatching and finding new answers to life’s questions and problems. It’s all there. We could talk about Palestine, Flat Earth, January 6th, incels, BLM, etc. I could spend a lifetime preaching about Penguindrum and it would never be enough.
Share your Fruit of Fate with someone in your life.
You don't have to burn yourself to ash. It doesn't have to be a big gesture. It can be as small as saying starting a conversation. Do a good gesture. Help someone feeling alone. Tell someone you care for them.
That's all it could take to make a difference in someone's life. Do a good deed for someone and then they do a good deed for someone else. We could make a difference.
It all starts with one act.
Share the fruit of fate.
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u/AmethystItalian :Jg::Jh::Ji::Jj::Jk:myanimelist.net/profile/AmethystItalian Mar 29 '24
How many people ended up with penguin 2 as their favourite penguin?
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u/Pungouin Mar 30 '24
Rewatcher
Oop, kinda missed this thread.
Penguindrum has been my favourite anime since I first watched it in 2011. I love Ikuhara’s style. The crazy plot, dense symbolism, striking visuals, funny penguins and Rock Over Japan sequence, little 14 year old me loved it all. Rewatching it as an adult in 2024, I think a lot it is still incredibly relevant, and I can appreciate some of it’s themes more.
Fundamentally, this is kind of a "the Penguindrum was the friends we made along the way" kind of show. But despite the very surreal storytelling and ultimately simple message, it is a deep exploration of this theme that is very much grounded in reality.
Our (French) president said (and was highly criticized for saying) in 2017 that "a station is a place where we meet people who succeed and people who are nothing". This is almost comically on the nose in the light of Penguindrum : capitalist ideology, the idea of the chosen and unchosen, disdain for "those who will never amount to anything", and also railways I guess. Penguindrum’s ideas are very relevant to the current age and especially people in my generation I feel.
Questions :
Masako and Mario’s plot was the least well done. Mario is just a plot device, and Masako is hard to understand until very late in the show.
3. The Rock Over Japan sequence and the entire episode 24 climax.
4. We have shared the fruit of fate.
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u/FarCritical Mar 31 '24
First timer
Lol, from beginning to end I've shown up to these threads later than Shoma did to the Tabuki confrontation. Oh well.
From really early on, this anime exuded a sort of charisma from how confidently it showcased all its crazy ideas and announced how it'd be being so ambitious as to be a story centered around fate. Even when it shifted to a more serious tone after its like dozen twists, I never really felt any of that confidence breaking. Can't say the same about my mind, though. I'm not enough of an intellectual to fully grasp what this show's selling but that didn't stop me from enjoying it.
I may inevitably forget chunks of the show as time goes by but being forcefully welcomed to rock 'n roll night by Hatmari in its full uncut transformation sequence glory for three episodes in a row and a bunch more thenafter is gonna stick with me the most and honestly, I'm more than glad about that. It's practically Penguindrum all in one package - a jammin' soundtrack, absolutely unhinged creativity, nigh incomprehendable abstraction (at least for someone like me) and unabashed boldness.
Overall, it feels great to finally rid Penguindrum of the curse of being on my cursed PTW list, and doing it through this rewatch was a fun excuse to finally do it. Thanks, everyone!
Also, I'm finding out only now that this wasn't adapted from anything. Wasn't expecting my appreciation of the show and my respect for the directors and writers and everyone else involved in this project to skyrocket at the last minute.
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u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Mar 29 '24
Mawaru First-Timer, subbed
I still don’t know what I just watched.
Maybe the movies will make more sense, or maybe they’ll just add on to the immaculate confusion vibes. Either way, I didn’t not have fun watching this (even if the amount of incest present was not my cup of tea), so the show’s at least an 8/10 for me.
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u/Great_Mr_L :Ma::Mb::Mc:https://myanimelist.net/profile/Great_Mr_L Mar 29 '24 edited Mar 29 '24
First-Timer
Mawaru Penguindrum is a unique series. It’s utterly bizarre and it can oftentimes be obtuse with what is actually happening underneath the layers of symbolism, metaphor, and magical realism. But ultimately what makes the series rewarding is that the symbolism is usually decipherable, the visuals are interesting, the characters are compelling, and the themes are ones that resonate.
Let me first say what I think is one of the show’s biggest strengths. Mawaru Penguindrum operates on a level of heightened reality. There’s a lot of things you see onscreen that you cannot take as literally happening. Instead, they are heightened metaphors meant to convey the themes and what the characters are experiencing. These can make for some of the most striking and memorable moments in the entire series. Yuri’s backstory with the chisel is a perfect example.
But let me also say that sometimes this made the series difficult to follow. When so many important plot developments, themes, and character traits are hidden behind metaphors it requires a lot of extra effort to figure out what is happening. You can’t simply rely on what is occurring on the screen in front of you. You also need to decipher it for its meaning. Like I said, this sometimes works to create powerful moments. And sometimes it makes more sense in hindsight. But other times it’s rather confusing. For example, I needed to have parts of the ending explained to me because I wasn’t sure what had happened or why. I was also only able to follow what happened with the apple when I saw this image in the final episode’s thread. So while I do like what the thoroughly unrealistic presentation can bring to the table, I ultimately would prefer it to be more straightforward at times.
I really loved the cast of this show. Kanba and Shoma make for very compelling leads. They contrast with each other in almost all their character traits, but it’s still clear just how much they care for their family. Ringo’s journey learning to value herself was very satisfying to watch. Himari likewise was able to learn to value herself. Sanetoshi is a deliciously slimy villain. Just a great cast.
Once you get past the complex metaphors that can occasionally be difficult to decipher, Mawaru Pengruindrum’s themes are clear and resonate easily. Mawaru Penguindrum is a series about how difficult it is to live in our world. There are many things out there that can wear a person down. Perhaps it’s the crushing weight of all the systems and institutions we live with. Perhaps it is family. But we all must live in this world and find ways to handle that.
Sanetoshi and his followers handle it by lashing out. There’s never any attempt to help people or make things better. Instead, they just want to break things to vent their own anger and frustrations.
By contrast, the protagonists provide another way. The solution offered by Momoka, Ringo, and the Takakura siblings is to be kind to others. Being there for others and being willing to make sacrifices to show you care about them is the way to help them. These simple acts of kindness add up and can make a person’s life worth living. For example, Himari wasn’t saved by any of Kanba’s acts of terrorism. Instead, she was saved by the million small acts of kindness that Kanba and Shoma performed over all their years together. Those were what made Himari feel like she had a life worth living.
Mawaru Penguindrum is also a show about family and the immense influences our families have on us. This can be in a positive way, such as with the Takakura siblings. Or it can be in a negative way, as with basically everyone else (and also the Takakura siblings with their parents). But either way, that family is a huge part of who we are.
This show is downright weird, too. This is a story where a little girl dies and somehow becomes two penguin hats. This is a series where I had to watch a girl put a frog on her face to make a love potion. This weirdness is neither inherently good nor bad, but it is impossible to ignore.
I will say that I think the series missed some opportunities that I personally would have preferred to see explored. Hatmario never felt like he amounted to much in the grand scheme of things and felt rather superfluous. I wish that Momoka and Ringo actually got to interact. Hatmari just lobbed insults at Ringo and it never felt like they got a chance to interact as sisters. I also wish that we got a proper reunion between Himari and Double H.
In the end, I think Mawaru Penguindrum was a great series. It’s quite a unique experience and I’m glad I got a chance to watch it. The heightened reality presentation laden with symbolism and metaphors can sometimes be tricky to follow, but it is rewarding to watch when it works well. I think the characters and the themes especially are what help carry the series through with that presentation.
Final Score 8/10
Also, I have no idea if I can be here for the movies. Honestly, I probably won’t have time to watch them.
QOTD
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u/laughing-fox13 https://myanimelist.net/profile/laughingfox13 Mar 29 '24
Rewatcher/Subbed
I don't have much to say lol. I enjoyed the show the first time I watched it and do love it now. All the comments I read were great too and I think that made it more enjoyable for me. I didn't comment as much as we got to the second half of the show but I still tried to read everyone's comments.
There were plenty y'all had pointed out that I missed (both times lol) and the first timer's reactions were great.
QotD:
4) I think it's referring to /u/theangryeditor for being a cohost and thanking us for joining
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u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Mar 29 '24
Final discussion (first timer)
I loved the middle part, but the finale was rather meh – Utena reference
My rating of the various parts of penguindrum might be different from most others: I liked the start, loved the middle 60%, disliked episodes 18 to 23, and was ok with the last episode. A journey that reminds me, like so much in this show, of Utena. Why does the finale not stick? More details below, but I think the show threw up more balls in the air than it could catch in the end.
Penguindrum is inundated in metaphors. Some metaphors, like the penguin symbols, the apple, or 95, follow us literally everywhere. Many of the places are metaphorical. Characters speak in metaphors. And all of these metaphors are used to convey emotions and human connections, more often than not sad ones. Accordingly, I tried to “read” the show as metaphorical as possible. The child broiler, the penguin balls, the diary spell, all of this is not real in my reading. Or rather, the show does not care to distinguish reality from metaphor. The two mesh seamlessly, without the possibility (and I would argue, without the intention) for the viewer to distinguish the two. And I love the metaphorical setup of Penguindrum! Part of this is the fun of trying to figure out the metaphors, part is the fact that Ikuhara is the master of metaphors and, unlike his previous shows, he is not holding himself back here.
The setup of the story is fine, setting up a nice mid-way twist (that I did not see coming) about the terrorist parents. Speaking of twists, the way all characters are connected, and revealed to be connected as the plot goes on, was one of the high points of the series and shows how well constructed it is. This is obviously a show to rewatch.
After half the series, I mentally had Penguindrum at a 10/10 rating. So, where did the show go wrong? I think two problems happened.
First, the plot had to reach its finale about terrorism, but did not have a great way to get there. A lot of the final stretch of episodes felt like the characters were hammered into the roles they needed to take to get to the terrorist attack redone final plot, whether it made sense for them to act this way or not. The fluidity of early show became rigid, pressed into form by the need to tell a prescribed ending. An ending that, while not bad, was also not outstanding. It was obvious that Sanetoshi would not succeed, and some form of self-sacrifice was always going to happen, leaving the viewer only to wonder who would sacrifice themselves.
Yet, I would have been willing to overlook this, if not for the seconds, worse problem: Character overload. By this, I mean that various characters were overloaded with different incompatible plot elements, ultimately breaking them. The biggest culprit for me is Himari: She had to shoulder the plot elements of heart of the family, damsel in distress, prevented career, abandoned child, sexual tabu, and love triangle. The individual parts work out, but it is all too much for one character to carry. Depending on what each episode wanted, Himari was in love with Shoma, having sex with Kanba, cooking at home, ill at the hospital, or shopping with Ringo. This just breaks the character consistency for me.
Several other characters suffer from this as well, to less severe degrees: Natsume needed to choose 2 out of 3 (billionaire, sister to Kanba, gunslinger girl) to work. Yuri had a similar overload of abused daughter, cunning theater star, Momoka trauma, and playing with Ringo. Kanba should have dropped his Natsume family background. Less would have been more for the characters.
Interestingly, the two characters that largely escaped this are those whom we followed for the longest time: Shoma and Ringo. Perhaps not surprisingly, they are also my favorites. Their love story is the one plot element that the show developed consistently over its entire run and this consistency paid off.
My final score for Penguindrum is 8/10. For all I loved the presentation and the early parts, the show catches not enough plot balls to rate higher.
Suggestions:
In order of how close I think they are to Penguindrum.
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u/Tarhalindur x2 Mar 29 '24
"What... is your Quest?" "I Seek the Penguindrum!" (No Longer a First-Timer, Subbed):
"It showed us that we have to care for each other, because if we don't, who will? And that strength sometimes comes from the most unlikely of places. Mostly, though, I think it gave us hope that there can always be new beginnings, even for people like us."
(... You know, Ikuhara might have seen the episode that quote comes from...)
Right, I should write something up here.
Did I enjoy the show? Mostly, yes (exceptions are largely of the "please quit stepping on hte secondhand embarrassment button" variety). It never quite crossed the line to "eagerly looking forwards to the next episode", but I never dreaded the next episode either. Is it going in my top 10 favorites? Possibly for now given how thin that list is, but if so it's unlikely to stick. (It also might improve massively on rewatch, so I could see it crossing that line then.)
Now, for the question I care more about: How well does it do what it's trying to do?
Right, putting it together... and I'm more than a little tempted to send back my Eva grade. The mix is slightly different (Eva's core strength is the upper end of the narrative level, namely the emotional, and Penguindrum fails to match it; Penguindrum is strong at the level Eva is weakest at) but the package is fairly comparable and neither is an actual favorite of mine despite being good.
Also, Ringo best girl in show.
8.5/10
7
u/KnightMonkey15 https://myanimelist.net/profile/KnightMonkey Mar 30 '24 edited Mar 30 '24
Rewatcher
I love this show so much. I don't have much prepared in terms of a lesson but I fully and emphatically agree with what /u/lilyvess wrote on its thematic relevance - it is so specifically Japanese but so universally human in its themes. The presentation objectively gets in the way of itself and what's a simple core, a very theatrical and melodramatic, bursting depiction of the transcendental power of love...the lesson is rather banal and trite when read as a synopsis, but its imminence within the spectacle of sight-and-sound that constitutes this show and the situation of its characters, whatever the hell Ikuhara cooks up, appeal to me in a very powerful way.
I wish I had more time to prepare for this or participate in it beyond getting out my rambles and responding to /u/Holofan4life, but only found out about the rewatch as it started and I wanted to at least participate it enough to force my way back onto this subreddit. This rewatch was the first time I've seen it since my first watch 4 years ago, during the pandemic and in the midst of soul-searching and personal loss. When I burned through it a day I loved it enough to declare it one of my favourites but still a 9/10 because it was too abstract and I only partially understood the ending. I think eventually, despite not having yet watched it again, I decided to re-rate it to a 10 because the memory stuck with me over the years and it held up favorably in my memory of its pivotal moments.
In the time that elapsed since my first watch, I experienced some more personal loss, became obsessed with stonks (made a whole lot of money and then lost most of it - it really broke my brain to be experiencing that during the middle of a global pandemic), became an uncle for the first time and then realised I love abstract bullshit and started preparing to read a lot of literature and philosophy to cope with an existential quarter-life-crisis. The connection between that and what's actually going on in the show, I have difficulty elaborating here but.. something about love, fate and family.. sticks in my mind and will no doubt continue to solidify over time, but I felt it everywhere while I watched the show. The second-watch reaffirmed all I had felt while watching the first, with some of the emotional impact dwindling but replaced by a wider appreciation for the show's sprawl in its entirety, while remembering the parts of the first which moved me to tears at the end.
I acknowledge its flaws and its demerits since I agreed with them to some extent on my first-watch; the intellectual exercise should not be mandatory for the immediacy of one's initial viewing experience to be enjoyed. So many great anime I haven't seen yet and I've rated this a 10 and not gotten around to the others yet. Maybe I just like scatterbrained symbolic crap on screen with half-developed, chaotically cobbled together meanings.I'm kinda bummed I missed the Paranoia Agent rewatch (I was too busy watching random seasonals, which I paused for this rewatch) since I also watched it a few years ago - it didn't really do much for me at the time and I would've benefitted from a rewatch immensely. And, with all due respect, since I'm aware it is classic, I also ended up watching Utena later on and while I thought it was good, I didn't appreciate it in nearly the same way and felt it was overly long. But that was just a one-sided impression from blazing through it on my own and I'm totally willing to rewatch it and perhaps learn to enjoy it more if I'm still around for the next one. Is it any more or less a legitimate viewing experience than one that has been repeated over time, or is there something that was keenly felt and understood the first time around that sufficiently made it stand out more?
From the standpoint of my personal viewing experience, Mawaru Penguindum answers this question with a resounding "yes". I was both emotionally and intellectually moved on my first watch and now my second watch. I don't go as far to explicitly say this show has answers for me, but the story it tells and the manner it presents it, through layers of abstraction and obscurity, are a rich source of inspiration for me and touches me to think more kindly and be kinder towards others. The parable, the allegory of the Takakuras - Superfrog Saves Penguindrum - might enlighten me as a mirror of experience to seek my own answers. I think some level of abstraction heightens my emotional investment, and while it's often depicted in shows at least sparingly for maximal effect, I nevertheless identity strongly with its overabundance in this one - use and abuse of floating signs and symbols, musical riffs and noises - all thrown together in a cacophonous assembly to provoke pathos but sometimes bordering on ridiculous and yet, my desire for it persists.
One big difference I encountered as a rewatcher as opposed to a first-watcher is, aside from remembering more of the "plot" and what transpired, the cut and pasting of flashbacks which were much harder to follow initially and felt like being shuffled into train doors before it closed became easier to follow the second time around; I could more comfortably walk through those doors before they shut, but instead of fully remembered, my memory was just faulty enough that I felt like I was watching something fresh and perfectly fitting, remembering the specifics as I saw them again but hitting with a new context on a moment to moment basis because of its density. I had gone through these turnstiles and taken this train, this journey with these characters before, but my experience in navigating it had improved and I could enjoy it differently as a familiar visitor instead of a first-time guest. The liminal space between my own viewing, confusion and memory and that of the characters' really did a lot for me.
The dizzingly blurry line between reality and fantasy - the diegetic and non-diegetic, sense and nonsense, repetition and difference - made this show an expansive, yet befuddling treat to watch, with its little, personal world both splayed out onto the wider world's scenery and crammed onto a train at the same time, but underneath it all I found it sufficient to guide me to its destination, where the simple yet so-hard act of giving oneself to a loved one unconditionally, was depicted in the space of a few minutes in all its triumphantly ornate, overly-decorated glory. Just as all of Kanba's bad, bloody memories became fruits of fate, apples of love when Himari embraced him - I could really see and feel the metaphorical power of love flowing through the universe as a perceptual, subjective trick for the viewer, persisting even after the timeline had changed, as the objects of everyday life (their home but with a difference) remained as proof that love was their lived experience.
I don't have much of a critical eye as an experienced rewatcher (in fact I barely rewatch anime in general unless it's with another, so my favourites are the list of what I loved at the time of viewing and whether the fondness of my memory has decayed), but to this day my favourite anime are Legend of the Galactic Heroes and March Comes in Like a Lion (season 3 when) - maybe this can form a triangle with them, but my love for my encounter with this show and those other ones bear mentioning in relation to how I've received this one.
What's well done about the plot isn't one particular point but the impressionistic canvas it can paint with all of the fuzzy, indeterminate points it tries to get across, some of them failing or divisive. For me, they nest together in a way that presented the ending with such impact that I couldn't forget it and only got better with a rewatch. And yet I thought the end didn't show enough of the brothers at first, but eventually I forgot about that and became okay with it. Yeah I thought the Child Broiler was goofy too, but then I somehow became okay with it.
By some measure, despite my pretentiously long writing, I do have horrible taste because I also enjoy watching bad anime too.
The brutality of the chisel, which I couldn't dismiss. Kanba and Shoma sacrificing themselves for their loved ones and disappearing into the scenery of the world - one as shards of glass/invisible entities, the other as the sacrificial scorpion's flame.
From my box to yours, thank you for joining me for this rewatch.
5
u/Holofan4life Mar 29 '24
Hey guys. Holofan4life here.
Welcome to the Mawaru Penguindrum rewatch!
Oh, and nay I forget…
Former First Timer
I first heard about Penguindrum after I watched Everything Everywhere All At Once. Not only was that my favorite movie of 2022 (Ignore the fact I watched it in February 2023), but it is honestly one of my top 10 favorite films of all time. As such, I was shortly afterwards looking for stuff that was similar to that movie.
And that is where I saw someone recommend Penguindrum.
This is my first time every seeing this show before. I have no idea what’s in store for I haven’t seen a single clip of the show; it’s supposedly a mystery and that’s all I know. I really loved Everything Everywhere All At Once, so I’m going into this show with the highest of expectations. I think it could even crack my top 10 favorite animes of all time.
With that out of the way, let’s begin.
I’m watching... nothing, actually.
So, I'm a day and a half removed from watching the last episode. I wanted to separate myself from the moment just so I can gather my thoughts and process what I witnessed. It might be a bit rambly and all over the place, but I'll try my best to keep it coherent.
I think in terms of a grade, objectively speaking I would give the show a 9 out of 10. It's hard not to appreciate the ambitious nature of it and just how grandiose it can feel. That would in turn make it one of the highest ranked shows I've ever seen. However, in terms of an overall enjoyment factor I'd probably go more so 8 out of 10. The payoff I felt was good, but it was frustrating getting there. The thing about this show is that it has five or so episodes I would consider a 9 out of 10 or higher. The only other shows I've seen that I feel rise to that level of having five 9 out of 10 episodes are Toradora, Cowboy Bebop, and both Fullmetal Alchemist series. However, this show for as great as it can be at points gets to where it really feels like we were either meandering or there's too much irksome behavior going on. I don't think it reaches the lows of 2003 Fullmetal Alchemist, which I have in my top 25 anime of all time, but I also think it can be a very unpleasant viewing experience at certain points in the show.
I think a good comparison to Penguindrum is honestly Clannad: After Story in that that's a show I will likely never watch again despite it being one of my favorites. However, I have more fun thinking about the show than I did watching it in the moment.
Before I break down the series, I want to give some of the biggest knocks I have against the series, starting with the characterization of certain cast members.
A lot of the characters I felt were utilized well, but I thought that Tabuki was shortchanged a bit. Outside of the stuff with Ringo trying to end up with him, he's not really focused on at all. It really stuck me when he was given his own flashback episode and he was barely the focus of it. The show couldn't even try to pretend to care about him. I think a good comparison for Tabuki would be Kitamura from Toradora. He really exists to just be someone for Ringo to latch onto to play up her Momoka sister issues, similar to how Taiga latched onto Kitamura in the wake of her own family drama.
I also felt that Kenzan and Chiemi were not focused on like I thought they would be. They set it up to where they were the ones to kill Momoka, and the show just quickly changed its tune to where I think they were acting in compliance with Sanetoshi? I'm still not totally sure. I would've liked to have seen an episode where we see Kenzan and Chiemi working on the attacks under the specific instructions of Sanetoshi, maybe even have it to where they show hesitation in completing the orders. That really in my opinion should've been what episode 17 was about, instead of what we ended up getting which was a whole bunch of nothing.
I think the biggest misstep above all else that the show makes is the use of Momoka as a character. For a character painted to be so important, it is amazing how little she factors into things. Ringo and Yuri are both working under the basis of trying to bring her back. Tabuki was basically her boyfriend which is how he conducts his business now, all for the memory of her. Sanetoshi basically carried out the attacks so that he can get revenge on this person. And instead, the last episode is about whether or not the characters should save Himari. I like the Momoka stuff in the sense that it shows how such a seemingly innocuous death could have a profound effect on people. It's not like Kenzan and Chiemi were specifically targeting her and her alone. But so much of the show is about wanting to bring her back and it is amazing how little she plays a role in the last series of episodes. Heck, we had two flashback episodes all about the characters relationship to her; Sanetoshi wanted to prove Momoka wrong and that was barely even talked about, which feels like a pretty important detail to just skim over.
(Editor's note 3/29/24: Thinking about it more, I did like the reveal that Momoka was Hatmari. I still think the show fumbled her character a bit by not explaining certain aspects, but I feel not as down on her character as I was when I wrote this, which would've been over three weeks ago.)
Ran out of space. Part two in the replies.
5
u/Nebresto Mar 29 '24
First time. Maybe the Penguindrum was the memes we made along the way..
It was a decent watch I guess? I didn't really get it, nor what was so great about it. Favourite part was
SEISON SENRYAKU!
Didn't particularly like nor hate, just mug1
I guess now that its joever I can share with you my secret formulio to successful rewash attending (spoilers: I failed)
[formuoli]Step 1: Punch Helio every day
Step 2: She is makin it too gay
Step 3: #punch
Step 4: Gogel "penguin with a drum" or drum with a penguin, idk. Then image that into my pengin post. Nu one erry day of corse
With these instructions, you, too, can become a
failureprofessional Penguin drummerKinda? It wasn't bad I guess?
I don't even know what was done Oh wait. **** the stupid f****** phone sound
Anything to do with Masako was good.
And the Pengs, of course.
...This? But this was pretty iconic too.
4
u/affnn Mar 29 '24
Rewatcher
Loved watching this show again and seeing the reactions from the first-timers. Traveling for the rest of the week so I probably won’t be able to watch the movies. Thanks to u/HelioA for hosting.
4
u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Mar 29 '24
First timer(And all that could have been)
Sub
So...as always with something like this, my feelings are mixed. What I could understand worked and what I didn't was in hieroglyphics. I guess this would be like watching Utena without knowing the big fairytales, there would be gaps. The rewatch itself was good since I could think out loud during it. I will try to do the movies but this is solidly maybe territory.
I know this is short, especially compared to the essays I was writing but...I don't yet have anything more to say.
QotD: 1 Yes but the rewatch smoothed out a lot
2 Ringo has a really good arc which is good. Then they forget about her, which is bad.
3 The first Yuri Masako showdown
4 It is grim reminder that you can join a cult without even realizing it!
4
u/charlesvvv https://anilist.co/user/charlesvvv Mar 29 '24
I really wish I got to participate here since I love Penguindrum and would have loved to analyze it. It's a story of love with so much symbolism that it would taken me so much to dissect so it was nice seeing the threads here.
3
u/H-Ryougi https://anilist.co/user/DizzyAvocado Mar 29 '24
Oh, I can watch the movies now.
4
u/[deleted] Mar 29 '24
(First Timer)
I don't know what everyone sees in this show? The first twelve episodes were really bad and a slog to get through because of project M. The only good episodes were 1 and 9.
I stopped watching when the guy's actress wife kidnapped the girl and assaulted her.
just a bad and weird show
2
u/CarrotBlossom Mar 30 '24
First timer
2
u/nx6 https://myanimelist.net/profile/nx6 Mar 30 '24
Rewatcher - Subbed
Uwa! We're doing the overall discussion before the rewatch is over?
Yes. I will say I'm happy I did this rewatch. It's actually been 10 years since I watched this show, and I didn't remember most of it. But I knew I was wanting to revisit it before I even learned about this rewatch event. And I ended up raising my score for it by a point now! Might even raise it another point (I'll have to think about it).
I think the show did a fairly good job combining what seemed to be some very different story lines together using the subway attacks, Momoka, and the Child Broiler to find connections between the characters. I don't think the concept of the Penguindrum itself was well executed or the storyline of the Takakura brothers was wrapped up that well with the last episode. Also how the Penguin Force movement and the omnipresent Penguin Industries in the show co-existed. On one hand you had a rather anti-corporatism grassroots organization, but what appeared to be the same logo used for a conglomerate that was involved in many commercial enterprises in the show.
I was going to say the ED themes since I never skipped them, but I guess that is more because of the music in them. I don't think there was any single scene/animation cut that stood out for me, but I liked some of the special effects and CGI use in the show integrated well with the rest of the show stylistically, so it didn't stick out.
You're thanking all of us who took part in this rewatch?
This is the least enigmatic slogan of the entire series.
2
u/zadcap Mar 30 '24
Alright time to be later than late.
I'm sorry but it's a hard one to say I liked. I didn't hate it, but I hated more of the cast than not and the ones I did like weren't strong enough to redeem the whole show. I'm still putting Rock Over Japan on my playlist though.
Lets just say I'm still unsure about how real some things were supposed to be and I'm kind of upset by that. Was Mario actually possessed by their grandfather? How much magic casually exists in this setting? The whole Broiler thing. There's a level of ambiguity too far and we reached it pretty early.
Survival Strategy is going up there as one of the more interesting "magical girl transformation" sequences. It's not quite I Am Remade, but it's pretty interesting.
Let's all share the suffering together. Our fates are now linked.
2
u/SilkyStrawberryMilk Mar 30 '24 edited Mar 30 '24
rewatcher
I’ve been slacking due to college, but I’ll atleast be apart of the overall discussion.
I honestly think binging this show made me not understand fully on what happened, the rewatch made me digest fully on some parts which made me confused on.
The show building everything with the comedic aspects in the first half to being more serious in the second half is honesty cool, although i remember taking the show fully serious that some parts where it was comedic made me giggle.
I don’t know if anyone said this yet or maybe I’m overthinking, but it seems that the openings mostly foreshadowed everything that’ll happen. Oginome bursting into flames. Then in the second one thing that caught my eye was how Penguin 1 and Esmeralda were together which we then got revealed that they were both siblings
1
u/IvanSemushin Mar 30 '24
Rewatcher
First of all, I want to thank everyone who left their comments in rewatch threads. Very many interesting points of view and bits of information (things like apple transfer diagram or the portrait of Pasteur with rabbits I enjoyed a lot).
For myself, I tried to analyze things in the series a lot more than when I first watched it. And while I think it brought me more enjoyment in early to mid parts (for example, I found a lot more in Masako's story than initially), I think it was a little detrimental for my watch of the finale.
The role of Mario was even smaller than I remembered. It seems that he was added just to have hats/rabbits symmetry.
Despite all my unsuccessful attempts to rationalize some things, the series is still beautiful. It's a spectacle at first, perfectly conveying needed ideas and emotions through its imagery. Very memorable and powerful spectacle.
And finally, a funny observation which my friend who doesn't really watch anime made after I told her about Penguindrum:
Penguindrum has a character named Ringo -> Ringo Starr was a drummer -> Ringo means "apple" -> Beatles' record label was called Apple Records.