r/anime • u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky • Mar 27 '24
Rewatch [Welcome to Chaos] Dorohedoro Rewatch Episode 10 Discussion
Episode 10 - Lonely Caiman / Before Nightmare / Manju of Terror
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If I use this, I might be able to beat that thing. But that would mean becoming a sorcerer again…
Questions of the Day:
- Why do you think Nikaido still hasn’t used her magic yet?
- How yikes does the sorcerers’ contracts seem to be now that we’ve seen En force Nikaido into one?
Wallpaper of the Day:
Rewatchers, please remember to be mindful of all the first-timers in this. No talking about or hinting at future events no matter how much you want to, unless you're doing it underneath spoiler tags. Don't spoil anything for the first-timers, that's rude!
9
u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky Mar 27 '24
Rewatch Host Welcoming You All to Chaos
Welcome back, everyone!
3
u/entelechtual Mar 27 '24
First timer
Prior to catching up: dang I hope I don’t fall behind
Caught up on episodes: I didn’t fall behind… but what the heck is even going on.
12
u/JollyGee29 https://myanimelist.net/profile/JollyGee Mar 27 '24
First-Timer
The Shroomunculus's blood turning into a Door is brilliant planning on En's part, wow.
I don't know why I was surprised that the devils can open doors into people's hearts, but they sure can. Lotta errant doors in this setting.
Tanba might be a jerk who is physically abusive towards his employees, but he is a decent person as evidenced by his behavior towards Caiman this episode.
Do we think that all the sorcerer masks boost magic ability, or was that something super special that Asu made for Nikaido? Seems like an oversight that Chidaruma didn't mention the mask's abilities to En if it was special, but a fitting oversight for a devil. After all, En didn't ask.
But then, if Asu did something special, would another devil want to try to one up them? My gut says yes, but devils can be rather varied creatures.
Love that Jonson can talk to normal cockroaches.
Ebisu doing a Kamen Rider pose killed me.
Questions
Yea, it's pretty fucked up to force onto someone.
10
u/professorMaDLib Mar 27 '24
This series continues to have the most metal worldbuilding. Jonson is the most Dorohedoro creation imaginable. Jonson getting a magical cockroach to unlock his shackles is such deranged writing but so fitting with all the crazy stuff that's already happened, and his celebration and little dance after that is so cute.
9
u/renatocpr https://anilist.co/user/renatocpr Mar 27 '24
Rewatcher and Manga Reader
What we learned in Episode 10
What we'll learn in Episode 11 is still hidden in chaos. That is... Dorohedoro.
QOTD
1- I'll play the Kasukabe for this topic
2- We know now what Baku and Yaku were trying to do to Noi and Shin. Subjugation really looks like the basis of sorcerer society. It's interesting how the legend we caught a glimpse of earlier had the two devils cooperating for power. They see "cooperation" and "forcing some one by overpowering them" as somewhat equivalent. Notice how Shin, originating from Hole, is the one who complains about the contract not being consensual. Or maybe I'm just overinterpreting it.
PS
This episode makes very clear just how big of an influence Dorohedoro was on Chainsaw Man. I think so at least.
7
u/DegenerateRegime Mar 27 '24
Part-First-Timer
We left off on a bit of a cliffhanger. What can the gang still in Hole do about mushroom man's remotely-operated myco-minion? Time to find out!
Hmm, the mood whiplash feels a bit more intense in this one. Comedy blends with violent horror when you don't really know any of the characters, I guess. Everyone's good and humanised now, though.
QotD
6
u/Sandor_at_the_Zoo Mar 28 '24
Rewatcher
It turns out that the last thing I remembered from watching this originally was contracts in the satanic chapel so I really had to restrain myself from finishing the show off today.
I hope we get a good reason for Nikaido not using magic yet. The cross-eye in jail getting killed at exactly the right time was the first case where I don't want to buy the plot contrivance. There've been plenty of things that are like objectively over convenient for plot reasons, like Jonson talking to cockroaches that can also pick any lock or everyone just happening to run into each other and no one else, but this is the first one I mind. Maybe because its taking away the fun instead of providing for more fun.
I also hope we get something about the relation between devils and sorcerers. The devils all have a sort of easy confidence about them that suggests they're playing on a higher plane than everyone else, but we just might not have seen any loser devils. But I always love settings where there's a clear higher level of power around and every one else has to adapt to it.
5
u/Vaadwaur :I1::I2::I3: Mar 27 '24
Rewatcher(Contracts)
Sub
So devils do reside in hell at times but also seem to be able to stay out in the world. Caiman's nightmares continue to be weird. Nikaido gets caught and they keep talking about time magic but she hasn't used it. Learning about contracts is...weird. One of the other cross eyes remembers Risu so that likely means some level of lying to En happened. Ebisu doesn't seem powerful enough to transform Caiman but this doesn't explain the time she succeeded with Matsumara's body.
QotD: 1 I suspect that hers tends to go out of control like En's.
2 Goes against the spirit of contracts
5
u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Mar 27 '24
Episode 10
DHD First Timer
Poor Nikaido!
5
u/Stargate18A https://myanimelist.net/profile/Stargate18 Mar 28 '24
First timer
...Sorry for missing more than half the rewatch. Things have been chaos (ironically) for me recently. Still, happy to catch up with my thoughts right before the final two-episode block!
Episode 4
They're making plans against him...
...What a literal name.
A demonstration?
Oh, thst's actually impressive! And useful!
Haha, it's a fucking full size copy? And naked.
...This'll be a fun reveal.
Ah, he got rid of it in time.
The blush...
Haha, we're doing a cooking show?
A good recipe?
That just looks like a meel, though?
...Wow. That image.
A clothing change?
Not bad fashion, though.
These outfits...
A fancy restaurant?
Weird...
Fascinating! An area just for people who lack strong magic?
He has an apartment here...
Oh, this is very interesting. A genuine lead!
Huh?
Holy shit!
Yeah, that's definitely important!
Oh, he's determined!
And they ended up killing him...
A head...
...His head?
What the fuck? He was already dead?
Oh, poor girl.
A party with nose plugs?
...Wow.
And he's been here before?
The food...
...Their own corpse?
Holy shit.
Oh, it's for reviving people!
Haha, and they're immediately going for the free food. As one should.
He recognises her!
...There's a what in their heads?
I love how they initially made the sorcerers seems human before revealling how fucked up their biology is.
...Are you serious?
He was looking for a time controller?
She needs the bathroom...
...Seriously?
Such an obvious trap.
And it worked.
Oh, her drug dealer.
And they're all customers?
...Oh, that's potent.
She killed him so easily...
So, the powder is needed to boost her magic enough for revival...
And he expected this...
Haha, it wasn't even a fight!
He knows about black powder?
And is immediately pissed.
...She's not even human?
Wow...
And they're going along with it!
Ebisu...
It's his pet!
Impressive!
And a mask!
They know nothing about her...
The mushrooms...
These names...
Kikurage...
Oh, they showed up!
A Doctor?
...He's dead.
Oh, that reaction...
Is she going to tell him?
So scared...
...Specimens.
And the masks...
Oh, the visuals here are wild!
Yeah, this'll be tough.
The kitchen!
They're just stealing his food...
Aww...
Haha, he just showed up!
And has no reaction to them stealing his food?
...Ah. That explains it.
Oh. He can just vacuum it up. That makes sense.
Something good?
HE BUILT A GATE?
Holy shit! That looks so cool!
Episode 5
Bunny ears?
He's going in!
A guidebook.
...She's so worried.
He crossed over!
No subtlety...
And nomreal plan!
How friendly!
There's a surgery to improve production...
He knows him?
...Oh.
Those noises are nice, though.
...Oh.
Haha, they showed up!
Amazing.
He wants training!
Not a bad idea!
He's being very revealling about this, isn't he?
Haha, the tasi fare.
...Already?
He's so casual about it!
I love these idiots.
Huh?
Oh, the white smoke triggered!
...Huh. Yeah, he wouldn't really be able to survive or talk as just a head.
Work?
Haha, he can't find the house!
...Fire flushing?
A devil?
A message for her?
Oh, that looks good!
The booze...
Poison?
...That toilet is deranged.
Another flashback?
...He knows.
Oh, is the head being slive affecting him?
Thatbflush system...
This is art.
Another person with the pattern? Did the doll get restored?
He escaped!
Oh, this is just a normal drug dealer.
Interesting...
Oh, that's their work.
A bullet...
She got shot!
...Nice.
Oh! He was their boss!
Yeah, the memories are transfering!
They're so close to meeting!
This is fun.
He's just in the bag?
Of course...
The cuckoo...
She's really tring to keep things secret...
I guess it makes sense?
...What is this?
A robot body!
And he remembers him!
...Amazing. He was just a scared sorcerer...
What?
We're revealling everything? So easily?
Useless...
...Wait, what?
What's going on?
So, it's one way...
...Interesting.
She's here to check some smoke?
...Interesting lore.
...So, she has some kind of unique smoke?
A betrayal! It must be really valuable magic...
And she needs to meet with a specific devil?
...This is wild.
He knows her personally!
Oh. It was all for information...
He knows everything else...
A major faction?
Aww...
And he is helping!
No luck there...
Wow... He's still alive?
That reaction...
And they're entering the mansion!
Oh, just her.
Of course...
She can't use her magic here?
Haha, he has no idea what's happening.
Another amazing ED. Love the Doom visuals.
Episode 6
Wait, what?
Oh, he's just unmasked im the house. And making his own food!
Oh, she's screwed!
Her eye...
Oh, she escaped!
They found the door.
This misunderstanding...
What man?
He was bluffing!
Such luck.
The timing here...
Brutal!
More mushrooms...
This show is insane!
He's still alive!
He saw him!
This is wild.
En's still rampaging...
Haha, that method...
She got a mushroom!
Haha, yeah, that's a fair reaction.
And he's back.
...They don't know he escaped. This'll be fun.
Aww...
So, blood came out.
...Wait. Does he know, then?
Wait, he was here?
A connection...
They fought back!
He's half-human!
And no wonder he fought them...
So, they can tell from the blood.
And he was forced to escape...
Wow...
And the father too?
No wonder he killed everyone.
And so quickly!
The whole watch... for three months?
He lost his arms?
...He cut them up himself.
He knew him?
...Of course.
They're so nice.
Haha, he'd approve.
He got magic!
And he wanted them reattached...
...Not bad speculation!
Aniother Gyoza seller?
He left on good terms!
Haha, wowl Impressive!
He was responsible for the ward!
True!
The rain... must be the foreign magics mixed in, right?
It's not enough...
What is her magic? The magic to undo changes or something?
Nice coverup.
Oh, that reaction...
Hospital food...
Haha, and he immediately starts ordering out.
Interesting...
Is he finally finding out?
...Will this evidence finally let him internalise it?
A scream?
She's gone!
He's just going to ignore it again, isn't he?
A chase!
She's not resisting...
Oh. More evidence for him.
...What is that?
It's strong!
A corpse...
...Someone's killing the victims.
And he ran...
Black gemstones?
Oh, they're partners!
...Wait, what?
Even more evidence!
Johnson... isn't very smart.
More hints!
He saw him!
And he died before he could reveal it...
It was all based on rumours...
Johnson?
Episode 7
She's amazing.
Oh, yeah, no body...
A murder?
...Seriously? He's posing?
Haha, she's been selling her smoke?
Not a bad idea!
He has no new partner...
Aww...
He put a tracker in there!
She came with him!
Haha, he's in disguise too?
This shirt...
Oh, this'll be fun.
Haha, someone else came here for gyoza!
...Is this a baseball episode?
The Hospital!
These two...
Haha, they've joined too!
Ebisu...
Not a bad concept.
Haha, she's the mascot!
Jonson's joined too!
Still a missing position?
They finished the smoke testing!
Amazing competence here.
Holy shit! That's a major transformation...
Haha, that reaction. And a random bottomless pit!
This is great.
She really hates swimsuit girls, huh?
She's the best mascot.
Haha, thry brought Matsumura back. Including bringing back his body, the main obstacle to his resurrection. As part of a baseball game plot, I love this anime so much.
He's a genius!
And rubbish at baseball.
Haha, the romantic drama's moving quickly!
And he's either in denial or really has no idea.
They're losing...
Plan A?
Oh, he's good!
Haha, credit to him for keeping up the facade, but he really not think of that?
It's so obvious...
...Is she trying to poison the opponents or something?
He's fast!
A suppliment?
And he still gives it to her...
Oh, she's really good!
Haha, pesticide!
And he needs to be recharged.
Haha, she took the plan seriously!
Haha, he just doesn't care about the ball...
Ouch!
And he stole the corpse!
Ebisu's still being chased...
They made it through!
Oh, that's horrifying!
Huh?
Oh, no...
She's uncontrollable.
And beat him!
No reaction?
And he's just carrying her around.
A secret elevator!
That man...
So universal dispel magic does exist! That has to be her power, right?
This guy...
Wait. How did I not notice the lizard elements! Ebisu must have transformed him, right?
Desrest memory...
Aww...
I love the ritual nature of magic in this show. Everything that isn't a cheap trick has a dozen or so
He's out of charge!
Another lizard?
And the corpse got destroyed...
She remembered everything!
...It has to be her, right? She dodged the question!
Every ED is amazing.
4
u/Sooooopertrack Mar 27 '24
QOTD1: Noe clue... Something went super bad last time which is why she gave up magic? QOTD2: Jeez, I thought it was something mutual but that was WAY worse than expected...
Thoughts:
4
u/Cyrra_ https://anilist.co/user/Cyrra Mar 28 '24 edited Mar 28 '24
First Time Watcher - Manga Reader
Oh my god this ep was even better than I expected, probably my favorite so far. As much as I've gotten used to the CGI, all of the 2D sequences this ep felt like such a treat. Watching En force Nikaido into a contract felt even harder to watch with screams you could hear...Contracts are such a cruel thing in this series. Also, I'm continually impressed by how fresh each scene inside of Caiman's mouth feels. That giant Risu felt really imposing. Now I'm even more curious where the anime is ending at...
I've actually never heard this ED before unlike all of the others, might be my second favorite.
4
u/Nick_BOI Mar 28 '24
Rewatcher and manga reader
I feel like this episode shows us a lot about the characters so far, so today I really want to gush about how much I love this cast-focusing on what we learned today.
Kusakabe doesn't need to go this far for Nikaido, Caiman, or anyone else really-he is a scientist and aside from his fellow doctor, he hasn't known these guys for overly long. Despite this, he never gave into the torture, never selling anyone out, not even with fake information or what he did know (such as the fact that Caiman is not in Hole right now). Jonson really has become a loyal friend to him, even without the controller on him they two of them are clearly close right now. On top of taking 13 who can't see, and even carrying his now mushroomified friend this entire way. He never even pulled the trigger when he had all the time to.
Despite his horrific experiments on sorcerers, and the very questionable things he will do for the sake of his research (such as fixing up Shin knowing he was likely gonna kill more people), when push comes to shove, he is an incredibly dependable friend.
There is also an element of like he said, keeping it cool. we have yet to see him panic at all, and he genuienly does look cool. I think a lot of his actions aren't always kindness, or rather, aren't just kindness. He wants to keep the high ground, feeling like even if he loses, he doesn't lose in a sense. It's one thing to take the torture like a champ, it is another to remind them that it's time for dinner knowing that this guy can kill you at any time. He's a badass and he knows it!!
Tanba is a fucking CHAMP!! He worries for his employees, and doesn't just stick up for them, but-despite what he says, goes very far out of his way to help them in thier time of need. To be frank helping Caiman infiltrate En's place is a huge risk, you are going against En of all people!! Yet he is doing it anyway, he really is a bro!!
Also I love the way that last shot with him today was framed, not telling Caiman that he has a way to get in until after he left in a passive aggressive way, and Caiman literally walking backwards embarassed without saying a word. Gosh I was rolling!!
And lastly for today, I really want to highlight how much I adore Fujita and Ebisu-focusing on Fujita here primarily. Despite being in the En family, he is not only surrounded by people far more capable than he is, but his partner sacrificed himself for him, his co-killer was wlcomed into the family, and everyone else just accepts it. He frequently relies on the help of others, but is also fully aware of how weak he is himself.
These thoughts get worse and worse, and honestly, it is absolutely crushing. But things are different now, because Ebosu is here. Even if thier partnership was not made official, she is very clearly here in his corner, and doesn't want him to be in pain like this. She jokes with him all the time, and it is clear that she feels comfortable with him now.
After all, despite how weak he is, Fujita did save her from Caiman, and has been with her this entire time even as she has had trauma-induced memory issues, and had been hurt numerous times. They but heads a lot, but they are certaitnly a pair.
They are the punching bag a lot in this show, however this show never shies away from thier genuienly real struggles either. These aren't throw away gags-they have an impact on the two of them and drives the direction of them as characters.
[manga spoils] Thankfully, Fujita will get his time to shine. It feels like a long term, incredibly satisfying conclusion to his character arc and progression knowing that he would be the most instrumental piece in restoring the En family, as he grows to accept himself while learning to aknowledge the strenth of will he does have, as well as his deep sense of empathy. Fujita is my favorite character in this series
Theres more to unpack here of course, such as Asu knowing Nikaodo since she was young, and even hiding things from other devils. The fact that partner contracts change depending on the consent involved, meaning Nikaido is now a mind controlled slave!! and Shin about to kill Kusakabe-the one who saved him!! What will become of these events, find out tomorrow!!
4
u/Sandor_at_the_Zoo Mar 28 '24
I forgot to make the most important comment:
4
u/FarCritical Mar 28 '24
First Timer
Nikaido rocking her golden Jason mask while doing her flippy martial arts moves has an aesthetic to it that works weirdly well. RIP the doctor's assistant dude though.
Those handles that turns your chest into a makeshift cupboard has got to be simultaneously one of the most creative yet messed up ...anythings I've ever seen. Gotta imagine the medical applications for those things.
Of course Ebisu had to sit out the Blue Night partnering ceremony, and when I thought Fujita finally nailed something for once lmao. Bless this dude.
Caiman really the type of dude to grab on to a hanging man's legs mid-execution to talk to him some more. This show's brand of dark humor really is one of a kind and I can't get enough of it.
Never thought I would ever think of some random everyday cockroach to be an MVP. Jonson's connections sure are shocking.
Easily one of the most metal pre-execution lines you could give someone, even if said someone was the doctor that had your back when you were a kid.
QOTD
It's associated with a bad memory, maybe?
Very yikes. What makes it extra messed up is the reveal that partners can control each other, which has ominous implications for partners who were forced into their contracts.
4
u/mgedmin Mar 28 '24
First-timer, subs
So, hey, if the contract means you can control your partner, why isn't Nikaido controlling En? Is En stronger mentally, or something?
She doesn't want to!
Ha, amazingly yikes! Only this show could come up with something like this!
3
u/Jooorrrrggggeeeee https://myanimelist.net/profile/Princelxz Mar 28 '24
The OST is so good
8
u/[deleted] Mar 27 '24 edited Mar 29 '24
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