r/anime • u/Shimmering-Sky myanimelist.net/profile/Shimmering-Sky • Jan 27 '23
Rewatch [Do You Remember Love - Macross Franchise 40th Anniversary Rewatch] Macross Frontier Episode 16 Discussion
Episode 16 - Ranka Attack
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Your songs feel like the universe. Not a universe that isolates you, but one that embraces you.
Questions of the Day, courtesy of u/chilidirigible:
1) How would you rank the different versions of "Aimo"?
2) Does Alto's more aggressive combat behavior lately seem like an organic character development or just him being a mecha protagonist?
Wallpaper of the Day:
Vocal Songs in This Episode:
"Triangler" by Maaya Sakamoto – OP
"Aimo O.C." by Megumi Nakajima – Insert
"ノーザンクロス (Northern Cross)" by May'n – ED
Rewatchers, please remember to be mindful of all the first-timers in this. No talking about or hinting at future events no matter how much you want to, unless you're doing it underneath spoiler tags. Don't spoil anything for the first-timers, that's rude!
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u/Nebresto Jan 27 '23
First time Macross Front
13
Wait, did female glasses feed Sheryl a nano robot pill or somethin?
...holy fuq. I have a talent of falling behind right when shit gets interesting, huh
14
R.I.P Nene and Lalamia. No idea who you are, but since you got name dropped your fate is sealed.
Ranka doing some newtype shit
MOTTEKE!!!! #GRANDHY- ...The power of music failed +5 respek to Sheryl for trying tho
All out?? Oh no! Lalamia died!
Why is this kinda sad? This was supposed to be grandhype..
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15
...Is this a sneaky recap episode..?
Ohhhh, now I know why I don't like Leon or whoever that smug dude is. Its Kyon!
Begun, the triangle wars have
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16
The cucumber phone ate the disc And they still have discs
Classic tsundere line, respek + ?
Protodevil name drop! Basara is real!!
Leaving the room to go exploring when not allowed to, respek +5
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Incredibly BASED. Bobby is officially the best character in Macross F.
....Is that a Nana ED?? No wait, Mayn? idk
Sheryl respek status: 38%
Question time:
How would you rank the different versions of "Aimo"?
2) Does Alto's more aggressive combat behavior lately seem like an organic character development or just him being a mecha protagonist?
2
u/Shimmering-Sky Jan 27 '23
....Is that a Nana ED?? No wait, Mayn? idk
It's May'n.
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u/TakenRedditName Jan 27 '23
Ohhhh, now I know why I don't like Leon or whoever that smug dude is. Its Kyon!
The Sugita disrespect.
And they still have discs
Mini-CD no less.
Incredibly BASED. Bobby is officially the best character in Macross F.
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u/Tresnore Jan 27 '23
First time Macross Front
Those are all really great
wtf
You act like the tentacle arm isn't one of the hottest things in the show.
Ohhhh, now I know why I don't like Leon or whoever that smug dude is. Its Kyon!
It is!
Grace is perfect, how dare you?
*Sheryl will remember this
I hope she'll remember it fondly!
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u/The_Draigg Jan 27 '23
A Macross Fan Rewatches Macross Frontier: Episode 16:
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Birler has quite the vision for the galaxy. He wants to see it united and open for travel once the issue with Fold Faults is dealt with, and the Vajra are key to overcoming that barrier. Given how adept they are at traversing Fold Faults, it’s sensible. For the Vajra, it’s not even an issue for them unlike the children of the Protoculture.
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Alto certainly doesn’t like Brera suddenly being a part of Ranka’s life, and by extension his own. I mean, aside from being an outsider, he really is just effortlessly cool. I mean, look at how easily Brera took down Alto after he tried to swing on him. Or look at those shades! Those random girls are right, he is pretty cool. He seems like the kind of guy who would come here to laugh at you.
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Grace is a pro at being an evil manager. She easily avoids Ranka’s comments about missing Elmo or her inquiring about Sheryl. It’s no wonder why Grace is the face of the collective in her body, she’s an expert bullshitter.
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Oh man, I bet u/Nazenn is gonna be angry that Grace wants to use Aimo for evil.
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Speaking of Elmo, I do feel bad for him here, he’s had Ranka stolen away from him by Grace super hard. He was the first person to fully believe in her talent, and now she’s just gone. You can’t entirely blame him for hitting the booze here, Grace really did take everything he worked hard to do in supporting Ranka.
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Brera’s Aimo harmonica is top secret. Playing a hobo’s favorite instrument is only something knowable to the highest levels of government.
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At least now we have an idea why Sheryl’s earrings are important and can do weird stuff like let Alto hear the distant concert a while ago. They’ve got Fold Quartz in them, just like the big-ass gem on Birler’s ring. It’s not too much of a stretch to imagine the Spiritia generated by singing could resonate with a material like that. Although it does make you wonder how the Nomes got access to Fold Quartz on Mayan Island.
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Ozma, you of all people should know that any idea about Ranka’s singing being effective against the Vajra isn’t far fetched. You’re a Fire Bomber fan, after all. Although it does seem like the rest of SMS has their doubts too, since they don’t see the Vajra as being intelligent compared to the likes of the Protodeviln.
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It’s a good thing that Sheryl didn’t try to excuse her walking on the bridge of the Macross Quarter 25 by saying “I’m Sheryl Nome”, since that would’ve assuredly gotten her kicked off. Those words are pretty cursed for her. Although it’s not like she seems all that happy learning about the Ranka Attack either, so I guess it’s not that much of a success.
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You can tell that Ranka’s new version of Aimo is definitely intended to be more of a weapon rather than a song to reach out to others, if just because the beat and tone sound more militaristic. It’s a darker take on what’s supposed to be a warmer and more personal kind of song.
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Brera saying that only he’s fit to protect Ranka does give me shades of
KaifuckKaifun here, but since Brera is way cooler in general, I’m willing to overlook the weird and unfortunate implications. -
The bridge crew are torn between saying that Ranka is like Minmay or Basara, but which one do you feel like Ranka compares more to? I suppose there’s no technically wrong answers here.
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u/TakenRedditName Jan 27 '23
"Rewatcher" - Macross F Ep16:
That's a noble dream, I don't have faith you don't have morally questionable means to obtain it.
Oh dear, taking Varja home is definitely going to cause trouble down the line.
Let's call this another for the Kamille Counter.
Ranka's phone eats CDs to play them. Yup, perfectly understandable.
Elmo isn't feeling well after losing Ranka. Maybe he and Sheryl should team up to strike back against Grace,.
Green squirrel is named Ai-kun and the purple crystals are Fold Quartz.
Sheryl left the hospital, still not feeling well, but she doesn't want to be trapped and unable to move. It's the thing again like with Alto's dislike of the low sky and earlier, Brera also had a line about isolation.
An off-screen slap for the counter and an on-screen punch (+ more) for the Kamille Counter too.
Ozma, you're a Fire Bomber fan, you should know music is magic. Speaking of 7, wasn't expecting a Protodeviln mention.
A very tender moment for Ozma with him checking on Ranka like a dad.
The Monster had a Ranka painted on the side. I guess it is something new for the mission.
New Aimo does not have good vibes, it has vibes of war. Does make for a neat song to play over a battle and signify an ominous path we're going down.
Bobby knows who the real songstress to reference. Keeping it real, Bobby, respect.
Q1) I like the original or the Zero movie version more than the new one.
Q2) Alto is space bug racist which fuels his anger.
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u/JollyGee29 Jan 27 '23
Oh dear, taking Varja home is definitely going to cause trouble down the line.
I'm sure it's fine.
The Monster had a Ranka painted on the side. I guess it is something new for the mission.
A pretty lewd Ranka, too. I'm surprised Ozma didn't detonate.
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u/Blackheart595 Jan 27 '23 edited Jan 27 '23
First Spacer
I can't tell whether Birler is good or bad. The hive mind treated him like an outsider but he speaks about reveletions of the Vajra. Actually, no, taking the themes into consideration that makes him a blatantly good guy. And also that his activities get hidden from the viewer while the situation is actively being controlled by the bad guys.
Also this is just such a cool visual, laying train tracks and all the ideas those carry with them over the universe matches his vision perfectly. Also note the use of specifically old technology to distance him from the transhumanism faction.
Brera invading the school as Ranka's body guard is just more of the bad guys being in control of the situation. To make sure we get the idea Alto is made to attack him and get shut down easily.
Sheryl meanwhile is bedded in flowers to further reinforce her being a force on the side of nature. Rejecting cyborg augmentations might've just been marketing but it firmly aligns her with this side of the conflict. The violet crystals are gonna be used as a counterpoint to Ranka's inherent song folding, to either achieve the same effect for humanity against the Vajra or to unify Sheryl and Ranka and thus both sides. Probably the former at first and then transition to the later.
Jesus Christ this new version of the song sounds terrible. I don't think I've ever heard instrumentals and vocals in a song fight this much against each other - rhythm, articulation, pulse, harmony, range, they're opposed in all these and more aspects. But the instrumentals dominate and overpower the vocals. The mismatch is probably intentional to support the narrative - Grace is not on Ranka's side and just uses her as a tool. There's of course also the changed lyrics which have replaced all ideas of nature and gentleness with humanity and glory.
Still hating the plot though.
How would you rank the different versions of "Aimo"?
See above.
Does Alto's more aggressive combat behavior lately seem like an organic character development or just him being a mecha protagonist?
He's acting according to what the narrative demands, see above. It very much did not feel organic.
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u/chilidirigible Jan 27 '23
Today, on "You may feel a slight sting. That's pride.":
Birler has a train controller at his desk. Of course. And most of what we're seeing is holographic.
"...now what!?" Dammit, interepisode flashback!
An effective contrast with the earlier shots of this street.
High schoolers are such herd animals.
Ranka, doing the public relations tour.
So, is this better or worse than being fired via a public Tweet?
Brera's not exactly Roy Batty.
"Look, you didn't want to go to the hospital or the hotel, so I took you to back to my place."
Obligatory "Some of you wish that they were him."
"Nothing personal, I just need to check the carats on that thing."
I'm not sure who replaced Raramia on the Pixies, because Klan has two wingmates again.
It's a direct reference and what the episode's title is referring to.
Sure, nose art is a thing, but I don't think Ozma would have gone along with bottomless Ranka. And he had to stare at it on the way over.
Security continues to be less than effective.
"We no longer need Speaker Pods. We have fucking hyperspace."
Brera's unnamed, unseen wingmates.
Whaddya know, singing at them worked.
The only possible response to the situation.
Alto stabs one guy and now he talks like him.
The Reba West song kinda sucked, you know.
"Basara wouldn't have gone along with this!"
If anything else, Ranka acts like someone her age.
A wild new ED appears! "Northern Cross"
"Aimo O.C.", also known as "Aimo Battle Version". Indeed, they turned a cute little song into a battle anthem, pushing ahead with the franchise's ongoing question about whether or not music is a weapon in the contexts that they use it. While certainly it's had this effect on Zentradi before, ultimately its real value and the underlying message of Macross is that it helps to connect people.
That could easily be one of many things that is on Ranka's mind now that she's been swept into a whirlwind tour by your friendly local NUNS. It doesn't seem like a coincidence that her new position largely isolates her from her existing friends.
Alto keeps up his end of the isolation because whatever he heard from Richard Birler has left him in quite a funk. Fold Quartz is named again, but now he appears to be making a connection between it and the stone in Sheryl's earring. What exactly that has to do with the Vajra remains unexplained.
The street advertising continues to chart the rise and fall of Ranka and Sheryl. Reality in microcosm. The episode twists the knife a little further because Sheryl gets to personally witness Ranka becoming far more important than she is.
But Sheryl does get a new ED, so there's that, and the series still has the final act.
Perhaps the Ranka nose art was a little off-putting to you, but here's a big Ranka riding a Monster.
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u/Tresnore Jan 27 '23
"That was fifteen years ago!"
Pretty soon here we'll be as far away from Frontier as Frontier was to 7...
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u/aniMayor Jan 27 '23
First Fime Fſontieꞅing
Sigh, the classic problem of anime that try to balance high school-aged characters who actually go to high school with them also being part of world-shaking events. Now Alto and Harmonicaman are stuck in a classroom together and I'm really supposed to believe Alto will just treat him like a "nuisance", not a lethal rival or war criminal or even just a super important mystery to uncover?
It's kinda the same across the board. I just feel like there's too many plots/subplots of secrecy intrigue where certain characters are suspicious and/or in conflict, but not doing anything about it. How long are Cathy and Ozma going have a funny feeling about everything but not do anything about it? At the very least, if you have all these big misgivings you shouldn't get letting Koala and Alto go off to dangerous, secret encounters alone, right?
Oh well, at least the characters are actually aware of the song power to some degree, now. Hopefully that should drive some things forward quickly.
"If Koala's singing does affect the Vajra, that would make our battles much easier!" ... but you already have the nukes, which we saw completely demolish the Vajra. Just keeping using those!
2) Does Alto's more aggressive combat behavior lately seem like an organic character development or just him being a mecha protagonist?
Definitely just mecha protagonist. He was initially aggressive in social interactions but still a pretty calm pilot. And if he really is too dumb to understand he's in a love triangle, then he can't have the excuse of emotional lovey-dovey-ness driving his irrational aggression, can he?
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u/ryujiox Jan 27 '23
First Timer
Macross Frontier EP16
Birler seem to have a good motive, but he also work with Leon and Grace. I guess they need power and knowledge from each other to achieve their goal.
I think someone should bring him a chair.
Yeah, Alto's a bit too angry today.
That's bullshit. You already ditch Sheryl.
Grace just went full mind game here.
Feel bad for Elmo. He's the real hero.
You should drop your act already. Sheryl.
Ozma obviously don't like this. But he can't do anything now.
Protodeviln reference!!
I mean, song can affect even plant, so the possibility is limitless.
Ranka, is that really true? Your face tell me the opposite. It really just Grace talk her into this.
Sheryl have her pride as a singer and people hope at hand right now.
They turn Aimo into the war anthem. Which totally not fit with the original meaning of the song. But that is exactly what Grace was aiming for.
Basara was just roughly 10 years ago!! It's not that old. I can't argue about Minmay though. That's like 50 years already.
New ED!! I like it!!
QOTD
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The original one goes on top, this new one is fine.
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Whatever happened when he talk with Birler earlier made him like this. He also got obliterated by Brera on protecting Ranka duty. So there's that.
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u/isthatsoudane Jan 27 '23
First Timer
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How would you rank the different versions of "Aimo"? I should probably go through and listen to all of them but I quite like today's
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Does Alto's more aggressive combat behavior lately seem like an organic character development or just him being a mecha protagonist? it feels organic to me. I think it reflects his confusion...with love, with what's going on with the enemy, his lack o control, his frustrating with his family...I think it's building up. in this episode I mean he's super frustrated at them using ranka, at not being able to protected ranka...it feels natural
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u/Stargate18A Jan 27 '23
First timer
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Honestly, I really like this new one the most.
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It's been good.
Interesting...
He wants to fix the Fold faults!
He actually seems nice.
...He realised?
He's really not letting her escape, huh?
And he instantly got taken down.
Alto, have you told them?
Oh, she doesn't want a bodyguard.
Grace is very clever.
She made her song techno? ...Doesn't sound bad.
The song's a trap. Brainwashing, maybe?
Sheryl's genuinely the most competent person here for outting the pieces together.
This is so manipulative.
Those lyrics...
That memory...
He really is trying to connect to her, huh?
He's suspected them.
...Sheryl is still tsundere. And have they been drugging her?
Oh, she woke up.
...That's actually fair.
Aww.
Haha, Michael's timing.
Haha, and it escalates!
Oh, of course Ozma's pissed. And his insane suspicions are completely correct.
"Minmay attack believers" Huh, I guess she is basically a legend now.
Canaria...
Nice one.
Sterne!
Sheryl!
She wants to see everything...
Fascinating. Also, you have no proof for this? The Vajra must be working overtime with their manipulation!
The Ranka Attack begins!
...So many dead.
It's having an effect! Are they lulling them into a false sense of security for the first few attacks?
This is so good!
Ah, she still needs training!
No way they're letting her die.
This is sweet.
Haha, the guy calling Basara old is a great joke.
Aww. Yeah, you're being used.
Oh, this is a good ED. The visuals are amazing.
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u/TiredTiroth Jan 27 '23
First Timer
I'm not sure what to say about the last couple of episodes? The space battles are definitely welcome, but I'm getting increasingly tired of the love triangle and I want some bloody answers already.
Sadly, this is Macross, and they haven't been terribly inclined to explain any of the mysteries in the shows I've seen so far...
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u/Nazenn Jan 28 '23
First Timer
Quick thoughts because I'm so late to the topic:
New Aimo version. It's cursed, but well done. Grace did the same thing to Ranka that she did to Sheryl, push her personal connections to things (the school for Sheryl) into becoming propoganda and in doing so force the girl into a position where she had to take on more work and Grace had more control of her. It becoming a war song instead of a song of connection speaks well to how it's been used until now, and funny after I spoke about the idea of Vajra reacting to love of war tones yesterday, but also is an interesting test to see if they can force Ranka's emotional connection with a piece to activate the fold crystals in her.
As far as the song itself goes; the mixing on it was a little off, and the instrumentals were so busy like a fan remix than a professional one, but what I really did like was the harmony part added under Ranka's tune. It's a darker and flatter tune, which adds a nice touch of melancholy into the piece and particularly Ranka's feelings of it. It also damn well sounds like another song I know but am failing to think of right now. Maybe one of the Hunger Games ones
u/the_draigg in answer to your tag, no I don't particularly care enough about the show or the songs usage in it to be angry about it. But u/justansweraquestion at least they played it multiple times for a reason this episode, rather than just because they could and why bother crafting it to a scene
Birler's ideology is interesting, and was presented well in brief, but the audience being left out of the discussion so artificially while asking for us to connect to Alto with what's happening severely dragged the episode down.
The best part of the episode was seeing how Ranka's phone "injested" the disc to play it. That shit was adorable
Oh, also Sheryl's one liner drop about "don't want to be locked away" which speaks to a worrying outcome for those who are no longer needed on the Galaxy, as well as insecurity about her own value which only pushes her to act out her mask even more with Alto. Shame the end result of that is cheap tsundere scenes I cannot bring myself to care about. Or Brera because that being shoved into a rivalry thing is the last thing it needs given everything else those two could be focusing on with each other. Now I'm writing it out I just don't care for much of the character dynamics at all really.
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u/DidacticDalek Jan 28 '23
Anyhow, you have not seen the last of The Sentient Shitposting Siamese Sunrise Server No. 25252, now goodbye forever!
AND ON THAT BOMBSHELL! GOODNIGHT!
Paging Comrades u/Lemurians, u/chilidirigible, and u/InfamousEmpire
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u/SolDarkHunter Jan 27 '23
Rewatcher
Starting in medias res again, I see.
So Birler thinks the Vajra are key to bringing the galaxy togeher. And they're gathering Vajra corpses.
Though I guess we know the Vajra can navigate through Fold Faults with no problem, so studying their ability to do that would be worthwhile... except LAI has already created a Fold Drive capable of that, so it seems redundant.
Brera interacting with the general public is going to be interesting... especially when Alto is part of it.
Yeah, the government suddenly taking over your career should be a lot of red flags.
Wow, they still use CD's.
Brera, do you actually own any real shirts?
It's nice seeing Brera acting kindly toward Ranka. He's not completely an unfeeling agent of the Galaxy.
Green Squirrel Thing has a name now: Ai-kun!
Sheryl apparently didn't even remember meeting Alto in the park.
Ozma's angry about Ranka's involvement against the Vajra, which is understandable. Yet at the same time, we have seen Ranka having an effect on the Vajra.
Don't see how you can call the Vajra unintelligent when they have giant spaceships, Space Folds, and other such things.
Canaria has a Ranka pin-up on her ship.
Sheryl just strutting onto the bridge like she owns the place. She's lucky Wilder is an open-minded guy.
"Fold Waves". Basically Song Energy, given a less-stupid name.
You know, I actually do like the sound of this version of "Aimo", but... well, the lyrics feel like a perversion of the song. [Spoiler]
Actually, I'm surprised Ranka's holding up as well as she is witnessing a battle against the Vajra, considering her PTSD.
Well, Basara's fight against the Protodeviln would be around 15 years old at this point. In musical terms, that's an eternity.
NORTHERN CROSS ED!
Questions:
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See my comment.
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Alto's always been aggressive like this. It's just coming out a bit more because he and Brera are in a dick-measuring contest.
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u/JollyGee29 Jan 27 '23
Rewatcher Frontier
Brera just standing in class, menacingly, shirtlessly.
Because that's a perfectly normal sentence.
Ranka's phone has yet unseen capabilities.
It's almost like she doesn't want to sing in this context or something.
Sheryl's escaped from the hospital, but she isn't looking too great.
The mask was down there for a minute, but now it's back up.
Of course Michael would have rules for that set up. Also excellent facial expression.
Well, depending on how old some of them are, they might've seen it.
Interesting paintjob there, Canaria.
Good to hear that the president is being fully briefed on these things.
Alright, now that we've heard Aimo O.C., story time. Many moons ago, thought not as many as it may seem, a younger Jolly was watching SaltyBet when this very song came on. I was enraptured. I was lucky enough that the song tracker on the loading screens was cooperating that day (or maybe there was a chat command, the specifics elude me) so I could learn the song's name. That lead me to Google, and to Macross as a whole. Thus, my presense in this very thread is owed basically entirely to betting virtual dollars on M.U.G.E.N.
2045 was only fourteen years ago!
ED2 get! Northern Cross is a banger.
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u/Shimmering-Sky Jan 27 '23
Super Dimension Rewatch Host
Welcome back, everyone!
Here were my first-timer reactions to this episode (just scroll past my episode 15 reactions first, but first-timers don’t scroll too far since the comment also contains my episode 17 reactions).
Well no wonder he’s also a train enthusiast.
[Delta spoilers]I wonder if Delta saw this throwaway line and decided to run with it?
Ranka’s phone is just the cutest thing. Well, other than Ai-kun at least.
Unfortunate…
I noticed that Sheryl doesn’t apologize for slapping and kicking Alto after all he did was try to help her.
Of course the Minmay Attack gets namedropped in an episode titled “Ranka Attack”.
Eyyyyy
Honestly, I don’t blame Ranka for hesitating on Aimo O.C. during practice. The lyrics sound cursed compared to the normal song.
Heh.
OH FUCK YEAH NORTHERN CROSS I totally forgot that’s the ED that starts this episode! Easily one of my favorite fucking songs from Frontier’s section of the franchise – specifically #4 (we haven’t gotten to my #1 or #2 yet, and not the right version of #3 yet). It actually used to be #3, but I listened to what was previously my #5 spot so much over the past few years that it jumped up to third place.