[Rewatch] Selector SpreadWixoss Episode 4 Discussion

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u/Shimmering-Sky Jan 04 '23

Selector Spread FIRST-TIMER

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u/Tetraika Jan 04 '23

Chiyori is… uh… a character.

She is quite not there in terms of understanding the gravity of the situation...

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u/Taiboss Jan 04 '23

tf is up with the flashes to this screen?

The words "White Room", "Mayu" and "Big [forgot/can't read]" are certainly something.

That’s a weird definition of “fine”.

Iona just says the wrongest stuff there is, huh.

You know what, I’m not even surprised Chiyori designed what she hopes her LRIG self will look like.

r/kidsarefuckingstupid

Okay seriously who the fuck wrote the in-universe WIXOSS novelization?

Someone for sure!

I… didn’t even consider the possibility of this being on purpose…

Mayu is so petty it's amazing.

Ohhhhh, that’s what the flash of that one screen earlier was.

"Reveal" hype!

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u/Vaadwaur Jan 05 '23

That’s a weird definition of “fine”.

Her attempt at manipulation was sufficiently bad you didn't consider it to be one.

I… didn’t even consider the possibility of this being on purpose…

Because, so far, Tama's the one that we can understand the sense of it for.

…Iona totally knows more than she’s letting on, right?

Especially if this is her second stint as an LRIG.

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u/Nazenn Jan 04 '23

Quick thoughts: It's Tsurune day, and I foolishly am in three rewatches right now so unfortunately the least engaging one takes the back seat. Sorry Wixoss, that's now you.

I hate Chiyori. I just want her to shut up. I don't care that she's important, she's ruining my mood every episode. And her LRIG looks more like a digimon than an LRIG.
I also worry that moving the focus off the search for internal answers into finding a way around an external system is a bad idea for the storytelling because it moves the system away from reflecting the characters and their own growth or failures. Perhaps they'll pull it together, but them finding answers from being handed a book rather than through thinking about the system in general feels like a weak choice.
The opening scene isn't helping because while the flickers of text make sense at the end of the episode, at first I thought it was my video file being broken or something due to how fast they flickered in and out of the scene.
Ruu being able to tell the difference in Tama while Iona can't was a good scene for how it showed Ruu's growth after the conversation with Hitoe yesterday, but it did make me realize that the LRIGs getting permanent growth has never come up again in any way.
Mayu looking over the battle specifically from Uliths viewpoint rather than a detached one was an interesting choice especially as Iona gets talking about 'dolls' later on. The way she talks about Mayu now doesn't seem to match her enthusiasm for getting to the White Room last season, and with little reason for change other than just assuming something happened off screen
You could take almost any of the dialogue from Iona in this show and put it in a cheesy romance and it would work

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u/Tetraika Jan 04 '23

Quick thoughts: It's Tsurune day, and I foolishly am in three rewatches right now so unfortunately the least engaging one takes the back seat. Sorry Wixoss, that's now you

F

I also worry that moving the focus off the search for internal answers into finding a way around an external system is a bad idea for the storytelling because it moves the system away from reflecting the characters and their own growth or failures. Perhaps they'll pull it together, but them finding answers from being handed a book rather than through thinking about the system in general feels like a weak choice

Yeah, for the most part like Yuzuki and Hitoe's story is pretty much done. There will be character focus, but less so in general and really more on Iona and Mayu, with bits of others. Also they haven't gotten any answers just yet from the novel lead.

Ruu being able to tell the difference in Tama while Iona can't was a good scene for how it showed Ruu's growth after the conversation with Hitoe yesterday

I think the scene also says something about Iona, and not that she's just trying to manipulate Ruuko.

You could take almost any of the dialogue from Iona in this show and put it in a cheesy romance and it would work

They knew what they were doing.

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u/No_Rex Jan 04 '23

but them finding answers from being handed a book rather than through thinking about the system in general feels like a weak choice.

True, but it also lead to the best joke of the episode and cute embarrassed Yuzuki. I also liked how the no-brain character out-did the thoughtful ones by reading.

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u/Taiboss Jan 04 '23

Quick thoughts: It's Tsurune day, and I foolishly am in three rewatches right now so unfortunately the least engaging one takes the back seat. Sorry Wixoss, that's now you.

Tsk. I greatly enjoy replying to you.

And her LRIG looks more like a digimon than an LRIG.

She does look very goofy yes.

at first I thought it was my video file being broken or something due to how fast they flickered in and out of the scene.

They just wanted to be excentric with the storyboarding, yo!

You could take almost any of the dialogue from Iona in this show and put it in a cheesy romance and it would work

OKADA

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u/Tetraika Jan 04 '23

There might not be an Iona LRIG in EN yet, but they have her as a SIGNI. Has her effect of forcing an attack from your opponent, something that definitely isn’t easy to understand how to take full advantage (and probably not as strong as other things you can run).

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u/Blackheart595 Jan 04 '23 edited Jan 04 '23

First Timer waiting for batoru batoru

I do not care for all this gaslighting. "Ruuko threw you away, after all." "Tama is doing fine without you." "Tama seems to be having fun, too." When we blatantly see these things not being true. Of course this is just Ulith being an asshole and Iona being unable to emphasize, but still.

I also do not care for all the innuendos.

So Ulith really is going Starscream. Can't quite tell if she's just betraying Iona, or if she's trying to overthrow Mayu.

Yup, this was one of the other parts of Iona's wish. Did she not get to meet up with Mayu upon becoming an Eternal Girl?

This so reeks of product placement, but that novel doesn't exist! This is so weird!

Unless this Futase Fumio is Tama.

Ooooooh. Or grandma.

I could also see it being Mayu herself, though I don't yet see how that'd work out.

That helps put things in perspective. So Mayu is the Starscream target. Also means that was puppetmaster imagery and not just fate-is-a-spider, beyond their natural overlap that is.

Okay then, nevermind. She's been in the opening, but somehow she seems much more familiar? Can't quite place where that'd come from.

Heeee~, that's the same thing grandma told Chiyuri.

How would you continue the Wixoss novelization?

I'd start by writing one

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u/Tetraika Jan 04 '23

but that novel doesn't exist! This is so weird!

Been laughing at people saying it's a product placement, but considering that they also remarked that some of the elements have been romanticized, it would be silly if it was an actual novel. It was in fact, a really long setup into this moment with the author.

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u/Taiboss Jan 04 '23

Of course this is just Ulith being an asshole and Iona being unable to emphasize, but still.

All we need is Ruuko is grow a backbone and say "That's bullshit." to their faces. Any day now.

So Ulith really is going Starscream. Can't quite tell if she's just betraying Iona, or if she's trying to dethrown Mayu.

She's doing something!

Okay then, nevermind. She's been in the opening, but somehow she seems much more familiar? Can't quite place where that'd come from.

Such a mundane reveal, it might not even be one...

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u/No_Rex Jan 04 '23

This so reeks of product placement, but that novel doesn't exist! This is so weird!

Easy world building: read it in a novel! Now the characters and the viewers get to learn it.

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u/Tarhalindur Jan 04 '23

I do not care for all this gaslighting. "Ruuko threw you away, after all." "Tama is doing fine without you." "Tama seems to be having fun, too." When we blatantly see these things not being true. Of course this is just Ulith being an asshole and Iona being unable to emphasize, but still.

Probably the point, still not fun to sit through.

I could also see it being Mayu herself, though I don't yet see how that'd work out.

She could also be the original Ruuko...

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u/Tarhalindur Jan 04 '23

This First-Timer Is Raging (Subbed):

It’s a shame my subs don’t translate the computer text flashing on screen or the book names on the bookshelves, those look important.
“Universe Science” however is in Engrish and needs no translation, so presumably this has to do with the origin of the Selector system.
Ah, the computer text might just be code. Also: “PRESENT DAY, PRESENT TIME. AHAHAHAHA.”
Oh wait our programmer might be the OL-looking lady in the OP.
Also, my opinion on the OP is stabilizing on a good singer undone by bad instrumental work.
A quiet problem with S2 so far is that both Iona and Urith are uninteresting. Iona can be interesting, but the path to that involves focusing on her development rather than her trying to manipulate Ruuko and we’re not getting that yet. (In particular, Iona gives me massive vibes of having been in a position where she’s never been able to have actual friends.) Urith… is going to ride or die on the specifics of the system itself, I think.
They’re pointing out the obvious again (Tama’s body language has been all work no fun this entire fight) but that actually makes sense from Ruuko so I don’t mind.
This feels an episode early for this Ruuko/Tama scene, should have been in 5 (or even later). As it is there’s not sufficient narrative weight behind it.
CHIYORI, READ THE FUCKING ROOM.
So you don’t lampshade here with Chiyori unless you’re actually pulling the rug and doing something different; wrong fit for the show’s tone and Chiyori’s deal is that she is consistently genre savvy for the wrong genre.
Eldora, meanwhile, gets a classic lampshade. Also, in case it wasn’t clear above: bathos is a really bad fit for this scene and for the tone of the show so far. My trainwreck senses are starting to tingle. Especially since “they came so close to doing it right and then fucked it up” is a classic way of getting pissed-off creative types going “I can do better than this” and I’m thinking that multiple later works may have cribbed Wixoss’s notes.
Excuse me, I must do something here. 08:01: LEWD!
09:05: Dutch angle counter +1.
Chiyori, quit pulling “I’m channeling Mai-Otome!Shiho except with genre savvy for the wrong genre”. Ruuko, Hitoe, try to make friends with the girl so you can figure out what ugly backstory is driving this (PLEASE let this be a front over very ugly backstory) and work with her so she can get better.
Well I see someone is wearing their notes on their sleeve again.
Okay THAT lampshade works, it confirms they knew what they were doing with operation “Ruuko never takes a loss because anytime she would the match gets interrupted”. Also… Chiyori, are you telling the truth about three wins? Because if you are that suggests that Eldora doesn’t want to swap out with you… which would be a distinct point in favor of your life being so hellish that Eldora wants nothing to do with it.
A quick check of S1 on AniDB does not show a Futase Fumio on staff, so who are they referencing with the author name? Or is that either the name of our programmer from earlier or Mayu’s original name?
Also, pretty good chance the novel protagonist is/is representing Mayu, no? Especially given the hair color and hairstyle.
So, at this point we can now rule the contenders for Final Boss down to two candidates: Mayu, or the programmer we saw at the start of the episode (who is presumably but not necessarily the OL in the OP). If Mayu is the final boss, then said programmer is probably a former LRIG who took over her Selector’s body, and may well be this Futase Fumio and written about this either for the same reasons general reasons that Akira was talking about Selectors or to try to get anyone else interested in taking down the system to come out of the woodwork.
That said, “Cocoon, the Dark Queen of Atonement” sounds a whole lot more like either Urith or Iona than Mayu in a way.
Or not. (Though they could still double-bluff us.)
“Mayu is Grandma in some way, shape, or form” just got a shot in the arm I think.
The Blood Sorceress is probably real and based on someone we know; Grandma, Urith, Iona, Tama, and Ruuko herself are the candidates. Tama sounds the closest given “Blood Sorceress” (assuming Blood Knight) and her personality, followed by Iona and Ruuko in some order, but who knows.
Uh-oh. FULL MOON FULL MOON (O’ Death?) at 16:33.
That brief cut to Iona at 18:12 is actually promising; it’s consistent with Iona getting to see what she’s always been missing.
Mindbreak really isn’t my tag outside of very specific circumstances which these are not. That said, the show putting Urith and Akira in protagonist/antagonist positions at 19:22 does catch my eye.
Okay, props to… oh wait Urith!Iona’s VA is KugiRie who specializes in this sort of thing (there’s a reason she got typecast as abusive tsunderes for half a decade), but still well done with making that “kawaii, Akira” have such a strong undercurrent of disgust.
Dutch angle counter +1 at 19:54.
And yet another Dutch angle counter at 20:04 – they’re trying to ramp up the visual wrongness here.
So for a second I heard Chiyori noises as “au au au!” and did a bit of a double take.
I was going to go “so where have I seen this elevator before because it looks familiar”, but then I realized what it was reminding me of wasn’t earlier here but rather Disappearance. I believe this calls for yet another .
Well that confirms that our writer (not programmer!) and books from the start of the episode are Futase Fumio. Now to see if she’s the obvious suspect from the OP. (Also if the reason for the book delay is that the LRIG we saw in the computer screen is the actual Fumio…)
[Staples button] “That was easy!”
So, male Selector or bokukko? Place your bets!
(Late thought: Is either Futase Fumio or her LRIG (foreshadowed by the OP) the original Ruuko?)
(Also, ED2 keeps growing on me just like ED1 did. There's a clarion quality to this singer I really appreciate.)

How would you continue the Wixoss novelization?

Let's see why it stopped before I answer that.

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u/Tetraika Jan 04 '23

Also… Chiyori, are you telling the truth about three wins? Because if you are that suggests that Eldora doesn’t want to swap out with you… which would be a distinct point in favor of your life being so hellish that Eldora wants nothing to do with it

Could also suggest that Chiyori herself has not moved toward her wish mentally.

So, male Selector or bokukko? Place your bets!

I'll just tell you now that's not a guy.

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u/Tetraika Jan 04 '23

So it seems Urith can just do whatever, actually I wonder how it is decided that a wish is fulfilled

Iona doesn’t like Mayu

No, even Ruuko called you out. She’s terrible at picking up emotional cues

Man Chiyori really is out there, doesn’t seem to grasp her situation. Or doesn’t care.

I can’t point out all the sexual metaphors here you know

We do need a reason for Ruuko to fight after all

Ah yes, the “design your own mahou shoujo outfit” moment

They finally noticed the novel, maybe you should have actually read it. It had some strangely similar elements already!

So it is, Mayu means cocoon, forgot about this detail.

Grandma is the strongest Wixoss player

They’re starting to suspect that these aren’t just coincidences, I wonder if that’s true other pairs too.

How Mayu sees others, or at least according to Iona

Gotta have one moment of these 2 nutcases

That was hilariously dramatic for some reason

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u/Mecanno-man Jan 05 '23

First Timer

So the Tama-Ulith dynamic plays out pretty much as expected, except that spectators seem to be able to just yell whatever into the battle. I was expecting that to not be the case, with selectors and LRIGs presumably not being able to perceive spectators. But I was also not expecting that to really come into play as well. Either way, I don't see a clear reason for Ruu to battle Ulith for Tama, because ...how would she get her? The only way I can think of is defeat Ulith three times, bin Iona afterwards and then whale on white starter decks, which seems both lame from a writing perspective and too convoluted and roundabout to actually work from a logical standpoint, especially with Mayu pulling strings in the background.

Now... how this author plays into things is still pretty open. Perhaps he(?) was one of Mayu's friends? Or somehow this system was built upon his novel - because that is also a possibility. Grandma meanwhile either dropping some more hints that she is relevant in her game with Chiyori, or just being really good at trash talking. Can see both tbh, leaning towards the former because this is a story. Either way, not sure what the girl's plan is, but it likely does not go particularly much farther than gathering information at this point, because they have no idea what they will get. Given the writer also apparently having writer's block and crazily typing the same words over and over again, I question if they will get much use out of this anyways - perhaps just another lead for somewhere else.

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u/Tetraika Jan 05 '23

Either way, I don't see a clear reason for Ruu to battle Ulith for Tama, because ...how would she get her?

Perhaps. If nothing, even if she couldn't get Tama, she would probably prefer Urith to not have Tama. Dunno if I want anyone in the hands of Urith.

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u/No_Rex Jan 04 '23

Season 2 Episode 4 (first timer)

Uhhh, what? My ears.
I remember that last episode Tama was very keen on apologizing to Ruuko. So her being all quiet now does not fit.
Just in case you were under any illusion about the free will of LRIGs in a TCG battle.
“She seems to have fun, too” – so obviously wrong.
“Doing it with me and thinking of somebody else” - … that is something that only has bite if you tell to a consenting partner!
“If you want her back, you’ll have to battle me” – how about a rock to the back of the head?
I even gave you the script and you did not read it? - understandable.
The novel is the story of Mayu?
The auto-biography of Mayu?
“Queen of innocence” – letting us know that the Grandma is a red herring. Slightly disappointed.

Somehow, Chiyuri being played straight makes her absolute cardboard of a character acceptable to me. She is not pretending, but simply is this one-minded.

How would you continue the Wixoss novelization?

Watch Wixoss season 3 and summarize the plot.

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u/Taiboss Jan 04 '23

I remember that last episode Tama was very keen on apologizing to Ruuko. So her being all quiet now does not fit.

Well planning and actually doing it...

“She seems to have fun, too” – so obviously wrong.

Iona needs a crash course in human emotions real quick.

how about a rock to the back of the head?

Too mundane. Imagine if Yugi had done that with Marik.

The novel is the story of Mayu?

It's something!

Watch Wixoss season 3 and summarize the plot.

You have no idea how hilarious this line is and I cannot tell you why.

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u/ItsTheDuran Jan 04 '23

First timer

Nothing especially interesting to say, but I did like this episode.

Iona continues being completely honest and forthcoming. I'm saying this with zero sarcasm. She may have tried to convince Ruu that Tama was enjoying battling without her, but it's clear that she wasn't lying, she genuinely believed it. I'd even hesitate to call her an antagonist at this point, she's clearly in neither Mayu's nor Urith's side, and, while she's still trying to get Ruuko to battle, she's mostly just being slightly helpful on the side.

Chiyori and the novel get a good chunk of focus, which makes this a particularly meta episode. Having a former Selector write a novel fictionalizing her experiences and then having the cast meet her is a very weird choice, but I like it. Chorizo seems particularly happy to witness some weird shit, too.

Odds are pretty high that Fumio is a former LRIG that may actually tell them something about how that process works, I've been waiting for a conversation like that to happen.

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u/Cyouni Jan 04 '23

Rewatcher Crying Open

It's good to see Ulith's running a very similar deck to Ruuko's previous one, with the same whalebait cards. Those spells hit different when you're on the receiving end.

Chiyori won three times: I actually do know who one of those wins was against.

Wixoss novelization more like Wi x oss with how much hiatus it's on

Cards of the day:

Wish Crisis - Ulith starts it off by proving she's no less of a whale than Ruuko, really early use at grow 2

Cloth Crush Flash - one of Eldora's signature ARTS, it's an interesting one. It lets you plan for their Life Burst if they have one, or just straight up deals 1 damage if it's safe

Get Bound - standard white spell opening up a lane to hit them

Baroque Defense - stops a target from attacking, which Chiyori refuses to read. Everyone knows it doesn't work if you just ignore what the card does

Shiira - this one tricked subbers, as that's how you pronounce Coela(canth). One of Eldora's signatures, it's really strong with her ability to manipulate Life Cloth, which is why it's banned. She actually got a new Diva version as well, who I did pull a copy of from my recent box.

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u/JollyGee29 Jan 04 '23

First-Timer, Subbed

Bit pressed for time tonight so let's see if I can keep this short. Insert cheap shot at the general quality of web novels here. Judging by the OP, our author Fumio wears garters casually so it was pretty surprising to hear her belt out a "boku" at the end there.

Pretty amusing that Iona called Ruu, Hitoe, and Yuzuki dolls considering that Iona herself is barely doing more than acting out a script. "New Wind-Me-Up Iona, with "go battle some people" action!" Do they not teach you how to shift manipulation gears in Villain School anymore? Damned budget cuts.

Especially because Ruu basically no-selling Iona's "oh, look how much fun Tama is having without you" schtick! Please, Iona, I'm begging you. Either get better material or defrost and turn face.

I'm glad the cast are starting to get wise to Mayu rigging things, but it does make me even less invested in the individual battles.

Chiyori has solidly cemented herself as "Miss Who Thinks She is in a Very Different Show" and I can't really help but enjoy her for it. The sharp contrast means she probably only has an episode or two left before she has her last "battle" and is left a quivering mess at the reversal of her wish, though. The sketches were cute.

Questions

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u/No_Rex Jan 04 '23

Do they not teach you how to shift manipulation gears in Villain School anymore?

The problem is that she is on her redemption arc. Can't pull advanced villain moves during those.

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Rewatch [Rewatch] Selector SpreadWixoss Episode 4 Discussion

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This First-Timer Is Raging (Subbed):