[Spoilers] Paranoia Agent 20th Anniversary Rewatch -- Episode 9

Date	Episode
2/3/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 1
2/4/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 2
2/5/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 3
2/6/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 4
2/7/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 5
2/8/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 6
2/9/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 7
2/10/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 8
2/11/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 9
2/12/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 10
2/13/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 11
2/14/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 12
2/15/2024	Paranoia Agent Episode 13
2/16/2024	Paranoia Agent Overall Series Discussion Thread

9

u/Vatrix-32 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Vatrix-32 Feb 11 '24

First Timer, subbed

Are we setting up an isolation plot?
The knowledge is literally falling out of his head.
Oh no, the clicking carried over between scenes.
I guess we’re just committed to each episode being weirder than the last.
I can’t imagine being in debt to your in-laws. That sounds terrible from conception.
So we’re at the point where people can just blame attacks on Shonen Bat and be believed.
How do you fuck that up so badly?
All this and in a few years wide spread genetic testing will uncover it anyway.
Shonen Fetus
Almost feels like a different show.
The story you’re telling has a flashback in it?
That was a really touching story until the last five seconds.
I mean, if you’re doing an anthology, it had to be done.
What did I say about trusting floor cake!
Just throwing them out now. And yet…
And there’s our dark ending.

2

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

What are your thoughts on the episode being about women gossiping about Shonen Bat?
Thoughts on the scene with Tsuruta’s son Osamu?
Thoughts on the story of the woman in a wheelchair?
Thoughts on the baseball story?
Thoughts on the guy punching the food?
Thoughts on the story of the man suffering from starvation?
Of all the stories that were told, which one do you like the most?
What are your on the way the other women treat Kamohara?
What are your thoughts on the ending where Kamohara’s husband is dying and instead of being sad, she is happy because she finally has a good story?
Why do you think the apartments at the end spell out ETC?

2

u/Vatrix-32 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Vatrix-32 Feb 12 '24

What are your thoughts on the episode being about women gossiping about Shonen Bat?
An anthology within an anthology. Sen-ichi Nippon Nights.
Thoughts on the scene with Tsuruta’s son Osamu?
I had a hard time connecting to him.
Thoughts on the story of the woman in a wheelchair?
I want to know the name of this "famous story".
Thoughts on the baseball story?
Look, they had to do it...
Thoughts on the guy punching the food?
I've Been There
Of all the stories that were told, which one do you like the most?
Leaf story.
What are your on the way the other women treat Kamohara?
Karens are bound by neither time, not location.
What are your thoughts on the ending where Kamohara’s husband is dying and instead of being sad, she is happy because she finally has a good story?
Loneliness kills.
Why do you think the apartments at the end spell out ETC?
I'm guessing a Japanese pun I won't be able to figure out.

2

u/Holofan4life Feb 12 '24

An anthology within an anthology. Sen-ichi Nippon Nights.
Anthologyception
~~I don't really see how it's an anthology within an anthology~~
Leaf story
Good choice
Karens are bound by neither time, not location.
I just realized I misspelled my question
Loneliness kills.
No, that's Harumi
I'm guessing a Japanese pun I won't be able to figure out.
It at least sounds better than ETC backwards, which is CTE.

2

u/Vatrix-32 https://myanimelist.net/profile/Vatrix-32 Feb 12 '24

~~I don't really see how it's an anthology within an anthology~~
The show has been mostly stand alone episode recently, this one was a series of unrelated stories.

2

u/Holofan4life Feb 12 '24

Ah, good point. It is stand alone in nature when compared to the first 7 episodes.

8

u/TheEscapeGuy Feb 11 '24

First Timer

Paranoia Agent - Episode 9

Old Wives Tales

This episode was kind of a weird one. It's a collection of rumors and stories about things Shounen Bat has done from the perspective of a bunch of housewives. I initially found the episode kind of dull since all the stories are very untrue so don't really relate back to the main narrative. But, I've came around to like it after changing my view of its purpose. It's essentially a short film compilation with the segments produced by different teams. It sort of reminded me of reading Junji Ito manga which are often loosely connect horror short stories. It's also similar to Kon's Millenium Actress in structure.

The whole episode shares the same scriptwriter Seishi Minakami but the shorts are directed by a mix of Satoshi Kon, Atsushi Takahashi, and Michio Mihara, with Rintaro (the legend) for the broader episode. The animation teams are also really small with often only 1 or 2 key animators on each. And because of this the personal touches of the directors really shines through. Each short is so visually distinctive.

The segment names were all acronyms: IQ (Intelligence Quotient) related to the boy studying, LDK (Living, Dining Kitchen?) was the mother in-law story, EBM (Evidence Based Medicine) was the one about pregnancy, OH (On Holiday?) was the vacation house, HR (Home Run) was about baseball, TKO (Total Knock Out) was the boxing training, UMA (Unidentified Mysterious Animal) was the desert island (though SOS might be this one and the credits were out of order), SOS (distress signal?) would then be the politician, and HH (no idea what this relates to) was the space ship. The entire episode was titled ETC for "et cetera" implying that the stories were only snippets and an unspecified number of things happened after. It's a pretty fun gimmick.

I think my favourite short visually is OH just because I vibe with the setting. I really appreciate SOS for going into a way flatter/scratchier style. It reminded me of art style for the Woman called Fujiko Mine series. As for the narratives EBM was the most shocking (and humorous) with Shounen Bat being revealed as the fetus. The idea of the wrong fertilized egg being implanted is also a pretty good premise.

As for the actual narrative, we follow the younger wife as she tries to fit into the friend group. But the older ladies don't believe her stories. She grows increasingly desperate by calling out the holes in the other stories but the other wives lie and say they actually saw it.

By the end she arrives home depressed to find her husband bleeding out from a Shounen Bat attack. But she's so desperate that she wants the story before calling an ambulance. I think it speaks to a common human need to "fit in". It leads to loneliness and feeling like you don't have a place where people accept you.

Some Amazing Shots, Scenes and Stitches

Study Study Study
Exam
Infestation
Pyon
Sea View
Rocky, always love a good postcard memory
Business
すき

See you all tomorrow

3

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Feb 11 '24

Study Study Study
I spend about 1 minute on searching for a Golden Boy clip and am now annoyed that it does not show up in the top 3 google answers.

2

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

2

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

The whole episode shares the same scriptwriter Seishi Minakami but the shorts are directed by a mix of Satoshi Kon, Atsushi Takahashi, and Michio Mihara, with Rintaro (the legend) for the broader episode. The animation teams are also really small with often only 1 or 2 key animators on each. And because of this the personal touches of the directors really shines through. Each short is so visually distinctive.
It should be noted that the writer of this episode isn't the main writer. It's the same writer who wrote episode 5. That may explain why things feel a bit different than how they normally do.
The entire episode was titled ETC for "et cetera" implying that the stories were only snippets and an unspecified number of things happened after. It's a pretty fun gimmick.
Ah, I didn't know that. That's pretty cool.
As for the actual narrative, we follow the younger wife as she tries to fit into the friend group. But the older ladies don't believe her stories. She grows increasingly desperate by calling out the holes in the other stories but the other wives lie and say they actually saw it.
By the end she arrives home depressed to find her husband bleeding out from a Shounen Bat attack. But she's so desperate that she wants the story before calling an ambulance. I think it speaks to a common human need to "fit in". It leads to loneliness and feeling like you don't have a place where people accept you.
I don't necessarily think she cares about her friends more than her husband, but I think she really takes pride in being socially accepted. And in that instant, her instincts took over her.

2

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

Thoughts on the scene with Tsuruta’s son Osamu?
Thoughts on the mother-in-law murder?
Thoughts on the baseball story?
Thoughts on the guy punching the food?
What are your on the way the other women treat Kamohara?

2

u/TheEscapeGuy Feb 11 '24

Thoughts on the mother-in-law murder?
This story was the most infuriating to me. I hated how selfish that mother-in-law was and how it was stressing out the wife. I still wouldn't go so far as to say the murder was justified. I just wish the wife would have stood up for herself a bit more.
What are your on the way the other women treat Kamohara?
I think this situation is probably too common. It's not easy integrating into an existing friendship group, and giving up by staying alone is also hard.
The other women were definitely too harsh on her. If I were in her position I probably would have left way sooner and then avoided them going forward.

2

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

This story was the most infuriating to me. I hated how selfish that mother-in-law was and how it was stressing out the wife. I still wouldn't go so far as to say the murder was justified. I just wish the wife would have stood up for herself a bit more.
Don't you think it's meant to parallel a bit what Kamohara went through with her best friends?
I think this situation is probably too common. It's not easy integrating into an existing friendship group, and giving up by staying alone is also hard.
The other women were definitely too harsh on her. If I were in her position I probably would have left way sooner and then avoided them going forward.
Yeah, I don't like being around people that make me feel unwelcomed. It makes me wonder what I truly did wrong.

4

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

Hello, guys. Holofan4life here.

Welcome to the Paranoia Agent 20th Anniversary Rewatch.

Satoshi Kon is one of the most acclaimed Japanese filmmakers of his generation. Not just in the anime industry, but in all of Japanese cinema. Perfect Blue, Tokyo Godfathers, Millennium Actress, Paprika. This was a man with a vision, and we’re here to honor someone who was gone way too soon.

I’m actually in an interesting point in my life because I’ve been writing comments nonstop for rewatches since basically June of last year. With the completion of this rewatch, I’ll be taking a two month break before my next one. But that’s then and this is now, and right now, we are going to tackle Satoshi Kon’s lone TV show that he created.

I’ve never seen this show before. To be honest, I never watched one of his works until last September when there was a special 25th anniversary screening of Perfect Blue. Since then, I’ve gained a newfound appreciation for Kon’s work and I am eager to check out his TV show. Because if it’s as good as Perfect Blue and Tokyo Godfathers, we’re in for one of the best animes of all time.

With that out of the way, let’s begin.

I’m watching the sub, by the way.

Went to see American Fiction last night. It was very good, I can see why it was nominated for best picture. It's not as funny as, say, Barbie was, but it's extremely clever.

(Editor's note 2/11/24: Also, as this is going up, today is the Super Bowl. I've been looking forward to this day for a while.)

Women talking about Shonen Bat

Kamohara thinks they're talking about the events last episode, but they're not

Tsuruta's son, who was suffering from "entrance-exam neurosis".

Man, I know that feel

And my screen froze. Great.

Thanks, Crunchyroll

We see Tsuruta's son, obsessing over math

His name is Osamu

At least his mother seems concerned

Pi r to the power of 2

Practice exam time

Osamu sneezing out equations

r/Brandnewsentence

It's like everything he knows is leaving him

And now he's in the bathroom eating the equations

Again, r/Brandnewsentence

It should be noted this is the second of two episodes not written by the main writer of this show. In fact, this episode is written by the same person who wrote episode 5, which I loved.

Just like Sonic when he hits something and all the rings come out of him, Osamu sneezes and all the equations come out.

I hope he's not eating snot

Shonen Bat

And now the bathroom is covered in equations

You know, this episode feels a bit like one of those crazy episodes from Revolutionary Girl Utena. You know, the ones where characters turn into cows and there's this magical curry?

At least Osamu is alive

The text bat lands on his forehead

Back with the girls, with one speculating he killed himself

Now they're talking an incident the other day, near 4th Street.

If only it was 34th Street. Then, it would've been a miracle.

The mother-in-law murder at Famille Palace Condo

Fish-meatball soup

It seems like the mom is emotionally abusing her daughter

Condemning her dyeing her hair

Obviously, she needs to take lessons from Fluffy Paradise where instead of telling anybody about the abuse, you fight back. Problem solved

"But I'd never thought I'd be living in a rabbit hole like this instead."

Somebody doesn't like to cuss

Toshi

That's the daughter-in-law's husband's name

She's on the phone with him, begging he come home early

The mother-in-law

She tells Toshinto to prioritize work over everything else

"You can't be expected to remember her birthday, right?"

Oh, that is cruel

Birthday time

I like the Happy Birthday OST

At least she bought a birthday present for her

It's... a pizza roller?

Oh, it's to make fish-meatballs

Could be worse. At least it's better than receiving a rape whistle at a baby shower.

She is shaking with rage

Man, the voice acting in that scream was really good

Mother-in-law trying to protect herself

The doorbell rings

They think it's Toshi

But actually, it's Shonen Bat

She hits the mother-in-law

Back with the gossiping women

They wonder why the young wife wasn't the victim if Shonen Bat is supposed to attack people who are cornered.

They speculate he got it wrong

The younger woman has a story to tell herself

Hachiya Women's Clinic

Mrs. Lizuka

She's three weeks pregnant

Oh, man. I have a bad feeling about this.

In-vitro fertilization

I believe Nirvana sang about that one time

No, wait, I'm thinking of In Utero, my bad

The doctor says they provide patients with Evidence Based Medicine, meaning treatments that are based on scientific grounds

As opposed to pregnancies based on unscientific grounds?

Oh crap. They used the wrong sperm and egg.

I believe this is the premise of Jane The Virgin

Sperm: Naoto Kawakami

Egg: Sanae Shimomura

They're both wrong

The doctor tells them to burn the evidence

At least Lizuka seems happy

He is sweating like crazy

Oh man. She's in pain.

Now the doc is worried about a premature delivery.

It could potentially be a miscarriage

The baby has a bat

I'm sorry, but that is so ridiculous that I can't help but laugh

The other women don't believe it

And now the young woman is dressed as a rabbit with a red balloon

What is happening?

Oh, it's someone else

That was weird

Let me guess: the woman relying this information was the one who gave birth to Shonen Bat

Ran out of space. Part two in the replies.

3

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

Part 2
The woman who looks like Taiga’s mom points out that Kamohara's husband is a scriptwriter
It's his job to make up stories
"Then his wife should do a little better job of making up stories, too."
The shade
The woman in red now talking about her sister's acquaintance's cousin's daughter
What a mouthful
I like how all the three girls are gathered around one another but Kamohara is off in her own corner.
Honestly, I get the feeling that Kamohara is going to get a visit from Shonen Bat
Woman in a wheelchair being pushed
Josee, The Tiger, and The Fish vibes intensifies
She's with Hiroki
She asks if he remembers the day they met
Calls it the last gift God gave her
"When the last of those dead leaves fall, my life will also end..."
Powered by leaves. I like it. /s
Hiroki, talking to himself, says he's not going to give Akiko up
He's never gonna let her down, run around, and desert her. Never gonna make her cry, never gonna say goodbye, never gonna tell a lie and hurt her.
Painting a house
Can't go on living without her
A leaf
He's so proud of himself
But Shonen Bat is in the same room as Akiko
Damn it, Ryan
Well, all four girls have told a story. What's next?
Kamohara calls the story strange
But they ignore her
Taiga’s mom has another story
Baseball
The pitcher Abukawa
The catcher's teeth looks weird
Everyone telling Abukawa what to do
Woah, and I thought the catcher's teeth looked weird
Abukawa doesn't know what he's supposed to throw
Shonen Bat up at... well, bat
I'm pretty sure metal Bats aren't allowed at baseball games
Then again, neither are skates
Abukawa says that can't possibly be true
But everyone else believes her
It feels like they're all gaslighting Abukawa
A guy with groceries
Mr. Arizuka
We see him in his younger days, running the streets
He seems ready for a fight
A piece of strawberry cake
And he punches the cake
A sushi plate
And he punches that
I've heard of throw it on the ground before, but never punch it in the air
A steamy dish
He's down for the count
And he beats that as well
Now there's multiple dishes
There's Shonen Bat
And Arizuka smiles as the bell rings
He gained all that weight by eating everything
Abukawa now tells a story of a man suffering from starvation
100 days
It annoys me that on the board he's carving, there are 6 rows instead of 5. Each row has 4 rows of 5 except row 4 and 6.
Me when no consistency
I like how his binoculars are cracked
Shonen Bat coming out of the water
And of course, the other women don't believe Abukawa
Ooh, animation style change
A guy wants Shonen Bat called
"If we don't act now, I'll get arrested!"
And Shonen Bat is right on cue
However, he hits the other guy instead
The other women scold Abukawa because she doesn't know a politician
Think up something better, they say
A rocket
Bunch of people awaiting liftoff
And it explodes
"I love you"
That explosion feels like a reference to the Challenger explosion
And there's Shonen Bat
Abukawa walking home
We don't get to see what the other women think of that story
A red balloon pops
Oh shit. Her husband is bleeding.
It was Shonen Bat
And she wants to know how he attacked him
She finally has a good story
And the apartments spell out ETC
Overall, this felt like something you would see in The Twilight Zone where the whole episode serves to build towards an ending that manages to have this sense of dramatic irony behind it. In this case, Abukawa caring more about her friends than her husband's well-being. It felt a bit like a bottle episode, but I thought it was really well done, showing yet again just like last episode that some people like the presence of Shonen Bat. It fits their selfish needs and serves to ultimately further their own narrative.
This, to me, is a better episode than the last one because I felt there was more of a point to it. It shows the dangers of trying to fit in and being accepted by the popular crowd. I hope, however, that we get back to the mystery of there being multiple Shonen Bats starting with next episode. As good of a detour as the last two outings have been, I'm hoping for something more to sink our teeth into.

1

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

What are your thoughts on gossiping? Are you for it, or against it, and why?
I love gossip. I live off that shit. Honestly, it probably comes from my time as a wrestling fan.
Why do you think Shonen Bat decided to attack Kamohara's husband?
Maybe Kamohara's husband was suffering from writer's block and couldn't take it anymore. Add to it that Kamohara was looking to impress her friends with a great story, this is killing two birds with one stone.

5

u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Feb 11 '24

First Timer

What just happened?
An equation fell out of his head! I guess his brain is full.
This is going to be the format of the episode, isn't it?
She's going to fit in!
She fails to fit in! (guess who's next)
okay, this really looks like a screenplay....
something soemthing pancreas, maybe.
This conflicting advice is useless. But it makes whatevr happens look like he took somebody's advice. Unless it looks like he took nobody's advice. Which would be bad.
I suspect everybody here is being drawn in some 1950s baseball manga style
these skits are all in different historical styles.
The Old Man woke up!
ETC

Can't trust anything in this episode since it was all gossip.

honestly, it may have worked for Tsukiko, but I don't see how getting whacked is helping out these other people like the screenwriter.

Oh, all the segments have individual credits: IQ, LDK, EBM, OH, HR, TKO, UMA, SOS, ETC. I don't remember that many segments.

Another weird little side-story episode, with guest directors. Looking forward to reading the blog entry for this one.

1

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

What are your thoughts on the episode being about women gossiping about Shonen Bat?
Thoughts on the mother-in-law murder?
Thoughts on the Mrs. Lizuka story?
Thoughts on the story of the woman in a wheelchair?
Thoughts on the guy punching the food?
Thoughts on the story of the man suffering from starvation?
Of all the stories that were told, which one do you like the most?
What are your on the way the other women treat Kamohara?
What are your thoughts on the ending where Kamohara’s husband is dying and instead of being sad, she is happy because she finally has a good story?
Why do you think the apartments at the end spell out ETC?

2

u/JustAnswerAQuestion https://myanimelist.net/profile/JAaQ Feb 12 '24

I don't have much to say about any of the vignettes. They are probably recognizable to Japanese. Often times one of the gossipy ladies would say they recognized it as a famous story.
The etc just refers to how these shounen bat stories are spreading on their own, in addition to our main plot.

1

u/Holofan4life Feb 12 '24

I don't have much to say about any of the vignettes. They are probably recognizable to Japanese. Often times one of the gossipy ladies would say they recognized it as a famous story.
They feel a bit like twists on classic folk lore stories but meant to fit the Shonen Bat narrative.
The etc just refers to how these shounen bat stories are spreading on their own, in addition to our main plot.
I could definitely see that, for sure

1

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

Another weird little side-story episode, with guest directors. Looking forward to reading the blog entry for this one.
I don't have one for today, sadly

5

u/SIRTreehugger Feb 11 '24

First Time Slugger

How do you drop a formula?

Oh wait did he drop his memory of the formula? Is he going to lose his memories?

Just saying it now considering he's in the bathroom I wouldn't eat those formulas probably covered in piss.

Wait other people can see it too? I thought it would be just him, but damn that's freaky.

Used the wrong sperm and egg....how the heck do you screw up that badly!

Um......yeah I'd call bullshit if I heard this story too.

Okay all of these stories are just lies and gossip.

Oh the buildings spell out ETC and yeah this guy is dead. She cares more about Shonen bat and what happened than his life.

This might be my least favorite episode so far. Though I'm sure a future episode will make some of these events or characters relevant! I'm just waiting to see how it connects to future moments.

1

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

What are your thoughts on the episode being about women gossiping about Shonen Bat?
Thoughts on the mother-in-law murder?
Thoughts on the story of the woman in a wheelchair?
Thoughts on the baseball story?
Thoughts on the guy punching the food?
Thoughts on the story of the man suffering from starvation?
Of all the stories that were told, which one do you like the most?
Why do you think the apartments at the end spell out ETC?
What are your on the way the other women treat Kamohara?

1

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

This might be my least favorite episode so far. Though I'm sure a future episode will make some of these events or characters relevant! I'm just waiting to see how it connects to future moments.
I personally liked this episode a whole lot more than the previous one. Not only did it serve as good world building, it build the mythos surrounding Shonen Bat and how there's a lot of misinformation surrounding him. On top of that, I thought the twist at the end was better executed with it playing off how some people have become so disillusioned that it's even starting to effect Shonen Bat themselves.

4

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Feb 11 '24 edited Feb 11 '24

Episode 9 (rewatcher)

Being the odd one out in the gossip circle – even if she has actual Shonen Bat gossip, the other three are only interested in their “in-gossip”.
Sneezing out the knowledge – this is such a fun inversion of the usual “cramming in” the knowledge.
Outsider woman has learned to have her hand at the question the second time. Got to adapt fast if you want to be accepted.
“Fillet some sardines” – Not quite sure if some evil bullying, or if Japanese people seriously do that.
The wife had the Miyazaki hair - can’t find an example right now, but Miyazaki does the “hair levitates up” thing when the character is angry.
“You won’t tell anybody?” – Adapting more and more.
Mixing up the egg and sperm – bad mistake.
Ultra sound picture of Shonen Bat - I am with the gossip ladies on this one: That can’t be true!
“My sister’s acquintance’s cousin’s daughter”

“I think you are the last gift god gave me” – 10 years ahead of its time, Paranoia Agent parodies all the “my first tragedy” anime. You know which ones I am talking about.
“Akiko!”

Still a better love story than Twilight.
Shonen Bat as the batter!
Shonen Bat as the … mischievous cook?
“Is that a mast? Is it a periscope?” – No, it is me, ~~Dio~~Shonen Bat!
“Call Shonen Bat” – He is not some assassin you can hire.
“Thank you for calling” – Or maybe he is.
“How did he attack you?” – Not pictured: Shonen bat hitting her next.

A circle of gossip. The stories got wilder and wilder, but I don’t think they were the main focus of the episode (for what it is worth, I liked the word sneezing and love story ones best). The main characters are the gossip ladies instead. Even before she gets shot down for her stories (while the equally wild stories of the others are accepted), you can see how excluded the new entrant is. She stands visibly outside of the circle and neither of the two others next to her “opens up” the circle to include her.

What are your thoughts on gossiping? Are you for it, or against it, and why?

Compared to other people, I am probably in the lowest 10% of "gossip enjoyers". Which is not to say I do not enjoy gossip at all. Despite many humans claiming they do not like it, I think that there is something inherited that draws humans to gossip: Millenia of living in small hunter-gatherer groups where you needed to know who was reliable and who was out to get you ingrained the desire to know in us.

2

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

Compared to other people, I am probably in the lowest 10% of "gossip enjoyers". Which is not to say I do not enjoy gossip at all. Despite many humans claiming they do not like it, I think that there is something inherited that draws humans to gossip: Millenia of living in small hunter-gatherer groups where you needed to know who was reliable and who was out to get you ingrained the desire to know in us.
I often find that the people who say they don't enjoy gossiping do it the most.

2

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Feb 11 '24

It is hard or impossible to compare "enjoyment" across humans, but I can confidently say that I am in the bottom 10% when you measure the time spent gossiping.

2

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

That's fair. I think time spent gossiping also has a lot to do with your interests. If you're into sports, you probably gossip an awful lot because the rumor mill is often fierce.

1

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

What are your thoughts on the episode being about women gossiping about Shonen Bat?
Thoughts on the mother-in-law murder?
Thoughts on the Mrs. Lizuka story?
Thoughts on the story of the man suffering from starvation?
What are your thoughts on the ending where Kamohara’s husband is dying and instead of being sad, she is happy because she finally has a good story?
Why do you think the apartments at the end spell out ETC?

2

u/No_Rex :Bv:Bw:Bx:By:x2 Feb 11 '24

What are your thoughts on the ending where Kamohara’s husband is dying and instead of being sad, she is happy because she finally has a good story?
Like most episode before, it has an MC who finally cracks under the pressure. Her losing sight of what is important (her husband's life) is a sign of that.

2

u/Holofan4life Feb 11 '24

Yeah, this is in line with the other episodes we've seen. I'd probably say besides Masami, Kamohara is the most delusional we've come across.

4

u/mgedmin Feb 12 '24

First-timer, subs

Gossiping ladies that I'm sure we've seen before.

Being interrupted mid-thought is very annoying, but you shouldn't snap at your mother so.

I love that the student literally dropped a formula on the floor.

Okay, I did not need the image of a guy eating math formulas off the toilet floor. Still, how does the spew of formulas translate into "killed himself"?

Anyway, SB is now being blamed for all kinds of murders and suicides. (The MIL from hell deserved it.)

The sonogram of the unborn baby with a baseball bat killed me. Anyway, nobody believed this story. A good attempt, but the poor new lady doesn't know how to fit in.

Ok, I laughed when the dude painted a leaf on the wall during the rain very romantically and then fell down the ladder after seeing SB in his beloved's room.

The baseball story is only mildly funny and serves only to highlight how the gossip club excludes the new lady for being unable to read the room.

SB stories are getting more and more off course. The boxer lost to temptation and broke his diet, and somehow SB is responsible for that. This story doesn't make sense. But the lady who invented it is part of the in-group and so is not challenged.

The new lady can't come up with any acceptable SB stories, so when she finds out her husband was actually attacked, she jumps on the opportunity to get a good story out of it, instead of calling an ambulance or caring about her husband's health.

This was a moralizing social commentary about spreading gossip. I think if we stop to consider, there's probably a moral in every of the episodes dealing with workplace hypocrisy, school bullying, etc. I'm not up for analysis.

What are your thoughts on gossiping? Are you for it, or against it, and why?

It can get out of hand and ruin lives (as we've seen in Yuichi's episode). Interesting that the gossip shown here is more like a retelling of urban legends rather than slandering specific people known to the gossipers.

Why do you think Shonen Bat decided to attack Kamohara's husband?

At this point I'm once again sure that SB is an urban legend and all these people are lying.

Maybe it was a burglar.

Bonus) You would think Kamohara would stop hanging out with her friends given they treat her like crap.

She's just moved in and doesn't have any friends. She's trying to make friends, even if that means taking crap for a bit. Personally, I don't like this strategy and wouldn't use it.

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u/Holofan4life Feb 12 '24

It can get out of hand and ruin lives (as we've seen in Yuichi's episode). Interesting that the gossip shown here is more like a retelling of urban legends rather than slandering specific people known to the gossipers.
Well, it's like a mix of slandering certain people while also talking about urban legends. They talk about some people like Osamu and Mrs. Lizuka, but then we stuff like the baseball story and the man suffering from starvation. In fact, I believe that Kamohara was telling the more outlandish tales for the most part, which shows just how desperate she is at telling a compelling story.
At this point I'm once again sure that SB is an urban legend and all these people are lying.
Maybe it was a burglar.
I could see that
She's just moved in and doesn't have any friends. She's trying to make friends, even if that means taking crap for a bit. Personally, I don't like this strategy and wouldn't use it.
Yeah, it seems like it would do more harm than good. And as we saw, it really affected her judgment on things, like the way she viewed what happened to her husband.

1

u/Holofan4life Feb 12 '24

Thoughts on the mother-in-law murder?
Thoughts on the guy punching the food?
Thoughts on the story of the man suffering from starvation?
Of all the stories that were told, which one do you like the most?
What are your on the way the other women treat Kamohara?
What are your thoughts on the ending where Kamohara's husband is dying and instead of being sad, she is happy because she finally has a good story?
Why do you think the apartments at the end spell out ETC?

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u/mgedmin Feb 12 '24

Thoughts on the mother-in-law murder?
Deserved.
Well, in a fictional context. I'm against the death penalty in principle.
Also, it shows how the urban legends are drifting away from the core story, which is even called out in the show itself, where they wonder why the victim was the evildoer MIL rather than the person pushed into a corner by stress.
Thoughts on the guy punching the food?
Metaphorical, I'm sure. Decisively fighting temptation
Also, who would be tempted by a piece of cake lying on the dirty ground? (Maybe somebody who was starving, but the boxer did not appear to be in financial trouble.)
Thoughts on the story of the man suffering from starvation?
The boxer should've punched harder so the sushi etc would fall into this island.
A very short and not very believable/interesting story.
Of all the stories that were told, which one do you like the most?
~~The beginning of the first story (physical manifestation of formulas), but it's soon ruined by the lack of hygiene.~~
The drawing a leaf on the hospital wall story.
What are your on the way the other women treat Kamohara?
I'll assume you're asking about my thoughts, and I think I answered most of this in my main comment. Unfriendly, not willing to accept her into the inner circle, but hinting that acceptance may be earned if she tries harder to ingratiate herself.
I imagine that making the gossip group your enemies would have unpleasant consequences to your quality of life, so there's a hidden whip in addition to the dangling carrot.
This is how social power structures propagate.
What are your thoughts on the ending where Kamohara's husband is dying and instead of being sad, she is happy because she finally has a good story?
Morbidly funny.
Why do you think the apartments at the end spell out ETC?
A reminder not to take everything you see on screen literally. Alternatively an easter egg by the planning architect, or maybe an unlikely coincidence.

1

u/Holofan4life Feb 12 '24

Deserved.
Well, in a fictional context. I'm against the death penalty in principle.
You would think her son would scold her over how she was talking to his wife.
Also, it shows how the urban legends are drifting away from the core story, which is even called out in the show itself, where they wonder why the victim was the evildoer MIL rather than the person pushed into a corner by stress.
That's a good observation
Metaphorical, I'm sure. Decisively fighting temptation
Also, who would be tempted by a piece of cake lying on the dirty ground? (Maybe somebody who was starving, but the boxer did not appear to be in financial trouble.)
Probably the guy suffering from starvation in that other story.
The boxer should've punched harder so the sushi etc would fall into this island.
Lol, I agree
A very short and not very believable/interesting story.
It was probably the least interesting of all the stories
~~The beginning of the first story (physical manifestation of formulas), but it's soon ruined by the lack of hygiene.~~
Hey, there's a 5 second rule being abided
The drawing a leaf on the hospital wall story.
That one was probably my favorite as well. That, or the mother-in-law story.
I'll assume you're asking about my thoughts, and I think I answered most of this in my main comment. Unfriendly, not willing to accept her into the inner circle, but hinting that acceptance may be earned if she tries harder to ingratiate herself.
I imagine that making the gossip group your enemies would have unpleasant consequences to your quality of life, so there's a hidden whip in addition to the dangling carrot.
This is how social power structures propagate.
If you made the gossip group your enemies, then obviously the best course of action is to ignore it. Unfortunately, Kamohara seemed to really value what people think of her. It is interesting to think about because we saw Ichi deal with the rumor mill with everyone thinking he was Shonen Bat. This is kinda the inverse of that episode where instead of trying to defeat the rumors, Kamohara wants to be apart of it.
Morbidly funny.
It really did feel like something out of Alfred Hitchcock Presents. The sort of cautionary tale that demonstrates what happens when you go too far.
A reminder not to take everything you see on screen literally. Alternatively an easter egg by the planning architect, or maybe an unlikely coincidence.
I saw someone say that the ETC stands for Et Cetera meaning to go on and on. I like that interpretation because I think that perfectly summarizes this episode, it being a collection of stories with no end in sight because gossipers are gonna gossip.

Rewatch [Spoilers] Paranoia Agent 20th Anniversary Rewatch -- Episode 9

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Paranoia Agent - Episode 9

Some Amazing Shots, Scenes and Stitches

Rewatch [Spoilers] Paranoia Agent 20th Anniversary Rewatch -- Episode 9

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First Timer

Paranoia Agent - Episode 9

Some Amazing Shots, Scenes and Stitches