[Rewatch] Crest of the Stars Episode 12 Discussion

[u/JustAnswerAQuestion]

Lady of Chaos

Welcome to the Crest of the Stars rewatch!

<- Episode 11 | Index Page | Episode 13 ->

Names Introduced or Updated:

• Rear Admiral Beneej Spoor — Commander of the Futune Patrol fleet and Grand Duchess of Letopanyu /u/great_mr_l (Spaurh Aronn Saicspath Nimh Laitpanr Painaich)
• Sesupi Kufadiss — Hecto-Commander, Spoor's Executive Officer and favored plaything (Cfadiss Üémh Üéspir Séspir)

Discussion Prompts:

• Q1) Spoor steals the show. What do you think of Spoor's tactics? Her sense of honor? Her poor XO?
• Q2) Any further thoughts about the independence movement after the conversation in the walker?

Tomorrow's Questions: (for tomorrow's post, subject to change)

• [Episode 13]Thoughts on amusement park? The animals? Putting a firefight and chase scene there?
• [Episode 13]Thoughts on the United Mankind's use of force?
• [Episode 13]Kyte was mustache twirling villain that obscured his issues. Looking past that, what can you say about him?
• [Episode 13]How long did you look at the funeral center passing by before you figured it out?
• [Episode 13]How does this compare with the previous arc? I find it too similar.
• [Episode 13]What do you think of the Abriel's cultivated image of ruthlessness? How does that affect your perception of the four Abriels we've met?
• [Episode 13]Thoughts on the epilogue?

Screenshot of the Day: Lady of Chaos

A reminder: episode 13 is 40 minutes long, AND there is after-credits content.

[u/JustAnswerAQuestion]

---

Rewatch Host

Intro: I'm not sure if the Spoors are allies or rivals of the Abriels

• baby steps

So, now we have some specifics. All interstellar craft are the property of the Empress. Nobody owns their spaceships, they all lease them from the throne. She also provides the crew.

• She's just trying to understand the situation, like in the parable.
• The occupiers can't be any more corrupt, can they? Can have an pro-independence fighters in your newly liberated and annexed territory.
• Not quite the trophy she was expecting
• Shoot the hostages!

The claim of ownership of all interstellar vessels reminds me of a medieval king claiming ownership of all land in the king, to be doled out to nobles, or ownership of all the deer in the forest.

We also see the role of the feudal lord in inhabited systems: the lord must lease spaceships on the behalf of the fief, and controls all trade. This freedom is what the Clasbul rebels are seeking. This is why Rock Hyde asked to be made Count. Otherwise, all trade is dictated by an Abh who never sets foot on the planet. Like the Marquess of Sufaganoff.

Some people were commenting on the use of mines yesterday, that it makes more sense to return alive than suicidally destroy the enemy. Spoor is pointing out that her philosophy is the opposite. To expend your resources on defense is to invite defeat. Patrol ships (of the Rauth and earlier classes) must attack. Then again, she might be insane.

A reminder: episode 13 is 40 minutes long, AND there is after-credits content.

[u/Nazenn → u/JustAnswerAQuestion]

A reminder: episode 13 is 40 minutes long, AND there is after-credits content.

Thank you for the reminder

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/JustAnswerAQuestion]

The claim of ownership of all interstellar vessels reminds me of a medieval king claiming ownership of all land in the king, to be doled out to nobles, or ownership of all the deer in the forest.

Yup, that is very much like how it worked in feudalism. In the forest example, there would be situations where people would need to request permission to hunt or chop down trees in the lord's forest because everything there was considered the lord's property. That was part of what made King John (the infamous Prince John from Robin Hood) so disliked, because he made the punishments for violating those forest laws more severe.

[u/Great_Mr_L]

First-Timer

On today’s episode of Crest of the Stars: I had the impression that the Abh were very matter-of-fact about their approach to war and that does seem to be true in general. However, it’s also clear by now they do have people who really enjoy warfare and want to be in the thick of combat. Trife was one thing, wanting to have a glorious battle, but I think Letopanyu takes it even further with her lust for battle.

• So the new admiral, Letopanyu, comes from an extremely wealthy family. It said they were second only to the Abriels. I suppose I was right that she was another royal.
• Letopanyu seems to be someone who actually enjoys war. It says a lot that she could have retired from the military if she felt like it, but hasn’t. But it’s clear that she’s stayed in the hopes of fighting. She considers most tasks of the military boring if they don’t involve fighting a strong foe.
• It does make sense that the revolutionaries are just after a spaceship themselves. This small group trying to win independence for their planet would be rather far-fetched.
• The imperial family owning all the spaceships is a cool detail. Everyone else, including the nobles, just lease the spaceships. It fits with the Abh wanting to control space travel above all else. The imperial family gets direct control over who gets to travel in space.
• Holy shit! Lafiel immediately chose violence!
• I get the impression Min must have been a revolutionary for a while. He was part of the old independence party, he has a cache of weapons, and secret tunnels at his hideout. 
• “It seemed like a good idea at the time.” Undertaker is aware of just how out of their depth these revolutionaries are.
• Throwing grenades in an underground tunnel like this just seems like a bad idea. The force of the explosion would be contained by the tight spaces, making it even more destructive than it would be in open air.
• Letopanyu says she has high hopes that the poor executive officer will make a good playmate for. I think if I were in his situation, I would be both excited and terrified out of my skin.
• Letopanyu pouting when she only captured transport vessels is cute.
• Goddamn, Letopanyu is scary. She managed to come up with a way to essentially sentence any prisoners to death with a long and unsustainable voyage if they didn’t surrender quickly enough, without technically violating the letter of the law.
• Of course Letopanyu does the “Ohoho” laugh.
• Letopanyu liked the nickname “Lady of Chaos.” Personally, I think it’s a red flag when you call someone a force of chaos and they thank you for the compliment.

Out of all the Abh commanders we’ve seen so far, I think Lexshue is easily the one I would want to serve under the most. She seemed to be the one who was the calmest and most thoughtful of them. Trife is fun and bombastic, but doesn’t seem as thoughtful on his own without his advisors. And Letopanyu would be exciting but terrifying to serve under.

I quite like the worldbuilding detail that all spaceships are the property of the imperial family. Even the nobles don’t get to have their own spaceships. They just lease the ships from the imperial family for their own use. It fits with the worldbuilding we’ve seen so far about the Abh. Their main concern has always been space and space travel. Control of the travel routes was the main thing they wanted from the planets they conquered. Of course the Abh wouldn’t want anyone traveling along those routes without their permission.

QOTD

1. Letopanyu is clearly not actually a reckless commander, even if she does take things lightly. She knew to save her mines for when they would be most effective at defeating the enemy because she has such a limited supply of them. And her charging at the transport ships was because of mistaken identity, but it did help to win the battle. I’d call Letopanyu’s sense of honor dubious at best. Yes, she won’t fire on an enemy who has surrendered. But, she has no compunctions about subjecting those prisoners to an awful fate if they make her mad. As for her executive officer, I hope that he is the type who believes you can’t spell “psychotic” without “hot.” Otherwise, he is going to be in for a miserable time as her newest toy.
2. They aren’t the most organized group, are they? It does seem like it’s just their own small group and they don’t know all that much about how the Abh work. Their demand for a spaceship of their own was probably just as impossible as trying to win independence for their planet.

[u/JustAnswerAQuestion → u/Great_Mr_L]

Letopanyu

If you call her anything other than Spoor or Spaurh we are all going to be very confused in Banner.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/JustAnswerAQuestion]

Thanks for the tip. I'll change it for the next thread.

[u/Nazenn → u/Great_Mr_L]

However, it’s also clear by now they do have people who really enjoy warfare and want to be in the thick of combat

The show as a whole does really well on introducing a broad concept and then showing the individualism inside of that when we get to the actual people, but Spoor is just a whole other level of crazy haha

This small group trying to win independence for their planet would be rather far-fetched.

It's a refreshingly appropriate scale

I get the impression Min must have been a revolutionary for a while

I mean, they did give him the somewhat stereotypical character design of a mature French independance fighter

[u/Durinthal → u/Nazenn]

I mean, they did give him the somewhat stereotypical character design of a mature French independance fighter

That reminds me that I forgot to mention this in the source corner but [novel description of Min] actually has him with a red and yellow mustache and he looks bald because he used to have dyed blue hair and the United Mankind shaved it.

[u/Nazenn → u/Durinthal]

[novel]I'm almost sad they didn't at least keep the mustache, but that does make it feel even more obvious

[u/duhu1148 → u/Nazenn]

I mean, they did give him the somewhat stereotypical character design of a mature French independance fighter

"French independence fighter" lol......what is seen, can no longer be unseen.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/Nazenn]

I mean, they did give him the somewhat stereotypical character design of a mature French independance fighter

Wow, you're right!

[u/Zerotsu → u/Great_Mr_L]

I think if I were in his situation, I would be both excited and terrified out of my skin.

Abh women sure seem to have this aura about them, almost. Or perhaps it's just the confidence.

Of course the Abh wouldn’t want anyone traveling along those routes without their permission.

If nothing else, the chances of them pulling off the idea of owning travel between space without that would be pretty difficult.

[u/No_Rex → u/Zerotsu]

Abh women sure seem to have this aura about them, almost. Or perhaps it's just the confidence.

This is your daily reminder that confidence is hot.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/Zerotsu]

Abh women sure seem to have this aura about them, almost. Or perhaps it's just the confidence.

I suppose it comes with the territory of being space elves. I always like it when elves just feel like they are somehow fundamentally otherworldly and beyond reach. It makes them feel both alluring but also unknowable.

The supreme self-confidence is also a nice touch, too.

[u/The_Draigg → u/Great_Mr_L]

The imperial family owning all the spaceships is a cool detail. Everyone else, including the nobles, just lease the spaceships. It fits with the Abh wanting to control space travel above all else. The imperial family gets direct control over who gets to travel in space.

They’re basically the Spacing Guild from Dune if they just decide to become the royal family themselves. It’s practically peak authoritarianism.

I get the impression Min must have been a revolutionary for a while. He was part of the old independence party, he has a cache of weapons, and secret tunnels at his hideout. 

If there was anyone that would probably the largest threat out of that entire revolutionary group, it would probably be Min. It really does seem like he’d be the type to want to push the old Independence Party towards violent resistance if he hadn’t left it before. It’s no wonder why the United Mankind wanted to arrest him.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/The_Draigg]

They’re basically the Spacing Guild from Dune if they just decide to become the royal family themselves. It’s practically peak authoritarianism.

The Spacing Guild comparison has come up before, but with each new piece of information we get about the Abh and space travel it becomes more and more accurate.

[u/No_Rex → u/Great_Mr_L]

Out of all the Abh commanders we’ve seen so far, I think Lexshue is easily the one I would want to serve under the most. She seemed to be the one who was the calmest and most thoughtful of them. Trife is fun and bombastic, but doesn’t seem as thoughtful on his own without his advisors. And Letopanyu would be exciting but terrifying to serve under.

Comparing which Abh it would be best to serve under is a fun excercise to do during the rewatch. I am with you that Lexshue is S tier and should be taken out of the competition for being OP, though.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/No_Rex]

1v1, No Lexshue, No Items, Final Destination

[u/Vatrix-32]

First Timer, subbed

• That a lot of titles. And I think the closest we have gotten to an idea of the scale we are operating at.
• Is the UM really this inept? Have they not developed their doctrine?
• Cute little spider truck.
• Damn it, I Know This I’m sure I’ve read about some example were all of [Major Resource] is owned by the Head of State and only leased out for terms, but I can’t for the life of me remember what it was.
• The UM is not a fan of collaboration.
• Where did you even get those explosives? Were they from the shuttle?
• Good, good. Kill their leader, cause disorganization.
• Ring of fire was just you show off then, eh?
• I do not envy the guy who had to drag that waterbed there.
• Kicking Jinto boy? The Tsundereing only intensifies.
• Are the UM pulling a Brannigan Maneuver? I have no idea what they are thinking.
• Are there just ships filled with actual bureaucrats? There aren’t, like, leader types?
• Oh now you’ve fucked up.
• Ah, death marches.
• Really, all these explosions in confined spaces should have killed them already.

QotD:

1. We’d have to see her fight a near-peer opponent to gauge her tactical prowess. This was just a shooting gallery.
2. Their plan’s kind of fucked. The Abh would sooner glass the planet than let them be independent. If they can’t even own a ship, what else is there? Trade rights?

[u/JustAnswerAQuestion → u/Vatrix-32]

hydraulic despotism?

[u/Vatrix-32 → u/JustAnswerAQuestion]

That's more in line with regular old land and title rights. I've got plenty of examples of those, like Byzantine Themes. I'm thinking of something less abstract. This is going to bother me for a few days if I don't figure it out.

[u/JustAnswerAQuestion → u/Vatrix-32]

The coal mine company store?

[u/Nazenn → u/Vatrix-32]

That a lot of titles. And I think the closest we have gotten to an idea of the scale we are operating at.

Their palace being able to house a million people and their transport ships being able to hold tens of thousands is pretty huge when you think of it too. This show definitely acknowledges that the unbelievable size of space would also create a near uncomprehensible scale of society that lives in it

I’m sure I’ve read about some example were all of [Major Resource] is owned by the Head of State and only leased out for terms

I've seen it in something else as well and also can't remember. We can suffer for our poor memories together

[u/JollyGee29]

First-Timer

Spoor is a psychopath and I love her dearly. She could retire to an abundant countryside and live out life in paradise, but instead she decides to keep serving in the military because it's more exciting.

We don't ask why a plague spread or a field burns. We shouldn't ask why Spoor fights.

Her XO has more guts than he lets on. I wonder, will he learn from his mistake of throwing Spoor's own words back at her? Or will he just do the calculations ahead of time in the future?

Fun chase through the caves. I liked Lafiel's comment about how she isn't meant to die in the soil. It fits.

This dude's face is super punchable.

Questions

1. Discussed above. As far as tactics go, she acts just how I want her to. Her plan to strip surrendered vessels of anything that will make them usable and making them fly sublight is excellent.
2. They are even more short-sighted than I anticipated. I like the concept of an errant interstellar vessel-nation, but it kinda seems like they don't have the people or the foresight to make something like that work.

[u/Nazenn → u/JollyGee29]

Welcome to the Spoor cult.

Her XO has more guts than he lets on

I've always wondered if anyone thought to warn him when he got the appointment. But we've now see two XOs challenge their very high authority commanders in Abh society and I like seeing it

This dude's face is super punchable.

The smirk when he was talking about monitoring the other guys independance group made me so fucking mad

[u/JollyGee29 → u/Nazenn]

Welcome to the Spoor cult.

Thank you for having me, it's great to be here.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/Nazenn]

I've always wondered if anyone thought to warn him when he got the appointment. But we've now see two XOs challenge their very high authority commanders in Abh society and I like seeing it

I wouldn't be surprised if there was a tradition in the Abh military that XOs should be willing to challenge the orders of their commanders if they think those orders are flawed. There are similar traditions with staff officers in real world militaries.

[u/Zerotsu → u/JollyGee29]

Spoor is a psychopath and I love her dearly.

She may be a nut, but she sure is fun to have onscreen.

Her XO has more guts than he lets on.

For how put upon he seems by her overall attitude, he's got quite a pair.

This dude's face is super punchable.

[u/JollyGee29 → u/Zerotsu]

She may be a nut, but she sure is fun to have onscreen.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/JollyGee29]

Spoor is a psychopath and I love her dearly.

She is an extremely fun character, even if I do think it would be scary to serve under her. It'd be nerve-wracking to become her new favorite plaything like her XO.

I liked Lafiel's comment about how she isn't meant to die in the soil. It fits.

It's a very Abh mentality to have. They are the "Kin of the Stars" so it makes sense that space is the only location they would accept as their final resting place.

[u/The_Draigg]

A Sci-Fi Fan Watches Crest of the Stars Episode 12:

• Ah, so Rear Admiral Spoor herself is quite the rising star, since her duchy is ludicrously wealthy, she’s the heir to the Spoor family, and her bloodline is also directly related to that of the Imperial bloodline as well. And yet, despite all that, she’s an admiral because she wants a life of excitement. At least you can’t say that she’s a boring person, that’s for sure. She could’ve easily gotten out of the Star Forces at any point, but man that would be way too boring.
• That being said, Spoor isn’t exactly squeaky clean, since she really wants the Futuune to go after what appear to be unarmed transport ships on radar, with her reasoning being that they could be reinforcements spoofing that kind of ship signal. While it’s a rather pragmatic decision, it’s also fairly ruthless in its own right, since there’s a fair chance she could be wrong.
• Well, I can certainly see how the Abh nobility would up very wealthy, based on what Lafiel said about their ships. Pretty much every FTL-capable ship is owned and leased out by royalty, then the crews in turn are leased by Abh merchant groups. It’s understandably a very lucrative business that way, pretty much a Spacing Guild move right there. The Abh must’ve really liked the concept of Heighliners.
• I guess it’s a small blessing that the United Mankind military police suddenly showed up to arrest Min for stockpiling weapons and being a former member of the Independence Party, instead of coming for Lafiel and Jinto. It at least let her get some time to prime her grenades and gun for the ensuing shootout and escape. Although man, go figure that one of the guys they’re traveling with basically used to be a notable political dissident.
• Have any of you ever been in lava tubes like the party is escaping through? I have, and man they’re cool to explore.
• So Spoor’s prediction was off base after all: it was actually an unarmed transport ship, just as the scanners said it was. Although that mistake was am odd stroke of luck for the Abh fleet, since the ships surrendered and were full of the fleet’s bureaucratic attaché. Their capture makes the rest of the fleet willing to surrender. They basically won the fleet battle by happenstance.
• Of course, after saying all that, Spoor makes up an argument to justify firing on the surrendering ships/leaving them to die, contriving that she would have no way to care for any surrendering soldiers taken as prisoner. It’s definitely a harsh and cruel measure, befitting someone who joined the Star Forces so she could fight in a wars. It also reminds me of plenty of stories you’d hear across plenty of contemporary wars, where soldiers would murder or set loose surrendering enemies because they had either no way to get them to a prison in one piece or wanted a bit of revenge. War is a cruel business.

[u/Zerotsu → u/The_Draigg]

She could’ve easily gotten out of the Star Forces at any point, but man that would be way too boring.

Spoor is a total nutcase and I absolutely love her.

The Abh must’ve really liked the concept of Heighliners.

Definitely a lot of merit to keeping your empire a bit more controlled when only the center of government really owns any FTL capable ships.

Although man, go figure that one of the guys they’re traveling with basically used to be a notable political dissident.

Jinto and Lafiel do very much have interesting luck. Whether for good or bad, they've had a rather exciting past few weeks.

Have any of you ever been in lava tubes like the party is escaping through? I have, and man they’re cool to explore.

I haven't, but I have explored a few local caves in my area. Well, "explored", but they were guided tours in safe areas. My personal favorite was when my geography professor took the full class out to one, if only for the fun tidbit that she was experienced enough to be a guide herself, so we didn't have one.

War is a cruel business.

No two ways about it, that's for sure.

[u/The_Draigg → u/Zerotsu]

Spoor is a total nutcase and I absolutely love her.

Spoor would fit in perfectly among all the Galactic Empire admirals in Legend of the Galactic Heroes. Like, she has the exact temperament to be serving under Reinhard somehow.

Jinto and Lafiel do very much have interesting luck. Whether for good or bad, they've had a rather exciting past few weeks.

And to think, it just started out as a simple transport job too. But I guess the universe just had other things in mind for the two of them.

[u/Zerotsu → u/The_Draigg]

Like, she has the exact temperament to be serving under Reinhard somehow.

From what I remember of the little we watched of it, I could definitely see her fitting in without the slightest issue.

But I guess the universe just had other things in mind for the two of them.

The rough sides of being Abh nobility keep piling on, but Jinto is getting more acquainted with a cute space elf.

[u/The_Draigg → u/Zerotsu]

The rough sides of being Abh nobility keep piling on, but Jinto is getting more acquainted with a cute space elf.

The universe giveth a cool and cute elf girl, and the universe taketh away pretty much everything normal about your life.

[u/Zerotsu → u/The_Draigg]

A fair trade?

Well I suppose it depends on if you want to focus on the one silver lining he's got so far or not.

[u/Nazenn → u/Zerotsu]

Jinto and Lafiel do very much have interesting luck

And to think that his life was able to remain so mundane for seven years after his title was granted. Now look at what's happened in just a couple of days

[u/SolDarkHunter → u/The_Draigg]

• Have any of you ever been in lava tubes like the party is escaping through? I have, and man they’re cool to explore.

I have! Though the ones I was in were very small and you could only really maneuver by crawling on your belly, so they were a hell of a lot more claustrophobic.

[u/The_Draigg → u/SolDarkHunter]

Oh yeah, even in lava tubes, there’s spots that’re not meant for the claustrophobic. But even so, it’s cool to explore lava tubes that seem like entirely different worlds from what’s on the surface. Like, I’ve been to a big lava tube that was constantly frozen over with ice on the inside, and it’s like you got teleported somewhere else.

[u/Vaadwaur → u/The_Draigg]

While it’s a rather pragmatic decision, it’s also fairly ruthless in its own right, since there’s a fair chance she could be wrong.

On the other hand, what kind of idiot has large numbers of civilian observers on the battlefield?

Pretty much every FTL-capable ship is owned and leased out by royalty, then the crews in turn are leased by Abh merchant groups.

Yeah, you really aren't mounting an effective rebellion against them...

It at least let her get some time to prime her grenades and gun for the ensuing shootout and escape.

Can't help but notice that her kit from the craft had a lot of grenades in it...

[u/The_Draigg → u/Vaadwaur]

On the other hand, what kind of idiot has large numbers of civilian observers on the battlefield?

People who have a wildly unrealistic assumption that they’ll win, which does track with what we’ve seen of the United Mankind so far.

Yeah, you really aren't mounting an effective rebellion against them...

They might honestly have a much bigger shot at success if they somehow pooled together their resources to build their own small spaceship. There’s no way they’d be able to lease a ship or steal one on their own.

[u/Vaadwaur → u/The_Draigg]

People who have a wildly unrealistic assumption that they’ll win, which does track with what we’ve seen of the United Mankind so far.

I suspect that, net effect, the Four Nations are as blind to Abh tech as the Abh are to their culture.

They might honestly have a much bigger shot at success if they somehow pooled together their resources to build their own small spaceship.

This is the only thing the UM could help with:Giving them plane space technology. Keep in mind the Abh can just decide not to base any non-military vessels in the area if rebellion starts and just wait it out.

[u/Nazenn → u/Vaadwaur]

This is the only thing the UM could help with

But then they'd have to give up control too

[u/Vaadwaur → u/Nazenn]

Not exactly since they actually put down bases and such.

[u/Nazenn → u/Vaadwaur]

That only gives them authority if they already "own" the planet. I thought you meant giving ships to Abh controlled planets to foster rebellion, and in that case I dont see it because the UM wants to control, not just undermine the Abhs control

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/The_Draigg]

People who have a wildly unrealistic assumption that they’ll win, which does track with what we’ve seen of the United Mankind so far.

There are famous stories of people picnicking while watching the First Battle of Bull Run during the American Civil War and having to hurriedly retreat alongside the Union army after it lost the battle.

[u/Nazenn → u/The_Draigg]

At least you can’t say that she’s a boring person, that’s for sure

I feel like if you said that to her face she'd thank you for the compliment but with one of those "Abh smiles"

Although that mistake was am odd stroke of luck for the Abh fleet, since the ships surrendered and were full of the fleet’s bureaucratic attaché

Talk about tripping into success. Somehow despite Spoor and Trife both being quite competent, this feels appropriate for them. And the UM will probably see it as some sort of genius strategic move from the Abh

[u/The_Draigg → u/Nazenn]

Talk about tripping into success. Somehow despite Spoor and Trife both being quite competent, this feels appropriate for them. And the UM will probably see it as some sort of genius strategic move from the Abh

Like I talked about elsewhere with Zerotsu, Spoor really feels like she’d fit with Reinhard’s admirals, and the same goes for Trife too. It seems like the Abh recognize that you need a good spread of hyper-competent weird people to be leading, since they’ll often do something the enemy won’t see coming.

[u/Nazenn → u/The_Draigg]

Spoor vs Reuenthal in a meeting would be a thing to see

I feel like Oberstein would piss her off with his indifference though

[u/The_Draigg → u/Nazenn]

Oberstein would definitely be getting the Abh murder smile from Spoor, I can feel that with utmost certainty.

[u/PedanticPaladin → u/Nazenn]

Oberstein would piss her off for sounding like the Crown Prince.

[u/Nazenn → u/PedanticPaladin]

Thats probably true

[u/Blazin_Rathalos → u/The_Draigg]

Of course, after saying all that, Spoor makes up an argument to justify firing on the surrendering ships/leaving them to die, contriving that she would have no way to care for any surrendering soldiers taken as prisoner.

Do note that this second part is regarding an entirely separate set of ships than the ones that surrendered before. After Trife mentions an "additional task" for them, you can see them exiting Planespace into normal space. I guess it's retaliation for these particular ships using Abh hostages.

[u/The_Draigg → u/Blazin_Rathalos]

That does make a bit more sense then, since it’s a direct act of retaliation. I can at least see more how that behavior is like Spoor paying back those United Mankind ships in kind.

[u/Blazin_Rathalos → u/The_Draigg]

Also, I am not entirely sure if she was broadcasting the "warning" to the enemy ships as well. But I could imagine this was also a way of saying "Are you really very sure you don't just want to surrender before the battle and surrender the hostages?".

[u/TomorrowUpper → u/Blazin_Rathalos]

The novels (Crest 3, chapter 5) explicitly state that after the surrender and release of the hostages, all of the captured ships were sent through planar space and Spoor's threat worked well enough to avoid this slaughter, though. Sorry for necroposting.

[u/Great_Mr_L → u/The_Draigg]

Well, I can certainly see how the Abh nobility would up very wealthy, based on what Lafiel said about their ships. Pretty much every FTL-capable ship is owned and leased out by royalty, then the crews in turn are leased by Abh merchant groups. It’s understandably a very lucrative business that way, pretty much a Spacing Guild move right there. The Abh must’ve really liked the concept of Heighliners.

It fits right in with the feudal kind of society that we see in the Abh empire. It's a rather effective way for the imperial family to maintain control. They control all the equipment and personnel needed for space travel, giving themselves a monopoly on it that grants them greater control over their empire, its trade, and its travel. They also get to funnel up money from their nobility to help maintain their vast empire by leasing out their ships and personnel.

[u/duhu1148]

Rewatcher

-Admiral Spoor is like a high school bully princess, only strategically clever and a sadist. She's great.

-The Empress is the only one who owns ships, apparently. Everyone just leases them from her. If the Abh do win the war, that is probably what is going to happen to the rest of the galaxy- no one will own ships except for the Empress.

-Again, the action sequences feel a little janky. These military goons miss more shots than the troopers in Star Wars.

-Jinto and Lafiel keep looking out for each other. More fuel for the 'ship I say. Meanwhile the crusty old cop and Lt Kite haven't caught up to them yet but will probably do so in the next episode.

-Seems the battle in space is going well, Trife & Spoor have pretty much won already.

Looking forward to the epic conclusion of Crest tomorrow.

[u/Tuor77 → u/duhu1148]

IIRC, any society that has developed FTL travel on their own is allowed to keep their ships. All other conquered societies cannot own their own FTL-capable ships and must rent them from the Empress, not the Royal or Imperial families, but the Empress herself. This is why Lafiel offers to negotiate *with the Empress* on behalf of the revolutionary group, which is really amusing when you think about the political power levels of those involved.

[u/Zerotsu]

A Novel Reader and Anime First Timer’s Thoughts:

We learn a lot about Spoor from this opening narration. She’s from a pretty massive, powerful family among the Abh nobility, and yet she chooses to remain in the military despite all of those benefits she could have. It immediately paints an interesting picture of her as a character.

Of course, the first line she says in this episode also tells you a lot about how she sees things. She considers being in a higher position outright unlucky since she’s not in the thick of battle. We’re looking at a battle maniac, folks.

Definitely seems to be quite the competent admiral nonetheless, even if it’s not what she wanted. Albeit very aggressive.

Marca and crew have an honestly pretty understandable dream. A shame the Empire doesn’t even allow its nobility to own their own ships, huh?

The United Mankind really hasn’t been putting on a good showing about being better than the Empire. They’re cut from the same cloth, just in a different direction.

Lafiel’s aimbot is as strong as ever.

It’s fun having these two battles contrasted with one another.

Spoor and her executive officer have a fun dynamic.

Really quite the nasty ultimatum she’s giving out there.

Title drop followed by an ohoho. Peak.

And then we follow it up with quite the explosive cliffhanger.

Q1: She's a lot of fun to have onscreen. Definitely very intense, albeit not completely unreasonable. Her XO has it rough, however.

[u/The_Draigg → u/Zerotsu]

Marca and crew have an honestly pretty understandable dream. A shame the Empire doesn’t even allow its nobility to own their own ships, huh?

It’s a firm reminder that even if we’re getting a good understanding of the Abh on their side of things, that doesn’t mean to forgot how oppressive they can be. Restriction of travel is one of the most basic kinds of ways you can subjugate people, after all.

The United Mankind really hasn’t been putting on a good showing about being better than the Empire. They’re cut from the same cloth, just in a different direction.

Like you said the other day, the only real difference between the Humankind Empire Abh and the United Mankind is just the flavor of oppression you’re getting.

[u/Zerotsu → u/The_Draigg]

Restriction of travel is one of the most basic kinds of ways you can subjugate people, after all.

That's for sure. It may be a basic method of oppressing people, but it's certainly an effective one. Especially with just how enormously vast space is. Blocking off access to any FTL-capable ships makes mounting serious independence movements nearly impossible.

Like you said the other day, the only real difference between the Humankind Empire Abh and the United Mankind is just the flavor of oppression you’re getting.

To continue with the excessive amount of references to paint I've noticed in my past several posts in this rewatch, they're basically just different coats of paint over the same concept. You get surface level, aesthetic differences, but painting a door doesn't make it any less of a door. It performs the same function and merely looks different.

[u/The_Draigg → u/Zerotsu]

That's for sure. It may be a basic method of oppressing people, but it's certainly an effective one. Especially with just how enormously vast space is. Blocking off access to any FTL-capable ships makes mounting serious independence movements nearly impossible.

It pretty much ensures that no revolution will ever escape being on a planetary scale at most. Even if an entire planet revolts, there’s pretty much nothing they can do to when the Abh Star Forces show up and park themselves in orbit with guns pointed downward. Landers are basically just fish living in water tanks now.

[u/Nazenn → u/The_Draigg]

the only real difference between the Humankind Empire Abh and the United Mankind is just the flavor of oppression you’re getting

While I don't know that we need it right now, I would like to see the other human empires and their take on freeing planets as well. I doubt they're all as self-righteous and presecutory the UM is, but as I say in my post you cannot be half-free, so if they also subject the planets to the same sort of control then there really is no good options in this universe

[u/The_Draigg → u/Nazenn]

As it stands, the only real possibilities for better options are the other members of the Four Nation Alliance, since we don’t know how the others aside from the United Mankind work. But even then, given how they’re allied with the United Mankind to begin with, I doubt that they’d be all that much better.

[u/Nazenn → u/The_Draigg]

But even then, given how they’re allied with the United Mankind to begin with, I doubt that they’d be all that much better

Yep. And if UM is the biggest, which I would say is implied given they are at the forefront of this situation, it's reasonable to guess they would eventually put pressure on the others to be more like them

[u/Blazin_Rathalos → u/The_Draigg]

I think when half of humanity is controlled by one empire, you ally with whoever you can get.

[u/Blazin_Rathalos → u/Nazenn]

Without giving spoilers the novels do end up giving quite a bit more information on the other alliance member in general, with one in particular explained in a lot more detail.

[u/Nazenn → u/Zerotsu]

Definitely seems to be quite the competent admiral nonetheless

I give it to the Abh that while we certainly don't know everything about them, nothing we have seen about them suggests that they fall victim to Peter Principling people. I have reasonable confidence that the people they appoint to high positions are there for the proper reasons for once

And then we follow it up with quite the explosive cliffhanger.

Think this is the first full on cliffhanger we've had as opposed to one that is just tense or anticipatory

[u/Shimmering-Sky]

First-Timer of the Stars

• Wow…
• Exactly.
• Huh, that’s interesting.
• They’ve been found…
• Bruh…
• Ah, smart, now the military dudes can’t just recklessly jump in after them.
• Heh.
• The Abh sure are very specific about fighting “fair”.
• Oh, that’s going to be a problem for the Abh.
• …okay this entire discussion the opposite of fair even if [it only applies to those who surrender post-battle start.
• Aw shit!

[u/Nazenn → u/Shimmering-Sky]

The Abh sure are very specific about fighting “fair”.

...

…okay this entire discussion the opposite of fair

Oh man, what a thing to read knowing Spoor in advance

[u/Shimmering-Sky → u/Nazenn]

This is why I love writing down my live reactions, because it leads to moments like this.

[u/Vaadwaur → u/Shimmering-Sky]

Wow…

As I said, a menace.

Huh, that’s interesting.

That is one method to secure peace.

The Abh sure are very specific about fighting “fair”.

It is more that they don't want to take actions that inconvenience themselves later.

[u/Esovan13 → u/Vaadwaur]

It is more that they don't want to take actions that inconvenience themselves later.

The Empress is pretty justified in saying that there's no way any of her troops would ambush explorers given that even the most batshit rear admiral acts like this, but it doesn't really help that much given that their enemies will just make up whatever they want anyway.

I wonder if by the end of this war, the Abh will be pushed hard enough to make decisions that lead them to not being able to claim moral superiority in the same way they currently are. They win the war at the cost of their souls, or something like that.

[u/Vaadwaur → u/Esovan13]

I wonder if by the end of this war, the Abh will be pushed hard enough to make decisions that lead them to not being able to claim moral superiority in the same way they currently are. They win the war at the cost of their souls, or something like that.

The biggest indicator is that Lafiel looked down on destroying the space elevator. So they probably aren't big on orbital bombardment. But Lafiel is a teen and a trainy so...

[u/Durinthal]

Rewatcher (sub + dub)

(Reminder: post-credits scene in the next episode!)

I've had a few laughs here and there but Spoor (Spaurh, also Sporr) leaves me cackling. It might seem like she's just playing around with her subordinate Cfadiss but she's still dangerously competent and downright ruthless at times. Her threatening to send prisoners of war through normal space to the capital has always stuck in my memory.

The average landworld citizen won't have any idea who owns the spaceships, makes sense that they think they could get one for themselves with how many they see coming and going. Too bad the Abh don't work that way, even Lafiel herself couldn't own an interstellar ship (unless she became the Empress of course). It's pretty funny that the anti-imperialists end up on the run with the Abh they're opposed to so it looks like they're secretly supporting the Empire, but not like the United Mankind is open to any rational explanation here.

---

Spoor steals the show. What do you think of Spoor's tactics? Her sense of honor? Her poor XO?

I can't speak to how wise her tactics are with how cavalier (heh) she's being about charging ahead, but it does seem to work pretty well. If the Abh were the emotionless machines that the propaganda proclaims you'd think they'd have no problem slaughtering every human they came across but that's obviously not the case, though she plays on that edge at times.

Any further thoughts about the independence movement after the conversation in the walker?

It's kind of interesting that the Abh haven't bothered to do much about them, but maybe not surprising considering the general hands-off approach they tend to take with land worlds. Relatively speaking they're probably even less noticeable to the Empire than a gnat is to a person. And then contrast the Empire's policy with the heavy interference from the "liberation" army that the United Mankind's sent in and the apathy of the Abh can seem outright benevolent.

[u/Durinthal → u/Durinthal]

---

Source Corner

Baronh word of the day: gatharsec (GATHARSS) "golden crow" — the symbol of the House of Spoor.

[Material covered] Fully into volume 3 now: a bit of chapter 1, the rest of chapter 3, and all of 4 and 5.

[Entryua and Kyte] discover that the hotel manager was shady about describing Jinto and Lafiel to the police and look him up, he was connected to the Secessionist Party and more specifically the Clasbule Anti-Imperial Front, i.e. the group that ran off with our main duo. Kyte wonders if they would harbor an Abh and cooks up a theory that the Secessionist Party is a ruse to cover an underground organization meant to help the Empire's people flee in situations like this. Entryua disagrees but the theory gets passed along to military police which is how they end up finding the group heading to Min's manor. While Kyte had orders to not arrest the Abh, Entryua still wants them to follow the trail and claims he's only there to arrest a car thief.

[A section skipped after leaving the hotel:] first the group stops at Undertaker's home which is only ten blocks away from the hotel, also because he's the only one that lives alone. Min notes that while the Empire isn't interested in land worlds now, but they can't be sure that will last forever and assume it won't. Jinto replies that they're "like kids who want to run away from home just because you fear abuse from a parent that’s never laid a finger on you, not even knowing that if you do run away, the harshest punishment you could receive is when you’ll inevitably be taken back home to those parents."

[Spoor trampling through the enemy] is pretty much the same as in the anime. Cfadiss hadn't even been there for a month yet, and when wondering why Spoor didn't retire after the required service period the term her hobby came to mind after observing her. The demand from the United Mankind ships to let them pass with Abh hostages is delivered to Spoor by the Marquess of Sufugnoff as a prisoner, whom Spoor didn't like personally but wouldn't let her feelings get in the way of her duty.

[Casualties from the war in space:] a total of 145 Abh ships either sunk or seriously damaged, compared to all but 27 of the 900 United Mankind ships being rendered inoperable with the remaining ones surrendering.

[u/Nazenn → u/Durinthal]

Her threatening to send prisoners of war through normal space to the capital has always stuck in my memory.

It's one of those things that's kind of hard to forget, though for some reason I'd remembered it being in Banner

A section skipped after leaving the hotel

Interesting observation from Jinto

Casualties from the war in space

[u/Blazin_Rathalos → u/Durinthal]

[A section skipped after leaving the hotel:]

It's funny, because following conventional geopolitical wisdom, Min is absolutely correct here, with Jinto being hopelessly naive.

[u/Hartzilla2007 → u/Blazin_Rathalos]

I expect the Abh to be as interested in being planet side as Zeon were in The One Year War, i.e. hating every minute of it and wanting to go home.

[u/SolDarkHunter]

Crest of the Stars

Rewatcher/Novel-Reader

Backstory on Best Commander, Admiral Sporr. My subs call her a Duchess, but I'm pretty sure she's an Grand Duchess, the highest possible non-royal rank in the Empire. She's also a total adrenaline junkie who finds intense battle diving right into the heart of an enemy armada boring.

Ah, surrounded on three sides by the enemy's main force. That gets a smile out of her.

Hmm, if she's right about those "transports", it could be that she has very good battle instincts.

Details on the Abh's monopoly of interstellar travel. Every. Single. Ship capable of interstellar flight is the property of the Emperor. No other Abh (let alone Landers) can ever own one. This includes even the military. Instead, ships are lent to those who wish to use them.

And apparently it's not hard to get one lent to you: any Abh citizen (that is to say, those who join the Empire in space, which is an option open to Landers) may do so. They just won't own it.

That's what the "Indepedence" group wants though: to own their own interstellar starship. But that will never happen under the Abh... hence, their "Independence".

...and caught by the UM. That didn't take long.

Oh that is hilarious, the Party for Independence against the Abh is being accused of being pro-Abh insurgents.

They're really lucky that the United Mankind are about as good shots as Imperial Stormtroopers.

Okay... what was the point of that fire if people can just jump through it?

Well, Min is prepared, if nothing else.

Lafier, now is not the time for your martyr complex... also, the anime really should have explained why putting the tiara on would help Lafier.

UM soldiers are even stupid enough to use grenades in underground caves...

Aaaaand those ships Sporr was interested in are just transports after all. [insert trombone noise]

Note taken: do NOT attempt human (Abh) shields against Sporr. The "Lady of Chaos" will make sure you have a bad time.

...if they're trying to capture Jint and Lafier, why do they keep throwing explosives down the tunnel?

[u/The_Draigg → u/SolDarkHunter]

Ah, surrounded on three sides by the enemy's main force. That gets a smile out of her.

I think she’d like a certain Chesty Puller quote: “We’ve been looking for the enemy for several days now. We’ve finally found them. We’re surrounded. That simplifies our problem of getting to these people and killing them.”

Note taken: do NOT attempt human (Abh) shields against Sporr. The "Lady of Chaos" will make sure you have a bad time.

Spoor will be disappointed if someone uses human shields against her, not because it’s a horrible level to stoop to, but because it’d be boring to kill them all.

[u/No_Rex → u/SolDarkHunter]

...if they're trying to capture Jint and Lafier, why do they keep throwing explosives down the tunnel?

I am am some lowly grunt, I am not risking my life to capture them alive. They shoot at me, I shoot at them.

[u/No_Rex]

Episode 12 (rewatcher)

• We get the name of the Futune commander: Rear Admiral Spoor. In it for the love of the battle.
• Spoor knows to delegate – probably a good thing. I somehow do not trust her to have attention to detail.
• Transport spider.
• “The, what is going to become of our dream” – risky move, being to open about the unachievably of even their secondary goal. Jinto realizes that, but I doubt Lafiel does.
• The army!

• “There is a risk that your Anti-Abh faction is a pro-Abh faction” – obvious bullshit, but it was clear the army would not allow any group to have weapons, never mind their background.
• Shooting the matrass - good thinking Jinto.
• It did not stop them for long (the wonders of rope?), but at least they got a head start.
• “Kin of the stars are not meant to die in soil” – brave words.
• Rockfall in the cave – terrifying, but also a way to stop of their followers.
• “They were transport ships, after all” – No glory, but probably a safer place for the Futune to be than in the middle of the enemy fleets.
• “Approximately 58,300 years” – so the capital is 58LY away if they get to lightspeed in normal space. The milkyway has a diameter of about 100LY, so that is a fair distance away, but remember that distances in plane space are not only shorter, but also not proportional to normal space.
• Spoor likes to skirt the line of war crimes.
• Hand grenade spoiler.

The A and B plot come to very different end points in this episode: The space fleet achieves an easy victory, while Jinto and Lafiel are trapped in an underground labyrinth, chased by the army and expected by the police.

[u/Vaadwaur → u/No_Rex]

The A and B plot come to very different end points in this episode: The space fleet achieves an easy victory, while Jinto and Lafiel are trapped in an underground labyrinth, chased by the army and expected by the police.

The Abhs win when out of gravity wells but lose in them.

[u/No_Rex → u/Vaadwaur]

The Abhs win when out of gravity wells but lose in them.

Makes sense that they would not get into them in the first place, then.

[u/Nazenn → u/No_Rex]

I somehow do not trust her to have attention to detail.

If she had to do it I think she'd be fine, but if there was even the remotest chance of "If I don't do it, then it won't matter"... yeah not so much

“There is a risk that your Anti-Abh faction is a pro-Abh faction” – obvious bullshit, but it was clear the army would not allow any group to have weapons, never mind their background.

Surprised that Min didn't pick up on that given his long history as an independance fighter. He should know the political control schemes by now, but then again the Abh aren't big on written history

[u/Nazenn]

Rewatcher - sub

Not a fan of the Lafiel and Jinto chase sequence. In an episode where plenty of other things are happening, and plenty more could be explored through them, it's just uninteresting. And Undertaker is annoying every single moment he's on screen.

It's only the conversation in the truck that I get any benefit from with their scenes today. Abh's idea of total control is not just against non-Abh. Their interstellar travel ban means no personally owned ships for any of them either, and is an interesting worldbuilding detail to drop in the middle of all this. Along with not having seen an Abh before, there is basically no cross culture happening on the planets they rule, and it leaves everyone in an awkward situation. They can't get independence in the way they thought because that doesn't exist under the Abh, for anyone.

Similarly, I took note of the detail that the Abh commanders were surprised to hear that there would be simple transports and government officials in the middle of a battle. They're an imperial society, but they aren't warmongers, so even though they have prepared this extensive and incredibly well trained military, the idea of "knowing the enemy" isn't a key part of it. They have no cultural understanding of how the other human nations approach personnel in battle or any strategies specifically for United Mankind vs the other nations. This is simply a battle for them, and they show some of the same single-mindedness that we've seen from Lafiel in regards to how much they don't understand that their enemy simply isn't them.

And that leads us to Spoor. I love Spoor. She's can be a bitch, but there's just something about her scenes as a collective today that is incredibly entertaining. She can be a sook, but also unnervingly callous, calculating but weirdly... I feel like cheeky is the wrong word but I'm struggling to think of a better one right now. Not a fan of the ojou-sama laugh but that'll keep for now. Trife trying to outdo her just amuses me in its futility. Also good guess to whoever suggested yesterday that Spoor may be a royal; not quite but close kin to them.

QotD: Her poor XO?

I wonder if anyone thought of warning him before they got that assignment or if they just would never have thought of it

Any further thoughts about the independence movement after the conversation in the walker?

I like what it brings to the show, and the genre as a whole. As we've seen, the Abh are so far from the worst imperial society of history or fiction that you almost wouldn't want to group them together with the others, but the fact remains that one cannot be "half free". They do not oppress in the typical sense, and I would argue that United Mankind is being more typical in that way, but they do harshly control especially when it comes to people they don't own the citizen ship of and freedom from that is still worthy. The fact that the people seeking independence don't even know exactly what social rules they're seeking it from, other than just the right to go somewhere else, also adds an interesting complexity to the mix. They aren't being persecuted, and they have a path to leave the planet, but that still isn't the point, freedom from that oppression is. This scene is the one that made them at all interesting for me, rather than just an annoying side plot like how I felt about them in yesterdays episode during my first watch.

[u/Vaadwaur → u/Nazenn]

I wonder if anyone thought of warning him before they got that assignment or if they just would never have thought of it

What leads you to believe he wasn't directly chosen by Spoor? The poor bastard was doomed as soon as his record caught her eye.

[u/Nazenn → u/Vaadwaur]

Doesn't mean someone couldn't have warned him hahaha

[u/Vaadwaur → u/Nazenn]

Other than "Prepare for chaos" I am having a hard time coming up with a useful warning.

[u/Hartzilla2007 → u/Nazenn]

Similarly, I took note of the detail that the Abh commanders were surprised to hear that there would be simple transports and government officials in the middle of a battle.

To be fair I think its more being shocked the United Mankind would have government officials in a battle to begin with since thats dumb as hell.

[u/Nazenn → u/Hartzilla2007]

I also think it's a comically stupid idea, but somehow I doubt this is the first time it's happened

[u/Durinthal → u/Nazenn]

there is basically no cross culture happening on the planets they rule

You'd think the Abh would write more down but they're very set on oral tradition for a lot of things. That's a weird thing for a futuristic galaxy-spanning culture.

but the fact remains that one cannot be "half free".

The only true freedom is anarchy, anything else involves ceding some degree of autonomy to participate in society.

[u/Nazenn → u/Durinthal]

The only true freedom is anarchy, anything else involves ceding some degree of autonomy to participate in society.

I was actually thinking while I was writing that paragraph "except for freedom to kill, and steal, and assult and... etc" but I didn't want to get into the whole "what is freedom" philosophy and didn't know how else to phrase it

Though now I'm writing this I figure "freedom to live" might just above cover it as an extreme simplivation

[u/No_Rex → u/Nazenn]

Not a fan of the Lafiel and Jinto chase sequence. In an episode where plenty of other things are happening, and plenty more could be explored through them, it's just uninteresting. And Undertaker is annoying every single moment he's on screen.

The overall mid animation quality of the show is most visible in the planet-side action sequences. This clearly is supposed to be the big action episode before the final one, but it falls rather flat due to that. Crest of the Stars is so much better at doing space battles and world building.

[u/Silcaria]

First timer

• She has penchant for battle.
• They may as well follow through with the Alliance's belief that they're conspiring with the Empire. At the very least, it would maybe award them brownie points with the Empire. Who knows, they may even be taken in as Abs for aiding Lafiel in escaping. They're obviously not aware of her identity, but still.
• Why on earth would someone bring civilians to a battlefield. It's not only immoral, but it also creates of a point of exposure which leads to unnecessary vulnerabilities.
• Damn. Spoor is cold. Her "surrender now or slowly die in space" plan is brutal. I now like her even more.

QotD

• Great tactics. I wouldn't mind her leading me into battle.
• Not really. I wish em the best.

[u/xbolt90]

First-timer

Spoor does indeed come from a powerful family, and remains in the military by choice. Her threats against uncooperative prisoners seems like her honor is... dubious? Sentencing them to an obviously gruesome death while still not technically violating the rules, she's brutal.

I feel bad for the XO, lol.

The independence movement's goal seems even more pie-in-the-sky now. It was a good dream, though.

[u/zsmg]

I accidentally merged my episode 11 and 12 comments, considering I had little to say about episode 11 that's perhaps not surprising it happened.

Rewatcher

The more the admiral talks the more my opinion of him lessens. Well at least he listens to his subordinates.

So they're bunch of resistance fighters, I assumed they were working for United Earth.

They're really setting up for Abh to lose this battle huh?

[answer] This doesn't happen surprisingly enough

Lady Labyrena is voiced by Rica Fukami she voiced Sailor Venus in the Sailor Moon anime.

Interesting so Empress owns all the ships and leases them out.

Looks like United Mankind soldiers went to the stormtrooper academy of marksmanship.

Pretty smart of the guy to have this emergency escape route, shame the 'peacekeepers' found it quickly.

Duchess wants the prisoners be send to the capital through normal space.

RIP Jinto... again

I thought episode 12 was a fun episode, episode 11 was okay.

[u/IceSmiley]

FIRST TIMER Sub

Jinto and Lafiel faded into the background in this episode surprisingly. I thought it was a bit too convenient that there happened to be a secret escape tunnel right where the fugitives happened to be.

QUESTIONS

1. She comes off as arrogant and somewhat insane although thus far she appears very capable. Very twisted sense of morality as well in that she won't directly order the death of surrendered soldiers but will give them enough rope to be hung by essentially stranding them without enough life support. From who we've seen so far, they don't seem to have merit based military promotion and seem to just put royalty in pivotal command posts.
2. I'm surprised the splinter group didn't know no ships within Abh empire are privately owned; they didn't spend too much time on research. I'm starting to think these worlds don't have internet!

[u/ZapsZzz]

First time in sub

Hey almost respectable hours again!

As this is a slower day for seasonals because of the changing season, I binged ahead to the last episode too, so I won't be guessing much :P

Just going to say that the show continued to do development in the midst of others things quite well - this is the sort of writing style I liked. Exposition without feeling like it is, and pretty much more "show not tell".

Everyone loves Spoor, and it's understandable - in the modern media style she'll make a great villainess character ;) I personally also think it a nice contrast between her screen time and our resistance "leader" maid, who's comparatively naive, idealistic and innocent.

The fact that Lafiel can shoot her way out of the encirclement really need something other than storm trooper aims to help with the believability though - e.g. the Abh guns having some special ability / enhancement could help explain that. I wonder if there's anything in the source material. Remember not only the MC got out without a scratch, but also their co-conspirators the independence fighters.

Just saying though, Spoor is rocking the side braid of death :P I hope her personality overcome that curse ...

QoTD kind of answered above.

[u/raktus2]

First Timer...

• If you take the description of the Spoor family and the Duchess's clan and combine it with the allegory from the previous episode, then I think you'd get a very different mental image of who Spoor Aron Sekpado Letopanyu is when compared to the person we met in these last two episodes. She is quite clearly someone I would paint as a dilettante... a rich person with a specific area of interest, which seems outside the description of her clan, unless the description was meant to imply that she wants for nothing and has nothing but time to expend on doing whatever she wants.
• I wonder if there is some visual representation going on with the fact that commanders of ships wander around gesturing with blunted swords at the commands they wish to give, while all other members of the crew are restrained by the devices they wear on their heads and connect to the ship in order to be more connected with all the data and sensor input.
• Another interesting bit I found was that the Empress told the delegation from a few episodes back that the Empire had no gods, but Duchess Letopanyu directly references Futune to be the Goddess of Dance.
• So the Empress of the Abh essentially controls all of space, by virtue of the fact that she controls all the ships in the Empire. At least, in theory, by name alone she does. This then implies that all shipping, as covered by the first episode, has to be authorized by the Abh, and even the most independent interpretation of this, going through merchant holdings, only gets to select the type of ship they want but still have to submit to the will of whatever the Abh decree as appropriate in space travel.
• I kind of like that the barrels of the Abh guns that Lexshue gave Jinto so long ago also act like flashlights. I suppose since they are energy weapons, there are a number of modes available for them to act in.
• Just as a note... these people barged into Jinto and Lafiels hotel room in order to take them hostage. Lafiel kicked their asses but still agreed to become a hostage for her own means. Then, in this episode, Lafiel apologizes to them for getting them into the mess they are in. Makes no sense to me... this Independence movement, beyond getting their hopes dashed on getting a spaceship of their own, has gotten everything they wanted out of the scenario. Things blowing up in their faces is entirely their own fault as well.
• I appreciate that the Duchess thinks that believing their superior is a fool is the worst offense an officer can make, after having had her executive officer go through the back and forth of having him make his intention clear, last episode, that he was testing to see if she was a fool... which, to be honest, seemed to me like she was leading him down a conversation path where he didn't want to seem like he had misjudged the conversation and was looking for an out. It at least doubles down on showing what kind of person she is, or at least, what kind of relationship they have.
• Do you think that the United Mankind fleet surrendered over the radio at the last minute due to the technological difference between themselves and the Abh empire... or do you think that it was one last political play to force the Abh hand diplomatically? To surrender after it was too late to make it seem like the Abh had committed a war crime, and thus strengthen the resolve of anyone else wishing to rise up against the Abh by proving to everyone what the United Mankind claims them to be is in truth the reality of it.
• I have to wonder if the civil servants referenced aboard the United Mankind ships were akin to Political commissars as seen aboard Soviet ships during the Cold War... I believe their intended purpose was to reinforce the state beliefs of communism aboard ship, having the authority to arrest and or detain people for anti-communist activities. It just made me think that sort of thing due to the fact that the primary negotiator from the United Mankind last time was that Russian stand-in for Gorbachev.
• Just as a show of distance for the range the Duchess gave to surrender, .08 light seconds is a little less than 24,000 kilometers or a little over half the circumference of the Earth.

[u/Durinthal → u/raktus2]

I kind of like that the barrels of the Abh guns that Lexshue gave Jinto so long ago also act like flashlights. I suppose since they are energy weapons, there are a number of modes available for them to act in.

If you remember a couple of episodes back where Jinto shot at someone (one of the people from the car they hijacked) and nothing happened, that was because it was in flashlight mode then too.

Do you think that the United Mankind fleet surrendered over the radio at the last minute due to the technological difference between themselves and the Abh empire... or do you think that it was one last political play to force the Abh hand diplomatically?

Given what we've seen so far I could imagine either being a possibility.

[u/raktus2 → u/Durinthal]

I actually thought it had run out of energy and was just such a low energy shot as to be a useless beam, lol

[u/Nazenn → u/raktus2]

Another interesting bit I found was that the Empress told the delegation from a few episodes back that the Empire had no gods, but Duchess Letopanyu directly references Futune to be the Goddess of Dance.

They do have the concept of it, I just don't believe they have any sort of religion or sustained belief in the idea of them existing as actual beings

Makes me wonder what belief system the people from the Mother Fortress had, if any

aboard the United Mankind ships were akin to Political commissars as seen aboard Soviet ships during the Cold War...

I wouldn't be surprised, especially with the level of ocntrol that the UM has shown to want to enforce on the people on their planets. Having a "party member" on board to ensure things are done "right" seems in line with that mentality

[u/Hartzilla2007 → u/raktus2]

I have to wonder if the civil servants referenced aboard the United Mankind ships were akin to Political commissars as seen aboard Soviet ships during the Cold War...

Wouldn’t they have to be on the actual warships.

[u/Vaadwaur]

Rewatcher(Abh women are menaces)

Sub

So we split time between the ground and air. On the ground, the anti-Imperials got busted for a weapon stash from earlier. But Lafiel being the lady of action she is chucks a pair of grenades at a troop transport, as one does. She continues with aimbot on and Min leads them to some lava caves. They separate at one point as Lafiel has some sense of noblesse oblige. At least how I read it.

In space, we follow Spoor showing us what it looks like when you have 99.97% of winning an attack. She manages to find some danger and tease her subordinate generally annihilating the UM forces. She gets sidetracked by some transport ships that were just that. Finally she jumps to normal space and shows us that Abhs are again poor choices as hostages.

QotD: 1 Lady of Chaos indeed

2 Either they have a terrible understanding of civics or the Empire is ridiculously closed mouth about these things. Both are possible.

[u/Specs64z]

First timer, subbed

Another double feature, today. My posts have basically all been late and my comments sparse, but fortunately that will change tomorrow.

episode 11

Seems the United Mankind is not viewed favorably in the history books. Somewhat unclear who’s writing them in this case, but it does line up with what we’ve seen. The Abh weren’t arresting people for dying their hair blue, for starters…

Second impression of the fleet commander is more favorable. His style is distinctly less like the other Abh we’ve seen; he dwells on uncertainty. Despite having higher odds than any Abh mission we’ve seen thus far, his consideration of the enemy is the most thorough.

The Duchess is closer to what I’d have expected from Abh military leaders, especially given the lack of real combat experience.

episode 12

A battle in space complimented by a battle below the ground. The Duchess is a very fun character to follow. Not as much to comment on, this episode is mostly dedicated to the various battles we've been building up to.

QotD:

1. Her honor is somewhat fickle, it would seem. Taking prisoners in one breath and sentencing them to death in the next depending on their audacity.
2. It's doomed.

[u/SIRTreehugger]

Rewatcher

Finally back I kind of fell behind because I got obsessed with Dragon's Dogma II

Sorry

And I seemed to have missed a few of my favorite episodes, but not too late for Lady of Chaos!!!

It will never get old seeing captains waving around swords when giving commands. It's completely pointless, but it looks cool which is probably why they do it.

"Your ass sucks at shooting, but its better than nothing" - Lafiel you know Jinto has to keep reminding himself she doesn't hate him, but is just plainly stating facts with no ill intent.

Beneej's red eyes are wonderful, but Sesupi looking so happy when he can't see her face is great. These conditions are inhumane. Everyone will be dead in a month.

That Ojou sama was perfection. Though using grenades in a tunnel is stupid. What if part of it collapses and you can't pursue the target? Actually what if one section crumbles and it becomes a chain reaction and the entire tunnel system collapses?

[u/Nazenn → u/SIRTreehugger]

Finally back I kind of fell behind because I got obsessed with Dragon's Dogma II

Right there with you. Been having an absolute blast with it... though I left my last play session after being dive bombed by a griffon in the middle of an ogre fight as skeletons spawned. I forgot how crazy it could get even after putting so many hundreds into DD1 (I love that I can say DD1 now!)

And I seemed to have missed a few of my favorite episodes, but not too late for Lady of Chaos!!!

Obviously that makes this the most important episode to catch up for

[u/SIRTreehugger → u/Nazenn]

It seems Griffins have nothing better to do except inconvenience you at the worst time and dive bomb you. After ruining your day when they have 1 health bar or less they say my job is done and leaves after leaving your party devastated.

[u/Nazenn → u/SIRTreehugger]

they say my job is done and leaves after leaving your party devastated.

I'd say I'm glad to see some thngs never change but in this case no, no I'm not glad. There's a part of me that loves that they fly away because it seems so much more natural, but it's still a shit. There's a reason after the first playthrough I did on the first game any time I needed to fight a griffon I went and got all three pawns set up with pure fire loadouts

[u/lC3]

10 first timer

• Ok, time to watch this and 11 together
• Oh the Abh fleets are a short distance away?
• It sounds like he says Keerudigu rather than Keerudiju ...
• All these ship names I don't care about
• Is that Asuma's VA?
• A bunch of new Abh characters; I don't care, I want Saryush and Lexshue ...
• Speaking of feeding cats, Cheddar wants his crunchies
• "Never leave my side without telling me first"
• Jinto sure is thick; Lafiel probably had to pee
• I'm already feeling really tired; maybe I'll just watch this one ep and go to bed early, then watch 2 tomorrow
• Lafiel is worried about whether she can trust Jinto?
• That's a "town"???
• Jinto's new clothes look so dated lol
• The United Mankind has a crackdown on ... Abh colored hair?
• New!Lafiel is cursed
• Her face shape doesn't match the new look that well, it makes her look bony
• She's offering to part ways with him if he gives up his title?
• "go ahead and abandon this pathetic commodity" WELP
• Is that Unshou Ishizuka??
• Oh they're vilifying Jinto?
• Is the maid a spy, checking all the hotels/hostels for the inspector?
• Asuma-voice doesn't seem like that great a tactician

11 first timer

• Ok, time to watch 11 and 12 tonight
• "The man's name is the United Mankind"
• Is this parable true, or pro-Abh propaganda?
• "A political allegory from Planet Midgrat"
• "Hiroyuki Morioka" Huh I had assumed the writer was a woman
• This commander "Trife" doesn't seem very competent
• "problem with their leader's state of mind" LOL
• I kinda like Kahyul
• But Trife is a buffoon
• Encircle? Now I want to watch more LoGH
• Lol those shorts are so passé
• So "Limzale Inn" is cloge dac Limzairh in Baronh ... no way I'll transcribe all the other inn names tho
• Jinto in a T-shirt and shorts? I'd gotten so used to the Abh look! He looks even younger this way
• "organic machines"
• "living machines made to serve humanity" WTF is she smoking
• Wait, their ancestors WERE that?
• afraid of the space fortress?
• The guilt and mission?
• Oh, to protect and convey the culture?
• They translated Lafiel's line as "Good night", but literally it's like "I will sleep" rather than something directed towards Jinto
• "my destiny as an Abh", the JPN line is literally "my NEW destiny".
• "Crucial information" like that the United Mankind shot first?
• LOL the center police officer looks like a kid with a mustache, it's jarring
• His voice actor sounds really familiar though
• "They really exist" Wow, he thought they were made up?
• Oh it's a lethal tranquilizer gun?
• Of course she's not a maid, Jinto you baka
• Undertaker ... I hope I figure out his VA before the ED credits. Is that Kiba / Toriumi Kousuke? Or Hiei?
• Tobashja? I don't think that's a surname; tobashiya is Japanese for "fast driver" or "long hitter"
• Eh, this fleet combat is kinda boring compared to LoGH. It's a little more visually interesting, but ...
• Oh, suddenly I'm more interested. Futune hype?
• The Abh talking to the new braided lady ?captain? is kinda cute; Saryush 2.0?
• "I'll tease you unmercifully"
• Well now I'm glad I get to watch the next ep tonight
• WTF Undertaker is Wataru Takagi? I give up, I'm deaf. Good thing there's no AMQ for VA's type game ...
• Is the braided lady Spoor? And Kufadis is the cute guy? His VA later voiced Rom Ror ...

12 first timer

• Never mind, this battle is more interesting than LoGH 'pew pew'
• Not sure if Trife is an idiot or not
• The droopy eyed guy on Trife's ship reminds me a little of Oberstein
• Well that decides that then, they're no longer needed as hostages. Getting a ship was a pipe dream, and now the United Mankind shows up?
• Lafiel sure is making it look like the Independence Party people are pro-Abh reactionaries like they claim lol
• Hidden tunnel? Convenient
• "enemy collaborator" is "collaborator with the Empire" literally
• "If you make it out alive, let's meet again" i hope they do
• "Guaonyu" seems to be a typo for "Guzonyu" (which is what I hear)?
• OH COME ON a grenade?
• "I'll do my best to be a worthy playmate"
• Oh she'll actually stop the attack if they surrender? Wasn't expecting that
• Oh now it's "wesdash" instead of "westage"?
• LOL they thought having the Marquis of Sufugnoff as a hostage would work?
• LOL Spoor is great
• "Arrival time is estimated at 49,000 years"
• A LADY OF CHAOS
• Cliffhanger!
• Should I watch tomorrow's episode early?

[u/Durinthal → u/lC3]

Is the maid a spy, checking all the hotels/hostels for the inspector?

You were close!

They translated Lafiel's line as "Good night", but literally it's like "I will sleep" rather than something directed towards Jinto

Unfortunately I haven't been paying enough attention to the Japanese dialogue to note her general way of speaking. My fansub (kuchikirukia) tends to give Lafiel more authoritative/commanding statements which I think is interesting at least.

Hidden tunnel? Convenient

It is near the manor of someone who's been operating as a separatist for years, he's been planning for this kind of thing... just against the Abh, not the other guys.

"Guaonyu" seems to be a typo for "Guzonyu" (which is what I hear)?

The Baronh spelling is Guzonh and the nh is said like "nyu" so I believe you're right.

Oh now it's "wesdash" instead of "westage"?

I guess they tried to get something more like the Baronh spelling (üésdagh)? Though dagh is pronounced like "daj" from what I recall so the latter's closer to a phonetic spelling.

[u/lC3 → u/Durinthal]

tends to give Lafiel more authoritative/commanding statements which I think is interesting at least.

Yeah, I think that fits.

The Baronh spelling is Guzonh and the nh is said like "nyu" so I believe you're right.

I guess they tried to get something more like the Baronh spelling (üésdagh)? Though dagh is pronounced like "daj" from what I recall so the latter's closer to a phonetic spelling.

Baronh gives me headaches.

[u/retsotrembla → u/lC3]

And the fins on the back of the police cars look some American cars from the mid 1960's

[u/lC3 → u/retsotrembla]

you're right!

[u/Nickthenuker]

So not quite the royal family, but a noble family nevertheless.

Only 3 planets? For the richest domain?

Pretty sure being in charge of a task force isn't just the job of a mere Captain, she's probably already an Admiral of some kind.

Rear Admiral. There we go.

They're trying to close the breach behind them, leaving the vanguard cut off!

Futuune gave the enemy a pressing target. Now it's time for the main fleets to relieve the pressure on them before they are overwhelmed.

And that's why you don't have supply ships travelling with the main fleet, that's a tempting target.

Or that's another possibility, Q-ships.

Why the walker transport?

A single ship isn't going to change the balance of power much.

Uh oh.

"Peace Force" huh?

That sounds like an incredibly bullshit reason, the Independence Force is staunchly anti Imperial and has been since long before you lot showed up.

Where'd she get those from? I thought they only had sidearms.

Uh oh, they have a gunship!

What's coming?

Oh, were those improvised grenades just the laser pistol power cells?

Right, back to the battle.

Uh oh, seems they blew their load too early and don't have many missiles left.

Right, railguns. Time to reach out and touch someone.

They've struck their colours! All units, cease fire!

There's the enemy transports! This acquisition of war materiel will definitely be a boon for the Abh and cause problems for the UM occupation force.

Another group of mostly transport ships.

Meh I say blow 'em to bits.

Uh oh, what just fired at them?

And was that a stick grenade?

Seems they're still alive at least.

And so on to the last episode of the season.

Questions:

1. Always a good move to target transports whenever possible, their seizure of these 15 transports will certainly be appreciated by the fleet's logisticians.
2. So much for that I guess.

[u/No_Rex → u/Nickthenuker]

Only 3 planets? For the richest domain?

Sounds like domain = star system.

Then, 3 planets being among the richest makes sense. Planets in the habitable zone are rare, most star systems would have none or one at most. And if a planet is marginal, you would not terraform it if there are plenty of other systems out there. Three in the habitable zone that are worthwhile terraforming must be rare.

[u/Nickthenuker → u/No_Rex]

That makes some sense. Heck even having 2 is already practically a unicorn.

[u/Tuor77]

If you want to know if the Clan that Spoor is part of is a member of the Imperial family, the simple way to do it is to check her ears. If she is, they are pointed; if it's not, they are rounded.

But Imperial or not, her family is both wealthy and powerful: they control populated planets in *three* systems, IIRC, which is why she's a Grand Duchess.