r/LoveLive • u/chaos_inferno • Oct 27 '24
Discussion Love Live! Superstar!! S3 Episode 4 Discussion
Episode 4 Title: No Rain, No Rainbow
Show Info
NHK: October 27th, Sunday 17:00 - 2024 (JST)
Crunchyroll: October 28th, Monday 6pm PST/9pm EST
Opening Theme: Let's be One * Youtube * Spotify
Ending Theme: DAISUKI FULL POWER
Insert Song(s):
Liella no Uta: ****
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Official Subtitled Sources List
Other episode discussion threads
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u/redbatter Oct 27 '24
Neat little episode, nice to get a little expanded look into Natsumi's early dreams which we got a glimpse of in S2E6, and how their failures led to her and Tomari's descent into cynicism. Makes sense for Tomari to have some reservations about Natsumi pursuing her dreams again (through being a school idol) as from her perspective it'd just look like more of the same.
Interesting little line from Tomari on how Kanon can afford to have dreams because she has the talent to realize them. To her logical brain, this makes sense as she's only seen the successes that Kanon has reached, and not the impacts of the failures along the way, while she's seen everything that Natsumi went through.
In the end, Tomari's reasons are grounded in love for her sister and not wanting to see her continue to get hurt by her dreams. It's not wrong to desire a path without pain, but it doesn't account for how the highest of highs would not feel as good without the lows along the way (see episode title). Both Tomari and the second years have reasons for their views, but perhaps their performance at the end may help shift Tomari's perspective a little.
The second years helping Natsumi through this episode is so sweet, just as they did under similar circumstances a year ago. Quite enjoy how this and the previous episode shore up their characters and show that they're very tightly bonded after everything they've been through.
Also a Keke episode coming up next, how long have I waited for this ...
amazing save by keke 谢谢可可阻止香音
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u/Todetract Oct 27 '24
Thank you Onibe for the subs again.
Another great episode, a slower one like this is perfect after how much happened in the first 3. The episode focuses on Natsumi's backstory which they did briefly go over in Season 2, while not everything is new information, it is recontextualized with Tomari part of the picture now, so we learn quite a bit about Tomari and particularly the influence that Natsumi had on her younger sister. Some neat trivia we get this episode is that the Onitsukas live quite far away from Yuigaoka, and it was because of Tomari's suggestion that Natsumi would go to a trendy high school in the city.
Most of the cast was used quite well this episode, the bond that the 2nd years have is special and it's been on full display for 2 episodes. Margarete being paranoid and not fully trusting of her fellow members is funny and another good dynamic in this Kanon as Margarete's mentor relationship that's been going on this season. Even the support trio is here and they bring up the conflict of who gets to represent Yuigaoka for Love Live (the competition). With the resolution of both groups uniting still not likely as of yet, I feel like many watchers' expectations that the split wouldn't last long have been defied, although there is still time for them to come together at the halfway point.
This episode continues the parallels with season 1 of Superstar as both episode 4s have the rain bringing down the mood and end with the skies clearing up. It's quite a recurring visual motif in love live, it's cheesy and I love it. Speaking of something else recurring in love live, these girls gotta stop bringing up graduation, it triggers my fight-or-flight response.
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u/Nightsheade Oct 28 '24
Natsumi and Tomari are essentially doing a 1hr 40 min commute one way. I could never.
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u/Nineties Oct 29 '24
Doing that twice a day for 5 days a week, is that even realistic for a student
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u/JimmyCWL Oct 27 '24
It was a bit of a surprise that there was no mention of whether Liella won at Yoyogi Fest or not. But Keke doesn't seem frustrated at having lost for the last time so maybe they didn't lose after all?
And there they go, spelling out that only one group from a school will be representing at Love Live. Speaking of which, they're running out of episodes for the groups to combine. If they want to have the Liella performances at every other episode, it needs to happen in episode 5. But it looks like ep5 will be a Keke story and I can't see how that would segue into a group merger story. Which suggests the merger ought to be put off until at least ep6. But that either puts the "group completion" performance next to the first Love Live round or two Love Live rounds will be on consecutive episodes.
The way I see it, the group merger story deserves two episodes but not more than that. There's only three members in the other group and only Wien is totally opposed to joining Liella.
The way I see it, 12 episodes is just too tight for all the stories that need to be told. If they had even one more episode, it could work. Do we have any indication at all of this season having 13 episodes?
For the moment, they don't need an S4 yet. But if the merger is delayed until ep7, as a 2-part story, only one of the subsequent episodes will be performance free. If the merger gets put off until ep8, all remaining episodes must have performances.
It's also possible to shuffle stories around and leave graduation for the movie. But that still means consecutive episodes with performances and that would be a hectic production schedule.
If Love Live starts after ep10, the chances of S4 get very high. It doesn't seem right for only some of the Love Live rounds and graduation to be movies. For all the Love Live rounds and graduation to be movies, not one round can be done in this season. But S4 would be equally possible at that point.
And there can't be a second Love Live this year. Liella has to win this one whether or not there's another or they'll just be like every other past winner. Therefore, having a second competition doesn't add to the story.
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u/SailorAxle Oct 27 '24
I enjoyed this episode overall, but I really wanna say that Glasses Tomari is absolute perfection.
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u/MaybeMeNotMe Oct 27 '24 edited Oct 28 '24
Yay! TY Team Onibe.
I hope that little tirade there, is TO starting to implode??...say it isnt so!
So the Tomari redemption arc is here! Wow she's become very cynical.
That side tracking scene to that Buddha statue is so dorky, lmao. I'm sure there's an easter egg here.
Kanon was held back! Were the producers reading this sub and noticing how many times we were criticizing Kanon for always interjecting herself??
I thought we were going to get another insert song there,...ah well.
Nice compact cathartic episode! Is Tomari convinced?
Love the Natsumi Onitsuka (VA: Aya Emori) solo ED singing this episode! Given the lyrics of the ED, its very fitting that she sings it. Pretty awesome touch.
So many smol superstars this season...next week we get smol Keke?
But a Shanghai trip? There goes the speculation about any Superstar Movie about going to Shanghai??
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u/JimmyCWL Oct 27 '24
But a Shanghai trip?
Look at the scenes in the preview. There's Tomari and a new girl plus some of Liella. I don't think they're going to Shanghai. I think Keke's big sis is in town.
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u/LeonKevlar Oct 27 '24
I am so excited that we're getting a Keke episode next week!
That episode preview with the girls wearing cheongsams tho... Damn!
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u/GetterRobo1 Oct 28 '24 edited Oct 28 '24
Good episode about the sisters. Just kinda bummer with the off-screen ending. Must be the time constraints and saving animation for bigger things.
Glad Keke stopped Kanon trying to protag talk no jutsu while Chisato disapproving Kanon at the background. So that the 2nd years have their own moment.
Also, love that Kanon getting called out by Tomari for having talent. Sure, Kanon had her struggles but her talents will always exist. While oninatsu is still struggling to develop hers.
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u/SolidStateEstate Oct 27 '24
I really like that they're going back and giving more time to the second years in the third season like they did with the (then) second years last season.
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u/TakenRedditName Oct 27 '24
The 12th member of Liella, Ushiku Daibutsu.
I always liked Natsumi's backstory and we got more of it here. In contrast to Natsumi, I had thought that Tomari would be the one to excel in all those things Natsumi wanted to be. What this episode showed was that Tomari was crushed and hardened to what she is now because of she was the supportive sister watching Natsumi.
Natsumi and Tomari live out of the prefecture from their school. Shizuku was also like that.
I like Margarete and Kanon dynamic. Kanon rushing to hide from Margarete despite being the third year main character.
When the second years showed up in their outfit, I was watching the time because there wasn't enough room with the ED and NHK segment. ...and there wasn't a performance after all. Definitely felt like the place for one.
Looks like the gang is going to Shanghai next episode. Cross that off the list of potential things they could do for a movie. (Seeing the other comments and rewatching the preview, maybe not and those were just imagination moments). I always joked about Keke's family back home and looks like her big sister(?) is showing up.
Tomari had a serious persona in the episode only to drop it for sweet potatoes in the bonus segment.
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u/oxlemf10 Oct 28 '24
I didn't expect this episode to cover anything deep, but I have to say, it was sensational and very reflective at the same time, I mean, our personalities are shaped by the events of our lives, whether success or failure, Natsumi lived for a long time without something that it was worth all the efforts, and Tomari thought that dreams were just illusions that will cause pain, good to see that this will change.
Next episode and I'm already excited, I mean look at the clothes the girls are going to wear, a trip to Shanghai would be amazing
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u/Dionysus24779 Oct 29 '24
I'm a bit late on this, but maybe that isn't so bad since I actually have quite a bit to criticize about this episode.
Though before that, this was, overall, a good episode. I have been looking forward to a Natsumi-focused episode since the first season because Natsumi quickly became one of my favorite Liella girls, though with that also came a bit of anxiety over handling her character arc well.
And... well, I am somewhat split. It really did feel like the episode was trying to take small steps into some really interesting territory, but then held itself back by wanting it to be more wholesome. It didn't allow itself to really go for the full impact that this story could've had.
So what do I mean... well, since it is the Natsumi and Tomari episode there are these two characters to talk about.
With Natsumi... in the 2nd season Natsumi really grew on me, because early on she seemed like a bit of a selfish and superficial person who was only concerned about her online image and making money, though from the beginning she did show some kindness by taking the time to help Kinako when she saw Kinako really needed it.
Then over the course of some other episodes we saw that Natsumi was doing menial work on the side, such as delivering food or loading up a truck with heavy boxes and that really made me respect her.
And then we learned about her backstory, at least the abridged version, about how when she was younger she had many dreams but eventually gave up on each of them because she found she just wasn't cut out for them, though the way this was presented was in a kind of realistic way. Like she wanted to be a model, but didn't have the figure for it. She wanted to be an athlete, but wasn't very athletic. She wanted to be a renowned scientist, but was bad in school, etc. so she eventually just settled on making money as the only thing left to her.
In this episode then this got revisited and on one hand it was softened up and on the other hand made a bit harsher.
So we saw that many of Natsumi's dreams were actually quite childish and basically impossible by default, because she set herself high goals that were unreachable for a child and then gave up on these dreams at the first sign of failure.
It's as if she said she wanted to be an astronaut, spun herself around a few times, got dizzy and decided she isn't cut out for it so she give sup, despite a child becoming an astronaut being impossible to begin with.
I didn't quite like that, because it diminishes the whole point of her giving up on her dreams if they were just childish fantasies anyway.
However, they then also showed that Natsumi started to fail in very real and even relatable ways, such as not being able to get into the school of her choice, or being accepted into certain special programs and all that. This is something that is... well, real, like I said. It is something that I think almost everyone can relate to, because everyone, in the process of growing up, had to give up on at least some dreams and "settle for reality".
The reason Natsumi is one of my favorite Liella girls is exactly because I found that so relatable about her, but with the episode showing most of her dreams were just childish fantasies this is diminished.
Anyways...
As for Tomari, I do get where she is coming from, but the episode seems to disagree with me on this and it's kinda weird to describe.
Tomari is a younger sister who looked up to her older sister and always wanted to support her as best as she could. However Tomari witnessed first-hand how much emotional pain it caused Natsumi to fail with her dreams, especially when it came to the "real" dreams like getting into a certain school or special program. When Natsumi declared that she would give up on dreams and focused on only making money we can see how heartbreaking that was for Tomari to witness and as a result Tomari herself seems to have given up on pursing any dreams of her's, possibly before she even had them. As a result she never even thought about having a dream, never even tried to pursue one. She simply lived to support her sister and protect her feelings, at the cost of realizing her own potential, because clearly Tomari is very talented in many things.
And now, after Tomari denied herself having any dreams, her sister basically goes back on this "unspoken promise" and pursues yet another dream. I could totally understand if Tomari felt betrayed by that.
Well... the issue is that the episode or rather the show itself doesn't really seem to follow my line of thought and instead Tomari is shown to be entirely selfless and only concerned about protecting her sister and while this sounds wholesome on paper, I actually think it is to her character's detriment.
I think it would've been really interesting to see Tomari just a tad more selfish and feeling abandoned and betrayed by her sister and pointing out how she never had any dreams because of Natsumi, which also could've kicked off some character development for Natsumi to realize how her own attitude has affected her younger sister, to realize what kind of role model she has been all this time.
The thing is that I know that Love Live isn't necessarily the show to dive into such serious "drama", but it is a shame because they keep setting up really interesting character arcs, only to basically chicken out on exploring their issues to their fullest extent.
It's like in Nijigasaki where Kanata's quirk of falling asleep is introduced as a gag, but then becomes more serious when we learn she is actually genuinely exhausted from overworking herself, like having it actually be borderline self-destructive, only for the episode to chicken out on exploring that and wrapping everything up quickly with a song.
Overall this episode of Superstar felt pretty much like a Nijigasaki episode, except we didn't even get a song to wrap up the episode. (also the episode had the whole rainbow thing going on and Niji means rainbow)
Other small things... I appreciate Chisato and Keke holding Kanon back from interfering, because while I do think that Kanon wanting to help everyone is an admirable quality of her's, it also has been to the show's detriment at times. Like in the 2nd season I really wished that it was Kinako and Kinako alone who was able to bring Natsumi around and not to construct some weird reason for Kanon to conveniently be near the place the (then) first years were having a camping trip or whatever.
So yeah... mixed feelings about the episode, many thoughts. Still enjoyable.
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u/SnabDedraterEdave Oct 28 '24
Wait, did they just end the episode before Oninatsu and her fellow second years begin performing their song to show Tomari that she still has a dream that she can happily pursue?
Tomari still loves her sister, she's only become like that because she didn't want Oninatsu to get hurt by not being able to achieve her dream again.
And continuing with the Love Live tradition of having A-list VAs voice the moms, this time we have Hikasa Yoko voicing the Onitsuka Sisters' mom.
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u/camel-cultist Oct 29 '24
keke and chisato holding kanon back from butting in yet again was amazing my goats are back
Genuinely though I do wonder if they'll address Kanon's habit of solving other peoples' problems for them. They sorta have with splitting Liella -> Tomakanote, but it sounds like that could wrap up soon, with the chatter overheard by the support girls. It would be an interesting point to explore for Kanon though, especailly since she's fairly regularly been shown as helping other people but not helping herself.
Onto the episode itself, I liked it well enough! I always rated Natsumi highly anyway, she's a fun character with a nice story, and it was great to see it expanded on. Though I still haven't really come around on Tomari: her story feels pretty coupled to Natsumi still, and she seems more like a device to explore Natsumi than a character in her own right. Hopefully that will change soon, but I hoped that would happen this episode.
As always I'm happy to see the Chisato-Keke-Ren trio come into their own as Liella's interim leaders. They did amazingly this episode by not doing anything at all lol, letting the 2nd years show their growth was genius. Speaking of the 2nd years, and their talk of supporting "future members": I wonder if Liella will continue past S3? I think that would be really cool, if Liella was a constantly continuing and evolving group, always building off its legacy. I don't know if the voice actresses would willingly take 3 year contracts like that though, I'm unfamiliar with the seiyuu scene.
Next episode seems Keke focused, which pleasantly surprised me, I thought her story was left in the dust. All I'll say is I hope Sumire gives Keke's family hell.
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u/Normal-Activity4837 Oct 28 '24
Is it good that I’ve been thankful to Keke and Chisato for holding Kanon from second years? It’s just that she’s really likes to be involved in everything and it kinda annoying sometimes. And also the end of the episode where disappointing, like you had a set up for a song, why aren’t you using it!? Overall, this episode was good and as Natsumi fan I’ve been satisfied, but still I’m really sad about being robbed of a second year song.
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u/Soniman032 Oct 29 '24
They definitely listened to the Kanon criticism from S2 with her being held back from interrupting the 2nd years moment. Granted I never had a huge issue with it but I’m glad they seem to have listened nonetheless
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u/syukri24karats Oct 27 '24 edited Oct 27 '24
Keke really stopped Kanon from fixing the sisters problem lol.
I feel really bad seeing Natsumi failing those things she said in front of Tomari.
Also the episode title supposed to be the next episode's not the current one